Is America the greatest country in the world?

PJ_Soul

HughFreakingDillon said:

mcgruff10 said:

What do my friends north of the border pay for healgh care a year?  Is it an itemized deduction on your pay Chevk?

that's really hard to say.

no, it is not, unless you are talking about private insurance coverage you get from your employer. 

I've never heard of such specifics filtering through an employer like that at all. I'm pretty sure even with extended healthcare plans, that kind of thing is kept confidential. I.e. the employer provides the insurance plan, but you still go through the insurance broker as an individual. I.e. I send my prescription receipts directly to Blue Cross for reimbursement. It's none of my employer's business which prescriptions I got. Same for any other medical treatment covered by extended healthcare insurance.

oftenreading

mcgruff10 said:

PJ_Soul said:

mcgruff10 said:

What do my friends north of the border pay for healgh care a year?  Is it an itemized deduction on your pay Chevk?

For basic healthcare, which includes ALL necessary care and procedures, including with specialists and ER visits, etc, we generally pay nothing. No, there is no itemization, and those handling our pay cheques have zero access to healthcare records. We don't ever see anything that lists how much it would have cost or anything. We just go in and get treated or evaluated or whatever, and then we walk out. That's it. And that does include child birth.

Some provinces do have a monthly fee for this, but it's not really relevant because it's so small and most adults have employers who pay it anyhow. It depends on your income. In BC it starts at $0 and maxes out at maybe $70?? I know if you earn less than $26K/year you don't pay anything. And if you do get charged this fee and don't pay it, nothing really happens anyway. It's not like if you never pay it you won't get the care. You'll still be covered. You simply owe them some money. They might add it to your income taxes owing actually, but not positive. All people have a right to medical care whether they pay or not.

Now there is extended healthcare insurance, which is usually 100% covered by employers, but some buy it, and that takes care of the stuff not covered by basic healthcare (mine covers 80% of most things, or up to a max, like I get $400 for eyeglasses every two years, etc etc). Extended healthcare covers things like massages and physio appointments, prescriptions, medical supplies, dental, non-necessary eye care (i.e. pay $80 for your annual standard eye exam (unless you're a child or over 65, when it's free), but anything for eye injuries or disease is covered under basic care). And then there is Pharmacare, which helps with prescriptions and medical supplies for those without extended care, and that is income-based.

But even though you walk in and it is free the money somehow comes from your income.  You don’t know the percentage?

No, it’s paid for through tax revenues. 

oftenreading

mcgruff10 said:

PJ_Soul said:

mcgruff10 said:

What do my friends north of the border pay for healgh care a year?  Is it an itemized deduction on your pay Chevk?

For basic healthcare, which includes ALL necessary care and procedures, including with specialists and ER visits, etc, we generally pay nothing. No, there is no itemization, and those handling our pay cheques have zero access to healthcare records. We don't ever see anything that lists how much it would have cost or anything. We just go in and get treated or evaluated or whatever, and then we walk out. That's it. And that does include child birth.

Some provinces do have a monthly fee for this, but it's not really relevant because it's so small and most adults have employers who pay it anyhow. It depends on your income. In BC it starts at $0 and maxes out at maybe $70?? I know if you earn less than $26K/year you don't pay anything. And if you do get charged this fee and don't pay it, nothing really happens anyway. It's not like if you never pay it you won't get the care. You'll still be covered. You simply owe them some money. They might add it to your income taxes owing actually, but not positive. All people have a right to medical care whether they pay or not.

Now there is extended healthcare insurance, which is usually 100% covered by employers, but some buy it, and that takes care of the stuff not covered by basic healthcare (mine covers 80% of most things, or up to a max, like I get $400 for eyeglasses every two years, etc etc). Extended healthcare covers things like massages and physio appointments, prescriptions, medical supplies, dental, non-necessary eye care (i.e. pay $80 for your annual standard eye exam (unless you're a child or over 65, when it's free), but anything for eye injuries or disease is covered under basic care). And then there is Pharmacare, which helps with prescriptions and medical supplies for those without extended care, and that is income-based.

But even though you walk in and it is free the money somehow comes from your income.  You don’t know the percentage?

I think it would be fairly complicated to figure out what portion of each person’s tax burden goes to health care, versus education or schools or any other area.   

jeffbr

How much does the 'average' Canadian pay in a year for public health care?

"According to the CIHI, in 2014, the last year for which comparable data was available, Canada spent $5,543 per resident, more than the United Kingdom ($4,986) and Australia ($5,187) but less than Sweden ($6,245) and far less than the United States ($11,126)."

PJ_Soul

oftenreading said:

mcgruff10 said:

PJ_Soul said:

mcgruff10 said:

What do my friends north of the border pay for healgh care a year?  Is it an itemized deduction on your pay Chevk?

For basic healthcare, which includes ALL necessary care and procedures, including with specialists and ER visits, etc, we generally pay nothing. No, there is no itemization, and those handling our pay cheques have zero access to healthcare records. We don't ever see anything that lists how much it would have cost or anything. We just go in and get treated or evaluated or whatever, and then we walk out. That's it. And that does include child birth.

Some provinces do have a monthly fee for this, but it's not really relevant because it's so small and most adults have employers who pay it anyhow. It depends on your income. In BC it starts at $0 and maxes out at maybe $70?? I know if you earn less than $26K/year you don't pay anything. And if you do get charged this fee and don't pay it, nothing really happens anyway. It's not like if you never pay it you won't get the care. You'll still be covered. You simply owe them some money. They might add it to your income taxes owing actually, but not positive. All people have a right to medical care whether they pay or not.

Now there is extended healthcare insurance, which is usually 100% covered by employers, but some buy it, and that takes care of the stuff not covered by basic healthcare (mine covers 80% of most things, or up to a max, like I get $400 for eyeglasses every two years, etc etc). Extended healthcare covers things like massages and physio appointments, prescriptions, medical supplies, dental, non-necessary eye care (i.e. pay $80 for your annual standard eye exam (unless you're a child or over 65, when it's free), but anything for eye injuries or disease is covered under basic care). And then there is Pharmacare, which helps with prescriptions and medical supplies for those without extended care, and that is income-based.

But even though you walk in and it is free the money somehow comes from your income.  You don’t know the percentage?

I think it would be fairly complicated to figure out what portion of each person’s tax burden goes to health care, versus education or schools or any other area.   

It's impossible. It's not like someone who gets cancer and racks up $300,000 in real care costs is taxed more. Just like people with kids don't pay more income tax because they have kids who go to school and get healthcare and shit. It's all just in the same pool of funds. We all obviously pay income tax based on our income though. And the government distributes all that tax revenue between services and expenses (income taxes and otherwise) as needed.

dignin

jeffbr said:

How much does the 'average' Canadian pay in a year for public health care?

"According to the CIHI, in 2014, the last year for which comparable data was available, Canada spent $5,543 per resident, more than the United Kingdom ($4,986) and Australia ($5,187) but less than Sweden ($6,245) and far less than the United States ($11,126)."

Wow. I knew Americans spend more for their healthcare but I had no idea it was double what Canadians pay. That's criminal.

rgambs

We could easily fund healthcare for all Americans if we didn't spend more than the rest of the world combined on "defense".

Thirty Bills Unpaid

PJ_Soul said:

mcgruff10 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

mcgruff10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

mcgruff10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

mcgruff10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Back to work the day after my surgery.

Now I understand how women giving birth in the US feels like.

Unless you pushed your appendix through the hole of your penis I don't think you have any clue what giving birth feels like.  

It's obvious ofc, but I'm taking about the piss poor treatment of parents (and small children) is in the US.

SWEDEN:
3 months paid leave for each parent. 300 more days to share. 

USA:
No paid leave. Max 12 weeks of unpaid parental leave.

U-S-A! U-S-A! 

Piss poor treatment?  What are you talking about?
Both my wife and I both got six weeks paid leave (New Jersey) after my youngest song was born.  

What am I talking about?

"This is one of the lowest levels of leave in the industrialized world. In comparison to other countries, the United States is one of the only countries in the world, and the only OECD member, that has not passed laws requiring business and corporations to offer paid maternity leave to their employees.[3]"

You are obsessed bro. 

how is it obsessing when he answered the question you asked him? how is it obsessing when all you wish for is for other humans to have the same benefits you have and can't undestand why a country so "rich" refuses to do this for its citizens, citizens who by and large can't afford these things out of pocket, and are proven to make society better, not make people lazier and "living off the government". no one is living off the government. they are paying taxes to a pool and people get benefits drawn from that pool. 

it's the same idea as "it takes a village to raise a child". why is it such a horrible concept for everyone to help each other? I have two loaves of bread, you have none, here, I'll give you half of one of mine. I still have enough for myself and mine of what I earned, but now I got to help another person who may not have had the same means as I did to earn my 2 loaves. 

it just amazes me that americans complain about so much, but when people outside their borders give suggestions regarding what has worked for them, they get their backs up and start shouting about how great america is.

are there ways that america does better than canada or sweden or other parts of europe? of course there are. I welcome those suggestions. I don't tell people they are obsessed with my country and that it wouldn't work because our countries aren't comparable. 

if someone starts a "is canada the greatest country in the world?", go ahead and comment as much as you wish. 

I mean he is obsessed with this thread.  Every day is something new.  He had an appendix removed and now he knows what it is like to give birth.  come on bro.  lol.  It isn't even close.  

Why don't you just let him post in peace?? I've never seen anyone get so shit on like this specifically just because he's posting in a thread a lot. Obviously he's doing it because he has a lot to say and is interested. Debate what he's saying, but not the fact that he's saying it.

Let me speak for Scruffy.

It's not necessarily him (Spiritual). It's more the fact that what he's saying sucks to hear. Discovering your country blows is a drag. Bliss is best!

mcgruff10

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

PJ_Soul said:

mcgruff10 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

mcgruff10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

mcgruff10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

mcgruff10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Back to work the day after my surgery.

Now I understand how women giving birth in the US feels like.

Unless you pushed your appendix through the hole of your penis I don't think you have any clue what giving birth feels like.  

It's obvious ofc, but I'm taking about the piss poor treatment of parents (and small children) is in the US.

SWEDEN:
3 months paid leave for each parent. 300 more days to share. 

USA:
No paid leave. Max 12 weeks of unpaid parental leave.

U-S-A! U-S-A! 

Piss poor treatment?  What are you talking about?
Both my wife and I both got six weeks paid leave (New Jersey) after my youngest song was born.  

What am I talking about?

"This is one of the lowest levels of leave in the industrialized world. In comparison to other countries, the United States is one of the only countries in the world, and the only OECD member, that has not passed laws requiring business and corporations to offer paid maternity leave to their employees.[3]"

You are obsessed bro. 

how is it obsessing when he answered the question you asked him? how is it obsessing when all you wish for is for other humans to have the same benefits you have and can't undestand why a country so "rich" refuses to do this for its citizens, citizens who by and large can't afford these things out of pocket, and are proven to make society better, not make people lazier and "living off the government". no one is living off the government. they are paying taxes to a pool and people get benefits drawn from that pool. 

it's the same idea as "it takes a village to raise a child". why is it such a horrible concept for everyone to help each other? I have two loaves of bread, you have none, here, I'll give you half of one of mine. I still have enough for myself and mine of what I earned, but now I got to help another person who may not have had the same means as I did to earn my 2 loaves. 

it just amazes me that americans complain about so much, but when people outside their borders give suggestions regarding what has worked for them, they get their backs up and start shouting about how great america is.

are there ways that america does better than canada or sweden or other parts of europe? of course there are. I welcome those suggestions. I don't tell people they are obsessed with my country and that it wouldn't work because our countries aren't comparable. 

if someone starts a "is canada the greatest country in the world?", go ahead and comment as much as you wish. 

I mean he is obsessed with this thread.  Every day is something new.  He had an appendix removed and now he knows what it is like to give birth.  come on bro.  lol.  It isn't even close.  

Why don't you just let him post in peace?? I've never seen anyone get so shit on like this specifically just because he's posting in a thread a lot. Obviously he's doing it because he has a lot to say and is interested. Debate what he's saying, but not the fact that he's saying it.

Let me speak for Scruffy.

It's not necessarily him (Spiritual). It's more the fact that what he's saying sucks to hear. Discovering your country blows is a drag. Bliss is best!

The us definitely doesn’t suck.  We have room for improvement like anywhere else but it definitely isn’t as bad as some make it out to be.  

Thirty Bills Unpaid

mcgruff10 said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

PJ_Soul said:

mcgruff10 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

mcgruff10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

mcgruff10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

mcgruff10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Back to work the day after my surgery.

Now I understand how women giving birth in the US feels like.

Unless you pushed your appendix through the hole of your penis I don't think you have any clue what giving birth feels like.  

It's obvious ofc, but I'm taking about the piss poor treatment of parents (and small children) is in the US.

SWEDEN:
3 months paid leave for each parent. 300 more days to share. 

USA:
No paid leave. Max 12 weeks of unpaid parental leave.

U-S-A! U-S-A! 

Piss poor treatment?  What are you talking about?
Both my wife and I both got six weeks paid leave (New Jersey) after my youngest song was born.  

What am I talking about?

"This is one of the lowest levels of leave in the industrialized world. In comparison to other countries, the United States is one of the only countries in the world, and the only OECD member, that has not passed laws requiring business and corporations to offer paid maternity leave to their employees.[3]"

You are obsessed bro. 

how is it obsessing when he answered the question you asked him? how is it obsessing when all you wish for is for other humans to have the same benefits you have and can't undestand why a country so "rich" refuses to do this for its citizens, citizens who by and large can't afford these things out of pocket, and are proven to make society better, not make people lazier and "living off the government". no one is living off the government. they are paying taxes to a pool and people get benefits drawn from that pool. 

it's the same idea as "it takes a village to raise a child". why is it such a horrible concept for everyone to help each other? I have two loaves of bread, you have none, here, I'll give you half of one of mine. I still have enough for myself and mine of what I earned, but now I got to help another person who may not have had the same means as I did to earn my 2 loaves. 

it just amazes me that americans complain about so much, but when people outside their borders give suggestions regarding what has worked for them, they get their backs up and start shouting about how great america is.

are there ways that america does better than canada or sweden or other parts of europe? of course there are. I welcome those suggestions. I don't tell people they are obsessed with my country and that it wouldn't work because our countries aren't comparable. 

if someone starts a "is canada the greatest country in the world?", go ahead and comment as much as you wish. 

I mean he is obsessed with this thread.  Every day is something new.  He had an appendix removed and now he knows what it is like to give birth.  come on bro.  lol.  It isn't even close.  

Why don't you just let him post in peace?? I've never seen anyone get so shit on like this specifically just because he's posting in a thread a lot. Obviously he's doing it because he has a lot to say and is interested. Debate what he's saying, but not the fact that he's saying it.

Let me speak for Scruffy.

It's not necessarily him (Spiritual). It's more the fact that what he's saying sucks to hear. Discovering your country blows is a drag. Bliss is best!

The us definitely doesn’t suck.  We have room for improvement like anywhere else but it definitely isn’t as bad as some make it out to be.  

Just busting your balls a bit, Scruffy! You know that.

Have you listened to Pigeon Camera yet? How about Locked in the Trunk of a Car?

PJ_Soul

mcgruff10 said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

PJ_Soul said:

mcgruff10 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

mcgruff10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

mcgruff10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

mcgruff10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Back to work the day after my surgery.

Now I understand how women giving birth in the US feels like.

Unless you pushed your appendix through the hole of your penis I don't think you have any clue what giving birth feels like.  

It's obvious ofc, but I'm taking about the piss poor treatment of parents (and small children) is in the US.

SWEDEN:
3 months paid leave for each parent. 300 more days to share. 

USA:
No paid leave. Max 12 weeks of unpaid parental leave.

U-S-A! U-S-A! 

Piss poor treatment?  What are you talking about?
Both my wife and I both got six weeks paid leave (New Jersey) after my youngest song was born.  

What am I talking about?

"This is one of the lowest levels of leave in the industrialized world. In comparison to other countries, the United States is one of the only countries in the world, and the only OECD member, that has not passed laws requiring business and corporations to offer paid maternity leave to their employees.[3]"

You are obsessed bro. 

how is it obsessing when he answered the question you asked him? how is it obsessing when all you wish for is for other humans to have the same benefits you have and can't undestand why a country so "rich" refuses to do this for its citizens, citizens who by and large can't afford these things out of pocket, and are proven to make society better, not make people lazier and "living off the government". no one is living off the government. they are paying taxes to a pool and people get benefits drawn from that pool. 

it's the same idea as "it takes a village to raise a child". why is it such a horrible concept for everyone to help each other? I have two loaves of bread, you have none, here, I'll give you half of one of mine. I still have enough for myself and mine of what I earned, but now I got to help another person who may not have had the same means as I did to earn my 2 loaves. 

it just amazes me that americans complain about so much, but when people outside their borders give suggestions regarding what has worked for them, they get their backs up and start shouting about how great america is.

are there ways that america does better than canada or sweden or other parts of europe? of course there are. I welcome those suggestions. I don't tell people they are obsessed with my country and that it wouldn't work because our countries aren't comparable. 

if someone starts a "is canada the greatest country in the world?", go ahead and comment as much as you wish. 

I mean he is obsessed with this thread.  Every day is something new.  He had an appendix removed and now he knows what it is like to give birth.  come on bro.  lol.  It isn't even close.  

Why don't you just let him post in peace?? I've never seen anyone get so shit on like this specifically just because he's posting in a thread a lot. Obviously he's doing it because he has a lot to say and is interested. Debate what he's saying, but not the fact that he's saying it.

Let me speak for Scruffy.

It's not necessarily him (Spiritual). It's more the fact that what he's saying sucks to hear. Discovering your country blows is a drag. Bliss is best!

The us definitely doesn’t suck.  We have room for improvement like anywhere else but it definitely isn’t as bad as some make it out to be.  

The healthcare system sure is though, and so is the President and the general state of federal politics. I don't think anyone is exaggerating about those two horror shows at all. I would also argue that what people have to say about the harm the USA does internationally, in various ways, is overstated either, depending on how you look at it. The USA is a much different place when you look at it from the outside in rather than the inside out. And it's not a less valid perspective. Just a different one. And a more objective one, in many ways. You just have to accept that. No, that doesn't mean that everything in America sucks. Literally nobody thinks that. But you know, pointing out what sucks is simply way more useful than pointing out what doesn't, and, frankly, more interesting too.

Spiritual_Chaos

mcgruff10 said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

PJ_Soul said:

mcgruff10 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

mcgruff10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

mcgruff10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

mcgruff10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Back to work the day after my surgery.

Now I understand how women giving birth in the US feels like.

Unless you pushed your appendix through the hole of your penis I don't think you have any clue what giving birth feels like.  

It's obvious ofc, but I'm taking about the piss poor treatment of parents (and small children) is in the US.

SWEDEN:
3 months paid leave for each parent. 300 more days to share. 

USA:
No paid leave. Max 12 weeks of unpaid parental leave.

U-S-A! U-S-A! 

Piss poor treatment?  What are you talking about?
Both my wife and I both got six weeks paid leave (New Jersey) after my youngest song was born.  

What am I talking about?

"This is one of the lowest levels of leave in the industrialized world. In comparison to other countries, the United States is one of the only countries in the world, and the only OECD member, that has not passed laws requiring business and corporations to offer paid maternity leave to their employees.[3]"

You are obsessed bro. 

how is it obsessing when he answered the question you asked him? how is it obsessing when all you wish for is for other humans to have the same benefits you have and can't undestand why a country so "rich" refuses to do this for its citizens, citizens who by and large can't afford these things out of pocket, and are proven to make society better, not make people lazier and "living off the government". no one is living off the government. they are paying taxes to a pool and people get benefits drawn from that pool. 

it's the same idea as "it takes a village to raise a child". why is it such a horrible concept for everyone to help each other? I have two loaves of bread, you have none, here, I'll give you half of one of mine. I still have enough for myself and mine of what I earned, but now I got to help another person who may not have had the same means as I did to earn my 2 loaves. 

it just amazes me that americans complain about so much, but when people outside their borders give suggestions regarding what has worked for them, they get their backs up and start shouting about how great america is.

are there ways that america does better than canada or sweden or other parts of europe? of course there are. I welcome those suggestions. I don't tell people they are obsessed with my country and that it wouldn't work because our countries aren't comparable. 

if someone starts a "is canada the greatest country in the world?", go ahead and comment as much as you wish. 

I mean he is obsessed with this thread.  Every day is something new.  He had an appendix removed and now he knows what it is like to give birth.  come on bro.  lol.  It isn't even close.  

Why don't you just let him post in peace?? I've never seen anyone get so shit on like this specifically just because he's posting in a thread a lot. Obviously he's doing it because he has a lot to say and is interested. Debate what he's saying, but not the fact that he's saying it.

Let me speak for Scruffy.

It's not necessarily him (Spiritual). It's more the fact that what he's saying sucks to hear. Discovering your country blows is a drag. Bliss is best!

The us definitely doesn’t suck.  We have room for improvement like anywhere else but it definitely isn’t as bad as some make it out to be.  

Maybe you would improve faster if you admit it does suck a bit more and is a bit more bad behind that patriotic "the greatest experiment in history and the only country with freedom of speech" sheen.

Some empathetic social democratic values would make you good.

mcgruff10

PJ_Soul said:

mcgruff10 said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

PJ_Soul said:

mcgruff10 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

mcgruff10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

mcgruff10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

mcgruff10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Back to work the day after my surgery.

Now I understand how women giving birth in the US feels like.

Unless you pushed your appendix through the hole of your penis I don't think you have any clue what giving birth feels like.  

It's obvious ofc, but I'm taking about the piss poor treatment of parents (and small children) is in the US.

SWEDEN:
3 months paid leave for each parent. 300 more days to share. 

USA:
No paid leave. Max 12 weeks of unpaid parental leave.

U-S-A! U-S-A! 

Piss poor treatment?  What are you talking about?
Both my wife and I both got six weeks paid leave (New Jersey) after my youngest song was born.  

What am I talking about?

"This is one of the lowest levels of leave in the industrialized world. In comparison to other countries, the United States is one of the only countries in the world, and the only OECD member, that has not passed laws requiring business and corporations to offer paid maternity leave to their employees.[3]"

You are obsessed bro. 

how is it obsessing when he answered the question you asked him? how is it obsessing when all you wish for is for other humans to have the same benefits you have and can't undestand why a country so "rich" refuses to do this for its citizens, citizens who by and large can't afford these things out of pocket, and are proven to make society better, not make people lazier and "living off the government". no one is living off the government. they are paying taxes to a pool and people get benefits drawn from that pool. 

it's the same idea as "it takes a village to raise a child". why is it such a horrible concept for everyone to help each other? I have two loaves of bread, you have none, here, I'll give you half of one of mine. I still have enough for myself and mine of what I earned, but now I got to help another person who may not have had the same means as I did to earn my 2 loaves. 

it just amazes me that americans complain about so much, but when people outside their borders give suggestions regarding what has worked for them, they get their backs up and start shouting about how great america is.

are there ways that america does better than canada or sweden or other parts of europe? of course there are. I welcome those suggestions. I don't tell people they are obsessed with my country and that it wouldn't work because our countries aren't comparable. 

if someone starts a "is canada the greatest country in the world?", go ahead and comment as much as you wish. 

I mean he is obsessed with this thread.  Every day is something new.  He had an appendix removed and now he knows what it is like to give birth.  come on bro.  lol.  It isn't even close.  

Why don't you just let him post in peace?? I've never seen anyone get so shit on like this specifically just because he's posting in a thread a lot. Obviously he's doing it because he has a lot to say and is interested. Debate what he's saying, but not the fact that he's saying it.

Let me speak for Scruffy.

It's not necessarily him (Spiritual). It's more the fact that what he's saying sucks to hear. Discovering your country blows is a drag. Bliss is best!

The us definitely doesn’t suck.  We have room for improvement like anywhere else but it definitely isn’t as bad as some make it out to be.  

The healthcare system sure is though, and so is the President and the general state of federal politics. I don't think anyone is exaggerating about those two horror shows at all. I would also argue that what people have to say about the harm the USA does internationally, in various ways, is overstated either, depending on how you look at it. The USA is a much different place when you look at it from the outside in rather than the inside out. And it's not a less valid perspective. Just a different one. And a more objective one, in many ways. You just have to accept that. No, that doesn't mean that everything in America sucks. Literally nobody thinks that. But you know, pointing out what sucks is simply way more useful than pointing out what doesn't, and, frankly, more interesting too.

Based on what you guys said today our healthcare definitely sucks if you don’t have good health insurance. Federal politics is better since the midterm elections. The president definitely sucks but no where as bad as W. 

Spiritual_Chaos

mcgruff10 said:

 The president definitely sucks but no where as bad as W. 

Who would you trust the most with getting through a 4th graders math book?

Who acknowledged climate change of the two? 

Who knew what climate change even was of the two?

PJ_Soul

Yeah, I think Trump is way worse than Bush, and yes, I remember everything Bush did. The difference is that Trump and his administration are FAR more incompetent than GW and his admin ever was. If that weren't the case, Trump and friends would have done far more damage IMO. So basically, people might hate GW more because he and the people he chose to surround himself with were NOT completely incompetent. How odd, lol.

Frankly, I don't understand how anyone can think GW is worse. I acknowledge people really feel that way - I just can't relate, really, all things considered. And I do wonder if those who say that are really acknowledging all the shit Trump actually has managed to do/fuck up. Because I think a lot of what he's actually done and is doing is being completely obscured by his day-to-day ridiculousness, so all the real issues and all the crap that Trump has done or undone to America and the world's detriment aren't even a blip on people's radars, even though they should be (and I don't blame people for that really, but do with people would focus better). And then there is the obvious shit that people forget about too - the lies, what I can only call illegal activity being done right out in the open, the clear erosion of America's state of democracy, the dismantling of trade relations with all of America's biggest trading partners, the environmental deregulation .... etc etc etc etc etc. And lots of people are dying under Trump's watch too. And remember, Trump's only had a couple years. George had 8. Just wait. I can't even imagine all the horribleness that Trump could fit into 8 years.

Meltdown99

Why do so many Americans gripe about universal health care?  Are they that stupid?  Brainwashed?

PJ_Soul

Meltdown99 said:

Why do so many Americans gripe about universal health care?  Are they that stupid?  Brainwashed?

I have to assume they're brainwashed. There is no other explanation that would make sense..... At least a fair number of them seem to be starting to realize it though.

Meltdown99

mcgruff10 said:

What do my friends north of the border pay for healgh care a year?  Is it an itemized deduction on your pay Chevk?

In Ontario we have a health levy, it's not much ... its just extra tax.  You know what, even poor people get good treatment ... that's what matters.  I went to my doctor for a note last week, I was billed $0...

mcgruff10

Meltdown99 said:

mcgruff10 said:

What do my friends north of the border pay for healgh care a year?  Is it an itemized deduction on your pay Chevk?

In Ontario we have a health levy, it's not much ... its just extra tax.  You know what, even poor people get good treatment ... that's what matters.  I went to my doctor for a note last week, I was billed $0...

So it is an extra tax on what exactly? Like does the lottery pay for your health care? Toll roads?  
Or what I am kind of thinking is Canada takes out 30% (whatever it may be) of your wages. You aren’t sure how much but a percentage goes to pay for health care. 

Meltdown99

I'll never except private insurance for health care.  I have auto and home insurance, pisses me off that I have to pay these gangsters only to have to try and get out of paying claims...I imagine in the US them fuckers in insurance are looking for the same...Anyone who works for an insurance has no SOUL and can FUCKOFF...