Canadian Politics Redux

HughFreakingDillon

DarthMaeglin said:

I’ve been trying to find out if our government is working on approving any “dead virus” (attenuated?) vaccines. I’ve seen it expressed online (and in person with an (gasp!) unvaccinated friend) that getting one of these more traditional vaccines available would address some peoples’ hesitancy. Unfortunately, this doesn’t seem to be part of the discussion which is disappointing to me.

Full disclosure, I was hesitant about the mnra vaccines but by the time I became eligible AZ had been taken away. So I went and got my 2 shots of Pfizer, setting aside my concerns for the moment. As boosters become more necessary I’m not sure if I want to continue to be part of the experiment. We’re told to follow the science but not worry about potential long term effects from the vaccines, feels like a double standard to me.

 I hope this doesn’t make me one of those dirty piece of shit “anti-vaxxers,” but I’m having to consider whether I’ll find myself standing amongst them in the future, and the ostracization and segregation is very troubling to me.

long term effects of any vaccine in history has been <40 days after vaccination. so if you haven't grown a second head in a month and a half, you are fine. 

DarthMaeglin

HughFreakingDillon said:

DarthMaeglin said:

I’ve been trying to find out if our government is working on approving any “dead virus” (attenuated?) vaccines. I’ve seen it expressed online (and in person with an (gasp!) unvaccinated friend) that getting one of these more traditional vaccines available would address some peoples’ hesitancy. Unfortunately, this doesn’t seem to be part of the discussion which is disappointing to me.

Full disclosure, I was hesitant about the mnra vaccines but by the time I became eligible AZ had been taken away. So I went and got my 2 shots of Pfizer, setting aside my concerns for the moment. As boosters become more necessary I’m not sure if I want to continue to be part of the experiment. We’re told to follow the science but not worry about potential long term effects from the vaccines, feels like a double standard to me.

 I hope this doesn’t make me one of those dirty piece of shit “anti-vaxxers,” but I’m having to consider whether I’ll find myself standing amongst them in the future, and the ostracization and segregation is very troubling to me.

long term effects of any vaccine in history has been <40 days after vaccination. so if you haven't grown a second head in a month and a half, you are fine. 

I get what you’re saying, but I don’t measure long term in days, but years.

And just for clarity, for those that are comfortable continuing with this regimen, that’s your prerogative and choice.

I’m really just asking if anyone’s aware if the more traditional vaccines are being investigated for use in Canada. I haven’t been able to find anything definitive.

HughFreakingDillon

DarthMaeglin said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

DarthMaeglin said:

I’ve been trying to find out if our government is working on approving any “dead virus” (attenuated?) vaccines. I’ve seen it expressed online (and in person with an (gasp!) unvaccinated friend) that getting one of these more traditional vaccines available would address some peoples’ hesitancy. Unfortunately, this doesn’t seem to be part of the discussion which is disappointing to me.

Full disclosure, I was hesitant about the mnra vaccines but by the time I became eligible AZ had been taken away. So I went and got my 2 shots of Pfizer, setting aside my concerns for the moment. As boosters become more necessary I’m not sure if I want to continue to be part of the experiment. We’re told to follow the science but not worry about potential long term effects from the vaccines, feels like a double standard to me.

 I hope this doesn’t make me one of those dirty piece of shit “anti-vaxxers,” but I’m having to consider whether I’ll find myself standing amongst them in the future, and the ostracization and segregation is very troubling to me.

long term effects of any vaccine in history has been <40 days after vaccination. so if you haven't grown a second head in a month and a half, you are fine. 

I get what you’re saying, but I don’t measure long term in days, but years.

And just for clarity, for those that are comfortable continuing with this regimen, that’s your prerogative and choice.

I’m really just asking if anyone’s aware if the more traditional vaccines are being investigated for use in Canada. I haven’t been able to find anything definitive.

that's what i mean....long term effects over 40 days for vaccines simply don't exist. 

oftenreading

DarthMaeglin said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

DarthMaeglin said:

I’ve been trying to find out if our government is working on approving any “dead virus” (attenuated?) vaccines. I’ve seen it expressed online (and in person with an (gasp!) unvaccinated friend) that getting one of these more traditional vaccines available would address some peoples’ hesitancy. Unfortunately, this doesn’t seem to be part of the discussion which is disappointing to me.

Full disclosure, I was hesitant about the mnra vaccines but by the time I became eligible AZ had been taken away. So I went and got my 2 shots of Pfizer, setting aside my concerns for the moment. As boosters become more necessary I’m not sure if I want to continue to be part of the experiment. We’re told to follow the science but not worry about potential long term effects from the vaccines, feels like a double standard to me.

 I hope this doesn’t make me one of those dirty piece of shit “anti-vaxxers,” but I’m having to consider whether I’ll find myself standing amongst them in the future, and the ostracization and segregation is very troubling to me.

long term effects of any vaccine in history has been <40 days after vaccination. so if you haven't grown a second head in a month and a half, you are fine. 

I get what you’re saying, but I don’t measure long term in days, but years.

And just for clarity, for those that are comfortable continuing with this regimen, that’s your prerogative and choice.

I’m really just asking if anyone’s aware if the more traditional vaccines are being investigated for use in Canada. I haven’t been able to find anything definitive.

First, I am not sure that you do get what HFD is saying - there is no evidence of long term side effects from any vaccines, and no biological reason why there would be long term side effects from the mRNA vaccines, so the recommendation is "following the science". The mRNA particles essentially disintegrate in the body very quickly and don't have the capacity to cause any long term side effects.

Second, and more to your original question, there are a number of vaccine trials underway or approved that Canada is a part of. Here's a link to the page: https://www.canada.ca/en/health-canada/services/drugs-health-products/covid19-industry/drugs-vaccines-treatments/list-authorized-trials.html  . You'll see that lots of different types are being investigated, along with trials in different populations and mix-and-match trials of the mRNA vaccines. 

The AZ vaccine is still approved, and in fact got full approval recently. I don't think it's being made available right now, but certainly might be in the future. It's hard to argue that the country should prioritize a less effective vaccine. The Janssen vaccine still has some level of approval, I think, but it seems like it's unlikely to be shipped to us any time soon, since they made such a mess of their production. 

Medicago, a vaccine developed in Canada, is in phase 3 trials. If successful, I think their plan is to have it available late this fall or early next year. It is not an mRNA vaccine. 

Edit: corrected a spelling mistake

DarthMaeglin

oftenreading said:

DarthMaeglin said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

DarthMaeglin said:

I’ve been trying to find out if our government is working on approving any “dead virus” (attenuated?) vaccines. I’ve seen it expressed online (and in person with an (gasp!) unvaccinated friend) that getting one of these more traditional vaccines available would address some peoples’ hesitancy. Unfortunately, this doesn’t seem to be part of the discussion which is disappointing to me.

Full disclosure, I was hesitant about the mnra vaccines but by the time I became eligible AZ had been taken away. So I went and got my 2 shots of Pfizer, setting aside my concerns for the moment. As boosters become more necessary I’m not sure if I want to continue to be part of the experiment. We’re told to follow the science but not worry about potential long term effects from the vaccines, feels like a double standard to me.

 I hope this doesn’t make me one of those dirty piece of shit “anti-vaxxers,” but I’m having to consider whether I’ll find myself standing amongst them in the future, and the ostracization and segregation is very troubling to me.

long term effects of any vaccine in history has been <40 days after vaccination. so if you haven't grown a second head in a month and a half, you are fine. 

I get what you’re saying, but I don’t measure long term in days, but years.

And just for clarity, for those that are comfortable continuing with this regimen, that’s your prerogative and choice.

I’m really just asking if anyone’s aware if the more traditional vaccines are being investigated for use in Canada. I haven’t been able to find anything definitive.

First, I am not sure that you do get what HFD is saying - there is no evidence of long term side effects from any vaccines, and no biological reason why there would be long term side effects from the mRNA vaccines, so the recommendation is "following the science". The mRNA particles essentially disintegrate in the body very quickly and don't have the capacity to cause any long term side effects.

Second, and more to your original question, there are a number of vaccine trials underway of approved that Canada is a part of. Here's a link to the page: https://www.canada.ca/en/health-canada/services/drugs-health-products/covid19-industry/drugs-vaccines-treatments/list-authorized-trials.html  . You'll see that lots of different types are being investigated, along with trials in different populations and mix-and-match trials of the mRNA vaccines. 

The AZ vaccine is still approved, and in fact got full approval recently. I don't think it's being made available right now, but certainly might be in the future. It's hard to argue that the country should prioritize a less effective vaccine. The Janssen vaccine still has some level of approval, I think, but it seems like it's unlikely to be shipped to us any time soon, since they made such a mess of their production. 

Medicago, a vaccine developed in Canada, is in phase 3 trials. If successful, I think their plan is to have it available late this fall or early next year. It is not an mRNA vaccine. 

Thanks, I started to look through the site but I’ll need to come back to it when I have more time to be thorough (and have a better understanding of what I’m reading, I fully acknowledge my limited knowledge.).

At a glance it seems like I can be more optimistic looking forward, sincerely, thanks.

Zod

HughFreakingDillon said:

dignin said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

so you think we should let people die so you can have a non-life threatening procedure?

yikes. 

I'm pretty much with him. I have zero empathy left for these assholes.

They have broken the social contract.

dignin said:

If my family gets in a bad car crash today and any of us need an ICU bed we may be shit out of luck.

All because these assholes spend too much time on Facebook.

I agree with the second statement.

I have a surgery that I need done at some point, but I can live with it in the mean time. 

but trading someone's life just so I can be 100% again? 

It get's more challenging here in BC. I've heard from a few people that their cancer treatments have been delayed because of capacity issues :(   And we're not even at where Alberta's at (yet) :(

HughFreakingDillon

Zod said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

dignin said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

so you think we should let people die so you can have a non-life threatening procedure?

yikes. 

I'm pretty much with him. I have zero empathy left for these assholes.

They have broken the social contract.

dignin said:

If my family gets in a bad car crash today and any of us need an ICU bed we may be shit out of luck.

All because these assholes spend too much time on Facebook.

I agree with the second statement.

I have a surgery that I need done at some point, but I can live with it in the mean time. 

but trading someone's life just so I can be 100% again? 

It get's more challenging here in BC. I've heard from a few people that their cancer treatments have been delayed because of capacity issues :(   And we're not even at where Alberta's at (yet) :(

yes, and that's where I agree the cancer patient should get priority. 

HughFreakingDillon

Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama both endorse Trudeau, and Bernie Sanders endorses Jagmeet Singh. I saw someone post on twitter
"(this) is so funny to me it's like they're play fighting with little Canadian action figures". LOL

dignin

HughFreakingDillon said:

dignin said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

so you think we should let people die so you can have a non-life threatening procedure?

yikes. 

I'm pretty much with him. I have zero empathy left for these assholes.

They have broken the social contract.

dignin said:

If my family gets in a bad car crash today and any of us need an ICU bed we may be shit out of luck.

All because these assholes spend too much time on Facebook.

I agree with the second statement.

I have a surgery that I need done at some point, but I can live with it in the mean time. 

but trading someone's life just so I can be 100% again? 

I'm okay with you being prioritized over the anti vaccine mouth breathers.

Now we are fucking over sick kids to save these fuckheads.

https://calgaryherald.com/news/local-news/alberta-childrens-hospital-to-close-75-per-cent-of-operating-rooms-by-monday

Meltdown99

People should not to delay their procedure because of the unvaccinated.  As it is now our health care system will be playing catch-up.  And now more procedures are being delayed because of the 4th wave of unvaccinated…it could be a while to clear up the backlog…

even though healthcare is a provincial responsibility, I was really hoping the issue of backlogged procedures would have been discussed more and in detail with concrete solutions to help provinces solve these problems…

oh well.  Kind off a terrible election anyways.

Meltdown99

I will clarify.  When I said fuck Alberta, I really meant Kenney.

Meltdown99

Retired vice-admiral Mark Norman endorses O'Toole as 'leader of substance'

https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/federal-election-2021/retired-vice-admiral-mark-norman-endorses-o-toole-as-leader-of-substance-1.5590763?cid=sm:trueanthem:ctvnews:twittermanualpost&taid=6145ddef137ff00001e7cc08&utm_campaign=trueAnthem:+New+Content+(Feed)&utm_medium=trueAnthem&utm_source=twitter

Meltdown99

I’d vote for butter tarts…

erebus

I’d vote for the 1.23 gas. 

1.46 here in Northern Ontario 

I realize it’s Ford’s provincial broken promise

Meltdown99

https://www.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=2284119

The Alberta healthcare is collapsing???

Meltdown99

Trudeau says he remains open to electoral reform if Liberals re-elected

https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/federal-election-2021/trudeau-says-he-remains-open-to-electoral-reform-if-liberals-re-elected-1.5590835?cid=sm:trueanthem:ctvnews:twittermanualpost&taid=6146037d24b73e0001f4ee34&utm_campaign=trueAnthem:+New+Content+(Feed)&utm_medium=trueAnthem&utm_source=twitter

LMFAO.  Let’s dig up the 2015 list of broken promises, so we can break them again.

HughFreakingDillon

sure. here it is. 

https://nationalpost.com/news/politics/a-look-at-policy-areas-scrutinized-by-a-new-book-on-the-trudeau-government

Meltdown99

Not all Liberal campaigning candidates are vaccinated: Trudeau

https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/not-all-liberal-campaigning-candidates-are-vaccinated-trudeau

Then quit pointing the finger.

oftenreading

Meltdown99 said:

Not all Liberal campaigning candidates are vaccinated: Trudeau

https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/not-all-liberal-campaigning-candidates-are-vaccinated-trudeau

Then quit pointing the finger.

Based on the title of the article, I was expecting to see something more significant than everyone is fully vaccinated except for a couple of people who are about to get their second shot. 

Given the interval between first and second shots, one can assume that potential candidates who were unvaccinated were told they have to be vaccinated to run, so they got their first shot and are waiting for the second. 

Yeah, that’s not an issue for me, or probably for any reasonable person. 

Meltdown99

https://globalnews.ca/news/8202089/alberta-health-worker-unions-call-on-kenney-to-request-military-help-with-covid-19-crisis/?utm_medium=Twitter&utm_source=%40GlobalCalgary

Alberta health-worker unions call on Kenney to request military help with COVID-19 crisis