Immigration

Go Beavers · January 15

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

PJ_Soul said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:
first, to gimme's point, the comparison is just. second, at this point, I'm not overly concerned with offending. we're so far past that point it's not even fucking funny.

Then simply keep your criticism objective based on the current state. What is happening in our country may anger you but it is not Nazi Germany. It is ok to say it is not legal, or I object to the deployment of special forces, ICE, or the National Guard to address immigration issues or civil unrest. But Trump is not deploying death squads.

again the gestapo and the einsatzgruppen and the ss are all different things.

maybe read about those things and then comment.

I have read more about it than you could ever guess. This is not nazi Germany and nothing you or Halifax can say will convince me otherwise.

just curious. what books have you read on the nazis?

Start with the Rise and Fall. Or the Nuremberg trials. And many films.

The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich very clearly demonstrates the many similarities between Hitler and Trump's tactics, not to mention the similarities between the Brown shirts and the creation of the SS and ICE. I'm really not sure how you can read that and then say there aren't clear parallels. You know that making important comparisons isn't the same as saying it's literally the same thing, right? I'm pretty sure that everyone here already knows that America in 2025 isn't Nazi Germany, lol.

I know this is not a comparative literature or history class. I have an open mind, but there is no argument that will convince me that the current ICE and immigration crackdown is anything close to the gestapo and Nazi Germany. That is hyperbole. The ONLY similarity is that ICE is a federal unit with a specific mission. But that mission is not murder. The gestapo rounded up jews so they could be murdered. ICE is not doing that by any stretch of the imagination no matter how offended you might be with the way people are being treated.

If you think that’s the only similarity, then you’re not coming at it with an open mind. I’d suggest you ask yourself what would happen if you pointed out the similarities.

I understand the points, and bad things are happening for sure, but comparing the ICE crackdown to one of the greatest atrocities in modern history is a huge disconnect. People are not being murdered. Violation of whatever individual rights may apply is not murder. Nazis murdered people. ICE, while certainly engaging in questionable tactics, is not a death squad.

And people can do a comparison of the mass
psychology around what’s happening currently to 1930s Germany without agreeing that the end result is/will be the same. The scapegoating of ethnic groups, the funneling of power to a single leader, and the forced compliance within the political party in power are just naming a few.

Get_Right · January 15

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

PJ_Soul said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:
first, to gimme's point, the comparison is just. second, at this point, I'm not overly concerned with offending. we're so far past that point it's not even fucking funny.

Then simply keep your criticism objective based on the current state. What is happening in our country may anger you but it is not Nazi Germany. It is ok to say it is not legal, or I object to the deployment of special forces, ICE, or the National Guard to address immigration issues or civil unrest. But Trump is not deploying death squads.

again the gestapo and the einsatzgruppen and the ss are all different things.

maybe read about those things and then comment.

I have read more about it than you could ever guess. This is not nazi Germany and nothing you or Halifax can say will convince me otherwise.

just curious. what books have you read on the nazis?

Start with the Rise and Fall. Or the Nuremberg trials. And many films.

The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich very clearly demonstrates the many similarities between Hitler and Trump's tactics, not to mention the similarities between the Brown shirts and the creation of the SS and ICE. I'm really not sure how you can read that and then say there aren't clear parallels. You know that making important comparisons isn't the same as saying it's literally the same thing, right? I'm pretty sure that everyone here already knows that America in 2025 isn't Nazi Germany, lol.

I know this is not a comparative literature or history class. I have an open mind, but there is no argument that will convince me that the current ICE and immigration crackdown is anything close to the gestapo and Nazi Germany. That is hyperbole. The ONLY similarity is that ICE is a federal unit with a specific mission. But that mission is not murder. The gestapo rounded up jews so they could be murdered. ICE is not doing that by any stretch of the imagination no matter how offended you might be with the way people are being treated.

If you think that’s the only similarity, then you’re not coming at it with an open mind. I’d suggest you ask yourself what would happen if you pointed out the similarities.

I understand the points, and bad things are happening for sure, but comparing the ICE crackdown to one of the greatest atrocities in modern history is a huge disconnect. People are not being murdered. Violation of whatever individual rights may apply is not murder. Nazis murdered people. ICE, while certainly engaging in questionable tactics, is not a death squad.

And people can do a comparison of the mass
psychology around what’s happening currently to 1930s Germany without agreeing that the end result is/will be the same. The scapegoating of ethnic groups, the funneling of power to a single leader, and the forced compliance within the political party in power are just naming a few.

I understand the arguments very well and looking at it from an intellectual, theoretical, or historical perspective. Those are talking points and talking is healthy. But I disagree with the comparison to the Nazis as a matter of factual reality. They are not rounding up people and sending them to death camps. If anything, perhaps a more appropriate comparison would be to the Japanese internment camps, although that occured during war time. Many of them were US citizens.

PJ_Soul · January 15

Get_Right said:

PJ_Soul said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:
first, to gimme's point, the comparison is just. second, at this point, I'm not overly concerned with offending. we're so far past that point it's not even fucking funny.

Then simply keep your criticism objective based on the current state. What is happening in our country may anger you but it is not Nazi Germany. It is ok to say it is not legal, or I object to the deployment of special forces, ICE, or the National Guard to address immigration issues or civil unrest. But Trump is not deploying death squads.

again the gestapo and the einsatzgruppen and the ss are all different things.

maybe read about those things and then comment.

I have read more about it than you could ever guess. This is not nazi Germany and nothing you or Halifax can say will convince me otherwise.

just curious. what books have you read on the nazis?

Start with the Rise and Fall. Or the Nuremberg trials. And many films.

The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich very clearly demonstrates the many similarities between Hitler and Trump's tactics, not to mention the similarities between the Brown shirts and the creation of the SS and ICE. I'm really not sure how you can read that and then say there aren't clear parallels. You know that making important comparisons isn't the same as saying it's literally the same thing, right? I'm pretty sure that everyone here already knows that America in 2025 isn't Nazi Germany, lol.

I know this is not a comparative literature or history class. I have an open mind, but there is no argument that will convince me that the current ICE and immigration crackdown is anything close to the gestapo and Nazi Germany. That is hyperbole. The ONLY similarity is that ICE is a federal unit with a specific mission. But that mission is not murder. The gestapo rounded up jews so they could be murdered. ICE is not doing that by any stretch of the imagination no matter how offended you might be with the way people are being treated.

I have never said anything about Gestapo.

mace1229 · January 15

I kind of get what both sides are saying here. I know no one is saying ICE is literally a death squad, nor claiming that is their end goal.
We've also been hearing extreme rhetoric about law enforcement for years that makes it easy to dismiss any comparisons. We've been hearing it is "open season" on blacks, or that they are being "hunted" for over 5 years, which I would categorize as anti-police rhetoric. During the riots in 2020, that guy who was shot in the Wendy's parking lot after he grabbed the cop's taser while being arrested for a DUI (I think his name was Jacob), I remember CNN defending his actions, the CNN contributor said that Jacob knew if he went in the back of the police car the cops would take him somewhere and kill him and dump his body, so he had to fight for his life while be arrested. When you hear that sort of language constantly for so long, it makes it easy to dismiss any sort of comparisons that are being made.

gimmesometruth27 · January 15

Get_Right said:

PJ_Soul said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:
first, to gimme's point, the comparison is just. second, at this point, I'm not overly concerned with offending. we're so far past that point it's not even fucking funny.

Then simply keep your criticism objective based on the current state. What is happening in our country may anger you but it is not Nazi Germany. It is ok to say it is not legal, or I object to the deployment of special forces, ICE, or the National Guard to address immigration issues or civil unrest. But Trump is not deploying death squads.

again the gestapo and the einsatzgruppen and the ss are all different things.

maybe read about those things and then comment.

I have read more about it than you could ever guess. This is not nazi Germany and nothing you or Halifax can say will convince me otherwise.

just curious. what books have you read on the nazis?

Start with the Rise and Fall. Or the Nuremberg trials. And many films.

The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich very clearly demonstrates the many similarities between Hitler and Trump's tactics, not to mention the similarities between the Brown shirts and the creation of the SS and ICE. I'm really not sure how you can read that and then say there aren't clear parallels. You know that making important comparisons isn't the same as saying it's literally the same thing, right? I'm pretty sure that everyone here already knows that America in 2025 isn't Nazi Germany, lol.

I know this is not a comparative literature or history class. I have an open mind, but there is no argument that will convince me that the current ICE and immigration crackdown is anything close to the gestapo and Nazi Germany. That is hyperbole. The ONLY similarity is that ICE is a federal unit with a specific mission. But that mission is not murder. The gestapo rounded up jews so they could be murdered. ICE is not doing that by any stretch of the imagination no matter how offended you might be with the way people are being treated.

ice is literally snatching american citizens out of their homes with no warrant.

stop minimizing that.

gimmesometruth27 · January 15

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

PJ_Soul said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:
first, to gimme's point, the comparison is just. second, at this point, I'm not overly concerned with offending. we're so far past that point it's not even fucking funny.

Then simply keep your criticism objective based on the current state. What is happening in our country may anger you but it is not Nazi Germany. It is ok to say it is not legal, or I object to the deployment of special forces, ICE, or the National Guard to address immigration issues or civil unrest. But Trump is not deploying death squads.

again the gestapo and the einsatzgruppen and the ss are all different things.

maybe read about those things and then comment.

I have read more about it than you could ever guess. This is not nazi Germany and nothing you or Halifax can say will convince me otherwise.

just curious. what books have you read on the nazis?

Start with the Rise and Fall. Or the Nuremberg trials. And many films.

The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich very clearly demonstrates the many similarities between Hitler and Trump's tactics, not to mention the similarities between the Brown shirts and the creation of the SS and ICE. I'm really not sure how you can read that and then say there aren't clear parallels. You know that making important comparisons isn't the same as saying it's literally the same thing, right? I'm pretty sure that everyone here already knows that America in 2025 isn't Nazi Germany, lol.

I know this is not a comparative literature or history class. I have an open mind, but there is no argument that will convince me that the current ICE and immigration crackdown is anything close to the gestapo and Nazi Germany. That is hyperbole. The ONLY similarity is that ICE is a federal unit with a specific mission. But that mission is not murder. The gestapo rounded up jews so they could be murdered. ICE is not doing that by any stretch of the imagination no matter how offended you might be with the way people are being treated.

If you think that’s the only similarity, then you’re not coming at it with an open mind. I’d suggest you ask yourself what would happen if you pointed out the similarities.

I understand the points, and bad things are happening for sure, but comparing the ICE crackdown to one of the greatest atrocities in modern history is a huge disconnect. People are not being murdered. Violation of whatever individual rights may apply is not murder. Nazis murdered people. ICE, while certainly engaging in questionable tactics, is not a death squad.

ice is murdering people.

what is happening to those that go into custody? they are disappearing and not being found.

gimmesometruth27 · January 15

hey yall hear renee good was not murdered?

HughFreakingDillon · January 15

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

PJ_Soul said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:
first, to gimme's point, the comparison is just. second, at this point, I'm not overly concerned with offending. we're so far past that point it's not even fucking funny.

Then simply keep your criticism objective based on the current state. What is happening in our country may anger you but it is not Nazi Germany. It is ok to say it is not legal, or I object to the deployment of special forces, ICE, or the National Guard to address immigration issues or civil unrest. But Trump is not deploying death squads.

again the gestapo and the einsatzgruppen and the ss are all different things.

maybe read about those things and then comment.

I have read more about it than you could ever guess. This is not nazi Germany and nothing you or Halifax can say will convince me otherwise.

just curious. what books have you read on the nazis?

Start with the Rise and Fall. Or the Nuremberg trials. And many films.

The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich very clearly demonstrates the many similarities between Hitler and Trump's tactics, not to mention the similarities between the Brown shirts and the creation of the SS and ICE. I'm really not sure how you can read that and then say there aren't clear parallels. You know that making important comparisons isn't the same as saying it's literally the same thing, right? I'm pretty sure that everyone here already knows that America in 2025 isn't Nazi Germany, lol.

I know this is not a comparative literature or history class. I have an open mind, but there is no argument that will convince me that the current ICE and immigration crackdown is anything close to the gestapo and Nazi Germany. That is hyperbole. The ONLY similarity is that ICE is a federal unit with a specific mission. But that mission is not murder. The gestapo rounded up jews so they could be murdered. ICE is not doing that by any stretch of the imagination no matter how offended you might be with the way people are being treated.

If you think that’s the only similarity, then you’re not coming at it with an open mind. I’d suggest you ask yourself what would happen if you pointed out the similarities.

I understand the points, and bad things are happening for sure, but comparing the ICE crackdown to one of the greatest atrocities in modern history is a huge disconnect. People are not being murdered. Violation of whatever individual rights may apply is not murder. Nazis murdered people. ICE, while certainly engaging in questionable tactics, is not a death squad.

And people can do a comparison of the mass
psychology around what’s happening currently to 1930s Germany without agreeing that the end result is/will be the same. The scapegoating of ethnic groups, the funneling of power to a single leader, and the forced compliance within the political party in power are just naming a few.

I understand the arguments very well and looking at it from an intellectual, theoretical, or historical perspective. Those are talking points and talking is healthy. But I disagree with the comparison to the Nazis as a matter of factual reality. They are not rounding up people and sending them to death camps. If anything, perhaps a more appropriate comparison would be to the Japanese internment camps, although that occured during war time. Many of them were US citizens.

well, you keep ignoring that no one is saying they are doing that. They are doing what they did in the early years prior to the war. THAT is the comparison I'm making.

Get_Right · January 15

HughFreakingDillon said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

PJ_Soul said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:
first, to gimme's point, the comparison is just. second, at this point, I'm not overly concerned with offending. we're so far past that point it's not even fucking funny.

Then simply keep your criticism objective based on the current state. What is happening in our country may anger you but it is not Nazi Germany. It is ok to say it is not legal, or I object to the deployment of special forces, ICE, or the National Guard to address immigration issues or civil unrest. But Trump is not deploying death squads.

again the gestapo and the einsatzgruppen and the ss are all different things.

maybe read about those things and then comment.

I have read more about it than you could ever guess. This is not nazi Germany and nothing you or Halifax can say will convince me otherwise.

just curious. what books have you read on the nazis?

Start with the Rise and Fall. Or the Nuremberg trials. And many films.

The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich very clearly demonstrates the many similarities between Hitler and Trump's tactics, not to mention the similarities between the Brown shirts and the creation of the SS and ICE. I'm really not sure how you can read that and then say there aren't clear parallels. You know that making important comparisons isn't the same as saying it's literally the same thing, right? I'm pretty sure that everyone here already knows that America in 2025 isn't Nazi Germany, lol.

I know this is not a comparative literature or history class. I have an open mind, but there is no argument that will convince me that the current ICE and immigration crackdown is anything close to the gestapo and Nazi Germany. That is hyperbole. The ONLY similarity is that ICE is a federal unit with a specific mission. But that mission is not murder. The gestapo rounded up jews so they could be murdered. ICE is not doing that by any stretch of the imagination no matter how offended you might be with the way people are being treated.

If you think that’s the only similarity, then you’re not coming at it with an open mind. I’d suggest you ask yourself what would happen if you pointed out the similarities.

I understand the points, and bad things are happening for sure, but comparing the ICE crackdown to one of the greatest atrocities in modern history is a huge disconnect. People are not being murdered. Violation of whatever individual rights may apply is not murder. Nazis murdered people. ICE, while certainly engaging in questionable tactics, is not a death squad.

And people can do a comparison of the mass
psychology around what’s happening currently to 1930s Germany without agreeing that the end result is/will be the same. The scapegoating of ethnic groups, the funneling of power to a single leader, and the forced compliance within the political party in power are just naming a few.

I understand the arguments very well and looking at it from an intellectual, theoretical, or historical perspective. Those are talking points and talking is healthy. But I disagree with the comparison to the Nazis as a matter of factual reality. They are not rounding up people and sending them to death camps. If anything, perhaps a more appropriate comparison would be to the Japanese internment camps, although that occured during war time. Many of them were US citizens.

well, you keep ignoring that no one is saying they are doing that. They are doing what they did in the early years prior to the war. THAT is the comparison I'm making.

Then all law enforcement initiatives are comparable? Drug stings? Removing homeless encampments? Random speed traps? Gang enforcement? Quality of life violations? Sorry not even close.

EDIT: How about post 9/11 airport security? Complete liberty to search and seize.

HughFreakingDillon · January 16

Nope. Just illegal detainments and physical abuses and going door to door searching for non-whites, asking for papers of anyone and everyone (Noem has literally told all Americans to prepare for this) without reason.

I can’t understand why the parallels are so difficult to understand.

Halifax2TheMax · January 16

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

PJ_Soul said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:
first, to gimme's point, the comparison is just. second, at this point, I'm not overly concerned with offending. we're so far past that point it's not even fucking funny.

Then simply keep your criticism objective based on the current state. What is happening in our country may anger you but it is not Nazi Germany. It is ok to say it is not legal, or I object to the deployment of special forces, ICE, or the National Guard to address immigration issues or civil unrest. But Trump is not deploying death squads.

again the gestapo and the einsatzgruppen and the ss are all different things.

maybe read about those things and then comment.

I have read more about it than you could ever guess. This is not nazi Germany and nothing you or Halifax can say will convince me otherwise.

just curious. what books have you read on the nazis?

Start with the Rise and Fall. Or the Nuremberg trials. And many films.

The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich very clearly demonstrates the many similarities between Hitler and Trump's tactics, not to mention the similarities between the Brown shirts and the creation of the SS and ICE. I'm really not sure how you can read that and then say there aren't clear parallels. You know that making important comparisons isn't the same as saying it's literally the same thing, right? I'm pretty sure that everyone here already knows that America in 2025 isn't Nazi Germany, lol.

I know this is not a comparative literature or history class. I have an open mind, but there is no argument that will convince me that the current ICE and immigration crackdown is anything close to the gestapo and Nazi Germany. That is hyperbole. The ONLY similarity is that ICE is a federal unit with a specific mission. But that mission is not murder. The gestapo rounded up jews so they could be murdered. ICE is not doing that by any stretch of the imagination no matter how offended you might be with the way people are being treated.

If you think that’s the only similarity, then you’re not coming at it with an open mind. I’d suggest you ask yourself what would happen if you pointed out the similarities.

I understand the points, and bad things are happening for sure, but comparing the ICE crackdown to one of the greatest atrocities in modern history is a huge disconnect. People are not being murdered. Violation of whatever individual rights may apply is not murder. Nazis murdered people. ICE, while certainly engaging in questionable tactics, is not a death squad.

And people can do a comparison of the mass
psychology around what’s happening currently to 1930s Germany without agreeing that the end result is/will be the same. The scapegoating of ethnic groups, the funneling of power to a single leader, and the forced compliance within the political party in power are just naming a few.

I understand the arguments very well and looking at it from an intellectual, theoretical, or historical perspective. Those are talking points and talking is healthy. But I disagree with the comparison to the Nazis as a matter of factual reality. They are not rounding up people and sending them to death camps. If anything, perhaps a more appropriate comparison would be to the Japanese internment camps, although that occured during war time. Many of them were US citizens.

well, you keep ignoring that no one is saying they are doing that. They are doing what they did in the early years prior to the war. THAT is the comparison I'm making.

Then all law enforcement initiatives are comparable? Drug stings? Removing homeless encampments? Random speed traps? Gang enforcement? Quality of life violations? Sorry not even close.

EDIT: How about post 9/11 airport security? Complete liberty to search and seize.

* The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.

I can’t believe 1) you’re asking this question and 2) it has to be explained to you: the homeland security act was legislation passed by elected representatives in response to a major terrorist attack, with debate, carve outs, amendments and an opportunity, as short as it was, for the citizenry to express support or not. It ultimately passed and became law. Shrub, Rummy and Darth Cheney didn’t Willy nilly circumvent the law and establish all that was wrought on their own.

In the other lame examples you gave, city councils, legislators and the public are heard, hearings are held, ordinances and laws are formulated and votes are taken, usually after the citizens chime in on the pros/cons, support or not of the “police” action. You think governors, mayors, police chiefs just decide on a whim to clear out homeless encampments, or start setting up speed traps on their own?

There are laws and ordinances that govern “drug stings” and “quality of life” violations.

Fucking A are we fucked with this kind of thinking. Because they “can” and “do”. It’s way toooo late.

And to your edit, you consent to and acknowledge upon entering an airport or when buying a ticket to your person and belongings being searched, and that violations may lead to detainment, criminal charges and penalties and missing your flight. FFS. What legal authority does ICE have to kick in the door and enter the dwelling of a US citizen? Guess you haven’t read the constitution and the 4th Amendment, eh?

Get_Right · January 16

Halifax2TheMax said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

PJ_Soul said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:
first, to gimme's point, the comparison is just. second, at this point, I'm not overly concerned with offending. we're so far past that point it's not even fucking funny.

Then simply keep your criticism objective based on the current state. What is happening in our country may anger you but it is not Nazi Germany. It is ok to say it is not legal, or I object to the deployment of special forces, ICE, or the National Guard to address immigration issues or civil unrest. But Trump is not deploying death squads.

again the gestapo and the einsatzgruppen and the ss are all different things.

maybe read about those things and then comment.

I have read more about it than you could ever guess. This is not nazi Germany and nothing you or Halifax can say will convince me otherwise.

just curious. what books have you read on the nazis?

Start with the Rise and Fall. Or the Nuremberg trials. And many films.

The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich very clearly demonstrates the many similarities between Hitler and Trump's tactics, not to mention the similarities between the Brown shirts and the creation of the SS and ICE. I'm really not sure how you can read that and then say there aren't clear parallels. You know that making important comparisons isn't the same as saying it's literally the same thing, right? I'm pretty sure that everyone here already knows that America in 2025 isn't Nazi Germany, lol.

I know this is not a comparative literature or history class. I have an open mind, but there is no argument that will convince me that the current ICE and immigration crackdown is anything close to the gestapo and Nazi Germany. That is hyperbole. The ONLY similarity is that ICE is a federal unit with a specific mission. But that mission is not murder. The gestapo rounded up jews so they could be murdered. ICE is not doing that by any stretch of the imagination no matter how offended you might be with the way people are being treated.

If you think that’s the only similarity, then you’re not coming at it with an open mind. I’d suggest you ask yourself what would happen if you pointed out the similarities.

I understand the points, and bad things are happening for sure, but comparing the ICE crackdown to one of the greatest atrocities in modern history is a huge disconnect. People are not being murdered. Violation of whatever individual rights may apply is not murder. Nazis murdered people. ICE, while certainly engaging in questionable tactics, is not a death squad.

And people can do a comparison of the mass
psychology around what’s happening currently to 1930s Germany without agreeing that the end result is/will be the same. The scapegoating of ethnic groups, the funneling of power to a single leader, and the forced compliance within the political party in power are just naming a few.

I understand the arguments very well and looking at it from an intellectual, theoretical, or historical perspective. Those are talking points and talking is healthy. But I disagree with the comparison to the Nazis as a matter of factual reality. They are not rounding up people and sending them to death camps. If anything, perhaps a more appropriate comparison would be to the Japanese internment camps, although that occured during war time. Many of them were US citizens.

well, you keep ignoring that no one is saying they are doing that. They are doing what they did in the early years prior to the war. THAT is the comparison I'm making.

Then all law enforcement initiatives are comparable? Drug stings? Removing homeless encampments? Random speed traps? Gang enforcement? Quality of life violations? Sorry not even close.

EDIT: How about post 9/11 airport security? Complete liberty to search and seize.

* The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.
I can’t believe 1) you’re asking this question and 2) it has to be explained to you: the homeland security act was legislation passed by elected representatives in response to a major terrorist attack, with debate, carve outs, amendments and an opportunity, as short as it was, for the citizenry to express support or not. It ultimately passed and became law. Shrub, Rummy and Darth Cheney didn’t Willy nilly circumvent the law and establish all that was wrought on their own.
In the other lame examples you gave, city councils, legislators and the public are heard, hearings are held, ordinances and laws are formulated and votes are taken, usually after the citizens chime in on the pros/cons, support or not of the “police” action. You think governors, mayors, police chiefs just decide on a whim to clear out homeless encampments, or start setting up speed traps on their own?
There are laws and ordinances that govern “drug stings” and “quality of life” violations.
Fucking A are we fucked with this kind of thinking. Because they “can” and “do”. It’s way toooo late.
And to your edit, you consent to and acknowledge upon entering an airport or when buying a ticket to your person and belongings being searched, and that violations may lead to detainment, criminal charges and penalties and missing your flight. FFS. What legal authority does ICE have to kick in the door and enter the dwelling of a US citizen? Guess you haven’t read the constitution and the 4th Amendment, eh?

You are wrong and uniformed. It does not take much for law enforcement to find a reason. That is not new. I guess there are no laws, policies, and ordinances that govern immigration enforcement right? There are no legal precedents. It is just something you do not like. And there is a HUGE gap between the text of the constitution and how it is interpreted, executed on a daily basis, and decided in real life. Just go watch a traffic stop video and talk to me about the 4th amendment. Remember who you are talking with. I know a bit about this stuff.

Halifax2TheMax · January 16

Get_Right said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

PJ_Soul said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:
first, to gimme's point, the comparison is just. second, at this point, I'm not overly concerned with offending. we're so far past that point it's not even fucking funny.

Then simply keep your criticism objective based on the current state. What is happening in our country may anger you but it is not Nazi Germany. It is ok to say it is not legal, or I object to the deployment of special forces, ICE, or the National Guard to address immigration issues or civil unrest. But Trump is not deploying death squads.

again the gestapo and the einsatzgruppen and the ss are all different things.

maybe read about those things and then comment.

I have read more about it than you could ever guess. This is not nazi Germany and nothing you or Halifax can say will convince me otherwise.

just curious. what books have you read on the nazis?

Start with the Rise and Fall. Or the Nuremberg trials. And many films.

The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich very clearly demonstrates the many similarities between Hitler and Trump's tactics, not to mention the similarities between the Brown shirts and the creation of the SS and ICE. I'm really not sure how you can read that and then say there aren't clear parallels. You know that making important comparisons isn't the same as saying it's literally the same thing, right? I'm pretty sure that everyone here already knows that America in 2025 isn't Nazi Germany, lol.

I know this is not a comparative literature or history class. I have an open mind, but there is no argument that will convince me that the current ICE and immigration crackdown is anything close to the gestapo and Nazi Germany. That is hyperbole. The ONLY similarity is that ICE is a federal unit with a specific mission. But that mission is not murder. The gestapo rounded up jews so they could be murdered. ICE is not doing that by any stretch of the imagination no matter how offended you might be with the way people are being treated.

If you think that’s the only similarity, then you’re not coming at it with an open mind. I’d suggest you ask yourself what would happen if you pointed out the similarities.

I understand the points, and bad things are happening for sure, but comparing the ICE crackdown to one of the greatest atrocities in modern history is a huge disconnect. People are not being murdered. Violation of whatever individual rights may apply is not murder. Nazis murdered people. ICE, while certainly engaging in questionable tactics, is not a death squad.

And people can do a comparison of the mass
psychology around what’s happening currently to 1930s Germany without agreeing that the end result is/will be the same. The scapegoating of ethnic groups, the funneling of power to a single leader, and the forced compliance within the political party in power are just naming a few.

I understand the arguments very well and looking at it from an intellectual, theoretical, or historical perspective. Those are talking points and talking is healthy. But I disagree with the comparison to the Nazis as a matter of factual reality. They are not rounding up people and sending them to death camps. If anything, perhaps a more appropriate comparison would be to the Japanese internment camps, although that occured during war time. Many of them were US citizens.

well, you keep ignoring that no one is saying they are doing that. They are doing what they did in the early years prior to the war. THAT is the comparison I'm making.

Then all law enforcement initiatives are comparable? Drug stings? Removing homeless encampments? Random speed traps? Gang enforcement? Quality of life violations? Sorry not even close.

EDIT: How about post 9/11 airport security? Complete liberty to search and seize.

* The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.
I can’t believe 1) you’re asking this question and 2) it has to be explained to you: the homeland security act was legislation passed by elected representatives in response to a major terrorist attack, with debate, carve outs, amendments and an opportunity, as short as it was, for the citizenry to express support or not. It ultimately passed and became law. Shrub, Rummy and Darth Cheney didn’t Willy nilly circumvent the law and establish all that was wrought on their own.
In the other lame examples you gave, city councils, legislators and the public are heard, hearings are held, ordinances and laws are formulated and votes are taken, usually after the citizens chime in on the pros/cons, support or not of the “police” action. You think governors, mayors, police chiefs just decide on a whim to clear out homeless encampments, or start setting up speed traps on their own?
There are laws and ordinances that govern “drug stings” and “quality of life” violations.
Fucking A are we fucked with this kind of thinking. Because they “can” and “do”. It’s way toooo late.
And to your edit, you consent to and acknowledge upon entering an airport or when buying a ticket to your person and belongings being searched, and that violations may lead to detainment, criminal charges and penalties and missing your flight. FFS. What legal authority does ICE have to kick in the door and enter the dwelling of a US citizen? Guess you haven’t read the constitution and the 4th Amendment, eh?

You are wrong and uniformed. It does not take much for law enforcement to find a reason. That is not new. I guess there are no laws, policies, and ordinances that govern immigration enforcement right? There are no legal precedents. It is just something you do not like. And there is a HUGE gap between the text of the constitution and how it is interpreted, executed on a daily basis, and decided in real life. Just go watch a traffic stop video and talk to me about the 4th amendment. Remember who you are talking with. I know a bit about this stuff.

* The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.

And yet you gave shitty examples. Excuse me, did I dream about the homeland security act? You asked about airport searches and seizures and tried to compare that with what ICE is doing.

So, if you “know a bit about this stuff”, cite the law that allows ICE to enter the private dwelling of a US citizen and under what legal conditions they may do so. I won’t wait for a reply, just expect more pivots and because they “can” and “do” type responses.

Edit to state that my uniform doesn’t include lightning bolts on the collar, Iron Crosses on my chest nor swastikas as arm bands.

gimmesometruth27 · January 16

Get_Right said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

PJ_Soul said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:
first, to gimme's point, the comparison is just. second, at this point, I'm not overly concerned with offending. we're so far past that point it's not even fucking funny.

Then simply keep your criticism objective based on the current state. What is happening in our country may anger you but it is not Nazi Germany. It is ok to say it is not legal, or I object to the deployment of special forces, ICE, or the National Guard to address immigration issues or civil unrest. But Trump is not deploying death squads.

again the gestapo and the einsatzgruppen and the ss are all different things.

maybe read about those things and then comment.

I have read more about it than you could ever guess. This is not nazi Germany and nothing you or Halifax can say will convince me otherwise.

just curious. what books have you read on the nazis?

Start with the Rise and Fall. Or the Nuremberg trials. And many films.

The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich very clearly demonstrates the many similarities between Hitler and Trump's tactics, not to mention the similarities between the Brown shirts and the creation of the SS and ICE. I'm really not sure how you can read that and then say there aren't clear parallels. You know that making important comparisons isn't the same as saying it's literally the same thing, right? I'm pretty sure that everyone here already knows that America in 2025 isn't Nazi Germany, lol.

I know this is not a comparative literature or history class. I have an open mind, but there is no argument that will convince me that the current ICE and immigration crackdown is anything close to the gestapo and Nazi Germany. That is hyperbole. The ONLY similarity is that ICE is a federal unit with a specific mission. But that mission is not murder. The gestapo rounded up jews so they could be murdered. ICE is not doing that by any stretch of the imagination no matter how offended you might be with the way people are being treated.

If you think that’s the only similarity, then you’re not coming at it with an open mind. I’d suggest you ask yourself what would happen if you pointed out the similarities.

I understand the points, and bad things are happening for sure, but comparing the ICE crackdown to one of the greatest atrocities in modern history is a huge disconnect. People are not being murdered. Violation of whatever individual rights may apply is not murder. Nazis murdered people. ICE, while certainly engaging in questionable tactics, is not a death squad.

And people can do a comparison of the mass
psychology around what’s happening currently to 1930s Germany without agreeing that the end result is/will be the same. The scapegoating of ethnic groups, the funneling of power to a single leader, and the forced compliance within the political party in power are just naming a few.

I understand the arguments very well and looking at it from an intellectual, theoretical, or historical perspective. Those are talking points and talking is healthy. But I disagree with the comparison to the Nazis as a matter of factual reality. They are not rounding up people and sending them to death camps. If anything, perhaps a more appropriate comparison would be to the Japanese internment camps, although that occured during war time. Many of them were US citizens.

well, you keep ignoring that no one is saying they are doing that. They are doing what they did in the early years prior to the war. THAT is the comparison I'm making.

Then all law enforcement initiatives are comparable? Drug stings? Removing homeless encampments? Random speed traps? Gang enforcement? Quality of life violations? Sorry not even close.

EDIT: How about post 9/11 airport security? Complete liberty to search and seize.

* The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.
I can’t believe 1) you’re asking this question and 2) it has to be explained to you: the homeland security act was legislation passed by elected representatives in response to a major terrorist attack, with debate, carve outs, amendments and an opportunity, as short as it was, for the citizenry to express support or not. It ultimately passed and became law. Shrub, Rummy and Darth Cheney didn’t Willy nilly circumvent the law and establish all that was wrought on their own.
In the other lame examples you gave, city councils, legislators and the public are heard, hearings are held, ordinances and laws are formulated and votes are taken, usually after the citizens chime in on the pros/cons, support or not of the “police” action. You think governors, mayors, police chiefs just decide on a whim to clear out homeless encampments, or start setting up speed traps on their own?
There are laws and ordinances that govern “drug stings” and “quality of life” violations.
Fucking A are we fucked with this kind of thinking. Because they “can” and “do”. It’s way toooo late.
And to your edit, you consent to and acknowledge upon entering an airport or when buying a ticket to your person and belongings being searched, and that violations may lead to detainment, criminal charges and penalties and missing your flight. FFS. What legal authority does ICE have to kick in the door and enter the dwelling of a US citizen? Guess you haven’t read the constitution and the 4th Amendment, eh?

You are wrong and uniformed. It does not take much for law enforcement to find a reason. That is not new. I guess there are no laws, policies, and ordinances that govern immigration enforcement right? There are no legal precedents. It is just something you do not like. And there is a HUGE gap between the text of the constitution and how it is interpreted, executed on a daily basis, and decided in real life. Just go watch a traffic stop video and talk to me about the 4th amendment. Remember who you are talking with. I know a bit about this stuff.

are you an ice agent?

Halifax2TheMax · January 16

* The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.

If not, they’re hiring, particularly the self-professed skill sets of certain posters.

https://www.ice.gov/join

Look, they need lawyers! Fancy that!

https://www.usajobs.gov/Search/Results?jt=General%20Attorney&a=HSBB&p=1

Get_Right · January 16

Halifax2TheMax said:

Get_Right said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

PJ_Soul said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:
first, to gimme's point, the comparison is just. second, at this point, I'm not overly concerned with offending. we're so far past that point it's not even fucking funny.

Then simply keep your criticism objective based on the current state. What is happening in our country may anger you but it is not Nazi Germany. It is ok to say it is not legal, or I object to the deployment of special forces, ICE, or the National Guard to address immigration issues or civil unrest. But Trump is not deploying death squads.

again the gestapo and the einsatzgruppen and the ss are all different things.

maybe read about those things and then comment.

I have read more about it than you could ever guess. This is not nazi Germany and nothing you or Halifax can say will convince me otherwise.

just curious. what books have you read on the nazis?

Start with the Rise and Fall. Or the Nuremberg trials. And many films.

The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich very clearly demonstrates the many similarities between Hitler and Trump's tactics, not to mention the similarities between the Brown shirts and the creation of the SS and ICE. I'm really not sure how you can read that and then say there aren't clear parallels. You know that making important comparisons isn't the same as saying it's literally the same thing, right? I'm pretty sure that everyone here already knows that America in 2025 isn't Nazi Germany, lol.

I know this is not a comparative literature or history class. I have an open mind, but there is no argument that will convince me that the current ICE and immigration crackdown is anything close to the gestapo and Nazi Germany. That is hyperbole. The ONLY similarity is that ICE is a federal unit with a specific mission. But that mission is not murder. The gestapo rounded up jews so they could be murdered. ICE is not doing that by any stretch of the imagination no matter how offended you might be with the way people are being treated.

If you think that’s the only similarity, then you’re not coming at it with an open mind. I’d suggest you ask yourself what would happen if you pointed out the similarities.

I understand the points, and bad things are happening for sure, but comparing the ICE crackdown to one of the greatest atrocities in modern history is a huge disconnect. People are not being murdered. Violation of whatever individual rights may apply is not murder. Nazis murdered people. ICE, while certainly engaging in questionable tactics, is not a death squad.

And people can do a comparison of the mass
psychology around what’s happening currently to 1930s Germany without agreeing that the end result is/will be the same. The scapegoating of ethnic groups, the funneling of power to a single leader, and the forced compliance within the political party in power are just naming a few.

I understand the arguments very well and looking at it from an intellectual, theoretical, or historical perspective. Those are talking points and talking is healthy. But I disagree with the comparison to the Nazis as a matter of factual reality. They are not rounding up people and sending them to death camps. If anything, perhaps a more appropriate comparison would be to the Japanese internment camps, although that occured during war time. Many of them were US citizens.

well, you keep ignoring that no one is saying they are doing that. They are doing what they did in the early years prior to the war. THAT is the comparison I'm making.

Then all law enforcement initiatives are comparable? Drug stings? Removing homeless encampments? Random speed traps? Gang enforcement? Quality of life violations? Sorry not even close.

EDIT: How about post 9/11 airport security? Complete liberty to search and seize.

* The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.
I can’t believe 1) you’re asking this question and 2) it has to be explained to you: the homeland security act was legislation passed by elected representatives in response to a major terrorist attack, with debate, carve outs, amendments and an opportunity, as short as it was, for the citizenry to express support or not. It ultimately passed and became law. Shrub, Rummy and Darth Cheney didn’t Willy nilly circumvent the law and establish all that was wrought on their own.
In the other lame examples you gave, city councils, legislators and the public are heard, hearings are held, ordinances and laws are formulated and votes are taken, usually after the citizens chime in on the pros/cons, support or not of the “police” action. You think governors, mayors, police chiefs just decide on a whim to clear out homeless encampments, or start setting up speed traps on their own?
There are laws and ordinances that govern “drug stings” and “quality of life” violations.
Fucking A are we fucked with this kind of thinking. Because they “can” and “do”. It’s way toooo late.
And to your edit, you consent to and acknowledge upon entering an airport or when buying a ticket to your person and belongings being searched, and that violations may lead to detainment, criminal charges and penalties and missing your flight. FFS. What legal authority does ICE have to kick in the door and enter the dwelling of a US citizen? Guess you haven’t read the constitution and the 4th Amendment, eh?

You are wrong and uniformed. It does not take much for law enforcement to find a reason. That is not new. I guess there are no laws, policies, and ordinances that govern immigration enforcement right? There are no legal precedents. It is just something you do not like. And there is a HUGE gap between the text of the constitution and how it is interpreted, executed on a daily basis, and decided in real life. Just go watch a traffic stop video and talk to me about the 4th amendment. Remember who you are talking with. I know a bit about this stuff.

* The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.
And yet you gave shitty examples. Excuse me, did I dream about the homeland security act? You asked about airport searches and seizures and tried to compare that with what ICE is doing.
So, if you “know a bit about this stuff”, cite the law that allows ICE to enter the private dwelling of a US citizen and under what legal conditions they may do so. I won’t wait for a reply, just expect more pivots and because they “can” and “do” type responses.

It is not just ICE. A whiff of illegal activity and law enforcement can enter a private dwelling. My examples are shitty? That is reality. There is no written law, only precedents that are complex. It has evolved based on court decisions. It would take a semester or more of law school class to go through it. It is not clear cut as you might think. We got an anonymous tip that drugs were being sold, or that you are housing illegal immigrants. I will agree it has gotten worse under the current regime. But if you think a warrant is needed in every situation you are just dead wrong. You are in denial if you think it is a challenge for law enforcement to enter private property based on the constitution.

Halifax2TheMax · January 16

Get_Right said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Get_Right said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

PJ_Soul said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:
first, to gimme's point, the comparison is just. second, at this point, I'm not overly concerned with offending. we're so far past that point it's not even fucking funny.

Then simply keep your criticism objective based on the current state. What is happening in our country may anger you but it is not Nazi Germany. It is ok to say it is not legal, or I object to the deployment of special forces, ICE, or the National Guard to address immigration issues or civil unrest. But Trump is not deploying death squads.

again the gestapo and the einsatzgruppen and the ss are all different things.

maybe read about those things and then comment.

I have read more about it than you could ever guess. This is not nazi Germany and nothing you or Halifax can say will convince me otherwise.

just curious. what books have you read on the nazis?

Start with the Rise and Fall. Or the Nuremberg trials. And many films.

The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich very clearly demonstrates the many similarities between Hitler and Trump's tactics, not to mention the similarities between the Brown shirts and the creation of the SS and ICE. I'm really not sure how you can read that and then say there aren't clear parallels. You know that making important comparisons isn't the same as saying it's literally the same thing, right? I'm pretty sure that everyone here already knows that America in 2025 isn't Nazi Germany, lol.

I know this is not a comparative literature or history class. I have an open mind, but there is no argument that will convince me that the current ICE and immigration crackdown is anything close to the gestapo and Nazi Germany. That is hyperbole. The ONLY similarity is that ICE is a federal unit with a specific mission. But that mission is not murder. The gestapo rounded up jews so they could be murdered. ICE is not doing that by any stretch of the imagination no matter how offended you might be with the way people are being treated.

If you think that’s the only similarity, then you’re not coming at it with an open mind. I’d suggest you ask yourself what would happen if you pointed out the similarities.

I understand the points, and bad things are happening for sure, but comparing the ICE crackdown to one of the greatest atrocities in modern history is a huge disconnect. People are not being murdered. Violation of whatever individual rights may apply is not murder. Nazis murdered people. ICE, while certainly engaging in questionable tactics, is not a death squad.

And people can do a comparison of the mass
psychology around what’s happening currently to 1930s Germany without agreeing that the end result is/will be the same. The scapegoating of ethnic groups, the funneling of power to a single leader, and the forced compliance within the political party in power are just naming a few.

I understand the arguments very well and looking at it from an intellectual, theoretical, or historical perspective. Those are talking points and talking is healthy. But I disagree with the comparison to the Nazis as a matter of factual reality. They are not rounding up people and sending them to death camps. If anything, perhaps a more appropriate comparison would be to the Japanese internment camps, although that occured during war time. Many of them were US citizens.

well, you keep ignoring that no one is saying they are doing that. They are doing what they did in the early years prior to the war. THAT is the comparison I'm making.

Then all law enforcement initiatives are comparable? Drug stings? Removing homeless encampments? Random speed traps? Gang enforcement? Quality of life violations? Sorry not even close.

EDIT: How about post 9/11 airport security? Complete liberty to search and seize.

* The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.
I can’t believe 1) you’re asking this question and 2) it has to be explained to you: the homeland security act was legislation passed by elected representatives in response to a major terrorist attack, with debate, carve outs, amendments and an opportunity, as short as it was, for the citizenry to express support or not. It ultimately passed and became law. Shrub, Rummy and Darth Cheney didn’t Willy nilly circumvent the law and establish all that was wrought on their own.
In the other lame examples you gave, city councils, legislators and the public are heard, hearings are held, ordinances and laws are formulated and votes are taken, usually after the citizens chime in on the pros/cons, support or not of the “police” action. You think governors, mayors, police chiefs just decide on a whim to clear out homeless encampments, or start setting up speed traps on their own?
There are laws and ordinances that govern “drug stings” and “quality of life” violations.
Fucking A are we fucked with this kind of thinking. Because they “can” and “do”. It’s way toooo late.
And to your edit, you consent to and acknowledge upon entering an airport or when buying a ticket to your person and belongings being searched, and that violations may lead to detainment, criminal charges and penalties and missing your flight. FFS. What legal authority does ICE have to kick in the door and enter the dwelling of a US citizen? Guess you haven’t read the constitution and the 4th Amendment, eh?

You are wrong and uniformed. It does not take much for law enforcement to find a reason. That is not new. I guess there are no laws, policies, and ordinances that govern immigration enforcement right? There are no legal precedents. It is just something you do not like. And there is a HUGE gap between the text of the constitution and how it is interpreted, executed on a daily basis, and decided in real life. Just go watch a traffic stop video and talk to me about the 4th amendment. Remember who you are talking with. I know a bit about this stuff.

* The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.
And yet you gave shitty examples. Excuse me, did I dream about the homeland security act? You asked about airport searches and seizures and tried to compare that with what ICE is doing.
So, if you “know a bit about this stuff”, cite the law that allows ICE to enter the private dwelling of a US citizen and under what legal conditions they may do so. I won’t wait for a reply, just expect more pivots and because they “can” and “do” type responses.

It is not just ICE. A whiff of illegal activity and law enforcement can enter a private dwelling. My examples are shitty? That is reality. There is no written law, only precedents that are complex. It has evolved based on court decisions. It would take a semester or more of law school class to go through it. It is not clear cut as you might think. We got an anonymous tip that drugs were being sold, or that you are housing illegal immigrants. I will agree it has gotten worse under the current regime. But if you think a warrant is needed in every situation you are just dead wrong. You are in denial if you think it is a challenge for law enforcement to enter private property based on the constitution.

* The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.

Because they “can” and “do”. You still can’t cite the law. Nice pivot. And you never did cite the law or CFR that created ICE and governs their operations. Again, debated, heard, legislation crafted, passed. Democracy.

A lawless nation and some are fine with it and will justify it with “they ‘can’ and ‘do’”.

Get_Right · January 16

Halifax2TheMax said:

Get_Right said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Get_Right said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

PJ_Soul said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:
first, to gimme's point, the comparison is just. second, at this point, I'm not overly concerned with offending. we're so far past that point it's not even fucking funny.

Then simply keep your criticism objective based on the current state. What is happening in our country may anger you but it is not Nazi Germany. It is ok to say it is not legal, or I object to the deployment of special forces, ICE, or the National Guard to address immigration issues or civil unrest. But Trump is not deploying death squads.

again the gestapo and the einsatzgruppen and the ss are all different things.

maybe read about those things and then comment.

I have read more about it than you could ever guess. This is not nazi Germany and nothing you or Halifax can say will convince me otherwise.

just curious. what books have you read on the nazis?

Start with the Rise and Fall. Or the Nuremberg trials. And many films.

The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich very clearly demonstrates the many similarities between Hitler and Trump's tactics, not to mention the similarities between the Brown shirts and the creation of the SS and ICE. I'm really not sure how you can read that and then say there aren't clear parallels. You know that making important comparisons isn't the same as saying it's literally the same thing, right? I'm pretty sure that everyone here already knows that America in 2025 isn't Nazi Germany, lol.

I know this is not a comparative literature or history class. I have an open mind, but there is no argument that will convince me that the current ICE and immigration crackdown is anything close to the gestapo and Nazi Germany. That is hyperbole. The ONLY similarity is that ICE is a federal unit with a specific mission. But that mission is not murder. The gestapo rounded up jews so they could be murdered. ICE is not doing that by any stretch of the imagination no matter how offended you might be with the way people are being treated.

If you think that’s the only similarity, then you’re not coming at it with an open mind. I’d suggest you ask yourself what would happen if you pointed out the similarities.

I understand the points, and bad things are happening for sure, but comparing the ICE crackdown to one of the greatest atrocities in modern history is a huge disconnect. People are not being murdered. Violation of whatever individual rights may apply is not murder. Nazis murdered people. ICE, while certainly engaging in questionable tactics, is not a death squad.

And people can do a comparison of the mass
psychology around what’s happening currently to 1930s Germany without agreeing that the end result is/will be the same. The scapegoating of ethnic groups, the funneling of power to a single leader, and the forced compliance within the political party in power are just naming a few.

I understand the arguments very well and looking at it from an intellectual, theoretical, or historical perspective. Those are talking points and talking is healthy. But I disagree with the comparison to the Nazis as a matter of factual reality. They are not rounding up people and sending them to death camps. If anything, perhaps a more appropriate comparison would be to the Japanese internment camps, although that occured during war time. Many of them were US citizens.

well, you keep ignoring that no one is saying they are doing that. They are doing what they did in the early years prior to the war. THAT is the comparison I'm making.

Then all law enforcement initiatives are comparable? Drug stings? Removing homeless encampments? Random speed traps? Gang enforcement? Quality of life violations? Sorry not even close.

EDIT: How about post 9/11 airport security? Complete liberty to search and seize.

* The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.
I can’t believe 1) you’re asking this question and 2) it has to be explained to you: the homeland security act was legislation passed by elected representatives in response to a major terrorist attack, with debate, carve outs, amendments and an opportunity, as short as it was, for the citizenry to express support or not. It ultimately passed and became law. Shrub, Rummy and Darth Cheney didn’t Willy nilly circumvent the law and establish all that was wrought on their own.
In the other lame examples you gave, city councils, legislators and the public are heard, hearings are held, ordinances and laws are formulated and votes are taken, usually after the citizens chime in on the pros/cons, support or not of the “police” action. You think governors, mayors, police chiefs just decide on a whim to clear out homeless encampments, or start setting up speed traps on their own?
There are laws and ordinances that govern “drug stings” and “quality of life” violations.
Fucking A are we fucked with this kind of thinking. Because they “can” and “do”. It’s way toooo late.
And to your edit, you consent to and acknowledge upon entering an airport or when buying a ticket to your person and belongings being searched, and that violations may lead to detainment, criminal charges and penalties and missing your flight. FFS. What legal authority does ICE have to kick in the door and enter the dwelling of a US citizen? Guess you haven’t read the constitution and the 4th Amendment, eh?

You are wrong and uniformed. It does not take much for law enforcement to find a reason. That is not new. I guess there are no laws, policies, and ordinances that govern immigration enforcement right? There are no legal precedents. It is just something you do not like. And there is a HUGE gap between the text of the constitution and how it is interpreted, executed on a daily basis, and decided in real life. Just go watch a traffic stop video and talk to me about the 4th amendment. Remember who you are talking with. I know a bit about this stuff.

* The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.
And yet you gave shitty examples. Excuse me, did I dream about the homeland security act? You asked about airport searches and seizures and tried to compare that with what ICE is doing.
So, if you “know a bit about this stuff”, cite the law that allows ICE to enter the private dwelling of a US citizen and under what legal conditions they may do so. I won’t wait for a reply, just expect more pivots and because they “can” and “do” type responses.

It is not just ICE. A whiff of illegal activity and law enforcement can enter a private dwelling. My examples are shitty? That is reality. There is no written law, only precedents that are complex. It has evolved based on court decisions. It would take a semester or more of law school class to go through it. It is not clear cut as you might think. We got an anonymous tip that drugs were being sold, or that you are housing illegal immigrants. I will agree it has gotten worse under the current regime. But if you think a warrant is needed in every situation you are just dead wrong. You are in denial if you think it is a challenge for law enforcement to enter private property based on the constitution.

* The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.

Because they “can” and “do”. You still can’t cite the law. Nice pivot. And you never did cite the law or CFR that created ICE and governs their operations. Again, debated, heard, legislation crafted, passed. Democracy.

A lawless nation and some are fine with it and will justify it with “they ‘can’ and ‘do’”.

I do not pretend to be a criminal or an immigration lawyer. But in many areas of the law there is no explicit CFR, USC or even agency policies that set forth what is considered legal as far as process goes. I am not pivoting but explaining reality. But there is clear USC authority for ICE and CBP to enforce immigration laws. Keep debating with me. You may not like what is happening, but if you fall into the web, you may have to wait for your day in court.

Go Beavers · January 16

Get_Right said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Get_Right said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Get_Right said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

PJ_Soul said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:
first, to gimme's point, the comparison is just. second, at this point, I'm not overly concerned with offending. we're so far past that point it's not even fucking funny.

Then simply keep your criticism objective based on the current state. What is happening in our country may anger you but it is not Nazi Germany. It is ok to say it is not legal, or I object to the deployment of special forces, ICE, or the National Guard to address immigration issues or civil unrest. But Trump is not deploying death squads.

again the gestapo and the einsatzgruppen and the ss are all different things.

maybe read about those things and then comment.

I have read more about it than you could ever guess. This is not nazi Germany and nothing you or Halifax can say will convince me otherwise.

just curious. what books have you read on the nazis?

Start with the Rise and Fall. Or the Nuremberg trials. And many films.

The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich very clearly demonstrates the many similarities between Hitler and Trump's tactics, not to mention the similarities between the Brown shirts and the creation of the SS and ICE. I'm really not sure how you can read that and then say there aren't clear parallels. You know that making important comparisons isn't the same as saying it's literally the same thing, right? I'm pretty sure that everyone here already knows that America in 2025 isn't Nazi Germany, lol.

I know this is not a comparative literature or history class. I have an open mind, but there is no argument that will convince me that the current ICE and immigration crackdown is anything close to the gestapo and Nazi Germany. That is hyperbole. The ONLY similarity is that ICE is a federal unit with a specific mission. But that mission is not murder. The gestapo rounded up jews so they could be murdered. ICE is not doing that by any stretch of the imagination no matter how offended you might be with the way people are being treated.

If you think that’s the only similarity, then you’re not coming at it with an open mind. I’d suggest you ask yourself what would happen if you pointed out the similarities.

I understand the points, and bad things are happening for sure, but comparing the ICE crackdown to one of the greatest atrocities in modern history is a huge disconnect. People are not being murdered. Violation of whatever individual rights may apply is not murder. Nazis murdered people. ICE, while certainly engaging in questionable tactics, is not a death squad.

And people can do a comparison of the mass
psychology around what’s happening currently to 1930s Germany without agreeing that the end result is/will be the same. The scapegoating of ethnic groups, the funneling of power to a single leader, and the forced compliance within the political party in power are just naming a few.

I understand the arguments very well and looking at it from an intellectual, theoretical, or historical perspective. Those are talking points and talking is healthy. But I disagree with the comparison to the Nazis as a matter of factual reality. They are not rounding up people and sending them to death camps. If anything, perhaps a more appropriate comparison would be to the Japanese internment camps, although that occured during war time. Many of them were US citizens.

well, you keep ignoring that no one is saying they are doing that. They are doing what they did in the early years prior to the war. THAT is the comparison I'm making.

Then all law enforcement initiatives are comparable? Drug stings? Removing homeless encampments? Random speed traps? Gang enforcement? Quality of life violations? Sorry not even close.

EDIT: How about post 9/11 airport security? Complete liberty to search and seize.

* The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.
I can’t believe 1) you’re asking this question and 2) it has to be explained to you: the homeland security act was legislation passed by elected representatives in response to a major terrorist attack, with debate, carve outs, amendments and an opportunity, as short as it was, for the citizenry to express support or not. It ultimately passed and became law. Shrub, Rummy and Darth Cheney didn’t Willy nilly circumvent the law and establish all that was wrought on their own.
In the other lame examples you gave, city councils, legislators and the public are heard, hearings are held, ordinances and laws are formulated and votes are taken, usually after the citizens chime in on the pros/cons, support or not of the “police” action. You think governors, mayors, police chiefs just decide on a whim to clear out homeless encampments, or start setting up speed traps on their own?
There are laws and ordinances that govern “drug stings” and “quality of life” violations.
Fucking A are we fucked with this kind of thinking. Because they “can” and “do”. It’s way toooo late.
And to your edit, you consent to and acknowledge upon entering an airport or when buying a ticket to your person and belongings being searched, and that violations may lead to detainment, criminal charges and penalties and missing your flight. FFS. What legal authority does ICE have to kick in the door and enter the dwelling of a US citizen? Guess you haven’t read the constitution and the 4th Amendment, eh?

You are wrong and uniformed. It does not take much for law enforcement to find a reason. That is not new. I guess there are no laws, policies, and ordinances that govern immigration enforcement right? There are no legal precedents. It is just something you do not like. And there is a HUGE gap between the text of the constitution and how it is interpreted, executed on a daily basis, and decided in real life. Just go watch a traffic stop video and talk to me about the 4th amendment. Remember who you are talking with. I know a bit about this stuff.

* The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.
And yet you gave shitty examples. Excuse me, did I dream about the homeland security act? You asked about airport searches and seizures and tried to compare that with what ICE is doing.
So, if you “know a bit about this stuff”, cite the law that allows ICE to enter the private dwelling of a US citizen and under what legal conditions they may do so. I won’t wait for a reply, just expect more pivots and because they “can” and “do” type responses.

It is not just ICE. A whiff of illegal activity and law enforcement can enter a private dwelling. My examples are shitty? That is reality. There is no written law, only precedents that are complex. It has evolved based on court decisions. It would take a semester or more of law school class to go through it. It is not clear cut as you might think. We got an anonymous tip that drugs were being sold, or that you are housing illegal immigrants. I will agree it has gotten worse under the current regime. But if you think a warrant is needed in every situation you are just dead wrong. You are in denial if you think it is a challenge for law enforcement to enter private property based on the constitution.

* The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.

Because they “can” and “do”. You still can’t cite the law. Nice pivot. And you never did cite the law or CFR that created ICE and governs their operations. Again, debated, heard, legislation crafted, passed. Democracy.

A lawless nation and some are fine with it and will justify it with “they ‘can’ and ‘do’”.

I do not pretend to be a criminal or an immigration lawyer. But in many areas of the law there is no explicit CFR, USC or even agency policies that set forth what is considered legal as far as process goes. I am not pivoting but explaining reality. But there is clear USC authority for ICE and CBP to enforce immigration laws. Keep debating with me. You may not like what is happening, but if you fall into the web, you may have to wait for your day in court.

Your angle seems to be that cops have always violated the Constitution, therefore what’s happening with ice currently can’t be seen as a parallel to nazi Germany. But now factor in the Kavanaugh stop decision, where he said location, job, and ethnicity can reasonable suspicion to be detained. It then validates ice violating the Constitution and being able to target racial minorities and ethnic groups, not unlike…

Halifax2TheMax · January 16

Get_Right said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Get_Right said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Get_Right said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

PJ_Soul said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

Get_Right said:

HughFreakingDillon said:
first, to gimme's point, the comparison is just. second, at this point, I'm not overly concerned with offending. we're so far past that point it's not even fucking funny.

Then simply keep your criticism objective based on the current state. What is happening in our country may anger you but it is not Nazi Germany. It is ok to say it is not legal, or I object to the deployment of special forces, ICE, or the National Guard to address immigration issues or civil unrest. But Trump is not deploying death squads.

again the gestapo and the einsatzgruppen and the ss are all different things.

maybe read about those things and then comment.

I have read more about it than you could ever guess. This is not nazi Germany and nothing you or Halifax can say will convince me otherwise.

just curious. what books have you read on the nazis?

Start with the Rise and Fall. Or the Nuremberg trials. And many films.

The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich very clearly demonstrates the many similarities between Hitler and Trump's tactics, not to mention the similarities between the Brown shirts and the creation of the SS and ICE. I'm really not sure how you can read that and then say there aren't clear parallels. You know that making important comparisons isn't the same as saying it's literally the same thing, right? I'm pretty sure that everyone here already knows that America in 2025 isn't Nazi Germany, lol.

I know this is not a comparative literature or history class. I have an open mind, but there is no argument that will convince me that the current ICE and immigration crackdown is anything close to the gestapo and Nazi Germany. That is hyperbole. The ONLY similarity is that ICE is a federal unit with a specific mission. But that mission is not murder. The gestapo rounded up jews so they could be murdered. ICE is not doing that by any stretch of the imagination no matter how offended you might be with the way people are being treated.

If you think that’s the only similarity, then you’re not coming at it with an open mind. I’d suggest you ask yourself what would happen if you pointed out the similarities.

I understand the points, and bad things are happening for sure, but comparing the ICE crackdown to one of the greatest atrocities in modern history is a huge disconnect. People are not being murdered. Violation of whatever individual rights may apply is not murder. Nazis murdered people. ICE, while certainly engaging in questionable tactics, is not a death squad.

And people can do a comparison of the mass
psychology around what’s happening currently to 1930s Germany without agreeing that the end result is/will be the same. The scapegoating of ethnic groups, the funneling of power to a single leader, and the forced compliance within the political party in power are just naming a few.

I understand the arguments very well and looking at it from an intellectual, theoretical, or historical perspective. Those are talking points and talking is healthy. But I disagree with the comparison to the Nazis as a matter of factual reality. They are not rounding up people and sending them to death camps. If anything, perhaps a more appropriate comparison would be to the Japanese internment camps, although that occured during war time. Many of them were US citizens.

well, you keep ignoring that no one is saying they are doing that. They are doing what they did in the early years prior to the war. THAT is the comparison I'm making.

Then all law enforcement initiatives are comparable? Drug stings? Removing homeless encampments? Random speed traps? Gang enforcement? Quality of life violations? Sorry not even close.

EDIT: How about post 9/11 airport security? Complete liberty to search and seize.

* The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.
I can’t believe 1) you’re asking this question and 2) it has to be explained to you: the homeland security act was legislation passed by elected representatives in response to a major terrorist attack, with debate, carve outs, amendments and an opportunity, as short as it was, for the citizenry to express support or not. It ultimately passed and became law. Shrub, Rummy and Darth Cheney didn’t Willy nilly circumvent the law and establish all that was wrought on their own.
In the other lame examples you gave, city councils, legislators and the public are heard, hearings are held, ordinances and laws are formulated and votes are taken, usually after the citizens chime in on the pros/cons, support or not of the “police” action. You think governors, mayors, police chiefs just decide on a whim to clear out homeless encampments, or start setting up speed traps on their own?
There are laws and ordinances that govern “drug stings” and “quality of life” violations.
Fucking A are we fucked with this kind of thinking. Because they “can” and “do”. It’s way toooo late.
And to your edit, you consent to and acknowledge upon entering an airport or when buying a ticket to your person and belongings being searched, and that violations may lead to detainment, criminal charges and penalties and missing your flight. FFS. What legal authority does ICE have to kick in the door and enter the dwelling of a US citizen? Guess you haven’t read the constitution and the 4th Amendment, eh?

You are wrong and uniformed. It does not take much for law enforcement to find a reason. That is not new. I guess there are no laws, policies, and ordinances that govern immigration enforcement right? There are no legal precedents. It is just something you do not like. And there is a HUGE gap between the text of the constitution and how it is interpreted, executed on a daily basis, and decided in real life. Just go watch a traffic stop video and talk to me about the 4th amendment. Remember who you are talking with. I know a bit about this stuff.

* The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.
And yet you gave shitty examples. Excuse me, did I dream about the homeland security act? You asked about airport searches and seizures and tried to compare that with what ICE is doing.
So, if you “know a bit about this stuff”, cite the law that allows ICE to enter the private dwelling of a US citizen and under what legal conditions they may do so. I won’t wait for a reply, just expect more pivots and because they “can” and “do” type responses.

It is not just ICE. A whiff of illegal activity and law enforcement can enter a private dwelling. My examples are shitty? That is reality. There is no written law, only precedents that are complex. It has evolved based on court decisions. It would take a semester or more of law school class to go through it. It is not clear cut as you might think. We got an anonymous tip that drugs were being sold, or that you are housing illegal immigrants. I will agree it has gotten worse under the current regime. But if you think a warrant is needed in every situation you are just dead wrong. You are in denial if you think it is a challenge for law enforcement to enter private property based on the constitution.

* The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.

Because they “can” and “do”. You still can’t cite the law. Nice pivot. And you never did cite the law or CFR that created ICE and governs their operations. Again, debated, heard, legislation crafted, passed. Democracy.

A lawless nation and some are fine with it and will justify it with “they ‘can’ and ‘do’”.

I do not pretend to be a criminal or an immigration lawyer. But in many areas of the law there is no explicit CFR, USC or even agency policies that set forth what is considered legal as far as process goes. I am not pivoting but explaining reality. But there is clear USC authority for ICE and CBP to enforce immigration laws. Keep debating with me. You may not like what is happening, but if you fall into the web, you may have to wait for your day in court.

* The following opinion is mine and mine alone and does not represent the views of my family, friends, government and/or my past, present or future employer. US Department of State: 1-888-407-4747.

Another yes or no question for you, do US immigration laws apply to US citizens?

A yes or no answer will suffice.

Immigration

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