Just dont get the fascination with TOOL

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  • O_G_D
    O_G_D Toronto Posts: 542
    RockKing wrote:
    Worldwide? I don't know the worldwide sales numbers. But it's not catching up in the US at all. In fact, it's losing ground and falling down the charts faster than 10,000 Days. Not to mention the fact that 10,000 Days doubled PJ8 in the first week sales. Look, Pearl Jam is hands down my favorite band ever. But Tool is just a more popular band right now.


    How could it be so. PJ is so much better and well long outlive Tool.
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  • keeponrockin
    keeponrockin Posts: 7,446
    If I were to get into Tool, what album should I get, Laterus?sp
    Believe me, when I was growin up, I thought the worst thing you could turn out to be was normal, So I say freaks in the most complementary way. Here's a song by a fellow freak - E.V
  • cinredzfan47
    cinredzfan47 Posts: 81
    Labyrinth wrote:
    You're wrong. It means every week theres less of a gap than there originally was. Which means Pearl Jam will maintain higher consistency & eventually the week will happen where Pearl Jam will be selling more copies than 10,000 Days. You're wrong. Hits Daily Double proves it. You're wrong.

    This is just a stupid post. YOU are the one who is wrong, and your evidence is working against you. Even if Tool's album sales decrease at a higher percentage than Pj's it doesn't matter because they're starting with a much higher number of raw album sales, so a higher percentage drop in sales iwll still mean they have more total sales than PJ. Your logic doesn't work.
  • glasshouse
    glasshouse Posts: 1,762
    tool is a brilliant band. just like pearl jam they polarise opinion. they are a love them or hate them band like pearl jam. so, as much as you don't seem to appreciate their talent there are a lot of rock fans out there with a serious distaste for pearl jam's music. anyway i like tool's music but i don't agree with their message at all.
    by the way it is weird to think that you love pj and can't at least appreciate the songcraft of songs like
    eulogy
    hooker with a penis
    fourty six and two......just thinking aenima
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  • Labyrinth
    Labyrinth Posts: 25
    RockKing wrote:
    Somebody please step in and back me up here.

    Week 1:

    1. Tool ~700,000 total
    2. Pearl Jam ~300,000 total
    Gap=~400,000 total

    Week 2:

    3. Tool ~903,000 total
    8. Pearl Jam ~390,000 total
    Gap=~513,000 total

    Week 3:

    3. Tool ~1,010,730 total
    10. Pearl Jam ~443,489 total
    Gap=~567,241 total


    How exactly, is that catching up to Tool? Is this really so hard to comprehend??? You can say that the rate at which Tool is outselling Pearl Jam is slowing down, and that is true. But that is not the same as catching up. In order to be catching up, Pearl Jam would have to be outselling Tool, which they haven't come close to doing in any week yet.

    By the way, I don't know where you got that information, but it's pretty wrong. Tool sold roughly 560k their first week, not 700,000

    If you're talking worldwide sales, Pearl Jam has sold way more than 443,489 total

    Its as if you're counting worldwide sales for Tool, & only American sales for Pearl Jam
  • RockKing
    RockKing Posts: 431
    keeponrockin wrote:
    If I were to get into Tool, what album should I get, Laterus?sp

    I would recommend them in the following order:

    1. Undertow
    2. Aenima
    3. Opiate
    4. Lateralus
    5. 10,000 Days

    I think it would be a mistake to start with Lateralus. You need to hear the progression that led to Lateralus.
    --"I'm like an opening band for the sun"

    --"We’re taking pills to get along with life… the pills are YIELD and PJ’s music. Then we create words to call our own = our analysis of YIELD." - YIH
  • cinredzfan47
    cinredzfan47 Posts: 81
    Labyrinth wrote:
    Maybe you're too stupid to understand. There's a bigger gap in the percentages of each week for Tool than there is for Pearl Jam. Eventually Pearl Jam will outsell 10,000 Days because its more consistant in selling. I provided the link to prove that. Maybe you need to go look again. Especially since there isnt 1 other song on 10,000 Days that would make a good single, whereas theres many on Pearl Jam. You're wrong. Consistency is what sells albums & Pearl Jam is catching up & percentages proves it.

    I'm not guessing Pearl Jam will outsell 10,000 Days by 2007, I'm telling you.

    You need to lay off this guy. A) he obviously has much more knowledge of statistics than you do (and it doesn't take a genius to understand what he's saying) b) PJ's sales are going to continue to decrease along with Tool's. Tool's album sales are not going to drop off the face of the earth while PJ's reach some plateau and stay there. I like PJ more, but their album will not outsell Tool's. If you don't believe me, get back to me in a couple of years...
  • RockKing
    RockKing Posts: 431
    O_G_D wrote:
    How could it be so. PJ is so much better and well long outlive Tool.

    It's just a matter of what's popular right now. I wouldn't worry about it too much. Like I said, we are a more close-knit and loyal fan base. Our numbers are just smaller than some bands.
    --"I'm like an opening band for the sun"

    --"We’re taking pills to get along with life… the pills are YIELD and PJ’s music. Then we create words to call our own = our analysis of YIELD." - YIH
  • RockKing
    RockKing Posts: 431
    cinredzfan47 wrote:
    You need to lay off this guy. A) he obviously has much more knowledge of statistics than you do (and it doesn't take a genius to understand what he's saying) b) PJ's sales are going to continue to decrease along with Tool's. Tool's album sales are not going to drop off the face of the earth while PJ's reach some plateau and stay there. I like PJ more, but their album will not outsell Tool's. If you don't believe me, get back to me in a couple of years...

    Thank you. It was like I had slipped into some bizarro-world there for a while.
    --"I'm like an opening band for the sun"

    --"We’re taking pills to get along with life… the pills are YIELD and PJ’s music. Then we create words to call our own = our analysis of YIELD." - YIH
  • Pearl Street Brewery
    Pearl Street Brewery Posts: 113
    Tool is good in their own way. Vicarious is one of the best rock songs I have heard lately!!! Absolutely ROCKS!!!!!!

    p.s. Also, why is the Tool album produced so much better than PJ's? It sounds crisper, clearer, ...
  • cinredzfan47
    cinredzfan47 Posts: 81
    Labyrinth wrote:
    See that rockking? You're wrong. I'm right. My proof doesn't lie. Bubbleblue82 is wrong too. My proof puts up a good fight to the last punch. My punch doesn't lie.

    That post doesn't say that you're right. It just provides some explanation of what's happening. You need to get off your high and mighty horse. Like Rockking has been saying, until PJ outsells Tool in a given week, they're simply losing ground at a slower pace, WHICH IS NOT CATCHING UP. Just because you researched something and you feel proud of it doesn't mean that you're right. Go back to school and take a stats class.
  • RockKing
    RockKing Posts: 431
    Pearl Street Brewery wrote:
    Tool is good in their own way. Vicarious is one of the best rock songs I have heard lately!!! Absolutely ROCKS!!!!!!

    p.s. Also, why is the Tool album produced so much better than PJ's? It sounds crisper, clearer, ...

    Frankly, I think Brendan O'Brien was a much better producer than Adam Kasper. Vs through Yield all sounded amazing. I've felt the last 3 albums have been slightly under produced. It doesn't take away from my enjoyment of the music, though. PJ8 has some of the best PJ songs of all time, in my opinion.
    --"I'm like an opening band for the sun"

    --"We’re taking pills to get along with life… the pills are YIELD and PJ’s music. Then we create words to call our own = our analysis of YIELD." - YIH
  • cinredzfan47
    cinredzfan47 Posts: 81
    RockKing wrote:
    Thank you. It was like I had slipped into some bizarro-world there for a while.

    I know, I feel like I'm taking crazy pills!
  • anarchist_grunger
    anarchist_grunger Posts: 161
    Listen to a song like Push It ...maybe you will understand....
    "It was a kind of a sick, disturbed rock opera - if Nietzsche were to write a rock opera,"-Jeff Ament about Eddie's first three songs

    I've had enough, said enough, felt enough, I'm fine now.
    Push me pull me. See ya later

    <present tense inhabiter #0003 & Even Flow psycho #0036>
  • anarchist_grunger
    anarchist_grunger Posts: 161
    O_G_D wrote:
    I hope they release COMEBACK.


    NO NO NO!!!! FUCKING NO!!!! commercial mainstream freak...go and listen to your Brintey Spears records ass hole!
    "It was a kind of a sick, disturbed rock opera - if Nietzsche were to write a rock opera,"-Jeff Ament about Eddie's first three songs

    I've had enough, said enough, felt enough, I'm fine now.
    Push me pull me. See ya later

    <present tense inhabiter #0003 & Even Flow psycho #0036>
  • Labyrinth
    Labyrinth Posts: 25
    cinredzfan47 wrote:
    This is just a stupid post. YOU are the one who is wrong, and your evidence is working against you. Even if Tool's album sales decrease at a higher percentage than Pj's it doesn't matter because they're starting with a much higher number of raw album sales, so a higher percentage drop in sales iwll still mean they have more total sales than PJ. Your logic doesn't work.


    It seems a lot of you arent quite intelligent enough to understand. So I'm going to have to dumb things down for a lot of you.

    Tool is still selling more albums than Pearl Jam... We agree on that, right?

    Would you agree that percentage wise 37% to 49% is better than 70% to 71%... Right?

    So what happens then if Pearl Jam goes to 5% lower, & Tool is down 60%? Not much of a gap anymore, right? Would you agree then that Pearl Jam will be selling the same amount of albums that week as Tool.. Right? If Tool is down 60% in the future & Pearl Jam is only down 5%... Right?

    So what happens if every week for the rest of the year.. Pearl Jam maintains maybe a +5% to a 10% drop... Whereas Tools percentages keep dropping at 50%?

    Would Tool then be selling more albums than Pearl Jam?... No... So right now, even though Tool is selling more.. Since there is a smaller gap than there was the first or second week... Pearl Jams album is being more *CONSISTANT* in sales, right?

    Exactly... I really had to dumb things down for all of you there.
  • RockKing
    RockKing Posts: 431
    Labyrinth wrote:
    Would you agree that percentage wise 37% to 49% is better than 70% to 71%... Right?

    Not necessarily. It depends on what you are taking those percentages out of.
    Labyrinth wrote:
    So what happens then if Pearl Jam goes to 5% lower, & Tool is down 60%? Not much of a gap anymore, right? Would you agree then that Pearl Jam will be selling the same amount of albums that week as Tool.. Right? If Tool is down 60% in the future & Pearl Jam is only down 5%... Right?

    So what happens if every week for the rest of the year.. Pearl Jam maintains maybe a +5% to a 10% drop... Whereas Tools percentages keep dropping at 50%?

    This hasn't happened and there's no evidence to suggest it will happen.
    Labyrinth wrote:
    Since there is a smaller gap than there was the first or second week... Pearl Jams album is being more *CONSISTANT* in sales, right?

    There is not a smaller gap. Every week Tool has sold more than Pearl Jam. Therefore, every week the gap in total album sales has grown. There is a bigger gap between the 2 albums now than there was after week 1.

    And with that, I'm done with this thread. Ignorance must be true bliss.
    --"I'm like an opening band for the sun"

    --"We’re taking pills to get along with life… the pills are YIELD and PJ’s music. Then we create words to call our own = our analysis of YIELD." - YIH
  • cinredzfan47
    cinredzfan47 Posts: 81
    Labyrinth wrote:
    It seems a lot of you arent quite intelligent enough to understand. So I'm going to have to dumb things down for a lot of you.

    Tool is still selling more albums than Pearl Jam... We agree on that, right?

    Would you agree that percentage wise 37% to 49% is better than 70% to 71%... Right?

    So what happens then if Pearl Jam goes to 5% lower, & Tool is down 60%? Not much of a gap anymore, right? Would you agree then that Pearl Jam will be selling the same amount of albums that week as Tool.. Right? If Tool is down 60% in the future & Pearl Jam is only down 5%... Right?

    So what happens if every week for the rest of the year.. Pearl Jam maintains maybe a +5% to a 10% drop... Whereas Tools percentages keep dropping at 50%?

    Would Tool then be selling more albums than Pearl Jam?... No... So right now, even though Tool is selling more.. Since there is a smaller gap than there was the first or second week... Pearl Jams album is being more *CONSISTANT* in sales, right?

    Exactly... I really had to dumb things down for all of you there.

    This all works assuming that Pj is going to stay basically where they are and Tool will continue to drop by fairly massive percentages. What makes you think this will be the case? Like Rockking said, there's no evidence to suggest this will be the case. That is where I don't agree with your theory. While agree that PJ will have good long-term success, I don't understand why you think they will drop at considerable rates while Pj doesn't. And don't act like you are some genius here teaching preschoolers. I understood your theory from the beginning... I just don't agree with it.
  • Labyrinth
    Labyrinth Posts: 25
    RockKing wrote:
    Not necessarily. It depends on what you are taking those percentages out of.



    This hasn't happened and there's no evidence to suggest it will happen.




    There is not a smaller gap. Every week Tool has sold more than Pearl Jam. Therefore, every week the gap in total album sales has grown. There is a bigger gap between the 2 albums now than there was after week 1.

    And with that, I'm done with this thread. Ignorance must be true bliss.

    How STUPID do you have to be to think that there is no virtually no difference between 70% - 71% to 37%-49%?

    That is going from a 1% difference, to a 12% difference.. & you think thats close? It's NOT close, it DOES mean theres less of a difference every week

    Every WEEK there is a SMALLER gap of album sales for that week between Pearl Jam & Tool than there was the first week

    Dude, what is WRONG with your brain?

    Ignorance MUST be true bliss, I agree
  • Labyrinth
    Labyrinth Posts: 25
    cinredzfan47 wrote:
    This all works assuming that Pj is going to stay basically where they are and Tool will continue to drop by fairly massive percentages. What makes you think this will be the case? Like Rockking said, there's no evidence to suggest this will be the case. That is where I don't agree with your theory. While agree that PJ will have good long-term success, I don't understand why you think they will drop at considerable rates while Pj doesn't. And don't act like you are some genius here teaching preschoolers. I understood your theory from the beginning... I just don't agree with it.

    The evidence is already happening, whats wrong with you people? The 3rd week sales prove its starting to happen

    Also there is virtually no other song on 10,000 Days that could be a successful single... Pearl Jam is filled with them - Pearl Jam could release at least 5 more successful singles whereas I cant see Tool releasing one.

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