The U.S. has the biggest baddest military ever, fuck yeah!

my2handsmy2hands Posts: 17,117
edited June 2007 in A Moving Train
so what good is that doing anybody?

and is it really a good thing that we have developed a military powerful enough to destroy the entire surface of the planet? i think we should be ashamed of this, instead of the typical overflowing pride
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  • even flow?even flow? Posts: 8,066
    Ever???? When you hear the saying that "the sun never went down on the British Empire". That dosen't strike you as the best military ever? Just some fodder for the pipe. :)
    You've changed your place in this world!
  • jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    this is cute
  • jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    my2hands wrote:

    and is it really a good thing that we have developed a military powerful enough to destroy the entire surface of the planet? i think we should be ashamed of this, instead of the typical overflowing pride
    and for the record, I'm very proud of it. would you rather be weak? have a good time with that
  • my2handsmy2hands Posts: 17,117
    jlew24asu wrote:
    this is cute


    i am being serious. everyone is always so proud of our military strength, so i want to know why. thats all.

    to me, it seems to be to be a silly idea for humans to direct most of their wealth at developing/maintaining more effective ways of killing each other and destroying what they have built. and then to blindly pump their fist in pride, wothout really looking at the much larger picture and long term impact on the human species.
  • blackredyellowblackredyellow Posts: 5,889
    my2hands wrote:
    so what good is that doing anybody?

    and is it really a good thing that we have developed a military powerful enough to destroy the entire surface of the planet? i think we should be ashamed of this, instead of the typical overflowing pride

    I don't really have a problem with us having the most powerful military, but at the same time I am ashamed that we are still dumping trillions of dollars into new nuclear weapons, other weapons systems and things like the terribly incapable missile defense system.
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  • jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    my2hands wrote:
    i am being serious. everyone is always so proud of our military strength, so i want to know why. thats all.

    to me, it seems to be to be a silly idea for humans to direct most of their wealth at developing/maintaining more effective ways of killing each other and destroying what they have built. and then to blindly pump their fist in pride, wothout really looking at the much larger picture and long term impact on the human species.
    sure, this sounds great. and I think we spend too much on defense. its good to be the best, but we over spend.

    look at the history of mankind. war has been part of it since the beginning. countries will always need to have a defense system. what else would stop someone from coming in and calling it their own? as much as you hate to accept it (understandable so). this will be part of human nature until the end of time. all we can do is promote peace. the earth has limited resources which means their will always be conflict to obtain those resources.
  • jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    I don't really have a problem with us having the most powerful military, but at the same time I am ashamed that we are still dumping trillions of dollars into new nuclear weapons, other weapons systems and things like the terribly incapable missile defense system.
    yea I agree with this. why the fuck do we need MORE nukes? with the amount of destruction they cause, I dont see the need for more then a few, if any.
  • my2handsmy2hands Posts: 17,117
    jlew24asu wrote:

    look at the history of mankind.

    ok i will.

    the human species has made many amazing advances throughout it's brief stay on the planet. major advances have been made, and continue to be made, such as womens rights, racism, slavery, workers rights, childrens rights, education, medicine, science, agriculture, transportation, etc. shit, we figured how to fly and have golfed on the moon (now thats fucking amazing). so i do not buy, for one second, that violence and war is human nature and will always exist on a large scale. bar fights may be inevitable, but a large coordinated campaign of violence with large public support is a different story, that can be "history" as you say....i think it is the easy way of the discussion for us to say it is natural or inevitable. we assume it is impossible, just as most thought the world was flat and space travel was unthinkable at one time. progress is the goal for all of us, and this should be on top of the list. it is up to us, you can only control you and your beliefs. i do not intend to change the world tommorow alone. but i do intend on being a small piece of the overall progress, a player on the team. i only own my mind :cool:
  • my2handsmy2hands Posts: 17,117
    1,200 Billion Dollars to Arm the Planet
    By Pierre Haski
    Rue89

    Monday 11 June 2007

    In the face of that, the effort the G-8 agreed on for Africa was 60 billion dollars. A demagogic observation? You decide ...

    It's demagogic, but I can't help myself. At the end of last week, the G-8 meeting in Germany promised 60 billion dollars for Africa, a sum presented as a significant effort to bring this continent out of despair. Monday, a report revealed that global military spending had reached 1,200 billion dollars last year, that is, an increase of 3.50 percent over the prior year (and of 37 percent over ten years). Take out your calculator: 3.50 percent of 1,200 billion makes the tidy sum of 42 billion dollars, just for the increase over last year. Something to compare to the G-8 gesture ...

    Demagogic, I said, even before the first outraged comments came in ... Obviously, countries not spending this money for their armament, or excessive armament, will not make Africa any better off or assure that the sums thus economized be used wisely. Africa itself, moreover, participates in this spending with several conflicts between the impoverished in Somalia or in the Congo ... Remember the maps that we lined up last week: Africa comes in at the head of continents where people are dying in warfare.

    Moreover, when the planet naively believed, after the end of the Cold War, that the arms race was over, development aid did not, all the same, profit. That was the time when we could report from former USSR tank factories converted into frying pan plants ... Today, people present the fact that Vladimir Putin proposed to George W. Bush that he should install his anti-missile shield in Azerbaijan as a great diplomatic breakthrough ...

    So let's forget Africa and get back to military spending. The Stockholm International Peace Research Institute (SIPRI) annual report allows us to follow the ever-instructive curve of military spending. There one may learn, for example, that the United States spent 529 billion dollars on their military operations in 2006, or a five percent increase over the previous year, essentially due to the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.

    According to the report, France, China, Japan and Great Britain each represented four to five percent of global military spending in 2006. The United States and Russia were the principal arms vendors from 2002 to 2006, with the share of each representing about 30 percent of global sales. Ultimately, China and India remain the world's main arms importers. Two countries in the midst of full-bore economic booms, certainly, but both with significant shares of their population below the poverty line ...

    And to show how far we have come from a disarmament perspective, the report shows that, "The volume of conventional weapons traded internationally in 2006 was 50 percent higher than that of 2002."

    But perhaps it's not so demagogic to make the connection between military spending and the fight against poverty. The Stockholm institute itself emphasizes that, "Millions of human beings' lives could be saved by health measures that would cost a tiny fraction of what the world spends every year on its armies."

    http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/061307G.shtml
  • I dont understand the logic in creating enough nuclear weapons that it could essentially wipes out all life and makes the area unusable.
  • blackredyellowblackredyellow Posts: 5,889
    I dont understand the logic in creating enough nuclear weapons that it could essentially wipes out all life and makes the area unusable.

    neither do I, but we've made enough for that point decades ago, but we are still producing them... It makes no sense to me...
    My whole life
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    of a sunny day
    “We can complain because rose bushes have thorns, or rejoice because thorn bushes have roses.”
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  • neither do I, but we've made enough for that point decades ago, but we are still producing them... It makes no sense to me...


    We got enough (the world) to kill eight billion people. There not even that many people on earth. It's insane logic to believe that that many nuclear weapons are needed and should be developed.
  • jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    my2hands wrote:
    ok i will.

    the human species has made many amazing advances throughout it's brief stay on the planet. major advances have been made, and continue to be made, such as womens rights, racism, slavery, workers rights, childrens rights, education, medicine, science, agriculture, transportation, etc. shit, we figured how to fly and have golfed on the moon (now thats fucking amazing). so i do not buy, for one second, that violence and war is human nature and will always exist on a large scale. bar fights may be inevitable, but a large coordinated campaign of violence with large public support is a different story, that can be "history" as you say....i think it is the easy way of the discussion for us to say it is natural or inevitable. we assume it is impossible, just as most thought the world was flat and space travel was unthinkable at one time. progress is the goal for all of us, and this should be on top of the list. it is up to us, you can only control you and your beliefs. i do not intend to change the world tomorrow alone. but i do intend on being a small piece of the overall progress, a player on the team. i only own my mind :cool:
    hands I'm with ya but i'm just being realistic. borders, land, recourses, will always be at the center of a dispute. do you expect the borders of countries in africa, for example, to stay the same forever? do you think no man will ever want to overthrow a government? look at the amount of dictators in the world. will they all give up power and let freedom reign? its just reality.
  • derka derka derka....

    America...fuck yeah....comin again to save the motherf-ing day yeeeah!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgdPcQWdjng

    America...
    America...
    America, FUCK YEAH!
    Coming again, to save the mother f-ing day yeah,
    America, FUCK YEAH!
    Freedom is the only way yeah,
    Terrorist your game is through cause now you have to answer too,
    America, FUCK YEAH!
    So lick my butt, and suck on my balls,
    America, FUCK YEAH!
    What you going to do when we come for you now,
    it’s the dream that we all share; it’s the hope for tomorrow

    FUCK YEAH!

    McDonalds, FUCK YEAH!
    Wal-Mart, FUCK YEAH!
    The Gap, FUCK YEAH!
    Baseball, FUCK YEAH!
    NFL, FUCK, YEAH!
    Rock and roll, FUCK YEAH!
    The Internet, FUCK YEAH!
    Slavery, FUCK YEAH!

    FUCK YEAH!

    Starbucks, FUCK YEAH!
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    Sushi, FUCK YEAH!
    Taco Bell, FUCK YEAH!
    Rodeos, FUCK YEAH!
    Bed bath and beyond (Fuck yeah, Fuck yeah)

    Liberty, FUCK YEAH!
    White Slips, FUCK YEAH!
    The Alamo, FUCK YEAH!
    Band-aids, FUCK YEAH!
    Las Vegas, FUCK YEAH!
    Christmas, FUCK YEAH!
    Immigrants, FUCK YEAH!
    Popeye, FUCK YEAH!
    Democrats, FUCK YEAH!
    Republicans (republicans) <
    :D
    (fuck yeah, fuck yeah)
    Sportsmanship
    Books

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/America,_Fuck_Yeah
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

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  • Alex_CoeAlex_Coe Posts: 762
    Presumably the point of building extra nukes is to get past missile defense... so if the russians develop a nuke-shooter-downer, and they shoot down 90% of our nukes the other 10% will be enough to obliterate Russia. Well, that's my theory.

    Also, nukes are great against aliens.
  • Alex_Coe wrote:
    Presumably the point of building extra nukes is to get past missile defense... so if the russians develop a nuke-shooter-downer, and they shoot down 90% of our nukes the other 10% will be enough to obliterate Russia. Well, that's my theory.

    Also, nukes are great against aliens.



    Only if a drunk pesticide pilot can fly his jet into that blue thingy.
  • my2handsmy2hands Posts: 17,117
    jlew24asu wrote:
    hands I'm with ya but i'm just being realistic. borders, land, recourses, will always be at the center of a dispute. do you expect the borders of countries in africa, for example, to stay the same forever? do you think no man will ever want to overthrow a government? look at the amount of dictators in the world. will they all give up power and let freedom reign? its just reality.

    lets stick to strictly our country, the good old USA. i cant control the politics of another country or region.

    who is a threat to our borders? who would invade us? why would they do that? do you really think we are threatened, with or without our arsenal?


    ps...having several thousand nukes pointed at each others civilian centers is not realistic, that is insane.
  • jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    my2hands wrote:
    lets stick to strictly our country, the good old USA. i cant control the politics of another country or region.
    ok. I think we spend too much and should not be building more nukes
    my2hands wrote:
    who is a threat to our borders? who would invade us? why would they do that? do you really think we are threatened, with or without our arsenal?
    if we had no means of defense, what would stop anyone from invading us? or attacking us?

    my2hands wrote:
    ps...having several thousand nukes pointed at each others civilian centers is not realistic, that is insane.
    I agree.
  • my2handsmy2hands Posts: 17,117
    jlew24asu wrote:

    if we had no means of defense, what would stop anyone from invading us? or attacking us?



    who would invade us and for what purpose?

    mexico? canada?
  • jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    my2hands wrote:
    who would invade us and for what purpose?

    mexico? canada?
    mexico could easily invade arizona and texas. I like those states.
  • my2handsmy2hands Posts: 17,117
    jlew24asu wrote:
    mexico could easily invade arizona and texas. I like those states.

    your joking right. your advocating for having the worlds strongest military to prevent mexico from invading us?

    when you really think about it, the self defense thing loses weight quickly. considering no one is a threat to invade us, and their really is no good reason to invade us. just as no one has invaded the erupoean countries with minimal military.

    if we are the best country, then we lead by example. the current example we are setting is militarization and pre-emtpive war, littering the planet with weapons of unspeakable devastating power. we should be doing the exact opposite, leading this planet into a new era of awareness and progress.
  • chromiamchromiam Posts: 4,114
    my2hands wrote:
    your joking right. your advocating for having the worlds strongest military to prevent mexico from invading us?

    when you really think about it, the self defense thing loses weight quickly. considering no one is a threat to invade us, and their really is no good reason to invade us. just as no one has invaded the erupoean countries with minimal military.

    if we are the best country, then we lead by example. the current example we are setting is militarization and pre-emtpive war, littering the planet with weapons of unspeakable devastating power. we should be doing the exact opposite, leading this planet into a new era of awareness and progress.

    no one is a threat to invade us???? That's a joke, right?? Start dismantling the naval and air force which the US has put together and I'm sure that there will be plenty of countries lining up to try to create instability and fear in this country.... hell some are already trying even with all the military might we have.
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  • SpecificsSpecifics Posts: 417
    When you look at the big wars its quite simple to see that its not armies that win wars, it's the people, bought in, quickly taught the necessary very simple skills by the regulars. No-one had or has the number of people in their army that was killed in WW2. It seems to me sizable professional armies serve only one purpose, the fear of not dominating, and to me this is as weak as it gets.

    I say with all seriousness, lets use our money to bring education and health to the World, and use charity to build funds for wars, then we will quickly see who supports war and how inevitable it is. Give us life, sell us war, not the other way around.

    If ever a war NEEDS fighting then there are plenty of strong people of courage who will step forward and give whatever it takes, money/life for that. I strongly doubt it would be the same people who salivate watching others blood spilled
  • SpecificsSpecifics Posts: 417
    chromiam wrote:
    no one is a threat to invade us???? That's a joke, right?? Start dismantling the naval and air force which the US has put together and I'm sure that there will be plenty of countries lining up to try to create instability and fear in this country.... hell some are already trying even with all the military might we have.

    Why would they invade? for natural resources? money? what would they be giving their life to obtain? the Simpsons? there is one reason why anybody hates america, and its certainly not jealousy, stop kidding yourself man, its sad.
  • jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    my2hands wrote:
    your joking right. your advocating for having the worlds strongest military to prevent mexico from invading us?
    i'm not advocating being the strongest. but I certainly would rather be the best, then average.
    my2hands wrote:
    when you really think about it, the self defense thing loses weight quickly. considering no one is a threat to invade us, and their really is no good reason to invade us. just as no one has invaded the erupoean countries with minimal military.
    mexico or canada isnt a threat to us because of our military strength. and since when does a country need a "good" reason to invade? remember the alamo ring a bell? I'm not saying mexico would invade us but without a defense system we would be vulnerable.
    my2hands wrote:
    if we are the best country, then we lead by example. the current example we are setting is militarization and pre-emtpive war, littering the planet with weapons of unspeakable devastating power. we should be doing the exact opposite, leading this planet into a new era of awareness and progress.
    I agree. but the world is a fucked up place. no matter how we lead, countries will always go to war with each other. I happen to like ron paul's approach with less foreign policy. although how much are we leading by example if we sit back and allow other countries destroy each other.
  • jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    Specifics wrote:
    Why would they invade? for natural resources? money? what would they be giving their life to obtain? the Simpsons? there is one reason why anybody hates america, and its certainly not jealousy, stop kidding yourself man, its sad.
    countries dont invade each other because of jealousy. they do it for power and control. although many countries are jealous of us. why do so many people come here for the "american dream". not everyone hates america as much as you.
  • SpecificsSpecifics Posts: 417
    jlew24asu wrote:
    countries dont invade each other because of jealousy. they do it for power and control. although many countries are jealous of us. why do so many people come here for the "american dream". not everyone hates america as much as you.

    People move all over the world, for the "fill in the blank dream". I know many more that move to New Zealand which has unbelievable natural beauty, a miniscule military, and no history whatsoever of invasion. I know many many more that move to Australia which is mostly a barren, arid, shit-hole (no offence sheila:p), Spain, France, i know many many many that come to Britain. Do i need to go on?

    Why would people be more jealous of america than a lot of other countries?
    and what power and control is to be gained from invading america?
  • jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    Specifics wrote:
    People move all over the world, for the "fill in the blank dream". I know many more that move to New Zealand which has unbelievable natural beauty, a miniscule military, and no history whatsoever of invasion. I know many many more that move to Australia which is mostly a barren, arid, shit-hole (no offence sheila:p), Spain, France, i know many many many that come to Britain. Do i need to go on?
    no you dont. I'd love for you to shut the fuck up. but you're wrong, more people come to america for an oppurtunity then all the of countries you mentioned combined.
    Specifics wrote:
    Why would people be more jealous of america than a lot of other countries?
    because we are the richest most successful country in the world. I know you hate that fact, sorry tini wini.
    Specifics wrote:
    and what power and control is to be gained from invading america?
    mexico fought a war to control texas. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mexican-American_War.
  • lastexit78lastexit78 Posts: 618
    Try to imagine what this planet would look like if nobody had ever developed nuclear arms. In my opinion it would be a complete mess. The only reason the Cold War stayed cold was the threat of nuclear conflict. We'd probably be entering World War 4 right about now if it wasn't for nuclear weapons and the fear they inflict. For some reason most people have forgotten just how violent the first half of the 20th century was. You could argue that the last 60 years have been the most peaceful in human history. That's amazing when you think about what's taken place these last six decades. Shrinking natural resources, overpopulation and a long list of lunatic leaders. A large reason for this peace is the US military and the fear it's created around the world. I look at the first Gulf War as a perfect example of this. We basically destroyed an Iraqi military that was supposed to be formidable in about a week. Don't you think that other countries took notice of this? Of course they did. Us being the force we are has deterred more confilcts than most people realize. It's a shame the idiots in power have completely misused this power the last 5 years. Because if used properly our military is the greatest peace keeping force on the planet.
    06/22/95, 11/04/95, 11/15/97, 07/16/98, 10/30/99, 10/30/00, 10/31/00, 10/20/01, 10/21/01, 12/08/02, 06/01/03, 06/06/03, 10/25/03, 10/26/03, 09/28/04, 03/18/05, 09/01/05, 07/15/06, 07/16/06, 07/18/06, 07/22/06, 07/23/06, 10/21/06, 10/22/06, 08/28/09, 09/21/09, 09/22/09, 05/20/10, 05/21/10, 10/24/10, 11/26/13, 12/06/13, 06/28/14, 10/26/14, 07/10/18, 08/10/18, 10/02/21, 
  • SpecificsSpecifics Posts: 417
    jlew24asu wrote:
    no you dont. I'd love for you to shut the fuck up. but you're wrong, more people come to america for an oppurtunity then all the of countries you mentioned combined.

    because we are the richest most successful country in the world. I know you hate that fact, sorry tini wini.

    mexico fought a war to control texas. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mexican-American_War.

    Oh dear man.
    No class, no sense, no balls.

    you respect this shit above any other because your hard-wired anthem filled head has clearly been way too easy to control. Many others like a sense of history and class in their surroundings and natural beauty. I'm positive you can find this in a fair part of america too. Where do most of the people you talk about emigrate from?

    Why did mexico want Texas?
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