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Syria and the US's Motive

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    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,626

    mrussel1 said:

    wait....the USSR plans to occupy Syria?

    Oh so now we act like these are different countries? So Russia gets to wash away everything pre1989? Putin wasn't a KGB colonel and a member of the Communist party?
    More logical fallacies - false equivalence this time.
    And yes, in a globalized world largely controlled by a single super power, sanctions are a form of 'cleansing'.

    I have to wonder if you and Jason would even be commenting on this thread if it wasn't an opportunity to shit on Russia. You are the only guy here with a more engrained hatred for them than Jason.
    The point to be made here is not that Russia is the more benevolent occupier (like, really?)...it is that American exceptionalism is a fantasy. Fuck the (world) police. The US has no moral high ground from which to justify their imperialist foreign policy
    I despise Russia because the Soviets were responsible for the deaths of my extended family. All of them. Not one survived. The US government killed exactly zero of my family. So maybe your arm chair analysis of world affairs holds no real consequences, but my family was affected by them.
    Second... my first wife was a Polish immigrant. Her father was a lieutenant to Walesa. He was imprisoned and tortured until Reagan was able to extract the dissidents to the US. Her grandmother was in Treblinka, survived, and grandfather was a Polish officer. You can guess what happened to him.

    So yeah. I hate the Russians for deep and personal reasons. They have been murderous butchers for more than a century. There is no comparison to sanctions. Give me a break.
  • Options
    JC29856JC29856 Posts: 9,617
    mrussel1 said:

    mrussel1 said:

    wait....the USSR plans to occupy Syria?

    Oh so now we act like these are different countries? So Russia gets to wash away everything pre1989? Putin wasn't a KGB colonel and a member of the Communist party?
    More logical fallacies - false equivalence this time.
    And yes, in a globalized world largely controlled by a single super power, sanctions are a form of 'cleansing'.

    I have to wonder if you and Jason would even be commenting on this thread if it wasn't an opportunity to shit on Russia. You are the only guy here with a more engrained hatred for them than Jason.
    The point to be made here is not that Russia is the more benevolent occupier (like, really?)...it is that American exceptionalism is a fantasy. Fuck the (world) police. The US has no moral high ground from which to justify their imperialist foreign policy
    I despise Russia because the Soviets were responsible for the deaths of my extended family. All of them. Not one survived. The US government killed exactly zero of my family. So maybe your arm chair analysis of world affairs holds no real consequences, but my family was affected by them.
    Second... my first wife was a Polish immigrant. Her father was a lieutenant to Walesa. He was imprisoned and tortured until Reagan was able to extract the dissidents to the US. Her grandmother was in Treblinka, survived, and grandfather was a Polish officer. You can guess what happened to him.

    So yeah. I hate the Russians for deep and personal reasons. They have been murderous butchers for more than a century. There is no comparison to sanctions. Give me a break.
    We know, you have personal justifiable biases against Russia, you said it before. We get it.
  • Options
    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,626
    edited December 2016
    JC29856 said:

    mrussel1 said:

    mrussel1 said:

    wait....the USSR plans to occupy Syria?

    Oh so now we act like these are different countries? So Russia gets to wash away everything pre1989? Putin wasn't a KGB colonel and a member of the Communist party?
    More logical fallacies - false equivalence this time.
    And yes, in a globalized world largely controlled by a single super power, sanctions are a form of 'cleansing'.

    I have to wonder if you and Jason would even be commenting on this thread if it wasn't an opportunity to shit on Russia. You are the only guy here with a more engrained hatred for them than Jason.
    The point to be made here is not that Russia is the more benevolent occupier (like, really?)...it is that American exceptionalism is a fantasy. Fuck the (world) police. The US has no moral high ground from which to justify their imperialist foreign policy
    I despise Russia because the Soviets were responsible for the deaths of my extended family. All of them. Not one survived. The US government killed exactly zero of my family. So maybe your arm chair analysis of world affairs holds no real consequences, but my family was affected by them.
    Second... my first wife was a Polish immigrant. Her father was a lieutenant to Walesa. He was imprisoned and tortured until Reagan was able to extract the dissidents to the US. Her grandmother was in Treblinka, survived, and grandfather was a Polish officer. You can guess what happened to him.

    So yeah. I hate the Russians for deep and personal reasons. They have been murderous butchers for more than a century. There is no comparison to sanctions. Give me a break.
    We know, you have personal justifiable biases against Russia, you said it before. We get it.
    My post wasn't to you. It was to Russian apologists. If it's so great there, why do people emigrate here? That makes no fucking sense. Why aren't our esteemed posters clamoring for their Russian visas?
    Post edited by mrussel1 on
  • Options
    polaris_xpolaris_x Posts: 13,559
    mrussel1 said:

    I don't need to believe anything. I know damn well the US is imperialistic. But to say or excuse Russia's abhorrent behavior in the 20th century and say the US is worse is delusional and completely blind in the other direction. For every My Lai, there are 20 Katyn's that happened every day, orchestrated by the Soviets.


    not even close ... when you factor in the following:

    * rise of al qaeda and ISIS
    * rise of extremism
    * overthrow of democratic and sovereign countries in latin america and the middle east
    * continued support of israel's occupation and human rights violations in palestine

    not sure how anyone can say russia is worse ... not even close
  • Options
    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,626
    polaris_x said:

    mrussel1 said:

    I don't need to believe anything. I know damn well the US is imperialistic. But to say or excuse Russia's abhorrent behavior in the 20th century and say the US is worse is delusional and completely blind in the other direction. For every My Lai, there are 20 Katyn's that happened every day, orchestrated by the Soviets.


    not even close ... when you factor in the following:

    * rise of al qaeda and ISIS
    * rise of extremism
    * overthrow of democratic and sovereign countries in latin america and the middle east
    * continued support of israel's occupation and human rights violations in palestine

    not sure how anyone can say russia is worse ... not even close
    Rise of extremism? It's not like we invented Muslim extremism. It was suppressed by brutal dictators. Weird that you're defending that.
  • Options
    polaris_xpolaris_x Posts: 13,559
    mrussel1 said:

    JC29856 said:

    mrussel1 said:

    mrussel1 said:

    wait....the USSR plans to occupy Syria?

    Oh so now we act like these are different countries? So Russia gets to wash away everything pre1989? Putin wasn't a KGB colonel and a member of the Communist party?
    More logical fallacies - false equivalence this time.
    And yes, in a globalized world largely controlled by a single super power, sanctions are a form of 'cleansing'.

    I have to wonder if you and Jason would even be commenting on this thread if it wasn't an opportunity to shit on Russia. You are the only guy here with a more engrained hatred for them than Jason.
    The point to be made here is not that Russia is the more benevolent occupier (like, really?)...it is that American exceptionalism is a fantasy. Fuck the (world) police. The US has no moral high ground from which to justify their imperialist foreign policy
    I despise Russia because the Soviets were responsible for the deaths of my extended family. All of them. Not one survived. The US government killed exactly zero of my family. So maybe your arm chair analysis of world affairs holds no real consequences, but my family was affected by them.
    Second... my first wife was a Polish immigrant. Her father was a lieutenant to Walesa. He was imprisoned and tortured until Reagan was able to extract the dissidents to the US. Her grandmother was in Treblinka, survived, and grandfather was a Polish officer. You can guess what happened to him.

    So yeah. I hate the Russians for deep and personal reasons. They have been murderous butchers for more than a century. There is no comparison to sanctions. Give me a break.
    We know, you have personal justifiable biases against Russia, you said it before. We get it.
    My post wasn't to you. It was to Russian apologists. If it's so great there, why do people emigrate here? That makes no fucking sense. Why aren't our esteemed posters clamoring for their Russian visas?
    just because your country offers opportunity doesn't make it great ... that opportunity has always come at a cost ... and because collectively, as a nation, you care not of the cost doesn't meant that cost hasn't been paid by millions of people ...

    for someone who supposedly has first hand knowledge of the suffering that illegal intervention could cause ... you would think you would be one to live against it ... so, ya ... hate on russia while continuing to enable what your own country does ...
  • Options
    polaris_xpolaris_x Posts: 13,559
    mrussel1 said:

    polaris_x said:

    mrussel1 said:

    I don't need to believe anything. I know damn well the US is imperialistic. But to say or excuse Russia's abhorrent behavior in the 20th century and say the US is worse is delusional and completely blind in the other direction. For every My Lai, there are 20 Katyn's that happened every day, orchestrated by the Soviets.


    not even close ... when you factor in the following:

    * rise of al qaeda and ISIS
    * rise of extremism
    * overthrow of democratic and sovereign countries in latin america and the middle east
    * continued support of israel's occupation and human rights violations in palestine

    not sure how anyone can say russia is worse ... not even close
    Rise of extremism? It's not like we invented Muslim extremism. It was suppressed by brutal dictators. Weird that you're defending that.
    oh no ... you can be sure you invented it ...

    the middle east was once a global jewel ... full of culture and history ... then you guys decide that you want to control the oil and all hell broke loose ...

    think about it for a second ... you guys spend more on defence than the NEXT 26 countries combined ... what for? ... you don't really believe people hate america because of big macs and the fact you can watch dr. phil on tv do ya? ... the military industrial complex is real ... war profiteering is real ... any country that's dependent on war and death to spur an economy is evil ... PERIOD ...
  • Options
    JC29856JC29856 Posts: 9,617
    polaris_x said:

    mrussel1 said:

    polaris_x said:

    mrussel1 said:

    I don't need to believe anything. I know damn well the US is imperialistic. But to say or excuse Russia's abhorrent behavior in the 20th century and say the US is worse is delusional and completely blind in the other direction. For every My Lai, there are 20 Katyn's that happened every day, orchestrated by the Soviets.


    not even close ... when you factor in the following:

    * rise of al qaeda and ISIS
    * rise of extremism
    * overthrow of democratic and sovereign countries in latin america and the middle east
    * continued support of israel's occupation and human rights violations in palestine

    not sure how anyone can say russia is worse ... not even close
    Rise of extremism? It's not like we invented Muslim extremism. It was suppressed by brutal dictators. Weird that you're defending that.
    oh no ... you can be sure you invented it ...

    the middle east was once a global jewel ... full of culture and history ... then you guys decide that you want to control the oil and all hell broke loose ...

    think about it for a second ... you guys spend more on defence than the NEXT 26 countries combined ... what for? ... you don't really believe people hate america because of big macs and the fact you can watch dr. phil on tv do ya? ... the military industrial complex is real ... war profiteering is real ... any country that's dependent on war and death to spur an economy is evil ... PERIOD ...
    dont forget the almighty dollar as world currency, the second anyone poses a threat. they end up ded... way back to JFK to more recently Saddam and Gadhafi.
  • Options
    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,626
    polaris_x said:

    mrussel1 said:

    polaris_x said:

    mrussel1 said:

    I don't need to believe anything. I know damn well the US is imperialistic. But to say or excuse Russia's abhorrent behavior in the 20th century and say the US is worse is delusional and completely blind in the other direction. For every My Lai, there are 20 Katyn's that happened every day, orchestrated by the Soviets.


    not even close ... when you factor in the following:

    * rise of al qaeda and ISIS
    * rise of extremism
    * overthrow of democratic and sovereign countries in latin america and the middle east
    * continued support of israel's occupation and human rights violations in palestine

    not sure how anyone can say russia is worse ... not even close
    Rise of extremism? It's not like we invented Muslim extremism. It was suppressed by brutal dictators. Weird that you're defending that.
    oh no ... you can be sure you invented it ...

    the middle east was once a global jewel ... full of culture and history ... then you guys decide that you want to control the oil and all hell broke loose ...

    think about it for a second ... you guys spend more on defence than the NEXT 26 countries combined ... what for? ... you don't really believe people hate america because of big macs and the fact you can watch dr. phil on tv do ya? ... the military industrial complex is real ... war profiteering is real ... any country that's dependent on war and death to spur an economy is evil ... PERIOD ...
    Who the fuck are"you guys"? Are you not associated with any of the ally powers from the Great War? Because they are the ones that partitioned the Ottomans into nation states to benefit western Europe.
  • Options
    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,626
    edited December 2016
    JC29856 said:

    polaris_x said:

    mrussel1 said:

    polaris_x said:

    mrussel1 said:

    I don't need to believe anything. I know damn well the US is imperialistic. But to say or excuse Russia's abhorrent behavior in the 20th century and say the US is worse is delusional and completely blind in the other direction. For every My Lai, there are 20 Katyn's that happened every day, orchestrated by the Soviets.


    not even close ... when you factor in the following:

    * rise of al qaeda and ISIS
    * rise of extremism
    * overthrow of democratic and sovereign countries in latin america and the middle east
    * continued support of israel's occupation and human rights violations in palestine

    not sure how anyone can say russia is worse ... not even close
    Rise of extremism? It's not like we invented Muslim extremism. It was suppressed by brutal dictators. Weird that you're defending that.
    oh no ... you can be sure you invented it ...

    the middle east was once a global jewel ... full of culture and history ... then you guys decide that you want to control the oil and all hell broke loose ...

    think about it for a second ... you guys spend more on defence than the NEXT 26 countries combined ... what for? ... you don't really believe people hate america because of big macs and the fact you can watch dr. phil on tv do ya? ... the military industrial complex is real ... war profiteering is real ... any country that's dependent on war and death to spur an economy is evil ... PERIOD ...
    dont forget the almighty dollar as world currency, the second anyone poses a threat. they end up ded... way back to JFK to more recently Saddam and Gadhafi.
    Hey Lenin....did you forget about Trotsky? Tomsky? How many people that posed a threat to the Soviets and were killed would you like me to list? It's a long list before we even leave Russia.
  • Options
    JC29856JC29856 Posts: 9,617
    mrussel1 said:

    JC29856 said:

    polaris_x said:

    mrussel1 said:

    polaris_x said:

    mrussel1 said:

    I don't need to believe anything. I know damn well the US is imperialistic. But to say or excuse Russia's abhorrent behavior in the 20th century and say the US is worse is delusional and completely blind in the other direction. For every My Lai, there are 20 Katyn's that happened every day, orchestrated by the Soviets.


    not even close ... when you factor in the following:

    * rise of al qaeda and ISIS
    * rise of extremism
    * overthrow of democratic and sovereign countries in latin america and the middle east
    * continued support of israel's occupation and human rights violations in palestine

    not sure how anyone can say russia is worse ... not even close
    Rise of extremism? It's not like we invented Muslim extremism. It was suppressed by brutal dictators. Weird that you're defending that.
    oh no ... you can be sure you invented it ...

    the middle east was once a global jewel ... full of culture and history ... then you guys decide that you want to control the oil and all hell broke loose ...

    think about it for a second ... you guys spend more on defence than the NEXT 26 countries combined ... what for? ... you don't really believe people hate america because of big macs and the fact you can watch dr. phil on tv do ya? ... the military industrial complex is real ... war profiteering is real ... any country that's dependent on war and death to spur an economy is evil ... PERIOD ...
    dont forget the almighty dollar as world currency, the second anyone poses a threat. they end up ded... way back to JFK to more recently Saddam and Gadhafi.
    Hey Lenin....did you forget about Trotsky? Tomsky? How many people that posed a threat to the Soviets and were killed would you like me to list? It's a long list before we even leave Russia.
    Whatever makes you feel better about the atrocities committed against "your people". I'm all for healing, have at it.

    No wonder you were such a staunch Hilliary supportor, you couldn't wait to cheer on war with the killers and butchers. Would it have been revenge? Im assuming your post election sabbatical was due to the bureaucratic de-enlistment hoops you had to jump thru after Hilliary lost and so did eventual war with Russia.
  • Options
    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,626
    JC29856 said:

    mrussel1 said:

    JC29856 said:

    polaris_x said:

    mrussel1 said:

    polaris_x said:

    mrussel1 said:

    I don't need to believe anything. I know damn well the US is imperialistic. But to say or excuse Russia's abhorrent behavior in the 20th century and say the US is worse is delusional and completely blind in the other direction. For every My Lai, there are 20 Katyn's that happened every day, orchestrated by the Soviets.


    not even close ... when you factor in the following:

    * rise of al qaeda and ISIS
    * rise of extremism
    * overthrow of democratic and sovereign countries in latin america and the middle east
    * continued support of israel's occupation and human rights violations in palestine

    not sure how anyone can say russia is worse ... not even close
    Rise of extremism? It's not like we invented Muslim extremism. It was suppressed by brutal dictators. Weird that you're defending that.
    oh no ... you can be sure you invented it ...

    the middle east was once a global jewel ... full of culture and history ... then you guys decide that you want to control the oil and all hell broke loose ...

    think about it for a second ... you guys spend more on defence than the NEXT 26 countries combined ... what for? ... you don't really believe people hate america because of big macs and the fact you can watch dr. phil on tv do ya? ... the military industrial complex is real ... war profiteering is real ... any country that's dependent on war and death to spur an economy is evil ... PERIOD ...
    dont forget the almighty dollar as world currency, the second anyone poses a threat. they end up ded... way back to JFK to more recently Saddam and Gadhafi.
    Hey Lenin....did you forget about Trotsky? Tomsky? How many people that posed a threat to the Soviets and were killed would you like me to list? It's a long list before we even leave Russia.
    Whatever makes you feel better about the atrocities committed against "your people". I'm all for healing, have at it.

    No wonder you were such a staunch Hilliary supportor, you couldn't wait to cheer on war with the killers and butchers. Would it have been revenge? Im assuming your post election sabbatical was due to the bureaucratic de-enlistment hoops you had to jump thru after Hilliary lost and so did eventual war with Russia.
    I said multiple times that I never believed that we would escalate to war. It would be economic war if anything or a proxy . But if you're accusing me of supporting Hillary and her Russian position vs. Trump and his school girl crush....then you're goddamn right!
  • Options
    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,626
    WTF are bureaucratic de-enlistment hoops,
  • Options
    Drowned OutDrowned Out Posts: 6,056
    edited December 2016
    I'm no Russian apologist. If they won the Cold War and were the ones expanding their empire unabated for the last 30 years, encircling North America with military bases and intercepting missiles and starting a new arms race, they'd be the ones I was bitching about.
  • Options
    JC29856JC29856 Posts: 9,617
    edited December 2016
    https://www.rt.com/news/372027-russian-mine-swipers-aleppo/

    “The munitions we found were German, American, Bulgarian... The amount they had was somewhat disconcerting,” Maj. Ivan Gromov, a bomb disposal squad leader said.

    The munition pictured looks like sarin gas.
    Post edited by JC29856 on
  • Options
    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,626
    JC29856 said:

    https://www.rt.com/news/372027-russian-mine-swipers-aleppo/

    “The munitions we found were German, American, Bulgarian... The amount they had was somewhat disconcerting,” Maj. Ivan Gromov, a bomb disposal squad leader said.

    The munition pictured looks like sarin gas.

    A quote by a Russian officer? That's compelling for whatever argument you're making. It's weird that they wouldn't find any Russian munitions since the Russians were arming the Syrians. Maybe their munitions are self dissolving.
  • Options
    JC29856JC29856 Posts: 9,617
    mrussel1 said:

    JC29856 said:

    https://www.rt.com/news/372027-russian-mine-swipers-aleppo/

    “The munitions we found were German, American, Bulgarian... The amount they had was somewhat disconcerting,” Maj. Ivan Gromov, a bomb disposal squad leader said.

    The munition pictured looks like sarin gas.

    A quote by a Russian officer? That's compelling for whatever argument you're making. It's weird that they wouldn't find any Russian munitions since the Russians were arming the Syrians. Maybe their munitions are self dissolving.
    It may have something to do with moderate rebel munitions and where they are looking.

    Russian bomb disposal teams are continuing to sweep schools and mosques of Aleppo for booby-traps, mines and munitions after they were wrested from rebel control.
    They reported 2,149 building in and near Aleppo as safe, including 44 schools, 38 mosques, 10 medical facilities and other crucial civilian infrastructure.
  • Options
    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,626
    And I love how you read and quote official Russian news as evidence. Just because it's not operating under the original name of Pravda doesn't mean it ain't Pravda.
  • Options
    JC29856JC29856 Posts: 9,617
    mrussel1 said:

    JC29856 said:

    https://www.rt.com/news/372027-russian-mine-swipers-aleppo/

    “The munitions we found were German, American, Bulgarian... The amount they had was somewhat disconcerting,” Maj. Ivan Gromov, a bomb disposal squad leader said.

    The munition pictured looks like sarin gas.

    A quote by a Russian officer? That's compelling for whatever argument you're making. It's weird that they wouldn't find any Russian munitions since the Russians were arming the Syrians. Maybe their munitions are self dissolving.
    Russians arming Syrians!!!


    image
  • Options
    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,626
    JC29856 said:

    mrussel1 said:

    JC29856 said:

    https://www.rt.com/news/372027-russian-mine-swipers-aleppo/

    “The munitions we found were German, American, Bulgarian... The amount they had was somewhat disconcerting,” Maj. Ivan Gromov, a bomb disposal squad leader said.

    The munition pictured looks like sarin gas.

    A quote by a Russian officer? That's compelling for whatever argument you're making. It's weird that they wouldn't find any Russian munitions since the Russians were arming the Syrians. Maybe their munitions are self dissolving.
    Russians arming Syrians!!!


    image
    More Pravda? You're a riot. You read Russian Today and think you have the truth. What a joke.
  • Options
    JC29856JC29856 Posts: 9,617
    mrussel1 said:

    JC29856 said:

    mrussel1 said:

    JC29856 said:

    https://www.rt.com/news/372027-russian-mine-swipers-aleppo/

    “The munitions we found were German, American, Bulgarian... The amount they had was somewhat disconcerting,” Maj. Ivan Gromov, a bomb disposal squad leader said.

    The munition pictured looks like sarin gas.

    A quote by a Russian officer? That's compelling for whatever argument you're making. It's weird that they wouldn't find any Russian munitions since the Russians were arming the Syrians. Maybe their munitions are self dissolving.
    Russians arming Syrians!!!


    image
    More Pravda? You're a riot. You read Russian Today and think you have the truth. What a joke.
    Enlighten us.
    You should at least provide some details on pravda if you're going to refer to it twice in as many posts.
  • Options
    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,626
    JC29856 said:

    mrussel1 said:

    JC29856 said:

    mrussel1 said:

    JC29856 said:

    https://www.rt.com/news/372027-russian-mine-swipers-aleppo/

    “The munitions we found were German, American, Bulgarian... The amount they had was somewhat disconcerting,” Maj. Ivan Gromov, a bomb disposal squad leader said.

    The munition pictured looks like sarin gas.

    A quote by a Russian officer? That's compelling for whatever argument you're making. It's weird that they wouldn't find any Russian munitions since the Russians were arming the Syrians. Maybe their munitions are self dissolving.
    Russians arming Syrians!!!


    image
    More Pravda? You're a riot. You read Russian Today and think you have the truth. What a joke.
    Enlighten us.
    You should at least provide some details on pravda if you're going to refer to it twice in as many posts.
    Soviet era propaganda newspaper. It's Russian for Truth.
  • Options
    Drowned OutDrowned Out Posts: 6,056
    Is there US-era propaganda? I'll take RT over CNN, FOX, or MSNBC any day.
  • Options
    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,626

    Is there US-era propaganda? I'll take RT over CNN, FOX, or MSNBC any day.

    Right... State controlled media is always the way to go. That's a good lesson. You think Watergate gets exposed in Russia? My Lai? Iran Contra?
  • Options
    Drowned OutDrowned Out Posts: 6,056
    mrussel1 said:

    Is there US-era propaganda? I'll take RT over CNN, FOX, or MSNBC any day.

    Right... State controlled media is always the way to go. That's a good lesson. You think Watergate gets exposed in Russia? My Lai? Iran Contra?
    Please. The same corps that own US media own the US govt. what's the difference? I'd also take the BBC or CBC over the US stations I mentioned.
    Is there US propaganda?
  • Options
    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,626
    edited December 2016

    mrussel1 said:

    Is there US-era propaganda? I'll take RT over CNN, FOX, or MSNBC any day.

    Right... State controlled media is always the way to go. That's a good lesson. You think Watergate gets exposed in Russia? My Lai? Iran Contra?
    Please. The same corps that own US media own the US govt. what's the difference? I'd also take the BBC or CBC over the US stations I mentioned.
    Is there US propaganda?
    Of course there is propaganda. That's a dumb question. But there is a world of difference between BBC and Pravda or RT. Just because the US media flawed doesn't make the polar opposite good.

    And you don't think the British or Canadian govt doesn't also feed bbc or CBC propaganda?
    Post edited by mrussel1 on
  • Options
    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,626

    mrussel1 said:

    Is there US-era propaganda? I'll take RT over CNN, FOX, or MSNBC any day.

    Right... State controlled media is always the way to go. That's a good lesson. You think Watergate gets exposed in Russia? My Lai? Iran Contra?
    Please. The same corps that own US media own the US govt. what's the difference? I'd also take the BBC or CBC over the US stations I mentioned.
    Is there US propaganda?
    Oh...and do you think the oligarchs in Russia are independent from the govt? The government is 100% controlling of business interests. Is that better to you? Is it better that if you run afoul of Putin he jails you and breaks up your company to himself and the other oligarchs?
  • Options
    Drowned OutDrowned Out Posts: 6,056
    I never said anything good about Pravda. RT is not Pravda.
    They are no more polar opposites than CNN and FOX. At least as it pertains to international news, RT is way ahead. It has actual informed guests on each side of a debate their talk shows....US stations like to parade out establishment speakers and phony terrorism experts.
    But again...this is because of the current state of affairs. It's easy for RT to have honest reporting because honest criticism of the US is all they need to support their position.
  • Options
    Drowned OutDrowned Out Posts: 6,056
    mrussel1 said:

    mrussel1 said:

    Is there US-era propaganda? I'll take RT over CNN, FOX, or MSNBC any day.

    Right... State controlled media is always the way to go. That's a good lesson. You think Watergate gets exposed in Russia? My Lai? Iran Contra?
    Please. The same corps that own US media own the US govt. what's the difference? I'd also take the BBC or CBC over the US stations I mentioned.
    Is there US propaganda?
    Oh...and do you think the oligarchs in Russia are independent from the govt? The government is 100% controlling of business interests. Is that better to you? Is it better that if you run afoul of Putin he jails you and breaks up your company to himself and the other oligarchs?
    You're moving the goal posts. As per. But no, it's not better.
  • Options
    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,626

    I never said anything good about Pravda. RT is not Pravda.
    They are no more polar opposites than CNN and FOX. At least as it pertains to international news, RT is way ahead. It has actual informed guests on each side of a debate their talk shows....US stations like to parade out establishment speakers and phony terrorism experts.
    But again...this is because of the current state of affairs. It's easy for RT to have honest reporting because honest criticism of the US is all they need to support their position.

    RT and honest reporting. Ha. What a fucking joke. I agree that CNN and all of the 24 news stations are shit. But it's not because they are controlled by the government, it's because their raison d'etre is capitalism so they are focused on ratings and entertainment ahead of actual news. When those two meet, then yeah.. great. But RT is an arm of the Kremlin. How about this...

    here's a nice little article about Putin and how he took down the owner of Yukos, as I mentioned above. Think something like this gets published on RT? http://www.vanityfair.com/news/politics/2012/04/vladimir-putin-mikhail-khodorkovsky-russia

    Yes, the Vanity Fair.. the same magazine in which Seymour Hersh wrote for..and exposed My Lai, illegal Cambodian bombings, Abu Gharib, etc. Do you think Vanity Fair gets to exist in Mother Russia? No fucking way.
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