Opioid Addiction in the US, Heroin and Oxys

13

Comments

  • Hi!Hi! Posts: 1,488
    Hi! said:
    Any ex-heroin addicts here? Is it really that hard to kick?
    I talked with a guy once who did it once and he said it was so good it scared the shit out of him and he never did it again. Better than sex is also how he described it. I can’t even imagine what withdrawal would be like.
    The best feeling I've had was with painkillers after I broke a bone in my foot. I didn't know much about drugs at the time. I felt warm, euphoric and my depression and anxiety was wiped away. I'd like to have that feeling all the time without addiction.
    I’ve had that feeling with painkillers once or twice. Best buzz I’ve ever had was taking adderall and smoking weed at same time, froze, but it gets old after awhile which all the negative side affects. I always enjoyed the high from mushrooms as well.
  • Thoughts_ArriveThoughts_Arrive Melbourne, AustraliaPosts: 13,863
    Yeah which is why people get hooked. Feels great but after tolerance kicks in you're just stopping withdrawal symptoms.
    Adelaide 17/11/2009, Melbourne 20/11/2009, Sydney 22/11/2009, Melbourne (Big Day Out Festival) 24/01/2014
  • tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 20,291
    Never done shrooms, never took pills.

    Took a codeine once.  Tore up my stomach, rough stormy weather made it worse.  Was next to the toilet for that trip into Dutch Harbor...
  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain.Posts: 28,469
    Killer!


    "Hate your job, love your stuff
    If you think that's living, you are
    Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong"
    -Juliana Hatfield
    ***********
    M.I.T.S.







  • hedonisthedonist standing on the edge of foreverPosts: 19,955
    edited June 11
    brianlux said:
    Killer!


    Ironic comment :whistle:  I actually prefer Blind Melon's cover of this vs. the original.

    Speaking of fucked up songs (or being aware you're fucked up), these guys always nail it for me.

    "But what would help is my medicine."



    Post edited by hedonist on
  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain.Posts: 28,469
    hedonist said:
    brianlux said:
    Killer!


    Ironic comment :whistle:  I actually prefer Blind Melon's cover of this vs. the original.

    Speaking of fucked up songs (or being aware you're fucked up), these guys always nail it for me.

    "But what would help is my medicine."



    LOL, how true!

    And for those who don't know it, here is the original "The Pusher" performed and written by Hoyt Axton:


    "Hate your job, love your stuff
    If you think that's living, you are
    Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong"
    -Juliana Hatfield
    ***********
    M.I.T.S.







  • jeffbrjeffbr SeattlePosts: 6,660
    Glad you thought so.
    Do you guys have safe injecting rooms in the US?
    I have never heard of them.  The majority of people would go nuts over that I'd think.

    Seattle might be a good candidate to try that considering the little house thing is becoming them it seems.
    Is Seattle the heroin capital of the US?
    If so, what are the reasons?
    Seattle isn't the heroin capital, but Seattle seems to be extra accommodating to addicts and criminals, so they're perhaps more visible than in other places. We tend to enable bad behavior on the streets. Here in Seattle you can piss and shit on the streets, you can camp wherever you want, you can shoplift, and you can possess up to 3g of opioids without any fear of prosecution, so it's a bit of a free for all. I actually have no issue with putting safe injection sites here, because at least that way there could be an avenue for social services to be involved with these people, and most importantly they would have access to clean needles, and the needles they use would be disposed of properly instead of littering the parks, streets and school playgrounds like they do now.
    "I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
  • Thoughts_ArriveThoughts_Arrive Melbourne, AustraliaPosts: 13,863
    Well, as per a news report today, my city is the heroin capital of Australia.
    Adelaide 17/11/2009, Melbourne 20/11/2009, Sydney 22/11/2009, Melbourne (Big Day Out Festival) 24/01/2014
  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 None Of Your Business...Posts: 7,260
    It's bad here in Canada as well...but it appears that our federal government has given up the battle...they are allowing a safe injection site in federal prison...LMFAO...I guess the fucking geniuses who thought this plan through have never heard of rehab or solitary confinement until you go to rehab.  
  • Thoughts_ArriveThoughts_Arrive Melbourne, AustraliaPosts: 13,863
    People here are treating it like a crime. It's an illness which is caused by mental illness and or homelessness. But people fail to see that.
    Adelaide 17/11/2009, Melbourne 20/11/2009, Sydney 22/11/2009, Melbourne (Big Day Out Festival) 24/01/2014
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 15,654
    People here are treating it like a crime. It's an illness which is caused by mental illness and or homelessness. But people fail to see that.
    addiction itself? or the things people will do to sustain the addiction?
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    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
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  • Thoughts_ArriveThoughts_Arrive Melbourne, AustraliaPosts: 13,863
    mickeyrat said:
    People here are treating it like a crime. It's an illness which is caused by mental illness and or homelessness. But people fail to see that.
    addiction itself? or the things people will do to sustain the addiction?
    The addiction.
    Adelaide 17/11/2009, Melbourne 20/11/2009, Sydney 22/11/2009, Melbourne (Big Day Out Festival) 24/01/2014
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 15,654
    mickeyrat said:
    People here are treating it like a crime. It's an illness which is caused by mental illness and or homelessness. But people fail to see that.
    addiction itself? or the things people will do to sustain the addiction?
    The addiction.
    what about alcoholism? its the same thing.

    and if addiction to various pills is criminal, the doctors and pharmacists should be held liable too, no?
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • oftenreadingoftenreading Victoria, BCPosts: 10,430
    It's bad here in Canada as well...but it appears that our federal government has given up the battle...they are allowing a safe injection site in federal prison...LMFAO...I guess the fucking geniuses who thought this plan through have never heard of rehab or solitary confinement until you go to rehab.  
    I think you are not familiar with the research on safe injection sites, nor the federal regulations on when "solitary confinement" can be used and when it can not, nor what treatment programs are available in corrections now. And perhaps not familiar with how jails and prisons are built, and that there isn't infinite capacity to put everyone in "solitary confinement". Are you in favour of a lot more building of prisons?
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • Thoughts_ArriveThoughts_Arrive Melbourne, AustraliaPosts: 13,863
    mickeyrat said:
    mickeyrat said:
    People here are treating it like a crime. It's an illness which is caused by mental illness and or homelessness. But people fail to see that.
    addiction itself? or the things people will do to sustain the addiction?
    The addiction.
    what about alcoholism? its the same thing.

    and if addiction to various pills is criminal, the doctors and pharmacists should be held liable too, no?
    I didn't say it's a crime. I said other people are. I'm saying it is an illness. 
    Adelaide 17/11/2009, Melbourne 20/11/2009, Sydney 22/11/2009, Melbourne (Big Day Out Festival) 24/01/2014
  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 None Of Your Business...Posts: 7,260
    It's bad here in Canada as well...but it appears that our federal government has given up the battle...they are allowing a safe injection site in federal prison...LMFAO...I guess the fucking geniuses who thought this plan through have never heard of rehab or solitary confinement until you go to rehab.  
    I think you are not familiar with the research on safe injection sites, nor the federal regulations on when "solitary confinement" can be used and when it can not, nor what treatment programs are available in corrections now. And perhaps not familiar with how jails and prisons are built, and that there isn't infinite capacity to put everyone in "solitary confinement". Are you in favour of a lot more building of prisons?
    I am familiar with what prison is supposed to be...it a place to serve your sentence...not a place to go to get high.  Every Cell can be locked 24/7.  They can build treatment centers at a few prisons, and for those who refuse to deal with life can either sit in their cell 2/7 or they can build an isolation wing...in our justice system, we favour rehabilitation except for drug abuse.  I choose not to endorse enabling.

    Now you can troll someone else...
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 15,654
    mickeyrat said:
    mickeyrat said:
    People here are treating it like a crime. It's an illness which is caused by mental illness and or homelessness. But people fail to see that.
    addiction itself? or the things people will do to sustain the addiction?
    The addiction.
    what about alcoholism? its the same thing.

    and if addiction to various pills is criminal, the doctors and pharmacists should be held liable too, no?
    I didn't say it's a crime. I said other people are. I'm saying it is an illness. 
    oh no, I got your stance on it. but you are the man on the ground so to speak, so I wondered what Aussies felt in general on alcoholics in relation to other addicted people.
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • oftenreadingoftenreading Victoria, BCPosts: 10,430
    It's bad here in Canada as well...but it appears that our federal government has given up the battle...they are allowing a safe injection site in federal prison...LMFAO...I guess the fucking geniuses who thought this plan through have never heard of rehab or solitary confinement until you go to rehab.  
    I think you are not familiar with the research on safe injection sites, nor the federal regulations on when "solitary confinement" can be used and when it can not, nor what treatment programs are available in corrections now. And perhaps not familiar with how jails and prisons are built, and that there isn't infinite capacity to put everyone in "solitary confinement". Are you in favour of a lot more building of prisons?
    I am familiar with what prison is supposed to be...it a place to serve your sentence...not a place to go to get high.  Every Cell can be locked 24/7.  They can build treatment centers at a few prisons, and for those who refuse to deal with life can either sit in their cell 2/7 or they can build an isolation wing...in our justice system, we favour rehabilitation except for drug abuse.  I choose not to endorse enabling.

    Now you can troll someone else...
    Your definition of trolling is an amusing one. 

    Have you ever worked in a correctional facility? I have. You have no idea how they actually operate.  
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 None Of Your Business...Posts: 7,260
    Maybe I'll come back to this debate later.  It's party time in Ontario and Canada and most importantly Toronto...great parade happening in Toronto.  Should check it out...maybe someday Vancouver and BC will win a championship. or maybe not.
  • Thoughts_ArriveThoughts_Arrive Melbourne, AustraliaPosts: 13,863
    mickeyrat said:
    mickeyrat said:
    mickeyrat said:
    People here are treating it like a crime. It's an illness which is caused by mental illness and or homelessness. But people fail to see that.
    addiction itself? or the things people will do to sustain the addiction?
    The addiction.
    what about alcoholism? its the same thing.

    and if addiction to various pills is criminal, the doctors and pharmacists should be held liable too, no?
    I didn't say it's a crime. I said other people are. I'm saying it is an illness. 
    oh no, I got your stance on it. but you are the man on the ground so to speak, so I wondered what Aussies felt in general on alcoholics in relation to other addicted people.
    Oh, we love our alcohol here. We have a big drinking culture where it is expected that you'll have a few on a night out. If you say you are a non drinker people look at you and ask questions and give you a hard time. I know from personal experience and from hearing other people share similar stories. Having said all that, I don't think it is looked down upon like heroin addiction. I never hear people saying negative things about alcoholics. 
    Adelaide 17/11/2009, Melbourne 20/11/2009, Sydney 22/11/2009, Melbourne (Big Day Out Festival) 24/01/2014
  • oftenreadingoftenreading Victoria, BCPosts: 10,430
    Maybe I'll come back to this debate later.  It's party time in Ontario and Canada and most importantly Toronto...great parade happening in Toronto.  Should check it out...maybe someday Vancouver and BC will win a championship. or maybe not.

    By all means, come on back when you wish. I've worked in medium and maximum security correctional facilities in Ontario and BC. Right now I don't work in correctional facilities, but I still work in addictions treatment. BC is by far the better province to live in, and I was so stoked to be able to move back. It would be difficult for me to care less than I do about whether BC ever wins a championship in any sport, though. The sport that I'm passionate about, that I participate in and follow, isn't one that's ever going to lead to a parade; in fact, even thinking about that kind of makes me laugh. 
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 20,291
    I’m sure this will be the first of many lawsuits to come out. 
    Johnson and Johnson to pay 572 million to Oklahoma for their role in the opioid addiction outbreak. 
    https://apple.news/AE4SFETV1RpqPdziK9txr1g
  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 None Of Your Business...Posts: 7,260
    How come the government organizations (FDA) and politicians who fail to keep checks and balances on the FDA are not being held responsible?  People are foolish to trust that FDA or Health Canada...they do not seem to work for the citizenry.   
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 15,654
    How come the government organizations (FDA) and politicians who fail to keep checks and balances on the FDA are not being held responsible?  People are foolish to trust that FDA or Health Canada...they do not seem to work for the citizenry.   
    its not fda. its dea. gop has gutted most enforcement of high dollar donors like pharma and the distributors.. 
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 20,291
    mickeyrat said:
    How come the government organizations (FDA) and politicians who fail to keep checks and balances on the FDA are not being held responsible?  People are foolish to trust that FDA or Health Canada...they do not seem to work for the citizenry.   
    its not fda. its dea. gop has gutted most enforcement of high dollar donors like pharma and the distributors.. 
    Exactly.  There are reasons Monsanto, Pfizer and Big Pharma get so many things out there for years.  When it finally catches up to them they’ve already made their billions and the penalties are like paying taxes.

    No big deal to the companies, on to the next thing.

    Watch Dallas Buyers Club.  Here was something that was known to help people but it took years for it to finally be made publicly available.  Cards are all stacked against us.
  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 None Of Your Business...Posts: 7,260
    mickeyrat said:
    How come the government organizations (FDA) and politicians who fail to keep checks and balances on the FDA are not being held responsible?  People are foolish to trust that FDA or Health Canada...they do not seem to work for the citizenry.   
    its not fda. its dea. gop has gutted most enforcement of high dollar donors like pharma and the distributors.. 
    Does the FDA regulate drugs?  Did they approve this poison?  Time to start holding those who regulate drugs accountable.  The funniest thing I heard 1 time was from a nurse, Cannabis is bad because it did not spend 20 years being tested in a lab like Pharmaceuticals...she did not have an answer when I stated that Cannabis does not kill but those Pharmaceuticals that spend years in the lab...

    And no offence...the democrats have had opportunities to up the funding.

    Unless I am told the pharmaceutical is needed to keep me going, I avoid them like the plague.
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 15,654
    mickeyrat said:
    How come the government organizations (FDA) and politicians who fail to keep checks and balances on the FDA are not being held responsible?  People are foolish to trust that FDA or Health Canada...they do not seem to work for the citizenry.   
    its not fda. its dea. gop has gutted most enforcement of high dollar donors like pharma and the distributors.. 
    Does the FDA regulate drugs?  Did they approve this poison?  Time to start holding those who regulate drugs accountable.  The funniest thing I heard 1 time was from a nurse, Cannabis is bad because it did not spend 20 years being tested in a lab like Pharmaceuticals...she did not have an answer when I stated that Cannabis does not kill but those Pharmaceuticals that spend years in the lab...

    And no offence...the democrats have had opportunities to up the funding.

    Unless I am told the pharmaceutical is needed to keep me going, I avoid them like the plague.
    up to and for approval under specific use. after that the overprescribing etc falls under DEA.
    there are legitimate uses for these opiods under controlled protocols you know.  Quack doctors and greedy distributors, both on the wholesale side and the retail side is what exploded this in complicity with the manufacturers.

    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 15,654
      this is good news..


     

    Purdue Pharma’s negotiations to settle thousands of lawsuits over the company’s role in the opioids crisis have turned into a standoff between members of the Sackler family, who own the company, and a group of state attorneys general over how much the family should pay and whether it can continue selling drugs abroad.

    The Sacklers are deep in negotiations that, if finalized, would force them to give up ownership of Purdue, the company widely blamed for the onset of the opioid epidemic with its aggressive marketing of the prescription painkiller OxyContin. But they want to keep selling OxyContin and other drugs abroad for as many as seven more years, through another company they own, Mundipharma, based in Cambridge, England.

    Some attorneys general, particularly in wealthier states like New York, Massachusetts and Connecticut, are resisting that and other issues related to the foreign business.

    “Connecticut demands that the Sacklers and Purdue management be forced completely out of the opioid business, domestically and internationally, and that they never be allowed to return,” said Attorney General William Tong of Connecticut.

    Lawyers representing more than 2,000 local governments suing Purdue in federal court have some objections of their own, but are more hopeful that a deal can be reached, according to several people familiar with the negotiations.

    A big issue is how much cash the Sacklers would have to pay to settle. In the talks, which have gone on for more than a year, all plaintiffs — cities, counties and tribes as well as states — originally wanted $6 billion. The Sacklers are now offering to pay $3 billion over seven years, plus an additional $1.5 billion, but with significant contingencies. The second payment would depend on the eventual sale of Mundipharma, netting at least $4.5 billion, after taxes, which is not a certainty. The family is aiming to have that sale finance their entire payout.

    Some state attorneys general want the $4.5 billion in cash upfront instead and a more expeditious sale of Mundipharma, but at a negotiating session last week in Cleveland, representatives for the Sacklers rejected that, according to a person familiar with the discussion.

    Purdue and representatives of the Sackler family declined requests for comment. In a statement earlier this week, Purdue said that “it sees little good coming from years of wasteful litigation and appeals,” adding that the company “believes a constructive global resolution is the best path forward, and the company is actively working with the state attorneys general and other plaintiffs to achieve this outcome.”

    continues


    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 15,654
     

    The potential settlement deal would have the Sacklers giving up ownership of Purdue and putting it into bankruptcy. A variety of scenarios could then ensue, including its outright liquidation, with the proceeds going to the litigants, or a restructuring of Purdue into a trust with profits going toward paying additional compensation and providing free access to addiction treatment drugs.

    Image
    Massachusetts attorney general Maura Healey left with Wendy Werbiskis whose son died of an overdose outside a Boston courthouse earlier this month
    Massachusetts attorney general Maura Healey, left, with Wendy Werbiskis, whose son died of an overdose, outside a Boston courthouse earlier this month.CreditCharles Krupa/Associated Press

    The negotiations are taking place under the prodding of Judge Dan A. Polster of Federal District Court in Cleveland who is overseeing multi-district litigation involving claims filed by cities, counties, tribes and others. The states, which have cases against the opioid industry pending in their own state courts, are not parties to that litigation. But they were brought into the process at the judge’s urging to settle all claims against Purdue and other manufacturers, distributors and retailers of opioids. The settlement is intended to help compensate state and local governments for medical treatment, law enforcement and emergency costs stemming from addiction and overdoses that have led to hundreds of thousands of deaths in the past two decades.

    The talks continue to be “fluid,” as several people familiar with the negotiations characterized them, and the parties are next expected to report to Judge Polster on Wednesday.

    News of the possible settlement with the Sacklers and Purdue leaked Wednesday and set off a flurry of discussions, as lawyers jostled for leverage.

    All of this is taking place under the threat of a possible Chapter 11 bankruptcy restructuring by Purdue that, in the absence of a settlement, could leave the states, cities and counties fighting it out for years with creditors of the drug company.

    Arriving at a just calculus is extremely difficult. In addition to putting a price tag on Purdue’s responsibility for the public health crisis, lawyers are trying to assess the fortune that the Sacklers made from opioids, the value of proposals on the table, and how the optics of any deal will appear to voters.

    Image
    Richard Sackler former chairman and president of Purdue Pharma in a screengrab taken from a 2015 video deposition
    Richard Sackler, former chairman and president of Purdue Pharma, in a screengrab taken from a 2015 video deposition.CreditKentucky Attorney General’s Office

    Almost every state has filed a lawsuit against Purdue and other opioid manufacturers, with many also naming distributors and retailers. But the states’ priorities differ. States like New York and Massachusetts, who were among the first to name individual Sacklers in their lawsuits, have the staff and financing to conduct their own investigations, and are in a stronger position to hold out. But some states, whose opioid-related budgets are faltering, seem more willing to strike a deal sooner, according to several people familiar with the negotiations.

    The negotiations intensified a week ago at the meeting in Cleveland, which some representatives of the Sackler family attended, along with lawyers representing the federal cases as well as about a dozen states, including New York, Massachusetts, Ohio, Connecticut, Pennsylvania, Maryland, North Carolina, Texas, New Jersey, Louisiana, Florida and Tennessee.

    Elizabeth Burch, a professor at the University of Georgia School of Law who studies complex litigation, said the opioid defendants are fighting legal battles on multiple fronts. That constellation of legal activity may prompt some state attorneys general to balk at entering a global settlement, believing they can individually cut a better deal.

    Adding kindling to the fire, Attorney General Dave Yost of Ohio on Friday filed a motion with a federal appeals court, arguing that the consolidated local cases before Judge Polster have “hampered” the ability of his office and other states to negotiate settlements with opioid industry defendants.

    Mr. Yost contends states are in a better position to litigate claims and wants to block the start of a bellwether trial in October against opioid manufacturers, distributors and retailers, which is meant to test the strength of local government claims. The looming trial, which currently names Purdue among the defendants, is another factor goading the current talks.

    Dogging negotiations with the Sacklers are questions about the family’s fortune and how much money they should pay as part of any settlement.

    The Sackler family’s net worth has been estimated by Bloomberg at $13 billion, so paying $3 billion to settle their claims would still leave them with a substantial fortune. And even so, some investigators believe they are worth much more. Earlier this month, the office of the New York State attorney general, Letitia James, sent subpoenas to 33 financial institutions and investment advisers tied to the Sackler family as they seek to trace billions of dollars that prosecutors believe the family took out of Purdue. But the case is unlikely to be resolved soon, leaving the extent of their fortune a mystery.


    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 15,654
     

    Purdue has been under scrutiny for years. Back in 2007, the company and three of its executives pleaded guilty to criminal charges that they misled regulators, doctors and patients about the risk of OxyContin addiction and the potential for abuse.

    Many observers agree that the Sackler family, which has controlled Purdue, needs to give up their whole network of pharmaceutical companies, not just Purdue.

    “They can’t be in this anymore, period,” said Keith Humphreys, a professor at Stanford University and former drug policy adviser to President Obama, adding, “You have to go to the root, which is the family.”


    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
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