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Viruses / Vaccines

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    lastexitlondonlastexitlondon Posts: 12,594
    Because  of mutations 
    But you as a vaccinated person catch the virus, so doesn't it still mutate?
    Why open that door wider? Whats your point
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    gvn2fly1421gvn2fly1421 Posts: 935
    The virus spreads much more and faster in unvaccinated.  Facts.  So more  spread. More change  . More  variants. Its simple 
    Is there proof of this?  It seems to have spread pretty quick in DC recently...

    https://www.cnn.com/world/live-news/olympics-coronavirus-pandemic-07-20-21/h_81880ac36fd792e0850fac1bda1820cf

    A White House official and a senior Pelosi aide, both fully vaccinated, test positive for Covid-19


    Some context: Six Texas lawmakers have tested positive for Covid-19 since Saturday. The lawmakers are part of the group that left Texas, flying from Austin to Washington, DC, to break the state House's quorum and block Republicans from passing a restrictive new voting law.

    Officials with the group told CNN that all of the lawmakers participating in the quorum break trip are fully vaccinated, including those who have tested positive for Covid-19.

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    gvn2fly1421gvn2fly1421 Posts: 935
    mrussel1 said:
    Also, to steal from a tweet that I posted the other day, why has there not been a town hall style Q & A with Fauci, the surgeon general, the CDC, etc fielding questions from all types of reporters?  Not just the softball questions Fauci fields daily, but have "conspiracy theorists" asking questions and have them answered.  I think something like that would go a long way in helping the vaccine hesitant. 

    Of all the money spent on advertising the vaccine, I would think this could easily be done.

    They consistently go in front of senate and house committees.  Fauci testified just today, along with the head of the CDC and the acting commissioner of the FDA.  Are these the softball questions that they are getting 'daily'?  And yeah, what a great idea, giving a bunch of know-nothings the credibility to ask questions.  Don't worry, Ayn Rand Paul is giving them enough oxygen already.  
    Where can I watch this?  All I see are clips of Fauci on the morning shows or local news?
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    lastexitlondonlastexitlondon Posts: 12,594
    Of course there  is .  The vaccine makes  the  person  have a much lower viral load as the  antibodies  have a head start on neutralizing  the  virus from the  second you are infected. An unvaccinated person the  load can multiply without any immediate  response.  Do you understand?
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    this song is meant to be called i got shit,itshould be called i got shit tickets-hartford 06 -
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    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,801
    mrussel1 said:
    Also, to steal from a tweet that I posted the other day, why has there not been a town hall style Q & A with Fauci, the surgeon general, the CDC, etc fielding questions from all types of reporters?  Not just the softball questions Fauci fields daily, but have "conspiracy theorists" asking questions and have them answered.  I think something like that would go a long way in helping the vaccine hesitant. 

    Of all the money spent on advertising the vaccine, I would think this could easily be done.

    They consistently go in front of senate and house committees.  Fauci testified just today, along with the head of the CDC and the acting commissioner of the FDA.  Are these the softball questions that they are getting 'daily'?  And yeah, what a great idea, giving a bunch of know-nothings the credibility to ask questions.  Don't worry, Ayn Rand Paul is giving them enough oxygen already.  
    Where can I watch this?  All I see are clips of Fauci on the morning shows or local news?
    I don't know.. CSPAN?  
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    lastexitlondonlastexitlondon Posts: 12,594
    The reason all these people are getting infected 
     The  delta. Which is a mutation which is what happens when a virus has free reign  to run riot. Now if its done in time the vaccines  break the chain sadly us stupid human beings  cant even do that  sensibly.  We had next to no covid then a kent variant swept through before we could  get enough  people educated enough to get a FREE jab.  Then we let planes from india just sail in on the cocky bullheadedness of a clown leader.  Now see how we got here. So the next variant could evade all vaccines  making it all a waste of time. So get vaccinated  world wide. Fast then you can't have another. Then another potential  game over situation. What is so hard to grasp?
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    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,801
    The reason all these people are getting infected 
     The  delta. Which is a mutation which is what happens when a virus has free reign  to run riot. Now if its done in time the vaccines  break the chain sadly us stupid human beings  cant even do that  sensibly.  We had next to no covid then a kent variant swept through before we could  get enough  people educated enough to get a FREE jab.  Then we let planes from india just sail in on the cocky bullheadedness of a clown leader.  Now see how we got here. So the next variant could evade all vaccines  making it all a waste of time. So get vaccinated  world wide. Fast then you can't have another. Then another potential  game over situation. What is so hard to grasp?
    Because I read that I might not be able to get pregnant if I get the vax. 
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    lastexitlondonlastexitlondon Posts: 12,594
    mrussel1 said:
    The reason all these people are getting infected 
     The  delta. Which is a mutation which is what happens when a virus has free reign  to run riot. Now if its done in time the vaccines  break the chain sadly us stupid human beings  cant even do that  sensibly.  We had next to no covid then a kent variant swept through before we could  get enough  people educated enough to get a FREE jab.  Then we let planes from india just sail in on the cocky bullheadedness of a clown leader.  Now see how we got here. So the next variant could evade all vaccines  making it all a waste of time. So get vaccinated  world wide. Fast then you can't have another. Then another potential  game over situation. What is so hard to grasp?
    Because I read that I might not be able to get pregnant if I get the vax. 
    And you may have  a magnetic arm with 5g. Surly  thats a plus.
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    PoncierPoncier Posts: 16,373
    Poncier said:
    Olympics are in danger now, because, wait for it...  Perfectly healthy, young, mostly vaccinated, athletes in peak physical condition are testing positive for Covid.  When will the testing stop?  

    https://www.espn.com/olympics/story/_/id/31847805/tokyo-2020-organizing-committee-chief-rule-cancellation-summer-olympics

    Tokyo 2020 organizing committee chief won't rule out last-minute cancellation of Olympics


    COVID-19 cases are rising in Tokyo, and the Games, postponed last year because of the pandemic, will be held without spectators. Japan this month decided that participants would compete in empty venues to minimize health risks.

    There have been 67 cases of COVID-19 infections in Japan among those accredited for the Games since July 1, when many athletes and officials started arriving, organizers said Tuesday.

    There is absolutely nothing in that article about the vaccination status of the 67 who've tested positive....you're making stuff up to fit your narrative
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/alisondurkee/2021/07/19/did-olympic-athletes-need-to-be-vaccinated-no---and-now-more-are-testing-positive-for-covid-19/?sh=169025d84db7

    BIG NUMBER

    More than 80%. That’s the percentage of Olympic and Paralympic athletes that are estimated to be vaccinated against Covid-19, the IOC projected in June. That number may now be higher, as the IOC told Forbes in an email Monday night it has “received assurances” that at least 85% of delegation members from countries’ National Olympics Committees have been vaccinated. Individual sports teams may also have higher vaccination rates: the Washington Post reported in June 90% of athletes on the U.S. Olympic swim team were vaccinated, for instance, while USA Today reports the U.S. men’s rugby team “collectively agree[d]...that vaccinations were an overall positive.”


    Does 80% count as "mostly"?

    Were 80% of the 67 positive cases vaxxed? Or 80% of all athletes which leaves 20% unvaxxed and therefore considering the number of athletes competing 67 (and sure to be more) positive tests no big surprise.
    That's where you intentionally tried to mislead....wording it that 67 mostly vaccinated athletes tested positive when you have no idea the vaccination status of team Mexico baseball players or a masseur for Russia's rugby team or Ugandan coaches & athletes...etc. etc.

    Factbox: Coronavirus outbreaks at the Tokyo Olympics | Reuters

    But I'd hazard a guess less than 80% are vaccinated, but I won't state it as fact.
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    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,801
    Poncier said:
    Poncier said:
    Olympics are in danger now, because, wait for it...  Perfectly healthy, young, mostly vaccinated, athletes in peak physical condition are testing positive for Covid.  When will the testing stop?  

    https://www.espn.com/olympics/story/_/id/31847805/tokyo-2020-organizing-committee-chief-rule-cancellation-summer-olympics

    Tokyo 2020 organizing committee chief won't rule out last-minute cancellation of Olympics


    COVID-19 cases are rising in Tokyo, and the Games, postponed last year because of the pandemic, will be held without spectators. Japan this month decided that participants would compete in empty venues to minimize health risks.

    There have been 67 cases of COVID-19 infections in Japan among those accredited for the Games since July 1, when many athletes and officials started arriving, organizers said Tuesday.

    There is absolutely nothing in that article about the vaccination status of the 67 who've tested positive....you're making stuff up to fit your narrative
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/alisondurkee/2021/07/19/did-olympic-athletes-need-to-be-vaccinated-no---and-now-more-are-testing-positive-for-covid-19/?sh=169025d84db7

    BIG NUMBER

    More than 80%. That’s the percentage of Olympic and Paralympic athletes that are estimated to be vaccinated against Covid-19, the IOC projected in June. That number may now be higher, as the IOC told Forbes in an email Monday night it has “received assurances” that at least 85% of delegation members from countries’ National Olympics Committees have been vaccinated. Individual sports teams may also have higher vaccination rates: the Washington Post reported in June 90% of athletes on the U.S. Olympic swim team were vaccinated, for instance, while USA Today reports the U.S. men’s rugby team “collectively agree[d]...that vaccinations were an overall positive.”


    Does 80% count as "mostly"?

    Were 80% of the 67 positive cases vaxxed? Or 80% of all athletes which leaves 20% unvaxxed and therefore considering the number of athletes competing 67 (and sure to be more) positive tests no big surprise.
    That's where you intentionally tried to mislead....wording it that 67 mostly vaccinated athletes tested positive when you have no idea the vaccination status of team Mexico baseball players or a masseur for Russia's rugby team or Ugandan coaches & athletes...etc. etc.

    Factbox: Coronavirus outbreaks at the Tokyo Olympics | Reuters

    But I'd hazard a guess less than 80% are vaccinated, but I won't state it as fact.
    I feel like you are disparaging most glorious Sputnik vaccine for the people.  
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    Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 36,972
    Poncier said:
    Poncier said:
    Olympics are in danger now, because, wait for it...  Perfectly healthy, young, mostly vaccinated, athletes in peak physical condition are testing positive for Covid.  When will the testing stop?  

    https://www.espn.com/olympics/story/_/id/31847805/tokyo-2020-organizing-committee-chief-rule-cancellation-summer-olympics

    Tokyo 2020 organizing committee chief won't rule out last-minute cancellation of Olympics


    COVID-19 cases are rising in Tokyo, and the Games, postponed last year because of the pandemic, will be held without spectators. Japan this month decided that participants would compete in empty venues to minimize health risks.

    There have been 67 cases of COVID-19 infections in Japan among those accredited for the Games since July 1, when many athletes and officials started arriving, organizers said Tuesday.

    There is absolutely nothing in that article about the vaccination status of the 67 who've tested positive....you're making stuff up to fit your narrative
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/alisondurkee/2021/07/19/did-olympic-athletes-need-to-be-vaccinated-no---and-now-more-are-testing-positive-for-covid-19/?sh=169025d84db7

    BIG NUMBER

    More than 80%. That’s the percentage of Olympic and Paralympic athletes that are estimated to be vaccinated against Covid-19, the IOC projected in June. That number may now be higher, as the IOC told Forbes in an email Monday night it has “received assurances” that at least 85% of delegation members from countries’ National Olympics Committees have been vaccinated. Individual sports teams may also have higher vaccination rates: the Washington Post reported in June 90% of athletes on the U.S. Olympic swim team were vaccinated, for instance, while USA Today reports the U.S. men’s rugby team “collectively agree[d]...that vaccinations were an overall positive.”


    Does 80% count as "mostly"?

    Were 80% of the 67 positive cases vaxxed? Or 80% of all athletes which leaves 20% unvaxxed and therefore considering the number of athletes competing 67 (and sure to be more) positive tests no big surprise.
    That's where you intentionally tried to mislead....wording it that 67 mostly vaccinated athletes tested positive when you have no idea the vaccination status of team Mexico baseball players or a masseur for Russia's rugby team or Ugandan coaches & athletes...etc. etc.

    Factbox: Coronavirus outbreaks at the Tokyo Olympics | Reuters

    But I'd hazard a guess less than 80% are vaccinated, but I won't state it as fact.
    Bingo.

    Never mind that the vaccine is 96% effective and doesn't prevent a fully vaccinated person from catching covid. And around and around it goes.
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    lastexitlondonlastexitlondon Posts: 12,594
    My cousin had sputnik. He is not magnetic  either 
     What a let down
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    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,801
    My cousin had sputnik. He is not magnetic  either 
     What a let down
    Where does he live that he got that vaccine?
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    Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 36,972
    To stay on topic, as I posted the other day, it seems it is becoming more and more likely that we ALL are going to catch the virus regardless of vaccination status.  

    If the above is true, why are the vaccinated so worried about the unvaccinated?
    Because of the potential of the unvaxxed catching covid in large enough numbers, requiring hospitalization and overwhelming the healthcare system. I want a bed for when my gun accidently shoots me, dammit. Fully vaxxed over 50 still have a higher chance of getting sick and requiring hospitalization, particularly with contributing factors like obesity, chronic disease, immune issue, etc. We all know 'Murica is a model of health and fitness.

    And that's a big "if."
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    ZodZod Posts: 10,396
    This is the part I don't get.  The Vaccines (for the most part), at least the mRNA ones prevent getting really sick, or even getting sick.  It's always been up in the air whether or not you transmit the virus with zero symptoms.   IE you get Covid, the vaccine knocks it out, you never get sick so you don't notice.  Still there's a period of time you've got it, and maybe spread it.

    So it would seem there's a possibility that if you randomly testing people who are vaccinated that they're probably going to test positive even though they aren't sick?  Is that a breakthrough case, or is that vaccine's doing what they're supposed to be doing?

    I guess if you're randomly testing, like at the Olympics, this is going to happen a lot?  That would suck to get pulled from your event because of a positive test, even though you aren't sick :(


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    Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 29,468
    Got my first shot
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    lastexitlondonlastexitlondon Posts: 12,594
    mrussel1 said:
    My cousin had sputnik. He is not magnetic  either 
     What a let down
    Where does he live that he got that vaccine?
    Moscow. He had both doses then came home.  He is here for a month then going  back. He teaches english  to rich russian kids
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    gimmesometruth27gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 22,271
    i wrote a song over the weekend called "anthem for the anti vaxxers"

    it is basically a tasty palm muted chug with a baby screaming on top of it.

    not worth recording or sharing. kinda like the anti vax posts.
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    lastexitlondonlastexitlondon Posts: 12,594
    Still nobody getting  polio or lockjaw. Thats nice 
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    gvn2fly1421gvn2fly1421 Posts: 935
    edited July 2021
    A recent series of tweets from Dr. Robert Malone, the "Inventor of mRNA vaccines and RNA as a drug".  Interesting take.  And best I can tell, he has stated he has been fully vaccinated.

    EDIT TO ADD...  THERE SEEMS TO BE CONFLICTING CLAIMS AS TO IF DR> MALONE IS THE INVENTOR OF mRNA VACCINES OR NOT.  THAT IS WHY IT IS IN QUOTES ABOVE, THAT IS WHAT HE PROCLAIMS ON HIS TWITTER ACCOUNT.










    Post edited by gvn2fly1421 on
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    nicknyr15nicknyr15 Posts: 7,925
    Were those Texas democrats who caught the virus all vaccinated? 

    It’s sad that I have to even type this but I’m legitimately asking, not instigating or trying to prove any point. 
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    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,801
    Strange, according to Statnews, who did a whole story on the beginnings of MRNA, it was developed by a Hungarian scientist named Katalin Kariko, who made the key breakthroughs.  To be sure others were involved but this Dr. Malone isn't mentioned.  Moderna and BioNTech took the work to the next level with substantial funding from PEs and the like.  But again, looking at Dr. Malone's resume on Linked, he didn't work at any of these places.  So it's curious how he 'invented' MRNA.  

    Regardless, he doesn't have any special access to data or anything today, so not sure why you would consider him more of an expert on social health policies than the other immunologists, virologists, or other experts who recommend the opposite.  

    https://www.statnews.com/2020/11/10/the-story-of-mrna-how-a-once-dismissed-idea-became-a-leading-technology-in-the-covid-vaccine-race/

    and then there's this..  https://www.logically.ai/factchecks/library/3aa2eefd

    UPDATE: Malone reached out to Logically, stating that he did not invent the mRNA vaccines, but instead the "vaccine technology platform." He also presented us with copies of nine patents – none of which showed that he invented the mRNA vaccines. The judgment for the claim has not changed.

    The COVID-19 pandemic has given rise to a lot of potentially dangerous misinformation. For reliable advice on COVID-19, including symptoms, prevention, and available treatment, please refer to the World Health Organization or your national healthcare authority.

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    gvn2fly1421gvn2fly1421 Posts: 935
    Weird then that he is still parading himself on twitter that way and his website still claims that.  Regardless, I think his points are pretty spot on.

    https://www.rwmalonemd.com/mrna-vaccine-inventor

    IT ALL STARTED WHEN…

    Dr. Malone is the inventor of mRNA vaccines (and DNA vaccines). He also discovered lipid mediated and naked RNA transfection technologies.

    It all started when he was at the Salk Institute in 1987 and 1988. There, he pioneered in-vitro RNA transfection and also in-vivo RNA transfection (in frog embryos, as well as mice).

    This resulted in his seminal paper: Cationic liposome-mediated RNA transfection RW Malone, PL Felgner, IM Verma. Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences (PNAS) 86 (16), 6077-6081

    His filed patent and disclosures from the Salk included in-vivo RNA transfection and also methods for mRNA stabilization - now being claimed as invented by others. These are available for review.

    His research was continued at Vical in 1989, where the first in-vivo mammalian rat experiments were designed by him. The mRNA, constructs, reagents were developed at the Salk institute and at Vical by Dr. Malone, this included dosing amounts for the in-vivo experiments. RNA and DNA were sent to Dr. Jon Wolff via Fedex. Dr.Wolff at the University of Wisconsin injected mice and rats. The initial patent disclosures for RNA and DNA vaccination were written by Dr. Malone in 1988-1989. Dr. Malone was also an inventor of DNA vaccines in 1988 and 1989.

    This body of work resulted in over 10 patents and numerous publications, yielding about 7000 citations for this work. The paper was the first showing data for DNA and RNA side by side for in-vivo (the first paper for in-vivo DNA):

    Direct gene transfer into mouse muscle in vivo. Wolff JA, Malone RW, et al. Science. 1990;247(4949 Pt 1):1465-8. Cited in 4,750 articles, is the result of that work.

    In 1989, research was performed that gave rise to the 10+ groundbreaking patents on mRNA vaccination, all with a priority date of March 3, 1989. This is the same priority date as the Salk Patent application, showing that the two institutions were working together (without Robert’s knowledge). These patents are the first published research on mRNA vaccination. The titles and links to the patents are listed in the documents below. These patents have proof of principle experiments on mRNA vaccines - that clearly document that the invention worked and that these are the first experiments showing this.

    Vical was to license the Salk Technology. Instead, they hired Robert’s thesis advisor from the Salk and soon after, the Salk dropped the patent and Vical never pursued a license from the Salk. Due to an employee contract with Vical, this stopped Robert from working in the field commercially for a decade. Vical claimed all the Salk research happened at Vical and sent a cease and desist letter.

    Dr. Malone carried on his research into mRNA vaccination during the 1990s, culminating in a mucosal patent that was issued in 2000. He also helped revolutionized the field of cationic liposomes for the use in RNA vaccinations. This work was so far ahead of its time, that only now is the world turning to mucosal mRNA vaccination as a method of immunization. For a listing of some of his work, see the publications at the end of this page.

    Scientifically trained at UC Davis, UC San Diego, and at the Salk Institute Molecular Biology and Virology laboratories, Dr. Malone received his medical training at Northwestern University (MD) and Harvard University Medical School (Clinical Research Post Graduate) , and in Pathology at UC Davis, He has almost 100 peer-reviewed publications, and has been an invited speaker at about 50 conferences.

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    gvn2fly1421gvn2fly1421 Posts: 935
    nicknyr15 said:
    Were those Texas democrats who caught the virus all vaccinated? 

    It’s sad that I have to even type this but I’m legitimately asking, not instigating or trying to prove any point. 
    All of them were.  Could you imagine the media coverage had they all had an "R" after their names? 
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    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,801
    @gvn2fly1421 wait until you see all the cool things I have done, as evidenced on what I put on my LLC page when trying to drive my consulting business. 
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    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,801
    nicknyr15 said:
    Were those Texas democrats who caught the virus all vaccinated? 

    It’s sad that I have to even type this but I’m legitimately asking, not instigating or trying to prove any point. 
    All of them were.  Could you imagine the media coverage had they all had an "R" after their names? 
    6 have tested positive out of 60 that went.  That's a 10% infection rate, for all of you non math majors.  And what is the estimated efficacy rate of the vaccines against the delta variant?  According to research, somewhere in the 80's https://www.healthline.com/health-news/heres-how-well-covid-19-vaccines-work-against-the-delta-variant#Vaccines-vs.-delta-variant

    Now 60 people is not statistically significant, so there could have been 3 infections, or 20 and the studies could still be right.  But to anticipate zero cases when there was someone in there obviously infected, would be an unwise expectation.  
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    gvn2fly1421gvn2fly1421 Posts: 935
    mrussel1 said:
    @gvn2fly1421 wait until you see all the cool things I have done, as evidenced on what I put on my LLC page when trying to drive my consulting business. 
    I hear ya.  And I updated my original post stating that him being the inventor was a disputed claim.

    But again, so weird to continue to consider yourself that when it is so easy to disprove, right?
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    RunIntoTheRainRunIntoTheRain Texas Posts: 1,013
    Thank you @mrussel1 for researching and posting the factual info.
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    KatKat There's a lot to be said for nowhere. Posts: 4,777
    I'm constantly stunned by how many liars are out there...good reason to be careful. Thank you for updating your post. :)

    Falling down,...not staying down
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    gimmesometruth27gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 22,271
    nicknyr15 said:
    Were those Texas democrats who caught the virus all vaccinated? 

    It’s sad that I have to even type this but I’m legitimately asking, not instigating or trying to prove any point. 
    i don't know, but they all look pretty stupid now in those photos taken on the plane with none of them wearing masks.
    There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
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