In all seriousness, the conflict is not as simple as Russia just standing up for the little guy. Russia invading Georgia is not some random out of the blue act in the name of justice, anymore than Bush invading Iraq was. So no, puremagic is not the only person in this thread talking sense.
Just as I thought, another insult based on national hatred. Sweet.
And just so you know, nobody except Georgia tried to resolve this situation by force i.e. by invasion. No army forces are going straight for Tbilisi as some sources claim. Russian forces were and are merely defending Ossetians against Gerogians who by the way fight sporting American surplus uniforms and guns.
P.S. I've never displayed any national hatred for USA because it really shows the person's low level of intelligence. I think there are stupid powermongers and plain dumb people in pretty much every country. That's the way it is in this world.
Just as I thought, another insult based on national hatred. Sweet.
Aw, I am just funnin' ya. I do not hate Russians or anyone else. I just happen to think that invading Georgia is wrong, both from a legal and a moral standpoint. The Georgians have been punted out of South Ossetia, and surely now they got the message. There is no need to invade Georgian soil proper, unless the goal is to secure oil reserves, remove a pro-Western enclave, or settle old scores, NONE of which are acceptable reasons to invade a country. Sorry. My opinion and all that. Its a bad move. The world has enough bullshit wars going on.
P.S. I've never displayed any national hatred for USA because it really shows the person's low level of intelligence. I think there are stupid powermongers and plain dumb people in pretty much ever country. That's the way it is in this world.
I personally think that WAR=WRONG. But if a war needs to be waged against those who try to kill your citizens then it's legitimate. It's just a matter of self-preservation and self-defence.
I hope it ends soons, whole families have been killed, Tshkinvali's whole infrastructure is ruined. I don't have a clue what Saakashvili was thinking while biting the hand that feeds. Maybe he thought that US will back him up not only by weapons, uniform, consultants provisions but with a real intervention.
I personally think that WAR=WRONG. But if a war needs to be waged against those who try to kill your citizens then it's legitimate. It's just a matter of self-preservation and self-defence.
Hey, I'll be the first person to argue this point, IF indeed a war is waged solely for these reasons. I think there are times when military action is needed, and actually, I tend towards the view that many of the Russian military's actions against Chechen rebels (for example) can be justified using this kind of argument. I do not think that the Russians have the moral right to push this particular action beyond the bounds of South Ossetia, though. If it stops now, fine. The Russians should not dismantle the Georgian government/military, though. If they do so, it will be for reasons that have nothing to do with protecting South Ossetia.
I think they would have stopped if Georgians have stopped. But now their Iraq contingent is on its way to the troubled region which shows they have no intention of resolving the matter in any other way but military.
Therefore, if Georgians have no more military power left to act with then probably they will get round the table and discuss how the situation can be resolved peacefully.
Definitely, some sort of document preserving the status quo must be worked out. Hell, there is no status quo left because Thkinvali have been completely wiped out. I don't know if US news channels show footage of the city, of the people but it's real ugly now. And thanks to Saakashvili it might get worse.
I think they would have stopped if Georgians have stopped. But now their Iraq contingent is on its way to the troubled region which shows they have no intention of resolving the matter in any other way but military.
I dont think those 2000 soldiers are going to turn the tide of the battle. Russia probably has a 30 to 1 troop advantage, heavy armor, and air superiority. This is like 20 year old man beating up a 7 year old. Russia will stop when they feel they have gotten their point across, not because they believe Georgia is a threat.
Let me get this straight. So we defend innocent civialians against the agressor because of nationalism. You mean we want to show Georgians that Georgian nation is inferior compared to Russian nation? Is that what you're getting at?
It's the same old story. You were reading the wrong books which say that if it were not for Americans World War II would not be won.
It's the other way around, "dude", seems like you've been learning the history from Rocky 4, Rambo 3 along with Wikipedia and other "exhaustive" Internet information sources.
Nah brah, I'm not saying Russia is wrong, necessarily, in this matter. I'm just saying that the Georgians might have overstepped their bounds and Russian nationalism stood in the way. That it's not always oil as the main cause of international conflict.
Russia is just doing what the USA used to do to Mexico. Can't really fault them for it. Mexico fucked up and the USA spanked them out of the american southwest. Whoops, their bad. Better get a real military next time, pussies.
All I know is that to see, and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.
-Enoch Powell
Russia is just doing what the USA used to do to Mexico. Can't really fault them for it. Mexico fucked up and the USA spanked them out of the american southwest. Whoops, their bad. Better get a real military next time, pussies.
I dont think those 2000 soldiers are going to turn the tide of the battle. Russia probably has a 30 to 1 troop advantage, heavy armor, and air superiority. This is like 20 year old man beating up a 7 year old. Russia will stop when they feel they have gotten their point across, not because they believe Georgia is a threat.
But men are, sure as hell, gonna continue to die because of this stupid-ass chickenshit pseudo-president.
I think they would have stopped if Georgians have stopped. But now their Iraq contingent is on its way to the troubled region which shows they have no intention of resolving the matter in any other way but military.
Therefore, if Georgians have no more military power left to act with then probably they will get round the table and discuss how the situation can be resolved peacefully.
Definitely, some sort of document preserving the status quo must be worked out. Hell, there is no status quo left because Thkinvali have been completely wiped out. I don't know if US news channels show footage of the city, of the people but it's real ugly now. And thanks to Saakashvili it might get worse.
The Russian government evidently has its citizens brainwashed. The only reason the region is "troubled" as you say is because Russia/Putin couldn't keep its giant military ego in check for less than 2 decades.
The situation is and was complicated from what I've read. the root lies in the russian empire, later to be the soviet union. There are several semi- and fully autonomous regions within the old Soviet states. The people of Abkhazia and Ossetia were always allied to the russians, much more so than the Georgians, and these regions had some autonomy. When Georgia and others broke off from the Soviet, these regions also wanted their independence, but were hampered by the Georgians. After some fighting, the russians intervened to seperate the fighting parties, and to protect their old allies. so, since then, these regions have been de facto semi-autonomous.
Since the Ossetians dont want to be Georgian citizens, and they are not recognized as a state globally, they were offered russian passports and citizenship in order for them to cross borders and travel. Ossetians want a close relationship with Russia, with the historical roots and all, and at least not with Georgia with whom they've been at war, and now again is.
The war have been long coming, especially after Sakaashvili made it a priority to bring the seperatists back into the fold of Georgia. (where they havent really been since the war in the early 90s) It is of course in russia's interest to have a foothold on that side of the mountains, in addition to maintaining the friendship with the Ossetians. But Georgia attacked first, by all accounts, so so far the Russians have justification for what they're doing. Now, we will see in the coming days whether the russians in turn overstep that justification.
And the west should step lightly in this matter as it is very similar to the whole Kosovo situation. But I also think russia wants to resolve the matter quickly and decisively. Otherwise it might spread to Chechnya and others...
Peace
Dan
"YOU [humans] NEED TO BELIEVE IN THINGS THAT AREN'T TRUE. HOW ELSE CAN THEY BECOME?" - Death
"Every judgment teeters on the brink of error. To claim absolute knowledge is to become monstrous. Knowledge is an unending adventure at the edge of uncertainty." - Frank Herbert, Dune, 1965
The Russian government evidently has its citizens brainwashed. The only reason the region is "troubled" as you say is because Russia/Putin couldn't keep its giant military ego in check for less than 2 decades.
US govenment have been brainwashing you and obviously your parents for the good half a century.
Apparantly since 2006 when Putin said that Russia will not let USA put its nose in everything most Americans had that feeling that Red threat is back again and Cold War could start again.
Also this old "Cold war" mentality doesn't seem to change in minds of American citizens.
Sure have it your way, in bizarro world where Bush,Jr. is a fricking saint and therefore has the right to interfere in everything that's not even remotely concern USA because he can.
US govenment have been brainwashing you and obviously your parents for the good half a century.
Apparantly since 2006 when Putin said that Russia will not let USA put its nose in everything most Americans had that feeling that Red threat is back again and Cold War could start again.
Also this old "Cold war" mentality doesn't seem to change in minds of American citizens.
Sure have it your way, in bizarro world where Bush,Jr. is a fricking saint and therefore has the right to interfere in everything that's not even remotely concern USA because he can.
I'm not American-I'm Australian. And trust me, I can think for myself but thanks for the concern.
In anycase its hardly the USA which is doing the interfering here. Russia wants the world to think its experiencing some sort of national rejuvination (in reality only in military spending). But where as China is experiencing a true rejuvenation economically -where it matters- Putin's achieved it in the superficial and by riding the booming oil price.
So what better thing to do to show the world your new found muscle than invade a little nation which had just by chance relatively recently become indendent from mother Russia with lttle or no provocation? Putin and co simply were waiting for an oppurtunity like this. What Putin has got on his side is that most Russians are too comfortable financially to give a shit who runs their country or take issue with its direction as long as the good times hand around. Capitalism has its perks. It could sound like I was making this up but I have a Russian friend who agrees with me.
The situation is and was complicated from what I've read. the root lies in the russian empire, later to be the soviet union. There are several semi- and fully autonomous regions within the old Soviet states. The people of Abkhazia and Ossetia were always allied to the russians, much more so than the Georgians, and these regions had some autonomy. When Georgia and others broke off from the Soviet, these regions also wanted their independence, but were hampered by the Georgians. After some fighting, the russians intervened to seperate the fighting parties, and to protect their old allies. so, since then, these regions have been de facto semi-autonomous.
Since the Ossetians dont want to be Georgian citizens, and they are not recognized as a state globally, they were offered russian passports and citizenship in order for them to cross borders and travel. Ossetians want a close relationship with Russia, with the historical roots and all, and at least not with Georgia with whom they've been at war, and now again is.
The war have been long coming, especially after Sakaashvili made it a priority to bring the seperatists back into the fold of Georgia. (where they havent really been since the war in the early 90s) It is of course in russia's interest to have a foothold on that side of the mountains, in addition to maintaining the friendship with the Ossetians. But Georgia attacked first, by all accounts, so so far the Russians have justification for what they're doing. Now, we will see in the coming days whether the russians in turn overstep that justification.
And the west should step lightly in this matter as it is very similar to the whole Kosovo situation. But I also think russia wants to resolve the matter quickly and decisively. Otherwise it might spread to Chechnya and others...
So what better thing to do to show the world your new found muscle than invade a little nation which had just by chance relatively recently become indendent from mother Russia with lttle or no provocation? Putin and co simply were waiting for an oppurtunity like this. What Putin has got on his side is that most Russians are too comfortable financially to give a shit who runs their country or take issue with its direction as long as the good times hand around. Capitalism has its perks. It could sound like I was making this up but I have a Russian friend who agrees with me.
Most Russians are not too comfortable financially. I think it was only two or three months ago Medvedev told the press poverty and corruption are still two of the main problems in Russia. I believe he said fighting poverty would be one of his priorities.
The situation is and was complicated from what I've read. the root lies in the russian empire, later to be the soviet union. There are several semi- and fully autonomous regions within the old Soviet states. The people of Abkhazia and Ossetia were always allied to the russians, much more so than the Georgians, and these regions had some autonomy. When Georgia and others broke off from the Soviet, these regions also wanted their independence, but were hampered by the Georgians. After some fighting, the russians intervened to seperate the fighting parties, and to protect their old allies. so, since then, these regions have been de facto semi-autonomous.
Since the Ossetians dont want to be Georgian citizens, and they are not recognized as a state globally, they were offered russian passports and citizenship in order for them to cross borders and travel. Ossetians want a close relationship with Russia, with the historical roots and all, and at least not with Georgia with whom they've been at war, and now again is.
The war have been long coming, especially after Sakaashvili made it a priority to bring the seperatists back into the fold of Georgia. (where they havent really been since the war in the early 90s) It is of course in russia's interest to have a foothold on that side of the mountains, in addition to maintaining the friendship with the Ossetians. But Georgia attacked first, by all accounts, so so far the Russians have justification for what they're doing. Now, we will see in the coming days whether the russians in turn overstep that justification.
And the west should step lightly in this matter as it is very similar to the whole Kosovo situation. But I also think russia wants to resolve the matter quickly and decisively. Otherwise it might spread to Chechnya and others...
Peace
Dan
Great post, thanks for a clear explanation of what is happening!
...and it may already be more or less over. The fighting at least.
Peace
Dan
"YOU [humans] NEED TO BELIEVE IN THINGS THAT AREN'T TRUE. HOW ELSE CAN THEY BECOME?" - Death
"Every judgment teeters on the brink of error. To claim absolute knowledge is to become monstrous. Knowledge is an unending adventure at the edge of uncertainty." - Frank Herbert, Dune, 1965
It could sound like I was making this up but I have a Russian friend who agrees with me.
Russia wants the world to think its experiencing some sort of national rejuvination (in reality only in military spending). But where as China is experiencing a true rejuvenation economically -where it matters- Putin's achieved it in the superficial and by riding the booming oil price.
So what better thing to do to show the world your new found muscle than invade a little nation which had just by chance relatively recently become indendent from mother Russia with lttle or no provocation? Putin and co simply were waiting for an oppurtunity like this. What Putin has got on his side is that most Russians are too comfortable financially to give a shit who runs their country or take issue with its direction as long as the good times hand around. Capitalism has its perks. It could sound like I was making this up but I have a Russian friend who agrees with me.
First, you say that Russia is doing well only in military terms and in this way spending a lot of money while its economy is in poor state. TWO sentences later you claim that most Russians are financially content. There's a huge contradiction in what you say.
Wow, really??? Well, here's a thought, maybe your Russian friend should be the president.
First, you say that Russia is doing well only in military terms and in this way spending a lot of money while its economy is in poor state. TWO sentences later you claim that most Russians are financially content. There's a huge contradiction in what you say.
Wow, really??? Well, here's a thought, maybe your Russian friend should be the president.
I didn't say the economy was doing poorly. From what I understand its indeed doing well, but in a large part because of oil revenues. Its hardly the sort of economic boom going on in China, despite the way Putin postures in interviews.
Most Russians are not too comfortable financially. I think it was only two or three months ago Medvedev told the press poverty and corruption are still two of the main problems in Russia. I believe he said fighting poverty would be one of his priorities.
I should have said "more" Russians. Certianly the younger classes and those in positions of influence like the media or public service (isn't that the media anyway) have a lot more disposable income. So as long as their happy...
Well jeez how many politicians want to do something about poverty?
I should have said "more" Russians. Certianly the younger classes and those in positions of influence like the media or public service (isn't that the media anyway) have a lot more disposable income. So as long as their happy...
Well jeez how many politicians want to do something about poverty?
It appears poverty has become more of a problem in the rural areas of Russia. The urban areas are indeed doing a lot better.
Your attempt to act as an apologist for Russia is just as weak, so there ya go. Protecting its own? THAT's naive.
-- I offer no apology for Russia because Russia is doing just what we do in other countries. The only problem here is the US and EU, just like you are pretending to be a shocked at Russia stepping up and saying fuck this. The U.S and BP go after their economy by building a pipeline to bypass their oil rights. Then we say, hey, plus we (U.S. and EU) are going to build a missile defense system in your backyard. Take that Russia! Well here's your answer, more death and destruction leveled on innocent people caught in the middle of greedy, egotistical politicians.
. That's the same argument Bush used for invading Iraq, a war I know you don't support. Apparently its cool when non-Americans use this rationale, though..
When all else fails, the theme is to resort to presumptuous personal attacks, how weak.
-- What I don't support are lies and deceit that get people killed, that destroy countries and people because of greedy politicians.
--Don't let the fact that I live in NM fool you into thinking I'm not an American because you'd be dead wrong. Everything our government does is not always done in the best interest of the people or the nation. Yet, everything Bush and Administration has questionably done, he claims he has done in the name of the American people. Mass murder is not my thing.
And I based what I said about Georgian troops on the ratings of combat readiness and general quality that you can find online ... In short, yes, training from Americans does make a difference.
-- Combat training may enhance a person's ability, but that is only a small, very small purpose of advanced military instructors. Its the training on U.S. militarysupplied equipment and sophisticated weapons that makes a difference. However, in this case, its not U.S. weapons vs rock throwing Arabs is it! No, its U.S. weapons facing an equally equipped and determined opponent.
=======
Why is it always necessary to push the envelop?
What makes you think that at some point a nation wasn't going to say f--k this? Bush and his Administration thought that since they had Iran isolated, North Korea silenced and China content, that Russia was no longer an issue. In fact they dismissed Russia's protest of these issues. They were blind to fact that they were backing Russia into a corner with the only option to come out fighting.
If you listen to Bush and Rice, they are both conceding the fact that Russia can have the disputed territories in Georgia. So why the hell didn't Bush and Rice negotiate and settle that with Georgia beforehand? Why did it have to come to this!!!
SIN EATERS--We take the moral excrement we find in this equation and we bury it down deep inside of us so that the rest of our case can stay pure. That is the job. We are morally indefensible and absolutely necessary.
The situation is and was complicated from what I've read. the root lies in the russian empire, later to be the soviet union. There are several semi- and fully autonomous regions within the old Soviet states. The people of Abkhazia and Ossetia were always allied to the russians, much more so than the Georgians, and these regions had some autonomy. When Georgia and others broke off from the Soviet, these regions also wanted their independence, but were hampered by the Georgians. After some fighting, the russians intervened to seperate the fighting parties, and to protect their old allies. so, since then, these regions have been de facto semi-autonomous.
Since the Ossetians dont want to be Georgian citizens, and they are not recognized as a state globally, they were offered russian passports and citizenship in order for them to cross borders and travel. Ossetians want a close relationship with Russia, with the historical roots and all, and at least not with Georgia with whom they've been at war, and now again is.
The war have been long coming, especially after Sakaashvili made it a priority to bring the seperatists back into the fold of Georgia. (where they havent really been since the war in the early 90s) It is of course in russia's interest to have a foothold on that side of the mountains, in addition to maintaining the friendship with the Ossetians. But Georgia attacked first, by all accounts, so so far the Russians have justification for what they're doing. Now, we will see in the coming days whether the russians in turn overstep that justification.
And the west should step lightly in this matter as it is very similar to the whole Kosovo situation. But I also think russia wants to resolve the matter quickly and decisively. Otherwise it might spread to Chechnya and others...
Peace
Dan
good post, and I agree with it mostly...
only I question if it is justified for Russia to bomb georgian towns and sink their ships in the black sea...this doesn't fall under "protecting russian citizens", but is more like a punishment or something...a demonstration of strength.
it seems like Russia still hasn't achieved a solid economic development which profits the majority of the people, not only a small oligarchy, they have to resort to imperial manners again...showing they are strong and powerful again, not only to the world, but mainly to their own citizens(which are mostly poor)...
m.
Godwin's Law:
"As an internet discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches one."
Comments
Ah ... "Douchebagastan". Now it all fits.
Just as I thought, another insult based on national hatred. Sweet.
And just so you know, nobody except Georgia tried to resolve this situation by force i.e. by invasion. No army forces are going straight for Tbilisi as some sources claim. Russian forces were and are merely defending Ossetians against Gerogians who by the way fight sporting American surplus uniforms and guns.
P.S. I've never displayed any national hatred for USA because it really shows the person's low level of intelligence. I think there are stupid powermongers and plain dumb people in pretty much every country. That's the way it is in this world.
Aw, I am just funnin' ya. I do not hate Russians or anyone else. I just happen to think that invading Georgia is wrong, both from a legal and a moral standpoint. The Georgians have been punted out of South Ossetia, and surely now they got the message. There is no need to invade Georgian soil proper, unless the goal is to secure oil reserves, remove a pro-Western enclave, or settle old scores, NONE of which are acceptable reasons to invade a country. Sorry. My opinion and all that. Its a bad move. The world has enough bullshit wars going on.
Well, we can agree on this point.
I hope it ends soons, whole families have been killed, Tshkinvali's whole infrastructure is ruined. I don't have a clue what Saakashvili was thinking while biting the hand that feeds. Maybe he thought that US will back him up not only by weapons, uniform, consultants provisions but with a real intervention.
Hey, I'll be the first person to argue this point, IF indeed a war is waged solely for these reasons. I think there are times when military action is needed, and actually, I tend towards the view that many of the Russian military's actions against Chechen rebels (for example) can be justified using this kind of argument. I do not think that the Russians have the moral right to push this particular action beyond the bounds of South Ossetia, though. If it stops now, fine. The Russians should not dismantle the Georgian government/military, though. If they do so, it will be for reasons that have nothing to do with protecting South Ossetia.
Therefore, if Georgians have no more military power left to act with then probably they will get round the table and discuss how the situation can be resolved peacefully.
Definitely, some sort of document preserving the status quo must be worked out. Hell, there is no status quo left because Thkinvali have been completely wiped out. I don't know if US news channels show footage of the city, of the people but it's real ugly now. And thanks to Saakashvili it might get worse.
I dont think those 2000 soldiers are going to turn the tide of the battle. Russia probably has a 30 to 1 troop advantage, heavy armor, and air superiority. This is like 20 year old man beating up a 7 year old. Russia will stop when they feel they have gotten their point across, not because they believe Georgia is a threat.
http://www.mixology.eu/files/images/Ikon_Vodka.jpg
Nah brah, I'm not saying Russia is wrong, necessarily, in this matter. I'm just saying that the Georgians might have overstepped their bounds and Russian nationalism stood in the way. That it's not always oil as the main cause of international conflict.
Russia is just doing what the USA used to do to Mexico. Can't really fault them for it. Mexico fucked up and the USA spanked them out of the american southwest. Whoops, their bad. Better get a real military next time, pussies.
-Enoch Powell
You mean that Texas incident in 19th century?
But men are, sure as hell, gonna continue to die because of this stupid-ass chickenshit pseudo-president.
Si, senor! We elkicko their asses mi amigo.
Russia just doin the same thing right? Welcome to the club boys
-Enoch Powell
http://i533.photobucket.com/albums/ee332/COREduroy/l1048752874.gif
The Russian government evidently has its citizens brainwashed. The only reason the region is "troubled" as you say is because Russia/Putin couldn't keep its giant military ego in check for less than 2 decades.
Since the Ossetians dont want to be Georgian citizens, and they are not recognized as a state globally, they were offered russian passports and citizenship in order for them to cross borders and travel. Ossetians want a close relationship with Russia, with the historical roots and all, and at least not with Georgia with whom they've been at war, and now again is.
The war have been long coming, especially after Sakaashvili made it a priority to bring the seperatists back into the fold of Georgia. (where they havent really been since the war in the early 90s) It is of course in russia's interest to have a foothold on that side of the mountains, in addition to maintaining the friendship with the Ossetians. But Georgia attacked first, by all accounts, so so far the Russians have justification for what they're doing. Now, we will see in the coming days whether the russians in turn overstep that justification.
And the west should step lightly in this matter as it is very similar to the whole Kosovo situation. But I also think russia wants to resolve the matter quickly and decisively. Otherwise it might spread to Chechnya and others...
Peace
Dan
"Every judgment teeters on the brink of error. To claim absolute knowledge is to become monstrous. Knowledge is an unending adventure at the edge of uncertainty." - Frank Herbert, Dune, 1965
US govenment have been brainwashing you and obviously your parents for the good half a century.
Apparantly since 2006 when Putin said that Russia will not let USA put its nose in everything most Americans had that feeling that Red threat is back again and Cold War could start again.
Also this old "Cold war" mentality doesn't seem to change in minds of American citizens.
Sure have it your way, in bizarro world where Bush,Jr. is a fricking saint and therefore has the right to interfere in everything that's not even remotely concern USA because he can.
One of the few who talks sense around here.
I'm not American-I'm Australian. And trust me, I can think for myself but thanks for the concern.
In anycase its hardly the USA which is doing the interfering here. Russia wants the world to think its experiencing some sort of national rejuvination (in reality only in military spending). But where as China is experiencing a true rejuvenation economically -where it matters- Putin's achieved it in the superficial and by riding the booming oil price.
So what better thing to do to show the world your new found muscle than invade a little nation which had just by chance relatively recently become indendent from mother Russia with lttle or no provocation? Putin and co simply were waiting for an oppurtunity like this. What Putin has got on his side is that most Russians are too comfortable financially to give a shit who runs their country or take issue with its direction as long as the good times hand around. Capitalism has its perks. It could sound like I was making this up but I have a Russian friend who agrees with me.
Excellent post.
naděje umírá poslední
Most Russians are not too comfortable financially. I think it was only two or three months ago Medvedev told the press poverty and corruption are still two of the main problems in Russia. I believe he said fighting poverty would be one of his priorities.
naděje umírá poslední
...and it may already be more or less over. The fighting at least.
Peace
Dan
"Every judgment teeters on the brink of error. To claim absolute knowledge is to become monstrous. Knowledge is an unending adventure at the edge of uncertainty." - Frank Herbert, Dune, 1965
First, you say that Russia is doing well only in military terms and in this way spending a lot of money while its economy is in poor state. TWO sentences later you claim that most Russians are financially content. There's a huge contradiction in what you say.
Wow, really??? Well, here's a thought, maybe your Russian friend should be the president.
I didn't say the economy was doing poorly. From what I understand its indeed doing well, but in a large part because of oil revenues. Its hardly the sort of economic boom going on in China, despite the way Putin postures in interviews.
She would be president if she had her way.
I should have said "more" Russians. Certianly the younger classes and those in positions of influence like the media or public service (isn't that the media anyway) have a lot more disposable income. So as long as their happy...
Well jeez how many politicians want to do something about poverty?
It appears poverty has become more of a problem in the rural areas of Russia. The urban areas are indeed doing a lot better.
naděje umírá poslední
-- I offer no apology for Russia because Russia is doing just what we do in other countries. The only problem here is the US and EU, just like you are pretending to be a shocked at Russia stepping up and saying fuck this. The U.S and BP go after their economy by building a pipeline to bypass their oil rights. Then we say, hey, plus we (U.S. and EU) are going to build a missile defense system in your backyard. Take that Russia! Well here's your answer, more death and destruction leveled on innocent people caught in the middle of greedy, egotistical politicians.
When all else fails, the theme is to resort to presumptuous personal attacks, how weak.
-- What I don't support are lies and deceit that get people killed, that destroy countries and people because of greedy politicians.
--Don't let the fact that I live in NM fool you into thinking I'm not an American because you'd be dead wrong. Everything our government does is not always done in the best interest of the people or the nation. Yet, everything Bush and Administration has questionably done, he claims he has done in the name of the American people. Mass murder is not my thing.
-- Combat training may enhance a person's ability, but that is only a small, very small purpose of advanced military instructors. Its the training on U.S. militarysupplied equipment and sophisticated weapons that makes a difference. However, in this case, its not U.S. weapons vs rock throwing Arabs is it! No, its U.S. weapons facing an equally equipped and determined opponent.
=======
Why is it always necessary to push the envelop?
What makes you think that at some point a nation wasn't going to say f--k this? Bush and his Administration thought that since they had Iran isolated, North Korea silenced and China content, that Russia was no longer an issue. In fact they dismissed Russia's protest of these issues. They were blind to fact that they were backing Russia into a corner with the only option to come out fighting.
If you listen to Bush and Rice, they are both conceding the fact that Russia can have the disputed territories in Georgia. So why the hell didn't Bush and Rice negotiate and settle that with Georgia beforehand? Why did it have to come to this!!!
good post, and I agree with it mostly...
only I question if it is justified for Russia to bomb georgian towns and sink their ships in the black sea...this doesn't fall under "protecting russian citizens", but is more like a punishment or something...a demonstration of strength.
it seems like Russia still hasn't achieved a solid economic development which profits the majority of the people, not only a small oligarchy, they have to resort to imperial manners again...showing they are strong and powerful again, not only to the world, but mainly to their own citizens(which are mostly poor)...
m.
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