Night 2 was perfect BUT....

halv

---

High Fidelity 2000

PJ_Soul said:

CP218430 said:

I've been listening to a lot of 03 and 06 shows and those were just scathing indictments on politics - they've actually dialed it down a bunch and I think for fans that are on the other side of the aisle. The fact that they have't played Trumpleaguer, Glorified G, Rival, Evacuation, Gimme Some Truth and railed before each song shows great restraint. Truly, look back and those shows from 03 and 06 are political rallies - now they do it Springsteen style and keep it zipped for the most part.

I actually consider it a display of weakness on Eddie's part rather than something admirable, but obviously that is reliant on our personal feelings about politics in music. But I think my perspective is pretty valid, because Eddie himself set me up to expect him to not just back off like he's doing. I personally think a non-political Eddie Vedder is less interesting than the old Ed (not that I'm no longer a big huge fan. I am. But still... I feel like something's been lost).

I would like to see a return to more politics. Bring on the anti-Trump rants at Wrigley!

halv

PJ_Soul said:

CP218430 said:

I've been listening to a lot of 03 and 06 shows and those were just scathing indictments on politics - they've actually dialed it down a bunch and I think for fans that are on the other side of the aisle. The fact that they have't played Trumpleaguer, Glorified G, Rival, Evacuation, Gimme Some Truth and railed before each song shows great restraint. Truly, look back and those shows from 03 and 06 are political rallies - now they do it Springsteen style and keep it zipped for the most part.

I actually consider it a display of weakness on Eddie's part rather than something admirable, but obviously that is reliant on our personal feelings about politics in music. But I think my perspective is pretty valid, because Eddie himself set me up to expect him to not just back off like he's doing. I personally think a non-political Eddie Vedder is less interesting than the old Ed (not that I'm no longer a big huge fan. I am. But still... I feel like something's been lost).

^^ I second this emotion^^

JH6056

PJ_Soul said:

CP218430 said:

I've been listening to a lot of 03 and 06 shows and those were just scathing indictments on politics - they've actually dialed it down a bunch and I think for fans that are on the other side of the aisle. The fact that they have't played Trumpleaguer, Glorified G, Rival, Evacuation, Gimme Some Truth and railed before each song shows great restraint. Truly, look back and those shows from 03 and 06 are political rallies - now they do it Springsteen style and keep it zipped for the most part.

I actually consider it a display of weakness on Eddie's part rather than something admirable, but obviously that is reliant on our personal feelings about politics in music. But I think my perspective is pretty valid, because Eddie himself set me up to expect him to not just back off like he's doing. I personally think a non-political Eddie Vedder is less interesting than the old Ed (not that I'm no longer a big huge fan. I am. But still... I feel like something's been lost).

Maybe you should read his full statement or watch video of when he apologized - I thought his larger message was much more politically important and useful than an all-out biting attack on Trump. Read/watch it then see if you feel the same...maybe you will, but I think his larger message is exactly what progressives missed and how Trump got this far.

aspoonfulweighsaton

The world is a better place with a less political Eddie Vedder. And it's not that I don't mostly agree with him or anything, it's just a tired routine. Again, I'm sure he's going to be back to his old ways before long, but I'm going to enjoy these shows way more because they did what they do best without the nonsense.

teskeinc

I think it is tough to rail on Trump when Clinton is the other option. 2/3 of the country despises both. A lot of the stuff he said in the past can easily be described about Clinton as well. Obviously, Trump is a disaster. Its really a "no win" this election cycle. Hillary has already won anyway, was decided in the back rooms years ago. Everything you are seeing now is basically a dog and pony show.

JH6056

teskeinc said:

I think it is tough to rail on Trump when Clinton is the other option. 2/3 of the country despises both. A lot of the stuff he said in the past can easily be described about Clinton as well. Obviously, Trump is a disaster. Its really a "no win" this election cycle. Hillary has already won anyway, was decided in the back rooms years ago. Everything you are seeing now is basically a dog and pony show.

Pretty sure that Trump getting to point of being the GOP candidate proves that back room deals can still be turned Topsy turvy. Because no one in GOP denies they never thought he'd get this far.

slightofjeff

I've never been offended by Ed's political rants, as some call them. But I'm not like, disappointed, when I go to a rock show and the singer doesn't proselytize about politics. If he wants to, fine, but it's not the primary purpose of why I'm there. I don't miss it if it's not there. That's just weird.

pjalive21

JH6056 said:

PJ_Soul said:

CP218430 said:

I've been listening to a lot of 03 and 06 shows and those were just scathing indictments on politics - they've actually dialed it down a bunch and I think for fans that are on the other side of the aisle. The fact that they have't played Trumpleaguer, Glorified G, Rival, Evacuation, Gimme Some Truth and railed before each song shows great restraint. Truly, look back and those shows from 03 and 06 are political rallies - now they do it Springsteen style and keep it zipped for the most part.

I actually consider it a display of weakness on Eddie's part rather than something admirable, but obviously that is reliant on our personal feelings about politics in music. But I think my perspective is pretty valid, because Eddie himself set me up to expect him to not just back off like he's doing. I personally think a non-political Eddie Vedder is less interesting than the old Ed (not that I'm no longer a big huge fan. I am. But still... I feel like something's been lost).

Maybe you should read his full statement or watch video of when he apologized - I thought his larger message was much more politically important and useful than an all-out biting attack on Trump. Read/watch it then see if you feel the same...maybe you will, but I think his larger message is exactly what progressives missed and how Trump got this far.

you nailed it....I like the messages that he is spreading now about all of us coming together and respecting one another...this is a more grounded Vedder than I have ever seen him..I think we get enough attack dog tactics from politicians like Trump and others

PJ_Soul

pjalive21 said:

PJ_Soul said:

CP218430 said:

I've been listening to a lot of 03 and 06 shows and those were just scathing indictments on politics - they've actually dialed it down a bunch and I think for fans that are on the other side of the aisle. The fact that they have't played Trumpleaguer, Glorified G, Rival, Evacuation, Gimme Some Truth and railed before each song shows great restraint. Truly, look back and those shows from 03 and 06 are political rallies - now they do it Springsteen style and keep it zipped for the most part.

I actually consider it a display of weakness on Eddie's part rather than something admirable, but obviously that is reliant on our personal feelings about politics in music. But I think my perspective is pretty valid, because Eddie himself set me up to expect him to not just back off like he's doing. I personally think a non-political Eddie Vedder is less interesting than the old Ed (not that I'm no longer a big huge fan. I am. But still... I feel like something's been lost).

I respectfully disagree with you here .I honestly got tired of all the political rants during previous tours, whether I agreed or not I myself want to get away from all that BS when I go to a show, as im in touch with politics and current events on a daily basis and when I got to a rock show for me that's an escape from the norm. I know they are political and he can say what he wants and I respect that, but I think even Ed got the sense that it went a little overboard at times. I like how he does it now, its more subtle, direct, and he moves along rather than going on a tangent. I think when he did go on that rants it killed some of the momentum of the shows, but that's just my observation. Most Pearl Jam fans believe whatever he does, so its preaching to the choir at times. I think he is trying to make changes in a different way now and as he gets older you cant sound so bitter, but try and create change in different ways.

Yeah, I'm aware that some don't like it. But I do. I like that kind of passion, even if it's controversial, and for me it makes a show memorable rather than ruining any momentum. If he is trying to makes changes politically in a different way now, I don't think I'm seeing it.... unless you mean playing at an Obama fundraiser. To me he is coming off more as apathetic, not as someone who has just refocused his efforts. Remember the uproar he caused and then how he released that single of Imagine and that letter to confront the press about his anti-war rant? That actually really seemed to excite a lot of fans. It kind of created an energy that we hadn't seen in a long time IMO. and it inspired a LOT of conversation on the topic. So I do think there is still a hunger for shit like that (with some), and a useful purpose for it. I guess he decided he didn't like the spotlight it shone on him though. Too bad, because his ability to get in the spotlight and make some important points was a positive I thought, and, up until recently, he thought so too.
He doesn't even advocate for women anymore. Not sure why he dropped that. He was so into it in the 90s. We could really use more voices like that now. Male feminists are the ones who could really change things, but not enough of them are stepping up.

PJ_Soul

JH6056 said:

PJ_Soul said:

CP218430 said:

I've been listening to a lot of 03 and 06 shows and those were just scathing indictments on politics - they've actually dialed it down a bunch and I think for fans that are on the other side of the aisle. The fact that they have't played Trumpleaguer, Glorified G, Rival, Evacuation, Gimme Some Truth and railed before each song shows great restraint. Truly, look back and those shows from 03 and 06 are political rallies - now they do it Springsteen style and keep it zipped for the most part.

I actually consider it a display of weakness on Eddie's part rather than something admirable, but obviously that is reliant on our personal feelings about politics in music. But I think my perspective is pretty valid, because Eddie himself set me up to expect him to not just back off like he's doing. I personally think a non-political Eddie Vedder is less interesting than the old Ed (not that I'm no longer a big huge fan. I am. But still... I feel like something's been lost).

Maybe you should read his full statement or watch video of when he apologized - I thought his larger message was much more politically important and useful than an all-out biting attack on Trump. Read/watch it then see if you feel the same...maybe you will, but I think his larger message is exactly what progressives missed and how Trump got this far.

I did watch the video the night he said it.

PJ_Soul

slightofjeff said:

I've never been offended by Ed's political rants, as some call them. But I'm not like, disappointed, when I go to a rock show and the singer doesn't proselytize about politics. If he wants to, fine, but it's not the primary purpose of why I'm there. I don't miss it if it's not there. That's just weird.

It's not the reason I'm there either, but I miss his voice in politics for sure. I wouldn't feel any different no matter who we were talking about. A appreciate strong voices of protest a lot, and Eddie not doing that anymore just means one less voice. It has nothing to do with my specific concert experience. I don't miss it if it's not there at a show I'm at (been to shows where he didn't mention it at all, and that's fine). I miss it in general.

HughFreakingDillon

PJ_Soul said:

lotsalemon said:

He apologized Friday night for something he said about Trump, I thought the mask was a nice touch Sunday. Though I thought he was gonna get the cake to his face haha

I wonder when Eddie got scared of a tiny bit of political controversy?

he didn't apologize for the words he said. he apologized for giving trump any unnecessary publicity or attention. he wanted those two nights to be positive.

JH6056

PJ_Soul said:

JH6056 said:

PJ_Soul said:

CP218430 said:

I've been listening to a lot of 03 and 06 shows and those were just scathing indictments on politics - they've actually dialed it down a bunch and I think for fans that are on the other side of the aisle. The fact that they have't played Trumpleaguer, Glorified G, Rival, Evacuation, Gimme Some Truth and railed before each song shows great restraint. Truly, look back and those shows from 03 and 06 are political rallies - now they do it Springsteen style and keep it zipped for the most part.

I actually consider it a display of weakness on Eddie's part rather than something admirable, but obviously that is reliant on our personal feelings about politics in music. But I think my perspective is pretty valid, because Eddie himself set me up to expect him to not just back off like he's doing. I personally think a non-political Eddie Vedder is less interesting than the old Ed (not that I'm no longer a big huge fan. I am. But still... I feel like something's been lost).

Maybe you should read his full statement or watch video of when he apologized - I thought his larger message was much more politically important and useful than an all-out biting attack on Trump. Read/watch it then see if you feel the same...maybe you will, but I think his larger message is exactly what progressives missed and how Trump got this far.

I did watch the video the night he said it.

So you'd rather he jumped on the "blast Trump" wagon? It's not bothering to focus on understanding the seemingly un-understandable supporters of Trump and only focusing on his obvious flaws that got us into this mess. He's absurdly flawed, but only blasting him does zero to get to his supporters.

But of course you have every right to want him to blast him... some of us think though that what he did say shows far more political astuteness, since blasting Trump didn't stop him from getting the nomination.

PJ_Soul

JH6056 said:

PJ_Soul said:

JH6056 said:

PJ_Soul said:

CP218430 said:

I've been listening to a lot of 03 and 06 shows and those were just scathing indictments on politics - they've actually dialed it down a bunch and I think for fans that are on the other side of the aisle. The fact that they have't played Trumpleaguer, Glorified G, Rival, Evacuation, Gimme Some Truth and railed before each song shows great restraint. Truly, look back and those shows from 03 and 06 are political rallies - now they do it Springsteen style and keep it zipped for the most part.

I actually consider it a display of weakness on Eddie's part rather than something admirable, but obviously that is reliant on our personal feelings about politics in music. But I think my perspective is pretty valid, because Eddie himself set me up to expect him to not just back off like he's doing. I personally think a non-political Eddie Vedder is less interesting than the old Ed (not that I'm no longer a big huge fan. I am. But still... I feel like something's been lost).

Maybe you should read his full statement or watch video of when he apologized - I thought his larger message was much more politically important and useful than an all-out biting attack on Trump. Read/watch it then see if you feel the same...maybe you will, but I think his larger message is exactly what progressives missed and how Trump got this far.

I did watch the video the night he said it.

So you'd rather he jumped on the "blast Trump" wagon? It's not bothering to focus on understanding the seemingly un-understandable supporters of Trump and only focusing on his obvious flaws that got us into this mess. He's absurdly flawed, but only blasting him does zero to get to his supporters.

But of course you have every right to want him to blast him... some of us think though that what he did say shows far more political astuteness, since blasting Trump didn't stop him from getting the nomination.

No, I didn't even say I wanted him to talk about Trump at all, specifically. I am talking more generally.

HughFreakingDillon

PJ_Soul said:

slightofjeff said:

I've never been offended by Ed's political rants, as some call them. But I'm not like, disappointed, when I go to a rock show and the singer doesn't proselytize about politics. If he wants to, fine, but it's not the primary purpose of why I'm there. I don't miss it if it's not there. That's just weird.

It's not the reason I'm there either, but I miss his voice in politics for sure. I wouldn't feel any different no matter who we were talking about. A appreciate strong voices of protest a lot, and Eddie not doing that anymore just means one less voice. It has nothing to do with my specific concert experience. I don't miss it if it's not there at a show I'm at (been to shows where he didn't mention it at all, and that's fine). I miss it in general.

he has seen 8 years of progress and positive change. there's no real reason for him to go on a political rant at shows at this point. he didn't start getting really riled up until after Bush was already in power, not before.

JH6056

PJ_Soul said:

JH6056 said:

PJ_Soul said:

JH6056 said:

PJ_Soul said:

CP218430 said:

I've been listening to a lot of 03 and 06 shows and those were just scathing indictments on politics - they've actually dialed it down a bunch and I think for fans that are on the other side of the aisle. The fact that they have't played Trumpleaguer, Glorified G, Rival, Evacuation, Gimme Some Truth and railed before each song shows great restraint. Truly, look back and those shows from 03 and 06 are political rallies - now they do it Springsteen style and keep it zipped for the most part.

I actually consider it a display of weakness on Eddie's part rather than something admirable, but obviously that is reliant on our personal feelings about politics in music. But I think my perspective is pretty valid, because Eddie himself set me up to expect him to not just back off like he's doing. I personally think a non-political Eddie Vedder is less interesting than the old Ed (not that I'm no longer a big huge fan. I am. But still... I feel like something's been lost).

Maybe you should read his full statement or watch video of when he apologized - I thought his larger message was much more politically important and useful than an all-out biting attack on Trump. Read/watch it then see if you feel the same...maybe you will, but I think his larger message is exactly what progressives missed and how Trump got this far.

I did watch the video the night he said it.

So you'd rather he jumped on the "blast Trump" wagon? It's not bothering to focus on understanding the seemingly un-understandable supporters of Trump and only focusing on his obvious flaws that got us into this mess. He's absurdly flawed, but only blasting him does zero to get to his supporters.

But of course you have every right to want him to blast him... some of us think though that what he did say shows far more political astuteness, since blasting Trump didn't stop him from getting the nomination.

No, I didn't even say I wanted him to talk about Trump at all, specifically. I am talking more generally.

You criticized him for apologizing and said you thought that was weak. You said that knowing the rest of what he ssid. If you weren't looking for him to blast Trump, what did you want instead of his apology? You're calling him non-political, which I completely disagree with, but what are you saying you wanted to hear from him on this issue?

PJ_Soul

HughFreakingDillon said:

PJ_Soul said:

slightofjeff said:

I've never been offended by Ed's political rants, as some call them. But I'm not like, disappointed, when I go to a rock show and the singer doesn't proselytize about politics. If he wants to, fine, but it's not the primary purpose of why I'm there. I don't miss it if it's not there. That's just weird.

It's not the reason I'm there either, but I miss his voice in politics for sure. I wouldn't feel any different no matter who we were talking about. A appreciate strong voices of protest a lot, and Eddie not doing that anymore just means one less voice. It has nothing to do with my specific concert experience. I don't miss it if it's not there at a show I'm at (been to shows where he didn't mention it at all, and that's fine). I miss it in general.

he has seen 8 years of progress and positive change. there's no real reason for him to go on a political rant at shows at this point. he didn't start getting really riled up until after Bush was already in power, not before.

What all the shit going down the LGBT and abortion rights and women's rights, etc etc etc? It's not just all about the POTUS. Politics is about a lot more than elections (as you know). I wish he were more involved and interested like he used to be. The more people who can draw attention to such matters the better. Sure they cancelled their NC show, but that was a passive, symbolic kind of thing, so just not the same (though I did support that).

PJ_Soul

JH6056 said:

PJ_Soul said:

JH6056 said:

PJ_Soul said:

JH6056 said:

PJ_Soul said:

CP218430 said:

I've been listening to a lot of 03 and 06 shows and those were just scathing indictments on politics - they've actually dialed it down a bunch and I think for fans that are on the other side of the aisle. The fact that they have't played Trumpleaguer, Glorified G, Rival, Evacuation, Gimme Some Truth and railed before each song shows great restraint. Truly, look back and those shows from 03 and 06 are political rallies - now they do it Springsteen style and keep it zipped for the most part.

I actually consider it a display of weakness on Eddie's part rather than something admirable, but obviously that is reliant on our personal feelings about politics in music. But I think my perspective is pretty valid, because Eddie himself set me up to expect him to not just back off like he's doing. I personally think a non-political Eddie Vedder is less interesting than the old Ed (not that I'm no longer a big huge fan. I am. But still... I feel like something's been lost).

Maybe you should read his full statement or watch video of when he apologized - I thought his larger message was much more politically important and useful than an all-out biting attack on Trump. Read/watch it then see if you feel the same...maybe you will, but I think his larger message is exactly what progressives missed and how Trump got this far.

I did watch the video the night he said it.

So you'd rather he jumped on the "blast Trump" wagon? It's not bothering to focus on understanding the seemingly un-understandable supporters of Trump and only focusing on his obvious flaws that got us into this mess. He's absurdly flawed, but only blasting him does zero to get to his supporters.

But of course you have every right to want him to blast him... some of us think though that what he did say shows far more political astuteness, since blasting Trump didn't stop him from getting the nomination.

No, I didn't even say I wanted him to talk about Trump at all, specifically. I am talking more generally.

You criticized him for apologizing and said you thought that was weak. You said that knowing the rest of what he ssid. If you weren't looking for him to blast Trump, what did you want instead of his apology? You're calling him non-political, which I completely disagree with, but what are you saying you wanted to hear from him on this issue?

I was just thinking of that as an example. Sorry I wasn't more clear. I would really rather hear from him about those other issues I just mentioned. But yes, I don't think anyone should ever apologize for mentioning something like Trump the maniac running for POTUS. Of course I like cooperation and whatnot, but there are limits. I'm not about to be concerned about someone who is mad that someone criticized Trump, lol.

JH6056

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

PJ_Soul said:

slightofjeff said:

I've never been offended by Ed's political rants, as some call them. But I'm not like, disappointed, when I go to a rock show and the singer doesn't proselytize about politics. If he wants to, fine, but it's not the primary purpose of why I'm there. I don't miss it if it's not there. That's just weird.

It's not the reason I'm there either, but I miss his voice in politics for sure. I wouldn't feel any different no matter who we were talking about. A appreciate strong voices of protest a lot, and Eddie not doing that anymore just means one less voice. It has nothing to do with my specific concert experience. I don't miss it if it's not there at a show I'm at (been to shows where he didn't mention it at all, and that's fine). I miss it in general.

he has seen 8 years of progress and positive change. there's no real reason for him to go on a political rant at shows at this point. he didn't start getting really riled up until after Bush was already in power, not before.

What all the shit going down the LGBT and abortion rights and women's rights, etc etc etc? It's not just all about the POTUS. Politics is about a lot more than elections (as you know). I wish he were more involved and interested like he used to me. The more people who can draw attention and call attention to such matters the better. Sure they cancelled their NC show, but that was a passive, symbolic kind of thing, so just not the same.

Every single one of those issues will be more impacted (for better or worse) by the choice of next President and that person's Supreme Court justice picks than any other single political local fight or generalist statement you could make. People who don't understand that mystify me, when just the last 2 years of abortion access/ending access and LGBTQ issues were more affected by court decisions than anything else in the most critical ways. We activists have all 3 yrs between presidential elections to act locally or work on national messages. But presidential election outcomes are major, as well as justice choices and Congressional elections on every issue you mention.

Recent history is glaring proof ofx ghis, again ft or both better and worse.

Lastly, I would be very careful about thinking you know the breadth of what he cares passionately about or the extent of his activism based on what he says during concerts. He's been doing this for 25 yrs... maybe he feels like he's figured out better ways to more effectively use his influence? You're making serious assumptions about his heart and actions based on his stage statements...