The Chocolate War

Ahnimus

catefrances wrote:

who said kraft was funding the tobacco company? all i said was philip morris were diversifying. and that i can not support any companies owned by a tobacco company.

Philip Morris is essentially a conglomeration that happens to have it's hands in tobacco and food. You aren't supporting a tobacco company by buying Kraft foods.

redrock

Ahnimus wrote:

Yes, they buy kraft to make more money, for stock market stability and increased bottom line for the shareholders. But none of that money goes into the tobacco industry.

Philip Morris being part of the tobacco industry , the money goes there.. obviously some of it goes to the share holders outside the industry but that is very limited...

catefrances

Ahnimus wrote:

I still haven't heard a reason for the boycott. All it's doing is hurting Kraft.

KRAFT, which is owned by PHILIP MORRIS.

redrock

Ahnimus wrote:

I still haven't heard a reason for the boycott. All it's doing is hurting Kraft.

Kraft is owned by philip morris..... what may be hurting kraft will hurt the tobacco company that owns them.

http://www.tobacco.org/Resources/00pmbrands.html All these brands listed are OWNED by Philip Morris.. don't tell me purchasing them will not add to their profits.... You know better than that.

Ahnimus

redrock wrote:

Kraft is owned by philip morris..... what may be hurting kraft will hurt the tobacco company that owns them.

http://www.tobacco.org/Resources/00pmbrands.html All these brands listed are OWNED by Philip Morris.. don't tell me purchasing them will not add to their profits.... You know better than that.

It will add to the conglomerations profits, but not to the tobacco profits or tobacco marketting or anything to do with tobacco.

Here is another way of thinking about it. Suppose you are successful and there is no longer a such thing as Philip Morris tobacco, Kraft Dinner or Miller Beer. What do you think will happen to the customer base? The smokers will smoke Marlboro or something, the Kraft fans will be disapointed but probably buy noname mac and cheese and the Miller fans will drink Bud or something. All that would change is that those three brand names will be dead. The customers will still smoke, drink and eat.

Ahnimus

catefrances wrote:

KRAFT, which is owned by PHILIP MORRIS.

You honestly think less kids will take up smoking if you stop eating Kraft macaroni and cheese?

redrock

Ahnimus wrote:

It will add to the conglomerations profits, but not to the tobacco profits or tobacco marketting or anything to do with tobacco.

Here is another way of thinking about it. Suppose you are successful and there is no longer a such thing as Philip Morris tobacco, Kraft Dinner or Miller Beer. What do you think will happen to the customer base? The smokers will smoke Marlboro or something, the Kraft fans will be disapointed but probably buy noname mac and cheese and the Miller fans will drink Bud or something. All that would change is that those three brand names will be dead. The customers will still smoke, drink and eat.

It will add to the profits of the tobacco company Philip Morris who has decided, with the profits of cigarette sales, to buy other companies. Whilst the profits will of course also go to Kraft, they will fill the coffers of Philip Morris who will most probably use some of the money to pursue their tobacco dealing..

On your second point, we know that will never happen.. and Philip Morris was just an example of a tobacco company. Kraft wouldn't die.. If it no longer satisfies the profit targets for Philip Morris.. Philip Morris will sell them off to someone else.. hopefully not a tobacco company.

catefrances

Ahnimus wrote:

You honestly think less kids will take up smoking if you stop eating Kraft macaroni and cheese?

no. but that's not my motivation. I will not support tobacco companies.
exactly which part of PERSONAL choice don't you get ryan?

redrock

Ahnimus wrote:

You honestly think less kids will take up smoking if you stop eating Kraft macaroni and cheese?

You're just being fastidious and obtuse here... you know exactly what we all mean...

Ahnimus

redrock wrote:

It will add to the profits of the tobacco company Philip Morris who has decided, with the profits of cigarette sales, to buy other companies. Whilst the profits will of course also go to Kraft, they will fill the coffers of Philip Morris who will most probably use some of the money to pursue their tobacco dealing..

On your second point, we know that will never happen.. and Philip Morris was just an example of a tobacco company. Kraft wouldn't die.. If it no longer satisfies the profit targets for Philip Morris.. Philip Morris will sell them off to someone else.. hopefully not a tobacco company.

You just reiterated my point. Philip Morris makes enough from tobacco profits to buy out Kraft and Miller. Then they don't need the profits from Kraft and Miller to continue selling tobacco. So boycotting kraft won't affect the tobacco industry at all.

Look, I realize you get some kind of feel-good high out of believing you can hurt the tobacco industry by boycotting Kraft, but it's illusory, it doesn't affect the tobacco industry at all.

catefrances

Ahnimus wrote:

You just reiterated my point. Philip Morris makes enough from tobacco profits to buy out Kraft and Miller. Then they don't need the profits from Kraft and Miller to continue selling tobacco. So boycotting kraft won't affect the tobacco industry at all.

Look, I realize you get some kind of feel-good high out of believing you can hurt the tobacco industry by boycotting Kraft, but it's illusory, it doesn't affect the tobacco industry at all.

then imagine the feel good high i get out of not supporting westinghouse or general electric.

prism

Ahnimus wrote:

It will add to the conglomerations profits, but not to the tobacco profits or tobacco marketting or anything to do with tobacco.

Here is another way of thinking about it. Suppose you are successful and there is no longer a such thing as Philip Morris tobacco, Kraft Dinner or Miller Beer. What do you think will happen to the customer base? The smokers will smoke Marlboro or something, the Kraft fans will be disapointed but probably buy noname mac and cheese and the Miller fans will drink Bud or something. All that would change is that those three brand names will be dead. The customers will still smoke, drink and eat.

I guess that people will have to start smoking 'or something' since Phillip Morris owns Marlboro as well

Ahnimus

catefrances wrote:

no. but that's not my motivation. I will not support tobacco companies.
exactly which part of PERSONAL choice don't you get ryan?

No I get the personal choice part of it. But I think that's just a diversive defense against your determination to boycott Kraft.

Why do you hate tobacco companies? Because they sell harmful substances? If boycotting Kraft isn't going to stop people from smoking, then how is it going to stop Philip Morris from selling tobacco? If it doesn't affect the tobacco industry at all, then I fail to see the point.

redrock

Ahnimus wrote:

You just reiterated my point. Philip Morris makes enough from tobacco profits to buy out Kraft and Miller. Then they don't need the profits from Kraft and Miller to continue selling tobacco. So boycotting kraft won't affect the tobacco industry at all.

Look, I realize you get some kind of feel-good high out of believing you can hurt the tobacco industry by boycotting Kraft, but it's illusory, it doesn't affect the tobacco industry at all.

They do need other brands.. their profits from tobacco sales are slumping....

Ahnimus

prism wrote:

I guess that people will have to start smoking 'or something' since Phillip Morris owns Marlboro as well

There are a lot of tobacco companies. Ultimately people will just grow it in their yards if they have to.

catefrances

Ahnimus wrote:

No I get the personal choice part of it. But I think that's just a diversive defense against your determination to boycott Kraft.

Why do you hate tobacco companies? Because they sell harmful substances? If boycotting Kraft isn't going to stop people from smoking, then how is it going to stop Philip Morris from selling tobacco? If it doesn't affect the tobacco industry at all, then I fail to see the point.

hmm why do i hate tobacco companies? let me think now? maybe cause they sell a product that kills people?

i am sure there is a lot of things you fail to see the point of ryan.

Ahnimus

redrock wrote:

They do need other brands.. their profits from tobacco sales are slumping....

Right, but in the end is it going to stop people from smoking? No. Then what's the point?

Ahnimus

catefrances wrote:

hmm why do i hate tobacco companies? let me think now? maybe cause they sell a product that kills people?

i am sure there is a lot of things you fail to see the point of ryan.

I believe I answered that question for you. As I figured that was why you hated the tobacco copanies, but you didn't answer the last question, what difference does it make?

catefrances

Ahnimus wrote:

No I get the personal choice part of it. But I think that's just a diversive defense against your determination to boycott Kraft.

Why do you hate tobacco companies? Because they sell harmful substances? If boycotting Kraft isn't going to stop people from smoking, then how is it going to stop Philip Morris from selling tobacco? If it doesn't affect the tobacco industry at all, then I fail to see the point.

okay ryan. why would i feel a need to boycott kraft if they were not owned by a tobacco company. what would my motivation be then? do you think there is something more to my boycott of kraft. or isn't the fact that kraft is owned by an unethical industry enough?

prism

Ahnimus wrote:

There are a lot of tobacco companies. Ultimately people will just grow it in their yards if they have to.

nah....their yards are already covered with pot plants