That's just ridiculous.....I mean that looks like something from the wrestling world not police enforcement. So is there a follow up to this video story?
Peace
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
That's just ridiculous.....I mean that looks like something from the wrestling world not police enforcement. So is there a follow up to this video story?
Peace
The other cop raised the guys arm over his head and let's go, it drops to the floor. He raises it agiain, it drops to the floor, he raised it a third time and drops it. It fell but right before it hit the floor, it stops. He holds it for a second. The crowd starts to cheer. The suspect begins to pump his arms. He stands up and breaks free of the choke hold, turns around and body slams the cop and pins him.
So the follow up is that he won the intercontinental championship.
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Surfing The far side of THE Sombrero Galaxy Posts: 18,199
I wonder what he did? He very well maybe did deserve it.
Are you serious....if a suspect is handcuffed with his hands behind his back DOES NOT deserve this no matter what he did. Why would I say this because he can't defend himself...pretty EASY for that cop to choke the shit out him huh.
What a world we live in....
Peace
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
I wonder what he did? He very well maybe did deserve it.
Are you serious....if a suspect is handcuffed with his hands behind his back DOES NOT deserve this no matter what he did. Why would I say this because he can't defend himself...pretty EASY for that cop to choke the shit out him huh.
What a world we live in....
Peace
Half serious. I was responding to JC's sarcasm.
With that said... did this guy just get caught beating his girlfriend, spitting on people, and sucker punching a cop? Did he just shoot somebody? If so... I'm not too concerned for the chokehold- he'd just be getting the beating he went and earned for himself in my opinion.
I wonder what he did? He very well maybe did deserve it.
Are you serious....if a suspect is handcuffed with his hands behind his back DOES NOT deserve this no matter what he did. Why would I say this because he can't defend himself...pretty EASY for that cop to choke the shit out him huh.
What a world we live in....
Peace
Half serious. I was responding to JC's sarcasm.
With that said... did this guy just get caught beating his girlfriend, spitting on people, and sucker punching a cop? Did he just shoot somebody? If so... I'm not too concerned for the chokehold- he'd just be getting the beating he went and earned for himself in my opinion.
So you prefer a Judge Dredd style of policing? I don't. It is not the duty of police to punish, only to apprehend. If you bypass the right to a trial you give police open license for police brutality, and that is not a civilized way of doing business.
Monkey Driven, Call this Living?
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Surfing The far side of THE Sombrero Galaxy Posts: 18,199
From the time I heard of the NYC choke hold case I thought of this piece by Richard Pryor. I have this album on vinyl along with all his other ones. Pryor knew quite well his experiences with the police and his bit about being the first black president. He was a man way ahead of time is right...
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
0
g under p
Surfing The far side of THE Sombrero Galaxy Posts: 18,199
I wonder what he did? He very well maybe did deserve it.
Are you serious....if a suspect is handcuffed with his hands behind his back DOES NOT deserve this no matter what he did. Why would I say this because he can't defend himself...pretty EASY for that cop to choke the shit out him huh.
What a world we live in....
Peace
Half serious. I was responding to JC's sarcasm.
With that said... did this guy just get caught beating his girlfriend, spitting on people, and sucker punching a cop? Did he just shoot somebody? If so... I'm not too concerned for the chokehold- he'd just be getting the beating he went and earned for himself in my opinion.
So you prefer a Judge Dredd style of policing? I don't. It is not the duty of police to punish, only to apprehend. If you bypass the right to a trial you give police open license for police brutality, and that is not a civilized way of doing business.
I totally agree. If that choke hold is ok where does it EVER end....just imagine how chaotic our society would become if this police behavior was allowed.
Peace
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
I wonder what he did? He very well maybe did deserve it.
Are you serious....if a suspect is handcuffed with his hands behind his back DOES NOT deserve this no matter what he did. Why would I say this because he can't defend himself...pretty EASY for that cop to choke the shit out him huh.
What a world we live in....
Peace
Half serious. I was responding to JC's sarcasm.
With that said... did this guy just get caught beating his girlfriend, spitting on people, and sucker punching a cop? Did he just shoot somebody? If so... I'm not too concerned for the chokehold- he'd just be getting the beating he went and earned for himself in my opinion.
So you prefer a Judge Dredd style of policing? I don't. It is not the duty of police to punish, only to apprehend. If you bypass the right to a trial you give police open license for police brutality, and that is not a civilized way of doing business.
I prefer people don't break the law. I have no tolerance for criminals. As much as I agree that the video clearly displays excessive force... unless it is shown the guy is a random guy who's innocent of anything... I don't really care.
Don't break the law. Don't hurt people. And guess what? You'll never have to worry about a cop choking you out.
From the time I heard of the NYC choke hold case I thought of this piece by Richard Pryor. I have this album on vinyl along with all his other ones. Pryor knew quite well his experiences with the police and his bit about being the first black president. He was a man way ahead of time is right...
I wonder what he did? He very well maybe did deserve it.
Are you serious....if a suspect is handcuffed with his hands behind his back DOES NOT deserve this no matter what he did. Why would I say this because he can't defend himself...pretty EASY for that cop to choke the shit out him huh.
What a world we live in....
Peace
Half serious. I was responding to JC's sarcasm.
With that said... did this guy just get caught beating his girlfriend, spitting on people, and sucker punching a cop? Did he just shoot somebody? If so... I'm not too concerned for the chokehold- he'd just be getting the beating he went and earned for himself in my opinion.
So you prefer a Judge Dredd style of policing? I don't. It is not the duty of police to punish, only to apprehend. If you bypass the right to a trial you give police open license for police brutality, and that is not a civilized way of doing business.
I prefer people don't break the law. I have no tolerance for criminals. As much as I agree that the video clearly displays excessive force... unless it is shown the guy is a random guy who's innocent of anything... I don't really care.
Don't break the law. Don't hurt people. And guess what? You'll never have to worry about a cop choking you out.
And what if the presumption of wrong doing changes over time? If we don't have a check on the police then we are giving them the ability to be judge and jury in the heat of the moment. It's a fine line in which you may find that the perception of criminal behavior starts bordering on the ridiculous and any one of us who aren't criminals could find ourselves on the other end of excessive force. We need the police to apprehend not judge.
Are we getting something out of this all-encompassing trip?
Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...
I wonder what he did? He very well maybe did deserve it.
Are you serious....if a suspect is handcuffed with his hands behind his back DOES NOT deserve this no matter what he did. Why would I say this because he can't defend himself...pretty EASY for that cop to choke the shit out him huh.
What a world we live in....
Peace
Half serious. I was responding to JC's sarcasm.
With that said... did this guy just get caught beating his girlfriend, spitting on people, and sucker punching a cop? Did he just shoot somebody? If so... I'm not too concerned for the chokehold- he'd just be getting the beating he went and earned for himself in my opinion.
So you prefer a Judge Dredd style of policing? I don't. It is not the duty of police to punish, only to apprehend. If you bypass the right to a trial you give police open license for police brutality, and that is not a civilized way of doing business.
I prefer people don't break the law. I have no tolerance for criminals. As much as I agree that the video clearly displays excessive force... unless it is shown the guy is a random guy who's innocent of anything... I don't really care.
Don't break the law. Don't hurt people. And guess what? You'll never have to worry about a cop choking you out.
And what if the presumption of wrong doing changes over time? If we don't have a check on the police then we are giving them the ability to be judge and jury in the heat of the moment. It's a fine line in which you may find that the perception of criminal behavior starts bordering on the ridiculous and any one of us who aren't criminals could find ourselves on the other end of excessive force. We need the police to apprehend not judge.
I stated, unless it is shown the guy is a random guy who's innocent of anything... I don't really care.
I agree completely that we need a check on police and the officer, in reality, needs some measure of reform for this behaviour. I only reflected my sentiments regarding how I feel about some criminal taking his lumps for his criminal behaviour.
I wouldn't be a good cop. I'd be a shitty cop. For example... if some guy had, say, just beaten up some woman, thrown punches at me, tried to run a way, got in a tussle with me, and I finally secured him... I'd have a hard time not feeding him a couple shots for good measure. I tip my hat to any cop that restrains himself from decking some scumbag that needs to be decked.
I get the feeling that some on here would prefer I give the criminal a hug.
I wonder what he did? He very well maybe did deserve it.
Are you serious....if a suspect is handcuffed with his hands behind his back DOES NOT deserve this no matter what he did. Why would I say this because he can't defend himself...pretty EASY for that cop to choke the shit out him huh.
What a world we live in....
Peace
Half serious. I was responding to JC's sarcasm.
With that said... did this guy just get caught beating his girlfriend, spitting on people, and sucker punching a cop? Did he just shoot somebody? If so... I'm not too concerned for the chokehold- he'd just be getting the beating he went and earned for himself in my opinion.
So you prefer a Judge Dredd style of policing? I don't. It is not the duty of police to punish, only to apprehend. If you bypass the right to a trial you give police open license for police brutality, and that is not a civilized way of doing business.
I prefer people don't break the law. I have no tolerance for criminals. As much as I agree that the video clearly displays excessive force... unless it is shown the guy is a random guy who's innocent of anything... I don't really care.
Don't break the law. Don't hurt people. And guess what? You'll never have to worry about a cop choking you out.
I think we have ample evidence that some people get choked, or worse, without having broken the law. Hell, we have evidence of people having been executed without having broken the law.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
I wonder what he did? He very well maybe did deserve it.
Are you serious....if a suspect is handcuffed with his hands behind his back DOES NOT deserve this no matter what he did. Why would I say this because he can't defend himself...pretty EASY for that cop to choke the shit out him huh.
What a world we live in....
Peace
Half serious. I was responding to JC's sarcasm.
With that said... did this guy just get caught beating his girlfriend, spitting on people, and sucker punching a cop? Did he just shoot somebody? If so... I'm not too concerned for the chokehold- he'd just be getting the beating he went and earned for himself in my opinion.
So you prefer a Judge Dredd style of policing? I don't. It is not the duty of police to punish, only to apprehend. If you bypass the right to a trial you give police open license for police brutality, and that is not a civilized way of doing business.
I prefer people don't break the law. I have no tolerance for criminals. As much as I agree that the video clearly displays excessive force... unless it is shown the guy is a random guy who's innocent of anything... I don't really care.
Don't break the law. Don't hurt people. And guess what? You'll never have to worry about a cop choking you out.
And what if the presumption of wrong doing changes over time? If we don't have a check on the police then we are giving them the ability to be judge and jury in the heat of the moment. It's a fine line in which you may find that the perception of criminal behavior starts bordering on the ridiculous and any one of us who aren't criminals could find ourselves on the other end of excessive force. We need the police to apprehend not judge.
Well put.
Not to mention part of the post you responded to: "Don't break the law. Don't hurt people. And guess what? You'll never have to worry about a cop choking you out."
Sorry, Thirty Bills Unpaid, but there are far too many examples of hasty, heavy-handed police brutality with a limited amount of quality evidence (or none at all) for me to believe that to be true. Hell, just within the last few weeks you could probably find a few. A great example is the twelve-year-old black child who had an airsoft gun and was playing in the park with it, and the police who received a call about a "black person with a gun", arrived on the scene, drove onto the park itself, hardly had left the car, and shot and killed a child. Guess what? The kid didn't break the law. He didn't hurt people. And now he's dead.
I'm curious to see how people would respond to this thought experiment.
Scenario One: We in the public see a new video on YouTube showing one man putting another in a chokehold. The other man slowly falls to the ground, while panting, saying "I can't breathe, I can't breathe". Then he has a heart attack, and dies. Do we assume the dead man was innocent, or guilty?
Scenario Two: We in the public see a new video on YouTube showing one police officer putting a man in a chokehold. The man slowly falls to the ground, while panting, saying "I can't breathe, I can't breathe". Then he has a heart attack, and dies. Do we assume the dead man was innocent, or guilty?
For those of you who feel that scenario one calls for an assumption of innocence, and scenario two calls for an assumption of guilt: why put so much credence in the investigative efforts of the police force? Why should we in the public hold police officers to different standards than any other civilian? For me, as I see it, if you're going to give people the authority to do things which regular civilians don't - you need to INTRODUCE further checks and balances: not provide get out of jail cards (which, in this case, they're not even hypothetical get out of jail cards).
'05 - TO, '06 - TO 1, '08 - NYC 1 & 2, '09 - TO, Chi 1 & 2, '10 - Buffalo, NYC 1 & 2, '11 - TO 1 & 2, Hamilton, '13 - Buffalo, Brooklyn 1 & 2, '15 - Global Citizen, '16 - TO 1 & 2, Chi 2
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
I wonder what he did? He very well maybe did deserve it.
Are you serious....if a suspect is handcuffed with his hands behind his back DOES NOT deserve this no matter what he did. Why would I say this because he can't defend himself...pretty EASY for that cop to choke the shit out him huh.
What a world we live in....
Peace
Half serious. I was responding to JC's sarcasm.
With that said... did this guy just get caught beating his girlfriend, spitting on people, and sucker punching a cop? Did he just shoot somebody? If so... I'm not too concerned for the chokehold- he'd just be getting the beating he went and earned for himself in my opinion.
So you prefer a Judge Dredd style of policing? I don't. It is not the duty of police to punish, only to apprehend. If you bypass the right to a trial you give police open license for police brutality, and that is not a civilized way of doing business.
I prefer people don't break the law. I have no tolerance for criminals. As much as I agree that the video clearly displays excessive force... unless it is shown the guy is a random guy who's innocent of anything... I don't really care.
Don't break the law. Don't hurt people. And guess what? You'll never have to worry about a cop choking you out.
And what if the presumption of wrong doing changes over time? If we don't have a check on the police then we are giving them the ability to be judge and jury in the heat of the moment. It's a fine line in which you may find that the perception of criminal behavior starts bordering on the ridiculous and any one of us who aren't criminals could find ourselves on the other end of excessive force. We need the police to apprehend not judge.
Innocent people don't run from or resist the police.
I wonder what he did? He very well maybe did deserve it.
Are you serious....if a suspect is handcuffed with his hands behind his back DOES NOT deserve this no matter what he did. Why would I say this because he can't defend himself...pretty EASY for that cop to choke the shit out him huh.
What a world we live in....
Peace
Half serious. I was responding to JC's sarcasm.
With that said... did this guy just get caught beating his girlfriend, spitting on people, and sucker punching a cop? Did he just shoot somebody? If so... I'm not too concerned for the chokehold- he'd just be getting the beating he went and earned for himself in my opinion.
So you prefer a Judge Dredd style of policing? I don't. It is not the duty of police to punish, only to apprehend. If you bypass the right to a trial you give police open license for police brutality, and that is not a civilized way of doing business.
I prefer people don't break the law. I have no tolerance for criminals. As much as I agree that the video clearly displays excessive force... unless it is shown the guy is a random guy who's innocent of anything... I don't really care.
Don't break the law. Don't hurt people. And guess what? You'll never have to worry about a cop choking you out.
And what if the presumption of wrong doing changes over time? If we don't have a check on the police then we are giving them the ability to be judge and jury in the heat of the moment. It's a fine line in which you may find that the perception of criminal behavior starts bordering on the ridiculous and any one of us who aren't criminals could find ourselves on the other end of excessive force. We need the police to apprehend not judge.
Innocent people don't run from or resist the police.
Scared, confused, mentally ill or even intoxicated people run from or resist police at times. That doesn't necessarily mean they are guilty.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
I wonder what he did? He very well maybe did deserve it.
Are you serious....if a suspect is handcuffed with his hands behind his back DOES NOT deserve this no matter what he did. Why would I say this because he can't defend himself...pretty EASY for that cop to choke the shit out him huh.
What a world we live in....
Peace
Half serious. I was responding to JC's sarcasm.
With that said... did this guy just get caught beating his girlfriend, spitting on people, and sucker punching a cop? Did he just shoot somebody? If so... I'm not too concerned for the chokehold- he'd just be getting the beating he went and earned for himself in my opinion.
So you prefer a Judge Dredd style of policing? I don't. It is not the duty of police to punish, only to apprehend. If you bypass the right to a trial you give police open license for police brutality, and that is not a civilized way of doing business.
I prefer people don't break the law. I have no tolerance for criminals. As much as I agree that the video clearly displays excessive force... unless it is shown the guy is a random guy who's innocent of anything... I don't really care.
Don't break the law. Don't hurt people. And guess what? You'll never have to worry about a cop choking you out.
I think we have ample evidence that some people get choked, or worse, without having broken the law. Hell, we have evidence of people having been executed without having broken the law.
And in these cases... the police officer in question should be held accountable.
All I'm saying is that I don't feel too badly for pedophiles, rapists, arsonists, and murderers when cops don't handle them gently.
I wonder what he did? He very well maybe did deserve it.
Are you serious....if a suspect is handcuffed with his hands behind his back DOES NOT deserve this no matter what he did. Why would I say this because he can't defend himself...pretty EASY for that cop to choke the shit out him huh.
What a world we live in....
Peace
Half serious. I was responding to JC's sarcasm.
With that said... did this guy just get caught beating his girlfriend, spitting on people, and sucker punching a cop? Did he just shoot somebody? If so... I'm not too concerned for the chokehold- he'd just be getting the beating he went and earned for himself in my opinion.
So you prefer a Judge Dredd style of policing? I don't. It is not the duty of police to punish, only to apprehend. If you bypass the right to a trial you give police open license for police brutality, and that is not a civilized way of doing business.
I prefer people don't break the law. I have no tolerance for criminals. As much as I agree that the video clearly displays excessive force... unless it is shown the guy is a random guy who's innocent of anything... I don't really care.
Don't break the law. Don't hurt people. And guess what? You'll never have to worry about a cop choking you out.
And what if the presumption of wrong doing changes over time? If we don't have a check on the police then we are giving them the ability to be judge and jury in the heat of the moment. It's a fine line in which you may find that the perception of criminal behavior starts bordering on the ridiculous and any one of us who aren't criminals could find ourselves on the other end of excessive force. We need the police to apprehend not judge.
Innocent people don't run from or resist the police.
Scared, confused, mentally ill or even intoxicated people run from or resist police at times. That doesn't necessarily mean they are guilty.
And it can't be an assumption that they always take a beating after running from or resisting. There are plenty of incidents where cops handle the situation very professionally.
I'm a nurse, not a law enforcement professional. But after seeing Mr. Garner complaining of not being able to breathe and then becoming unresponsive, and seeing the officers on the scene, who ordinarily part of a first responder team, to see them do nothing really upset me. And made me wonder, because nurses follow the Nursing Scope and Standards of Practice , what kind of professional oath officers take. I found this on the International Association of Chiefs of Police.
On my honor, I will never betray my badge1, my integrity, my character, or the public trust. I will always have the courage to hold myself and others accountable for our actions. I will always uphold the constitution2 my community3 and the agency I serve.
Before any officer takes the Law Enforcement Oath of Honor, it is important that he/she understands what it means. An oath is a solemn pledge someone makes when he/she sincerely intends to do what he/she says.
Honor means that one's word is given as a guarantee. Betray is defined as breaking faith with the public trust. Badge is the symbol of your office. Integrity is being the same person in both private and public life. Character means the qualities that distinguish an individual. Public trust is a charge of duty imposed in faith toward those you serve. Courage is having the strength to withstand unethical pressure, fear or danger. Accountability means that you are answerable and responsible to your oath of office. Community is the jurisdiction and citizens served.
1 Insert appropriate term such as: badge; profession; country 2 Insert appropriate term such as: constitution, laws; monarch 3 Insert appropriate term such as: community; country; land; nationtheiacp.org/What-is-the-Law-Enforcement-Oath-of-Honor
Not helping an unconscious man does not seem to be upholding the public trust or holding yourself accountable for your actions. Nor does failing to render aid to a 12 year old that you just shot. It is like these officers don't recognize them as people. Something is seriously wrong here. I know some really good police officers and some truly lousy ones. I think some major house cleaning is in order.
And the sun it may be shining . . . but there's an ocean in my eyes
I wonder what he did? He very well maybe did deserve it.
Are you serious....if a suspect is handcuffed with his hands behind his back DOES NOT deserve this no matter what he did. Why would I say this because he can't defend himself...pretty EASY for that cop to choke the shit out him huh.
What a world we live in....
Peace
Half serious. I was responding to JC's sarcasm.
With that said... did this guy just get caught beating his girlfriend, spitting on people, and sucker punching a cop? Did he just shoot somebody? If so... I'm not too concerned for the chokehold- he'd just be getting the beating he went and earned for himself in my opinion.
So you prefer a Judge Dredd style of policing? I don't. It is not the duty of police to punish, only to apprehend. If you bypass the right to a trial you give police open license for police brutality, and that is not a civilized way of doing business.
I prefer people don't break the law. I have no tolerance for criminals. As much as I agree that the video clearly displays excessive force... unless it is shown the guy is a random guy who's innocent of anything... I don't really care.
Don't break the law. Don't hurt people. And guess what? You'll never have to worry about a cop choking you out.
And what if the presumption of wrong doing changes over time? If we don't have a check on the police then we are giving them the ability to be judge and jury in the heat of the moment. It's a fine line in which you may find that the perception of criminal behavior starts bordering on the ridiculous and any one of us who aren't criminals could find ourselves on the other end of excessive force. We need the police to apprehend not judge.
Innocent people don't run from or resist the police.
Scared, confused, mentally ill or even intoxicated people run from or resist police at times. That doesn't necessarily mean they are guilty.
And it can't be an assumption that they always take a beating after running from or resisting. .
I agree. Good thing no-one here is actually arguing this.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
I wonder what he did? He very well maybe did deserve it.
Are you serious....if a suspect is handcuffed with his hands behind his back DOES NOT deserve this no matter what he did. Why would I say this because he can't defend himself...pretty EASY for that cop to choke the shit out him huh.
What a world we live in....
Peace
Half serious. I was responding to JC's sarcasm.
With that said... did this guy just get caught beating his girlfriend, spitting on people, and sucker punching a cop? Did he just shoot somebody? If so... I'm not too concerned for the chokehold- he'd just be getting the beating he went and earned for himself in my opinion.
So you prefer a Judge Dredd style of policing? I don't. It is not the duty of police to punish, only to apprehend. If you bypass the right to a trial you give police open license for police brutality, and that is not a civilized way of doing business.
I prefer people don't break the law. I have no tolerance for criminals. As much as I agree that the video clearly displays excessive force... unless it is shown the guy is a random guy who's innocent of anything... I don't really care.
Don't break the law. Don't hurt people. And guess what? You'll never have to worry about a cop choking you out.
And what if the presumption of wrong doing changes over time? If we don't have a check on the police then we are giving them the ability to be judge and jury in the heat of the moment. It's a fine line in which you may find that the perception of criminal behavior starts bordering on the ridiculous and any one of us who aren't criminals could find ourselves on the other end of excessive force. We need the police to apprehend not judge.
Innocent people don't run from or resist the police.
Scared, confused, mentally ill or even intoxicated people run from or resist police at times. That doesn't necessarily mean they are guilty.
And it can't be an assumption that they always take a beating after running from or resisting. .
I agree. Good thing no-one here is actually arguing this.
Not succinctly. But there's been enough generalizations made in the dozens of 'police are the shits' threads where one might easily be left with such an impression.
I wonder what he did? He very well maybe did deserve it.
Are you serious....if a suspect is handcuffed with his hands behind his back DOES NOT deserve this no matter what he did. Why would I say this because he can't defend himself...pretty EASY for that cop to choke the shit out him huh.
What a world we live in....
Peace
Half serious. I was responding to JC's sarcasm.
With that said... did this guy just get caught beating his girlfriend, spitting on people, and sucker punching a cop? Did he just shoot somebody? If so... I'm not too concerned for the chokehold- he'd just be getting the beating he went and earned for himself in my opinion.
So you prefer a Judge Dredd style of policing? I don't. It is not the duty of police to punish, only to apprehend. If you bypass the right to a trial you give police open license for police brutality, and that is not a civilized way of doing business.
I prefer people don't break the law. I have no tolerance for criminals. As much as I agree that the video clearly displays excessive force... unless it is shown the guy is a random guy who's innocent of anything... I don't really care.
Don't break the law. Don't hurt people. And guess what? You'll never have to worry about a cop choking you out.
And what if the presumption of wrong doing changes over time? If we don't have a check on the police then we are giving them the ability to be judge and jury in the heat of the moment. It's a fine line in which you may find that the perception of criminal behavior starts bordering on the ridiculous and any one of us who aren't criminals could find ourselves on the other end of excessive force. We need the police to apprehend not judge.
I stated, unless it is shown the guy is a random guy who's innocent of anything... I don't really care.
I agree completely that we need a check on police and the officer, in reality, needs some measure of reform for this behaviour. I only reflected my sentiments regarding how I feel about some criminal taking his lumps for his criminal behaviour.
I wouldn't be a good cop. I'd be a shitty cop. For example... if some guy had, say, just beaten up some woman, thrown punches at me, tried to run a way, got in a tussle with me, and I finally secured him... I'd have a hard time not feeding him a couple shots for good measure. I tip my hat to any cop that restrains himself from decking some scumbag that needs to be decked.
I get the feeling that some on here would prefer I give the criminal a hug.
I don't think a criminal needs a hug. But I disagree that it is ok to pass judgment before affording the person the right to be charged, tried, and convicted or acquitted. That is not the job of the police. These are men and women who are professionals in investigation and apprehension. When we grant them greater responsibilities than they are trained for, and that the Constitution grants them, then we are placing the very ones that are there to protect us in a very difficult position.
Are we getting something out of this all-encompassing trip?
Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...
He was definitely a criminal. If we generalized and exaggerated your opinion on the issue the way you generalize and exaggerate ours I could say I get the feeling you think he deserved it because he was a criminal. :-w
Post edited by rgambs on
Monkey Driven, Call this Living?
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Surfing The far side of THE Sombrero Galaxy Posts: 18,199
What did you find awful about it? He was a criminal after all, would you prefer he been given a hug? :-w
Lol....you sir may have a good point.
Peace
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
He was definitely a criminal. If we generalized and exaggerated your opinion on the issue the way you generalize and exaggerate ours I could say I get the feeling you think he deserved it because he was a criminal. :-w
Are you serious?
Just the fact that you say 'yours' and 'ours' reflects how you see this issue.
I've been very critical of police when they have acted badly- the Cleveland case as well as this particular case. I've defended the police as well: Wilson and- on a smaller and local scale- the personal attacks on Musky by some of the champion contributors here.
You, sir, on the other hand have failed to exercise objectivity at any point of this month long exercise. You have placed yourself on one side of this issue and self-righteously flaunted your sheltered and naïve opinion every moment you have seen the opportunity.
* And I see you fumbled your response: you were quoted saying something else (obviously that means you slapped something down... scratched your pea brain... and then thought of a better and even more clever quip essentially saying the same stupid thing).
Comments
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
"Can't make this shit up"
So the follow up is that he won the intercontinental championship.
What a world we live in....
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
With that said... did this guy just get caught beating his girlfriend, spitting on people, and sucker punching a cop? Did he just shoot somebody? If so... I'm not too concerned for the chokehold- he'd just be getting the beating he went and earned for himself in my opinion.
He did. He was way ahead of his times.
Good selection here, ocean. Really good.
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
Don't break the law. Don't hurt people. And guess what? You'll never have to worry about a cop choking you out.
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...
I AM MINE
I agree completely that we need a check on police and the officer, in reality, needs some measure of reform for this behaviour. I only reflected my sentiments regarding how I feel about some criminal taking his lumps for his criminal behaviour.
I wouldn't be a good cop. I'd be a shitty cop. For example... if some guy had, say, just beaten up some woman, thrown punches at me, tried to run a way, got in a tussle with me, and I finally secured him... I'd have a hard time not feeding him a couple shots for good measure. I tip my hat to any cop that restrains himself from decking some scumbag that needs to be decked.
I get the feeling that some on here would prefer I give the criminal a hug.
Not to mention part of the post you responded to: "Don't break the law. Don't hurt people. And guess what? You'll never have to worry about a cop choking you out."
Sorry, Thirty Bills Unpaid, but there are far too many examples of hasty, heavy-handed police brutality with a limited amount of quality evidence (or none at all) for me to believe that to be true. Hell, just within the last few weeks you could probably find a few. A great example is the twelve-year-old black child who had an airsoft gun and was playing in the park with it, and the police who received a call about a "black person with a gun", arrived on the scene, drove onto the park itself, hardly had left the car, and shot and killed a child. Guess what? The kid didn't break the law. He didn't hurt people. And now he's dead.
I'm curious to see how people would respond to this thought experiment.
Scenario One: We in the public see a new video on YouTube showing one man putting another in a chokehold. The other man slowly falls to the ground, while panting, saying "I can't breathe, I can't breathe". Then he has a heart attack, and dies. Do we assume the dead man was innocent, or guilty?
Scenario Two: We in the public see a new video on YouTube showing one police officer putting a man in a chokehold. The man slowly falls to the ground, while panting, saying "I can't breathe, I can't breathe". Then he has a heart attack, and dies. Do we assume the dead man was innocent, or guilty?
For those of you who feel that scenario one calls for an assumption of innocence, and scenario two calls for an assumption of guilt: why put so much credence in the investigative efforts of the police force? Why should we in the public hold police officers to different standards than any other civilian? For me, as I see it, if you're going to give people the authority to do things which regular civilians don't - you need to INTRODUCE further checks and balances: not provide get out of jail cards (which, in this case, they're not even hypothetical get out of jail cards).
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
All I'm saying is that I don't feel too badly for pedophiles, rapists, arsonists, and murderers when cops don't handle them gently.
On my honor,
I will never betray my badge1,
my integrity, my character,
or the public trust.
I will always have
the courage to hold myself
and others accountable for our actions.
I will always uphold the constitution2
my community3 and the agency I serve.
Before any officer takes the Law Enforcement Oath of Honor, it is important that he/she understands what it means. An oath is a solemn pledge someone makes when he/she sincerely intends to do what he/she says.
Honor means that one's word is given as a guarantee.
Betray is defined as breaking faith with the public trust.
Badge is the symbol of your office.
Integrity is being the same person in both private and public life.
Character means the qualities that distinguish an individual.
Public trust is a charge of duty imposed in faith toward those you serve.
Courage is having the strength to withstand unethical pressure, fear or danger.
Accountability means that you are answerable and responsible to your oath of office.
Community is the jurisdiction and citizens served.
1 Insert appropriate term such as: badge; profession; country
2 Insert appropriate term such as: constitution, laws; monarch
3 Insert appropriate term such as: community; country; land; nationtheiacp.org/What-is-the-Law-Enforcement-Oath-of-Honor
Not helping an unconscious man does not seem to be upholding the public trust or holding yourself accountable for your actions. Nor does failing to render aid to a 12 year old that you just shot. It is like these officers don't recognize them as people. Something is seriously wrong here. I know some really good police officers and some truly lousy ones. I think some major house cleaning is in order.
Pretty awful.
When we grant them greater responsibilities than they are trained for, and that the Constitution grants them, then we are placing the very ones that are there to protect us in a very difficult position.
Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...
I AM MINE
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
Just the fact that you say 'yours' and 'ours' reflects how you see this issue.
I've been very critical of police when they have acted badly- the Cleveland case as well as this particular case. I've defended the police as well: Wilson and- on a smaller and local scale- the personal attacks on Musky by some of the champion contributors here.
You, sir, on the other hand have failed to exercise objectivity at any point of this month long exercise. You have placed yourself on one side of this issue and self-righteously flaunted your sheltered and naïve opinion every moment you have seen the opportunity.
* And I see you fumbled your response: you were quoted saying something else (obviously that means you slapped something down... scratched your pea brain... and then thought of a better and even more clever quip essentially saying the same stupid thing).
Good try!