europe - grim prospect ahead?

know1

soulsinging wrote:

i believe in a greater power and evolution. can your mind wrap itself around that contradiction? dont go confusing all faith or belief in higher powers with Catholic doctrine.

I believe in evolution as well. You cannot look at the species of this earth and deny that evolution occurs. The question is whether something is in control of it or not.

my2hands

cincybearcat wrote:

You are no better than the 'bible beaters' you profess to hate and to be so much smarter then.

Anyhow, I think that Europe grim prospects can be summed up much better in their unemployment rates than whether or not they believe in a god.

i have never claimed to be "better" than anyone... and i certainly never said i "hated" any bible beaters?... and i have never claimed to be "smarter" than anyone or anything so please stop putting words in my mouth. Thank You

i said that a belief in a "higher being" or "God" is a weakness... i also admitted to have many weaknesses myself... i am capable of self-reflection

this is why religion is a subject i do not discuss, because people over-react

my2hands

There is a Marker,
No one sees it cause of sand
That has covered over
All the messages it kept
From misunderstanding,
What Original Truth was
And now expanding
In a faith, but not in love...

What went wrong?
Walking tightrope high
Over moral ground.
Seeing visions of
Falling up somehow.
Oh do come down
With the living, let
What is living love.
So unforgiving, yet
Needing forgiveness first...

God, what do you say?

Those undecided
Needn't have faith to be free.
And those misguided,
There was a plan for them to be...
Now you got both sides
Claiming 'killing in god's name'.
But god is nowhere
To be found, conveniently...

What goes on?
Walking tightrope high
Over moral ground.
Walk the bridges be-
-fore you burn them down!
Do come round
With the living, let
What is living love.
Unforgiving, yet
Needing forgiveness first...

God, what do you say?
God, what do you say?

I feel a sickness...
A sickness coming over me
Like watching freedom
Being sucked straight out to sea
And the solution?
Well, from me far would it be
But the delusion
Is feeling dangerous to me

What goes wrong?
Walking tightrope high
Over moral ground.
Seeing visions of
Falling up somehow.
Oh, do come down
With the living, let
What is living love,
Unforgiving...yet
Needing forgiveness first?

Oh, what do you say?
God, what do you say?

What do you say?

Calling out, calling out
Calling out, calling out

Collin

know1 wrote:

Give me one example of something that science has proven beyond any shadow of a doubt? There is none. All they can do is observe and recognize patterns based upon limited human experience. Tomorrow, new information could be presented that renders their theories incorrect. A scientist would never profess that something has been completely proven.

Water freezes at 32 degrees (or 0 degrees Celsius) and boils at 212 degrees (100 degrees Celsius).

No - I didn't say they were wrong. I said I BELIEVED that their beliefs are wrong. I left it open to the possibility that if something changed and I then believed they were correct, I would convert.

He believes all those things he mentioned, does that make him close minded?

my2hands

know1 wrote:

I believe in evolution as well. You cannot look at the species of this earth and deny that evolution occurs. The question is whether something is in control of it or not.

in my opinion there is no "something" controlling us, the world, or evolution...

my2hands

soulsinging wrote:

i believe in a greater power and evolution. can your mind wrap itself around that contradiction? dont go confusing all faith or belief in higher powers with Catholic doctrine.

yes i can "wrap my mind" around that concept...just dont be offended if i dont believe it

i am not confucing "all faith or belief in higher powers with Catholic Doctrine"... the article mentioned the catholic church several times... and it just happens to be the biggest, and finest, example of a fraudulent religion that is based strictly on population control and $$$

ps...i love a good fairly tale

know1

my2hands wrote:

There is a Marker,
No one sees it cause of sand
That has covered over
All the messages it kept
From misunderstanding,
What Original Truth was
And now expanding
In a faith, but not in love...

What went wrong?
Walking tightrope high
Over moral ground.
Seeing visions of
Falling up somehow.
Oh do come down
With the living, let
What is living love.
So unforgiving, yet
Needing forgiveness first...

God, what do you say?

Those undecided
Needn't have faith to be free.
And those misguided,
There was a plan for them to be...
Now you got both sides
Claiming 'killing in god's name'.
But god is nowhere
To be found, conveniently...

What goes on?
Walking tightrope high
Over moral ground.
Walk the bridges be-
-fore you burn them down!
Do come round
With the living, let
What is living love.
Unforgiving, yet
Needing forgiveness first...

God, what do you say?
God, what do you say?

I feel a sickness...
A sickness coming over me
Like watching freedom
Being sucked straight out to sea
And the solution?
Well, from me far would it be
But the delusion
Is feeling dangerous to me

What goes wrong?
Walking tightrope high
Over moral ground.
Seeing visions of
Falling up somehow.
Oh, do come down
With the living, let
What is living love,
Unforgiving...yet
Needing forgiveness first?

Oh, what do you say?
God, what do you say?

What do you say?

Calling out, calling out
Calling out, calling out

To me, that song demonstrates a belief in God and an aversion to those who profess that belief but whose actions contradict that belief.

soulsinging

my2hands wrote:

yes i can "wrap my mind" around that concept...just dont be offended if i dont believe it

i am not confucing "all faith or belief in higher powers with Catholic Doctrine"... the article mentioned the catholic church several times... and it just happens to be the biggest, and finest, example of a fraudulent religion that is based strictly on population control and $$$

ps...i love a good fairly tale

im not offended by whether or not you believe it. i am offended by your contention that i am somehow "weaker" than you for believing there is something bigger than me out there. for the record, im not christian either.

it's odd, i recognize a lot of my own former thinking in your rhetoric and cant help wondering if i used to come across as arrogant and pompous as you do.

know1

Collin wrote:

Water freezes at 32 degrees (or 0 degrees Celsius) and boils at 212 degrees (100 degrees Celsius).

That has not been proven conclusively. It is only a theory that holds true under the information and conditions we know today. A scientist will tell you the same.

Collin

know1 wrote:

That has not been proven conclusively. It is only a theory that holds true under the information and conditions we know today. A scientist will tell you the same.

Yes, but today under the conditions we know, and that is all we know, we can prove this. I can heat up water and say it will boil at 212 degrees, you and everyone else in the world knows it's true.

So basically the Bible is a theory that doesn't hold under the information and conditions we know today. The fun part about being a believer is, you can say; god did it, god made it happen... And I can't, no one can, say you're wrong because no one can prove god doesn't exist.

my2hands

soulsinging wrote:

i am offended by your contention that i am somehow "weaker" than you for believing there is something bigger than me out there.

i never said that anyone is weaker than me...i said that I BELIEVE it is a weakness... and i admitted and continue to admit to have many weaknesses

thank you

ps...you guys are becoming experts in putting words in others mouth

soulsinging

my2hands wrote:

i never said that anyone is weaker than me...i said that I BELIEVE it is a weakness... and i admitted and continue to admit to have many weaknesses

thank you

ps...you guys are becoming experts in putting words in others mouth

fair enough. i BELIEVE you're a pompous ass for making a sweepingly judgmental statement like that.

my2hands

soulsinging wrote:

it's odd, i recognize a lot of my own former thinking in your rhetoric and cant help wondering if i used to come across as arrogant and pompous as you do.

i truly hope that i am not coming across as pompous or arrogant...i am just stating MY OPINION!... that i feel that a belief in a higher being or purpose is a human weakness... just like drug addiction is a weakness

we all have weakness (and flaws)...it is the truly strong that can admit to them

decides2dream

perhaps that is why i loved living in prague so much.

my2hands

soulsinging wrote:

fair enough. i BELIEVE you're a pompous ass for making a sweepingly judgmental statement like that.

i can live with that... and i stand by opinion...i am not attempting to put anyone down, or their beliefs...i could care less what someone believes in... i am just stating how i feel

once the human race can admit its weakness' we can start to evolve

i just think it is cute for adults to believe in fairy tales and metaphors as fact

Carlos D

Europe is a bit of a joke really.Most people I know mock you if say you believe in God and not because they have thought about it and come to the conclusion that there is no God,but because it is accepted in society nowadays that anyone who believes in God is a nutcase who believes they are morally superior to everyone else.It's just ridiculous when people suggest that Religion is created to control and exploit people.If they took the time to read the Bible I'm sure they would have a lot less criticisms of it.

soulsinging

my2hands wrote:

i truly hope that i am not coming across as pompous or arrogant...i am just stating MY OPINION!... that i feel that a belief in a higher being or purpose is a human weakness... just like drug addiction is a weakness

we all have weakness (and flaws)...it is the truly strong that can admit to them

dont get me started on drug addiction. but yes, you do come across like that.

surferdude

my2hands wrote:

i truly hope that i am not coming across as pompous or arrogant...i am just stating MY OPINION!... that i feel that a belief in a higher being or purpose is a human weakness... just like drug addiction is a weakness

we all have weakness (and flaws)...it is the truly strong that can admit to them

I think the truly strong admit to their weaknesses but don't point out others.

As I tell my son that he can't make himself bigger by making someone else smaller. He can only make him seem bigger by making someone else bigger. But in the end he can only be who he is and that it's up to hm if he lives up to that potential. And we allhave the potential to be more amazing than we imagine.

decides2dream

surferdude wrote:

I think the truly strong admit to their weaknesses but don't point out others.

As I tell my son that he can't make himself bigger by making someone else smaller. He can only make him seem bigger by making someone else bigger. But in the end he can only be who he is and that it's up to hm if he lives up to that potential. And we allhave the potential to be more amazing than we imagine.

that is truly beautiful, and something we all should aspire to...no matter what our belief system.

danmac

know1 wrote:

I'm not Mother Theresa. I'm very far from it. I know that man has fallibilities while you seem to think that man is supreme. You're the one with the God complex, not me.

I chuckle at your inordinate amount of faith in science considering that science has been proven no more right than the bible.

Your comments about the church and Jesus and the bible are extremely humorous as well. I take it that you stumbled upon some enlightenment that has "proven" your theories? If not, they are no more valid than those of a religious person.

And yes, I believe the other religions are wrong. If I believed they were right, then I would belong to them.

Science no more right than the bible?

Heads up folks, its another Waco survivor. Join the queue over there love, free tea and biscuits, behind onelonggong and the other one, the Doctor will be over shortly.

Can people like you really exist in the 21st century?

Whats next, earth is flat, stil centre of the cosmos? Or hasnt science proved that one to you yet?
Big bang, Darwin? Names ring bells?
Or did we come from the almighty in 6 days 6000 years ago?
Martin Luther fought people like you 600 years ago.