they didnt mail it in. but i agree with everything else. their setlists are more "predictable" than theyve ever been. i felt that way in 2013 with the 4 show run in philly and brooklyn. there were alot of repeats. it was the first time i could ever predict what was coming next.
I'm with you, but wouldn't exactly say they "mailed it in". They peaked in Philly and really left it all out there on the first half of the tour. That is without question. You only have so much energy. It's very easy for the hardcore fan to notice that they took a conservative approach in NYC and played a bunch of songs repetitively. But it's understandable at this point. Still two solid shows and a ton of fun. Driven to Tears with Sting was pretty fucking cool and the floor was shaking at points! A bunch of people along with myself thought they might play something like Parting Ways, Nothing as it Seems, Hold on, Strangest Tribe, You Are, or Dirty Frank cause the shows had the potential to be epic. They didn't. But that's ok though.
Post edited by SmallestOceans on
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Perhaps mail it in is too strong of a term for some of you, which is fine, so I ask that you look beyond that and at the actual content of what I'm saying - that they played a predicable, hit-heavy setlist at a time when more than ever, they should be taking chances and celebrating their huge catalogue, and to me, that's disappointing.
The band plays "hits" they play "rarities" they play "b-sides" every show! They cater to every single fan from the hardest of the hardcore to the most casual fan who used to listen to them in high school and just knows the first three albums. There is literally something for everyone.What more could you want?
2000: Noblesville, IN 2010: Noblesville, IN 2011: PJ20 Night 1 2013: Wrigley Field, Baltimore 2014: St. Louis 2016: Lexington, Fenway I, Wrigley I, Temple of the Dog - NYC 2017: EV solo - Louisville 2018: Wrigley 1 2022: St. Louis 2023: Austin 1 & 2 2024: Vegas 1, Noblesville, IN, Wrigley 2
The band plays "hits" they play "rarities" they play "b-sides" every show! They cater to every single fan from the hardest of the hardcore to the most casual fan who used to listen to them in high school and just knows the first three albums. There is literally something for everyone.What more could you want?
Since you asked...I want to hand them a setlist and have them play it in my backyard! I have a nice backyard and behind it is a retention pond that's always dry, I could easily accommodate 3,000.
Does playing a set with Ten in order take much more effort than 7 Ten songs in a show?
Every show can't be a Pearl Jam nerd's wet dream. Then there would be no more rarities and order of songs is the only important thing (which is what this discussion evolves to over the years). Remember when Leash was the Sasquatch? Now it's mailing it in.
They try to give their audiences of every show something unique to take home with them. I would say they really hit the gas starting the 2010 tour. Due to that, the bar is raised very high. Every show is really good.
Msg 2 won't be considered in the list of 'epic' shows.... but if you were there, you got a few treats, you were at the show that Rick nielson came out for surrender.... and sting for driven to tears. And then a handful of other tunes you dont hear all the time. To me, that's pretty awesome.
With that said... were they feeling time crunches? For both shows it seemed Eddie's banter was minimal ... and solos seemed to be cut shorter
Perhaps mail it in is too strong of a term for some of you, which is fine, so I ask that you look beyond that and at the actual content of what I'm saying - that they played a predicable, hit-heavy setlist at a time when more than ever, they should be taking chances and celebrating their huge catalogue, and to me, that's disappointing.
"Mail it in" = To deliver a performance without commitment or effort, with lackluster results
I never ever said Leash was a bad thing - trust me, I saw it the second time it had been performed since the long hiatus.
The point is, this show catered to a casual fan, and between the lack of difference in setlist, alot of hits, and a very fast show (you're correct, they were flying through it), that's not what you come to expect from a second night at MSG, and I think we can all agree on that.
Perhaps mail it in is too strong of a term for some of you, which is fine, so I ask that you look beyond that and at the actual content of what I'm saying - that they played a predicable, hit-heavy setlist at a time when more than ever, they should be taking chances and celebrating their huge catalogue, and to me, that's disappointing.
"Mail it in" = To deliver a performance without commitment or effort, with lackluster results
As I said - to only play mostly hits, to play 2 of the 3 same songs to open, closing the encore again with Porch, trotting out Last Kiss, ignoring 1995-2010, to me, shows less effort and care in the setlist than what we are accustomed to as fans.
The band plays "hits" they play "rarities" they play "b-sides" every show! They cater to every single fan from the hardest of the hardcore to the most casual fan who used to listen to them in high school and just knows the first three albums. There is literally something for everyone.What more could you want?
Since you asked...I want to hand them a setlist and have them play it in my backyard! I have a nice backyard and behind it is a retention pond that's always dry, I could easily accommodate 3,000.
all GA? will there be a lottery? you have room for the merch truck? : )
Columbia 2008 Atlanta 2012 Wrigley 2013 Charlotte 2013 Seattle 2013 Memphis 2014 Greenville (VS.) 2016 Columbia 2016 New Orleans 2016 Fenway I 2016 Fenway II 2016 Wrigley I 2016 Wrigley II 2016
The choice of songs is a direct correlation to the effort, in my opinion.
No. Effort is playing your heart out. They LIKE playing Even Flow, Given to Fly, Lightening Bolt etc. Get over it.
I bet they mix up the setlist when they get bored. But they don't get as big of a FULL ARENA fan reaction when they do, bc its just 10c area reacting. They get more full arena responses from the hits. And that's what they felt like doing last night.
DC '03 - Reading '04 - Philly '05 - Camden 1 '06 - DC '06 - E. Rutherford '06 - The Vic '07 - Lollapalooza '07 - DC '08 - EV DC 1 & 2 '08 (Met Ed!!) - EV Baltimore 1 & 2 '09 - EV NYC 1 '11 (Met Ed!) - Hartford '13 - GCF '15 - MSG 2 '16 - TOTD MSG '16 - Boston 1 & 2 '18 - SHN '21 - EV NYC 1 & 2 '22 - MSG '22
Does playing a set with Ten in order take much more effort than 7 Ten songs in a show?
Every show can't be a Pearl Jam nerd's wet dream. Then there would be no more rarities and order of songs is the only important thing (which is what this discussion evolves to over the years). Remember when Leash was the Sasquatch? Now it's mailing it in.
They try to give their audiences of every show something unique to take home with them. I would say they really hit the gas starting the 2010 tour. Due to that, the bar is raised very high. Every show is really good.
Msg 2 won't be considered in the list of 'epic' shows.... but if you were there, you got a few treats, you were at the show that Rick nielson came out for surrender.... and sting for driven to tears. And then a handful of other tunes you dont hear all the time. To me, that's pretty awesome.
With that said... were they feeling time crunches? For both shows it seemed Eddie's banter was minimal ... and solos seemed to be cut shorter
I think my point in this is there are a lot of songs that are fan favorites that are not really rarities not gettng played Faithful - 1 Immortality - 1 Insignificance - 0
You get my point. I could care less about Strangest Tribe or Dirty Frank Just want some more of their material from th he middle albums they used to play alot more of
honestly, I bet the band is tired of playing those songs as well, but as passionate as the fab club is, to sell out arenas every night you gotta play to the whole crowd and not just the 10c
Ive seen 25 shows, 7 at msg. Wife has seen 2. We both walked out of there on cloud nine!! If they would mail it in like that every show, id never go away upset. Wife had tears during nothingman, her childhood anthem, you cant make that up. Sweet lou is a rarity cuz its simply terrible, id rather see a song i know and love rather than walking the cow or hey foxymomhandlemama. Rare doesnt always mean good, ask rick harrison!! I think a lot of us are getting a wee bit carried away. This is all done in good humor, but i think "out of my mind" is the rarity for you. Wink emoticon!! Mail that to fenway night 2 baby!! Ill gladly open that up!! Peace, love, dope!!
The choice of songs is a direct correlation to the effort, in my opinion.
No. Effort is playing your heart out. They LIKE playing Even Flow, Given to Fly, Lightening Bolt etc. Get over it.
I bet they mix up the setlist when they get bored. But they don't get as big of a FULL ARENA fan reaction when they do, bc its just 10c area reacting. They get more full arena responses from the hits. And that's what they felt like doing last night.
Well, based on the shows you've seen, I think it's hard to make an argument last night's show held a candle to Philly 05 or East Rutherford 06, for example.
Not going to lie, I agree with the OP. I'm so glad I got these tickets through a friend who has connections. I would have been mad if I payed a hefty price for these tickets. This was my 3rd show this tour and by the end of the night I concluded that the band is really tired right now. Not a bad show, but certainly not their best. Not the end of the world...
Camden 2 (2008) Philly 1 and 4 (2009) Newark (2010) MSG 1 (2010) Toronto 1 and 2 (2011) Brooklyn 1 and 2 (2013) Philly 2 (2013) Greenville (2016) Columbia (2016) MSG 2 (2016) Fenway 2 (2016) EV NJPAC (2022) MSG (2022) Denver (2022)
Not going to lie, I agree with the OP. I'm so glad I got these tickets through a friend who has connections. I would have been mad if I payed a hefty price for these tickets. This was my 3rd show this tour and by the end of the night I concluded that the band is really tired right now. Not a bad show, but certainly not their best. Not the end of the world...
So tired that they go into to the crowd sing and play to make up for their lackluster performance?
Not going to lie, I agree with the OP. I'm so glad I got these tickets through a friend who has connections. I would have been mad if I payed a hefty price for these tickets. This was my 3rd show this tour and by the end of the night I concluded that the band is really tired right now. Not a bad show, but certainly not their best. Not the end of the world...
So tired that they go into to the crowd sing and play to make up for their lackluster performance?
Seeing two shows towards the beginning of the tour (Greenville and Columbia), I can tell you the energy from the band didn't quite match these shows. PJ is still the best and it was a good show, but I can see where people are coming from, especially if they payed a lot for the tickets. Heck, I was even back stage last night, met Stone (who is so nice) and Dennis Rodman, and I'm still being objective here
Camden 2 (2008) Philly 1 and 4 (2009) Newark (2010) MSG 1 (2010) Toronto 1 and 2 (2011) Brooklyn 1 and 2 (2013) Philly 2 (2013) Greenville (2016) Columbia (2016) MSG 2 (2016) Fenway 2 (2016) EV NJPAC (2022) MSG (2022) Denver (2022)
they didnt mail it in. but i agree with everything else. their setlists are more "predictable" than theyve ever been. i felt that way in 2013 with the 4 show run in philly and brooklyn. there were alot of repeats. it was the first time i could ever predict what was coming next.
I know I'm going to get slammed for this, and let me preface this by saying that the band destroyed both nights, but this is just my stupid opinion after going to MSG I and II. I love PJ. We all do. We spend tons of money on tickets, merch, travel etc to see the best band on the planet play. I easily spent $1,500 to see 3 shows this tour.
My opinion is that when PJ plays back to back shows, the repeats should be minimal. I say this with peace and love, peace and love,youtu.be/eAU0l7325w0 because PJ has such an incredible library of music and I want to hear as much as possible.
Off the top of my head, and there may be more or I may be mistaken, but they played Jeremy, DTE, Porch, Evenflow, Once, Alive, Given to fly, Corduroy, Lightning Bolt, MYM and Small Town both nights. It's too much.
I understand the need to please "casual" fans. But in a market like NYC there is more than enough "hardcore" fans to fill MSG for 4 nights, and they shouldn't feel obligated to simply play the crowd pleasing hits.
did a quick calculation - over 2 nights and about 6 hours of music they played a total of 65 songs, 11 which were repeated. so they played 54 (or 83%) unique songs over 2 nights. most bands outside of Springsteen don't play 54 unique songs in a full tour. yea they mailed it in (cue eye roll - drops mic and heads off stage)
10 repeats for the 2 msg shows this year, in 2010 there were 7 repeats between the 2 msg shows but thats a little misleading cuz they were promoting backspacer so they played the fixer, unthought known, just breathe and the end both nights. the only non backspacer songs they played both nights were do the evolution, alive, and amazingly LUKIN.
the non lightning bolt repeats this year were jeremy, do the evolution, porch, even flow, once, alive, given to fly, corduroy, and elderly woman. this msg stand definitely had more of a "greatest hits" feel, theres no denying it,
my ONLY advice to fans who do not appreciate the live performances, would be to stay at home. there has to be some realization that sometimes the band is not going to play everything YOU want to hear at YOUR show. i'm digging the stats from @pjhawks, tough to say with those numbers that the show was mailed in.
There's a huge difference between mailing it in and playing "greatest hits. Playing hits doesn't equate to mailing it and playing lost dogs doesn't equate to best show ever.
did a quick calculation - over 2 nights and about 6 hours of music they played a total of 65 songs, 11 which were repeated. so they played 54 (or 83%) unique songs over 2 nights. most bands outside of Springsteen don't play 54 unique songs in a full tour. yea they mailed it in (cue eye roll - drops mic and heads off stage)
I disagree with the "mailed it in" comment. PJ never "mails it in" and always brings the house down. I think the frustration is, for me at least, is I fucking love PJ so much that I want to hear as much of their music as possible. I want to hear Binaural. And Riot Act. And Avocado. And every other piece of music that they have ever written/covered/played, etc. When 20% of a concert is spent playing songs I literally heard 24 hours ago, I get disappointed for all the songs I love and did not hear.
The reason why most other bands simply play a generic set list is because 75% of their music sucks.
did a quick calculation - over 2 nights and about 6 hours of music they played a total of 65 songs, 11 which were repeated. so they played 54 (or 83%) unique songs over 2 nights. most bands outside of Springsteen don't play 54 unique songs in a full tour. yea they mailed it in (cue eye roll - drops mic and heads off stage)
Respectfully disagree sir. Phish and Widespread Panic go on 4 night runs with not one single repeat. I'm so tired of hearing that argument "no other band". You are just simply wrong my friend! I've seen Phish 45 times in the past 5 years...including most of their MSG shows, and they sure as hell have more than 54% unique songs.
"I want to go...but I don't want to go alone...With you I could never feel alone..."
There's a huge difference between mailing it in and playing "greatest hits. Playing hits doesn't equate to mailing it and playing lost dogs doesn't equate to best show ever.
nobody is saying play lost dogs. theres a bunch of album songs that arent super rare theyve ignored. immortality, faithfull, i am mine, light years, grievance, insignificance, not for you, life wasted, severed hand, amongst the waves, etc.
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Fort Lauderdale 16, Miami 16, Tampa 16, Jacksonville 16, Greenville 16, Hampton 16, Columbia 16, Lexington 16, Philly1 16, Philly2 16, NYC1 16, NYC2 16, Quebec City 16, Ottawa 16, Toronto1 16, Toronto2 16, Fenway1 16, Fenway2 16, Wrigley1 16, Wrigley2 16
2010: Noblesville, IN
2011: PJ20 Night 1
2013: Wrigley Field, Baltimore
2014: St. Louis
2016: Lexington, Fenway I, Wrigley I, Temple of the Dog - NYC
2017: EV solo - Louisville
2018: Wrigley 1
2022: St. Louis
2023: Austin 1 & 2
2024: Vegas 1, Noblesville, IN, Wrigley 2
Every show can't be a Pearl Jam nerd's wet dream. Then there would be no more rarities and order of songs is the only important thing (which is what this discussion evolves to over the years). Remember when Leash was the Sasquatch? Now it's mailing it in.
They try to give their audiences of every show something unique to take home with them. I would say they really hit the gas starting the 2010 tour. Due to that, the bar is raised very high. Every show is really good.
Msg 2 won't be considered in the list of 'epic' shows.... but if you were there, you got a few treats, you were at the show that Rick nielson came out for surrender.... and sting for driven to tears. And then a handful of other tunes you dont hear all the time. To me, that's pretty awesome.
With that said... were they feeling time crunches? For both shows it seemed Eddie's banter was minimal ... and solos seemed to be cut shorter
The point is, this show catered to a casual fan, and between the lack of difference in setlist, alot of hits, and a very fast show (you're correct, they were flying through it), that's not what you come to expect from a second night at MSG, and I think we can all agree on that.
Atlanta 2012
Wrigley 2013
Charlotte 2013
Seattle 2013
Memphis 2014
Greenville (VS.) 2016
Columbia 2016
New Orleans 2016
Fenway I 2016
Fenway II 2016
Wrigley I 2016
Wrigley II 2016
I bet they mix up the setlist when they get bored. But they don't get as big of a FULL ARENA fan reaction when they do, bc its just 10c area reacting. They get more full arena responses from the hits. And that's what they felt like doing last night.
Faithful - 1
Immortality - 1
Insignificance - 0
You get my point. I could care less about Strangest Tribe or Dirty Frank
Just want some more of their material from th he middle albums they used to play alot more of
Charlotte 03
Asheville 04
Atlanta 12
Greenville 16, Columbia 16
Seattle 18
Nashville 22
Philly 1 and 4 (2009)
Newark (2010)
MSG 1 (2010)
Toronto 1 and 2 (2011)
Brooklyn 1 and 2 (2013)
Philly 2 (2013)
Greenville (2016)
Columbia (2016)
MSG 2 (2016)
Fenway 2 (2016)
EV NJPAC (2022)
MSG (2022)
Denver (2022)
Philly 1 and 4 (2009)
Newark (2010)
MSG 1 (2010)
Toronto 1 and 2 (2011)
Brooklyn 1 and 2 (2013)
Philly 2 (2013)
Greenville (2016)
Columbia (2016)
MSG 2 (2016)
Fenway 2 (2016)
EV NJPAC (2022)
MSG (2022)
Denver (2022)
My opinion is that when PJ plays back to back shows, the repeats should be minimal. I say this with peace and love, peace and love,youtu.be/eAU0l7325w0 because PJ has such an incredible library of music and I want to hear as much as possible.
Off the top of my head, and there may be more or I may be mistaken, but they played Jeremy, DTE, Porch, Evenflow, Once, Alive, Given to fly, Corduroy, Lightning Bolt, MYM and Small Town both nights. It's too much.
I understand the need to please "casual" fans. But in a market like NYC there is more than enough "hardcore" fans to fill MSG for 4 nights, and they shouldn't feel obligated to simply play the crowd pleasing hits.
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana
the non lightning bolt repeats this year were jeremy, do the evolution, porch, even flow, once, alive, given to fly, corduroy, and elderly woman. this msg stand definitely had more of a "greatest hits" feel, theres no denying it,
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“I think you won, but I enjoyed the fight” - EV
Playing hits doesn't equate to mailing it and playing lost dogs doesn't equate to best show ever.
The reason why most other bands simply play a generic set list is because 75% of their music sucks.
Randall's Island 96 and haven't stopped since...
nobody is saying play lost dogs. theres a bunch of album songs that arent super rare theyve ignored. immortality, faithfull, i am mine, light years, grievance, insignificance, not for you, life wasted, severed hand, amongst the waves, etc.