The Democratic Candidates

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Comments

  • mcgruff10mcgruff10 New Jersey Posts: 28,523
    mcgruff10 said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    Here's an opinion piece that pretty well matches my own.

    The only thing wrong with Elizabeth Warren’s campaign is the sexist way we react to it




    What a dumb dumb dumb article.  Breaking up google and amazon and student loan forgiveness is good policy?  It’s not that we are sexist, they are just really stupid ideas. 
    You know I'm not accusing you specifically of being sexist, right?? I'm making a much wider point than that. But as I already said, I really don't expect any of you to get where I'm coming from with this. That doesn't change how deeply I feel it's 100% true that America is absolutely really sexist in its politics (and that that is being reflected in this dem race perfectly well), and I think anyone denying it is being willfully ignorant IMHO.
    You don’t expect me to understand yet I voted for two female candidates in the past two years and they both lost. 

    The point being...?  I imagine you've voted for men in the past that have lost, too. 
    How could I be sexist if I voted for a female presidential candidate and New Jersey governor?

    -- What did them winning or losing have to do with anything?
    Nothing.  Just stated a fact. 
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • mcgruff10mcgruff10 New Jersey Posts: 28,523
    mcgruff10 said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    Here's an opinion piece that pretty well matches my own.

    The only thing wrong with Elizabeth Warren’s campaign is the sexist way we react to it




    What a dumb dumb dumb article.  Breaking up google and amazon and student loan forgiveness is good policy?  It’s not that we are sexist, they are just really stupid ideas. 
    You know I'm not accusing you specifically of being sexist, right?? I'm making a much wider point than that. But as I already said, I really don't expect any of you to get where I'm coming from with this. That doesn't change how deeply I feel it's 100% true that America is absolutely really sexist in its politics (and that that is being reflected in this dem race perfectly well), and I think anyone denying it is being willfully ignorant IMHO.
    You don’t expect me to understand yet I voted for two female candidates in the past two years and they both lost. 

    The point being...?  I imagine you've voted for men in the past that have lost, too. 
    How could I be sexist if I voted for a female presidential candidate and New Jersey governor?

    Do we have to point out that there's a whole lot more to not being sexist than voting for women twice?
    I thought we were talking about sexism in politics.  I m just pointing out that regardless of gender I vote for who I think is the best candidate. 

    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 49,961
    mcgruff10 said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    Here's an opinion piece that pretty well matches my own.

    The only thing wrong with Elizabeth Warren’s campaign is the sexist way we react to it




    What a dumb dumb dumb article.  Breaking up google and amazon and student loan forgiveness is good policy?  It’s not that we are sexist, they are just really stupid ideas. 
    You know I'm not accusing you specifically of being sexist, right?? I'm making a much wider point than that. But as I already said, I really don't expect any of you to get where I'm coming from with this. That doesn't change how deeply I feel it's 100% true that America is absolutely really sexist in its politics (and that that is being reflected in this dem race perfectly well), and I think anyone denying it is being willfully ignorant IMHO.
    You don’t expect me to understand yet I voted for two female candidates in the past two years and they both lost. 

    The point being...?  I imagine you've voted for men in the past that have lost, too. 
    How could I be sexist if I voted for a female presidential candidate and New Jersey governor?

    Do we have to point out that there's a whole lot more to not being sexist than voting for women twice?
    I thought we were talking about sexism in politics.  I m just pointing out that regardless of gender I vote for who I think is the best candidate. 

    And I'm talking about a way bigger issue, and you have proven you don't get what I'm even getting at.
    I've already posted a few articles here outlining what I mean by all this over the past few weeks, so I think my going into it further is pointless - sorry HFD, I know you asked. I simply don't have the energy right now. I'll continue posting articles that help make my point when I see them.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 37,047
    PJ Soul's point is not that the individual (you) is sexist, the system and how it is covered is. 
    "Oh Canada...you're beautiful when you're drunk"
    -EV  8/14/93




  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 49,961
    PJ Soul's point is not that the individual (you) is sexist, the system and how it is covered is. 
    Yes, thank you.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • cincybearcatcincybearcat Posts: 16,454
    It’s generally not a good strategy to say

    1) I don’t expect any of you to understand this 


    I do believe sexism plays a role, even in the Dems election process. I do not think it’s the only reason some women are not getting traction while some men are. I do believe that so many women running is a sign of progress and all things being equal, gender should play a role. That role being vote for the women all things being equal. 

    I think warren is getting a decent amount of press. She is just boring, so not capturing ears. She also focuses on policy which unfortunately appears to be a bad campaign strategy (see trumps win). But for me I just don’t like her policies. And I think Bernie is just as boring/annoying with bad policies. He just has some weird fan base since he has been working at this (presidential campaign) much longer than Warren. 

    I think Harris is screwing herself. Inability to answer tough questions makes the media cover less. But she could totally dominate the airwaves if she wanted to...ala Pete.

    Ill see how this thing shakes out before I decide if, in my opinion, sexism played a big role.

    Let me ask you this - who would be your vote right now?
    hippiemom = goodness
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 37,047
    PJ_Soul said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    Here's an opinion piece that pretty well matches my own.

    The only thing wrong with Elizabeth Warren’s campaign is the sexist way we react to it




    What a dumb dumb dumb article.  Breaking up google and amazon and student loan forgiveness is good policy?  It’s not that we are sexist, they are just really stupid ideas. 
    You know I'm not accusing you specifically of being sexist, right?? I'm making a much wider point than that. But as I already said, I really don't expect any of you to get where I'm coming from with this. That doesn't change how deeply I feel it's 100% true that America is absolutely really sexist in its politics (and that that is being reflected in this dem race perfectly well), and I think anyone denying it is being willfully ignorant IMHO.
    You don’t expect me to understand yet I voted for two female candidates in the past two years and they both lost. 

    The point being...?  I imagine you've voted for men in the past that have lost, too. 
    How could I be sexist if I voted for a female presidential candidate and New Jersey governor?

    Do we have to point out that there's a whole lot more to not being sexist than voting for women twice?
    I thought we were talking about sexism in politics.  I m just pointing out that regardless of gender I vote for who I think is the best candidate. 

    And I'm talking about a way bigger issue, and you have proven you don't get what I'm even getting at.
    I've already posted a few articles here outlining what I mean by all this over the past few weeks, so I think my going into it further is pointless - sorry HFD, I know you asked. I simply don't have the energy right now. I'll continue posting articles that help make my point when I see them.
    to be fair to McGruff, I can see where he easily misunderstood your point, since you didn't really articulate it (today). I haven't seen anything beyond the article you posted today. 

    I just think it's important, if you state something as harsh as "none of you men are going to understand my point",  to actually expand on that point. obviously, if you wish not to, that's your prerogative. 
    "Oh Canada...you're beautiful when you're drunk"
    -EV  8/14/93




  • erebuserebus Posts: 566
    Women, get out and vote and change the system. Women out number men in the US
    be the change you want to be
    you already see a good start in participation and female canidates running and being elected
    good ideas are not gender specific and neither are bad ones 

    good canidates will rise to the top .... Hopefully

    1996: Toronto
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    2005: Thunder Bay
    2008: West Palm Beach, Tampa
    2009: Chicago I, Chicago II
    2010: Boston
    2011: Toronto I, Toronto II, Winnipeg
    2012: Missoula
    2013: London, Pittsburgh, Buffalo
    2014: St. Paul, Milwaukee
    2016: Quebec City, Ottawa, Toronto I, Toronto II
    2022: Hamilton, Toronto 
    2023: St. Paul I, St. Paul II
    2024: Vancouver I, Vancouver II
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 30,534
    edited April 2019
    PJ_Soul said:
    PJ Soul's point is not that the individual (you) is sexist, the system and how it is covered is. 
    Yes, thank you.

    For 2019.

    Biden was Obamas VP and is a household name so ofc he will get attention.

    Bernie Sanders is still hot off the 2016 (or 15?) election and was the media darling underdog back then. 

    Beto fought - and air drummed - in Texas and almost won, and there has been talks about him running for president since then.

    But look at Warren and Harris - they do get attention.

    Not saying the system isn't sexist. But Warren is in the media alot.


     
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • mcgruff10mcgruff10 New Jersey Posts: 28,523
    PJ Soul's point is not that the individual (you) is sexist, the system and how it is covered is. 
    Understood, thank you for explaining.  It definitely was not articulated well. 
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 49,961
    It’s generally not a good strategy to say

    1) I don’t expect any of you to understand this 


    I do believe sexism plays a role, even in the Dems election process. I do not think it’s the only reason some women are not getting traction while some men are. I do believe that so many women running is a sign of progress and all things being equal, gender should play a role. That role being vote for the women all things being equal. 

    I think warren is getting a decent amount of press. She is just boring, so not capturing ears. She also focuses on policy which unfortunately appears to be a bad campaign strategy (see trumps win). But for me I just don’t like her policies. And I think Bernie is just as boring/annoying with bad policies. He just has some weird fan base since he has been working at this (presidential campaign) much longer than Warren. 

    I think Harris is screwing herself. Inability to answer tough questions makes the media cover less. But she could totally dominate the airwaves if she wanted to...ala Pete.

    Ill see how this thing shakes out before I decide if, in my opinion, sexism played a big role.

    Let me ask you this - who would be your vote right now?
    It's not a strategy. I say that because hardly anyone ever understands it. I say it because of experience with people's reaction to the concept. And the resistance and knee jerk reactions I always get have me completely fed up.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 37,047
    PJ_Soul said:
    It’s generally not a good strategy to say

    1) I don’t expect any of you to understand this 


    I do believe sexism plays a role, even in the Dems election process. I do not think it’s the only reason some women are not getting traction while some men are. I do believe that so many women running is a sign of progress and all things being equal, gender should play a role. That role being vote for the women all things being equal. 

    I think warren is getting a decent amount of press. She is just boring, so not capturing ears. She also focuses on policy which unfortunately appears to be a bad campaign strategy (see trumps win). But for me I just don’t like her policies. And I think Bernie is just as boring/annoying with bad policies. He just has some weird fan base since he has been working at this (presidential campaign) much longer than Warren. 

    I think Harris is screwing herself. Inability to answer tough questions makes the media cover less. But she could totally dominate the airwaves if she wanted to...ala Pete.

    Ill see how this thing shakes out before I decide if, in my opinion, sexism played a big role.

    Let me ask you this - who would be your vote right now?
    It's not a strategy. I say that because hardly anyone ever understands it. I say it because of experience with people's reaction to the concept. And the resistance and knee jerk reactions I always get have me completely fed up.
    beyond the concept, which is sexism is politics, I don't really know what we, as a collective, fail to understand, as I haven't personally seen anything where you've tried to explain it. If you have already and don't wish to rehash, fine, I just haven't seen it. 
    "Oh Canada...you're beautiful when you're drunk"
    -EV  8/14/93




  • oftenreadingoftenreading Victoria, BC Posts: 12,845
    PJ_Soul said:
    PJ Soul's point is not that the individual (you) is sexist, the system and how it is covered is. 
    Yes, thank you.

    For 2019.

    Biden was Obamas VP and is a household name so ofc he will get attention.

    Bernie Sanders is still hot off the 2016 (or 15?) election and was the media darling underdog back then. 

    Beto fought - and air drummed - in Texas and almost won, and there has been talks about him running for president since then.

    But look at Warren and Harris - they do get attention.

    Not saying the system isn't sexist. But Warren is in the media alot.


     

    What's the quality of the coverage, though? Being "in the media a lot" doesn't guarantee non-sexist coverage. That's never going to be accurately assessed in a graph like that, but the coverage of women often focuses far more on appearance and issues like how they get along with people, how "warm" they are, which is different than how men are covered.
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 49,961
    ^^^ Absolutely. It's a complicated fact.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 49,961
    PJ_Soul said:
    It’s generally not a good strategy to say

    1) I don’t expect any of you to understand this 


    I do believe sexism plays a role, even in the Dems election process. I do not think it’s the only reason some women are not getting traction while some men are. I do believe that so many women running is a sign of progress and all things being equal, gender should play a role. That role being vote for the women all things being equal. 

    I think warren is getting a decent amount of press. She is just boring, so not capturing ears. She also focuses on policy which unfortunately appears to be a bad campaign strategy (see trumps win). But for me I just don’t like her policies. And I think Bernie is just as boring/annoying with bad policies. He just has some weird fan base since he has been working at this (presidential campaign) much longer than Warren. 

    I think Harris is screwing herself. Inability to answer tough questions makes the media cover less. But she could totally dominate the airwaves if she wanted to...ala Pete.

    Ill see how this thing shakes out before I decide if, in my opinion, sexism played a big role.

    Let me ask you this - who would be your vote right now?
    It's not a strategy. I say that because hardly anyone ever understands it. I say it because of experience with people's reaction to the concept. And the resistance and knee jerk reactions I always get have me completely fed up.
    beyond the concept, which is sexism is politics, I don't really know what we, as a collective, fail to understand, as I haven't personally seen anything where you've tried to explain it. If you have already and don't wish to rehash, fine, I just haven't seen it. 
    Fair enough. I would go more into it, but I'm just too fucking sad and depressed right now. My cat died and I'm finding myself too devastated to have the drive to debate much.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 None Of Your Business... Posts: 10,739
    PJ_Soul said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    It’s generally not a good strategy to say

    1) I don’t expect any of you to understand this 


    I do believe sexism plays a role, even in the Dems election process. I do not think it’s the only reason some women are not getting traction while some men are. I do believe that so many women running is a sign of progress and all things being equal, gender should play a role. That role being vote for the women all things being equal. 

    I think warren is getting a decent amount of press. She is just boring, so not capturing ears. She also focuses on policy which unfortunately appears to be a bad campaign strategy (see trumps win). But for me I just don’t like her policies. And I think Bernie is just as boring/annoying with bad policies. He just has some weird fan base since he has been working at this (presidential campaign) much longer than Warren. 

    I think Harris is screwing herself. Inability to answer tough questions makes the media cover less. But she could totally dominate the airwaves if she wanted to...ala Pete.

    Ill see how this thing shakes out before I decide if, in my opinion, sexism played a big role.

    Let me ask you this - who would be your vote right now?
    It's not a strategy. I say that because hardly anyone ever understands it. I say it because of experience with people's reaction to the concept. And the resistance and knee jerk reactions I always get have me completely fed up.
    beyond the concept, which is sexism is politics, I don't really know what we, as a collective, fail to understand, as I haven't personally seen anything where you've tried to explain it. If you have already and don't wish to rehash, fine, I just haven't seen it. 
    Fair enough. I would go more into it, but I'm just too fucking sad and depressed right now. My cat died and I'm finding myself too devastated to have the drive to debate much.
    Sorry to hear about your cat...
    Give Peas A Chance…
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 30,534
    PJ_Soul said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    It’s generally not a good strategy to say

    1) I don’t expect any of you to understand this 


    I do believe sexism plays a role, even in the Dems election process. I do not think it’s the only reason some women are not getting traction while some men are. I do believe that so many women running is a sign of progress and all things being equal, gender should play a role. That role being vote for the women all things being equal. 

    I think warren is getting a decent amount of press. She is just boring, so not capturing ears. She also focuses on policy which unfortunately appears to be a bad campaign strategy (see trumps win). But for me I just don’t like her policies. And I think Bernie is just as boring/annoying with bad policies. He just has some weird fan base since he has been working at this (presidential campaign) much longer than Warren. 

    I think Harris is screwing herself. Inability to answer tough questions makes the media cover less. But she could totally dominate the airwaves if she wanted to...ala Pete.

    Ill see how this thing shakes out before I decide if, in my opinion, sexism played a big role.

    Let me ask you this - who would be your vote right now?
    It's not a strategy. I say that because hardly anyone ever understands it. I say it because of experience with people's reaction to the concept. And the resistance and knee jerk reactions I always get have me completely fed up.
    beyond the concept, which is sexism is politics, I don't really know what we, as a collective, fail to understand, as I haven't personally seen anything where you've tried to explain it. If you have already and don't wish to rehash, fine, I just haven't seen it. 
    Fair enough. I would go more into it, but I'm just too fucking sad and depressed right now. My cat died and I'm finding myself too devastated to have the drive to debate much.
    Oh, I'm so sorry :(
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • cincybearcatcincybearcat Posts: 16,454
    Cats are awesome. Sorry for your loss PJ Soul
    hippiemom = goodness
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 49,961
    Thanks all. It's tough. :(
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 None Of Your Business... Posts: 10,739
    PJ_Soul said:
    Thanks all. It's tough. :(
    It is.  Take as much time as you need to grieve.  Pets are very much family.  
    Give Peas A Chance…
  • oftenreadingoftenreading Victoria, BC Posts: 12,845
    Oh no.  Sorry to hear that. Losing a pet is so damn hard. 
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • jeffbrjeffbr Seattle Posts: 7,177
    PJ_Soul said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    It’s generally not a good strategy to say

    1) I don’t expect any of you to understand this 


    I do believe sexism plays a role, even in the Dems election process. I do not think it’s the only reason some women are not getting traction while some men are. I do believe that so many women running is a sign of progress and all things being equal, gender should play a role. That role being vote for the women all things being equal. 

    I think warren is getting a decent amount of press. She is just boring, so not capturing ears. She also focuses on policy which unfortunately appears to be a bad campaign strategy (see trumps win). But for me I just don’t like her policies. And I think Bernie is just as boring/annoying with bad policies. He just has some weird fan base since he has been working at this (presidential campaign) much longer than Warren. 

    I think Harris is screwing herself. Inability to answer tough questions makes the media cover less. But she could totally dominate the airwaves if she wanted to...ala Pete.

    Ill see how this thing shakes out before I decide if, in my opinion, sexism played a big role.

    Let me ask you this - who would be your vote right now?
    It's not a strategy. I say that because hardly anyone ever understands it. I say it because of experience with people's reaction to the concept. And the resistance and knee jerk reactions I always get have me completely fed up.
    beyond the concept, which is sexism is politics, I don't really know what we, as a collective, fail to understand, as I haven't personally seen anything where you've tried to explain it. If you have already and don't wish to rehash, fine, I just haven't seen it. 
    Fair enough. I would go more into it, but I'm just too fucking sad and depressed right now. My cat died and I'm finding myself too devastated to have the drive to debate much.
    Sorry to hear, PJSoul. 
    "I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 30,534
    edited April 2019
    The "he's to damn left wing and progressive!" candidate Bernie wants to bring the US closer to European countries in ways that is proven to be better for the citizens. Dangerous stuff. Lets be a greedy outlier in the world instead!

    VS

    Some people in here's favorite "we need some moderate, too much positive change is dangerous!" candidate met with lobbyists on his first day running:




    Post edited by Spiritual_Chaos on
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 29,685
    The "he's to damn left wing and progressive!" candidate Bernie wants to bring the US closer to European countries in ways that is proven to be better for the citizens. Dangerous stuff. Lets be a greedy outlier in the world instead!

    VS

    Some people in here's favorite "we need some moderate, too much positive change is dangerous!" candidate met with lobbyists on his first day running:




    You still don't get that Pete and Joe seem ideologically similar,  of what Pete has divulged.  You like one,  don't like the other.  Should I conclude it's because Joe is old?
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 30,534
    edited April 2019
    mrussel1 said:
    The "he's to damn left wing and progressive!" candidate Bernie wants to bring the US closer to European countries in ways that is proven to be better for the citizens. Dangerous stuff. Lets be a greedy outlier in the world instead!

    VS

    Some people in here's favorite "we need some moderate, too much positive change is dangerous!" candidate met with lobbyists on his first day running:




    You still don't get that Pete and Joe seem ideologically similar,  of what Pete has divulged.  You like one,  don't like the other.  Should I conclude it's because Joe is old?
    I've left Pete. And the last time you brought this up I had written BIDEN instead of BERNIE in my post by mistake.
    Post edited by Spiritual_Chaos on
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 30,534
    edited April 2019
    Pod Save America talks about Biding joining:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vOPQcugG8XY
    Post edited by Spiritual_Chaos on
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 29,685
    mrussel1 said:
    The "he's to damn left wing and progressive!" candidate Bernie wants to bring the US closer to European countries in ways that is proven to be better for the citizens. Dangerous stuff. Lets be a greedy outlier in the world instead!

    VS

    Some people in here's favorite "we need some moderate, too much positive change is dangerous!" candidate met with lobbyists on his first day running:




    You still don't get that Pete and Joe seem ideologically similar,  of what Pete has divulged.  You like one,  don't like the other.  Should I conclude it's because Joe is old?
    I've left Pete. And the last time you brought this up I had written BIDEN instead of BERNIE in my post by mistake.
    I know but the rest of the point still stood.  

    Regardless,  that was quite the torrid love affair.  Why the short romance?
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 49,961
    edited April 2019
    I can't believe anyone is willing to even consider voting for a candidate who isn't super focused on healthcare for all. Yes, Biden spending his first day meeting with a fucking health insurance CEO and corporate lobbyists is a major black mark against him in my own mind. If I could vote, and I was considering Biden in the primaries at all, that alone would disqualify him.
    Post edited by PJ_Soul on
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • F Me In The BrainF Me In The Brain this knows everybody from other commets Posts: 31,289
    PJ_Soul said:
    I can't believe anyone is willing to even consider voting for a candidate who isn't super focused on healthcare for all.
    Not even the people who do not consider this to be the most important topic?  (I think that is a large # of people)

    People voted Grand Wizard Trump into office.  I can believe pretty much anything, at this point.
    The love he receives is the love that is saved
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 30,534
    edited April 2019
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    The "he's to damn left wing and progressive!" candidate Bernie wants to bring the US closer to European countries in ways that is proven to be better for the citizens. Dangerous stuff. Lets be a greedy outlier in the world instead!

    VS

    Some people in here's favorite "we need some moderate, too much positive change is dangerous!" candidate met with lobbyists on his first day running:




    You still don't get that Pete and Joe seem ideologically similar,  of what Pete has divulged.  You like one,  don't like the other.  Should I conclude it's because Joe is old?
    I've left Pete. And the last time you brought this up I had written BIDEN instead of BERNIE in my post by mistake.
    I know but the rest of the point still stood.  

    Regardless,  that was quite the torrid love affair.  Why the short romance?
    Honeymoon period is over. He gave the exact same carefully carved (albeit nicely constructed) answers in every interview which wore me out and he seemed to be tactically holding positive change back to court the "moderates". As in, being very careful around health care reform and such.

    Looks more and more like a GOD DAMN PHONEY!
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
This discussion has been closed.