Seat Confirmations - Week of Jan. 27

tdawe

mpedone said:

hihobibo said:

Saltzy23 said:

mcgruff10 said:

I don't understand why they don't release the ticket info to all since it seems like everything is in place.

It's absurd.

The F2F marketplaces should all be up as well.

There is literally no reason to keep waiting.  Not so that they know where they are sitting as much as opening up the marketplaces to allow people to start posting and buying if they are looking.

I do not understand why we need to wait until mid-late February to be able to buy any secondary tickets for any shows that are not NYC or CO.

The wait should be there. It seems so many people are ready to SELL on the exchange right now than buy. But why? We were only offered the tickets a couple weeks ago. Don't put in if you aren't going to go. This site now gives everyone an out, so they can get the thrill of winning the lottery, but then change their mind about flying across the country to actually go. The rumors thread was accurate for a few weeks ahead of the announcement, enough time to prepare plans in case you won. 

I think a lot of people are hoping to get tickets to MSG and/or Baltimore (and all the others, obviously) via the F2F exchange. Way more than are eager to sell.

I've explained this too many times now in another thread but there are no going to be tickets available for MSG on the F2F exchange. Apparently some Redditor was told by TM that they weren't setting it up in the first place, but even if they do there won't be any tickets on it.

For the non-transferable shows, including Baltimore, I have a theory that scalpers bought up tickets like they would for any other show without really understanding how non-resellable they would be. There are some listed on second- or third-tier resale websites proposing sketchy arrangements involving sales of TM account passwords and whatnot, but I doubt they'll find many takers for those and in any event there don't seem to be as many listings as you would expect. My prediction is that there will be some tickets on the exchanges the minute they open up (a combination of scalpers trying to get their money back, the odd fan whose plans changed between the lottery/sale and 2/18, and maybe possibly TM holding back some primary inventory to throw on there just to get the traffic going). Those will sell immediately, then it will be a ghost town until late March when people who can't make the shows start to move their tix. 

estarr31

Saltzy23 said:

mcgruff10 said:

I don't understand why they don't release the ticket info to all since it seems like everything is in place.

It's absurd.

The F2F marketplaces should all be up as well.

There is literally no reason to keep waiting.  Not so that they know where they are sitting as much as opening up the marketplaces to allow people to start posting and buying if they are looking.

I do not understand why we need to wait until mid-late February to be able to buy any secondary tickets for any shows that are not NYC or CO.

I don't know why it matters that this be done now. It's a new system and maybe they still need to figure out the kinks. 

gettingright

mpedone said:

Lerxst1992 said:

PB11041 said:

Saltzy23 said:

pbultimate said:

Saltzy23 said:

mcgruff10 said:

I don't understand why they don't release the ticket info to all since it seems like everything is in place.

It's absurd.

The F2F marketplaces should all be up as well.

There is literally no reason to keep waiting.  Not so that they know where they are sitting as much as opening up the marketplaces to allow people to start posting and buying if they are looking.

I do not understand why we need to wait until mid-late February to be able to buy any secondary tickets for any shows that are not NYC or CO.

Im being serious cause i’ve never heard of F2F until this yr. 

is it already in place for other acts or is it a new system they may be designing?

It's a new thing for me as well.  I'm pretty sure it's a new thing they are trying in general.  

I get the overall idea, even if I may disagree with it in many ways, but at least get the damn execution of it right. 

My personal belief is that if someone gets shut out of a show and is willing to pay market price to get in, they should be allowed to in a free market capitalist society, but I also understand that people are sick of people acquiring tickets SOLELY so that they can flip them and make a bundle of cash.

Having like 3 more weeks before these F2F marketplaces open up sucks one way or the other though.  

Just, why?

that is not how markets work, the buyer of goods is not the only determining factor in an economic system, the producer is allowed to set prices and adjust or not adjust based on their choice

Producer only sets the wholesale markets, not resale. 

In this case the producer is setting an artificially low price, and trying to prohibit the market to correct.

Then the producer is trying to artificially restrict resale supply, something that can not be successfully 100% accomplished.

So the result is that pairs of tickets that do squeeze out into the market, are 15 TIMES more expensive than comparable performer tickets.

Solution: producer sets an absurdly high price, like 15 times what the most expensive MSG ticket is going for now. There's no secondary market if there's no primary market!

The problem in price setting in this case is what the motive for the pricing is. If profit is the main motive, which is what we are accustomed to in a capitalist society, then every seat would have its own price according to its relative proximity to the stage because at a concert not all seats are equal in value.

This would allow the producer to capture the maximum amount of profit by creating an equilibrium price for each seat/section in the venue. Many producers have gone to this method to help squeeze secondary markets out and capture the profit lost to the secondary market. However, this comes with the social cost of appearing greedy by allowing only those with the financial means to access the market, which, for various reasons, buyers in the market place frown on severely. When it comes to purchasing art, social pressure on the artist is that they should make available the art to everyone equally regardless of true market value. Furthermore, a misconception also exists that those who have invested previous time and money are more deserving of the value than the artist, and should have access below market value. But, from a capitalist perspective, this is incorrect. Previous time and money spent on the product are not investments to be cashed in on later, but rather, sunk costs that have no future value. You got what you paid for when you paid for it, and there is no obligation from the seller to provide anything more in the future. (On a side note: this is the same principle when people expect sex in the future for monies spent on a date in the present, which I am (maybe) coining now as a "sexvestment." But, the same principle applies of a sunk cost vs. an investment - there should be no future expectations of increasing value).

Clearly, the main motive is not profit for this producer as they provide the best seats (and what would be most expensive seats) to their fan club members. So, in a sense, the band is providing value on past investment of time and money. This should create great joy among the group of buyers as they are essentially getting an extremely high value for the tickets, and are being rewarded for previous purchases. The problem is that when some have invested more over time, and are not selected for an item where demand exceeds supply, they have a strong sense that an injustice has taken place. What they fail to realize is that the very market the producer has created is, from a profit perspective, a total injustice to the producer. 

Lastly, once a purchase is able to be made, a buyer can seek to increase that value in a couple of ways. First, you can gain financially by reselling a ticket purchased at well below market value for true market value. Or, if a buyer gets GA tickets, they can seek to increase the experiential value of their ticket by lining up early to turn a potential 25th row seat into a maximum 1st row seat, which will really maximize their overall utility on the ticket purchased with the relatively small investment of time.

In conclusion, your previous expenses are not investments, but rather sunk costs for which you should not hope to gain any future value on. The producers (Pearl Jam), from a strictly profit perspective, have created a market place where they are the biggest losers. Furthermore, they have done their best to keep secondary sales to a minimum so that their lost profits don't get into others' hands, and that those who have invested their time and money over the years have access to the best seats at an extraordinarily low cost. So, even if you didn't get selected in the lottery, you should not only be not gutted, you should be thanking the band (unless you have a lot of money where you could afford to pay true market value) for the opportunity to purchase something at well below market value.

Sorry for the long post; I love economics.

UseUrIllusions

gettingright said:

mpedone said:

Lerxst1992 said:

PB11041 said:

Saltzy23 said:

pbultimate said:

Saltzy23 said:

mcgruff10 said:

I don't understand why they don't release the ticket info to all since it seems like everything is in place.

It's absurd.

The F2F marketplaces should all be up as well.

There is literally no reason to keep waiting.  Not so that they know where they are sitting as much as opening up the marketplaces to allow people to start posting and buying if they are looking.

I do not understand why we need to wait until mid-late February to be able to buy any secondary tickets for any shows that are not NYC or CO.

Im being serious cause i’ve never heard of F2F until this yr. 

is it already in place for other acts or is it a new system they may be designing?

It's a new thing for me as well.  I'm pretty sure it's a new thing they are trying in general.  

I get the overall idea, even if I may disagree with it in many ways, but at least get the damn execution of it right. 

My personal belief is that if someone gets shut out of a show and is willing to pay market price to get in, they should be allowed to in a free market capitalist society, but I also understand that people are sick of people acquiring tickets SOLELY so that they can flip them and make a bundle of cash.

Having like 3 more weeks before these F2F marketplaces open up sucks one way or the other though.  

Just, why?

that is not how markets work, the buyer of goods is not the only determining factor in an economic system, the producer is allowed to set prices and adjust or not adjust based on their choice

Producer only sets the wholesale markets, not resale. 

In this case the producer is setting an artificially low price, and trying to prohibit the market to correct.

Then the producer is trying to artificially restrict resale supply, something that can not be successfully 100% accomplished.

So the result is that pairs of tickets that do squeeze out into the market, are 15 TIMES more expensive than comparable performer tickets.

Solution: producer sets an absurdly high price, like 15 times what the most expensive MSG ticket is going for now. There's no secondary market if there's no primary market!

The problem in price setting in this case is what the motive for the pricing is. If profit is the main motive, which is what we are accustomed to in a capitalist society, then every seat would have its own price according to its relative proximity to the stage because at a concert not all seats are equal in value.

This would allow the producer to capture the maximum amount of profit by creating an equilibrium price for each seat/section in the venue. Many producers have gone to this method to help squeeze secondary markets out and capture the profit lost to the secondary market. However, this comes with the social cost of appearing greedy by allowing only those with the financial means to access the market, which, for various reasons, buyers in the market place frown on severely. When it comes to purchasing art, social pressure on the artist is that they should make available the art to everyone equally regardless of true market value. Furthermore, a misconception also exists that those who have invested previous time and money are more deserving of the value than the artist, and should have access below market value. But, from a capitalist perspective, this is incorrect. Previous time and money spent on the product are not investments to be cashed in on later, but rather, sunk costs that have no future value. You got what you paid for when you paid for it, and there is no obligation from the seller to provide anything more in the future. (On a side note: this is the same principle when people expect sex in the future for monies spent on a date in the present, which I am (maybe) coining now as a "sexvestment." But, the same principle applies of a sunk cost vs. an investment - there should be no future expectations of increasing value).

Clearly, the main motive is not profit for this producer as they provide the best seats (and what would be most expensive seats) to their fan club members. So, in a sense, the band is providing value on past investment of time and money. This should create great joy among the group of buyers as they are essentially getting an extremely high value for the tickets, and are being rewarded for previous purchases. The problem is that when some have invested more over time, and are not selected for an item where demand exceeds supply, they have a strong sense that an injustice has taken place. What they fail to realize is that the very market the producer has created is, from a profit perspective, a total injustice to the producer. 

Lastly, once a purchase is able to be made, a buyer can seek to increase that value in a couple of ways. First, you can gain financially by reselling a ticket purchased at well below market value for true market value. Or, if a buyer gets GA tickets, they can seek to increase the experiential value of their ticket by lining up early to turn a potential 25th row seat into a maximum 1st row seat, which will really maximize their overall utility on the ticket purchased with the relatively small investment of time.

In conclusion, your previous expenses are not investments, but rather sunk costs for which you should not hope to gain any future value on. The producers (Pearl Jam), from a strictly profit perspective, have created a market place where they are the biggest losers. Furthermore, they have done their best to keep secondary sales to a minimum so that their lost profits don't get into others' hands, and that those who have invested their time and money over the years have access to the best seats at an extraordinarily low cost. So, even if you didn't get selected in the lottery, you should not only be not gutted, you should be thanking the band (unless you have a lot of money where you could afford to pay true market value) for the opportunity to purchase something at well below market value.

Sorry for the long post; I love economics.

well said, however with the amount of merchandise PJ sells, in the end, they are the biggest winners. 

Bentleyspop

Why doesn't 10club understand that as soon as we get seat locations we can all start threads complaining about....

Seat location 
Seat numbers
Seniority
10club allocations
Ticketmaster.com 
The TM plot against 10club members
TM being a criminal enterprise
Etc etc

PD279656

The ticket prices on ebay are hilarious. 

Matts3221

Habit4me said:

Sorry gang but 705xxx GA PIT. Denver.

No need to apologize , enjoy every min of it.

pledgeagrievance

Matts3221 said:

Habit4me said:

Sorry gang but 705xxx GA PIT. Denver.

No need to apologize , enjoy every min of it.

What number in line are you?

PSUS2H

Everyones waiting for seat confirmations (me too) but I'm really waiting for that Ohana line up announcement! hit me! 

mpedone

tdawe said:

mpedone said:

hihobibo said:

Saltzy23 said:

mcgruff10 said:

I don't understand why they don't release the ticket info to all since it seems like everything is in place.

It's absurd.

The F2F marketplaces should all be up as well.

There is literally no reason to keep waiting.  Not so that they know where they are sitting as much as opening up the marketplaces to allow people to start posting and buying if they are looking.

I do not understand why we need to wait until mid-late February to be able to buy any secondary tickets for any shows that are not NYC or CO.

The wait should be there. It seems so many people are ready to SELL on the exchange right now than buy. But why? We were only offered the tickets a couple weeks ago. Don't put in if you aren't going to go. This site now gives everyone an out, so they can get the thrill of winning the lottery, but then change their mind about flying across the country to actually go. The rumors thread was accurate for a few weeks ahead of the announcement, enough time to prepare plans in case you won. 

I think a lot of people are hoping to get tickets to MSG and/or Baltimore (and all the others, obviously) via the F2F exchange. Way more than are eager to sell.

I've explained this too many times now in another thread but there are no going to be tickets available for MSG on the F2F exchange. Apparently some Redditor was told by TM that they weren't setting it up in the first place, but even if they do there won't be any tickets on it.

For the non-transferable shows, including Baltimore, I have a theory that scalpers bought up tickets like they would for any other show without really understanding how non-resellable they would be. There are some listed on second- or third-tier resale websites proposing sketchy arrangements involving sales of TM account passwords and whatnot, but I doubt they'll find many takers for those and in any event there don't seem to be as many listings as you would expect. My prediction is that there will be some tickets on the exchanges the minute they open up (a combination of scalpers trying to get their money back, the odd fan whose plans changed between the lottery/sale and 2/18, and maybe possibly TM holding back some primary inventory to throw on there just to get the traffic going). Those will sell immediately, then it will be a ghost town until late March when people who can't make the shows start to move their tix. 

I will believe that about the MSG Tix when the F2F starts. I've seen enough reports about TM CSRs giving out erroneous info to not simply swallow it, especially not second- or third-hand. That said, I agree that it wouldn't make sense to sell tix to MSG there. My point in bringing it up was simply that I think there are many more people posting here looking to buy than are eager to sell, in contrast to what hihobibo posted.

Lostpawn

UseUrIllusions said:

gettingright said:

mpedone said:

Lerxst1992 said:

PB11041 said:

Saltzy23 said:

pbultimate said:

Saltzy23 said:

mcgruff10 said:

I don't understand why they don't release the ticket info to all since it seems like everything is in place.

It's absurd.

The F2F marketplaces should all be up as well.

There is literally no reason to keep waiting.  Not so that they know where they are sitting as much as opening up the marketplaces to allow people to start posting and buying if they are looking.

I do not understand why we need to wait until mid-late February to be able to buy any secondary tickets for any shows that are not NYC or CO.

Im being serious cause i’ve never heard of F2F until this yr. 

is it already in place for other acts or is it a new system they may be designing?

It's a new thing for me as well.  I'm pretty sure it's a new thing they are trying in general.  

I get the overall idea, even if I may disagree with it in many ways, but at least get the damn execution of it right. 

My personal belief is that if someone gets shut out of a show and is willing to pay market price to get in, they should be allowed to in a free market capitalist society, but I also understand that people are sick of people acquiring tickets SOLELY so that they can flip them and make a bundle of cash.

Having like 3 more weeks before these F2F marketplaces open up sucks one way or the other though.  

Just, why?

that is not how markets work, the buyer of goods is not the only determining factor in an economic system, the producer is allowed to set prices and adjust or not adjust based on their choice

Producer only sets the wholesale markets, not resale. 

In this case the producer is setting an artificially low price, and trying to prohibit the market to correct.

Then the producer is trying to artificially restrict resale supply, something that can not be successfully 100% accomplished.

So the result is that pairs of tickets that do squeeze out into the market, are 15 TIMES more expensive than comparable performer tickets.

Solution: producer sets an absurdly high price, like 15 times what the most expensive MSG ticket is going for now. There's no secondary market if there's no primary market!

The problem in price setting in this case is what the motive for the pricing is. If profit is the main motive, which is what we are accustomed to in a capitalist society, then every seat would have its own price according to its relative proximity to the stage because at a concert not all seats are equal in value.

This would allow the producer to capture the maximum amount of profit by creating an equilibrium price for each seat/section in the venue. Many producers have gone to this method to help squeeze secondary markets out and capture the profit lost to the secondary market. However, this comes with the social cost of appearing greedy by allowing only those with the financial means to access the market, which, for various reasons, buyers in the market place frown on severely. When it comes to purchasing art, social pressure on the artist is that they should make available the art to everyone equally regardless of true market value. Furthermore, a misconception also exists that those who have invested previous time and money are more deserving of the value than the artist, and should have access below market value. But, from a capitalist perspective, this is incorrect. Previous time and money spent on the product are not investments to be cashed in on later, but rather, sunk costs that have no future value. You got what you paid for when you paid for it, and there is no obligation from the seller to provide anything more in the future. (On a side note: this is the same principle when people expect sex in the future for monies spent on a date in the present, which I am (maybe) coining now as a "sexvestment." But, the same principle applies of a sunk cost vs. an investment - there should be no future expectations of increasing value).

Clearly, the main motive is not profit for this producer as they provide the best seats (and what would be most expensive seats) to their fan club members. So, in a sense, the band is providing value on past investment of time and money. This should create great joy among the group of buyers as they are essentially getting an extremely high value for the tickets, and are being rewarded for previous purchases. The problem is that when some have invested more over time, and are not selected for an item where demand exceeds supply, they have a strong sense that an injustice has taken place. What they fail to realize is that the very market the producer has created is, from a profit perspective, a total injustice to the producer. 

Lastly, once a purchase is able to be made, a buyer can seek to increase that value in a couple of ways. First, you can gain financially by reselling a ticket purchased at well below market value for true market value. Or, if a buyer gets GA tickets, they can seek to increase the experiential value of their ticket by lining up early to turn a potential 25th row seat into a maximum 1st row seat, which will really maximize their overall utility on the ticket purchased with the relatively small investment of time.

In conclusion, your previous expenses are not investments, but rather sunk costs for which you should not hope to gain any future value on. The producers (Pearl Jam), from a strictly profit perspective, have created a market place where they are the biggest losers. Furthermore, they have done their best to keep secondary sales to a minimum so that their lost profits don't get into others' hands, and that those who have invested their time and money over the years have access to the best seats at an extraordinarily low cost. So, even if you didn't get selected in the lottery, you should not only be not gutted, you should be thanking the band (unless you have a lot of money where you could afford to pay true market value) for the opportunity to purchase something at well below market value.

Sorry for the long post; I love economics.

well said, however with the amount of merchandise PJ sells, in the end, they are the biggest winners. 

So the band is using concert tickets as a loss leader to get merch sales?  That’s a huge win for those of us who don’t go crazy on merch!!!

Foriginal Sin

I just joined the club last week, why don’t I deserve to be in the closest reserved seats? I’ve loved the band since 1985

ajflicker

leebug87 said:

One of my Canadian friends said that they have seat confirmations already - anyone else? I thought that the confirmations werent beings sent until Friday?

Canadian here, no confirm yet.

UseUrIllusions

Lostpawn said:

UseUrIllusions said:

gettingright said:

mpedone said:

Lerxst1992 said:

PB11041 said:

Saltzy23 said:

pbultimate said:

Saltzy23 said:

mcgruff10 said:

I don't understand why they don't release the ticket info to all since it seems like everything is in place.

It's absurd.

The F2F marketplaces should all be up as well.

There is literally no reason to keep waiting.  Not so that they know where they are sitting as much as opening up the marketplaces to allow people to start posting and buying if they are looking.

I do not understand why we need to wait until mid-late February to be able to buy any secondary tickets for any shows that are not NYC or CO.

Im being serious cause i’ve never heard of F2F until this yr. 

is it already in place for other acts or is it a new system they may be designing?

It's a new thing for me as well.  I'm pretty sure it's a new thing they are trying in general.  

I get the overall idea, even if I may disagree with it in many ways, but at least get the damn execution of it right. 

My personal belief is that if someone gets shut out of a show and is willing to pay market price to get in, they should be allowed to in a free market capitalist society, but I also understand that people are sick of people acquiring tickets SOLELY so that they can flip them and make a bundle of cash.

Having like 3 more weeks before these F2F marketplaces open up sucks one way or the other though.  

Just, why?

that is not how markets work, the buyer of goods is not the only determining factor in an economic system, the producer is allowed to set prices and adjust or not adjust based on their choice

Producer only sets the wholesale markets, not resale. 

In this case the producer is setting an artificially low price, and trying to prohibit the market to correct.

Then the producer is trying to artificially restrict resale supply, something that can not be successfully 100% accomplished.

So the result is that pairs of tickets that do squeeze out into the market, are 15 TIMES more expensive than comparable performer tickets.

Solution: producer sets an absurdly high price, like 15 times what the most expensive MSG ticket is going for now. There's no secondary market if there's no primary market!

The problem in price setting in this case is what the motive for the pricing is. If profit is the main motive, which is what we are accustomed to in a capitalist society, then every seat would have its own price according to its relative proximity to the stage because at a concert not all seats are equal in value.

This would allow the producer to capture the maximum amount of profit by creating an equilibrium price for each seat/section in the venue. Many producers have gone to this method to help squeeze secondary markets out and capture the profit lost to the secondary market. However, this comes with the social cost of appearing greedy by allowing only those with the financial means to access the market, which, for various reasons, buyers in the market place frown on severely. When it comes to purchasing art, social pressure on the artist is that they should make available the art to everyone equally regardless of true market value. Furthermore, a misconception also exists that those who have invested previous time and money are more deserving of the value than the artist, and should have access below market value. But, from a capitalist perspective, this is incorrect. Previous time and money spent on the product are not investments to be cashed in on later, but rather, sunk costs that have no future value. You got what you paid for when you paid for it, and there is no obligation from the seller to provide anything more in the future. (On a side note: this is the same principle when people expect sex in the future for monies spent on a date in the present, which I am (maybe) coining now as a "sexvestment." But, the same principle applies of a sunk cost vs. an investment - there should be no future expectations of increasing value).

Clearly, the main motive is not profit for this producer as they provide the best seats (and what would be most expensive seats) to their fan club members. So, in a sense, the band is providing value on past investment of time and money. This should create great joy among the group of buyers as they are essentially getting an extremely high value for the tickets, and are being rewarded for previous purchases. The problem is that when some have invested more over time, and are not selected for an item where demand exceeds supply, they have a strong sense that an injustice has taken place. What they fail to realize is that the very market the producer has created is, from a profit perspective, a total injustice to the producer. 

Lastly, once a purchase is able to be made, a buyer can seek to increase that value in a couple of ways. First, you can gain financially by reselling a ticket purchased at well below market value for true market value. Or, if a buyer gets GA tickets, they can seek to increase the experiential value of their ticket by lining up early to turn a potential 25th row seat into a maximum 1st row seat, which will really maximize their overall utility on the ticket purchased with the relatively small investment of time.

In conclusion, your previous expenses are not investments, but rather sunk costs for which you should not hope to gain any future value on. The producers (Pearl Jam), from a strictly profit perspective, have created a market place where they are the biggest losers. Furthermore, they have done their best to keep secondary sales to a minimum so that their lost profits don't get into others' hands, and that those who have invested their time and money over the years have access to the best seats at an extraordinarily low cost. So, even if you didn't get selected in the lottery, you should not only be not gutted, you should be thanking the band (unless you have a lot of money where you could afford to pay true market value) for the opportunity to purchase something at well below market value.

Sorry for the long post; I love economics.

well said, however with the amount of merchandise PJ sells, in the end, they are the biggest winners. 

So the band is using concert tickets as a loss leader to get merch sales?  That’s a huge win for those of us who don’t go crazy on merch!!!

The real profit is in the merchandise, always has been. 

ajflicker

CantKeepmedown said:

100 Pacer said:

MakeUSmile said:

FWIW... His msg seats are in the first few rows of floor E with a 130k number. If it sticks

Interesting - if that’s true my number is 131,XXX so the reserved pair should be in the same vicinity.

Makes me wonder if my 198xxx number ends up in the back of the floor.  

I'm going in with a "just happy to be in the building" mentality.  That's the only way to do it.  

In 2016 in Ottawa my 535xxx got me 4 rows back from GA pit on the floor.

Vedd Hedd

Lostpawn

UseUrIllusions said:

Lostpawn said:

UseUrIllusions said:

gettingright said:

mpedone said:

Lerxst1992 said:

PB11041 said:

Saltzy23 said:

pbultimate said:

Saltzy23 said:

mcgruff10 said:

I don't understand why they don't release the ticket info to all since it seems like everything is in place.

It's absurd.

The F2F marketplaces should all be up as well.

There is literally no reason to keep waiting.  Not so that they know where they are sitting as much as opening up the marketplaces to allow people to start posting and buying if they are looking.

I do not understand why we need to wait until mid-late February to be able to buy any secondary tickets for any shows that are not NYC or CO.

Im being serious cause i’ve never heard of F2F until this yr. 

is it already in place for other acts or is it a new system they may be designing?

It's a new thing for me as well.  I'm pretty sure it's a new thing they are trying in general.  

I get the overall idea, even if I may disagree with it in many ways, but at least get the damn execution of it right. 

My personal belief is that if someone gets shut out of a show and is willing to pay market price to get in, they should be allowed to in a free market capitalist society, but I also understand that people are sick of people acquiring tickets SOLELY so that they can flip them and make a bundle of cash.

Having like 3 more weeks before these F2F marketplaces open up sucks one way or the other though.  

Just, why?

that is not how markets work, the buyer of goods is not the only determining factor in an economic system, the producer is allowed to set prices and adjust or not adjust based on their choice

Producer only sets the wholesale markets, not resale. 

In this case the producer is setting an artificially low price, and trying to prohibit the market to correct.

Then the producer is trying to artificially restrict resale supply, something that can not be successfully 100% accomplished.

So the result is that pairs of tickets that do squeeze out into the market, are 15 TIMES more expensive than comparable performer tickets.

Solution: producer sets an absurdly high price, like 15 times what the most expensive MSG ticket is going for now. There's no secondary market if there's no primary market!

The problem in price setting in this case is what the motive for the pricing is. If profit is the main motive, which is what we are accustomed to in a capitalist society, then every seat would have its own price according to its relative proximity to the stage because at a concert not all seats are equal in value.

This would allow the producer to capture the maximum amount of profit by creating an equilibrium price for each seat/section in the venue. Many producers have gone to this method to help squeeze secondary markets out and capture the profit lost to the secondary market. However, this comes with the social cost of appearing greedy by allowing only those with the financial means to access the market, which, for various reasons, buyers in the market place frown on severely. When it comes to purchasing art, social pressure on the artist is that they should make available the art to everyone equally regardless of true market value. Furthermore, a misconception also exists that those who have invested previous time and money are more deserving of the value than the artist, and should have access below market value. But, from a capitalist perspective, this is incorrect. Previous time and money spent on the product are not investments to be cashed in on later, but rather, sunk costs that have no future value. You got what you paid for when you paid for it, and there is no obligation from the seller to provide anything more in the future. (On a side note: this is the same principle when people expect sex in the future for monies spent on a date in the present, which I am (maybe) coining now as a "sexvestment." But, the same principle applies of a sunk cost vs. an investment - there should be no future expectations of increasing value).

Clearly, the main motive is not profit for this producer as they provide the best seats (and what would be most expensive seats) to their fan club members. So, in a sense, the band is providing value on past investment of time and money. This should create great joy among the group of buyers as they are essentially getting an extremely high value for the tickets, and are being rewarded for previous purchases. The problem is that when some have invested more over time, and are not selected for an item where demand exceeds supply, they have a strong sense that an injustice has taken place. What they fail to realize is that the very market the producer has created is, from a profit perspective, a total injustice to the producer. 

Lastly, once a purchase is able to be made, a buyer can seek to increase that value in a couple of ways. First, you can gain financially by reselling a ticket purchased at well below market value for true market value. Or, if a buyer gets GA tickets, they can seek to increase the experiential value of their ticket by lining up early to turn a potential 25th row seat into a maximum 1st row seat, which will really maximize their overall utility on the ticket purchased with the relatively small investment of time.

In conclusion, your previous expenses are not investments, but rather sunk costs for which you should not hope to gain any future value on. The producers (Pearl Jam), from a strictly profit perspective, have created a market place where they are the biggest losers. Furthermore, they have done their best to keep secondary sales to a minimum so that their lost profits don't get into others' hands, and that those who have invested their time and money over the years have access to the best seats at an extraordinarily low cost. So, even if you didn't get selected in the lottery, you should not only be not gutted, you should be thanking the band (unless you have a lot of money where you could afford to pay true market value) for the opportunity to purchase something at well below market value.

Sorry for the long post; I love economics.

well said, however with the amount of merchandise PJ sells, in the end, they are the biggest winners. 

So the band is using concert tickets as a loss leader to get merch sales?  That’s a huge win for those of us who don’t go crazy on merch!!!

The real profit is in the merchandise, always has been. 

Oh, I believe you. Just calling it a win for folks like me. I go for the experience, not for the stuff. 

ryanphishes

UseUrIllusions said:

Lostpawn said:

UseUrIllusions said:

gettingright said:

mpedone said:

Lerxst1992 said:

PB11041 said:

Saltzy23 said:

pbultimate said:

Saltzy23 said:

mcgruff10 said:

I don't understand why they don't release the ticket info to all since it seems like everything is in place.

It's absurd.

The F2F marketplaces should all be up as well.

There is literally no reason to keep waiting.  Not so that they know where they are sitting as much as opening up the marketplaces to allow people to start posting and buying if they are looking.

I do not understand why we need to wait until mid-late February to be able to buy any secondary tickets for any shows that are not NYC or CO.

Im being serious cause i’ve never heard of F2F until this yr. 

is it already in place for other acts or is it a new system they may be designing?

It's a new thing for me as well.  I'm pretty sure it's a new thing they are trying in general.  

I get the overall idea, even if I may disagree with it in many ways, but at least get the damn execution of it right. 

My personal belief is that if someone gets shut out of a show and is willing to pay market price to get in, they should be allowed to in a free market capitalist society, but I also understand that people are sick of people acquiring tickets SOLELY so that they can flip them and make a bundle of cash.

Having like 3 more weeks before these F2F marketplaces open up sucks one way or the other though.  

Just, why?

that is not how markets work, the buyer of goods is not the only determining factor in an economic system, the producer is allowed to set prices and adjust or not adjust based on their choice

Producer only sets the wholesale markets, not resale. 

In this case the producer is setting an artificially low price, and trying to prohibit the market to correct.

Then the producer is trying to artificially restrict resale supply, something that can not be successfully 100% accomplished.

So the result is that pairs of tickets that do squeeze out into the market, are 15 TIMES more expensive than comparable performer tickets.

Solution: producer sets an absurdly high price, like 15 times what the most expensive MSG ticket is going for now. There's no secondary market if there's no primary market!

The problem in price setting in this case is what the motive for the pricing is. If profit is the main motive, which is what we are accustomed to in a capitalist society, then every seat would have its own price according to its relative proximity to the stage because at a concert not all seats are equal in value.

This would allow the producer to capture the maximum amount of profit by creating an equilibrium price for each seat/section in the venue. Many producers have gone to this method to help squeeze secondary markets out and capture the profit lost to the secondary market. However, this comes with the social cost of appearing greedy by allowing only those with the financial means to access the market, which, for various reasons, buyers in the market place frown on severely. When it comes to purchasing art, social pressure on the artist is that they should make available the art to everyone equally regardless of true market value. Furthermore, a misconception also exists that those who have invested previous time and money are more deserving of the value than the artist, and should have access below market value. But, from a capitalist perspective, this is incorrect. Previous time and money spent on the product are not investments to be cashed in on later, but rather, sunk costs that have no future value. You got what you paid for when you paid for it, and there is no obligation from the seller to provide anything more in the future. (On a side note: this is the same principle when people expect sex in the future for monies spent on a date in the present, which I am (maybe) coining now as a "sexvestment." But, the same principle applies of a sunk cost vs. an investment - there should be no future expectations of increasing value).

Clearly, the main motive is not profit for this producer as they provide the best seats (and what would be most expensive seats) to their fan club members. So, in a sense, the band is providing value on past investment of time and money. This should create great joy among the group of buyers as they are essentially getting an extremely high value for the tickets, and are being rewarded for previous purchases. The problem is that when some have invested more over time, and are not selected for an item where demand exceeds supply, they have a strong sense that an injustice has taken place. What they fail to realize is that the very market the producer has created is, from a profit perspective, a total injustice to the producer. 

Lastly, once a purchase is able to be made, a buyer can seek to increase that value in a couple of ways. First, you can gain financially by reselling a ticket purchased at well below market value for true market value. Or, if a buyer gets GA tickets, they can seek to increase the experiential value of their ticket by lining up early to turn a potential 25th row seat into a maximum 1st row seat, which will really maximize their overall utility on the ticket purchased with the relatively small investment of time.

In conclusion, your previous expenses are not investments, but rather sunk costs for which you should not hope to gain any future value on. The producers (Pearl Jam), from a strictly profit perspective, have created a market place where they are the biggest losers. Furthermore, they have done their best to keep secondary sales to a minimum so that their lost profits don't get into others' hands, and that those who have invested their time and money over the years have access to the best seats at an extraordinarily low cost. So, even if you didn't get selected in the lottery, you should not only be not gutted, you should be thanking the band (unless you have a lot of money where you could afford to pay true market value) for the opportunity to purchase something at well below market value.

Sorry for the long post; I love economics.

well said, however with the amount of merchandise PJ sells, in the end, they are the biggest winners. 

So the band is using concert tickets as a loss leader to get merch sales?  That’s a huge win for those of us who don’t go crazy on merch!!!

The real profit is in the merchandise, always has been. 

Concession sales too.  Phish fans set an MGM concession record for alcohol a few years back for their vegas shows...and the venue let people bring in alcohol!

ajflicker

guitar101 said:

jeremyjmcb said:

JimmyV said:

guitar101 said:

JimmyV said:

guitar101 said:

https://am.ticketmaster.com/pearljamtenclub

No tickets for me yet but thanks for posting.

Didnt realize that was the old link from the home/away shows.

Really? Weird. I don't remember doing that in 2018.

No one is seeing new tickets in this link, correct?

I cant even login.  I tried my ticketmaster and 10 club login info.

I couldn't get in either.

rfherbst

Habit4me said:

Sorry gang but 705xxx GA PIT. Denver.

Wow.  Just curious - did you put in for BA or GA?