Don't teach them anything, let them decide. If they as questions answer them. Keep in mind that even saying "Well, this is what I believe and why?" encourages children to share your beliefs. That may be the least you can do though.
yeah but i can't let them decide just yet he's 12 and she is 9 that time will be here soon but till then i feel we must attend services it really is hard though iv'e had reservations about organized religion for a long time i never took into account how i would deal with those ? regarding my own children untill now .....
ok so i being a parent of 2 children should do what ?? ..
(1) tell them church sucks that it's all lies .
(2) the priest are all perverts.
(3) we need to go because we can see the good in people .
(4) teach them religion at home ..
i'm not a very religious person by no means but some how i believe going to church once a week would be good for my 2 kids...
...
If i had kids... I think I would lead them towards the Christian Church... but, I don't know which one... there are a bunch to choose from. I would probably base my decision on one that some of their friends go to... for the social aspect of it. Christianity mostly because Christmas kicks Chanukah's and Ramidan's ass.
I would attend services with them and tell them that if they have questions... they should ask. I would also allow them to decide on their own... when they are about 15 or 16 to decide what they want to do.
I would also tell them that God doesn't look upon one religion over another... regardless of what the church leaders tell them. God doesn't hate Hindus or Muslims or Buddhists or Jews or Scientologists... He loves them all as long as they are kind, caring, giving and loving people.
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
yeah but i can't let them decide just yet he's 12 and she is 9 that time will be here soon but till then i feel we must attend services it really is hard though iv'e had reservations about organized religion for a long time i never took into account how i would deal with those ? regarding my own children untill now .....
Well, in my opinion, that's brainwashing. It lays a foundational belief in the supernatural, which later in life, may or may not evolve into a belief in supernatural phenomena, without effort of finding natural causes.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Well, in my opinion, that's brainwashing. It lays a foundational belief in the supernatural, which later in life, may or may not evolve into a belief in supernatural phenomena, without effort of finding natural causes.
thanks for the educated response will just have to see ........
...
If i had kids... I think I would lead them towards the Christian Church... but, I don't know which one... there are a bunch to choose from. I would probably base my decision on one that some of their friends go to... for the social aspect of it. Christianity mostly because Christmas kicks Chanukah's and Ramidan's ass.
I would attend services with them and tell them that if they have questions... they should ask. I would also allow them to decide on their own... when they are about 15 or 16 to decide what they want to do.
I would also tell them that God doesn't look upon one religion over another... regardless of what the church leaders tell them. God doesn't hate Hindus or Muslims or Buddhists or Jews or Scientologists... He loves them all as long as they are kind, caring, giving and loving people.
that is good caring opinions or suggestions i do appreciate that thanks.....
I went to church weekly for the best part of a decade (actually probably slightly more) and although I still go from time to time I am far less religious than I used to be. There are a variety of reasons for this, but mostly things like too many unanswered questions, lack of relevance and a way of life which one doesn't want to lead anymore.
The wind is blowing cold
Have we lost our way tonight?
Have we lost our hope to sorrow?
Feels like were all alone
Running further from what’s right
And there are no more heroes to follow
...
This is the same thing the followers of Muqtada Al Sadr state. You could be a spokesman for the Fundamentalist Shi'ites in Iraq/Iran that wish to instill good religious structure to everyone... including the conversion of the marginalized hippie Americans that worship hedonism and selfishness.
They're not wrong when they say American culture is hedonistic and selfish. Would you disagree? Do you think Americans are giving and unselfish?
All I know is that to see, and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.
-Enoch Powell
They're not wrong when they say American culture is hedonistic and selfish. Would you disagree? Do you think Americans are giving and unselfish?
...
Yeah... that's why your statement fits in nicely with any fundamental religion... Christian or Muslim. Either side can use the same statement and make the same arguement.
That was my point.
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
...
Yeah... that's why your statement fits in nicely with any fundamental religion... Christian or Muslim. Either side can use the same statement and make the same arguement.
That was my point.
I am not a fundamentalist though. I do not follow the Bible in literal word for word format.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but you are making the argument that Christians and Muslims would agree that selfish and hedonistic people say that "Church sucks." Does that make either of their beliefs less legitimate? What kind of point is that?
The Muslims are right when they say that hippy fucks prize hedonism and selfishness over worshipping in a community.
All I know is that to see, and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.
-Enoch Powell
You can't be serious. You can't hardly open a thread on this board without someone blaming a Christian for messing up.
I'd like to see your numbers or any evidence at all that MOST Christians genuinely do not try to do better.
I think it's just the opposite, but I feel that the ones who do screw up get noticed much more than the many, many who do a lot of wonderful things for their fellow humans in the name of religion.
his quote said non-christians mess up and blame christians. ive never heard this done. not once have i heard an atheist say "my marriage fell apart becos of those damn christians" or i've got a drinking problem becos of jesus. but i hear christians all the time bitching about how their kids have sex and do drugs becos of the godless heathens in our culture. it's NEVER their fault. im looking for equivalent example.
the onl evidence i have is personal. i know maybe 10 devout christians. 90% of the christians i ever met dont do shit outside of go to church. they dont worship. they dont pray. they dont give a damn. they pay lip service for the hour they're in church each weekend and that is all. but these same people raise hell about anything they perceive as an assault on the values they do not even practice.
I am not a fundamentalist though. I do not follow the Bible in literal word for word format.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but you are making the argument that Christians and Muslims would agree that selfish and hedonistic people say that "Church sucks." Does that make either of their beliefs less legitimate? What kind of point is that?
The Muslims are right when they say that hippy fucks prize hedonism and selfishness over worshipping in a community.
that'd be a real stunning point if those hippy fucks weren't right when they said religious fucks like you are hate-mongering fascists.
his quote said non-christians mess up and blame christians. ive never heard this done. not once have i heard an atheist say "my marriage fell apart becos of those damn christians" or i've got a drinking problem becos of jesus. but i hear christians all the time bitching about how their kids have sex and do drugs becos of the godless heathens in our culture. it's NEVER their fault. im looking for equivalent example.
the onl evidence i have is personal. i know maybe 10 devout christians. 90% of the christians i ever met dont do shit outside of go to church. they dont worship. they dont pray. they dont give a damn. they pay lip service for the hour they're in church each weekend and that is all. but these same people raise hell about anything they perceive as an assault on the values they do not even practice.
Non Christians on this board blame Christians for every kind of ill in the world. I guess we've had 2 different experiences then because the Christians I know - and I know a lot - do not blame non-Christians for things that happen to them.
The only people we should try to get even with...
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
im not surprised to find you believe this. you and your ilk are the ones who woulda been first in line lockstepping and saying heil hitler in the 40s. congratulations.
i dont see much of the latter happening. ive never seen anyone who was a non-believer blame christians for their choices. they either dont care, dont see what they did as messing up, or dont think them messing up has anything to do with someone else's religion. i cant even think of an example that would fit the situation you described?
yes, many christians do genuinely try to do better. but i honestly feel most dont... they are christian in name only. they show up to church on sunday, zone out for an hour, then go home and don't think about jesus again until next sunday. they lie, gossip, steal, indulge in greed and lust and whatever else, and think nothing of it, figuring that one day a week is enough to get them off the hook. plenty of non-christians do this too, but at least they don't try to pretend about it. they either admit it's wrong and don't care, or think there's nothing wrong with it. i appreciate that more than saying it's wrong, pretending you care and publicly ranting about other people that do it, but figuring you're allowed to do it all you want becos that service on sunday will clean your slate. that pisses me off, and it's why i often find religion far more frustrating than atheism, who at least admit they dont give a shit.
Never seen it , huh? How about this:
"a guy who confesses his sins, asks forgiveness, then continues to do the same thing over and over and over figuring he can just keep confessing. i prefer the atheists who say "yeah, it's wrong but i dont care" to christians who claim to aspire to high ideals but are only paying lip service to being good"
The author of those words escapes me... but its the type of thing i'm talking about it. Look, Souls, you and i have had our disagreements and i feel like we have peacefully hammered them out and come to a respectful middleplace, so i don't want to open up any old wounds. That being said, your assesment of Christians and Christianity is more than slightly, shall we say, askew, and a tad hypocritical.
Listen, i'll give a concrete example. High profile Joe Schmo cheats on his taxes and you may get one paragraph on page eight. Joe Christian does the same thing and the media eats it up. Its all over the place and it takes about two flipping seconds to find a link to the story on this board. Why is that? You can't deny it, and you can't say it isn't a gross hypocrisy. A guy cheating on his taxes is a guy cheating on his taxes.
Also, its a bit hasty to condemn an entire world body of believers based on your, perhaps, prejudicial judgements of "ten" people you know.
"When all your friends and sedatives mean well but make it worse... better find yourself a place to level out."
im not surprised to find you believe this. you and your ilk are the ones who woulda been first in line lockstepping and saying heil hitler in the 40s. congratulations.
Well, no.
The racist part of fascism is what gets all the attention. The rather smooth, cohesive operation of society is what I'm concerned with. I'm not a racist.
Fascism promotes naturalism in political form. What's wrong with being loyal to your country? What's wrong with encouraging all citizens to love their culture? What's wrong with supporting a strong military? One, strong nation that works together is a great thing.
It's the extremist tendency to kill the weakest of their society that made fascism fail. This is why liberty must be protected by a constitution and not a dictator.
Still, our society makes too many assumptions about fascism.
All I know is that to see, and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.
-Enoch Powell
"a guy who confesses his sins, asks forgiveness, then continues to do the same thing over and over and over figuring he can just keep confessing. i prefer the atheists who say "yeah, it's wrong but i dont care" to christians who claim to aspire to high ideals but are only paying lip service to being good"
The author of those words escapes me... but its the type of thing i'm talking about it. Look, Souls, you and i have had our disagreements and i feel like we have peacefully hammered them out and come to a respectful middleplace, so i don't want to open up any old wounds. That being said, your assesment of Christians and Christianity is more than slightly, shall we say, askew, and a tad hypocritical.
Listen, i'll give a concrete example. High profile Joe Schmo cheats on his taxes and you may get one paragraph on page eight. Joe Christian does the same thing and the media eats it up. Its all over the place and it takes about two flipping seconds to find a link to the story on this board. Why is that? You can't deny it, and you can't say it isn't a gross hypocrisy. A guy cheating on his taxes is a guy cheating on his taxes.
Also, its a bit hasty to condemn an entire world body of believers based on your, perhaps, prejudicial judgements of "ten" people you know.
becos 9 times outta 10 joe guy is someone who cheated on his taxes. joe christian guy is a guy who spends his days out in public ranting about greed, materialism, and secular hedonism and pointing it out in everyone else without acknowledging its existence within himself. that is hypocrisy. and that is what disgusts me. not the religion, not the beliefs, not the faith, hypocrisy. i hate it in christians and i hate it in everyone else. including atheists. ive defended your beliefs from the people who are equally hypocritical in their hatred of christians.
as to my quote... where do i blame christians for my ills? i didnt say it causes me any harm, just that i find it repulsive. it is totally consistent with everything i've been saying. the first guy in that post was a hypocrite, the second was not. but i am not blaming them for my decisions. perhaps you misread me. when i say "i dont see non believers blaming christians for their choices" i mean i dont see non believers blaming christians for the choices, hardship or ills that befall the non believers. i hear christians often saying everyone else in the world is greedy, amoral, lustful, etc and that it is those people's fault for the sad state of their world or community or faith or whatever, totally overlooking and ignoring the fact that they themselves are such things in spades.
The racist part of fascism is what gets all the attention. The rather smooth, cohesive operation of society is what I'm concerned with. I'm not a racist.
Fascism promotes naturalism in political form. What's wrong with being loyal to your country? What's wrong with encouraging all citizens to love their culture? What's wrong with supporting a strong military? One, strong nation that works together is a great thing.
It's the extremist tendency to kill the weakest of their society that made fascism fail. This is why liberty must be protected by a constitution and not a dictator.
Still, our society makes too many assumptions about fascism.
yet here you are basically saying that this country would be better off if we purged the society of its "weaker" hippy elements. basically, you're like all the other neocons. the thought of a strong military smacking the shit out of third world countries that have no army to speak of gets your little pecker hard and makes you feel like a man and worry a little less about the fact that your gay neighbor jim wants to marry a guy and you secretly wish you could find out what that'd be like.
yet here you are basically saying that this country would be better off if we purged the society of its "weaker" hippy elements. basically, you're like all the other neocons. the thought of a strong military smacking the shit out of third world countries that have no army to speak of gets your little pecker hard and makes you feel like a man and worry a little less about the fact that your gay neighbor jim wants to marry a guy and you secretly wish you could find out what that'd be like.
Haha, I won't take the bait on all of that filth you spew. Obviously you are full of a lot of hate.
I'm not a neo-con and I don't want us going around the world fighting third world countries. I'd rather let those countries starve and die. No free money for them, you know? I don't think we should be in Iraq. I'd like to be out of the UN.
I'm more of a fan of building our country and making it great. Purging society of its weaker elements does not mean killing. It means educating and building a patriotic country, even if that country has many different ethnic groups. We don't all need to be white anglo-saxons in order to have a cohesive nation.
You make a lot of assumptions and a lot of what you say is complete garbage. You should be embarrassed at how silly you sound.
All I know is that to see, and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.
-Enoch Powell
Haha, I won't take the bait on all of that filth you spew. Obviously you are full of a lot of hate.
I'm not a neo-con and I don't want us going around the world fighting third world countries. I'd rather let those countries starve and die. No free money for them, you know? I don't think we should be in Iraq. I'd like to be out of the UN.
I'm more of a fan of building our country and making it great. Purging society of its weaker elements does not mean killing. It means educating and building a patriotic country, even if that country has many different ethnic groups. We don't all need to be white anglo-saxons in order to have a cohesive nation.
You make a lot of assumptions and a lot of what you say is complete garbage. You should be embarrassed at how silly you sound.
and you make equal assumptions about me. cos im also all for keeping us out of the un, out of third world countries, and letting them fix their own damn problems. im also for better education. but i dont think we need to be beating the military drum and installing the 10 commandments to get those things done. cos neither of those solve our problems. if you build a huge military, sooner or later you're going to feel compelled to use it for something. which is why we keep ending up in bullshit situations like iraq, panama, grenada, etc. we didnt have much of a standing army until after ww2. prior to that, our citizens answered the call when it was a worthy call. then the cons figured out a huge blustery military and constant fear (of communism, terrorism, whatever) was a good way to political victory. and so they've gotten us into one mess after another. you give a politician a toy like that (big shiny military) and he's going to use it for his own purposes. you keep a small but well trained military and he will be careful to only call on it when he needs it. and if we need more, our citizens will answer knowing the cause is just. the lack of patriotism you see today is not becos of godless lazy hippies, it is becos of cynicism and disenchantment with the way the military-industrial complex has exploited and commodified war. americans dont want to fight cos we haven't been sure we're fighting for the right reasons for a long time... over 50 years.
and you make equal assumptions about me. cos im also all for keeping us out of the un, out of third world countries, and letting them fix their own damn problems. im also for better education. but i dont think we need to be beating the military drum and installing the 10 commandments to get those things done. cos neither of those solve our problems. if you build a huge military, sooner or later you're going to feel compelled to use it for something. which is why we keep ending up in bullshit situations like iraq, panama, grenada, etc. we didnt have much of a standing army until after ww2. prior to that, our citizens answered the call when it was a worthy call. then the cons figured out a huge blustery military and constant fear (of communism, terrorism, whatever) was a good way to political victory. and so they've gotten us into one mess after another. you give a politician a toy like that (big shiny military) and he's going to use it for his own purposes. you keep a small but well trained military and he will be careful to only call on it when he needs it. and if we need more, our citizens will answer knowing the cause is just. the lack of patriotism you see today is not becos of godless lazy hippies, it is becos of cynicism and disenchantment with the way the military-industrial complex has exploited and commodified war. americans dont want to fight cos we haven't been sure we're fighting for the right reasons for a long time... over 50 years.
1. The Korean and Vietnam conflicts were both initiated by Democrats, not "conservatives." You conveniently forgot about that. You can't blame conservatives for everything. Therefore, it is the liberals' fault for causing this vast growth in our military.
2. There is no effing way that lack of patriotism is due to "cynicism and disenchantment with the way the military-industrial complex has exploited and commidifed war." If you want to say that, you have to blame Lyndon Johnson who initiated Vietnam. Or perhaps Kennedy before him.
The military was grown to counter the threat that the Soviets posed. Those liberals were right for growing it. The communists wanted to dominate the world and anyone who denies that is a fucking idiot and needs to learn history.
The simple fact is, lack of patriotism IS due to cynicism, but it is due to cynicism of our moral superiority to our foes. Liberals aren't patriotic because they believe that what America does, in general, is wrong. They don't believe that our history and culture is worth being proud of.
I would agree that we don't need to police the world and I'd be fine with saying F you to these countries who want us to come in and "help" them.
Patriotism should not derive from the "mistakes" that we make: it should come from the good things we do.
All I know is that to see, and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.
-Enoch Powell
1. The Korean and Vietnam conflicts were both initiated by Democrats, not "conservatives." You conveniently forgot about that. You can't blame conservatives for everything. Therefore, it is the liberals' fault for causing this vast growth in our military.
2. There is no effing way that lack of patriotism is due to "cynicism and disenchantment with the way the military-industrial complex has exploited and commidifed war." If you want to say that, you have to blame Lyndon Johnson who initiated Vietnam. Or perhaps Kennedy before him.
The military was grown to counter the threat that the Soviets posed. Those liberals were right for growing it. The communists wanted to dominate the world and anyone who denies that is a fucking idiot and needs to learn history.
The simple fact is, lack of patriotism IS due to cynicism, but it is due to cynicism of our moral superiority to our foes. Liberals aren't patriotic because they believe that what America does, in general, is wrong. They don't believe that our history and culture is worth being proud of.
I would agree that we don't need to police the world and I'd be fine with saying F you to these countries who want us to come in and "help" them.
Patriotism should not derive from the "mistakes" that we make: it should come from the good things we do.
How can you discuss a hedonistic and selfish society when you yourself are concerned only with your own country. Patriotism to the point you are describing is ignorance. You probably feel really cool by being Mr " Fuck every one else" but we will see how things turn when China over takes the US in ten years and you come begging to a communist country for your future.
becos 9 times outta 10 joe guy is someone who cheated on his taxes. joe christian guy is a guy who spends his days out in public ranting about greed, materialism, and secular hedonism and pointing it out in everyone else without acknowledging its existence within himself. that is hypocrisy. and that is what disgusts me. not the religion, not the beliefs, not the faith, hypocrisy. i hate it in christians and i hate it in everyone else. including atheists. ive defended your beliefs from the people who are equally hypocritical in their hatred of christians.
None of the many Christians I know spend their days "out in public ranting about greed, materialism, and secular hedonism and pointing it out in everyone else without acknowledging its existence within himself"....because that's not Christian.
In fact, I would suggest that the people you are calling Christians, aren't really.
The only people we should try to get even with...
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
How can you discuss a hedonistic and selfish society when you yourself are concerned only with your own country. Patriotism to the point you are describing is ignorance. You probably feel really cool by being Mr " Fuck every one else" but we will see how things turn when China over takes the US in ten years and you come begging to a communist country for your future.
You had a valid point going until the idiocy of that last bit. I'll bet you $1,000 that in 10 years China won't have taken us over.
"I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
Comments
More like... it shouldn't... right?
Otherwise... there wouldn't be these religious wars going on.
Hail, Hail!!!
i guess i meant to say that it doesn't matter to me
If i had kids... I think I would lead them towards the Christian Church... but, I don't know which one... there are a bunch to choose from. I would probably base my decision on one that some of their friends go to... for the social aspect of it. Christianity mostly because Christmas kicks Chanukah's and Ramidan's ass.
I would attend services with them and tell them that if they have questions... they should ask. I would also allow them to decide on their own... when they are about 15 or 16 to decide what they want to do.
I would also tell them that God doesn't look upon one religion over another... regardless of what the church leaders tell them. God doesn't hate Hindus or Muslims or Buddhists or Jews or Scientologists... He loves them all as long as they are kind, caring, giving and loving people.
Hail, Hail!!!
Well, in my opinion, that's brainwashing. It lays a foundational belief in the supernatural, which later in life, may or may not evolve into a belief in supernatural phenomena, without effort of finding natural causes.
Have we lost our way tonight?
Have we lost our hope to sorrow?
Feels like were all alone
Running further from what’s right
And there are no more heroes to follow
So what are we becoming?
Where did we go wrong?
They're not wrong when they say American culture is hedonistic and selfish. Would you disagree? Do you think Americans are giving and unselfish?
-Enoch Powell
Humans are selfish by nature. I don't think any country or its people has a patent on it.
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except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
Yeah... that's why your statement fits in nicely with any fundamental religion... Christian or Muslim. Either side can use the same statement and make the same arguement.
That was my point.
Hail, Hail!!!
I am not a fundamentalist though. I do not follow the Bible in literal word for word format.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but you are making the argument that Christians and Muslims would agree that selfish and hedonistic people say that "Church sucks." Does that make either of their beliefs less legitimate? What kind of point is that?
The Muslims are right when they say that hippy fucks prize hedonism and selfishness over worshipping in a community.
-Enoch Powell
I'd say some countries are more selfish than others. America is about as selfish as it comes.
-Enoch Powell
his quote said non-christians mess up and blame christians. ive never heard this done. not once have i heard an atheist say "my marriage fell apart becos of those damn christians" or i've got a drinking problem becos of jesus. but i hear christians all the time bitching about how their kids have sex and do drugs becos of the godless heathens in our culture. it's NEVER their fault. im looking for equivalent example.
the onl evidence i have is personal. i know maybe 10 devout christians. 90% of the christians i ever met dont do shit outside of go to church. they dont worship. they dont pray. they dont give a damn. they pay lip service for the hour they're in church each weekend and that is all. but these same people raise hell about anything they perceive as an assault on the values they do not even practice.
then move. i hear iran is doing a great job of making sure hedonism is shut out. you'd like it there.
that'd be a real stunning point if those hippy fucks weren't right when they said religious fucks like you are hate-mongering fascists.
Non Christians on this board blame Christians for every kind of ill in the world. I guess we've had 2 different experiences then because the Christians I know - and I know a lot - do not blame non-Christians for things that happen to them.
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
Haha, fascism has many fine attributes, actually.
-Enoch Powell
im not surprised to find you believe this. you and your ilk are the ones who woulda been first in line lockstepping and saying heil hitler in the 40s. congratulations.
Never seen it , huh? How about this:
"a guy who confesses his sins, asks forgiveness, then continues to do the same thing over and over and over figuring he can just keep confessing. i prefer the atheists who say "yeah, it's wrong but i dont care" to christians who claim to aspire to high ideals but are only paying lip service to being good"
The author of those words escapes me... but its the type of thing i'm talking about it. Look, Souls, you and i have had our disagreements and i feel like we have peacefully hammered them out and come to a respectful middleplace, so i don't want to open up any old wounds. That being said, your assesment of Christians and Christianity is more than slightly, shall we say, askew, and a tad hypocritical.
Listen, i'll give a concrete example. High profile Joe Schmo cheats on his taxes and you may get one paragraph on page eight. Joe Christian does the same thing and the media eats it up. Its all over the place and it takes about two flipping seconds to find a link to the story on this board. Why is that? You can't deny it, and you can't say it isn't a gross hypocrisy. A guy cheating on his taxes is a guy cheating on his taxes.
Also, its a bit hasty to condemn an entire world body of believers based on your, perhaps, prejudicial judgements of "ten" people you know.
Well, no.
The racist part of fascism is what gets all the attention. The rather smooth, cohesive operation of society is what I'm concerned with. I'm not a racist.
Fascism promotes naturalism in political form. What's wrong with being loyal to your country? What's wrong with encouraging all citizens to love their culture? What's wrong with supporting a strong military? One, strong nation that works together is a great thing.
It's the extremist tendency to kill the weakest of their society that made fascism fail. This is why liberty must be protected by a constitution and not a dictator.
Still, our society makes too many assumptions about fascism.
-Enoch Powell
becos 9 times outta 10 joe guy is someone who cheated on his taxes. joe christian guy is a guy who spends his days out in public ranting about greed, materialism, and secular hedonism and pointing it out in everyone else without acknowledging its existence within himself. that is hypocrisy. and that is what disgusts me. not the religion, not the beliefs, not the faith, hypocrisy. i hate it in christians and i hate it in everyone else. including atheists. ive defended your beliefs from the people who are equally hypocritical in their hatred of christians.
as to my quote... where do i blame christians for my ills? i didnt say it causes me any harm, just that i find it repulsive. it is totally consistent with everything i've been saying. the first guy in that post was a hypocrite, the second was not. but i am not blaming them for my decisions. perhaps you misread me. when i say "i dont see non believers blaming christians for their choices" i mean i dont see non believers blaming christians for the choices, hardship or ills that befall the non believers. i hear christians often saying everyone else in the world is greedy, amoral, lustful, etc and that it is those people's fault for the sad state of their world or community or faith or whatever, totally overlooking and ignoring the fact that they themselves are such things in spades.
yet here you are basically saying that this country would be better off if we purged the society of its "weaker" hippy elements. basically, you're like all the other neocons. the thought of a strong military smacking the shit out of third world countries that have no army to speak of gets your little pecker hard and makes you feel like a man and worry a little less about the fact that your gay neighbor jim wants to marry a guy and you secretly wish you could find out what that'd be like.
My thoughts exactly. Thanks for saving me from having to type it out myself!
Haha, I won't take the bait on all of that filth you spew. Obviously you are full of a lot of hate.
I'm not a neo-con and I don't want us going around the world fighting third world countries. I'd rather let those countries starve and die. No free money for them, you know? I don't think we should be in Iraq. I'd like to be out of the UN.
I'm more of a fan of building our country and making it great. Purging society of its weaker elements does not mean killing. It means educating and building a patriotic country, even if that country has many different ethnic groups. We don't all need to be white anglo-saxons in order to have a cohesive nation.
You make a lot of assumptions and a lot of what you say is complete garbage. You should be embarrassed at how silly you sound.
-Enoch Powell
and you make equal assumptions about me. cos im also all for keeping us out of the un, out of third world countries, and letting them fix their own damn problems. im also for better education. but i dont think we need to be beating the military drum and installing the 10 commandments to get those things done. cos neither of those solve our problems. if you build a huge military, sooner or later you're going to feel compelled to use it for something. which is why we keep ending up in bullshit situations like iraq, panama, grenada, etc. we didnt have much of a standing army until after ww2. prior to that, our citizens answered the call when it was a worthy call. then the cons figured out a huge blustery military and constant fear (of communism, terrorism, whatever) was a good way to political victory. and so they've gotten us into one mess after another. you give a politician a toy like that (big shiny military) and he's going to use it for his own purposes. you keep a small but well trained military and he will be careful to only call on it when he needs it. and if we need more, our citizens will answer knowing the cause is just. the lack of patriotism you see today is not becos of godless lazy hippies, it is becos of cynicism and disenchantment with the way the military-industrial complex has exploited and commodified war. americans dont want to fight cos we haven't been sure we're fighting for the right reasons for a long time... over 50 years.
1. The Korean and Vietnam conflicts were both initiated by Democrats, not "conservatives." You conveniently forgot about that. You can't blame conservatives for everything. Therefore, it is the liberals' fault for causing this vast growth in our military.
2. There is no effing way that lack of patriotism is due to "cynicism and disenchantment with the way the military-industrial complex has exploited and commidifed war." If you want to say that, you have to blame Lyndon Johnson who initiated Vietnam. Or perhaps Kennedy before him.
The military was grown to counter the threat that the Soviets posed. Those liberals were right for growing it. The communists wanted to dominate the world and anyone who denies that is a fucking idiot and needs to learn history.
The simple fact is, lack of patriotism IS due to cynicism, but it is due to cynicism of our moral superiority to our foes. Liberals aren't patriotic because they believe that what America does, in general, is wrong. They don't believe that our history and culture is worth being proud of.
I would agree that we don't need to police the world and I'd be fine with saying F you to these countries who want us to come in and "help" them.
Patriotism should not derive from the "mistakes" that we make: it should come from the good things we do.
-Enoch Powell
How can you discuss a hedonistic and selfish society when you yourself are concerned only with your own country. Patriotism to the point you are describing is ignorance. You probably feel really cool by being Mr " Fuck every one else" but we will see how things turn when China over takes the US in ten years and you come begging to a communist country for your future.
None of the many Christians I know spend their days "out in public ranting about greed, materialism, and secular hedonism and pointing it out in everyone else without acknowledging its existence within himself"....because that's not Christian.
In fact, I would suggest that the people you are calling Christians, aren't really.
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
You had a valid point going until the idiocy of that last bit. I'll bet you $1,000 that in 10 years China won't have taken us over.