BF25394: Well, it would be cheaper for me to provide one "sale" in that manner (constant streaming) rather than purchasing a new physical album each week. Igotid88 is correct -- if tens of thousands of fan club members did that for a while, then it'd make a really big difference.
And what would be the point of that?
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
I wouldn't have guessed that "Even Flow" would be atop this list, let alone by such a wide margin. The fact that people are apparently as eager to listen to "Last Kiss" today as they are to "Dark Matter" or "Wreckage" is depressing.
BF25394: Well, it would be cheaper for me to provide one "sale" in that manner (constant streaming) rather than purchasing a new physical album each week. Igotid88 is correct -- if tens of thousands of fan club members did that for a while, then it'd make a really big difference.
I think Spotify has algorithms to prevent this. I'd have to hunt a bit to find the article I read years ago, but fans of an indie band did something like this (I think they uploaded an album of super-short "songs" that could rack up tons of listens on repeat), but they weren't the only ones. There are "services" that will do this, too, and potentially get your music blacklisted from Spotify.
"I'm a lucky man, to count on both hands the [shows I've done]. Some folks just have one, others they got none..."
Hartford 10.02.96 | Mansfield 2 09.16.98 | Mansfield 1 08.29.00 |
Mansfield 1 07.02.03 | Mansfield 3 07.11.03 | Boston 2 05.25.06 | Tampa 04.11.16 | Fenway 1 08.05.16 | Fenway 2 08.07.16 | Fenway 1 09.02.18 | Fenway 2 09.04.18 | Baltimore 03.28.20 | Hamilton 09.06.22 | Toronto 09.08.22 | Nashville 09.16.22 | St Louis 09.18.22
"He made the deal with the devil, we get to play with him. He goes to hell, of course. We're going to heaven."
I understand those of you who are saying it's an implausible plan. I agree that it almost assuredly wouldn't work based on one reason or another. Sometimes I just like thinking about different, out-of-the-box ideas. Igotid88 said he actually tried to implement such a plan to no avail. Anyways, thanks for the conversation!
Anyway, believe it or not, I actually have a useful post. On this thread, some of the more prominent fan club members (igotid88, BF25394, and others) have recently been discussing Ten Club album sales and whether Luminate scans are completed in reference to them. Well, I just received a reply from an individual who represents Equilibrium Entertainment, LLC, and this is his verbatim reply concerning Luminate scans for fan club orders:
"To my knowledge, at this time, Luminate does NOT record sales through artists' websites. Artists should keep records of that themselves. The artists should then pool sales information together from their distribution service, other websites, and physical sales to get accurate totals. I'd argue that an artist should keep meticulous records of sales and streams from all sources, not just for marketing and tax purposes, but also to have reliable data in the event they want to apply for RIAA certification (i.e. gold, platinum, diamond). During that process, the RIAA literally audits an artist's record keeping, and tracks every sale, to get the most accurate information."
I hope some of you might find this reply/information helpful pertaining to the Luminate sales discussion. Thanks!
I wouldn't have guessed that "Even Flow" would be atop this list, let alone by such a wide margin. The fact that people are apparently as eager to listen to "Last Kiss" today as they are to "Dark Matter" or "Wreckage" is depressing.
Even Flow makes sense. And it had a resurgence with the Skate Jesus meme. Ever since they put the warning at the beginning of the Jeremy video. It started to get less views
I wouldn't have guessed that "Even Flow" would be atop this list, let alone by such a wide margin. The fact that people are apparently as eager to listen to "Last Kiss" today as they are to "Dark Matter" or "Wreckage" is depressing.
Even Flow makes sense. And it had a resurgence with the Skate Jesus meme. Ever since they put the warning at the beginning of the Jeremy video. It started to get less views
Further supports why they play it darn near every night. I still want them to open with it...at least once, to dare the pee breakers to leave.
Anyway, believe it or not, I actually have a useful post. On this thread, some of the more prominent fan club members (igotid88, BF25394, and others) have recently been discussing Ten Club album sales and whether Luminate scans are completed in reference to them. Well, I just received a reply from an individual who represents Equilibrium Entertainment, LLC, and this is his verbatim reply concerning Luminate scans for fan club orders:
"To my knowledge, at this time, Luminate does NOT record sales through artists' websites. Artists should keep records of that themselves. The artists should then pool sales information together from their distribution service, other websites, and physical sales to get accurate totals. I'd argue that an artist should keep meticulous records of sales and streams from all sources, not just for marketing and tax purposes, but also to have reliable data in the event they want to apply for RIAA certification (i.e. gold, platinum, diamond). During that process, the RIAA literally audits an artist's record keeping, and tracks every sale, to get the most accurate information."
I hope some of you might find this reply/information helpful pertaining to the Luminate sales discussion. Thanks!
Thanks for this. It supports what I have been saying all along, which is that I have reason to believe that sales via the Ten Club are not reported to Luminate. However, I think this individual's generalization has an important corollary that is left unsaid, i.e., the default is that artists' website sales are not tracked, but there may be artists who make the investment to enable their sales to be tracked. For example, there is no way that Taylor Swift sold 1.91 million units of her new album in the first week unless it includes orders through her website. And it also explains why the reported numbers for Gigaton and Dark Matter seem low in light of anecdotal evidence of sales of CDs and variant LPs among fan club members. But Pearl Jam is unlikely to pay to set up to report to Luminate (or to have sales audited by RIAA) because they just don't care about chart placement or RIAA certification.
It's another reason why the Billboard 200 is not to be taken seriously.
I wouldn't have guessed that "Even Flow" would be atop this list, let alone by such a wide margin. The fact that people are apparently as eager to listen to "Last Kiss" today as they are to "Dark Matter" or "Wreckage" is depressing.
Even Flow makes sense. And it had a resurgence with the Skate Jesus meme. Ever since they put the warning at the beginning of the Jeremy video. It started to get less views
I wouldn't have guessed that "Even Flow" would be atop this list, let alone by such a wide margin. The fact that people are apparently as eager to listen to "Last Kiss" today as they are to "Dark Matter" or "Wreckage" is depressing.
Even Flow makes sense. And it had a resurgence with the Skate Jesus meme. Ever since they put the warning at the beginning of the Jeremy video. It started to get less views
#2 / #23 in Australia #2 / #8 in Austria #2 / #9 in Germany #2 / #24 in Netherlands #2 / #49 in Ireland #2 / #7 in Portugal #2 / #23 in Scotland #2 / #123 in UK (9,835 + 1,583 sales) #2 / #9 in Swiss #2 / #7 in Belgium #3 in Spain #3 / #29 in Italy #3 / #18 in New Zealand #5 / #171 in US (59' sales in 1st week) #13 / #109 in France #13 Finland #17 Denmark #21 Sweden
Dark Matter stays in the Top 10 in week 2 in Austria, Germany, Portugal, Switzerland and Belgium. Nice results in these countries.
I think your list is mixing apples and oranges. Some of these charts are sales-only. Others, like the Billboard 200, are sales-plus-streaming. In terms of U.S. sales, Dark Matter is #2 / #19 in your notation.
#2 / #23 in Australia #2 / #8 in Austria #2 / #9 in Germany #2 / #24 in Netherlands #2 / #49 in Ireland #2 / #7 in Portugal #2 / #23 in Scotland #2 / #123 in UK (9,835 + 1,583 sales) #2 / #9 in Swiss #2 / #7 in Belgium #3 in Spain #3 / #29 in Italy #3 / #18 in New Zealand #5 / #171 in US (59' sales in 1st week) #13 / #109 in France #13 Finland #17 Denmark #21 Sweden
Dark Matter stays in the Top 10 in week 2 in Austria, Germany, Portugal, Switzerland and Belgium. Nice results in these countries.
I think your list is mixing apples and oranges. Some of these charts are sales-only. Others, like the Billboard 200, are sales-plus-streaming. In terms of U.S. sales, Dark Matter is #2 / #19 in your notation.
These all are the official charts of each country. There might be variations in how each country weights streams in the charts. But I'm pretty sure in all of these charts streams are included in some way. I know for sure for Australia, NZ, Germany and UK, they are.
Original post updated for charts for week ending May 18, 2024. "Wreckage" continues to gain steam at radio, moving up from No. 22 to No. 14 in Alternative Airplay and from No. 12 to No. 7 at Rock & Alternative Airplay, as well as from No. 22 to No. 15 at Triple-A. Dark Matter slips from No. 19 to No. 29 in sales in its third week.
Original post updated for charts for week ending May 25, 2024. "Wreckage" continues to make steady gains at radio. Dark Matter holds steady at No. 29 in sales in its fourth week.
Original post updated for charts for week ending June 1, 2024. (I was in Seattle last week when this info became available and didn't get around to updating. There will be another update tomorrow for June 8 charts.)
"Wreckage" enters the top ten at Triple-A and spends a second week in the top five in Rock & Alternative Airplay. "Dark Matter" spends its thirteenth week in the top two on Canada Rock. Dark Matter falls off the 50-position Top Album Sales chart after four weeks.
Original post updated for charts for week ending June 8, 2024.
Dark Matter is holding on in sales, still in the top 50 among current albums and seeing a bounce at indie retailers.
"Wreckage" cracks the top ten on Alternative Airplay and Mainstream Rock Airplay, and moves up to No. 3 on Rock & Alternative Airplay. It also reaches a new high of No. 7 at Triple-A.
"Dark Matter" enjoys a slight uptick at rock radio, moving up a notch while remaining in the top 30 for a sixteenth week.
In other news, twenty one pilots register the biggest sales week for any rock album in 2024, selling 113,000 units of their latest album, Clancy. (And, yes, twenty one pilots is a rock act. They have ten number one songs at alternative rock radio.)
IMO, Wreckage is the strongest track on the record. I liked Dark Matter as the lead single but Wreckage was the perfect follow up. I've grown to like Running a lot, but I'm not sure if it was even an "official" single. Or what that even means anymore...
"Darkness comes in waves, tell me, why invite it to stay?"
IMO, Wreckage is the strongest track on the record. I liked Dark Matter as the lead single but Wreckage was the perfect follow up. I've grown to like Running a lot, but I'm not sure if it was even an "official" single. Or what that even means anymore...
You're right. To the extent that "single" has a meaning anymore, it means that a song is worked to radio. "Running" was not worked to radio. It was really just a teaser for fans, but "Wreckage" is the second single. "Wreckage" is the song with the greatest crossover possibility on the record.
I don't know...I would argue that Got to Give is stronger than Wreckage
My subjective opinion is that "Got to Give" is the best song on the album, but my objective opinion is that "Wreckage" has the best crossover potential primarily because it is midtempo. Bear in mind that crossing over for Pearl Jam in 2024 doesn't mean getting played on top 40 radio. That's not happening except in a Kate Bush/Stranger Things-type situation. Crossing over for Pearl Jam in 2024 means significant play on Triple-A stations, and that is already happening with "Wreckage."
I don't know...I would argue that Got to Give is stronger than Wreckage
LOL, no. Got To Give is the LEAST viewed song from the album on YouTube and all other formats.
LOL...did I say it had more views?
Sorry, didn’t think I had to spell it out for ya. Love it or hate it but YouTube views are a good indicator of how popular a song is or will be. You may like Got To Give but it wouldn’t stand a chance at radio for the general population or be a good song to shift units. Waiting For Stevie on the other hand….there’s a reason casual fans like Howard Stern and all those music critics liked it…..melody, hooks, memorable moments and throwback to 90’s PJ.
I don't know...I would argue that Got to Give is stronger than Wreckage
LOL, no. Got To Give is the LEAST viewed song from the album on YouTube and all other formats.
LOL...did I say it had more views?
Sorry, didn’t think I had to spell it out for ya. Love it or hate it but YouTube views are a good indicator of how popular a song is or will be. You may like Got To Give but it wouldn’t stand a chance at radio for the general population or be a good song to shift units. Waiting For Stevie on the other hand….there’s a reason casual fans like Howard Stern and all those music critics liked it…..melody, hooks, memorable moments and throwback to 90’s PJ
Nothing will really shift units at this point. The overwhelming majority of people who would potentially buy this album have already bought it. It sold about 1,500 copies last week, and that is with "Wreckage" is getting about as much airplay as any Pearl Jam song can get in 2024, in the top ten and gaining at alternative, mainstream rock and Triple-A radio.
For what it's worth, my objective opinion (based on years of experience in and with radio) is that "Waiting for Stevie" would have very little appeal beyond mainstream rock radio. "Got to Give" would have a shot at Triple-A. But, in both cases, we'd be talking about drops in the bucket of overall music consumption in 2024. "Dark Matter" followed by "Wreckage" was the best combo they had available to them, and I think the band should be pleased with the exposure those songs have gotten. ("Running" was not a single.)
Comments
Most fan club members aren't even streaming the album to listen to it, let alone to have it on in the background of their device all day.
Hartford 10.02.96 | Mansfield 2 09.16.98 | Mansfield 1 08.29.00 | Mansfield 1 07.02.03 | Mansfield 3 07.11.03 | Boston 2 05.25.06 | Tampa 04.11.16 | Fenway 1 08.05.16 | Fenway 2 08.07.16 | Fenway 1 09.02.18 | Fenway 2 09.04.18 | Baltimore 03.28.20 | Hamilton 09.06.22 | Toronto 09.08.22 | Nashville 09.16.22 | St Louis 09.18.22
"He made the deal with the devil, we get to play with him.
He goes to hell, of course. We're going to heaven."
"To my knowledge, at this time, Luminate does NOT record sales through artists' websites. Artists should keep records of that themselves. The artists should then pool sales information together from their distribution service, other websites, and physical sales to get accurate totals. I'd argue that an artist should keep meticulous records of sales and streams from all sources, not just for marketing and tax purposes, but also to have reliable data in the event they want to apply for RIAA certification (i.e. gold, platinum, diamond). During that process, the RIAA literally audits an artist's record keeping, and tracks every sale, to get the most accurate information."
I hope some of you might find this reply/information helpful pertaining to the Luminate sales discussion. Thanks!
It's another reason why the Billboard 200 is not to be taken seriously.
#2 / #23 / #39 in Australia
#2 / #8 / #15 / #49 in Austria
#2 / #9 / #26 / #45 / #87 in Germany
#2 / #24 / #41 in Netherlands
#2 / #49 / #100 in Ireland
#2 / #5 / #9 / #23 in Portugal
#2 / #23 in Scotland
#2 / #123 in UK (9,835 + 1,583 sales)
#2 / #9 / #19 / #52 in Swiss
#2 / #7 / #12 in Belgium
#3 / #26 / #37 / #60 in Spain
#3 / #29 / #58 / #98 in Italy
#3 / #18 / #40 in New Zealand
#5 / #171 in US (59' sales in 1st week)
#13 / #109 in France
#13 Finland
#17 Denmark
#21 Sweden
Dark Matter stays in the Top 10 in week 2 in Austria, Germany, Portugal, Switzerland and Belgium.
Nice results in these countries.
It doesn't have the rest of the new songs
There might be variations in how each country weights streams in the charts.
But I'm pretty sure in all of these charts streams are included in some way.
I know for sure for Australia, NZ, Germany and UK, they are.
"Wreckage" enters the top ten at Triple-A and spends a second week in the top five in Rock & Alternative Airplay. "Dark Matter" spends its thirteenth week in the top two on Canada Rock. Dark Matter falls off the 50-position Top Album Sales chart after four weeks.
Dark Matter is holding on in sales, still in the top 50 among current albums and seeing a bounce at indie retailers.
"Wreckage" cracks the top ten on Alternative Airplay and Mainstream Rock Airplay, and moves up to No. 3 on Rock & Alternative Airplay. It also reaches a new high of No. 7 at Triple-A.
"Dark Matter" enjoys a slight uptick at rock radio, moving up a notch while remaining in the top 30 for a sixteenth week.
In other news, twenty one pilots register the biggest sales week for any rock album in 2024, selling 113,000 units of their latest album, Clancy. (And, yes, twenty one pilots is a rock act. They have ten number one songs at alternative rock radio.)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana
For what it's worth, my objective opinion (based on years of experience in and with radio) is that "Waiting for Stevie" would have very little appeal beyond mainstream rock radio. "Got to Give" would have a shot at Triple-A. But, in both cases, we'd be talking about drops in the bucket of overall music consumption in 2024. "Dark Matter" followed by "Wreckage" was the best combo they had available to them, and I think the band should be pleased with the exposure those songs have gotten. ("Running" was not a single.)