11 Arguments Against Theism
Comments
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gue_barium wrote:I said "murder".
Instances of animals killing within their own species is rare. At least among the higher mammals. It happens, but I wouldn't say that makes it natural.This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.0 -
catefrances wrote:nope. i'm talking about violence.This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.0
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deadnothingbetter wrote:it's kinda the same thing.
umm.... no. it's kinda not.
i can be violent. but that doesn't mean i would kill someone.hear my name
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catefrances wrote:umm.... no. it's kinda not.
i can be violent. but that doesn't mean i would kill someone.This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.0 -
deadnothingbetter wrote:now, you've got me confused. if violence is the natural animalistic nature, then what is killing? is it any less justifiable or more justifiable than violence?
what i meant was that violence doesn't equate to killing. not that killing isn't animalistic by nature. animals kill animals all the time. and some murder some. ive seen chimpanzees steal a baby form its mother and murder it as she screamed for its return.hear my name
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catefrances wrote:what i meant was that violence doesn't equate to killing. not that killing isn't animalistic by nature. animals kill animals all the time. and some murder some. ive seen chimpanzees steal a baby form its mother and murder it as she screamed for its return.
i find it intriguing at how others interpret goodness. so i guess that was my intention, to understand your concepts of goodness. and ahnimus's also.This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.0 -
i feel that goodness is not just about not doing harm to others. but extending that to being empathetic towards those who do and wish us harm.hear my name
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now for the sake of whatever the hell else there might be to understand... what drives us to do good? for instance, there are mean unsympathetic people who would do harm. not just physical violent harm but also untangible harm such as discriminizing, taunting and slandering for no particular reason. maybe just because they are bitter or because they love to harm others. but in essence what is wrong with that? what would drive others to fear doing this or the fear of harming others and feel remorse and sympathy for those in need?
for example, you see a child who is in need and you feel sympathy for the child. why? what harm would it do you if you just ignore the child and walk away and go on with your life?This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.0 -
catefrances wrote:you mean to tell me that when something happens within Nature it is possible for it to be considered unnatural?
Do know of any instances of chimpanzee killing chimpanzee? Dolphin killing dolphin? Whale killing whale?
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deadnothingbetter wrote:now for the sake of whatever the hell else there might be to understand... what drives us to do good? for instance, there are mean unsympathetic people who would do harm. not just physical violent harm but also untangible harm such as discriminizing, taunting and slandering for no particular reason. maybe just because they are bitter or because they love to harm others. but in essence what is wrong with that? what would drive others to fear doing this or the fear of harming others and feel remorse and sympathy for those in need?
for example, you see a child who is in need and you feel sympathy for the child. why? what harm would it do you if you just ignore the child and walk away and go on with your life?
children need guidance. they need love and they need nurturing.
as for not doing others harm. i dont see the point. it leads to nothing. it's a power trip and i don't dig on that kind of power.hear my name
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catefrances wrote:you mean to tell me that when something happens within Nature it is possible for it to be considered unnatural?
Rarely, large lion males will kill cubs, grizzly males will kill grizzly cubs. Biologists don't understand the behavior.
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catefrances wrote:children need guidance. they need love and they need nurturing.
as for not doing others harm. i dont see the point. it leads to nothing. it's a power trip and i don't dig on that kind of power.
There are physically violent sports in our society, boxing, football, etc.
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gue_barium wrote:Do know of any instances of chimpanzee killing chimpanzee? Dolphin killing dolphin? Whale killing whale?
yes i do. as i have stated previously i have seen chimpanzees steal a baby from its mother and kill it as she screamed for its return. i have seen orcas kill a grey whale. though orcas are dolphins, not whales. i have heard that some species of dolphin will kill an interloper if it is a juvenile. male bears kill baby bears all the time.hear my name
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gue_barium wrote:There are physically violent sports in our society, boxing, football, etc.
yes there are and i see those sports as war in microcosm. socially acceptable outlets for violence.hear my name
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catefrances wrote:children need guidance. they need love and they need nurturing.
as for not doing others harm. i dont see the point. it leads to nothing. it's a power trip and i don't dig on that kind of power.This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.0 -
deadnothingbetter wrote:i don't think you understood me though. if i see a child who needs "guidance" "love" and "nurturing" but I say, "ah, what the hell, it ain't my problem." is there any wrong in me doing that?
not in your eyes.hear my name
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catefrances wrote:yes i do. as i have stated previously i have seen chimpanzees steal a baby from its mother and kill it as she screamed for its return. i have seen orcas kill a grey whale. though orcas are dolphins, not whales. i have heard that some species of dolphin will kill an interloper if it is a juvenile. male bears kill baby bears all the time.
And this is an explanation of "naturalness" to you?
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catefrances wrote:not in your eyes.
but answer my question. how do you interpret that as wrong?This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.0 -
deadnothingbetter wrote:lol.... well, i have my own interpretations of course. so it's not like i would do such a thing. i know it's wrong if i saw a child who was seriously in need and ignore the situation. i would do the best i could to help the child.
but answer my question. how do you interpret that as wrong?
because as a mother i nurture my children. i see how i feel about 'your' reaction to the child as an extension of that.hear my name
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