Kaepernick

Thirty Bills Unpaid

F Me In The Brain said:

Do you think Barry Bonds could have helped teams when he was black balled and shunned by the league? 
Of course he could have.  So could Kaepernick, which is what my point has been relative to his playing ability.


I think that lots of people use that word -- the ref was the one who took offense.  Maybe he didn't know that Kaepernick identifies himself as a black man?  I could see if Alex Smith called someone that how people would be offended.

"He was just saying inappropriate language," Houston told the Tribune on Monday night at MetLife Stadium. He said Kaepernick cursed at him, including using the N-word.

Asked if he was insulted, Houston said it's more a "cultural thing." Houston reiterated that he incensed Kaepernick on the play by saying "nice pass" at the end of a Kyle Fuller interception.

I feel that Kaepernick is having a positive impact by doing what he is doing.  People can shit on his head all that they like.  Even if you think he is an idiot and a crap player, look at what his donations can do to help people.  People want to line up to kick this guy in the balls when he is trying to help people.  Who cares if it is a way for him to keep getting attention or whatever else people are taking issue with.  He is helping people.

Okay I guess he's just fantastic then.

I honestly couldn't give two shits what Kap does. I'm impressed with him keeping his promise on the million dollars and he has made a positive impact... but he is not Ghandi.

At this point... some shit team would do well to take a chance on him and hope for a revival of his career. It would be a great story and an opportunity to make the shit team somewhat marketable. If some shit team does take him... I wouldn't be upset. It wouldn't bother me in the slightest.

JimmyV

I don't have strong feelings about Kap one way or the other, but I do think some of his supporters are ignoring a potential employer's responsibility to research and be concerned by potential red flags. Forget that it's the NFL for a minute. QB is a face-of-the-organization position. Not just in the workplace (on the field) but in the community, in front of the press, etc. Every job applicant knows his/her background is going to be checked out and their references will be called. For Kap those  reports come back saying "He was good for us early on, but we did see diminished production over time. Oh, also, he started each workday with a political protest." How many businesses are going to hire that guy?

F Me In The Brain

Dyer, that is fantastic.

F Me In The Brain

He is more like Ghandi than you or I.

Thirty Bills Unpaid

oftenreading said:

Good posts, F Me and Dyer.

Seems like one or two people keep throwing out the Kaepernick used the n word at times. It bears remembering that, within the black community, it's a word that's often used, having been reclaimed and repurposed. Its use there is totally different than if a white player had used it.

So it's actually a cool term that has reinvented itself? Interesting.

In the context you defend... a QB throws a pick and as he unceremoniously heads to the sideline- angered and embarrassed- he calls someone a n**ger that is taunting him. I'm assuming in that context... that he meant the term in a somewhat hostile manner, but you're saying it was tossed out there as a cultural thing and is excusable?

Good posts because you agree with them? Those other posts you disagree with are shitty, eh?

F Me In The Brain

JimmyV said:

I don't have strong feelings about Kap one way or the other, but I do think some of his supporters are ignoring a potential employer's responsibility to research and be concerned by potential red flags. Forget that it's the NFL for a minute. QB is a face-of-the-organization position. Not just in the workplace (on the field) but in the community, in front of the press, etc. Every job applicant knows his/her background is going to be checked out and their references will be called. For Kap those  reports come back saying "He was good for us early on, but we did see diminished production over time. Oh, also, he started each workday with a political protest." How many businesses are going to hire that guy?

Yeah, I certainly understand your point.
My argument is against those who say he is not good enough to play, or that what he is doing is in some way bad.

HughFreakingDillon

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

oftenreading said:

Good posts, F Me and Dyer.

Seems like one or two people keep throwing out the Kaepernick used the n word at times. It bears remembering that, within the black community, it's a word that's often used, having been reclaimed and repurposed. Its use there is totally different than if a white player had used it.

So it's actually a cool term that has reinvented itself? Interesting.

In the context you defend... a QB throws a pick and as he unceremoniously heads to the sideline- angered and embarrassed- he calls someone a n**ger that is taunting him. I'm assuming in that context... that he meant the term in a somewhat hostile manner, but you're saying it was tossed out there as a cultural thing and is excusable?

Good posts because you agree with them? Those other posts you disagree with are shitty, eh?

it is a gross term, to be sure, but it is seemingly somewhat acceptable within the confines of their own culture. it's hard to find an equitable example outside of the black community, but to me it's like me calling another white person an asshole. 

oftenreading

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

oftenreading said:

Good posts, F Me and Dyer.

Seems like one or two people keep throwing out the Kaepernick used the n word at times. It bears remembering that, within the black community, it's a word that's often used, having been reclaimed and repurposed. Its use there is totally different than if a white player had used it.

So it's actually a cool term that has reinvented itself? Interesting.

In the context you defend... a QB throws a pick and as he unceremoniously heads to the sideline- angered and embarrassed- he calls someone a n**ger that is taunting him. I'm assuming in that context... that he meant the term in a somewhat hostile manner, but you're saying it was tossed out there as a cultural thing and is excusable?

Good posts because you agree with them? Those other posts you disagree with are shitty, eh?

First - if you care to, look up the use of the n word in the black community. There's quite a lot written about it. 

Second - I am never going to comment on every post, whether I agree or disagree, and which ones I chose to comment on is not your concern. 

Third - I don't understand this push to say that because Kaepernick's not perfect, he's a worthless idiot. Why can't he just be an imperfect human being like the rest of us, trying to do a good thing?

Thirty Bills Unpaid

There has been talk of how Kap is better than Hoyet from Americans at their keyboards (to use the phrase trotted out recently). Are the keyboard warriors sure?

Kap had a defence that was unreal and he threw to guys like Crabtree and Davis- very strong assets to have as a QB. Not to mention they had a very undervalued coach.

Hoyer's supporting cast is hardly the same. He's had big games in the past. It is ironic that the armchair coach can definitively anoint Kap the better of the two and scoff at suggestions otherwise.

I'm not saying Hoyer is great by any stretch, but I'm not going to concede he's worse than Kap. I'm not part of the professional organization that is responsible for running the team's operations (or Ghandi).

brianlux

Here's an interesting discussion of the use of the "n" word--  the music is cool but kind of gets in the way- still worth checking out-- good stuff here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8AapoCaZWIs

pjhawks

HesCalledDyer said:

The below is from a series of posts on Twitter which I copied, pasted, and edited for format only.  All words are from the original poster, Charles Clymer, and remain unchanged other than to edit symbols and abbreviations (e.g. &, +, w/) into proper vocabulary (e.g. and, with).  Charles Clymer is a Georgetown University alumnus and a United States Army Veteran:

Over the past few days, I have seen grumblings from white men online that they plan to boycott the NFL over black players protesting.  I am a white male, a lifelong NFL fan, and a military veteran, and I have a few things to say. 

I served this country specifically in defense of the rights enumerated in our Constitution.  I served so that Americans like Kaepernick could take a knee during the National Anthem in protest of white supremacy and police brutality.  I served because patriotism takes many forms, and the highest forms of patriotism are exercising the right to criticize America so that we might improve and giving one's life so that others might exercise that right.  Neither of these forms of patriotism are higher than the other, and they are inextricable.  We cannot separate the courage required to speak truth to the bruises in our souls with the courage it takes to die for that speech.  We cannot separate the moral voice Lincoln called our "better angels" with the sacrifice he anointed the "last full measure of devotion".  I am told a boycott of the NFL is due to Kaepernick and other black players "bringing politics" into a space meant to be nonpolitical.  And I am here to tell you, as a lifelong football fan, that the NFL is the most political institution in the country.  Moreso than Congress. Moreso than the White House. Moreso than any memorialized block of marble in all the land.

The NFL is nothing if not political. It is the greatest prism through which we define the American identity.  And that is precisely because we have made the NFL the most common and explicit touchstone of the American experience.  The NFL is the highest-earning, most-watched sport in the country, and it is also the most decorated in patriotic pageantry.  And these two things, good or bad, working in tandem give greater access to the American value system than anything else in our society.  Those watching an NFL game are confronted with the truth that there are women and men in uniform who serve, and often die, for our freedoms. There's the National Anthem, the color guard, the jet flyovers, the solemn tributes to the troops, the commercials, and a million other little snippets of insistence that we are able to watch grown men play with a ball on a field - because of those women and men in uniform who sacrifice for our freedoms - that are clearly spelled out in the Constitution.  And the most important of those freedoms is speaking truth to power.  If that is not political, if that is not the essence of defining how power is given and granted, then nothing is political.  Professional football revolves around a core pageantry of celebrating freedom and the power required to maintain that freedom.

So many White Americans are unsettled by Kaepernick's protest due to the realization that patriotism is not something we exclusively own.  We, as White Americans, are so accustomed to seeing patriotism made in our own image, bereft of all struggles of people of color, that it is jarring to see a Black American exercise their free speech to protest injustices we can scarcely comprehend.  It's as though White Americans wash, wax, and rev up a nice car for the sake of celebrating having the car but never need to drive it and are shocked when Black Americans use that car to drive down a muddy road, the very purpose for which that car was created.  We are shocked to find problems a wash and wax cannot address, problems we'd sooner never acknowledge, lest we be required to solve them.

I did not serve my country so that grown adults could engage in lofty, empty theatrics for values they supposedly hold dear only to stage an outcry when someone dares to ask if we really care about those values.  I did not serve my country so that other White Americans could use that service to silence Black Americans.  And - this is important - I did not serve my country so that only military veterans could lay claim to the mantle of patriotism.

You can disagree with Kaepernick's reasons for protesting (although I believe you'd be wrong) but you cannot exploit my service, or that of any military veteran, to shame Kaepernick and other black citizens into silence.  And let me be absolutely clear: if this is your reason to boycott the NFL - not domestic violence, not rape, not traumatic brain injuries, not unfair labor practices - but seeing a black player respectfully kneel in protest of racism, I would have to question not only your understanding of our Constitutional freedoms but the very core of your humanity, that part shaped by empathy and compassion.  If that core in your soul is missing, there are far bigger problems to address than what's on Sunday afternoon television.  I wish you way more than a flag and an anthem in finding it.

so it's ok for Kaepernick and Bennett to protest...but not ok for people who disagree to protest against their stance?  got it.

F Me In The Brain

You didn't say the NFL should be background watched while hosting an Oscars party, so I can understand your NFL talent evaluation opinion, even if I disagree with it. 

I watched Kaepernick play QB with that pile of garbage Niners team last season...and Hoyer play 2 games with a better team (albeit still shitty) this season.  My personal evaluation stands, and firmly. 

I like being an American at my keyboard...no insult there.  I admitted to not being an NFL Scout.    I happily say the same things to people when I meet them that I say here.  This is the only 'board' I participate in and I do not have a Twitter, Facebook, Snapchat, nor Instagram account.  My posts are in no way meant to be arbitrary posts to stir any proverbial pot about topics that I do not care about.  I like the idea of being called a warrior but feel I am not worthy. 

I'm happy to have had this discourse this morning for 2 reasons...
Suck Blue is a term I shall use now, it makes me laugh.
&
Kaepernick is actually doing his best to live like Ghandi.

pjhawks

F Me In The Brain said:

He is more like Ghandi than you or I.

this might be the funniest thing i've read on the internet in at least a week. just...wow.

Thirty Bills Unpaid

F Me In The Brain said:

You didn't say the NFL should be background watched while hosting an Oscars party, so I can understand your NFL talent evaluation opinion, even if I disagree with it. 

I watched Kaepernick play QB with that pile of garbage Niners team last season...and Hoyer play 2 games with a better team (albeit still shitty) this season.  My personal evaluation stands, and firmly. 

I like being an American at my keyboard...no insult there.  I admitted to not being an NFL Scout.    I happily say the same things to people when I meet them that I say here.  This is the only 'board' I participate in and I do not have a Twitter, Facebook, Snapchat, nor Instagram account.  My posts are in no way meant to be arbitrary posts to stir any proverbial pot about topics that I do not care about.  I like the idea of being called a warrior but feel I am not worthy. 

I'm happy to have had this discourse this morning for 2 reasons...
Suck Blue is a term I shall use now, it makes me laugh.
&
Kaepernick is actually doing his best to live like Ghandi.

I have no issue with anything you said... or likely will say in the future.

I have to admit that I thought you were saying 'suck poo' which I thought was rather gentle. Then... I thought about it a bit more. You needed to rhyme both words. Lol.

Gawddamn Kap and Ghandi making me look so pedestrian.

F Me In The Brain

pjhawks said:

F Me In The Brain said:

He is more like Ghandi than you or I.

this might be the funniest thing i've read on the internet in at least a week. just...wow.

Glad to have made you laugh!
Personally, I read a story about a guy getting his head stuck up a woman's vagina this week.  (First time since 2007, I think, was what the article shared.)  That beats Kaepernick talk for me.

F Me In The Brain

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

F Me In The Brain said:

You didn't say the NFL should be background watched while hosting an Oscars party, so I can understand your NFL talent evaluation opinion, even if I disagree with it. 

I watched Kaepernick play QB with that pile of garbage Niners team last season...and Hoyer play 2 games with a better team (albeit still shitty) this season.  My personal evaluation stands, and firmly. 

I like being an American at my keyboard...no insult there.  I admitted to not being an NFL Scout.    I happily say the same things to people when I meet them that I say here.  This is the only 'board' I participate in and I do not have a Twitter, Facebook, Snapchat, nor Instagram account.  My posts are in no way meant to be arbitrary posts to stir any proverbial pot about topics that I do not care about.  I like the idea of being called a warrior but feel I am not worthy. 

I'm happy to have had this discourse this morning for 2 reasons...
Suck Blue is a term I shall use now, it makes me laugh.
&
Kaepernick is actually doing his best to live like Ghandi.

I have no issue with anything you said... or likely will say in the future.

I have to admit that I thought you were saying 'suck poo' which I thought was rather gentle. Then... I thought about it a bit more. You needed to rhyme both words. Lol.

Gawddamn Kap and Ghandi making me look so pedestrian.

Ha!  Intimating I would should support during a Trump rally deserved a good response.  (And I am a Republican!  Would rather have had Birdie Sanders or Pothead Johnson in the White House.)

Go Beavers

pjhawks said:

HesCalledDyer said:

The below is from a series of posts on Twitter which I copied, pasted, and edited for format only.  All words are from the original poster, Charles Clymer, and remain unchanged other than to edit symbols and abbreviations (e.g. &, +, w/) into proper vocabulary (e.g. and, with).  Charles Clymer is a Georgetown University alumnus and a United States Army Veteran:

Over the past few days, I have seen grumblings from white men online that they plan to boycott the NFL over black players protesting.  I am a white male, a lifelong NFL fan, and a military veteran, and I have a few things to say. 

I served this country specifically in defense of the rights enumerated in our Constitution.  I served so that Americans like Kaepernick could take a knee during the National Anthem in protest of white supremacy and police brutality.  I served because patriotism takes many forms, and the highest forms of patriotism are exercising the right to criticize America so that we might improve and giving one's life so that others might exercise that right.  Neither of these forms of patriotism are higher than the other, and they are inextricable.  We cannot separate the courage required to speak truth to the bruises in our souls with the courage it takes to die for that speech.  We cannot separate the moral voice Lincoln called our "better angels" with the sacrifice he anointed the "last full measure of devotion".  I am told a boycott of the NFL is due to Kaepernick and other black players "bringing politics" into a space meant to be nonpolitical.  And I am here to tell you, as a lifelong football fan, that the NFL is the most political institution in the country.  Moreso than Congress. Moreso than the White House. Moreso than any memorialized block of marble in all the land.

The NFL is nothing if not political. It is the greatest prism through which we define the American identity.  And that is precisely because we have made the NFL the most common and explicit touchstone of the American experience.  The NFL is the highest-earning, most-watched sport in the country, and it is also the most decorated in patriotic pageantry.  And these two things, good or bad, working in tandem give greater access to the American value system than anything else in our society.  Those watching an NFL game are confronted with the truth that there are women and men in uniform who serve, and often die, for our freedoms. There's the National Anthem, the color guard, the jet flyovers, the solemn tributes to the troops, the commercials, and a million other little snippets of insistence that we are able to watch grown men play with a ball on a field - because of those women and men in uniform who sacrifice for our freedoms - that are clearly spelled out in the Constitution.  And the most important of those freedoms is speaking truth to power.  If that is not political, if that is not the essence of defining how power is given and granted, then nothing is political.  Professional football revolves around a core pageantry of celebrating freedom and the power required to maintain that freedom.

So many White Americans are unsettled by Kaepernick's protest due to the realization that patriotism is not something we exclusively own.  We, as White Americans, are so accustomed to seeing patriotism made in our own image, bereft of all struggles of people of color, that it is jarring to see a Black American exercise their free speech to protest injustices we can scarcely comprehend.  It's as though White Americans wash, wax, and rev up a nice car for the sake of celebrating having the car but never need to drive it and are shocked when Black Americans use that car to drive down a muddy road, the very purpose for which that car was created.  We are shocked to find problems a wash and wax cannot address, problems we'd sooner never acknowledge, lest we be required to solve them.

I did not serve my country so that grown adults could engage in lofty, empty theatrics for values they supposedly hold dear only to stage an outcry when someone dares to ask if we really care about those values.  I did not serve my country so that other White Americans could use that service to silence Black Americans.  And - this is important - I did not serve my country so that only military veterans could lay claim to the mantle of patriotism.

You can disagree with Kaepernick's reasons for protesting (although I believe you'd be wrong) but you cannot exploit my service, or that of any military veteran, to shame Kaepernick and other black citizens into silence.  And let me be absolutely clear: if this is your reason to boycott the NFL - not domestic violence, not rape, not traumatic brain injuries, not unfair labor practices - but seeing a black player respectfully kneel in protest of racism, I would have to question not only your understanding of our Constitutional freedoms but the very core of your humanity, that part shaped by empathy and compassion.  If that core in your soul is missing, there are far bigger problems to address than what's on Sunday afternoon television.  I wish you way more than a flag and an anthem in finding it.

so it's ok for Kaepernick and Bennett to protest...but not ok for people who disagree to protest against their stance?  got it.

I don't think he's saying it's not okay, he's saying don't exploit his service as some facade to shut down the message of Kap's protest. 

Go Beavers

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

oftenreading said:

Good posts, F Me and Dyer.

Seems like one or two people keep throwing out the Kaepernick used the n word at times. It bears remembering that, within the black community, it's a word that's often used, having been reclaimed and repurposed. Its use there is totally different than if a white player had used it.

So it's actually a cool term that has reinvented itself? Interesting.

In the context you defend... a QB throws a pick and as he unceremoniously heads to the sideline- angered and embarrassed- he calls someone a n**ger that is taunting him. I'm assuming in that context... that he meant the term in a somewhat hostile manner, but you're saying it was tossed out there as a cultural thing and is excusable?

Good posts because you agree with them? Those other posts you disagree with are shitty, eh?

It's something whites have grapsed on to in an attempt to try and discount his statement. 

Smellyman

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

F Me In The Brain said:

Do you think Barry Bonds could have helped teams when he was black balled and shunned by the league? 
Of course he could have.  So could Kaepernick, which is what my point has been relative to his playing ability.


I think that lots of people use that word -- the ref was the one who took offense.  Maybe he didn't know that Kaepernick identifies himself as a black man?  I could see if Alex Smith called someone that how people would be offended.

"He was just saying inappropriate language," Houston told the Tribune on Monday night at MetLife Stadium. He said Kaepernick cursed at him, including using the N-word.

Asked if he was insulted, Houston said it's more a "cultural thing." Houston reiterated that he incensed Kaepernick on the play by saying "nice pass" at the end of a Kyle Fuller interception.

I feel that Kaepernick is having a positive impact by doing what he is doing.  People can shit on his head all that they like.  Even if you think he is an idiot and a crap player, look at what his donations can do to help people.  People want to line up to kick this guy in the balls when he is trying to help people.  Who cares if it is a way for him to keep getting attention or whatever else people are taking issue with.  He is helping people.

Okay I guess he's just fantastic then.

I honestly couldn't give two shits what Kap does. I'm impressed with him keeping his promise on the million dollars and he has made a positive impact... but he is not Ghandi.

At this point... some shit team would do well to take a chance on him and hope for a revival of his career. It would be a great story and an opportunity to make the shit team somewhat marketable. If some shit team does take him... I wouldn't be upset. It wouldn't bother me in the slightest.

For not caring, you sure live in this thread

pjhawks

Go Beavers said:

pjhawks said:

HesCalledDyer said:

The below is from a series of posts on Twitter which I copied, pasted, and edited for format only.  All words are from the original poster, Charles Clymer, and remain unchanged other than to edit symbols and abbreviations (e.g. &, +, w/) into proper vocabulary (e.g. and, with).  Charles Clymer is a Georgetown University alumnus and a United States Army Veteran:

Over the past few days, I have seen grumblings from white men online that they plan to boycott the NFL over black players protesting.  I am a white male, a lifelong NFL fan, and a military veteran, and I have a few things to say. 

I served this country specifically in defense of the rights enumerated in our Constitution.  I served so that Americans like Kaepernick could take a knee during the National Anthem in protest of white supremacy and police brutality.  I served because patriotism takes many forms, and the highest forms of patriotism are exercising the right to criticize America so that we might improve and giving one's life so that others might exercise that right.  Neither of these forms of patriotism are higher than the other, and they are inextricable.  We cannot separate the courage required to speak truth to the bruises in our souls with the courage it takes to die for that speech.  We cannot separate the moral voice Lincoln called our "better angels" with the sacrifice he anointed the "last full measure of devotion".  I am told a boycott of the NFL is due to Kaepernick and other black players "bringing politics" into a space meant to be nonpolitical.  And I am here to tell you, as a lifelong football fan, that the NFL is the most political institution in the country.  Moreso than Congress. Moreso than the White House. Moreso than any memorialized block of marble in all the land.

The NFL is nothing if not political. It is the greatest prism through which we define the American identity.  And that is precisely because we have made the NFL the most common and explicit touchstone of the American experience.  The NFL is the highest-earning, most-watched sport in the country, and it is also the most decorated in patriotic pageantry.  And these two things, good or bad, working in tandem give greater access to the American value system than anything else in our society.  Those watching an NFL game are confronted with the truth that there are women and men in uniform who serve, and often die, for our freedoms. There's the National Anthem, the color guard, the jet flyovers, the solemn tributes to the troops, the commercials, and a million other little snippets of insistence that we are able to watch grown men play with a ball on a field - because of those women and men in uniform who sacrifice for our freedoms - that are clearly spelled out in the Constitution.  And the most important of those freedoms is speaking truth to power.  If that is not political, if that is not the essence of defining how power is given and granted, then nothing is political.  Professional football revolves around a core pageantry of celebrating freedom and the power required to maintain that freedom.

So many White Americans are unsettled by Kaepernick's protest due to the realization that patriotism is not something we exclusively own.  We, as White Americans, are so accustomed to seeing patriotism made in our own image, bereft of all struggles of people of color, that it is jarring to see a Black American exercise their free speech to protest injustices we can scarcely comprehend.  It's as though White Americans wash, wax, and rev up a nice car for the sake of celebrating having the car but never need to drive it and are shocked when Black Americans use that car to drive down a muddy road, the very purpose for which that car was created.  We are shocked to find problems a wash and wax cannot address, problems we'd sooner never acknowledge, lest we be required to solve them.

I did not serve my country so that grown adults could engage in lofty, empty theatrics for values they supposedly hold dear only to stage an outcry when someone dares to ask if we really care about those values.  I did not serve my country so that other White Americans could use that service to silence Black Americans.  And - this is important - I did not serve my country so that only military veterans could lay claim to the mantle of patriotism.

You can disagree with Kaepernick's reasons for protesting (although I believe you'd be wrong) but you cannot exploit my service, or that of any military veteran, to shame Kaepernick and other black citizens into silence.  And let me be absolutely clear: if this is your reason to boycott the NFL - not domestic violence, not rape, not traumatic brain injuries, not unfair labor practices - but seeing a black player respectfully kneel in protest of racism, I would have to question not only your understanding of our Constitutional freedoms but the very core of your humanity, that part shaped by empathy and compassion.  If that core in your soul is missing, there are far bigger problems to address than what's on Sunday afternoon television.  I wish you way more than a flag and an anthem in finding it.

so it's ok for Kaepernick and Bennett to protest...but not ok for people who disagree to protest against their stance?  got it.

I don't think he's saying it's not okay, he's saying don't exploit his service as some facade to shut down the message of Kap's protest. 

i haven't seen people shutting down Kaep's message as much as they don't like the forum he has chosen to present said message.