Knowing what you know now would you still support the withdrawal of troops from Iraq

BS44325
BS44325 Posts: 6,124
in A Moving Train
http://youtu.be/tLteUGkvpOc

Oh to be back in 2009-10. The good old days. Stable Iraq...arab spring...green revolution. Opportunity lost.
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Comments

  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,105
    Withdrawal of US or Canadian troops or some or all of the "coalition of the willing?"
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  • BS44325
    BS44325 Posts: 6,124
    Halifax2TheMax said:

    Withdrawal of US or Canadian troops or some or all of the "coalition of the willing?"

    Your choice.
  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,105
    US troops, yes. Canadian troops, no.
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,105
    When Canada invests as much as the US does in waging war, in both blood and treasure, then maybe I'll change my mind.

    https://www.nationalpriorities.org/cost-of/


    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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  • gimmesometruth27
    gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 24,050
    Uh yeah.

    Status of forces agreement, signed by GWB, guaranteed we would be out by the agreed upon date. Obama tried to keep us there. But they kicked us out.

    Don't pin the withdrawal on Obama, he could not make Iraq allow us to stay.

    You can't blame the successor, a man who never supported the war, for the fuck up of the predecessor.

    Let's cut the history revision crap please.
    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

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  • BS44325
    BS44325 Posts: 6,124
    gimmesometruth27 said:

    Uh yeah.

    Status of forces agreement, signed by GWB, guaranteed we would be out by the agreed upon date. Obama tried to keep us there. But they kicked us out.

    Don't pin the withdrawal on Obama, he could not make Iraq allow us to stay.

    You can't blame the successor, a man who never supported the war, for the fuck up of the predecessor.

    Let's cut the history revision crap please.

    So all things being equal you think the troops should have stayed?
  • InHiding80
    InHiding80 Upland,CA Posts: 7,623
    Halifax2TheMax said:

    When Canada invests as much as the US does in waging war, in both blood and treasure, then maybe I'll change my mind.

    https://www.nationalpriorities.org/cost-of/


    Let's just hope Terrence and Philip don't offend Sheila Broflovski again.
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,662
    Yeah, of course. Never should have been there in the first place.
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • josevolution
    josevolution Posts: 31,576
    How about knowing that if asshat Chaney & bush didn't push for that war we could of saved 4thousand Amrrican lives , how about we come to terms with that 1st
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • BS44325
    BS44325 Posts: 6,124
    josevolution said:

    How about knowing that if asshat Chaney & bush didn't push for that war we could of saved 4thousand Amrrican lives , how about we come to terms with that 1st

    Why can't we come to terms with both?
  • Aafke
    Aafke Posts: 1,219
    The invasion never should have taken place! The world had to ignore the war drums and war mongers....

    All the West did was fuel the engines of the hatred against western thinking, and western arrogance of deciding what is best for the rest of the world, out of pure and simple greed....
    Waves_zps6b028461.jpg
    "The meeting of two personalities is like the contact of two chemical substances: if there is any reaction, both are transformed".- Carl Jung.
    "Art does not reproduce what we see; rather, it makes us see."- Paul Klee
  • badbrains
    badbrains Posts: 10,255
    Knowing what we know now? Shit, how many of us were saying back then not to even go? Where were you then?
  • josevolution
    josevolution Posts: 31,576
    BS44325 said:

    josevolution said:

    How about knowing that if asshat Chaney & bush didn't push for that war we could of saved 4thousand Amrrican lives , how about we come to terms with that 1st

    Why can't we come to terms with both?
    Because I don't believe we should just dismiss the total fuck up of invasion & death of all those lives as if they can just be replaced with a new generation of soldiers how about we learn and never make a mistake like that again ...
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • Aafke
    Aafke Posts: 1,219
    josevolution said:

    BS44325 said:

    josevolution said:

    How about knowing that if asshat Chaney & bush didn't push for that war we could of saved 4thousand Amrrican lives , how about we come to terms with that 1st

    Why can't we come to terms with both?
    Because I don't believe we should just dismiss the total fuck up of invasion & death of all those lives as if they can just be replaced with a new generation of soldiers how about we learn and never make a mistake like that again ...
    I agree!
    Waves_zps6b028461.jpg
    "The meeting of two personalities is like the contact of two chemical substances: if there is any reaction, both are transformed".- Carl Jung.
    "Art does not reproduce what we see; rather, it makes us see."- Paul Klee
  • badbrains
    badbrains Posts: 10,255
    josevolution said:

    BS44325 said:

    josevolution said:

    How about knowing that if asshat Chaney & bush didn't push for that war we could of saved 4thousand Amrrican lives , how about we come to terms with that 1st

    Why can't we come to terms with both?
    Because I don't believe we should just dismiss the total fuck up of invasion & death of all those lives as if they can just be replaced with a new generation of soldiers how about we learn and never make a mistake like that again ...
    You just killed his hard on. Way to go Jose. What a buzz kill.
  • BS44325
    BS44325 Posts: 6,124
    Aafke said:

    josevolution said:

    BS44325 said:

    josevolution said:

    How about knowing that if asshat Chaney & bush didn't push for that war we could of saved 4thousand Amrrican lives , how about we come to terms with that 1st

    Why can't we come to terms with both?
    Because I don't believe we should just dismiss the total fuck up of invasion & death of all those lives as if they can just be replaced with a new generation of soldiers how about we learn and never make a mistake like that again ...
    I agree!
    Ok great...now how about answering the question at hand with respect to the withdrawal?
  • rgambs
    rgambs Posts: 13,576
    "Knowing what we know now"
    I think there is quite a bit of evidence that those who orchestrated it knew this exact sort of destabilization would occur before they invaded in the first place! The evidence suggests it was part of the motivation that originated decades ago.

    That being said, yes I would still support the troop withdrawal...It would be nice if we didn't find terrorist groups into power in the first place, but that will never stop. ISIS is a symptom, it is not the disease. If it wasn't Iraq it would be elsewhere.
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  • dignin
    dignin Posts: 9,478
    Yes
  • Aafke
    Aafke Posts: 1,219
    rgambs said:

    "Knowing what we know now"
    I think there is quite a bit of evidence that those who orchestrated it knew this exact sort of destabilization would occur before they invaded in the first place! The evidence suggests it was part of the motivation that originated decades ago.

    That being said, yes I would still support the troop withdrawal...It would be nice if we didn't find terrorist groups into power in the first place, but that will never stop. ISIS is a symptom, it is not the disease. If it wasn't Iraq it would be elsewhere.

    Not only is ISIS a symptom instead of the disease, in my opinion, this symptom is meanly caused by the idiotic why Iraq was invaded in the first place, under false pretenses!
    Waves_zps6b028461.jpg
    "The meeting of two personalities is like the contact of two chemical substances: if there is any reaction, both are transformed".- Carl Jung.
    "Art does not reproduce what we see; rather, it makes us see."- Paul Klee
  • callen
    callen Posts: 6,388
    BS44325 said:

    josevolution said:

    How about knowing that if asshat Chaney & bush didn't push for that war we could of saved 4thousand Amrrican lives , how about we come to terms with that 1st

    Why can't we come to terms with both?
    Like blaming the surgeon for the actions if the shooter
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