why do you believe in God or...

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  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    hippiemom wrote:
    I'd say it's going to affect at least one of you quite dramatically somewhere down the line. I'm not suggesting that you try to change one another's beliefs, just sayin'. I sure wish I'd be around to hear the very surprised thoughts of one or both of you when the time comes, regarding the fairness of it all.
    assuming that one of us is right, when the whole ordeal happens, right? i never said you were suggesting that we should change each other's beliefs.... i was stressing the importance of faith, belief without seeing since you said neither one of us know if we are right. that's what my faith is about.... i think that's what his faith was about too.

    allbeit the importance lies in what is now, and respecting each other for our differences in beliefs. just like jesus did... when he was questioned by the pharisees if his works were indeed done by God he asked them who they thought John the baptist was and if they could answer he'd answer their question. They were afraid that what they might answer might get them into trouble so they refused to answer. Jesus said, "ok, you can't answer my question then I can't answer yours either." In other words, believe in whatever the hell you want. Anything else is irrelevant. I'm not going to waste my time disproving that you were wrong, or that a muslim is wrong or that anyone is wrong. So why waste your time trying to disprove my faith?
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • deadnote
    deadnote Posts: 1,678
    i believe there is a god but i dont believe in her/him
    i sit around wishing i was asleep all the time

    what kind of life is that ?
    set your laughter free

    dreamer in my dream

    we got the guns

    i love you,but im..............callin out.........callin out
  • soulsinging
    soulsinging Posts: 13,202
    chopitdown wrote:
    I think the symbolism of the cross and jesus is that after Jesus died the opportunity is available to jew and gentile. He does have his so called chosen people, but he extended the opportunity for salvation to all. It would somewhat agree with your def of a vain and petty god (God is admittedly a jealous God (per OT)) but as soon as the salvation opportunity was made open to everyone he becomes all inviting. The bible says God wishes that none would perish, and since we haven't chatted face to face, I'll have to take him at his word. There are those that b/c of that verse feel that there is universal salvation; and there are others who don't feel that way chiefly b/c of "I am the way the truth and the life no man comes to the father but through me". I found a book, as i posted somewhere in here earlier, called the difficult doctrine of love...your university may have it (i'm sure as a law student you have all sorts of time to read extra books :) ) I hope this helps somewhat.

    yes, lots of free time these days ;)

    i guess i tend more towards the universal salvation end of thinsg then... or would if i believed in salvation. i guess what ive been discussing here is kind of off-topic... less why do i believe in god and more why i do not believe god is like the christian god. i can't wrap my head around a god with human traits like jealousy or vanity.
  • Ahnimus
    Ahnimus Posts: 10,560
    The seventh commandment is thou shalt not admit adultery.

    Christians have only one spouse. This is called monotony.

    Kids on the Old and New Testaments
    http://basicjokes.com/djoke.php?id=551
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • catefrances
    catefrances Posts: 29,003
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    well, i guess you've just put on a whole new meaning to righteousness all on your own. righteousness literally means perfection. upright, a just man/woman, a perfect person.

    that i'd doubt anyone has ever lived by

    righteous does not mean perfect. being perfect is an impossibility.
    being a just person again, does not mean one is perfect. you being a believer should surely know that mankind is not born perfect. and thus how does one gain perfection if one is born with sin?
    righteous means being without sin or guilt. and though i do not profess to ever being without guilt, i still choose to live my life without doing harm to anyone else as much as i can consciously can. and by my living what i see as a life with high motrals. i do not mean society's morals, because as a single aprent and atheist i am already at odds with that. but of course as you probably have gathered from many of my previous postings, society's idea of morality is not something that holds great sway with me.
    as for being wthout sin. well...i am an atheist and so see sin as a religious construct and therefore choose not to class 'wrongdoings' and 'indiscretions' as sins. :)
    hear my name
    take a good look
    this could be the day
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  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    catefrances wrote:
    righteous does not mean perfect. being perfect is an impossibility.
    being a just person again, does not mean one is perfect. you being a believer should surely know that mankind is not born perfect. and thus how does one gain perfection if one is born with sin?
    righteous means being without sin or guilt. and though i do not profess to ever being without guilt, i still choose to live my life without doing harm to anyone else as much as i can consciously can. and by my living what i see as a life with high motrals. i do not mean society's morals, because as a single aprent and atheist i am already at odds with that. but of course as you probably have gathered from many of my previous postings, society's idea of morality is not something that holds great sway with me.
    as for being wthout sin. well...i am an atheist and so see sin as a religious construct and therefore choose not to class 'wrongdoings' and 'indiscretions' as sins. :)
    well, i'm definitely not referring to sin in this case.

    i mean if you've found a way to be righteous well that's great. i personally don't think that we humans could ever be righteous... sure, we could be righteous by "faith" but in a humanly way it is impossible. somewhere down the line i'm sure i've offended someone in some way.
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    soulsinging wrote:
    yes, lots of free time these days ;)

    i guess i tend more towards the universal salvation end of thinsg then... or would if i believed in salvation. i guess what ive been discussing here is kind of off-topic... less why do i believe in god and more why i do not believe god is like the christian god. i can't wrap my head around a god with human traits like jealousy or vanity.
    i personally think that there are no limitations of any kind to a so-called god. it depends on what concepts you might have of this being, but to me, this god has no limitations to emotions. that's a god to me. a god can have anger and love all at once and it doesn't belittle this being in any way if he/she has emotions of any kind. i personally think that it's an even more profound concept to think that he is an emotional entity as well as sovereign.
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • callen
    callen Posts: 6,388
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    i personally think that there are no limitations of any kind to a so-called god. it depends on what concepts you might have of this being, but to me, this god has no limitations to emotions. that's a god to me. a god can have anger and love all at once and it doesn't belittle this being in any way if he/she has emotions of any kind. i personally think that it's an even more profound concept to think that he is an emotional entity as well as sovereign.
    so nice to find a god that fits one's needs......just gives one that warm fuzzy secure feeling...that special feeling....magical almost.
    10-18-2000 Houston, 04-06-2003 Houston, 6-25-2003 Toronto, 10-8-2004 Kissimmee, 9-4-2005 Calgary, 12-3-05 Sao Paulo, 7-2-2006 Denver, 7-22-06 Gorge, 7-23-2006 Gorge, 9-13-2006 Bern, 6-22-2008 DC, 6-24-2008 MSG, 6-25-2008 MSG
  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    callen wrote:
    so nice to find a god that fits one's needs......just gives one that warm fuzzy secure feeling...that special feeling....magical almost.
    ok
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • callen
    callen Posts: 6,388
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    ok
    it is okay.....sing with me......."its okay......it's okaayaaayyayyyaaa......its okay.....its okayyyyayyyayyyaaaa"
    10-18-2000 Houston, 04-06-2003 Houston, 6-25-2003 Toronto, 10-8-2004 Kissimmee, 9-4-2005 Calgary, 12-3-05 Sao Paulo, 7-2-2006 Denver, 7-22-06 Gorge, 7-23-2006 Gorge, 9-13-2006 Bern, 6-22-2008 DC, 6-24-2008 MSG, 6-25-2008 MSG
  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    callen wrote:
    it is okay.....sing with me......."its okay......it's okaayaaayyayyyaaa......its okay.....its okayyyyayyyayyyaaaa"
    :confused: do people always act so strange when meeting someone who believes in a god? ;)
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • catefrances
    catefrances Posts: 29,003
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    well, i'm definitely not referring to sin in this case.

    i mean if you've found a way to be righteous well that's great. i personally don't think that we humans could ever be righteous... sure, we could be righteous by "faith" but in a humanly way it is impossible. somewhere down the line i'm sure i've offended someone in some way.


    one would imagine that intent has a great deal to do with it. i am gonna go out on a limb here and say that one should not be 'punished' nor held accountable for something they have done that they are unconscious of.
    hear my name
    take a good look
    this could be the day
    hold my hand
    lie beside me
    i just need to say
  • soulsinging
    soulsinging Posts: 13,202
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    i personally think that there are no limitations of any kind to a so-called god. it depends on what concepts you might have of this being, but to me, this god has no limitations to emotions. that's a god to me. a god can have anger and love all at once and it doesn't belittle this being in any way if he/she has emotions of any kind. i personally think that it's an even more profound concept to think that he is an emotional entity as well as sovereign.

    but i imagine, being a perfect being, it would have only the perfect emotions... love, compassion, etc. not jealousy (of people worshipping god by the wrong name or practices) or whatever else. aren't envy, pride, and wrath among the seven deadly sins? why does god get to indulge in them?
  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    soulsinging wrote:
    but i imagine, being a perfect being, it would have only the perfect emotions... love, compassion, etc. not jealousy (of people worshipping god by the wrong name or practices) or whatever else. aren't envy, pride, and wrath among the seven deadly sins? why does god get to indulge in them?
    well, the seven "deadly" sins were labeled by the roman catholic church... i don't know where they get it from, figuring that it's not in the bible. but who said that envy, pride, and wrath were not perfect emotions? i could hate someone perfectly... if you get what i'm saying. ;)
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    catefrances wrote:
    one would imagine that intent has a great deal to do with it. i am gonna go out on a limb here and say that one should not be 'punished' nor held accountable for something they have done that they are unconscious of.
    you mean like when you ignore someone, only you didn't mean to but they thought you purposely ignored them?
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • catefrances
    catefrances Posts: 29,003
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    you mean like when you ignore someone, only you didn't mean to but they thought you purposely ignored them?

    well quite frankly i hardly think you're going to hell for ignoring someone. ;):D

    it depends on what your mean by 'didn't mean to'?
    were you aware of their presence? if you were not aware of their presence then your ignoring them was unintentional wasn't it? therefore how can you be responsible for an action that came about because of something you were unaware of? you know what i'm saying?
    hear my name
    take a good look
    this could be the day
    hold my hand
    lie beside me
    i just need to say
  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    catefrances wrote:
    well quite frankly i hardly think you're going to hell for ignoring someone. ;):D

    it depends on what your mean by 'didn't mean to'?
    were you aware of their presence? if you were not aware of their presence then your ignoring them was unintentional wasn't it? therefore how can you be responsible for an action that came about because of something you were unaware of? you know what i'm saying?
    ??? i wasn't saying that you'll go to hell for unintentionally ignoring someone. i was just asking if that's what you meant when you said, "one should not be 'punished' nor held accountable for something they have done that they are unconscious of." sorta like unintentionally ignoring someone.
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • catefrances
    catefrances Posts: 29,003
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    ??? i wasn't saying that you'll go to hell for unintentionally ignoring someone. i was just asking if that's what you meant when you said, "one should not be 'punished' nor held accountable for something they have done that they are unconscious of." sorta like unintentionally ignoring someone.


    i know that's not what you meant. i was just messing with you. sometimes it gets a bit heavy around here, you know? :D
    hear my name
    take a good look
    this could be the day
    hold my hand
    lie beside me
    i just need to say
  • writersu
    writersu Posts: 1,867
    catefrances wrote:
    ...why don't you, if that is the case.


    i am an atheist. i don't believe in a God cause it makes absolutely no sense to me. this has been the case since i was 11 years old. religion does not give me the answers i require.


    ok just because you asked.........

    I believe in God because I cannot imagine how the whole world could be in sync for no reason. By "world" I mean, nature not mankind who always screw up the world.

    And I believe in Jesus because of the apostle Paul, who killed Christians and then saw the risen Jesus and changed his mind totally about the whole thing. He then led a life of total chaos and still preached about Jesus and what He taught us. If he did not believe it to be true, he would have bailed. That said, though religion does not have anything to do with God although many people think it does. Religion is about rituals and faith is about living. Jesus came and told the Pharisees, "You have the rules right but your hearts are hard." (not a quote just a wrap up of what he said)

    I am currently not attending church. My ex goes there and he was a total bastard---still is

    he gives church a bad name.........
    Baby, You Wouldn't Last a Minute on The Creek......


    Together we will float like angels.........

    In the moment that you left the room, the album started skipping, goodbye to beauty shared with the ones that you love.........
  • soulsinging
    soulsinging Posts: 13,202
    writersu wrote:
    ok just because you asked.........

    I believe in God because I cannot imagine how the whole world could be in sync for no reason. By "world" I mean, nature not mankind who always screw up the world.

    And I believe in Jesus because of the apostle Paul, who killed Christians and then saw the risen Jesus and changed his mind totally about the whole thing. He then led a life of total chaos and still preached about Jesus and what He taught us. If he did not believe it to be true, he would have bailed. That said, though religion does not have anything to do with God although many people think it does. Religion is about rituals and faith is about living. Jesus came and told the Pharisees, "You have the rules right but your hearts are hard." (not a quote just a wrap up of what he said)

    I am currently not attending church. My ex goes there and he was a total bastard---still is

    he gives church a bad name.........

    the hale bopp people went from being normal members of society to giving away all their earthly possessions and then committing suicide to catch the alien spaceship behind the comet. if they did not believe that to be true, they would have bailed. is that sufficient to believe they are right?

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