Looking forward to the imminent closure of this thread 🙄
It shouldn’t close…as long as the discourse remains civil. See my previous post where I simply laid out my opinions. And now I welcome any other thoughts even if they differ from my so we can have a spirited conversation or even just ponder what others have to say.
now if something like that is a no go here, I’d say the guidelines are ironically contrary to some of this band’s most foundational beliefs.
They're enjoying their biggest hit in 18 years. They're doing something right.
The music is the hit. It sells itself. A completely separate idea from what I'm addressing, which is a deliberate marketing strategy for the record.
Don't conflate the two - distinct concepts.
Thanks for educating me about the music business.
I expressed an opinion about the way the record is being promoted (lack of clear strategy in my view). You diverted and made a comment about DM’s success (I assume) on charts (ha) so far.
These are separate concepts, so it’s not an education about the music biz you may need, but rather, an education in staying on topic. Or, you can read my opinion, disagree, and move on.
Another group think foot soldier in this message board who just can’t stand an alternate opinion.
They released Dark Matter.
They did the visual dark matter finder.
A vinyl single for Dark Matter.
Several clips on march madness and nhl tv.
They have 12 variants of the record, based on regions for Record Store Day. In addition to several regular variants now available in the store, and the original record store day version.
They have a one night only showing of the album in theaters just before the album drops.
They released Running.
They have had several listening parties.
Oh, and they have a world tour with more shows than any recent tour set up for May-September.
Radio has been playing the 2 songs that are out.
What exactly are they leaving out?
And it’s still 3-4 weeks away from being released.
So a lot of this in my opinion is gimmicky re tread.
12 variants of the same record? Why?
radio playing the two songs - has nothing to do with their promotional activities.
People buy “singles”? Why?
I think you get where I’m headed. This is all extremely old school and very gimmicky, not to mention expensive haha. Again maybe the bulk of the promotion will come after the release. That’s fine I suppose. But as long as your realize there is no real effort involved in almost all of that line item list you spelled out. Again it’s mostly re tread for profit and hey, I’m all in favor of capitalism so if folks are willing to bite is see why they’re doing it!
just wondering out loud (is that still acceptable?) whether there will be more original substance to come. Examples would be:
more snippets from rest of album (what happened to the DM site?)
vignettes from band members about making the record (from official sources not media)
is there a DM video like with DoTC?
Etc, etc
it’s ok to wonder and ask questions.
Fair enough, but let me ask this a different way?
What would you do that is more modern? PJ is old school, yeah, but I mean, the dark matter observer isnt old school. Variants for regional albums arent really old school. That Stone interview was pretty in-depth where he talked about almost every song.
I didnt expect any real new snippets from the album, but we already got 2 full releases (DM and Running) and heard official snippets of Something Special and one other one(Possibly a hidden track or opening sound?)
I expect that some of those things you are talking about will also happen, ie, videos and visualizers....probably once the movie has played, so likely just prior to or after the album release.
I like singles, btw. I like the sound of 45's over 33's, typically. And vinyl collecting is a thing.
They never really did a lot of press or promoting, other than typical channels, so I dont expect them to hit the Today show or 60 Minutes. I would expect maybe one TV appearance on some late night show, but in the age of the internet, I think they are doing things well enough to promote the album, without blowing a budget where it would not recoup. Albums sales are pretty flat, all things considered, in this age of streaming, so vinyl is what makes the money and enhanced CD's maybe a bit.
They're enjoying their biggest hit in 18 years. They're doing something right.
The music is the hit. It sells itself. A completely separate idea from what I'm addressing, which is a deliberate marketing strategy for the record.
Don't conflate the two - distinct concepts.
Thanks for educating me about the music business.
I expressed an opinion about the way the record is being promoted (lack of clear strategy in my view). You diverted and made a comment about DM’s success (I assume) on charts (ha) so far.
These are separate concepts, so it’s not an education about the music biz you may need, but rather, an education in staying on topic. Or, you can read my opinion, disagree, and move on.
Another group think foot soldier in this message board who just can’t stand an alternate opinion.
They released Dark Matter.
They did the visual dark matter finder.
A vinyl single for Dark Matter.
Several clips on march madness and nhl tv.
They have 12 variants of the record, based on regions for Record Store Day. In addition to several regular variants now available in the store, and the original record store day version.
They have a one night only showing of the album in theaters just before the album drops.
They released Running.
They have had several listening parties.
Oh, and they have a world tour with more shows than any recent tour set up for May-September.
Radio has been playing the 2 songs that are out.
What exactly are they leaving out?
And it’s still 3-4 weeks away from being released.
So a lot of this in my opinion is gimmicky re tread.
12 variants of the same record? Why?
radio playing the two songs - has nothing to do with their promotional activities.
People buy “singles”? Why?
I think you get where I’m headed. This is all extremely old school and very gimmicky, not to mention expensive haha. Again maybe the bulk of the promotion will come after the release. That’s fine I suppose. But as long as your realize there is no real effort involved in almost all of that line item list you spelled out. Again it’s mostly re tread for profit and hey, I’m all in favor of capitalism so if folks are willing to bite is see why they’re doing it!
just wondering out loud (is that still acceptable?) whether there will be more original substance to come. Examples would be:
more snippets from rest of album (what happened to the DM site?)
vignettes from band members about making the record (from official sources not media)
is there a DM video like with DoTC?
Etc, etc
it’s ok to wonder and ask questions.
I hope there’s more video stuff, music video and vignettes, not sure those are that original as they’ve regularly done those things for previous albums. I’m all for more PJ video footage. I’m also ok with what they’ve done to promote the record thus far.
To say that to date, what's been done has required no real effort, is a bit disingenuous don't you think? 2 singles releases, deals with NHL and March Madness, podcast interviews, private listening sessions, a custom mobile app, movie theatre release schedule... no real effort? Sorry, I don't buy it.
To say that to date, what's been done has required no real effort, is a bit disingenuous don't you think? 2 singles releases, deals with NHL and March Madness, podcast interviews, private listening sessions, a custom mobile app, movie theatre release schedule... no real effort? Sorry, I don't buy it.
So yeah I don’t really see much effort there. What’s required to have cbs and the networks that carry nhl games play a few snippets here and there? A quick phone call and a couple signatures? I mean aside from 20 seconds of something special in one….one March madness promo, we’ve only heard/seen music that’s already released. So then it’s just a legal thing for the networks to get permission to use the songs. I promise you the sausage making is way less impressive once you see it from the inside.
Podcast interviews : Jeff and Stone. Who else? Stone’s with Pinfield was insanely underwhelming as I have noted (since I actually listened to it). Jeff’s was good. Stone’s interview with SPIN was maybe the single best piece of promotion yet. Loved that read! Btw no blame to the guys here so we are clear. We haven’t heard from Mike, Matt, or Ed via any widely available channel.
Listening Parties: I don’t know. I kind of see these as a little elitist for my taste. I really think the PJ of old would have absolutely admonished bands for something like this. I know Ed has fun with it and hey that’s cool, but it smacks of self indulgence. Since there are many, many die hards who’ve given blood sweat and tears to this band for 30 years or more who would never have a chance to attend something like this, maybe something more accessible would be preferable?
Actually, I like the early chance to hear the album through ONE (or two) times through the theatrical release. I think the timing is completely wrong. Do that a few weeks out (like now) instead of the listening parties. Meanwhile, you have the guys on multiple podcasts, making the rounds, and building the wave of hype slowly.
Let me also add that 12 variants of vinyl is ridiculous in a way. How many PJ fans buy records, as a %? 2-3% MAYBE!
Now we learn of these variants a month after the handful of versions originally went up for sale? It seems like a $ grab. I mean come on. Aside from the odd collector who just wants these things lying around, who is buying multiple copies? I went out of my comfort zone to BUY even one copy of the record bc I can just listen to my paid streaming service haha.
Bottom line I guess is that what they’ve done so far has very very narrow appeal in most cases.
I kind of liked calling a number on my cell phone through Verizon to get a clip of a new backspacer tune!!
It is kind of odd to set that all up just to give us a sneak peak at a song that was coming out shortly anyway. I am sure they have more planned with it but it really would have worked better with it happening more consecutively.
It is kind of odd to set that all up just to give us a sneak peak at a song that was coming out shortly anyway. I am sure they have more planned with it but it really would have worked better with it happening more consecutively.
Spot. On. Exactly.
The whole roll out has been a bit odd and underwhelming.
To say that to date, what's been done has required no real effort, is a bit disingenuous don't you think? 2 singles releases, deals with NHL and March Madness, podcast interviews, private listening sessions, a custom mobile app, movie theatre release schedule... no real effort? Sorry, I don't buy it.
So yeah I don’t really see much effort there. What’s required to have cbs and the networks that carry nhl games play a few snippets here and there? A quick phone call and a couple signatures? I mean aside from 20 seconds of something special in one….one March madness promo, we’ve only heard/seen music that’s already released. So then it’s just a legal thing for the networks to get permission to use the songs. I promise you the sausage making is way less impressive once you see it from the inside.
Podcast interviews : Jeff and Stone. Who else? Stone’s with Pinfield was insanely underwhelming as I have noted (since I actually listened to it). Jeff’s was good. Stone’s interview with SPIN was maybe the single best piece of promotion yet. Loved that read! Btw no blame to the guys here so we are clear. We haven’t heard from Mike, Matt, or Ed via any widely available channel.
Listening Parties: I don’t know. I kind of see these as a little elitist for my taste. I really think the PJ of old would have absolutely admonished bands for something like this. I know Ed has fun with it and hey that’s cool, but it smacks of self indulgence. Since there are many, many die hards who’ve given blood sweat and tears to this band for 30 years or more who would never have a chance to attend something like this, maybe something more accessible would be preferable?
Actually, I like the early chance to hear the album through ONE (or two) times through the theatrical release. I think the timing is completely wrong. Do that a few weeks out (like now) instead of the listening parties. Meanwhile, you have the guys on multiple podcasts, making the rounds, and building the wave of hype slowly.
Let me also add that 12 variants of vinyl is ridiculous in a way. How many PJ fans buy records, as a %? 2-3% MAYBE!
Now we learn of these variants a month after the handful of versions originally went up for sale? It seems like a $ grab. I mean come on. Aside from the odd collector who just wants these things lying around, who is buying multiple copies? I went out of my comfort zone to BUY even one copy of the record bc I can just listen to my paid streaming service haha.
Bottom line I guess is that what they’ve done so far has very very narrow appeal in most cases.
I kind of liked calling a number on my cell phone through Verizon to get a clip of a new backspacer tune!!
The % of PJ fans buying vinyl is SIGNIFICANTLY higher than 3%, especially among the 10C. And a whole lot of people here are buying all 12.
The part where the band makes “effort” is in composing & recording the music. They aren’t marketing execs.
I’m thinking the reason the theatrical event is the 16th rather than, say, now, is to delay the album leaking for as long as possible, by the week of release it will most likely be out there either way..
It is kind of odd to set that all up just to give us a sneak peak at a song that was coming out shortly anyway. I am sure they have more planned with it but it really would have worked better with it happening more consecutively.
The site said “ check back for more clips”. So I’m expecting something soon.
1996.....Toronto 2005.....Hamilton 2011.....Toronto N1, Toronto N2, Hamilton 2013.....London, Buffalo 2014.....Detroit 2016.....Toronto N1 Toronto N2, Boston N1, Boston N2, Chicago N1 2018.....Seattle N1, Seattle N2 2022.....San Diego, Los Angeles N1, Los Angeles N2, Phoenix, Oakland N1, Oakland N2, Quebec City, Ottawa, Hamilton, Toronto 2023.....Fort Worth N1, Fort Worth N2, Austin N1, Austin N2 2024.....????
From my perspective if the band releases music and tours, I’m happy. It’s up to them how they promote the album to generate interest and increase sales. That said, the interviews around the time of the Gigaton release were great!
2010: London 2012: Manchester I, Manchester II, Manchester (EV) 2014: Milan, Leeds, Milton Keynes 2017: London II (EV) 2018: Amsterdam I, London I, Prague, London II 2019: London (EV) 2022: London I, London II, Budapest, Krakow, Amsterdam
To say that to date, what's been done has required no real effort, is a bit disingenuous don't you think? 2 singles releases, deals with NHL and March Madness, podcast interviews, private listening sessions, a custom mobile app, movie theatre release schedule... no real effort? Sorry, I don't buy it.
So yeah I don’t really see much effort there. What’s required to have cbs and the networks that carry nhl games play a few snippets here and there? A quick phone call and a couple signatures? I mean aside from 20 seconds of something special in one….one March madness promo, we’ve only heard/seen music that’s already released. So then it’s just a legal thing for the networks to get permission to use the songs. I promise you the sausage making is way less impressive once you see it from the inside.
Podcast interviews : Jeff and Stone. Who else? Stone’s with Pinfield was insanely underwhelming as I have noted (since I actually listened to it). Jeff’s was good. Stone’s interview with SPIN was maybe the single best piece of promotion yet. Loved that read! Btw no blame to the guys here so we are clear. We haven’t heard from Mike, Matt, or Ed via any widely available channel.
Listening Parties: I don’t know. I kind of see these as a little elitist for my taste. I really think the PJ of old would have absolutely admonished bands for something like this. I know Ed has fun with it and hey that’s cool, but it smacks of self indulgence. Since there are many, many die hards who’ve given blood sweat and tears to this band for 30 years or more who would never have a chance to attend something like this, maybe something more accessible would be preferable?
Actually, I like the early chance to hear the album through ONE (or two) times through the theatrical release. I think the timing is completely wrong. Do that a few weeks out (like now) instead of the listening parties. Meanwhile, you have the guys on multiple podcasts, making the rounds, and building the wave of hype slowly.
Let me also add that 12 variants of vinyl is ridiculous in a way. How many PJ fans buy records, as a %? 2-3% MAYBE!
Now we learn of these variants a month after the handful of versions originally went up for sale? It seems like a $ grab. I mean come on. Aside from the odd collector who just wants these things lying around, who is buying multiple copies? I went out of my comfort zone to BUY even one copy of the record bc I can just listen to my paid streaming service haha.
Bottom line I guess is that what they’ve done so far has very very narrow appeal in most cases.
I kind of liked calling a number on my cell phone through Verizon to get a clip of a new backspacer tune!!
The % of PJ fans buying vinyl is SIGNIFICANTLY higher than 3%, especially among the 10C. And a whole lot of people here are buying all 12.
The part where the band makes “effort” is in composing & recording the music. They aren’t marketing execs.
I’m thinking the reason the theatrical event is the 16th rather than, say, now, is to delay the album leaking for as long as possible, by the week of release it will most likely be out there either way..
Sure, if you narrow to 10c fans then obviously the % would be higher. But I’m talking all PJ fans (since they all have access to the vinyl variants or just the “normal” copies, in theory). I doubt it’s any more than 1-2% actually, of the wide audience. Also, I guess I’m just curious as to why one would buy 2,3,8, 12! Versions of the same record unless they were a SERIOUS collector (and these folks are prob a di minimus % ). Are people buying CDs too? Cassette tapes?
it’s always struck me as odd the PJ sells a CD still. The vinyl I get (and let’s be honest this is all driven by Ed’s fascination with it), so it doesn’t surprise me that they offer a couple variants to have some fun, but 12 sounds like a cash grab. Though, I doubt it will amount to much.
Hey - doesn’t black vinyl sound the best anyway? Pretty sure that’s been the standard for decades.
Like I said though, this will be my first vinyl purchase in 40 years of life. Making an exception for what could be the last record, but yeah I guess I don’t know anyone else going around buying records (in my peer group that is).
but hey - if you’re buying them all then enjoy it. Maybe there is some sort of Easter egg on each of them as a surprise?
To say that to date, what's been done has required no real effort, is a bit disingenuous don't you think? 2 singles releases, deals with NHL and March Madness, podcast interviews, private listening sessions, a custom mobile app, movie theatre release schedule... no real effort? Sorry, I don't buy it.
So yeah I don’t really see much effort there. What’s required to have cbs and the networks that carry nhl games play a few snippets here and there? A quick phone call and a couple signatures? I mean aside from 20 seconds of something special in one….one March madness promo, we’ve only heard/seen music that’s already released. So then it’s just a legal thing for the networks to get permission to use the songs. I promise you the sausage making is way less impressive once you see it from the inside.
Podcast interviews : Jeff and Stone. Who else? Stone’s with Pinfield was insanely underwhelming as I have noted (since I actually listened to it). Jeff’s was good. Stone’s interview with SPIN was maybe the single best piece of promotion yet. Loved that read! Btw no blame to the guys here so we are clear. We haven’t heard from Mike, Matt, or Ed via any widely available channel.
Listening Parties: I don’t know. I kind of see these as a little elitist for my taste. I really think the PJ of old would have absolutely admonished bands for something like this. I know Ed has fun with it and hey that’s cool, but it smacks of self indulgence. Since there are many, many die hards who’ve given blood sweat and tears to this band for 30 years or more who would never have a chance to attend something like this, maybe something more accessible would be preferable?
Actually, I like the early chance to hear the album through ONE (or two) times through the theatrical release. I think the timing is completely wrong. Do that a few weeks out (like now) instead of the listening parties. Meanwhile, you have the guys on multiple podcasts, making the rounds, and building the wave of hype slowly.
Let me also add that 12 variants of vinyl is ridiculous in a way. How many PJ fans buy records, as a %? 2-3% MAYBE!
Now we learn of these variants a month after the handful of versions originally went up for sale? It seems like a $ grab. I mean come on. Aside from the odd collector who just wants these things lying around, who is buying multiple copies? I went out of my comfort zone to BUY even one copy of the record bc I can just listen to my paid streaming service haha.
Bottom line I guess is that what they’ve done so far has very very narrow appeal in most cases.
I kind of liked calling a number on my cell phone through Verizon to get a clip of a new backspacer tune!!
The % of PJ fans buying vinyl is SIGNIFICANTLY higher than 3%, especially among the 10C. And a whole lot of people here are buying all 12.
The part where the band makes “effort” is in composing & recording the music. They aren’t marketing execs.
I’m thinking the reason the theatrical event is the 16th rather than, say, now, is to delay the album leaking for as long as possible, by the week of release it will most likely be out there either way..
Sure, if you narrow to 10c fans then obviously the % would be higher. But I’m talking all PJ fans (since they all have access to the vinyl variants or just the “normal” copies, in theory). I doubt it’s any more than 1-2% actually, of the wide audience. Also, I guess I’m just curious as to why one would buy 2,3,8, 12! Versions of the same record unless they were a SERIOUS collector (and these folks are prob a di minimus % ). Are people buying CDs too? Cassette tapes?
it’s always struck me as odd the PJ sells a CD still. The vinyl I get (and let’s be honest this is all driven by Ed’s fascination with it), so it doesn’t surprise me that they offer a couple variants to have some fun, but 12 sounds like a cash grab. Though, I doubt it will amount to much.
Hey - doesn’t black vinyl sound the best anyway? Pretty sure that’s been the standard for decades.
Like I said though, this will be my first vinyl purchase in 40 years of life. Making an exception for what could be the last record, but yeah I guess I don’t know anyone else going around buying records (in my peer group that is).
but hey - if you’re buying them all then enjoy it. Maybe there is some sort of Easter egg on each of them as a surprise?
I would be sad if they didn’t sell a cd. I don’t have the room for massive amounts of vinyl (have some though!), and I like having a physical product with the art and liner notes. It’s also an excuse to support Warren, my local record store owner!
As for the multiple vinyls, I would probably pick one I liked, but I totally understand the collector aspect of it. I used to collect comics a lot, and they were all about multiple covers and variants.
To say that to date, what's been done has required no real effort, is a bit disingenuous don't you think? 2 singles releases, deals with NHL and March Madness, podcast interviews, private listening sessions, a custom mobile app, movie theatre release schedule... no real effort? Sorry, I don't buy it.
So yeah I don’t really see much effort there. What’s required to have cbs and the networks that carry nhl games play a few snippets here and there? A quick phone call and a couple signatures? I mean aside from 20 seconds of something special in one….one March madness promo, we’ve only heard/seen music that’s already released. So then it’s just a legal thing for the networks to get permission to use the songs. I promise you the sausage making is way less impressive once you see it from the inside.
Podcast interviews : Jeff and Stone. Who else? Stone’s with Pinfield was insanely underwhelming as I have noted (since I actually listened to it). Jeff’s was good. Stone’s interview with SPIN was maybe the single best piece of promotion yet. Loved that read! Btw no blame to the guys here so we are clear. We haven’t heard from Mike, Matt, or Ed via any widely available channel.
Listening Parties: I don’t know. I kind of see these as a little elitist for my taste. I really think the PJ of old would have absolutely admonished bands for something like this. I know Ed has fun with it and hey that’s cool, but it smacks of self indulgence. Since there are many, many die hards who’ve given blood sweat and tears to this band for 30 years or more who would never have a chance to attend something like this, maybe something more accessible would be preferable?
Actually, I like the early chance to hear the album through ONE (or two) times through the theatrical release. I think the timing is completely wrong. Do that a few weeks out (like now) instead of the listening parties. Meanwhile, you have the guys on multiple podcasts, making the rounds, and building the wave of hype slowly.
Let me also add that 12 variants of vinyl is ridiculous in a way. How many PJ fans buy records, as a %? 2-3% MAYBE!
Now we learn of these variants a month after the handful of versions originally went up for sale? It seems like a $ grab. I mean come on. Aside from the odd collector who just wants these things lying around, who is buying multiple copies? I went out of my comfort zone to BUY even one copy of the record bc I can just listen to my paid streaming service haha.
Bottom line I guess is that what they’ve done so far has very very narrow appeal in most cases.
I kind of liked calling a number on my cell phone through Verizon to get a clip of a new backspacer tune!!
The % of PJ fans buying vinyl is SIGNIFICANTLY higher than 3%, especially among the 10C. And a whole lot of people here are buying all 12.
The part where the band makes “effort” is in composing & recording the music. They aren’t marketing execs.
I’m thinking the reason the theatrical event is the 16th rather than, say, now, is to delay the album leaking for as long as possible, by the week of release it will most likely be out there either way..
Sure, if you narrow to 10c fans then obviously the % would be higher. But I’m talking all PJ fans (since they all have access to the vinyl variants or just the “normal” copies, in theory). I doubt it’s any more than 1-2% actually, of the wide audience. Also, I guess I’m just curious as to why one would buy 2,3,8, 12! Versions of the same record unless they were a SERIOUS collector (and these folks are prob a di minimus % ). Are people buying CDs too? Cassette tapes?
it’s always struck me as odd the PJ sells a CD still. The vinyl I get (and let’s be honest this is all driven by Ed’s fascination with it), so it doesn’t surprise me that they offer a couple variants to have some fun, but 12 sounds like a cash grab. Though, I doubt it will amount to much.
Hey - doesn’t black vinyl sound the best anyway? Pretty sure that’s been the standard for decades.
Like I said though, this will be my first vinyl purchase in 40 years of life. Making an exception for what could be the last record, but yeah I guess I don’t know anyone else going around buying records (in my peer group that is).
but hey - if you’re buying them all then enjoy it. Maybe there is some sort of Easter egg on each of them as a surprise?
They better keep selling CDs! I still have a CD player in my car. It's more that I want to have a physical copy of my own. Digital download is fine, but not the same.
As for the variants, they are pretty limited quantities, so probably within the range of "serious PJ vinyl collector" tolerances. I think getting multiple variants is beyond being a fan of the music and about collecting. Gotta get the complete set! It's not my jam, but to each their own. Given how well variants sell just when they are 10C exclusives (and the troubles people are having pre-ordering some of these), I think the market for this type of thing is clearly there. I do think it's gimmicky, but again, it's not my jam. It is for many other people.
The cassette thing is the really wild one to me. I know it's not just Pearl Jam; it's been a growing trend for years now. My best guess is that it's a nostalgia thing, which I DO get, but I'm not seeking out a cassette player anytime soon, while I'm pretty sure I will always have a CD player and a turntable. Frankly, I think they should lean even more into the nostalgia and start releasing music on 8-track and concert films on LaserDisc and VHS.
"I'm a lucky man, to count on both hands the [shows I've done]. Some folks just have one, others they got none..."
Hartford 10.02.96 | Mansfield 2 09.16.98 | Mansfield 1 08.29.00 |
Mansfield 1 07.02.03 | Mansfield 3 07.11.03 | Boston 2 05.25.06 | Tampa 04.11.16 | Fenway 1 08.05.16 | Fenway 2 08.07.16 | Fenway 1 09.02.18 | Fenway 2 09.04.18 | Baltimore 03.28.20 | Hamilton 09.06.22 | Toronto 09.08.22 | Nashville 09.16.22 | St Louis 09.18.22
"He made the deal with the devil, we get to play with him. He goes to hell, of course. We're going to heaven."
To say that to date, what's been done has required no real effort, is a bit disingenuous don't you think? 2 singles releases, deals with NHL and March Madness, podcast interviews, private listening sessions, a custom mobile app, movie theatre release schedule... no real effort? Sorry, I don't buy it.
So yeah I don’t really see much effort there. What’s required to have cbs and the networks that carry nhl games play a few snippets here and there? A quick phone call and a couple signatures? I mean aside from 20 seconds of something special in one….one March madness promo, we’ve only heard/seen music that’s already released. So then it’s just a legal thing for the networks to get permission to use the songs. I promise you the sausage making is way less impressive once you see it from the inside.
Podcast interviews : Jeff and Stone. Who else? Stone’s with Pinfield was insanely underwhelming as I have noted (since I actually listened to it). Jeff’s was good. Stone’s interview with SPIN was maybe the single best piece of promotion yet. Loved that read! Btw no blame to the guys here so we are clear. We haven’t heard from Mike, Matt, or Ed via any widely available channel.
Listening Parties: I don’t know. I kind of see these as a little elitist for my taste. I really think the PJ of old would have absolutely admonished bands for something like this. I know Ed has fun with it and hey that’s cool, but it smacks of self indulgence. Since there are many, many die hards who’ve given blood sweat and tears to this band for 30 years or more who would never have a chance to attend something like this, maybe something more accessible would be preferable?
Actually, I like the early chance to hear the album through ONE (or two) times through the theatrical release. I think the timing is completely wrong. Do that a few weeks out (like now) instead of the listening parties. Meanwhile, you have the guys on multiple podcasts, making the rounds, and building the wave of hype slowly.
Let me also add that 12 variants of vinyl is ridiculous in a way. How many PJ fans buy records, as a %? 2-3% MAYBE!
Now we learn of these variants a month after the handful of versions originally went up for sale? It seems like a $ grab. I mean come on. Aside from the odd collector who just wants these things lying around, who is buying multiple copies? I went out of my comfort zone to BUY even one copy of the record bc I can just listen to my paid streaming service haha.
Bottom line I guess is that what they’ve done so far has very very narrow appeal in most cases.
I kind of liked calling a number on my cell phone through Verizon to get a clip of a new backspacer tune!!
The % of PJ fans buying vinyl is SIGNIFICANTLY higher than 3%, especially among the 10C. And a whole lot of people here are buying all 12.
The part where the band makes “effort” is in composing & recording the music. They aren’t marketing execs.
I’m thinking the reason the theatrical event is the 16th rather than, say, now, is to delay the album leaking for as long as possible, by the week of release it will most likely be out there either way..
Sure, if you narrow to 10c fans then obviously the % would be higher. But I’m talking all PJ fans (since they all have access to the vinyl variants or just the “normal” copies, in theory). I doubt it’s any more than 1-2% actually, of the wide audience. Also, I guess I’m just curious as to why one would buy 2,3,8, 12! Versions of the same record unless they were a SERIOUS collector (and these folks are prob a di minimus % ). Are people buying CDs too? Cassette tapes?
it’s always struck me as odd the PJ sells a CD still. The vinyl I get (and let’s be honest this is all driven by Ed’s fascination with it), so it doesn’t surprise me that they offer a couple variants to have some fun, but 12 sounds like a cash grab. Though, I doubt it will amount to much.
Hey - doesn’t black vinyl sound the best anyway? Pretty sure that’s been the standard for decades.
Like I said though, this will be my first vinyl purchase in 40 years of life. Making an exception for what could be the last record, but yeah I guess I don’t know anyone else going around buying records (in my peer group that is).
but hey - if you’re buying them all then enjoy it. Maybe there is some sort of Easter egg on each of them as a surprise?
They better keep selling CDs! I still have a CD player in my car. It's more that I want to have a physical copy of my own. Digital download is fine, but not the same.
As for the variants, they are pretty limited quantities, so probably within the range of "serious PJ vinyl collector" tolerances. I think getting multiple variants is beyond being a fan of the music and about collecting. Gotta get the complete set! It's not my jam, but to each their own. Given how well variants sell just when they are 10C exclusives (and the troubles people are having pre-ordering some of these), I think the market for this type of thing is clearly there. I do think it's gimmicky, but again, it's not my jam. It is for many other people.
The cassette thing is the really wild one to me. I know it's not just Pearl Jam; it's been a growing trend for years now. My best guess is that it's a nostalgia thing, which I DO get, but I'm not seeking out a cassette player anytime soon, while I'm pretty sure I will always have a CD player and a turntable. Frankly, I think they should lean even more into the nostalgia and start releasing music on 8-track and concert films on LaserDisc and VHS.
The cassette comeback was actually caused by Adele… sorta. Or her label at least. When her album was occupying multiple vinyl pressing plants in ‘21 (and impacting early ‘22 releases too) a lot of punk and indie bands started doing tapes to fill that void because the wait to press anyone else’s vinyl was so long.
i still buy a cd of every PJ studio album, because I always have and I always like the packaging but PJ is the only band I still do that for
To say that to date, what's been done has required no real effort, is a bit disingenuous don't you think? 2 singles releases, deals with NHL and March Madness, podcast interviews, private listening sessions, a custom mobile app, movie theatre release schedule... no real effort? Sorry, I don't buy it.
So yeah I don’t really see much effort there. What’s required to have cbs and the networks that carry nhl games play a few snippets here and there? A quick phone call and a couple signatures? I mean aside from 20 seconds of something special in one….one March madness promo, we’ve only heard/seen music that’s already released. So then it’s just a legal thing for the networks to get permission to use the songs. I promise you the sausage making is way less impressive once you see it from the inside.
Podcast interviews : Jeff and Stone. Who else? Stone’s with Pinfield was insanely underwhelming as I have noted (since I actually listened to it). Jeff’s was good. Stone’s interview with SPIN was maybe the single best piece of promotion yet. Loved that read! Btw no blame to the guys here so we are clear. We haven’t heard from Mike, Matt, or Ed via any widely available channel.
Listening Parties: I don’t know. I kind of see these as a little elitist for my taste. I really think the PJ of old would have absolutely admonished bands for something like this. I know Ed has fun with it and hey that’s cool, but it smacks of self indulgence. Since there are many, many die hards who’ve given blood sweat and tears to this band for 30 years or more who would never have a chance to attend something like this, maybe something more accessible would be preferable?
Actually, I like the early chance to hear the album through ONE (or two) times through the theatrical release. I think the timing is completely wrong. Do that a few weeks out (like now) instead of the listening parties. Meanwhile, you have the guys on multiple podcasts, making the rounds, and building the wave of hype slowly.
Let me also add that 12 variants of vinyl is ridiculous in a way. How many PJ fans buy records, as a %? 2-3% MAYBE!
Now we learn of these variants a month after the handful of versions originally went up for sale? It seems like a $ grab. I mean come on. Aside from the odd collector who just wants these things lying around, who is buying multiple copies? I went out of my comfort zone to BUY even one copy of the record bc I can just listen to my paid streaming service haha.
Bottom line I guess is that what they’ve done so far has very very narrow appeal in most cases.
I kind of liked calling a number on my cell phone through Verizon to get a clip of a new backspacer tune!!
The % of PJ fans buying vinyl is SIGNIFICANTLY higher than 3%, especially among the 10C. And a whole lot of people here are buying all 12.
The part where the band makes “effort” is in composing & recording the music. They aren’t marketing execs.
I’m thinking the reason the theatrical event is the 16th rather than, say, now, is to delay the album leaking for as long as possible, by the week of release it will most likely be out there either way..
Sure, if you narrow to 10c fans then obviously the % would be higher. But I’m talking all PJ fans (since they all have access to the vinyl variants or just the “normal” copies, in theory). I doubt it’s any more than 1-2% actually, of the wide audience. Also, I guess I’m just curious as to why one would buy 2,3,8, 12! Versions of the same record unless they were a SERIOUS collector (and these folks are prob a di minimus % ). Are people buying CDs too? Cassette tapes?
it’s always struck me as odd the PJ sells a CD still. The vinyl I get (and let’s be honest this is all driven by Ed’s fascination with it), so it doesn’t surprise me that they offer a couple variants to have some fun, but 12 sounds like a cash grab. Though, I doubt it will amount to much.
Hey - doesn’t black vinyl sound the best anyway? Pretty sure that’s been the standard for decades.
Like I said though, this will be my first vinyl purchase in 40 years of life. Making an exception for what could be the last record, but yeah I guess I don’t know anyone else going around buying records (in my peer group that is).
but hey - if you’re buying them all then enjoy it. Maybe there is some sort of Easter egg on each of them as a surprise?
They better keep selling CDs! I still have a CD player in my car. It's more that I want to have a physical copy of my own. Digital download is fine, but not the same.
As for the variants, they are pretty limited quantities, so probably within the range of "serious PJ vinyl collector" tolerances. I think getting multiple variants is beyond being a fan of the music and about collecting. Gotta get the complete set! It's not my jam, but to each their own. Given how well variants sell just when they are 10C exclusives (and the troubles people are having pre-ordering some of these), I think the market for this type of thing is clearly there. I do think it's gimmicky, but again, it's not my jam. It is for many other people.
The cassette thing is the really wild one to me. I know it's not just Pearl Jam; it's been a growing trend for years now. My best guess is that it's a nostalgia thing, which I DO get, but I'm not seeking out a cassette player anytime soon, while I'm pretty sure I will always have a CD player and a turntable. Frankly, I think they should lean even more into the nostalgia and start releasing music on 8-track and concert films on LaserDisc and VHS.
The cassette comeback was actually caused by Adele… sorta. Or her label at least. When her album was occupying multiple vinyl pressing plants in ‘21 (and impacting early ‘22 releases too) a lot of punk and indie bands started doing tapes to fill that void because the wait to press anyone else’s vinyl was so long
I actually thought it was earlier than that, but '21 feels like it was about 10 years ago, so...
"I'm a lucky man, to count on both hands the [shows I've done]. Some folks just have one, others they got none..."
Hartford 10.02.96 | Mansfield 2 09.16.98 | Mansfield 1 08.29.00 |
Mansfield 1 07.02.03 | Mansfield 3 07.11.03 | Boston 2 05.25.06 | Tampa 04.11.16 | Fenway 1 08.05.16 | Fenway 2 08.07.16 | Fenway 1 09.02.18 | Fenway 2 09.04.18 | Baltimore 03.28.20 | Hamilton 09.06.22 | Toronto 09.08.22 | Nashville 09.16.22 | St Louis 09.18.22
"He made the deal with the devil, we get to play with him. He goes to hell, of course. We're going to heaven."
You can get a kind of skewed view of the world from being in a club with a lot of people who are on the vinyl train. CD sales still account for nearly half of all physical album sales, and the total number of CDs sold in 2023 in the U.S. actually increased year-over-year from 2022. The CD is far from dead.
EDIT: And CDs are still the leading format in some other markets, like Japan.
You can get a kind of skewed view of the world from being in a club with a lot of people who are on the vinyl train. CD sales still account for nearly half of all physical album sales, and the total number of CDs sold in 2023 in the U.S. actually increased year-over-year from 2022. The CD is far from dead.
EDIT: And CDs are still the leading format in some other markets, like Japan.
Maybe the cd is far from dead in the context of physical medium sales (vinyl, cassette, cd). But, compare the sales #s to streams on various platforms (Spotify, Apple Music, YouTube, etc). I’d be truly shocked if sales of physical music accounts for any more than the smallest drop in the bucket you could imagine.
For instance…Taylor Swift’s most popular song on Spotify right now is approaching 2 Billion (yes billion) streams. It’s literally impossible for physical units of her music to represent anything meaningful relative to that #.
You can get a kind of skewed view of the world from being in a club with a lot of people who are on the vinyl train. CD sales still account for nearly half of all physical album sales, and the total number of CDs sold in 2023 in the U.S. actually increased year-over-year from 2022. The CD is far from dead.
EDIT: And CDs are still the leading format in some other markets, like Japan.
Maybe the cd is far from dead in the context of physical medium sales (vinyl, cassette, cd). But, compare the sales #s to streams on various platforms (Spotify, Apple Music, YouTube, etc). I’d be truly shocked if sales of physical music accounts for any more than the smallest drop in the bucket you could imagine.
For instance…Taylor Swift’s most popular song on Spotify right now is approaching 2 Billion (yes billion) streams. It’s literally impossible for physical units of her music to represent anything meaningful relative to that #.
But that’s counting plays, not purchases. If we could somehow count every time someone played Alive from a cd tape or record they only bought once it could absolutely be that many.
You can get a kind of skewed view of the world from being in a club with a lot of people who are on the vinyl train. CD sales still account for nearly half of all physical album sales, and the total number of CDs sold in 2023 in the U.S. actually increased year-over-year from 2022. The CD is far from dead.
EDIT: And CDs are still the leading format in some other markets, like Japan.
Maybe the cd is far from dead in the context of physical medium sales (vinyl, cassette, cd). But, compare the sales #s to streams on various platforms (Spotify, Apple Music, YouTube, etc). I’d be truly shocked if sales of physical music accounts for any more than the smallest drop in the bucket you could imagine.
For instance…Taylor Swift’s most popular song on Spotify right now is approaching 2 Billion (yes billion) streams. It’s literally impossible for physical units of her music to represent anything meaningful relative to that #.
Except that 1 album stream does not equal 1 album sale. Swift still sells millions of physical copies. Midnights sold ell over 1 million physical copies it's first week. It may not be the highest revenue stream, but it's certainly more than a "drop in the bucket".
"I'm a lucky man, to count on both hands the [shows I've done]. Some folks just have one, others they got none..."
Hartford 10.02.96 | Mansfield 2 09.16.98 | Mansfield 1 08.29.00 |
Mansfield 1 07.02.03 | Mansfield 3 07.11.03 | Boston 2 05.25.06 | Tampa 04.11.16 | Fenway 1 08.05.16 | Fenway 2 08.07.16 | Fenway 1 09.02.18 | Fenway 2 09.04.18 | Baltimore 03.28.20 | Hamilton 09.06.22 | Toronto 09.08.22 | Nashville 09.16.22 | St Louis 09.18.22
"He made the deal with the devil, we get to play with him. He goes to hell, of course. We're going to heaven."
You can get a kind of skewed view of the world from being in a club with a lot of people who are on the vinyl train. CD sales still account for nearly half of all physical album sales, and the total number of CDs sold in 2023 in the U.S. actually increased year-over-year from 2022. The CD is far from dead.
EDIT: And CDs are still the leading format in some other markets, like Japan.
Maybe the cd is far from dead in the context of physical medium sales (vinyl, cassette, cd). But, compare the sales #s to streams on various platforms (Spotify, Apple Music, YouTube, etc). I’d be truly shocked if sales of physical music accounts for any more than the smallest drop in the bucket you could imagine.
For instance…Taylor Swift’s most popular song on Spotify right now is approaching 2 Billion (yes billion) streams. It’s literally impossible for physical units of her music to represent anything meaningful relative to that #.
But that’s counting plays, not purchases. If we could somehow count every time someone played Alive from a cd tape or record they only bought once it could absolutely be that many.
Yes, this is one of the reasons why the Billboard 200 formula is broken. It purports to track all consumption, but it can't track consumption of physical media (or digital downloads) beyond the original sale. This skews the chart in favor of streaming and genres that are disproportionately streamed. (It also gives an album credit for the consumption of individual songs, something that it never attempted to do before. If Michael Jackson had a hit song that sold a bunch of 45s and got played on the radio all the time, none of that had any impact on the album chart. Now, if a pop artist has a big hit, streams of that song will be translated into sales-equivalents on the album chart even though that's not consumption of the album; it's consumption of the single. And there is also an arbitrariness, e.g., "Bohemian Rhapsody" is streamed a lot, and then they decide whether to credit its streams to A Night at the Opera or Greatest Hits or the soundtrack to Wayne's World or the soundtrack to Bohemian Rhapsody, even though the vast majority of its streams are not as part of any album.)
I listen to MP3 or other digital when on the go. When I want to listen to something really good, I usually pull out vinyl. That said, vinyl playing is somewhat of an effort. WHich is fun, but there are also times I just want to listen to the best quality without messing with a record. CD's are for that, and CD's are easily shareable.
I listen to MP3 or other digital when on the go. When I want to listen to something really good, I usually pull out vinyl. That said, vinyl playing is somewhat of an effort. WHich is fun, but there are also times I just want to listen to the best quality without messing with a record. CD's are for that, and CD's are easily shareable.
How is vinyl better than the best quality digital unless you want the auditory artifacts and the crackling etc?
I like Cds because I can listen to them in my work computer. Our network blocks streaming services and the building I work in has no cell signal, so unless I download a bunch of music to my phone to listen to offline, I am pretty limited.
I like Cds because I can listen to them in my work computer. Our network blocks streaming services and the building I work in has no cell signal, so unless I download a bunch of music to my phone to listen to offline, I am pretty limited.
Your company/office uses computers with CD drives?
I don't think I've seen such a thing since 2012. Weird.
I'm not sure I've held a CD in my hand since maybe 2010. I mean...you literally cannot buy cars with CD players (and it's been that way for a handful of years). I'm just so fascinated by the idea of people buying/using them.
Comments
now if something like that is a no go here, I’d say the guidelines are ironically contrary to some of this band’s most foundational beliefs.
cheers!
I hope not.
What would you do that is more modern? PJ is old school, yeah, but I mean, the dark matter observer isnt old school. Variants for regional albums arent really old school. That Stone interview was pretty in-depth where he talked about almost every song.
I didnt expect any real new snippets from the album, but we already got 2 full releases (DM and Running) and heard official snippets of Something Special and one other one(Possibly a hidden track or opening sound?)
I expect that some of those things you are talking about will also happen, ie, videos and visualizers....probably once the movie has played, so likely just prior to or after the album release.
I like singles, btw. I like the sound of 45's over 33's, typically. And vinyl collecting is a thing.
They never really did a lot of press or promoting, other than typical channels, so I dont expect them to hit the Today show or 60 Minutes. I would expect maybe one TV appearance on some late night show, but in the age of the internet, I think they are doing things well enough to promote the album, without blowing a budget where it would not recoup. Albums sales are pretty flat, all things considered, in this age of streaming, so vinyl is what makes the money and enhanced CD's maybe a bit.
Nuclear fission
2 singles releases, deals with NHL and March Madness, podcast interviews, private listening sessions, a custom mobile app, movie theatre release schedule... no real effort? Sorry, I don't buy it.
Stone’s with Pinfield was insanely underwhelming as I have noted (since I actually listened to it). Jeff’s was good. Stone’s interview with SPIN was maybe the single best piece of promotion yet. Loved that read! Btw no blame to the guys here so we are clear. We haven’t heard from Mike, Matt, or Ed via any widely available channel.
Listening Parties: I don’t know. I kind of see these as a little elitist for my taste. I really think the PJ of old would have absolutely admonished bands for something like this. I know Ed has fun with it and hey that’s cool, but it smacks of self indulgence. Since there are many, many die hards who’ve given blood sweat and tears to this band for 30 years or more who would never have a chance to attend something like this, maybe something more accessible would be preferable?
Actually, I like the early chance to hear the album through ONE (or two) times through the theatrical release. I think the timing is completely wrong. Do that a few weeks out (like now) instead of the listening parties. Meanwhile, you have the guys on multiple podcasts, making the rounds, and building the wave of hype slowly.
Bottom line I guess is that what they’ve done so far has very very narrow appeal in most cases.
but, I can’t effing wait to hear Dark Matter!
2005.....Hamilton
2011.....Toronto N1, Toronto N2, Hamilton
2013.....London, Buffalo
2014.....Detroit
2016.....Toronto N1 Toronto N2, Boston N1, Boston N2, Chicago N1
2018.....Seattle N1, Seattle N2
2022.....San Diego, Los Angeles N1, Los Angeles N2, Phoenix, Oakland N1, Oakland N2, Quebec City, Ottawa, Hamilton, Toronto
2023.....Fort Worth N1, Fort Worth N2, Austin N1, Austin N2
2024.....????
2012: Manchester I, Manchester II, Manchester (EV)
2014: Milan, Leeds, Milton Keynes
2017: London II (EV)
2018: Amsterdam I, London I, Prague, London II
2019: London (EV)
2022: London I, London II, Budapest, Krakow, Amsterdam
it’s always struck me as odd the PJ sells a CD still. The vinyl I get (and let’s be honest this is all driven by Ed’s fascination with it), so it doesn’t surprise me that they offer a couple variants to have some fun, but 12 sounds like a cash grab. Though, I doubt it will amount to much.
but hey - if you’re buying them all then enjoy it. Maybe there is some sort of Easter egg on each of them as a surprise?
Nowadays, colored vinyl manufacturing has pretty much narrowed that gap, but only when pressed properly, which isn't always the case.
If you want to be certain, go the safe route and get black.
As for the multiple vinyls, I would probably pick one I liked, but I totally understand the collector aspect of it. I used to collect comics a lot, and they were all about multiple covers and variants.
The cassette thing is the really wild one to me. I know it's not just Pearl Jam; it's been a growing trend for years now. My best guess is that it's a nostalgia thing, which I DO get, but I'm not seeking out a cassette player anytime soon, while I'm pretty sure I will always have a CD player and a turntable. Frankly, I think they should lean even more into the nostalgia and start releasing music on 8-track and concert films on LaserDisc and VHS.
Hartford 10.02.96 | Mansfield 2 09.16.98 | Mansfield 1 08.29.00 | Mansfield 1 07.02.03 | Mansfield 3 07.11.03 | Boston 2 05.25.06 | Tampa 04.11.16 | Fenway 1 08.05.16 | Fenway 2 08.07.16 | Fenway 1 09.02.18 | Fenway 2 09.04.18 | Baltimore 03.28.20 | Hamilton 09.06.22 | Toronto 09.08.22 | Nashville 09.16.22 | St Louis 09.18.22
"He made the deal with the devil, we get to play with him.
He goes to hell, of course. We're going to heaven."
When her album was occupying multiple vinyl pressing plants in ‘21 (and impacting early ‘22 releases too) a lot of punk and indie bands started doing tapes to fill that void because the wait to press anyone else’s vinyl was so long.
i still buy a cd of every PJ studio album, because I always have and I always like the packaging but PJ is the only band I still do that for
I actually thought it was earlier than that, but '21 feels like it was about 10 years ago, so...
Hartford 10.02.96 | Mansfield 2 09.16.98 | Mansfield 1 08.29.00 | Mansfield 1 07.02.03 | Mansfield 3 07.11.03 | Boston 2 05.25.06 | Tampa 04.11.16 | Fenway 1 08.05.16 | Fenway 2 08.07.16 | Fenway 1 09.02.18 | Fenway 2 09.04.18 | Baltimore 03.28.20 | Hamilton 09.06.22 | Toronto 09.08.22 | Nashville 09.16.22 | St Louis 09.18.22
"He made the deal with the devil, we get to play with him.
He goes to hell, of course. We're going to heaven."
EDIT: And CDs are still the leading format in some other markets, like Japan.
Except that 1 album stream does not equal 1 album sale. Swift still sells millions of physical copies. Midnights sold ell over 1 million physical copies it's first week. It may not be the highest revenue stream, but it's certainly more than a "drop in the bucket".
Hartford 10.02.96 | Mansfield 2 09.16.98 | Mansfield 1 08.29.00 | Mansfield 1 07.02.03 | Mansfield 3 07.11.03 | Boston 2 05.25.06 | Tampa 04.11.16 | Fenway 1 08.05.16 | Fenway 2 08.07.16 | Fenway 1 09.02.18 | Fenway 2 09.04.18 | Baltimore 03.28.20 | Hamilton 09.06.22 | Toronto 09.08.22 | Nashville 09.16.22 | St Louis 09.18.22
"He made the deal with the devil, we get to play with him.
He goes to hell, of course. We're going to heaven."
Nuclear fission
I don't think I've seen such a thing since 2012. Weird.
I'm not sure I've held a CD in my hand since maybe 2010. I mean...you literally cannot buy cars with CD players (and it's been that way for a handful of years). I'm just so fascinated by the idea of people buying/using them.