I was talking with my wife (who got home to late to watch) about the debates. She dislikes Trump as much as anyone I know and said, "Trump has a lot of charisma. His followers are like a cult. The democrats need to find someone who can inspire and pull in enough votes to get Trump out of there."
I agree. And that leaves me feeling a bit nervous. I don't see anyone (yet) with the charisma and ability to present well and speak well the way Obama does. What I saw tonight were:
-Old men shaking fingers.
-Women yelling (one nearly screeching).
-Young men struggling and sweating.
-More focus on immigration than environment (ruin the planet and everyone goes away).
-Feeble attempts at nods to LGBTQ issues.
-All of the above trying to out yell each other.
Nothing inspiring there.
I had that exact same feeling tonight. I think it’s referred to as “cult of personality” IDK
And wouldn’t you know there was an ad for Quentin Tarrantino’s newest flick with a subplot of Charles Manson and Sharon Tate during one of the commercial breaks?
Detroit 2000, Detroit 2003 1-2, Grand Rapids VFC 2004, Philly 2005, Grand Rapids 2006, Detroit 2006, Cleveland 2006, Lollapalooza 2007, Detroit Eddie Solo 2011, Detroit 2014, Chicago 2016 1-2, Chicago 2018 1-2, Ohana Encore 2021 1-2, Chicago Eddie/Earthlings 2022 1-2, Nashville 2022, St. Louis 2022
IF NO ONE SPEAKS SPANISH TONIGHT I'M GONNA BE FUMING!
Why? This whole speaking Spanish thing is starting to sound like political correctness gone into over drive. Will you be fuming just as much if global warming isn't given more time (you know I will be). That's way more important to EVERYBODY!
And don't get me wrong- I'm a big fan of our Hispanic citizens and neighbors to the south and their culture. I know a fair amount of Spanish language myself, amigos y amigas. And, in fact, as I write this, I'm eating fajitas. (Hope I don't spill any into the keyboard!)
People speaking Spanish isn't eating up time though, so what's the problem with it? I truly don't understand why anyone minds it. Like, okay okay, "identity politics"... soooo..... speaking a very common language used in America is irritating to people because it is meant to appeal to those who speak it?
People speaking Spanish is not irritating to me. But I don't think 11% is very common. In California, yes. New Mexico, Arizona and Texas yes. Those who govern those states would do well to know some Spanish. But the POTUS? If he or she does, fine. If not, fine. There are much bigger issues. Why has this become such a big issue? I don't get it.
I think because it is new? A new way to show respect to a very large number of people who are discriminated against, especially lately? Let's not pretend that how Hispanics are perceived in America isn't an important issue, because it is. Yes, there are other big and important issues. But this isn't eating other issues, so I still don't understand what the problem is. I think it is certainly worthy of acknowledgement for the reasons I already said. And inclusion IS important.
Post edited by PJ_Soul on
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,936
I was talking with my wife (who got home to late to watch) about the debates. She dislikes Trump as much as anyone I know and said, "Trump has a lot of charisma. His followers are like a cult. The democrats need to find someone who can inspire and pull in enough votes to get Trump out of there."
I agree. And that leaves me feeling a bit nervous. I don't see anyone (yet) with the charisma and ability to present well and speak well the way Obama does. What I saw tonight were:
-Old men shaking fingers.
-Women yelling (one nearly screeching).
-Young men struggling and sweating.
-More focus on immigration than environment (ruin the planet and everyone goes away).
-Feeble attempts at nods to LGBTQ issues.
-All of the above trying to out yell each other.
Nothing inspiring there.
I had that exact same feeling tonight. I think it’s referred to as “cult of personality” IDK I do think it was a decent debate though, Harris did a great job.
Yeah, Kamala is smart. She's a possibility. If she were stronger on environment, I could get behind her.
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
I was talking with my wife (who got home to late to watch) about the debates. She dislikes Trump as much as anyone I know and said, "Trump has a lot of charisma. His followers are like a cult. The democrats need to find someone who can inspire and pull in enough votes to get Trump out of there."
I agree. And that leaves me feeling a bit nervous. I don't see anyone (yet) with the charisma and ability to present well and speak well the way Obama does. What I saw tonight were:
-Old men shaking fingers.
-Women yelling (one nearly screeching).
-Young men struggling and sweating.
-More focus on immigration than environment (ruin the planet and everyone goes away).
-Feeble attempts at nods to LGBTQ issues.
-All of the above trying to out yell each other.
Nothing inspiring there.
I had that exact same feeling tonight. I think it’s referred to as “cult of personality” IDK I do think it was a decent debate though, Harris did a great job.
Yeah, Kamala is smart. She's a possibility. If she were stronger on environment, I could get behind her.
Hmm, during the climate change parts of the debate I thought she gave some really solid answers. Hard for people to elaborate more due to time constraints obviously, but I thought she was strong on the issue of climate change. I liked how she referred to Trump as a threat to national security due his beliefs in climate fiction over climate facts.
Detroit 2000, Detroit 2003 1-2, Grand Rapids VFC 2004, Philly 2005, Grand Rapids 2006, Detroit 2006, Cleveland 2006, Lollapalooza 2007, Detroit Eddie Solo 2011, Detroit 2014, Chicago 2016 1-2, Chicago 2018 1-2, Ohana Encore 2021 1-2, Chicago Eddie/Earthlings 2022 1-2, Nashville 2022, St. Louis 2022
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,936
I was talking with my wife (who got home to late to watch) about the debates. She dislikes Trump as much as anyone I know and said, "Trump has a lot of charisma. His followers are like a cult. The democrats need to find someone who can inspire and pull in enough votes to get Trump out of there."
I agree. And that leaves me feeling a bit nervous. I don't see anyone (yet) with the charisma and ability to present well and speak well the way Obama does. What I saw tonight were:
-Old men shaking fingers.
-Women yelling (one nearly screeching).
-Young men struggling and sweating.
-More focus on immigration than environment (ruin the planet and everyone goes away).
-Feeble attempts at nods to LGBTQ issues.
-All of the above trying to out yell each other.
Nothing inspiring there.
I had that exact same feeling tonight. I think it’s referred to as “cult of personality” IDK I do think it was a decent debate though, Harris did a great job.
Yeah, Kamala is smart. She's a possibility. If she were stronger on environment, I could get behind her.
Hmm, during the climate change parts of the debate I thought she gave some really solid answers. Hard for people to elaborate more due to time constraints obviously, but I thought she was strong on the issue of climate change. I liked how she referred to Trump as a threat to national security due his beliefs in climate fiction over climate facts.
Good to know! I missed that part. Our reception here goes in and out. I missed about 1/3 of the debate.
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
I was talking with my wife (who got home to late to watch) about the debates. She dislikes Trump as much as anyone I know and said, "Trump has a lot of charisma. His followers are like a cult. The democrats need to find someone who can inspire and pull in enough votes to get Trump out of there."
I agree. And that leaves me feeling a bit nervous. I don't see anyone (yet) with the charisma and ability to present well and speak well the way Obama does. What I saw tonight were:
-Old men shaking fingers.
-Women yelling (one nearly screeching).
-Young men struggling and sweating.
-More focus on immigration than environment (ruin the planet and everyone goes away).
-Feeble attempts at nods to LGBTQ issues.
-All of the above trying to out yell each other.
Nothing inspiring there.
I had that exact same feeling tonight. I think it’s referred to as “cult of personality” IDK I do think it was a decent debate though, Harris did a great job.
Yeah, Kamala is smart. She's a possibility. If she were stronger on environment, I could get behind her.
Hmm, during the climate change parts of the debate I thought she gave some really solid answers. Hard for people to elaborate more due to time constraints obviously, but I thought she was strong on the issue of climate change. I liked how she referred to Trump as a threat to national security due his beliefs in climate fiction over climate facts.
Good to know! I missed that part. Our reception here goes in and out. I missed about 1/3 of the debate.
Oh, and she supports the green new deal.
Detroit 2000, Detroit 2003 1-2, Grand Rapids VFC 2004, Philly 2005, Grand Rapids 2006, Detroit 2006, Cleveland 2006, Lollapalooza 2007, Detroit Eddie Solo 2011, Detroit 2014, Chicago 2016 1-2, Chicago 2018 1-2, Ohana Encore 2021 1-2, Chicago Eddie/Earthlings 2022 1-2, Nashville 2022, St. Louis 2022
I was talking with my wife (who got home to late to watch) about the debates. She dislikes Trump as much as anyone I know and said, "Trump has a lot of charisma. His followers are like a cult. The democrats need to find someone who can inspire and pull in enough votes to get Trump out of there."
I agree. And that leaves me feeling a bit nervous. I don't see anyone (yet) with the charisma and ability to present well and speak well the way Obama does. What I saw tonight were:
-Old men shaking fingers.
-Women yelling (one nearly screeching).
-Young men struggling and sweating.
-More focus on immigration than environment (ruin the planet and everyone goes away).
-Feeble attempts at nods to LGBTQ issues.
-All of the above trying to out yell each other.
Nothing inspiring there.
I had that exact same feeling tonight. I think it’s referred to as “cult of personality” IDK I do think it was a decent debate though, Harris did a great job.
Yeah, Kamala is smart. She's a possibility. If she were stronger on environment, I could get behind her.
Hmm, during the climate change parts of the debate I thought she gave some really solid answers. Hard for people to elaborate more due to time constraints obviously, but I thought she was strong on the issue of climate change. I liked how she referred to Trump as a threat to national security due his beliefs in climate fiction over climate facts.
Good to know! I missed that part. Our reception here goes in and out. I missed about 1/3 of the debate.
Your reception? Are you living in 1979, Brian?
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,936
I was talking with my wife (who got home to late to watch) about the debates. She dislikes Trump as much as anyone I know and said, "Trump has a lot of charisma. His followers are like a cult. The democrats need to find someone who can inspire and pull in enough votes to get Trump out of there."
I agree. And that leaves me feeling a bit nervous. I don't see anyone (yet) with the charisma and ability to present well and speak well the way Obama does. What I saw tonight were:
-Old men shaking fingers.
-Women yelling (one nearly screeching).
-Young men struggling and sweating.
-More focus on immigration than environment (ruin the planet and everyone goes away).
-Feeble attempts at nods to LGBTQ issues.
-All of the above trying to out yell each other.
Nothing inspiring there.
I had that exact same feeling tonight. I think it’s referred to as “cult of personality” IDK I do think it was a decent debate though, Harris did a great job.
Yeah, Kamala is smart. She's a possibility. If she were stronger on environment, I could get behind her.
Hmm, during the climate change parts of the debate I thought she gave some really solid answers. Hard for people to elaborate more due to time constraints obviously, but I thought she was strong on the issue of climate change. I liked how she referred to Trump as a threat to national security due his beliefs in climate fiction over climate facts.
Good to know! I missed that part. Our reception here goes in and out. I missed about 1/3 of the debate.
Your reception? Are you living in 1979, Brian?
Haha! Oh, that was a great year. Yeah, I could get stuck there!
No, we're in a semi rural area that requires satellite (or maybe there is cable here now, I'm not sure) and I'm just not enough of a TV guy to pay for that much for the little TV I watch. I have you and the others here to keep me plenty amused.
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
I was talking with my wife (who got home to late to watch) about the debates. She dislikes Trump as much as anyone I know and said, "Trump has a lot of charisma. His followers are like a cult. The democrats need to find someone who can inspire and pull in enough votes to get Trump out of there."
I agree. And that leaves me feeling a bit nervous. I don't see anyone (yet) with the charisma and ability to present well and speak well the way Obama does. What I saw tonight were:
-Old men shaking fingers.
-Women yelling (one nearly screeching).
-Young men struggling and sweating.
-More focus on immigration than environment (ruin the planet and everyone goes away).
-Feeble attempts at nods to LGBTQ issues.
-All of the above trying to out yell each other.
Nothing inspiring there.
I had that exact same feeling tonight. I think it’s referred to as “cult of personality” IDK I do think it was a decent debate though, Harris did a great job.
Yeah, Kamala is smart. She's a possibility. If she were stronger on environment, I could get behind her.
Hmm, during the climate change parts of the debate I thought she gave some really solid answers. Hard for people to elaborate more due to time constraints obviously, but I thought she was strong on the issue of climate change. I liked how she referred to Trump as a threat to national security due his beliefs in climate fiction over climate facts.
Good to know! I missed that part. Our reception here goes in and out. I missed about 1/3 of the debate.
Your reception? Are you living in 1979, Brian?
Haha! Oh, that was a great year. Yeah, I could get stuck there!
No, we're in a semi rural area that requires satellite (or maybe there is cable here now, I'm not sure) and I'm just not enough of a TV guy to pay for that much for the little TV I watch. I have you and the others here to keep me plenty amused.
Not that great a year for me, but then again I was a tender age
Do you have dial up, Brian?
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,936
I was talking with my wife (who got home to late to watch) about the debates. She dislikes Trump as much as anyone I know and said, "Trump has a lot of charisma. His followers are like a cult. The democrats need to find someone who can inspire and pull in enough votes to get Trump out of there."
I agree. And that leaves me feeling a bit nervous. I don't see anyone (yet) with the charisma and ability to present well and speak well the way Obama does. What I saw tonight were:
-Old men shaking fingers.
-Women yelling (one nearly screeching).
-Young men struggling and sweating.
-More focus on immigration than environment (ruin the planet and everyone goes away).
-Feeble attempts at nods to LGBTQ issues.
-All of the above trying to out yell each other.
Nothing inspiring there.
I had that exact same feeling tonight. I think it’s referred to as “cult of personality” IDK I do think it was a decent debate though, Harris did a great job.
Yeah, Kamala is smart. She's a possibility. If she were stronger on environment, I could get behind her.
Hmm, during the climate change parts of the debate I thought she gave some really solid answers. Hard for people to elaborate more due to time constraints obviously, but I thought she was strong on the issue of climate change. I liked how she referred to Trump as a threat to national security due his beliefs in climate fiction over climate facts.
Good to know! I missed that part. Our reception here goes in and out. I missed about 1/3 of the debate.
Your reception? Are you living in 1979, Brian?
Haha! Oh, that was a great year. Yeah, I could get stuck there!
No, we're in a semi rural area that requires satellite (or maybe there is cable here now, I'm not sure) and I'm just not enough of a TV guy to pay for that much for the little TV I watch. I have you and the others here to keep me plenty amused.
Not that great a year for me, but then again I was a tender age
Do you have dial up, Brian?
No, I have that slow version of high speed internet knows as DSL (Disastrously Slow Laptop).
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
I was talking with my wife (who got home to late to watch) about the debates. She dislikes Trump as much as anyone I know and said, "Trump has a lot of charisma. His followers are like a cult. The democrats need to find someone who can inspire and pull in enough votes to get Trump out of there."
I agree. And that leaves me feeling a bit nervous. I don't see anyone (yet) with the charisma and ability to present well and speak well the way Obama does. What I saw tonight were:
-Old men shaking fingers.
-Women yelling (one nearly screeching).
-Young men struggling and sweating.
-More focus on immigration than environment (ruin the planet and everyone goes away).
-Feeble attempts at nods to LGBTQ issues.
-All of the above trying to out yell each other.
Nothing inspiring there.
I had that exact same feeling tonight. I think it’s referred to as “cult of personality” IDK I do think it was a decent debate though, Harris did a great job.
Yeah, Kamala is smart. She's a possibility. If she were stronger on environment, I could get behind her.
Hmm, during the climate change parts of the debate I thought she gave some really solid answers. Hard for people to elaborate more due to time constraints obviously, but I thought she was strong on the issue of climate change. I liked how she referred to Trump as a threat to national security due his beliefs in climate fiction over climate facts.
Good to know! I missed that part. Our reception here goes in and out. I missed about 1/3 of the debate.
Your reception? Are you living in 1979, Brian?
Haha! Oh, that was a great year. Yeah, I could get stuck there!
No, we're in a semi rural area that requires satellite (or maybe there is cable here now, I'm not sure) and I'm just not enough of a TV guy to pay for that much for the little TV I watch. I have you and the others here to keep me plenty amused.
Not that great a year for me, but then again I was a tender age
Do you have dial up, Brian?
No, I have that slow version of high speed internet knows as DSL (Disastrously Slow Laptop).
I was a cord cutter for about 10 years and decided to try cable...after 6 months of that crap...time to cut the cord again.
Give Peas A Chance…
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,936
I was talking with my wife (who got home to late to watch) about the debates. She dislikes Trump as much as anyone I know and said, "Trump has a lot of charisma. His followers are like a cult. The democrats need to find someone who can inspire and pull in enough votes to get Trump out of there."
I agree. And that leaves me feeling a bit nervous. I don't see anyone (yet) with the charisma and ability to present well and speak well the way Obama does. What I saw tonight were:
-Old men shaking fingers.
-Women yelling (one nearly screeching).
-Young men struggling and sweating.
-More focus on immigration than environment (ruin the planet and everyone goes away).
-Feeble attempts at nods to LGBTQ issues.
-All of the above trying to out yell each other.
Nothing inspiring there.
I had that exact same feeling tonight. I think it’s referred to as “cult of personality” IDK I do think it was a decent debate though, Harris did a great job.
Yeah, Kamala is smart. She's a possibility. If she were stronger on environment, I could get behind her.
Hmm, during the climate change parts of the debate I thought she gave some really solid answers. Hard for people to elaborate more due to time constraints obviously, but I thought she was strong on the issue of climate change. I liked how she referred to Trump as a threat to national security due his beliefs in climate fiction over climate facts.
Good to know! I missed that part. Our reception here goes in and out. I missed about 1/3 of the debate.
Your reception? Are you living in 1979, Brian?
Haha! Oh, that was a great year. Yeah, I could get stuck there!
No, we're in a semi rural area that requires satellite (or maybe there is cable here now, I'm not sure) and I'm just not enough of a TV guy to pay for that much for the little TV I watch. I have you and the others here to keep me plenty amused.
Not that great a year for me, but then again I was a tender age
Do you have dial up, Brian?
No, I have that slow version of high speed internet knows as DSL (Disastrously Slow Laptop).
I was a cord cutter for about 10 years and decided to try cable...after 6 months of that crap...time to cut the cord again.
What kind of internet provider do you use now?
And what is a cord cutter? An electrician? Cable installation? Wood cutter? Obstetrician?
Post edited by brianlux on
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
I was talking with my wife (who got home to late to watch) about the debates. She dislikes Trump as much as anyone I know and said, "Trump has a lot of charisma. His followers are like a cult. The democrats need to find someone who can inspire and pull in enough votes to get Trump out of there."
I agree. And that leaves me feeling a bit nervous. I don't see anyone (yet) with the charisma and ability to present well and speak well the way Obama does. What I saw tonight were:
-Old men shaking fingers.
-Women yelling (one nearly screeching).
-Young men struggling and sweating.
-More focus on immigration than environment (ruin the planet and everyone goes away).
-Feeble attempts at nods to LGBTQ issues.
-All of the above trying to out yell each other.
Nothing inspiring there.
I had that exact same feeling tonight. I think it’s referred to as “cult of personality” IDK I do think it was a decent debate though, Harris did a great job.
Yeah, Kamala is smart. She's a possibility. If she were stronger on environment, I could get behind her.
Hmm, during the climate change parts of the debate I thought she gave some really solid answers. Hard for people to elaborate more due to time constraints obviously, but I thought she was strong on the issue of climate change. I liked how she referred to Trump as a threat to national security due his beliefs in climate fiction over climate facts.
Good to know! I missed that part. Our reception here goes in and out. I missed about 1/3 of the debate.
Your reception? Are you living in 1979, Brian?
Haha! Oh, that was a great year. Yeah, I could get stuck there!
No, we're in a semi rural area that requires satellite (or maybe there is cable here now, I'm not sure) and I'm just not enough of a TV guy to pay for that much for the little TV I watch. I have you and the others here to keep me plenty amused.
Not that great a year for me, but then again I was a tender age
Do you have dial up, Brian?
No, I have that slow version of high speed internet knows as DSL (Disastrously Slow Laptop).
I was a cord cutter for about 10 years and decided to try cable...after 6 months of that crap...time to cut the cord again.
What kind of internet provider do you use now?
And what is a cord cutter? An electrician? Cable installation? Wood cutter? Obstetrician?
I have cable internet. I will keep my internet. You have never heard the term cord cutter? They are people like yourself who have ditched their cable/sat for OTR or streaming services.
I was talking with my wife (who got home to late to watch) about the debates. She dislikes Trump as much as anyone I know and said, "Trump has a lot of charisma. His followers are like a cult. The democrats need to find someone who can inspire and pull in enough votes to get Trump out of there."
I agree. And that leaves me feeling a bit nervous. I don't see anyone (yet) with the charisma and ability to present well and speak well the way Obama does. What I saw tonight were:
-Old men shaking fingers.
-Women yelling (one nearly screeching).
-Young men struggling and sweating.
-More focus on immigration than environment (ruin the planet and everyone goes away).
-Feeble attempts at nods to LGBTQ issues.
-All of the above trying to out yell each other.
Nothing inspiring there.
I had that exact same feeling tonight. I think it’s referred to as “cult of personality” IDK I do think it was a decent debate though, Harris did a great job.
Yeah, Kamala is smart. She's a possibility. If she were stronger on environment, I could get behind her.
Hmm, during the climate change parts of the debate I thought she gave some really solid answers. Hard for people to elaborate more due to time constraints obviously, but I thought she was strong on the issue of climate change. I liked how she referred to Trump as a threat to national security due his beliefs in climate fiction over climate facts.
Good to know! I missed that part. Our reception here goes in and out. I missed about 1/3 of the debate.
Your reception? Are you living in 1979, Brian?
Haha! Oh, that was a great year. Yeah, I could get stuck there!
No, we're in a semi rural area that requires satellite (or maybe there is cable here now, I'm not sure) and I'm just not enough of a TV guy to pay for that much for the little TV I watch. I have you and the others here to keep me plenty amused.
Not that great a year for me, but then again I was a tender age
Do you have dial up, Brian?
No, I have that slow version of high speed internet knows as DSL (Disastrously Slow Laptop).
I was a cord cutter for about 10 years and decided to try cable...after 6 months of that crap...time to cut the cord again.
What kind of internet provider do you use now?
And what is a cord cutter? An electrician? Cable installation? Wood cutter? Obstetrician?
I have cable internet. I will keep my internet. You have never heard the term cord cutter? They are people like yourself who have ditched their cable/sat for OTR or streaming services.
No, never heard that one. I'm technologically "challenged".
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,936
I was talking with my wife (who got home to late to watch) about the debates. She dislikes Trump as much as anyone I know and said, "Trump has a lot of charisma. His followers are like a cult. The democrats need to find someone who can inspire and pull in enough votes to get Trump out of there."
I agree. And that leaves me feeling a bit nervous. I don't see anyone (yet) with the charisma and ability to present well and speak well the way Obama does. What I saw tonight were:
-Old men shaking fingers.
-Women yelling (one nearly screeching).
-Young men struggling and sweating.
-More focus on immigration than environment (ruin the planet and everyone goes away).
-Feeble attempts at nods to LGBTQ issues.
-All of the above trying to out yell each other.
Nothing inspiring there.
(Warren)
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
Let's be clear about something here on student loan debt. It is on a path that goes beyond this dumb label of just stamping people with a label of "oh, you knew what you were getting into." Stop with that shit right now. I paid my loans. Do I want future generations to continue on the trajectory it's currently on? Absolutely not. "Because I did it means everyone else should do it" is terrible logic. There is a problem. It needs to be fixed as it's not sustainable. But like everything in our world - people like to pretend something isn't their problem when they're not individually attached to the issue (usually a beautifully dystopic Libertarian viewpoint).
First, they need to get rid of subsidized loans - that's #1: subsidies only drive up costs. #2 - the cost of college and higher education is no where even fucking close to what it was 20, 30, 40 years ago. Hell, it's not even close to what it was 10 years ago. College is not supposed to be only an accessible benefit to the wealthy. #3 the benefit to the economy as a whole by putting more money in the wallets of the largest generation since the fucking garbage Boomers would outweigh any costs to taxpayers.
#4 - while we're on the topic of what comes out of my wallet for taxes that I don't want to pay for - I could name an endless list of shit that I'd want my money back from right now instead of helping out higher education. Namely, we all bitch about this college plan shit (even though Warren's plan taxes the ultra wealthy of the wealthies to fund this) when it's a fucking drop in the ocean to how much of our actual dollars are taken out of our actual wallets for some garbage war going on somewhere that in no way benefits us whatsoever.
Do I think higher education should be free? Not at all, but the access and opportunity should be fair and equal. And it is not right now.
Warren is by far the most qualified candidate both in experience and, more importantly, detail of policy. She should have been given the keys to the CFPB, as she was the one who started it. Where Obama completely dropped the ball was by not dropping the hammer on large bank and investment firm execs ten years ago, and if Warren was actually heading the CFPB this would have happened.
Student loans and subsidies are not not the problem. It's the cost curve of education outpacing inflation is the problem. I also don't understand how one argues that subsidies drive up cost, unless you're arguing that it allows too many people to go to college, thereby driving up the cost.
Last, no one has articulated how this loan forgiveness isn't a regressive tax. In fact the Post had a long editorial today calling it a rich kid bailout. I'll post it later, but it is.
But WHY are college costs increasing by about 2x the inflation rate? Because more people can pay for tuition because of widely available loans.
So why are loans widely available? Because they are guaranteed.
That is the subsidy driving up demand and limiting supply and causing tuition to increase roughly double the inflation rate.
If Warren or Sanders think they are going to win the presidency with another giveaway, we are looking at 4 more years. Address the problem, the hidden subsidy of guarantees.
I don't know how you run on a platform if reducing access to universities. That's not a winner. I also think there's more to it than just subsidies. State appointed funding has been reduced in many cases and some make the case that the reduced tuition to underprivileged has passed on higher costs to full tuition students. Then there's the arguments about amenities, including targeted facilities for athletes. My guess is it's some combination of all. Subsidies and loan guarantees are a big part I'm sure.
I agree it's a rock and hard place. If Warren is the nom and she starts promising free stuff like tuition and debt forgiveness, its 4 more years.
A smarter tactic would be to offer lower cost tuition for 2 year colleges and lower interest rates and extended terms. Even throw in some volunteering to pay down loans.
But free stuff? They'll get tagged socialist and its hello Blondie.
Can people stop with the "free stuff" line. That's a GOP false narrative and talking point that progressives shouldn't fall for.
Nothings free, the burden is just lifted off the student or patient and carried by the rest of the populace through higher taxes. Specifically from the highest of earners.
Nobody with two brain cells to scrape together in Canada thinks our single payer health care system is free. We all pay for it together, and were happy to do it.
Healthcare and tertiary education shouldn't be discussed with the same arguments. One is a human right, the other is not even close.
It's should be a citizen's right to get a reasonable similar chance in life and to not tier up society in a rigid and detrimental class-system. Educated people is an advantage for society, just like heaving good roads are. Which is also not a human right to my knowledge.
Sanders and Sweden's Folkhemmet vision: Sometimes referred to as "the Swedish Middle Way", folkhemmet was viewed as midway between capitalism and socialism. The base of the folkhem vision is that the entire society ought to be like a small family, where everybody contributes, but also where everybody looks after one another. The Swedish Social Democrats' successes in the postwar period is often explained by the fact that the party managed to motivate major social reforms with the idea of the folkhem and the national family's joint endeavor.
The US: Me, me, me
Post edited by Spiritual_Chaos on
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
Americans are getting scared. The boogieman called "taxes" they have been conditioned to fear all their life while they work three jobs to make ends meet is gonna have to rise.
Oh wait...
Post edited by Spiritual_Chaos on
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
So weird with the leading questions: "Will you raise taxes YES OR NO. DONT GIVE CONTEXT. FUCK OPEN QUESTIONS LIKE WE LEARNED IN JOURNALIST SCHOOL - YES OR NO"
Sanders starting strong.
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
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Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
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Detroit 2000, Detroit 2003 1-2, Grand Rapids VFC 2004, Philly 2005, Grand Rapids 2006, Detroit 2006, Cleveland 2006, Lollapalooza 2007, Detroit Eddie Solo 2011, Detroit 2014, Chicago 2016 1-2, Chicago 2018 1-2, Ohana Encore 2021 1-2, Chicago Eddie/Earthlings 2022 1-2, Nashville 2022, St. Louis 2022
Detroit 2000, Detroit 2003 1-2, Grand Rapids VFC 2004, Philly 2005, Grand Rapids 2006, Detroit 2006, Cleveland 2006, Lollapalooza 2007, Detroit Eddie Solo 2011, Detroit 2014, Chicago 2016 1-2, Chicago 2018 1-2, Ohana Encore 2021 1-2, Chicago Eddie/Earthlings 2022 1-2, Nashville 2022, St. Louis 2022
Your reception? Are you living in 1979, Brian?
Not that great a year for me, but then again I was a tender age
Do you have dial up, Brian?
But yup, Kamala by a mile.
In this exchange, Biden didn't seem old to me. He had some fight in him.
Biden didnt seem old there. He just felt like some old racist fucks ”son”
"That was a mortal blow"
"Biden looked stunned tonight"
Chris Matthews: Kamala Harris Hit Joe Biden With Something He Wasn’t Ready For
https://youtu.be/GW2_nVaP3ww
Sanders and Sweden's Folkhemmet vision:
Sometimes referred to as "the Swedish Middle Way", folkhemmet was viewed as midway between capitalism and socialism. The base of the folkhem vision is that the entire society ought to be like a small family, where everybody contributes, but also where everybody looks after one another. The Swedish Social Democrats' successes in the postwar period is often explained by the fact that the party managed to motivate major social reforms with the idea of the folkhem and the national family's joint endeavor.
The US:
Me, me, me
Elizabeth Warren: I Have The Biggest Anti-Corruption Plan Since Watergate
I wanna fall asleep to Chris Matthews soothing voice.
"Money makes its way felt in every decision in Washington"
Americans are getting scared. The boogieman called "taxes" they have been conditioned to fear all their life while they work three jobs to make ends meet is gonna have to rise.
Oh wait...
So weird with the leading questions: "Will you raise taxes YES OR NO. DONT GIVE CONTEXT. FUCK OPEN QUESTIONS LIKE WE LEARNED IN JOURNALIST SCHOOL - YES OR NO"
Sanders starting strong.