All those staying kids can get away in the blink of an eye....I don't agree fully. And the real parenting happens from day 1 so when a 4 year old sees a fence they aren't even thinking about getting through or going over. But then again, most parents are becoming more and more complacent. Instead of parenting they are videoing their kids doing bad/stupid/dangerous stuff. All the whole the kid is creating bad habits.
All those staying kids can get away in the blink of an eye....I don't agree fully. And the real parenting happens from day 1 so when a 4 year old sees a fence they aren't even thinking about getting through or going over. But then again, most parents are becoming more and more complacent. Instead of parenting they are videoing their kids doing bad/stupid/dangerous stuff. All the whole the kid is creating bad habits.
my son was a climber. he'd scale the massive pine tree in our yard and I allowed it. I allowed cause its what I did as a child. there was a chance he could fall sure... but there was also an equal chance he wouldn't. did I keep an eye on him in public? absolutely. and I did so because I knew it would take him a split second to 'escape'. his father however was a little more complacent and once had to pick his son up from the police station cause at less than 2 years of age, he wandered off from his dad and decided to walk home on his own. friendly neighbours called the cops and well you know the rest. when I heard of the incident I asked his father did he move away from the last spot our son had seen him. he hesitated just a little and I knew that's exactly what he'd done. so my son turned around, no longer saw his father and not being a crier/screamer/whiny kid he decided well ill just meet dad at home. he knew how to get home because he was always walking down there with me. things could've ended up differently ie he could've been abducted, hit by a car crossing the street etc.. but he wasn't and my son is now an 18 year old motor mechanic. all it takes is a split second of distraction and your child is 'gone'. it happens. heck I lost track of my eldest in a toy shop once. parenting is difficult at the best of ... add the excitement of a zoo and the distraction of other kids/people and next thing you know little johnny's is sitting in the gorilla moat out of safety's reach. all it takes is seconds... half a second quicker and mom may have seen what the kid was doing and called him back. it sucks the gorilla is dead. it sucks the gorilla is even in captivity. but the bottom line is a child's safety is of primary concern in this situation. apportioning blame doesn't change the outcome. kids are kids, they are inquisitive and fearless little creatures. if they don't see a danger, if its not pointed out to them(and sometimes even if it is) they wont see it. so what im saying is yes kids can get away from you in a split second.. especially when there are people around. you look one way and theyre scooting off in the opposite direction lost in the crowd.
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Looking at those pictures... I can't help but think that is a poor design. Directly after the bushes is the drop to the moat. The fencing prior to the bushes is not exactly child proof. It's not at all what I pictured from written descriptions.
Basically, the kid just had to pop through the fence and he's essentially falling into the moat.
I still think supervision was an issue, but its not as grievously poor as I was led to believe.
Thanks for posting that. I think I said earlier, in 38 years (something like that) no one had ever gotten through or into the gorilla enclosure. So yeah, that design looks pretty bad, but it must have been up to some kind of code. The zoo people aren't morons.
1. Foreseeability is significant when determining negligence. It's hard not to imagine what happened happening at some point in time given the rather 'flimsy' design.
2. That very design would have had my spider senses tingling and I would have been on extra alert. I think this is the case with most parents given that for 38 years... there have been no incidents.
Watched the video again with a colleague and yikes... what a nightmare.
1. Foreseeability is significant when determining negligence. It's hard not to imagine what happened happening at some point in time given the rather 'flimsy' design.
2. That very design would have had my spider senses tingling and I would have been on extra alert. I think this is the case with most parents given that for 38 years... there have been no incidents.
1. How would you design a zoo?
2. Spidy senses are nice to have just like children.
I wouldn't design a zoo. But if I did... no access to animals.
And I know you're just poking at me, but do you think it is wise to have a 12 foot drop into a gorilla compound directly behind a bush hedge protected by three wires? A kid walks through the loose hedge and falls having nothing to place his foot on and unable to see that he doesn't.
^^^ My amoeba sized brain can only see playgrounds at schools etc that are designed for an accident/injury waiting to happen yet no one says anything.
We can't be too careful. Kids need to learn to climb, jump, run, assess risk, etc. Playgrounds offer that as well as an environment to facilitate muscular skeleto growth.
How about all those streets and sidewalks....no barrier to keep kids from getting hit by a car....
I haven't completely absolved mom.
But look at the drop behind the hedge. Step through the hedge and... fall 12 feet? The fence before the hedge isn't really a fence. It indicates 'stay out' to anyone wth a mind, but 3 yr olds don't have minds.
It's the same thing as going to a thrill park and getting on a ride. There is a level of safety expected of the thrill park. The zoo didn't see the potential and likely should have.
All those staying kids can get away in the blink of an eye....I don't agree fully. And the real parenting happens from day 1 so when a 4 year old sees a fence they aren't even thinking about getting through or going over. But then again, most parents are becoming more and more complacent. Instead of parenting they are videoing their kids doing bad/stupid/dangerous stuff. All the whole the kid is creating bad habits.
Really? I will assume you have children. You've never turned your head and when you look back, your child wasn't where he or she was just a second ago?
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All those staying kids can get away in the blink of an eye....I don't agree fully. And the real parenting happens from day 1 so when a 4 year old sees a fence they aren't even thinking about getting through or going over. But then again, most parents are becoming more and more complacent. Instead of parenting they are videoing their kids doing bad/stupid/dangerous stuff. All the whole the kid is creating bad habits.
Really? I will assume you have children. You've never turned your head and when you look back, your child wasn't where he or she was just a second ago?
I'd focus more on the aspect of boundaries with the kids.
Yeah, it definitely wasn't hard for the kid to get in, that's a quick hop and a short scramble through the bushes. Speaking of the hedge, that should be a wild black raspberry hedge. It's thornier than a rose bush, native to the region, incredibly hardy and abundant in the area (free to dig up and transplant), and the kids would have berries to snack on in June. It's a no brainer.
I often wonder why public spaces are filled with non-native (often expensive) ornamentals when edible options would serve the same purpose. Put some freaking blueberries, gooseberries, elderberries, and raspberries in for cripes sake!
^^^ Speaking of, I just walked into a grocery store and there was a small tree in front of it with some lovely pinkish berries that looked exquisitely delicious, so I pinched one and gave it a taste. A little too tart it was, and now the tip of my tongue is numb... Now why in the hell would you plant such a tasty looking fruit in front of the store when eating it is clearly not a good idea? Hello, has no one ever heard of mullberry tree?
What a ridiculous amount of waste and idiocy in this country.
Zoo enclosures are designed to keep animals in and provide maximum visibility for all guests (kids, adults, individuals in wheel-chairs).
The fence and moat we're not to keep people out. The zoo probably thought the big freakin Gorilla was enough to do that.
The kid might not have had designs on jumping into the moat. He may have been planning on stepping through the bushes to see better. Of course, once you step through those bushes, you fall- the ledge is immediate.
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Basically, the kid just had to pop through the fence and he's essentially falling into the moat.
I still think supervision was an issue, but its not as grievously poor as I was led to believe.
1. Foreseeability is significant when determining negligence. It's hard not to imagine what happened happening at some point in time given the rather 'flimsy' design.
2. That very design would have had my spider senses tingling and I would have been on extra alert. I think this is the case with most parents given that for 38 years... there have been no incidents.
Watched the video again with a colleague and yikes... what a nightmare.
But real.
2. Spidy senses are nice to have just like children.
And I know you're just poking at me, but do you think it is wise to have a 12 foot drop into a gorilla compound directly behind a bush hedge protected by three wires? A kid walks through the loose hedge and falls having nothing to place his foot on and unable to see that he doesn't.
My amoeba sized brain can only see playgrounds at schools etc that are designed for an accident/injury waiting to happen yet no one says anything.
It's nuts
Elementary School was perfect - a slide, a swing and nothing else back then.
But look at the drop behind the hedge. Step through the hedge and... fall 12 feet? The fence before the hedge isn't really a fence. It indicates 'stay out' to anyone wth a mind, but 3 yr olds don't have minds.
It's the same thing as going to a thrill park and getting on a ride. There is a level of safety expected of the thrill park. The zoo didn't see the potential and likely should have.
The fence and moat we're not to keep people out. The zoo probably thought the big freakin Gorilla was enough to do that.
we will find a way, we will find our place
Yeah, it definitely wasn't hard for the kid to get in, that's a quick hop and a short scramble through the bushes.
Speaking of the hedge, that should be a wild black raspberry hedge. It's thornier than a rose bush, native to the region, incredibly hardy and abundant in the area (free to dig up and transplant), and the kids would have berries to snack on in June.
It's a no brainer.
I often wonder why public spaces are filled with non-native (often expensive) ornamentals when edible options would serve the same purpose. Put some freaking blueberries, gooseberries, elderberries, and raspberries in for cripes sake!
Now why in the hell would you plant such a tasty looking fruit in front of the store when eating it is clearly not a good idea?
Hello, has no one ever heard of mullberry tree?
What a ridiculous amount of waste and idiocy in this country.