Why Do Some People Say, “Church Sucks!”

soulsinging

cornnifer wrote:

Most Christians mess up, acknowledge their imperfections and genuinely try to do better (being human they sometimes fail).
Others mess up and then point fingers at the shortcomings of Christians.
Just who is the bigger hypocrite?

i dont see much of the latter happening. ive never seen anyone who was a non-believer blame christians for their choices. they either dont care, dont see what they did as messing up, or dont think them messing up has anything to do with someone else's religion. i cant even think of an example that would fit the situation you described?

yes, many christians do genuinely try to do better. but i honestly feel most dont... they are christian in name only. they show up to church on sunday, zone out for an hour, then go home and don't think about jesus again until next sunday. they lie, gossip, steal, indulge in greed and lust and whatever else, and think nothing of it, figuring that one day a week is enough to get them off the hook. plenty of non-christians do this too, but at least they don't try to pretend about it. they either admit it's wrong and don't care, or think there's nothing wrong with it. i appreciate that more than saying it's wrong, pretending you care and publicly ranting about other people that do it, but figuring you're allowed to do it all you want becos that service on sunday will clean your slate. that pisses me off, and it's why i often find religion far more frustrating than atheism, who at least admit they dont give a shit.

know1

soulsinging wrote:

i dont see much of the latter happening. ive never seen anyone who was a non-believer blame christians for their choices. they either dont care, dont see what they did as messing up, or dont think them messing up has anything to do with someone else's religion. i cant even think of an example that would fit the situation you described?

yes, many christians do genuinely try to do better. but i honestly feel most dont... they are christian in name only. they show up to church on sunday, zone out for an hour, then go home and don't think about jesus again until next sunday. they lie, gossip, steal, indulge in greed and lust and whatever else, and think nothing of it, figuring that one day a week is enough to get them off the hook. plenty of non-christians do this too, but at least they don't try to pretend about it. they either admit it's wrong and don't care, or think there's nothing wrong with it. i appreciate that more than saying it's wrong, pretending you care and publicly ranting about other people that do it, but figuring you're allowed to do it all you want becos that service on sunday will clean your slate. that pisses me off, and it's why i often find religion far more frustrating than atheism, who at least admit they dont give a shit.

You can't be serious. You can't hardly open a thread on this board without someone blaming a Christian for messing up.

I'd like to see your numbers or any evidence at all that MOST Christians genuinely do not try to do better.

I think it's just the opposite, but I feel that the ones who do screw up get noticed much more than the many, many who do a lot of wonderful things for their fellow humans in the name of religion.

brainofPJ

know1 wrote:

the ones who do screw up get noticed much more than the many, many who do a lot of wonderful things for their fellow humans in the name of religion.

that's the case with every major religion, even the smaller ones..sad but true

Ahnimus

Leatherman® wrote:

Question from a blogger this morning. Thought this group would have some good information for him...

Your Thoughts Here

Because they are closed-minded and bigoted. The church hides behind a book of ancient fairy tales and claims ultimate knowledge and the path to righteousness.

Why when David Koresh says it, it's a cult, but when it's written in a book, it's a religion?

Cosmo

know1 wrote:

I was identifying with most of your points until now. If you acknowledge that nobody can be like Christ, but then say that just attempting to be Christ-like isn't enough, then you've made it impossible.

...
True... no one can be 'Christ-like' (except Jesus... and He was pretty much, one of a kind)... BUT, we CAN choose to follow Christ's teachings... or CHOOSE not to adhere to them and site Jesus' forgiveness for our screw ups... so, therefore, if we do it again... no big deal.
That's a loophole that many (so-called) Christians use to get around the Thou Shalt Not Steal rule and cheat on their taxes and the Thou Shalt Not Kill rule and support capital punishment and war. Like, if you keep having to ask Jesus for forgiveness because you constantly lust after every girl you see... then, YOU need to do something about it... like quit being such a fucking pervert or accept it as a fact of your character and quit telling everyone else what a great Christian you are... you are not following Christ's teachings... and it is a choice... your choice.
So, you CAN choose to follow Christ's teachings... knowing you will never equal Jesus. But, more often than not... we CHOOSE to ignore His word in favor of our own wants. We all do that... with the big diffference being, I'm carrying my own sins on my back and not dumping them on the back of Jesus so I can go out and commit more sins.

CorporateWhore

Some people say "church sucks" because they are marginalized hippies who know nothing about hard work or constructive social traditions. They prefer to create their own morality that worships hedonism and selfishness than give their heart and soul into community worship of God, the creator and sustainer of all life.

inmytree

CorporateWhore wrote:

Some people say "church sucks" because they are marginalized hippies who know nothing about hard work or constructive social traditions. They prefer to create their own morality that worships hedonism and selfishness than give their heart and soul into community worship of God, the creator and sustainer of all life.

what a wonderful example of a welcoming environment...

norm

CorporateWhore wrote:

Some people say "church sucks" because they are marginalized hippies who know nothing about hard work or constructive social traditions. They prefer to create their own morality that worships hedonism and selfishness than give their heart and soul into community worship of God, the creator and sustainer of all life.

Hey know1, this is what I'm talking about.

Cosmo

know1 wrote:

You can't be serious. You can't hardly open a thread on this board without someone blaming a Christian for messing up.

I'd like to see your numbers or any evidence at all that MOST Christians genuinely do not try to do better.

I think it's just the opposite, but I feel that the ones who do screw up get noticed much more than the many, many who do a lot of wonderful things for their fellow humans in the name of religion.

...
Blaming Christians... yeah... when they are at fault. Isn't that where blame lies... on the guilty parties? Maybe Christians feel persecuted because they are told they will be persecuted. Not getting to put up a Nativity Scene in a Government isn't persecution... neither is forced prayer in Publicly Funded (Taxpayer) Schools. It's more like crying like a fucking baby because they can't get their way.
And I agree... the ones that get busted are probably in the minority amongst the Christians. Most of the people I know that are Christians are nice, caring people... but, Christians do not corner the market on nice and caring. I also know Atheists and Agnostics that are equally nice and caring. I don't know too many assholes and dicks because I steer clear of assholes and dicks... Christian, Catholic, Atheist, Agnostic or otherwise.

Ahnimus

CorporateWhore wrote:

Some people say "church sucks" because they are marginalized hippies who know nothing about hard work or constructive social traditions. They prefer to create their own morality that worships hedonism and selfishness than give their heart and soul into community worship of God, the creator and sustainer of all life.

So, in otherwords to flush it down the toilet?

HoorayForHumans

church doesn't suck for me. it's a comfort that i can't really explain. i don't go like i did when i was younger, but it has nothing to do with me thinking that church "sucks" or anything like that. as for answers and proof that god exists and all, well, it's called faith for a reason. but i guess the nonbeliever has faith as well because you can't prove that god does not exist. but then again, as far as that goes you can't really prove or disprove anything as far as where everything came from, so i guess you just have to choose the right faith for yourself. if your faith is in science, you have to ask yourself where everything that made science possible came from. for me the answer is that god made everything, somehow, and made it so that the science we know would work.

i don't have anything against you guys bashing church, because people definitely take things literally out of the bible and use it for their own agenda, like politicians. but you've gotta remember that not everyone is like that. and the people who are, well i tend to doubt their faith.

Scratchin a Letter

CorporateWhore wrote:

Some people say "church sucks" because they are marginalized hippies who know nothing about hard work or constructive social traditions.

That's an interesting theory. Perhaps they are tired of bad things constantly happening. Perhaps they think it's a bit inane following rules and values for no concrete reason. Perhaps they would rather sleep in. Perhaps they think it's worthless, because I cartainly do. And I wouldn't call myself a 'marginalised hippy' either.

Ahnimus

Scratchin a Letter wrote:

That's an interesting theory. Perhaps they are tired of bad things constantly happening. Perhaps they think it's a bit inane following rules and values for no concrete reason. Perhaps they would rather sleep in. Perhaps they think it's worthless, because I cartainly do. And I wouldn't call myself a 'marginalised hippy' either.

Hmm, maybe the die-hard religious baffoons should be called "children" or "gullible". I was thinking of a way to truly depict the similarities between religion and other fairy tales. But no matter which way I think about it, religion is a fairy tale and I can't make it look anymore like a fairy tale. Somehow I think even if I could, it would just strenthen people's belief in it.

chopitdown

Ahnimus wrote:

Hmm, maybe the die-hard religious baffoons should be called "children" or "gullible". I was thinking of a way to truly depict the similarities between religion and other fairy tales. But no matter which way I think about it, religion is a fairy tale and I can't make it look anymore like a fairy tale. Somehow I think even if I could, it would just strenthen people's belief in it.

well thank you for your wonderful insights, really. Someday, I hope to be as enlightened.

Scratchin a Letter

Ahnimus wrote:

Hmm, maybe the die-hard religious baffoons should be called "children" or "gullible". I was thinking of a way to truly depict the similarities between religion and other fairy tales. But no matter which way I think about it, religion is a fairy tale and I can't make it look anymore like a fairy tale. Somehow I think even if I could, it would just strenthen people's belief in it.

I'd never go out of my way to piss off someone who goes to church, but I would love to pull out a pop-up book depicting Jesus as an alien and angels as fairies next time I walk past a preacher in the street telling me how I'm going to be saved.

Cosmo

HoorayForHumans wrote:

church doesn't suck for me. it's a comfort that i can't really explain. i don't go like i did when i was younger, but it has nothing to do with me thinking that church "sucks" or anything like that. as for answers and proof that god exists and all, well, it's called faith for a reason. but i guess the nonbeliever has faith as well because you can't prove that god does not exist. but then again, as far as that goes you can't really prove or disprove anything as far as where everything came from, so i guess you just have to choose the right faith for yourself. if your faith is in science, you have to ask yourself where everything that made science possible came from. for me the answer is that god made everything, somehow, and made it so that the science we know would work.

i don't have anything against you guys bashing church, because people definitely take things literally out of the bible and use it for their own agenda, like politicians. but you've gotta remember that not everyone is like that. and the people who are, well i tend to doubt their faith.

...
That's good... I'm happy you find comfort in the Church. I am not trying to make anyone question their faith... I'm just trying to explain why it doesn't work for me.
I believe that faith is a personal choice and not something that is mandated... for each, his own. And if that person lives his or her life as a descent, caring and loving person... then, what does it matter which religion he/she chooses to follow.
That's my take on the deal.

josevolution

ok so i being a parent of 2 children should do what ?? ..
(1) tell them church sucks that it's all lies .

(2) the priest are all perverts.

(3) we need to go because we can see the good in people .

(4) teach them religion at home ..

i'm not a very religious person by no means but some how i believe going to church once a week would be good for my 2 kids...

Cosmo

CorporateWhore wrote:

Some people say "church sucks" because they are marginalized hippies who know nothing about hard work or constructive social traditions. They prefer to create their own morality that worships hedonism and selfishness than give their heart and soul into community worship of God, the creator and sustainer of all life.

...
This is the same thing the followers of Muqtada Al Sadr state. You could be a spokesman for the Fundamentalist Shi'ites in Iraq/Iran that wish to instill good religious structure to everyone... including the conversion of the marginalized hippie Americans that worship hedonism and selfishness.

Ahnimus

josevolution wrote:

ok so i being a parent of 2 children should do what ?? ..
(1) tell them church sucks that it's all lies .

(2) the priest are all perverts.

(3) we need to go because we can see the good in people .

(4) teach them religion at home ..

i'm not a very religious person by no means but some how i believe going to church once a week would be good for my 2 kids...

Don't teach them anything, let them decide. If they as questions answer them. Keep in mind that even saying "Well, this is what I believe and why?" encourages children to share your beliefs. That may be the least you can do though.

HoorayForHumans

Cosmo wrote:

...
what does it matter which religion he/she chooses to follow.

it doesn't