Options

Pearl Jam Yield 25th Anniversary Edition Translucent Red and Black Hi-melt vinyl

1910111214

Comments

  • Options
    BIGDaddyWilBIGDaddyWil Michigan Posts: 3,048
    demetrios said:

    Just got my copy of the VMP exclusive Pearl Jam Yield 2-LP/45rpm cut and WOW! Big shout to VMP for the hype-sticker credit, that is so cool and means the world to me! We labored over making this a quality pressing at every stage. Record Technology Inc did a perfect job plating and Furnace Record Pressing pressed it nice and flat! The feedback online has been so positive but I figured I’d share just one quip since we cut the lacquers here Black Belt Mastering




    Thanks D!
    Pine Knob Music Theatre - Jul 31, 1992 Crisler Arena - Mar 20, 1994
    Summerfest - Jul 09, 1995*Savage Hall - Sep 22, 1996The Palace of Auburn Hills-Aug 23, 1998 Breslin Center- Aug 18, 1998,The Palace of Auburn Hills-Oct 07, 2000 DTE Energy Theatre-Jun5,2003,DTE Energy Music Theatre - Jun 26, 2003Sports Arena - Oct 02, 2004 Van Andel Arena - May 19, 2006Palace of Auburn Hills-May 22, 2006 Quicken Loans Arena-May 09, 2010
    10-16-2014 Detroit
  • Options
    dobybluedobyblue Posts: 63
    edited November 2023
    The problem is the source material, it suffers from too much dynamic range compression. Doesn't matter who cuts the lacquers or where it's pressed because the source material already handicaps it.

    Hard to imagine MOFI wouldn't do a better job, but to be clear that's got nothing to do with who plates it, who cuts the lacquers or who presses it, it would be better because they would be starting with the mix files and it would be mastered with all the dynamics of the original performance. If they didn't have access to work with the mix files, they wouldn't release it. They don't issue albums that they can't master.

    How much more dynamics would there be? Well, the Atmos mix gives us some good insight into that. Here's the approved stereo remaster that was used for the vinyl on the bottom, with the Atmos files downmixed to stereo on the top, Given To Fly - this is a significant difference in dynamics, not 1-2dB but some 7-9dB on average. I hate that the format with the lowest fidelity is trumping today's best vinyl and high resolution digital releases solely due to large differences in mastering. It doesn't matter for old albums that have dynamic stereo masters (ie anything before 1995), but for albums released during the ongoing loudness wars, it's very frustrating. This is why you'll see quite a few posts here pining for Blu-ray releases of the Atmos mixes, so we can get both fidelity and dynamics together, the way music is supposed to be.


    Post edited by dobyblue on
  • Options
    whoyouare72whoyouare72 Chicago IL Posts: 2,083
    edited November 2023

    dobyblue said:
    The problem is the source material, it suffers from too much dynamic range compression. Doesn't matter who cuts the lacquers or where it's pressed because the source material already handicaps it.

    Hard to imagine MOFI wouldn't do a better job, but to be clear that's got nothing to do with who plates it, who cuts the lacquers or who presses it, it would be better because they would be starting with the mix files and it would be mastered with all the dynamics of the original performance. If they didn't have access to work with the mix files, they wouldn't release it. They don't issue albums that they can't master.

    How much more dynamics would there be? Well, the Atmos mix gives us some good insight into that. Here's the approved stereo remaster that was used for the vinyl on the bottom, with the Atmos files downmixed to stereo on the top, Given To Fly - this is a significant difference in dynamics, not 1-2dB but some 7-9dB on average. I hate that the format with the lowest fidelity is trumping today's best vinyl and high resolution digital releases solely due to large differences in mastering. It doesn't matter for old albums that have dynamic stereo masters (ie anything before 1995), but for albums released during the ongoing loudness wars, it's very frustrating. This is why you'll see quite a few posts here pining for Blu-ray releases of the Atmos mixes, so we can get both fidelity and dynamics together, the way music is supposed to be.



    Thank you for posting this!
  • Options
    strangespotintheskystrangespotinthesky Pittsburgh Posts: 33
    dobyblue said:
    The problem is the source material, it suffers from too much dynamic range compression. Doesn't matter who cuts the lacquers or where it's pressed because the source material already handicaps it.

    Hard to imagine MOFI wouldn't do a better job, but to be clear that's got nothing to do with who plates it, who cuts the lacquers or who presses it, it would be better because they would be starting with the mix files and it would be mastered with all the dynamics of the original performance. If they didn't have access to work with the mix files, they wouldn't release it. They don't issue albums that they can't master.

    How much more dynamics would there be? Well, the Atmos mix gives us some good insight into that. Here's the approved stereo remaster that was used for the vinyl on the bottom, with the Atmos files downmixed to stereo on the top, Given To Fly - this is a significant difference in dynamics, not 1-2dB but some 7-9dB on average. I hate that the format with the lowest fidelity is trumping today's best vinyl and high resolution digital releases solely due to large differences in mastering. It doesn't matter for old albums that have dynamic stereo masters (ie anything before 1995), but for albums released during the ongoing loudness wars, it's very frustrating. This is why you'll see quite a few posts here pining for Blu-ray releases of the Atmos mixes, so we can get both fidelity and dynamics together, the way music is supposed to be.


    So is this why I am noticing some high frequency distortion?  Like it sounds overdriven and broken up in some parts?  I just changed my stylus and thought that was the issue.  But maybe it's just the way the vinyl was pressed?  There is a ton of detail but I do hear things break up at parts on the high end at points.
    Pitt '98 - Pitt '00 - Pitt '03 - State College '03 - Hershey '03 - Toledo '04 - Pitt '05 - Philly '05 - Cleveland '06 - Pitt '06 - Cinci '06 - Bonnaroo '08 - MSG I '08 - MSG II '08
  • Options
    tylerjtylerj Indiana Posts: 289
    dobyblue said:
    The problem is the source material, it suffers from too much dynamic range compression. Doesn't matter who cuts the lacquers or where it's pressed because the source material already handicaps it.

    Hard to imagine MOFI wouldn't do a better job, but to be clear that's got nothing to do with who plates it, who cuts the lacquers or who presses it, it would be better because they would be starting with the mix files and it would be mastered with all the dynamics of the original performance. If they didn't have access to work with the mix files, they wouldn't release it. They don't issue albums that they can't master.

    How much more dynamics would there be? Well, the Atmos mix gives us some good insight into that. Here's the approved stereo remaster that was used for the vinyl on the bottom, with the Atmos files downmixed to stereo on the top, Given To Fly - this is a significant difference in dynamics, not 1-2dB but some 7-9dB on average. I hate that the format with the lowest fidelity is trumping today's best vinyl and high resolution digital releases solely due to large differences in mastering. It doesn't matter for old albums that have dynamic stereo masters (ie anything before 1995), but for albums released during the ongoing loudness wars, it's very frustrating. This is why you'll see quite a few posts here pining for Blu-ray releases of the Atmos mixes, so we can get both fidelity and dynamics together, the way music is supposed to be.


    While I don't like the new Yield sounds "bad," I did listen to it yesterday after listening to a MOFI record. Could really tell a difference between the 2 with the MOFI being very noticeably better. Most of Pearl Jam's albums are noticeably compressed. The only album that really "wows" me is the OG VS. I doubt we'll ever truly audiophile stuff from PJ, but their recent vaults and releases at least signal to me they're trying to make them sound at least a little better. 
    Chicago, Aug 24, 2009 
    Noblesville, May 7, 2010
    PJ20 Night 1, 2011
    Cincinnati, Oct. 1, 2014
    Milwaukee, Oct. 20, 2014
    Wrigley Field, Aug 20, 2016
    Wrigley Field, Aug 22, 2016
    Wrigley Field, Aug 18, 2018
    Wrigley Field, Aug 20, 2018
    St. Louis, Sept. 18, 2022
    Chicago, Sept. 5, 2023
    Chicago, Sept. 7, 2023

  • Options
    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,717
    tylerj said:
    dobyblue said:
    The problem is the source material, it suffers from too much dynamic range compression. Doesn't matter who cuts the lacquers or where it's pressed because the source material already handicaps it.

    Hard to imagine MOFI wouldn't do a better job, but to be clear that's got nothing to do with who plates it, who cuts the lacquers or who presses it, it would be better because they would be starting with the mix files and it would be mastered with all the dynamics of the original performance. If they didn't have access to work with the mix files, they wouldn't release it. They don't issue albums that they can't master.

    How much more dynamics would there be? Well, the Atmos mix gives us some good insight into that. Here's the approved stereo remaster that was used for the vinyl on the bottom, with the Atmos files downmixed to stereo on the top, Given To Fly - this is a significant difference in dynamics, not 1-2dB but some 7-9dB on average. I hate that the format with the lowest fidelity is trumping today's best vinyl and high resolution digital releases solely due to large differences in mastering. It doesn't matter for old albums that have dynamic stereo masters (ie anything before 1995), but for albums released during the ongoing loudness wars, it's very frustrating. This is why you'll see quite a few posts here pining for Blu-ray releases of the Atmos mixes, so we can get both fidelity and dynamics together, the way music is supposed to be.


    While I don't like the new Yield sounds "bad," I did listen to it yesterday after listening to a MOFI record. Could really tell a difference between the 2 with the MOFI being very noticeably better. Most of Pearl Jam's albums are noticeably compressed. The only album that really "wows" me is the OG VS. I doubt we'll ever truly audiophile stuff from PJ, but their recent vaults and releases at least signal to me they're trying to make them sound at least a little better. 
    Agreed that the OG Vs is the only studio record that I think sounds really good.  
  • Options
    demetriosdemetrios Canada Posts: 88,116

  • Options
    dobyblue said:
    The problem is the source material, it suffers from too much dynamic range compression. Doesn't matter who cuts the lacquers or where it's pressed because the source material already handicaps it.

    Hard to imagine MOFI wouldn't do a better job, but to be clear that's got nothing to do with who plates it, who cuts the lacquers or who presses it, it would be better because they would be starting with the mix files and it would be mastered with all the dynamics of the original performance. If they didn't have access to work with the mix files, they wouldn't release it. They don't issue albums that they can't master.

    How much more dynamics would there be? Well, the Atmos mix gives us some good insight into that. Here's the approved stereo remaster that was used for the vinyl on the bottom, with the Atmos files downmixed to stereo on the top, Given To Fly - this is a significant difference in dynamics, not 1-2dB but some 7-9dB on average. I hate that the format with the lowest fidelity is trumping today's best vinyl and high resolution digital releases solely due to large differences in mastering. It doesn't matter for old albums that have dynamic stereo masters (ie anything before 1995), but for albums released during the ongoing loudness wars, it's very frustrating. This is why you'll see quite a few posts here pining for Blu-ray releases of the Atmos mixes, so we can get both fidelity and dynamics together, the way music is supposed to be.


    So is this why I am noticing some high frequency distortion?  Like it sounds overdriven and broken up in some parts?  I just changed my stylus and thought that was the issue.  But maybe it's just the way the vinyl was pressed?  There is a ton of detail but I do hear things break up at parts on the high end at points.

    Could be any number of things, you'd likely need to listen to the record on a different set-up to determine if the problem is on the record. Most local hifi stores will let you demo equipment if you appear to be a serious buyer, like...I wouldn't listen to it on my friend's AT-LP60 to determine if it's the record because that's just not a good turntable.
  • Options
    If the artistic intent at the time was to have it compressed and loud. That intent should be respected. 

    ya George Lucs-people
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • Options
    Nah, had nothing to do with the artist, sorry to disappoint you. Your respect is headed for the A&R guys that wanted it loud because they thought it needed to be to compete with other records on the radio, unaware that FM compression (given that was the dominant way people listened to radio when Yield was released) actually made louder records sound more muted.
  • Options
    demetriosdemetrios Canada Posts: 88,116

  • Options
    demetriosdemetrios Canada Posts: 88,116


  • Options
    2-feign-reluctance2-feign-reluctance TigerTown, USA Posts: 23,184
    dobyblue said:
    Nah, had nothing to do with the artist, sorry to disappoint you. Your respect is headed for the A&R guys that wanted it loud because they thought it needed to be to compete with other records on the radio, unaware that FM compression (given that was the dominant way people listened to radio when Yield was released) actually made louder records sound more muted.
    You two are the Siskel & Ebert of music releases around here. 
    www.cluthelee.com
  • Options
    Kearn5yKearn5y Ireland Posts: 2,708
    PJ Freak said:
    Kearn5y said:
    PJ Freak said:
    Kearn5y said:
    Any of these land in Europe yet. My copy has been sitting in LA since the 18th waiting for acceptance 
    Same here, mine still in LA since 18th 
    Any movement? Mine still has moved since then. That's 2 weeks now
    Still stuck in LA 😔
    Have to ask, any movement? My copy hasnt moved in 6 weeks now. 
    Kearnsy
  • Options
    demetriosdemetrios Canada Posts: 88,116

    vinylemergency

    Traded in some stuff to snag the recent #VinylMePlease #PearlJamYield reissue on #Discogs. What a revelation this pressing is. You hear so much more than before, and I love these songs even more because of it, 25 years later. Cheers to @blackbeltmastering for nailing this, as he has for all the PJ releases he’s cut new lacquers for. Need to get him back on the podcast to discuss this as well as the new 2LP 45RPM 30th anniversary reissue of Vs, which is high atop my wantlist this Christmas.

    #pearljam #yield #vinylemergencypodcast #vinylemergency #leviseitz #blackbeltmastering #vmp #vinyl #recordcollection #onmyturntable #instavinyl #albums #90smusic @vinylmeplease @thestorfer @officialament @mikemccreadypj #pearljamvinyl #pearljamcollection #vmpexclusive



  • Options
    demetriosdemetrios Canada Posts: 88,116
    Kearn5y said:
    PJ Freak said:
    Kearn5y said:
    PJ Freak said:
    Kearn5y said:
    Any of these land in Europe yet. My copy has been sitting in LA since the 18th waiting for acceptance 
    Same here, mine still in LA since 18th 
    Any movement? Mine still has moved since then. That's 2 weeks now
    Still stuck in LA 😔
    Have to ask, any movement? My copy hasnt moved in 6 weeks now. 

    Totally email 10Club. That's way too long with no movement.
  • Options
    Kearn5yKearn5y Ireland Posts: 2,708
    demetrios said:
    Kearn5y said:
    PJ Freak said:
    Kearn5y said:
    PJ Freak said:
    Kearn5y said:
    Any of these land in Europe yet. My copy has been sitting in LA since the 18th waiting for acceptance 
    Same here, mine still in LA since 18th 
    Any movement? Mine still has moved since then. That's 2 weeks now
    Still stuck in LA 😔
    Have to ask, any movement? My copy hasnt moved in 6 weeks now. 

    Totally email 10Club. That's way too long with no movement.
    Told me I have to wait 90 days which sucks. Shipment is lost as far as I'm concerned 
    Kearnsy
  • Options
    Got this a few days ago. Asked about delivery to Dublin.
    We are currently processing orders for this product. This requires us to print labels and apply them to the packaging.
    At this time, a label has been printed and your order is either awaiting processing or pick-up by our shipping partner.
    We apologize for any confusion.
    Thanks
    10c

    i wish i wish i wish i wish, i guess it never stops
  • Options
    Kearn5yKearn5y Ireland Posts: 2,708
    eboweddie said:
    Got this a few days ago. Asked about delivery to Dublin.
    We are currently processing orders for this product. This requires us to print labels and apply them to the packaging.
    At this time, a label has been printed and your order is either awaiting processing or pick-up by our shipping partner.
    We apologize for any confusion.
    Thanks
    10c
    Has your copy even shipped? My copy is sitting in the airport somewhere.
    Kearnsy
  • Options
    Not yet no
     Its still in the US.  

    i wish i wish i wish i wish, i guess it never stops
  • Options
    demetriosdemetrios Canada Posts: 88,116
    Kearn5y said:
    demetrios said:
    Kearn5y said:
    PJ Freak said:
    Kearn5y said:
    PJ Freak said:
    Kearn5y said:
    Any of these land in Europe yet. My copy has been sitting in LA since the 18th waiting for acceptance 
    Same here, mine still in LA since 18th 
    Any movement? Mine still has moved since then. That's 2 weeks now
    Still stuck in LA 😔
    Have to ask, any movement? My copy hasnt moved in 6 weeks now. 

    Totally email 10Club. That's way too long with no movement.
    Told me I have to wait 90 days which sucks. Shipment is lost as far as I'm concerned 

    Damn! Hope it's not lost and moves soon. My Backspacer '23 vinyl pressing & Fort Worth N1 poster tracking numbers didn't update for over a month and then it updated. 
  • Options
    bicyclejoebicyclejoe USA Posts: 1,177
    Why 45rpm pressings excel, by one of the great vinyl master masters:

    Why 45 rpm? by Kevin Gray, AcousTech Mastering

    "After 60 years the good ol’ analog LP is still one of the highest resolution sources of music distribution available. It has a solid, palpable, satisfying sound that no digital format has yet equaled, let alone surpassed. The most unfortunate thing about the LP is that it was really starting to flourish back in the mid 80s, just as the record companies tried to kill it.

    Advances in cutterheads (the device that etches the groove in the master lacquer disk) and cutting electronics reached a pinnacle in the early 80s. Digital computers arrived on the scene in their best role: Out of the audio chain, but doing machine-control to adjust the groove spacing on the record for maximum playing time and recorded volume. 180 gram virgin vinyl pressings were the next development, and last but not least, around the late 70s, 45 rpm 12” LPs started to appear.

    Why 45, you ask? Because it sounds better! In record mastering, the higher the recorded level and frequency, the greater the groove curvature. Curvature isn’t usually a problem, per se, on the outside of a 12” 33 1/3 record, but as the groove moves toward the center, its relative speed slows down and curvature increases. Yes, it is still turning at 33 1/3 revolutions per minute, but consider: one revolution takes 1.8 seconds. That 1.8 seconds at a 12” diameter is covering a lot more territory than at the minimum 4.75” diameter. The result is actually a loss in high frequencies, and increase in distortion as the groove moves to the center. The problems start when the curvature of the groove equals or exceeds the diameter of the playback stylus. What can be done about it? Many things have been tried, but there is no “magic bullet”. Keep the recorded volume to a reasonable level (read: On scale on the meters) is the first thing. Play the record back with an elliptical or line-contact stylus that has a smaller tip radius. And, if possible, make the record short enough to keep the music away from the very end of the disk. This isn’t always possible, of course.

    BUT, if we spin the disk at 45rpm we now have a 35% increase in groove velocity at any point on the disk. This is a huge advantage! Yes, the groove still slows down as it moves inward, but the effects are greatly reduced. The only problem is that the amount of recorded time is now also reduced by 35%. What do you do about that? (Hint: split up the LP into 4 sides on 2 records.) Now you’re cookin’ doc! Yep, twice the mastering cost, plating cost, pressing cost, label and jacket costs. It’s enough to make the bean-counters break down and cry. But the sound! Oooooh, yeah! This isn’t sales hype, it’s physics. Listen for yourself. You tell me if it’s worth it. A lot of music lovers think so…and they are right!"
    My Pearl Jam Road: 10/22/90 Seattle | 12/22/90 Seattle, Moore Theater | 9/29/92 Seattle, Magnusson Park, Drop in the Park | 9/5/93 The Gorge, with Neil Young and Blind Melon | 7/20/06 Portland, Arlene Schnitzer Concert Hall with Sleater-Kinney | 7/22/06 The Gorge, 10/21/06 Mountain View, Shoreline Ampitheatre, Bridge School Benefit | 9/21/09 Seattle | 9/22/09 Seattle | 9/26/09 Portland, OR | 7/14/2011 Eddie Vedder, Portland, OR | 11/29/13 Portland, OR
  • Options
    LoujoeLoujoe Posts: 7,960
    Interesting. Thx
  • Options
    demetriosdemetrios Canada Posts: 88,116
    Think they will put more back in stock over @ https://www.vinylmeplease.com/products/pearl-jam-yield?variant=39968285229146 ? Wouldn't they have deleted the url if they were completely sold out?
  • Options
    beano.79beano.79 Posts: 697
    Just played mine.... Well that sounds lovely 
  • Options
    demetriosdemetrios Canada Posts: 88,116


  • Options
    bobasfeetbobasfeet Posts: 1,072
    Spun this weekend. Wow.
  • Options
    demetriosdemetrios Canada Posts: 88,116
    Crossing fingers they release Binaural next year, via a cool translucent orange & black hi melt vinyl.
  • Options
    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,717
    demetrios said:
    Crossing fingers they release Binaural next year, via a cool translucent orange & black hi melt vinyl.
    Lost Dogs first.  Not sure what is taking so long. 
  • Options
    bobasfeetbobasfeet Posts: 1,072
    demetrios said:
    Crossing fingers they release Binaural next year, via a cool translucent orange & black hi melt vinyl.
    Vitalogy 30th too.
Sign In or Register to comment.