This is the dumbest, most useless thing ever. How about someone focuses on the idiotic ticket process that is nothing but a bullshit scam?
Some people only care about themselves. Yeah, the ticket process is a major issue, click a few buttons. Real difficult.
Get real. Boycotting things for a few minutes doesn't come close to moving the needle. Meanwhile PJ and TM are in bed together completely raping the fan base and they want to play this holier than thou card? So lame.
To be clear, you are saying don’t use your time to draw attention to one thing that is bad, use your time and attention on another thing that is bad?
To be even clearer, he is saying: don't use your time to draw attention to major, systemic problems that threaten the very future of the country and our freedoms within it; instead, use your time and attention on a system that people use to access entertainment products.*
* A system that, whatever its flaws, still manages to ensure that thousands of the best seats in every arena are set aside for the band's fan club members-- a fact that completely undermines his assertion that "every action [Pearl Jam] took was to help monopolize the system and cater to the bots and scalpers."
This is the dumbest, most useless thing ever. How about someone focuses on the idiotic ticket process that is nothing but a bullshit scam?
Some people only care about themselves. Yeah, the ticket process is a major issue, click a few buttons. Real difficult.
Get real. Boycotting things for a few minutes doesn't come close to moving the needle. Meanwhile PJ and TM are in bed together completely raping the fan base and they want to play this holier than thou card? So lame.
To be clear, you are saying don’t use your time to draw attention to one thing that is bad, use your time and attention on another thing that is bad?
To be even clearer, he is saying: don't use your time to draw attention to major, systemic problems that threaten the very future of the country and our freedoms within it; instead, use your time and attention on a system that people use to access entertainment products.*
* A system that, whatever its flaws, still manages to ensure that thousands of the best seats in every arena are set aside for the band's fan club members-- a fact that completely undermines his assertion that "every action [Pearl Jam] took was to help monopolize the system and cater to the bots and scalpers."
Cool fake story. Let me know when Target and Amazon go under next week. You know, Target. The store PJ partnered with? I'll wait here.
BTW, the system does nothing for the 10c members other than put them in a corner where they are threatened if they sell their tickets above face value. Instead, something comes up and they have to sell, but no other fans are allowed to get them at face value. Nope, the bots are pushed to the front of the line and within seconds, resell them for up to 10x face value while your band does..................absolutely nothing about it. Those are facts. So, anyway, make sure you use cash when you pay $1200 for a nosebleed seat to Raleigh. That'll show em.
The 10C does not get the best seats anymore. Do not hate the players, hate the game. The DOJ approved the ticketmaster live nation merger. That never should have happened. I cannot blame TM for taking advantage of its competitive position to earn more profit. That is economics 101. IMHO the problem is the broken system that allowed it to happen.
0
brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 42,808
Reading through this thread leaves me wondering how it is that so many Pearl Jam fans have turned away from or even against a lot of what (besides making great music, of course), this band has stood up for over the years. And why all the nasty attacks on a boycott that was voluntary? No one forced all these haters to do one single thing. And why slam those of us who participated? So much hate, and to see it on this pages is hugely disappointing.
Rock fans, including Pearl Jam fans, disproportionately belong to certain demographics that are more likely to be unsympathetic to the causes that Pearl Jam champions. This tension has existed for a long time.
Yeah, I suppose. It just seems odd to me that Pearl Jam fans would fit that group, but then I've seen the same with bands like Jello Biafra's fans. Many stand with his perspective on things, but a many also seem to hate the things he stands up for. Makes no sense to me.
Reading through this thread leaves me wondering how it is that so many Pearl Jam fans have turned away from or even against a lot of what (besides making great music, of course), this band has stood up for over the years. And why all the nasty attacks on a boycott that was voluntary? No one forced all these haters to do one single thing. And why slam those of us who participated? So much hate, and to see it on this pages is hugely disappointing.
It's because if you have been paying attention, the band hasn't been standing up for anything. Actions speak louder than words. Saying you are against the monopolization and then participating in the monopoly is not standing against shit. Seeking attention is different than actually doing something about an issue.
I wouldn't assume all the things the band does fit in the same bag. This one was a good call.
Post edited by brianlux on
"Don't give in to the lies. Don't give in to the fear. Hold on to the truth. And to hope."
The 10C does not get the best seats anymore. Do not hate the players, hate the game. The DOJ approved the ticketmaster live nation merger. That never should have happened. I cannot blame TM for taking advantage of its competitive position to earn more profit. That is economics 101. IMHO the problem is the broken system that allowed it to happen.
I’d argue 10c gets the best ticket, but they can’t accommodate everyone in the club having the best seats so there are bunk seats too (I mean, it is all a balance with TMs sales as well).
This is the dumbest, most useless thing ever. How about someone focuses on the idiotic ticket process that is nothing but a bullshit scam?
Some people only care about themselves. Yeah, the ticket process is a major issue, click a few buttons. Real difficult.
Get real. Boycotting things for a few minutes doesn't come close to moving the needle. Meanwhile PJ and TM are in bed together completely raping the fan base and they want to play this holier than thou card? So lame.
To be clear, you are saying don’t use your time to draw attention to one thing that is bad, use your time and attention on another thing that is bad?
To be even clearer, he is saying: don't use your time to draw attention to major, systemic problems that threaten the very future of the country and our freedoms within it; instead, use your time and attention on a system that people use to access entertainment products.*
* A system that, whatever its flaws, still manages to ensure that thousands of the best seats in every arena are set aside for the band's fan club members-- a fact that completely undermines his assertion that "every action [Pearl Jam] took was to help monopolize the system and cater to the bots and scalpers."
Cool fake story. Let me know when Target and Amazon go under next week. You know, Target. The store PJ partnered with? I'll wait here.
BTW, the system does nothing for the 10c members other than put them in a corner where they are threatened if they sell their tickets above face value. Instead, something comes up and they have to sell, but no other fans are allowed to get them at face value. Nope, the bots are pushed to the front of the line and within seconds, resell them for up to 10x face value while your band does..................absolutely nothing about it. Those are facts. So, anyway, make sure you use cash when you pay $1200 for a nosebleed seat to Raleigh. That'll show em.
I have zero knowledge of how it all works, but I’ve always sensed, when it comes to TM and tickets the last few tours - it sorta goes:
TM: We’ll give you more fan club seats than other bands are normally allocated. We’ll also agree to have resale prices locked (aside from NY and CO). (Yielding TM less revenue on resale percentage fees.). However, you need to agree to let us sell a portion as premium ticket pricing.
10C: Deal.
Not a bad give and take. But again, that’s just my interpretation.
TM has monopolized the industry. No chance in playing venues over 1,000 seats without.
Comcast is the only tv and internet option where I live. If I don’t use Comcast, I don’t have the internet. Sucks, but that’s what it is. It’d take government action to change it. Same as TM, albeit in a larger scale.
Boston '06 Mansfield '08 Hartford '10 Worcester, Hartford '13 Global Citizen, NY '15
This is the dumbest, most useless thing ever. How about someone focuses on the idiotic ticket process that is nothing but a bullshit scam?
Some people only care about themselves. Yeah, the ticket process is a major issue, click a few buttons. Real difficult.
Get real. Boycotting things for a few minutes doesn't come close to moving the needle. Meanwhile PJ and TM are in bed together completely raping the fan base and they want to play this holier than thou card? So lame.
To be clear, you are saying don’t use your time to draw attention to one thing that is bad, use your time and attention on another thing that is bad?
To be even clearer, he is saying: don't use your time to draw attention to major, systemic problems that threaten the very future of the country and our freedoms within it; instead, use your time and attention on a system that people use to access entertainment products.*
* A system that, whatever its flaws, still manages to ensure that thousands of the best seats in every arena are set aside for the band's fan club members-- a fact that completely undermines his assertion that "every action [Pearl Jam] took was to help monopolize the system and cater to the bots and scalpers."
Cool fake story. Let me know when Target and Amazon go under next week. You know, Target. The store PJ partnered with? I'll wait here.
BTW, the system does nothing for the 10c members other than put them in a corner where they are threatened if they sell their tickets above face value. Instead, something comes up and they have to sell, but no other fans are allowed to get them at face value. Nope, the bots are pushed to the front of the line and within seconds, resell them for up to 10x face value while your band does..................absolutely nothing about it. Those are facts. So, anyway, make sure you use cash when you pay $1200 for a nosebleed seat to Raleigh. That'll show em.
I'll tell you one thing though. If this 24 hour blackout doesn't change everything, they should do something completely unheard of.... A TWENTY-FIVE HOUR BLACKOUT! Go big or go home.
I have zero knowledge of how it all works, but I’ve always sensed, when it comes to TM and tickets the last few tours - it sorta goes:
TM: We’ll give you more fan club seats than other bands are normally allocated. We’ll also agree to have resale prices locked (aside from NY and CO). (Yielding TM less revenue on resale percentage fees.). However, you need to agree to let us sell a portion as premium ticket pricing.
I guess Target is OK when the band needs to make a cash grab selling a limited edition item.
That’s been on sale for years. Good try though. Atleast we can weed out the clueless in this chain
You are the clueless one. I'm well aware of when this lp was available. The point so you can understand was that it was alright for the band to make a profit by forcing their fans to Target to buy an exclusive item but now they are telling the fans to boycott Target after they have made their money. Sounds pretty hypocritical to me!
4/22/92 St. Petersburg, 8/23/92 Orlando, 3/29/94 St. Petersburg, 10/7/96 Ft. Lauderdale, 9/8/98 East Rutherford, 9/22/98 West Palm Beach, 9/23/98 West Palm Beach, 8/9/00 West Palm Beach, 8/10/00 West Palm Beach, 8/12/00 Tampa, 4/11/03 West Palm Beach, 4/13/03 Tampa, 6/2/03 Irvine, 6/3/03 Irvine, 9/28/04 Boston, 9/29/04 Boston, 9/1/05 George WA, 9/11/05 Kitchener, 9/12/05 London, 9/13/05 Hamilton, 10/03/05 Philadelphia, 5/16/06 Chicago, 5/17/06 Chicago, 6/23/06 Pittsburgh, 6/24/06 Cincinnati, 6/11/08, West Palm Beach, 6/12/08 Tampa, 6/19/08 Camden, 6/20/08 Camden, 8/23/09 Chicago, 8/24/09 Chicago, 10/27/09 Philadelphia, 10/28/09 Philadelphia, 10/30/09 Philadelphia, 10/31/09 Philadelphia, 5/18/10 New Jersey, 5/20/10 New York, 5/21/10 New York, 9/3/11 East Troy, 9/4/11 East Troy, 9/11/11 Toronto, 9/12/11 Toronto, 9/02/12 Philadelphia, 9/21/12 Pensacola, 7/19/13 Chicago, 10/18/13 Brooklyn, 10/19/13 Brooklyn, 11/23/13 LA, 10/24/13 LA, 11/16/13 Oklahoma City, 10/1/14 Cincinnati, 10/20/14 Milwaukee, 10/22/14 Denver, 4/8/16 Ft. Lauderdale, 4/9/16 Miami, 4/11/16 Tampa, 5/1/16 New York, 5/2/16 New York, 8/5/16 Boston, 8/7/16 Boston, 8/20/16 Chicago, 8/22/16 Chicago, 4/07/17 New York, 8/08/18 Seattle, 8/10/18 Seattle, 8/20/18 Chicago 9/02/18 Boston, 9/04/18 Boston, 9/11/22 New York, 9/16/22 Nashville, 9/22/22 Denver, 8/31/23, St. Paul, 9/2/23 St. Paul, 9/18/23 Austin, 9/19/23 Austin
The 10C does not get the best seats anymore. Do not hate the players, hate the game. The DOJ approved the ticketmaster live nation merger. That never should have happened. I cannot blame TM for taking advantage of its competitive position to earn more profit. That is economics 101. IMHO the problem is the broken system that allowed it to happen.
I’d argue 10c gets the best ticket, but they can’t accommodate everyone in the club having the best seats so there are bunk seats too (I mean, it is all a balance with TMs sales as well).
It is not true anymore. 10C gets GA but after that, the seats are nowhere near as good as they used to be. I do think the percentage of tickets given to the 10C is above average, but the seat locations are not as good as they used to be. At least that is my experience.
I have zero knowledge of how it all works, but I’ve always sensed, when it comes to TM and tickets the last few tours - it sorta goes:
TM: We’ll give you more fan club seats than other bands are normally allocated. We’ll also agree to have resale prices locked (aside from NY and CO). (Yielding TM less revenue on resale percentage fees.). However, you need to agree to let us sell a portion as premium ticket pricing.
10C: Deal.
Not a bad give and take. But again, that’s just my interpretation.
Not exactly.
The band wants to tour and negotiates the production rights to LiveNation who then own the tour. The venue, having signed on with Ticketmaster, facilitates the production. Management negotiates the band’s fee with LiveNation and stipulates fan club access to a certain percentage of the house. LiveNation agrees to the band’s fee and stipulates premium ticket prices for a certain percentage of the venue. With no public on sale management can go ahead and request a larger fan club allocation and with no public on sale LiveNation can enjoy premium sales from the get go. The band can earn a set fee for playing a smaller run and take home a higher percentage by not shouldering the overhead. The band dictates what’s best for them and management works on behalf of the band to successfully execute their goals.
To quote the 10C from Newsletter #8: "Please understand we have a lot of members and it is very hard to please everybody. If you are one of those unhappy people...please call 1-900-IDN-TCAR."
"Me knowing the truth, I can not concur."
1996: Toronto - 1998: Chicago, Montreal, Barrie - 2000: Montreal, Toronto - 2002: Seattle X2 (Key Arena) - 2003: Cleveland, Buffalo, Toronto, Montreal, Seattle (Benaroya Hall) - 2004: Reading, Toledo, Grand Rapids - 2005: Kitchener, London, Hamilton, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto, Quebec City - 2006: Toronto X2, Albany, Hartford, Grand Rapids, Cleveland - 2007: Chicago (Vic Theatre) - 2008: NYC X2, Hartford, Mansfield X2 - 2009: Toronto, Chicago X2, Seattle X2, Philadelphia X4 - 2010: Columbus, Noblesville, Cleveland, Buffalo, Hartford - 2011: Montreal, Toronto X2, Ottawa, Hamilton - 2012: Missoula - 2013: London, Chicago, Buffalo, Hartford - 2014: Detroit, Moline - 2015: NYC (Global Citizen Festival) - 2016: Greenville, Toronto X2, Chicago 1 - 2017: Brooklyn (RRHOF Induction) - 2018: Chicago 1, Boston 1 - 2022: Fresno, Ottawa, Hamilton, Toronto, NYC, Camden - 2023: St. Paul X2, Austin X2 - 2024: Vancouver X2, Portland, Sacramento, Missoula, Noblesville, Philadelphia X2, Baltimore - 2025: Hollywood X2, Atlanta 2, Nashville X2, Pittsburgh X2
I guess Target is OK when the band needs to make a cash grab selling a limited edition item.
That’s been on sale for years. Good try though. Atleast we can weed out the clueless in this chain
You are the clueless one. I'm well aware of when this lp was available. The point so you can understand was that it was alright for the band to make a profit by forcing their fans to Target to buy an exclusive item but now they are telling the fans to boycott Target after they have made their money. Sounds pretty hypocritical to me!
Target wasn’t shitting on minorities in their hiring process back then (or at least acquiescing to smooth brain shareholders who want regressive policies because some white buys feel put out). So things change.
Also, no one was forced to buy from Target (ten club sold them too. Twice I believe)
I have zero knowledge of how it all works, but I’ve always sensed, when it comes to TM and tickets the last few tours - it sorta goes:
TM: We’ll give you more fan club seats than other bands are normally allocated. We’ll also agree to have resale prices locked (aside from NY and CO). (Yielding TM less revenue on resale percentage fees.). However, you need to agree to let us sell a portion as premium ticket pricing.
10C: Deal.
Not a bad give and take. But again, that’s just my interpretation.
TM has monopolized the industry. No chance in playing venues over 1,000 seats without.
Comcast is the only tv and internet option where I live. If I don’t use Comcast, I don’t have the internet. Sucks, but that’s what it is. It’d take government action to change it. Same as TM, albeit in a larger scale.
Not completely true. Red Rocks doesnt use TM Plenty of baseball stadiums dont use TM Lots of college arenas and stadiums don't use TM Etc etc
I guess Target is OK when the band needs to make a cash grab selling a limited edition item.
That’s been on sale for years. Good try though. Atleast we can weed out the clueless in this chain
You are the clueless one. I'm well aware of when this lp was available. The point so you can understand was that it was alright for the band to make a profit by forcing their fans to Target to buy an exclusive item but now they are telling the fans to boycott Target after they have made their money. Sounds pretty hypocritical to me!
Target wasn’t shitting on minorities in their hiring process back then (or at least acquiescing to smooth brain shareholders who want regressive policies because some white buys feel put out). So things change.
Also, no one was forced to buy from Target (ten club sold them too. Twice I believe)
There is still PJ product being sold at Target. If their business practices are so awful why doesn't the band buy all their product back and boycott Target themselves. I think we know the answer. It's the Democrat mantra do as I say not as I do.
4/22/92 St. Petersburg, 8/23/92 Orlando, 3/29/94 St. Petersburg, 10/7/96 Ft. Lauderdale, 9/8/98 East Rutherford, 9/22/98 West Palm Beach, 9/23/98 West Palm Beach, 8/9/00 West Palm Beach, 8/10/00 West Palm Beach, 8/12/00 Tampa, 4/11/03 West Palm Beach, 4/13/03 Tampa, 6/2/03 Irvine, 6/3/03 Irvine, 9/28/04 Boston, 9/29/04 Boston, 9/1/05 George WA, 9/11/05 Kitchener, 9/12/05 London, 9/13/05 Hamilton, 10/03/05 Philadelphia, 5/16/06 Chicago, 5/17/06 Chicago, 6/23/06 Pittsburgh, 6/24/06 Cincinnati, 6/11/08, West Palm Beach, 6/12/08 Tampa, 6/19/08 Camden, 6/20/08 Camden, 8/23/09 Chicago, 8/24/09 Chicago, 10/27/09 Philadelphia, 10/28/09 Philadelphia, 10/30/09 Philadelphia, 10/31/09 Philadelphia, 5/18/10 New Jersey, 5/20/10 New York, 5/21/10 New York, 9/3/11 East Troy, 9/4/11 East Troy, 9/11/11 Toronto, 9/12/11 Toronto, 9/02/12 Philadelphia, 9/21/12 Pensacola, 7/19/13 Chicago, 10/18/13 Brooklyn, 10/19/13 Brooklyn, 11/23/13 LA, 10/24/13 LA, 11/16/13 Oklahoma City, 10/1/14 Cincinnati, 10/20/14 Milwaukee, 10/22/14 Denver, 4/8/16 Ft. Lauderdale, 4/9/16 Miami, 4/11/16 Tampa, 5/1/16 New York, 5/2/16 New York, 8/5/16 Boston, 8/7/16 Boston, 8/20/16 Chicago, 8/22/16 Chicago, 4/07/17 New York, 8/08/18 Seattle, 8/10/18 Seattle, 8/20/18 Chicago 9/02/18 Boston, 9/04/18 Boston, 9/11/22 New York, 9/16/22 Nashville, 9/22/22 Denver, 8/31/23, St. Paul, 9/2/23 St. Paul, 9/18/23 Austin, 9/19/23 Austin
I have zero knowledge of how it all works, but I’ve always sensed, when it comes to TM and tickets the last few tours - it sorta goes:
TM: We’ll give you more fan club seats than other bands are normally allocated. We’ll also agree to have resale prices locked (aside from NY and CO). (Yielding TM less revenue on resale percentage fees.). However, you need to agree to let us sell a portion as premium ticket pricing.
10C: Deal.
Not a bad give and take. But again, that’s just my interpretation.
Not exactly.
The band wants to tour and negotiates the production rights to LiveNation who then own the tour. The venue, having signed on with Ticketmaster, facilitates the production. Management negotiates the band’s fee with LiveNation and stipulates fan club access to a certain percentage of the house. LiveNation agrees to the band’s fee and stipulates premium ticket prices for a certain percentage of the venue. With no public on sale management can go ahead and request a larger fan club allocation and with no public on sale LiveNation can enjoy premium sales from the get go. The band can earn a set fee for playing a smaller run and take home a higher percentage by not shouldering the overhead. The band dictates what’s best for them and management works on behalf of the band to successfully execute their goals.
Good stuff. The biz of the industry has always peaked my curiosity.
We have an awesome local theater down the street (Cabot Theater, Beverly MA). I remember having coffee with one of the directors years back, and asked how Boston gets all the top comedians and what’d it take to get them 15 miles north. She said it’s because the promoter who gets all the comedians is, essentially, exclusive with Boston. I found it quite interesting, the business of it all.
Boston '06 Mansfield '08 Hartford '10 Worcester, Hartford '13 Global Citizen, NY '15
The 10C does not get the best seats anymore. Do not hate the players, hate the game. The DOJ approved the ticketmaster live nation merger. That never should have happened. I cannot blame TM for taking advantage of its competitive position to earn more profit. That is economics 101. IMHO the problem is the broken system that allowed it to happen.
I entered the Ten Club lottery for the shows in the spring of 2024. All of the tickets I got-- and I got tickets to every show I requested-- were either in the GA section, from one to ten rows on the floor behind the GA section, or in the first section on the side of the stage. So you're just wrong. The Ten Club still gets large numbers of the best seats in every arena, which is what I said.
This is the dumbest, most useless thing ever. How about someone focuses on the idiotic ticket process that is nothing but a bullshit scam?
Some people only care about themselves. Yeah, the ticket process is a major issue, click a few buttons. Real difficult.
Get real. Boycotting things for a few minutes doesn't come close to moving the needle. Meanwhile PJ and TM are in bed together completely raping the fan base and they want to play this holier than thou card? So lame.
To be clear, you are saying don’t use your time to draw attention to one thing that is bad, use your time and attention on another thing that is bad?
To be even clearer, he is saying: don't use your time to draw attention to major, systemic problems that threaten the very future of the country and our freedoms within it; instead, use your time and attention on a system that people use to access entertainment products.*
* A system that, whatever its flaws, still manages to ensure that thousands of the best seats in every arena are set aside for the band's fan club members-- a fact that completely undermines his assertion that "every action [Pearl Jam] took was to help monopolize the system and cater to the bots and scalpers."
Cool fake story. Let me know when Target and Amazon go under next week. You know, Target. The store PJ partnered with? I'll wait here.
BTW, the system does nothing for the 10c members other than put them in a corner where they are threatened if they sell their tickets above face value. Instead, something comes up and they have to sell, but no other fans are allowed to get them at face value. Nope, the bots are pushed to the front of the line and within seconds, resell them for up to 10x face value while your band does..................absolutely nothing about it. Those are facts. So, anyway, make sure you use cash when you pay $1200 for a nosebleed seat to Raleigh. That'll show em.
See my post above. "Does nothing for the 10c members"? Au contraire. The system gave me, as a Ten Club member, the opportunity to purchase outstanding face-value tickets to as many shows as I wished-- and, in fact, I got those tickets. I would never have been able to attend ten Pearl Jam shows in six cities in two countries for under $2,000 if it had not been for the Ten Club lottery (or certainly not without a lot more effort required and a lot more uncertainty).
What fake story are you referring to? You said something that is demonstrably false, that "every action [Pearl Jam took] was to help monopolize the system and cater to the bots and scalpers." Thousands of fan club tickets are purchased for every show, most of which are excellent. Pearl Jam took actions to make that possible. If you are so convinced that the band is as corrupt as you say it is, why are you paying to belong to this fan club? You're painting yourself as quite a sucker.
Reading through this thread leaves me wondering how it is that so many Pearl Jam fans have turned away from or even against a lot of what (besides making great music, of course), this band has stood up for over the years. And why all the nasty attacks on a boycott that was voluntary? No one forced all these haters to do one single thing. And why slam those of us who participated? So much hate, and to see it on this pages is hugely disappointing.
Rock fans, including Pearl Jam fans, disproportionately belong to certain demographics that are more likely to be unsympathetic to the causes that Pearl Jam champions. This tension has existed for a long time.
Yeah, I suppose. It just seems odd to me that Pearl Jam fans would fit that group, but then I've seen the same with bands like Jello Biafra's fans. Many stand with his perspective on things, but a many also seem to hate the things he stands up for. Makes no sense to me.
Bear in mind that a lot of Pearl Jam's fan base consists of people who were adolescents or young adults in the early '90s and who connected to the general sense of dislocation and angst that the band's music projected, but without necessarily thinking or caring too much about the specific political ideas that infused the songs. They either didn't share the band's politics back then but didn't care because the band rocked in a way that they liked, or they were too young or disengaged to have strong political beliefs one way or the other. Now the fan base is older and their political beliefs are more in line with their demographics-- disproportionately white and middle-aged, and more conservative-- than are the political beliefs of Pearl Jam's members, who belong to the same demographic but who came of age in an artistic and cultural environment that fostered a different, more liberal political outlook. That creates a tension.
I'll tell you one thing though. If this 24 hour blackout doesn't change everything, they should do something completely unheard of.... A TWENTY-FIVE HOUR BLACKOUT! Go big or go home.
Breathe. You seem incredibly angry about something that you didn't have to participate in. Why? Also, if you're that angry about getting PJ tickets, maybe just stay home? Another situation where no one is forcing you to deal with something that seems to be highly upsetting in your life. We get your position. Posting more furious posts will do far less than boycotts, but you be you. Take care.
1991- Hollywood Palladium, California with Temple of the Dog, Soundgarden, and Alice in Chains -RIP Magazine Show Oct. 6th 1992- Lollapalooza, Irvine, California Nothing since then. I suck. 2016- Fenway Park, Boston - Both glorious nights 2022- Oakland Night 2 2024 Sacramento, CA
0
brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 42,808
Reading through this thread leaves me wondering how it is that so many Pearl Jam fans have turned away from or even against a lot of what (besides making great music, of course), this band has stood up for over the years. And why all the nasty attacks on a boycott that was voluntary? No one forced all these haters to do one single thing. And why slam those of us who participated? So much hate, and to see it on this pages is hugely disappointing.
Rock fans, including Pearl Jam fans, disproportionately belong to certain demographics that are more likely to be unsympathetic to the causes that Pearl Jam champions. This tension has existed for a long time.
Yeah, I suppose. It just seems odd to me that Pearl Jam fans would fit that group, but then I've seen the same with bands like Jello Biafra's fans. Many stand with his perspective on things, but a many also seem to hate the things he stands up for. Makes no sense to me.
Bear in mind that a lot of Pearl Jam's fan base consists of people who were adolescents or young adults in the early '90s and who connected to the general sense of dislocation and angst that the band's music projected, but without necessarily thinking or caring too much about the specific political ideas that infused the songs. They either didn't share the band's politics back then but didn't care because the band rocked in a way that they liked, or they were too young or disengaged to have strong political beliefs one way or the other. Now the fan base is older and their political beliefs are more in line with their demographics-- disproportionately white and middle-aged, and more conservative-- than are the political beliefs of Pearl Jam's members, who belong to the same demographic but who came of age in an artistic and cultural environment that fostered a different, more liberal political outlook. That creates a tension.
Interesting perspective that make sense, BF. Thanks.
My earlier interesting in rock music came at a time when even in our teens, the music we loved was also often the voice of things that mattered a lot to us. Songs like Crosby, Still, Nash, and Young's "Ohio", Buffalo Springfield's "For What It's Worth", Otis Redding's "Respect" (later rearranged by Aretha Franklin), Creedence Clearwater Revival's "Fortunate Son", Bob Dylan's "Masters of War", and Phil Ochs' "I Ain't Marching Any More" (and many, many more), mattered to us and still resonate all these years later.
It's also worth nothing that a lot of those songs were seeds that germinated more contemporary bands like Pearl Jam, Drive-By Truckers, Radiohead, Muse, and Sleater-Kinney.
But a lot of people do change and become more conservative as they age. Even a lot of so-called "boomers" did. Which is why I like Neil Young's line, "People my age, they don't do the things I do" and "Better to burn out than to fade away/ rust." Not me, baby.
"Don't give in to the lies. Don't give in to the fear. Hold on to the truth. And to hope."
The 10C does not get the best seats anymore. Do not hate the players, hate the game. The DOJ approved the ticketmaster live nation merger. That never should have happened. I cannot blame TM for taking advantage of its competitive position to earn more profit. That is economics 101. IMHO the problem is the broken system that allowed it to happen.
I entered the Ten Club lottery for the shows in the spring of 2024. All of the tickets I got-- and I got tickets to every show I requested-- were either in the GA section, from one to ten rows on the floor behind the GA section, or in the first section on the side of the stage. So you're just wrong. The Ten Club still gets large numbers of the best seats in every arena, which is what I said.
Yeah maybe, but not in the northeast. GA is great if that is want you want. Maybe you have a five digit number and they stick you in the back of the floor? Seats at the back of the floor are not the best seats in the house and those were assigned more than usual from what I could tell. All I know is my seats have been farther back than prior tours. I was put in the 200s for MSG, far worse than prior years when I would get those same great side seats you mention. They may get a good allotment of tickets, but they are spread out more so TM can sell premiums. I am not wrong.
I guess Target is OK when the band needs to make a cash grab selling a limited edition item.
That’s been on sale for years. Good try though. Atleast we can weed out the clueless in this chain
You are the clueless one. I'm well aware of when this lp was available. The point so you can understand was that it was alright for the band to make a profit by forcing their fans to Target to buy an exclusive item but now they are telling the fans to boycott Target after they have made their money. Sounds pretty hypocritical to me!
Thankful for people who aren't blindly ignorant. Everyone that supported this band on the lowest level knows this.
I guess Target is OK when the band needs to make a cash grab selling a limited edition item.
That’s been on sale for years. Good try though. Atleast we can weed out the clueless in this chain
You are the clueless one. I'm well aware of when this lp was available. The point so you can understand was that it was alright for the band to make a profit by forcing their fans to Target to buy an exclusive item but now they are telling the fans to boycott Target after they have made their money. Sounds pretty hypocritical to me!
Target wasn’t shitting on minorities in their hiring process back then (or at least acquiescing to smooth brain shareholders who want regressive policies because some white buys feel put out). So things change.
Also, no one was forced to buy from Target (ten club sold them too. Twice I believe)
This may be the dumbest, laziest comment I have ever read. Holy hell
I guess Target is OK when the band needs to make a cash grab selling a limited edition item.
That’s been on sale for years. Good try though. Atleast we can weed out the clueless in this chain
You are the clueless one. I'm well aware of when this lp was available. The point so you can understand was that it was alright for the band to make a profit by forcing their fans to Target to buy an exclusive item but now they are telling the fans to boycott Target after they have made their money. Sounds pretty hypocritical to me!
Target wasn’t shitting on minorities in their hiring process back then (or at least acquiescing to smooth brain shareholders who want regressive policies because some white buys feel put out). So things change.
Also, no one was forced to buy from Target (ten club sold them too. Twice I believe)
There is still PJ product being sold at Target. If their business practices are so awful why doesn't the band buy all their product back and boycott Target themselves. I think we know the answer. It's the Democrat mantra do as I say not as I do.
Your last sentence is laughable, but ok, good burn man. Since they are in support of efforts to limit environmental impact they should also never travel and cease to exist to minimize their carbon footprint. Pretty sure you know how it works, but you're whining because they don't 100% disconnect from parts of our way of living that are also negative. With that type of thinking it's no wonder shit is so fucked up these days. If you can't go all in, why go in at all, right? Fuck the world and everyone who isn't fortunate to be you who for some reason pays a membership to a band forum they seem to loathe.
Also, The current "king" of do as I say, not as I do is the sitting president, but do go on. Are you part of the new USSR (United States Sympathizers of Russia)?
I guess Target is OK when the band needs to make a cash grab selling a limited edition item.
That’s been on sale for years. Good try though. Atleast we can weed out the clueless in this chain
You are the clueless one. I'm well aware of when this lp was available. The point so you can understand was that it was alright for the band to make a profit by forcing their fans to Target to buy an exclusive item but now they are telling the fans to boycott Target after they have made their money. Sounds pretty hypocritical to me!
Target wasn’t shitting on minorities in their hiring process back then (or at least acquiescing to smooth brain shareholders who want regressive policies because some white buys feel put out). So things change.
Also, no one was forced to buy from Target (ten club sold them too. Twice I believe)
This may be the dumbest, laziest comment I have ever read. Holy hell
Nah, there's some others in this thread that are way dumber 😉.
This is the dumbest, most useless thing ever. How about someone focuses on the idiotic ticket process that is nothing but a bullshit scam?
Some people only care about themselves. Yeah, the ticket process is a major issue, click a few buttons. Real difficult.
Get real. Boycotting things for a few minutes doesn't come close to moving the needle. Meanwhile PJ and TM are in bed together completely raping the fan base and they want to play this holier than thou card? So lame.
To be clear, you are saying don’t use your time to draw attention to one thing that is bad, use your time and attention on another thing that is bad?
To be even clearer, he is saying: don't use your time to draw attention to major, systemic problems that threaten the very future of the country and our freedoms within it; instead, use your time and attention on a system that people use to access entertainment products.*
* A system that, whatever its flaws, still manages to ensure that thousands of the best seats in every arena are set aside for the band's fan club members-- a fact that completely undermines his assertion that "every action [Pearl Jam] took was to help monopolize the system and cater to the bots and scalpers."
Cool fake story. Let me know when Target and Amazon go under next week. You know, Target. The store PJ partnered with? I'll wait here.
BTW, the system does nothing for the 10c members other than put them in a corner where they are threatened if they sell their tickets above face value. Instead, something comes up and they have to sell, but no other fans are allowed to get them at face value. Nope, the bots are pushed to the front of the line and within seconds, resell them for up to 10x face value while your band does..................absolutely nothing about it. Those are facts. So, anyway, make sure you use cash when you pay $1200 for a nosebleed seat to Raleigh. That'll show em.
See my post above. "Does nothing for the 10c members"? Au contraire. The system gave me, as a Ten Club member, the opportunity to purchase outstanding face-value tickets to as many shows as I wished-- and, in fact, I got those tickets. I would never have been able to attend ten Pearl Jam shows in six cities in two countries for under $2,000 if it had not been for the Ten Club lottery (or certainly not without a lot more effort required and a lot more uncertainty).
What fake story are you referring to? You said something that is demonstrably false, that "every action [Pearl Jam took] was to help monopolize the system and cater to the bots and scalpers." Thousands of fan club tickets are purchased for every show, most of which are excellent. Pearl Jam took actions to make that possible. If you are so convinced that the band is as corrupt as you say it is, why are you paying to belong to this fan club? You're painting yourself as quite a sucker.
You know who got a much, much better opportunity? The bots and the scalpers. You have to be slow to not see the b.s. that is currently happening. You keep focusing on the TENS of people who ORIGINALLY get an opportunity to get tickets. However, you fail to see anything past that. The system is set up for the bots and scalpers to spike the price point and fuck over the fan base. Stop boot licking and be honest for once. Yay, you got tickets to a show. Awesome. The rest of the arena was monopolized and the fan base was fucked over.
Comments
* A system that, whatever its flaws, still manages to ensure that thousands of the best seats in every arena are set aside for the band's fan club members-- a fact that completely undermines his assertion that "every action [Pearl Jam] took was to help monopolize the system and cater to the bots and scalpers."
BTW, the system does nothing for the 10c members other than put them in a corner where they are threatened if they sell their tickets above face value. Instead, something comes up and they have to sell, but no other fans are allowed to get them at face value. Nope, the bots are pushed to the front of the line and within seconds, resell them for up to 10x face value while your band does..................absolutely nothing about it. Those are facts. So, anyway, make sure you use cash when you pay $1200 for a nosebleed seat to Raleigh. That'll show em.
Yeah, I suppose. It just seems odd to me that Pearl Jam fans would fit that group, but then I've seen the same with bands like Jello Biafra's fans. Many stand with his perspective on things, but a many also seem to hate the things he stands up for. Makes no sense to me.
I wouldn't assume all the things the band does fit in the same bag. This one was a good call.
TM: We’ll give you more fan club seats than other bands are normally allocated. We’ll also agree to have resale prices locked (aside from NY and CO). (Yielding TM less revenue on resale percentage fees.). However, you need to agree to let us sell a portion as premium ticket pricing.
Mansfield '08
Hartford '10
Worcester, Hartford '13
Global Citizen, NY '15
I'm well aware of when this lp was available. The point so you can understand was that it was alright for the band to make a profit by forcing their fans to Target to buy an exclusive item but now they are telling the fans to boycott Target after they have made their money.
Sounds pretty hypocritical to me!
9/02/18 Boston, 9/04/18 Boston, 9/11/22 New York, 9/16/22 Nashville, 9/22/22 Denver, 8/31/23, St. Paul, 9/2/23 St. Paul, 9/18/23 Austin, 9/19/23 Austin
It is not true anymore. 10C gets GA but after that, the seats are nowhere near as good as they used to be. I do think the percentage of tickets given to the 10C is above average, but the seat locations are not as good as they used to be. At least that is my experience.
The band wants to tour and negotiates the production rights to LiveNation who then own the tour. The venue, having signed on with Ticketmaster, facilitates the production. Management negotiates the band’s fee with LiveNation and stipulates fan club access to a certain percentage of the house. LiveNation agrees to the band’s fee and stipulates premium ticket prices for a certain percentage of the venue. With no public on sale management can go ahead and request a larger fan club allocation and with no public on sale LiveNation can enjoy premium sales from the get go. The band can earn a set fee for playing a smaller run and take home a higher percentage by not shouldering the overhead. The band dictates what’s best for them and management works on behalf of the band to successfully execute their goals.
"Me knowing the truth, I can not concur."
1996: Toronto - 1998: Chicago, Montreal, Barrie - 2000: Montreal, Toronto - 2002: Seattle X2 (Key Arena) - 2003: Cleveland, Buffalo, Toronto, Montreal, Seattle (Benaroya Hall) - 2004: Reading, Toledo, Grand Rapids - 2005: Kitchener, London, Hamilton, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto, Quebec City - 2006: Toronto X2, Albany, Hartford, Grand Rapids, Cleveland - 2007: Chicago (Vic Theatre) - 2008: NYC X2, Hartford, Mansfield X2 - 2009: Toronto, Chicago X2, Seattle X2, Philadelphia X4 - 2010: Columbus, Noblesville, Cleveland, Buffalo, Hartford - 2011: Montreal, Toronto X2, Ottawa, Hamilton - 2012: Missoula - 2013: London, Chicago, Buffalo, Hartford - 2014: Detroit, Moline - 2015: NYC (Global Citizen Festival) - 2016: Greenville, Toronto X2, Chicago 1 - 2017: Brooklyn (RRHOF Induction) - 2018: Chicago 1, Boston 1 - 2022: Fresno, Ottawa, Hamilton, Toronto, NYC, Camden - 2023: St. Paul X2, Austin X2 - 2024: Vancouver X2, Portland, Sacramento, Missoula, Noblesville, Philadelphia X2, Baltimore - 2025: Hollywood X2, Atlanta 2, Nashville X2, Pittsburgh X2
Red Rocks doesnt use TM
Plenty of baseball stadiums dont use TM
Lots of college arenas and stadiums don't use TM
Etc etc
9/02/18 Boston, 9/04/18 Boston, 9/11/22 New York, 9/16/22 Nashville, 9/22/22 Denver, 8/31/23, St. Paul, 9/2/23 St. Paul, 9/18/23 Austin, 9/19/23 Austin
Mansfield '08
Hartford '10
Worcester, Hartford '13
Global Citizen, NY '15
What fake story are you referring to? You said something that is demonstrably false, that "every action [Pearl Jam took] was to help monopolize the system and cater to the bots and scalpers." Thousands of fan club tickets are purchased for every show, most of which are excellent. Pearl Jam took actions to make that possible. If you are so convinced that the band is as corrupt as you say it is, why are you paying to belong to this fan club? You're painting yourself as quite a sucker.
Take care.
1992- Lollapalooza, Irvine, California
Nothing since then. I suck.2016- Fenway Park, Boston - Both glorious nights
2022- Oakland Night 2
2024 Sacramento, CA
Yeah maybe, but not in the northeast. GA is great if that is want you want. Maybe you have a five digit number and they stick you in the back of the floor? Seats at the back of the floor are not the best seats in the house and those were assigned more than usual from what I could tell. All I know is my seats have been farther back than prior tours. I was put in the 200s for MSG, far worse than prior years when I would get those same great side seats you mention. They may get a good allotment of tickets, but they are spread out more so TM can sell premiums. I am not wrong.
Also, The current "king" of do as I say, not as I do is the sitting president, but do go on. Are you part of the new USSR (United States Sympathizers of Russia)?