Dying Bees theories...

13

Comments

  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,042
    rgambs said:

    Gaia's Garden is great!!! A subscription to Mother Earth News is also absolutely necessary to anyone interested in whole, ethical food. All home gardens have permaculture aspects, people have done hedges and Marigolds for time out of sight, we just gotta get back to common sense living!
    look into native perrenial edibles. berries are the obvious place to start but there should be plenty of leafy greens and some tubers, here we have Jerusalem Artichoke. that should be pine nut heaven out there isn't it? over time you can "domesticate" them slightly and they should thrive in the local soil

    I am green with envy, I have productive soil in Ohio but I don't have the bounty of The Range of Light to provide sustenance to my soul. Speaking about a quaint farm for sale Thoreau says "...and do all those things which had no other motive or excuse but that I might pay for it and be unmolested in my possession of it; for I knew all the while that it would yeild the most abundant crop of the kind I wanted if I could only afford to let it alone." Rejoice in the bounty of the Sierra's! You have such a garden at your doorstep. Muir's playground, the granite capital of the world!!!
    "I am monarch of all I survey, My right there is none to dispute."
    Set forth and rule the land Mr. Lux!! However many mountains you climb in a year it cannot be enough, nor can it ever be too many. Survey the land and own it for the rest of your days!

    An infectiously joyous post, rgambs!

    I am grateful indeed to be so close these marvelous mountains-- and seeing snow on them once again is fantastic! I've moved around a good bit in my time and have found that each place has it's gifts and it's magic. I very much enjoyed seeing the rolling hills of your Ohio (and envy it's productive soil- these foothill soils need much amending). I loved the salt air and ubiquitous green of Puget Sound when I lived up north. And despite bitter cold winters, I very much loved the vineyards and orchards and fertile fields of western New York State. Part of me wants to return to all these places but I find it likely that my home state of California is where I'll spend the rest of my days. You never know though- I always found it fascinating that so quintessentially Californian a person as John Steinbeck would spend his final years about as far away from this state on the mainland- the tip of Long Island- as possible.

    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • rgambsrgambs Posts: 13,576
    Steinbeck! What a modern master! Have you read any Muir? Emerson and Thoreau were men of letters who wrote about a life of action but Johnny boy actually lived it! Bold mammajamma right there walkin the walk! My wife and I are 90% decided to tear up our roots and Entmarch around the world in a state of semi-transience. Gardening is the one thing I won't be able to do to my satisfaction, but anybody anywhere can grow some maters out on the deck!
    Monkey Driven, Call this Living?
  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,042
    rgambs said:

    Steinbeck! What a modern master! Have you read any Muir? Emerson and Thoreau were men of letters who wrote about a life of action but Johnny boy actually lived it! Bold mammajamma right there walkin the walk! My wife and I are 90% decided to tear up our roots and Entmarch around the world in a state of semi-transience. Gardening is the one thing I won't be able to do to my satisfaction, but anybody anywhere can grow some maters out on the deck!

    Yeah, I've read at least a little by every major nature and environmental writer and several who are lesser known. All of which makes focusing on specific solutions or ideas about what our best course of action is. Several things I think most of us will accept as obvious benefits- recycling, conserving resources and energy and so forth. But there are at least a couple a major view points that are diametrically opposed and- at least to my way of thinking- maybe not so easy to chose between.

    One school of thought says that the sooner civilization collapses the better. This mode of thinking is based on the belief that human nature will not change, that we are a destructive and wasteful species and that our impact on the planet is harmful and the sooner most of us are out of here the better. In theory, I see a lot of truth in this. But that's a difficult path to choose and the ramifications are frightening when thinking about ones own and one's loved ones survival.

    Another basic philosophy about all this says that we just need to learn to live in a sustainable manner. But some well versed environmental thinkers believe recycling, carbon offsetting, hybrid and electric cars and so forth are just things we do to make us feel better and that with countries like China and India expanding their consumption added to other developed nations like the U.S. with our already in place consumption- that all of that adds up to the same outcome- eventually the environment will not be suited to ours or many other life form's existence.

    Another line of thinking says any hope of solving environmental problems such as fresh water shortages, global warming, and pollution rests on finding new solutions through increased technology. Many environmental purists believe technology was the problem in the first place and point out that some of these co-called high tech solutions only cause further problems- such as the massive arrays of solar collectors in desert regions which are greatly harming desert eco-systems.

    So the answers are not easy to find.


    But I hugely digress. We were talking about bees and their plight, which of course is very much related to environmental issues.

    Another canary-in-the-coal-mine is the Monarch Butterfly. Here's an interesting article about their plight:

    http://blog.nature.org/science/2014/02/26/cornfield-monarch-butterfly-decline-pollinators-agriculture/
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • polaris_xpolaris_x Posts: 13,559
    rgambs ... there must be community gardens where you are at?
  • rgambsrgambs Posts: 13,576
    no sir mr polaris no community gardens...i live near amish country and everyone grows their own garden...i cant think of a house on my road that doesnt have a small veg garden. We do have local farmers markets which are awesome!
    Monkey Driven, Call this Living?
  • polaris_xpolaris_x Posts: 13,559
    rgambs said:

    no sir mr polaris no community gardens...i live near amish country and everyone grows their own garden...i cant think of a house on my road that doesnt have a small veg garden. We do have local farmers markets which are awesome!

    well ... at least you have access to that ...
  • LieslLiesl Posts: 64
    Yes its the chemicals,mostly insectiside that contain neomicotinoids accumulate on the plants and are slowly poisioning the bees. Its is also a range diseases and mites that have come from othr countrys. We here in New Zealand have been invaded by the Varroa bee mite, which has caused about half of our wild honey bee population to dye. (as well as the chemicals). I watched a documentary last week on honey bees, and it said America has no wild honey bees left, all that you have are "farmed" bees that have to be treated with antibiotics to keep them healthy, they showed a family who have many thousand bees that they literallly drive the hives around, on the back of a truck to polinate peoples crops. We are starting to see evidence here in New Zealand that our wild bees that live in a built up area are actually more healthy than the ones that live in heavily farmed areas. We are desperatly trying to get our honey bee populatiion to recover. Its serious people, we will potentially loose one third of the worlds food if we kill bees, and that will be just the begining.
  • rgambsrgambs Posts: 13,576
    yes, here in america we truck bees back and forth across the nation to achieve commercial pollination. it i sad and unsustainable. there are still "wild" honeybees but not even a fraction of whats needed to pollinate. there are a quadrillion corn kernels needing pollinated each year.. that's alot lol
    Monkey Driven, Call this Living?
  • callencallen Posts: 6,388
    Cosmo said:

    polaris" said:
    i would suspect it has something to do with what we are doing to the environment ... the arctic seal that recently got rescued in florida is yet another indication ...
    ...
    We will be the ultimate demise of our species... well, actually, our arrogance and our denial will do us in. Mother Earth can only take so much. Mass Extinction is a means for her to heal.

    Its evolution baby and we're part if it. Bright side the planet will continue wo the human virus. Checked out some white tigers in zoo last Saturday. Sad all the magnificent animals that are becoming extinct due to us. Be fruitful and multiply. HA.
    10-18-2000 Houston, 04-06-2003 Houston, 6-25-2003 Toronto, 10-8-2004 Kissimmee, 9-4-2005 Calgary, 12-3-05 Sao Paulo, 7-2-2006 Denver, 7-22-06 Gorge, 7-23-2006 Gorge, 9-13-2006 Bern, 6-22-2008 DC, 6-24-2008 MSG, 6-25-2008 MSG
  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,042
    callen said:

    Cosmo said:

    polaris" said:
    i would suspect it has something to do with what we are doing to the environment ... the arctic seal that recently got rescued in florida is yet another indication ...
    ...
    We will be the ultimate demise of our species... well, actually, our arrogance and our denial will do us in. Mother Earth can only take so much. Mass Extinction is a means for her to heal.
    Its evolution baby and we're part if it. Bright side the planet will continue wo the human virus. Checked out some white tigers in zoo last Saturday. Sad all the magnificent animals that are becoming extinct due to us. Be fruitful and multiply. HA.

    I've often thought the same thing, Callen, that our demise is almost a certainty and a natural part of life's/nature's cycles and that we are rather vain in thinking we can go on infinitely. It's natural that with our big brains, our emotional make up and our vivid imaginations we would want to carry on. How many of us really want to die? And yet we do seem hell-bent on destroying ourselves. It really is like (and I don't mean the song title here) that we are engaged in world wide suicide.

    Like you, I see it as positive that the planet will go on without us but why would we take ourselves out of the game early when we could easily go much longer. I agree that evolution will and maybe even should move us along in due time but by our actions, we are manipulating evolution's time tables* in a way that will shorten our longevity. What other species is dumb enough to do that? Why are we doing that? I often ask that question: why the fuck are we doing that?

    Ha! JonnyPistachio, if you are reading this, how's this for a song-line turn about:

    "Evolution is fucking with me right now." <-----> "We are fucking with evolution right now." image



    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • JWPearlJWPearl Posts: 19,893
    I actually feel educated from this thread and now im curious to know what's going down with the bees.
  • JWPearlJWPearl Posts: 19,893
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Posts: 49,954
    The dying bees thing scares the shit out of me.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,042
    This is majorly fucked up:

    http://earthweareone.com/37-million-bees-found-dead-in-ontario-canada-after-planting-large-gmo-corn-field/

    37 Million Bees Found Dead In Ontario, Canada After Planting Large GMO Corn Field

    Millions of bees dropped dead after GMO corn was planted few weeks ago in Ontario, Canada. The local bee keeper, Dave Schuit who produces honey in Elmwood lost about 37 million bees which are about 600 hives.

    Full article at link. When will these people ever wake up?
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • Jason PJason P Posts: 19,138
    brianlux said:

    This is majorly fucked up:

    http://earthweareone.com/37-million-bees-found-dead-in-ontario-canada-after-planting-large-gmo-corn-field/

    37 Million Bees Found Dead In Ontario, Canada After Planting Large GMO Corn Field

    Millions of bees dropped dead after GMO corn was planted few weeks ago in Ontario, Canada. The local bee keeper, Dave Schuit who produces honey in Elmwood lost about 37 million bees which are about 600 hives.

    Full article at link. When will these people ever wake up?

    You don't plant corn in December in Ontario Canada.
  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,042
    Jason P said:

    brianlux said:

    This is majorly fucked up:

    http://earthweareone.com/37-million-bees-found-dead-in-ontario-canada-after-planting-large-gmo-corn-field/

    37 Million Bees Found Dead In Ontario, Canada After Planting Large GMO Corn Field

    Millions of bees dropped dead after GMO corn was planted few weeks ago in Ontario, Canada. The local bee keeper, Dave Schuit who produces honey in Elmwood lost about 37 million bees which are about 600 hives.

    Full article at link. When will these people ever wake up?

    You don't plant corn in December in Ontario Canada.
    People who plant GMO products think they are God's anyway and can work against nature. Did I say, "insane Gods"? :wink:

    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • brianlux said:

    This is majorly fucked up:

    http://earthweareone.com/37-million-bees-found-dead-in-ontario-canada-after-planting-large-gmo-corn-field/

    37 Million Bees Found Dead In Ontario, Canada After Planting Large GMO Corn Field

    Millions of bees dropped dead after GMO corn was planted few weeks ago in Ontario, Canada. The local bee keeper, Dave Schuit who produces honey in Elmwood lost about 37 million bees which are about 600 hives.

    Full article at link. When will these people ever wake up?

    Dr David Suzuki has been on a quest to save the bees for some time now. if you don't know who he is, you should:

    http://www.davidsuzuki.org/david/

    I really wish I would have gone to see him on his most recent speaking tour of Canada. My wife wasn't interested, and I didn't bother finding someone else to go with. I now regret it. He won't be doing another one ever again.

    http://www.davidsuzuki.org/blogs/science-matters/2014/07/its-time-to-save-the-bees-and-ban-neonic-pesticides/

    new album "Cigarettes" out Spring 2025!

    www.headstonesband.com




  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,042

    brianlux said:

    This is majorly fucked up:

    http://earthweareone.com/37-million-bees-found-dead-in-ontario-canada-after-planting-large-gmo-corn-field/

    37 Million Bees Found Dead In Ontario, Canada After Planting Large GMO Corn Field

    Millions of bees dropped dead after GMO corn was planted few weeks ago in Ontario, Canada. The local bee keeper, Dave Schuit who produces honey in Elmwood lost about 37 million bees which are about 600 hives.

    Full article at link. When will these people ever wake up?

    Dr David Suzuki has been on a quest to save the bees for some time now. if you don't know who he is, you should:

    http://www.davidsuzuki.org/david/

    I really wish I would have gone to see him on his most recent speaking tour of Canada. My wife wasn't interested, and I didn't bother finding someone else to go with. I now regret it. He won't be doing another one ever again.

    http://www.davidsuzuki.org/blogs/science-matters/2014/07/its-time-to-save-the-bees-and-ban-neonic-pesticides/

    Suzuki does great work- thanks for posting this, P!

    I read an article somewhere that basically called Dr. Suzuki a hypocrite because he lives comfortably but considering the great work he has done- well damn!- I'm glad he is doing well. His work is invaluable!

    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • Jason PJason P Posts: 19,138
    Speaking of bees, I saw this new bee hive tap that looks pretty amazing compared to what people used to have do to get the honey.

    The pair came up with the idea on the New South Wales north coast, near Byron Bay, wanting to find an easier way to extract honey than the time-consuming and elaborate current system of dismantling the hive.
    It was a combination of bee stings through his protective suit and his distress at squashing bees as he put the hive back together that had Cedar thinking there had to be a better way.

    “So my Dad and I set to work on a decade-long task of inventing the beekeepers dream,” he said.

    His solution was to design plastic honeycomb frames that split in two with the turn of a handle, allowing the honey to drain down and out without opening the hive or disturbing the bees. It then locks back in place for the bees to reset with wax and refill. A perspex window into the hive allows you to see when the honeycomb is full and ready to be harvested.

    “This really is a revolution. You can see into the hive, see when the honey is ready and take it away in such a gentle way,” Cedar said.


    Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com.au/crowdfunding-investors-went-nuts-for-this-gamechanging-australian-invention-a-beehive-with-a-honey-tap-2015-2#ixzz3SbXdshTx

    image

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NclSobmdnGc
  • brianlux said:

    brianlux said:

    This is majorly fucked up:

    http://earthweareone.com/37-million-bees-found-dead-in-ontario-canada-after-planting-large-gmo-corn-field/

    37 Million Bees Found Dead In Ontario, Canada After Planting Large GMO Corn Field

    Millions of bees dropped dead after GMO corn was planted few weeks ago in Ontario, Canada. The local bee keeper, Dave Schuit who produces honey in Elmwood lost about 37 million bees which are about 600 hives.

    Full article at link. When will these people ever wake up?

    Dr David Suzuki has been on a quest to save the bees for some time now. if you don't know who he is, you should:

    http://www.davidsuzuki.org/david/

    I really wish I would have gone to see him on his most recent speaking tour of Canada. My wife wasn't interested, and I didn't bother finding someone else to go with. I now regret it. He won't be doing another one ever again.

    http://www.davidsuzuki.org/blogs/science-matters/2014/07/its-time-to-save-the-bees-and-ban-neonic-pesticides/

    Suzuki does great work- thanks for posting this, P!

    I read an article somewhere that basically called Dr. Suzuki a hypocrite because he lives comfortably but considering the great work he has done- well damn!- I'm glad he is doing well. His work is invaluable!

    I always laugh when people criticize others for living comfortably. I don't see that as a negative at all. So do the guys in PJ. what are they supposed to do? give away every last red cent just because they rail against the interests of the 1%? People need to keep in mind that not all people who belong to the 1% tax bracket necessarily have the same interests as those associated with said evil 1%. I'd say only 70% of the 1% are bad. :)

    new album "Cigarettes" out Spring 2025!

    www.headstonesband.com




  • rgambsrgambs Posts: 13,576
    70% of the 1% lol
    That would be a good song!

    In all seriousness, I don't think the 1% is the problem, it's the .01% that are the real nasty fuckers keeping the world in chains!
    Monkey Driven, Call this Living?
  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,042
    rgambs said:

    70% of the 1% lol
    That would be a good song!

    In all seriousness, I don't think the 1% is the problem, it's the .01% that are the real nasty fuckers keeping the world in chains!

    Could be, Gambs. Amazing how so few control so many and so much. I suppose its always been that way. We can but dream to change that... and each do our own little part toward that end.

    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • brianlux said:

    rgambs said:

    70% of the 1% lol
    That would be a good song!

    In all seriousness, I don't think the 1% is the problem, it's the .01% that are the real nasty fuckers keeping the world in chains!

    Could be, Gambs. Amazing how so few control so many and so much. I suppose its always been that way. We can but dream to change that... and each do our own little part toward that end.

    ever since modern "society". kings and queens. rich as fuck with all of their subjects.

    freedom through oppression.

    new album "Cigarettes" out Spring 2025!

    www.headstonesband.com




  • rgambs said:

    70% of the 1% lol
    That would be a good song!

    In all seriousness, I don't think the 1% is the problem, it's the .01% that are the real nasty fuckers keeping the world in chains!

    The one percent
    Rich as fuck
    Freedom through oppression
    Just my luck

    We’re all your subjects
    Subjects in society
    Who made you king?
    All such calamity

    We can but dream to change
    Each do our part
    Work as a team
    Where do we start?

    We’re all but bees
    We feed the queen
    The wind bends the trees
    We need the dream

    So few have control
    Can’t control a thing
    Hoard all the bones
    We choke on the wing


    new album "Cigarettes" out Spring 2025!

    www.headstonesband.com




  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,042

    rgambs said:

    70% of the 1% lol
    That would be a good song!

    In all seriousness, I don't think the 1% is the problem, it's the .01% that are the real nasty fuckers keeping the world in chains!

    The one percent
    Rich as fuck
    Freedom through oppression
    Just my luck

    We’re all your subjects
    Subjects in society
    Who made you king?
    All such calamity

    We can but dream to change
    Each do our part
    Work as a team
    Where do we start?

    We’re all but bees
    We feed the queen
    The wind bends the trees
    We need the dream

    So few have control
    Can’t control a thing
    Hoard all the bones
    We choke on the wing


    Excellent verse there, P. Well done!

    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • wow, lots of old school names in this thread.

    rip hippiemom.
    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Posts: 49,954
    edited March 2015
    brianlux said:

    This is majorly fucked up:

    http://earthweareone.com/37-million-bees-found-dead-in-ontario-canada-after-planting-large-gmo-corn-field/

    37 Million Bees Found Dead In Ontario, Canada After Planting Large GMO Corn Field

    Millions of bees dropped dead after GMO corn was planted few weeks ago in Ontario, Canada. The local bee keeper, Dave Schuit who produces honey in Elmwood lost about 37 million bees which are about 600 hives.

    Full article at link. When will these people ever wake up?

    Brian, the headline to this article and your summary are extremely misleading - it suggests that the crop being a GMO one somehow made the bees die, which is absolutely not the case. The bees are suspected to have died from the legal use of neonicotinoid pesticides. The fact that the corn was GMO actually had absolutely nothing to do with it as far as I can tell, after reading the article. If we're going to be worried and outraged here, let's at least direct it to the right place, which in this case would be Bayer CropScience Inc. and the Canadian and US departments of Agriculture, without GMOs having a thing to do with it specifically.
    Post edited by PJ_Soul on
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • rgambsrgambs Posts: 13,576
    PJ_Soul said:

    brianlux said:

    This is majorly fucked up:

    http://earthweareone.com/37-million-bees-found-dead-in-ontario-canada-after-planting-large-gmo-corn-field/

    37 Million Bees Found Dead In Ontario, Canada After Planting Large GMO Corn Field

    Millions of bees dropped dead after GMO corn was planted few weeks ago in Ontario, Canada. The local bee keeper, Dave Schuit who produces honey in Elmwood lost about 37 million bees which are about 600 hives.

    Full article at link. When will these people ever wake up?

    Brian, the headline to this article and your summary are extremely misleading - it suggests that the crop being a GMO one somehow made the bees die, which is absolutely not the case. The bees are suspected to have died from the legal use of neonicotinoid pesticides. The fact that the corn was GMO actually had absolutely nothing to do with it as far as I can tell, after reading the article. If we're going to be worried and outraged here, let's at least direct it to the right place, which in this case would be Bayer CropScience Inc. and the Canadian and US departments of Agriculture, without GMOs having a thing to do with it specifically.
    Not exactly. The link between GM crops and neonicotinoid use is strong. Here is a nice breakdown of the tangled relationship.

    http://www.commondreams.org/views/2012/05/16/what-do-gmo-seeds-have-do-bee-die-offs-corn-belt
    Monkey Driven, Call this Living?
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Posts: 49,954
    edited March 2015
    I think that article also completely misrepresents the problem. GMOs are not the issue here. If you read that carefully, it's clear that whether or not the crops are GMOs is ultimately irrelevant. The only reason they are a factor is because they are what happens to be most conveniently available for playing around with pesticides. All of the other factors mentioned in this article are what matter, and the GMO thing is really just a distraction. GMOs or no GMOs, the results are inevitable because of changes in practices and use of pesticides over time. If there weren't GMOs we'd be just as fucked.

    The reason I'm arguing this is because it is becoming frustrating to me thst so many people are demonizing GMOs for all the wrong reasons. As far as i can tell, most people don't even know why they dislike them, or if they do, they are going off of false facts. They just know they don't. And this is a disservice to the entire world, since it puts focus on all the wrong issues, while the real.issie that should be of concern when it comes to GMOs - economics - is being almost completely ignored, even though that is the factor that might be most effectively and positivelydealt with, and this is to the great disadvantage of farmers and local economies around the world.

    Anyway, GMOs or no GMOs, bees are dying. Hauling out the pitchforks in protest of GMOs is not going to change that. The outrage needs to be directed towards the government and pesticide industry.
    Post edited by PJ_Soul on
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Posts: 49,954
    edited March 2015
    Post edited by PJ_Soul on
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Sign In or Register to comment.