Canadian Politics Redux

PJfanwillneverleave1

So where does the list end that it should apply to?

PJ_Soul

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

So where does the list end that it should apply to?

It is up to the doctors.

PJfanwillneverleave1

Ok, so you don't agree with that?

oftenreading

lukin2006 said:

^^^and that as well, so this bill essentially would not help als, Alzheimer's or dementia patients...

Okay, granted I have been too busy to read an update today, but my understanding is that it applies to essentially terminal conditions wherein the individual has the capacity to consent at the time of the request. Therefore, it should apply to ALS, which doesn't affect cognition and which is a fatal condition. The real problems come in with the dementias (which includes Alzheimer's) regarding consent, plus the non-terminal but serious conditions that can cause unrelieved suffering.

hedonist

Curious - does the bill apply if you do a living will requesting that right before or when diagnosed with something that can affect your mind / ability to consent?

I really need to look into California law on this.

polaris_x

oftenreading said:

lukin2006 said:

^^^and that as well, so this bill essentially would not help als, Alzheimer's or dementia patients...

Okay, granted I have been too busy to read an update today, but my understanding is that it applies to essentially terminal conditions wherein the individual has the capacity to consent at the time of the request. Therefore, it should apply to ALS, which doesn't affect cognition and which is a fatal condition. The real problems come in with the dementias (which includes Alzheimer's) regarding consent, plus the non-terminal but serious conditions that can cause unrelieved suffering.

it does not apply to ALS because the person has to be terminally ill with death in the foreseeable future ... it goes against the Carter decision from the Supreme Court ...

so, not only does the bill fail to live up to the Supreme Court decision thus opening it up for another costly legal challenge ... it fails to deliver to the people who need this legislation the most ...

polaris_x

hedonist said:

Curious - does the bill apply if you do a living will requesting that right before or when diagnosed with something that can affect your mind / ability to consent?

I really need to look into California law on this.

it's not so much the consent as the issue right now ... it's who qualifies ... you could consent prior to getting something but still not qualify if your diagnosis does not show that death is in the foreseeable future ...

oftenreading

polaris_x said:

oftenreading said:

lukin2006 said:

^^^and that as well, so this bill essentially would not help als, Alzheimer's or dementia patients...

Okay, granted I have been too busy to read an update today, but my understanding is that it applies to essentially terminal conditions wherein the individual has the capacity to consent at the time of the request. Therefore, it should apply to ALS, which doesn't affect cognition and which is a fatal condition. The real problems come in with the dementias (which includes Alzheimer's) regarding consent, plus the non-terminal but serious conditions that can cause unrelieved suffering.

it does not apply to ALS because the person has to be terminally ill with death in the foreseeable future ... it goes against the Carter decision from the Supreme Court ...

so, not only does the bill fail to live up to the Supreme Court decision thus opening it up for another costly legal challenge ... it fails to deliver to the people who need this legislation the most ...

Do you have a reference to why it doesn't apply to ALS? Because with end stage ALS, death is forseeable.

polaris_x

http://www.dyingwithdignity.ca/email_your_mp_today

oftenreading

polaris_x said:

http://www.dyingwithdignity.ca/email_your_mp_today

Interesting. And puzzling to me, because death is certainly foreseeable with ALS. I guess we will need to wait for this to play out, but I do not think there would be any difficulty getting two physicians to say that death is foreseeable for an individual with advanced ALS.

polaris_x

oftenreading said:

polaris_x said:

http://www.dyingwithdignity.ca/email_your_mp_today

Interesting. And puzzling to me, because death is certainly foreseeable with ALS. I guess we will need to wait for this to play out, but I do not think there would be any difficulty getting two physicians to say that death is foreseeable for an individual with advanced ALS.

ya ... sure, once an ALS patient is in hospice or palliative care - they may qualify but many ALS patients feel their quality of life is so compromised at an earlier stage that this should be an option to them ... why do they have to wait until their respiratory systems begin to fail when they've already lost control of all their muscles?

lukin2006

http://www.nationalpost.com/index.html

Philip Cross: The dirty secret of a bigger CPP is that it’s to help bail out public-sector pension plans

lukin2006

The politicians don't give a shit how much more money it cost us the taxpayer or an individual that needs to seek the courts help in assisted dying ... Di d they even consult a constitutional lawyer. Maybe it's time the Supreme Court also issued direct remedies in their rulings or strike these laws down completely and have no law regarding assisted dying

polaris_x

so ... GM is likely leaving Oshawa ... this after a massive bailout a few years ago from both federal and provincial gov'ts ... thanks Free Trade! ...

lukin2006

^^^ the auto industry will not be in Ontario in 15-20 years or sooner according to a local auto analyst ... I can't find the link, I'll look, but he made those comments about 11/2 years ago when Chrysler was looking for billions to retool the Windsor Assembly Plant, Chrysler went it alone and invested 2 billion.

I feel nothing but sympathy for those effected in Oshawa, this is what most of southern Ontario has been dealing with for 15 years...we've watched plant after plant close, now this area is under a little resurgence with the new Chrysler Pacific van. But the nature of the auto industry is very cyclical.

There is not much we can do about these trade agreements ... In the end I feel the government has let the people who are/were in manufacturing or any sector that is struggling. There should have been a strategy to offer people opportunities to be re-trained with skills that will allow them to better adjust to the changing economy.

lukin2006

Canada's auto industry could disappear within 15 years, says industry analyst

http://windsorstar.com/business/canadas-auto-industry-could-disappear-within-15-years-says-industry-analyst?__lsa=6944-3b0b

lukin2006

Why would any manufacturer invest in Ontario with outlandish hydro cost, likely more red tape than ever before? Just don't see manufacturing getting in real breaks from this government ... Besides I'm not really sure it matters to our current premier ... Common sense at queens park has been replaced by ...

Then her cap n trade plan did nothing for the auto industry in Ontario ... Only make the future dark and bleak.

Look at the bright side the bureaucrats are doing well and have gotten a free pass.

lukin2006

Workers at GM Oshawa fear company planning 'exit strategy' to close plant

http://www.cp24.com/news/workers-at-gm-oshawa-fear-company-planning-exit-strategy-to-close-plant-1.2955178

polaris_x

c'mon ... you can't actually blame the province on this ... these fucking multi-national corporations make fucking billions delivering sub-standard product ... and yet we continually get extorted from them ... meanwhile our gov'ts continue to make FT agreements that always ends up with jobs overseas ...

lukin2006

Actually yes I am blaming the province to some degree. So, I thought hard core environmentalist like yourself would be glad to see these heavy emitters of carbon gone overseas (I kid)? Well I do think this current band of thieves running this province are...don't worry though...when they are done with this province it'll be an environmental utopia. Seems to me we here in southern Ontario got very little support from this province when manufacturing collapsed (other than Gm or Chrysler).

And I don't support free trade agreements with any country, and yes these corporations are moving to parts unknown for lesser standards. What do you think the average ontarian can do about? Nothing, because these lying corrupt politicians are elected dictators, all of them.

Was it not shortly after PM sunny ways was elected he handed 2+ billion to developing countries to help with their environment, really...so these fuckers sign away our good jobs, then they hand the same countries our cash to fix their problems.

And besides GM or any of these auto companies are not even our companies never were...there US companies at heart.

The elimination of the auto pact has done more harm to our auto industry than any free trade agreement.

And the same auto analyst Dennis DeRossier also claimed that the auto czar appointed by the province and federal government was not well-consulted over the cap n trade...yeah the province is totally blameless, creating a mess out of hydro, introducing 2 of the largest tax increases on Ontarions, more red tape and on and on ... This province sucks.