America's Gun Violence

Halifax2TheMax

Just another “responsible” gun owner. And only charged with aggravated assault too.

Facebook fight between 'keyboard gangsters' ends in shooting - ABC News https://apple.news/AyP1f9EhuTzW3V3MLBtkybA

mcgruff10

oftenreading said:

mcgruff10 said:

Wait, the two of you are proclaiming that if someone breaks into my house illegally and takes them illegally I am partly to blame if those stolen firearms aren’t in a safe?  

Yes, of course. Any gun owner has a responsibility to take particular care with it. Are you actually claiming that’s not the case? It’s a lethal weapon with a decent street value, after all. Any doofus knows a gun would be a target in a burglary. 

If guns are left unsecured and are stolen then the person who didn’t secure them is partially responsible. It’s analogous to the situation where, if someone had confidential medical or financial information and they left it unsecured and it was stolen, they would be sanctioned.  

I wonder if there is a law on the books where a homeowner must secure their firearms in a safe.  
I still 100% disagree with your thinking that the gun owner is partially responsible.

oftenreading

I thought I recalled that during our lengthy discussions on changes to gun law that would be more broadly acceptable, pretty much everyone agreed with requiring appropriate and safe gun storage. 

cincybearcat

https://www-m.cnn.com/2018/08/10/americas/canada-shooting/index.html?r=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cnn.com%2F

Cmon Canada, stop with the cultural appropriation already.

oftenreading

The stats on gun thefts and consequent use in violent crime are horrifying. Not surprisingly, the NRA has systematically targeted laws requiring safe storage as well as laws aiming to make gun owners partially responsible if their negligence leads to injury or death, to the extent that some ridiculous cases of negligence never even result in charges, let alone convictions. 

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/sep/21/gun-theft-us-firearm-survey


https://newrepublic.com/article/121632/why-are-states-so-reluctant-prosecute-gun-negligence-crime

Halifax2TheMax

mcgruff10 said:

oftenreading said:

mcgruff10 said:

Wait, the two of you are proclaiming that if someone breaks into my house illegally and takes them illegally I am partly to blame if those stolen firearms aren’t in a safe?  

Yes, of course. Any gun owner has a responsibility to take particular care with it. Are you actually claiming that’s not the case? It’s a lethal weapon with a decent street value, after all. Any doofus knows a gun would be a target in a burglary. 

If guns are left unsecured and are stolen then the person who didn’t secure them is partially responsible. It’s analogous to the situation where, if someone had confidential medical or financial information and they left it unsecured and it was stolen, they would be sanctioned.  

I wonder if there is a law on the books where a homeowner must secure their firearms in a safe.  
I still 100% disagree with your thinking that the gun owner is partially responsible.

If I remember correctly, you have multiple firearms, correct? What do you do when you go on vacation? Leave them laying around the House unsecured? What about on a work day when no one is home? Same? What about when it’s just the kids in the house, maybe with their friends who don’t come from a gun cultured household? Long guns or hand guns? Just casually placed around the house, in case? A corner here, under the bed there, on a shelf here, under a cushion there? I’m really trying to understand this “responsible” gun owner thing. And if they’re for “protection,” why wouldn’t they be locked up or secured when you’re not home? Somebody might chase you into the house or you might surprise a burglar? Wouldn’t it be “safer” to carry on your person? Do you know how many guns you have and where they are? When was the last time you took inventory?

Spiritual_Chaos

mcgruff10 said:

oftenreading said:

mcgruff10 said:

Wait, the two of you are proclaiming that if someone breaks into my house illegally and takes them illegally I am partly to blame if those stolen firearms aren’t in a safe?  

Yes, of course. Any gun owner has a responsibility to take particular care with it. Are you actually claiming that’s not the case? It’s a lethal weapon with a decent street value, after all. Any doofus knows a gun would be a target in a burglary. 

If guns are left unsecured and are stolen then the person who didn’t secure them is partially responsible. It’s analogous to the situation where, if someone had confidential medical or financial information and they left it unsecured and it was stolen, they would be sanctioned.  

I wonder if there is a law on the books where a homeowner must secure their firearms in a safe.  
I still 100% disagree with your thinking that the gun owner is partially responsible.

The law in Sweden - a saner country then the US as we all know :P     

Storage, movement and transportation of weapons

When applying for a weapon license, you must specify how and where your weapons are stored when not in use. The storage space must be approved or meet the corresponding requirements.

 You who are authorized to possess firearms are, according to the general rule of the law of arms, obliged to take care of the weapons and keep them under such a view that there is no risk of unauthorized access to them.

 Storage of weapons at home
When firearms are not used, you must store them in approved safety cabinets that meet the requirements of SS 3492 or SSF 3492. An approved cabinet is fitted with a sticker SS 3492 / SSF3492, placed inside the cabinet. If you store a large number of weapons, or especially dangerous firearms, the police will in some cases place higher demands on the custody.

Halifax2TheMax

Spiritual_Chaos said:

mcgruff10 said:

oftenreading said:

mcgruff10 said:

Wait, the two of you are proclaiming that if someone breaks into my house illegally and takes them illegally I am partly to blame if those stolen firearms aren’t in a safe?  

Yes, of course. Any gun owner has a responsibility to take particular care with it. Are you actually claiming that’s not the case? It’s a lethal weapon with a decent street value, after all. Any doofus knows a gun would be a target in a burglary. 

If guns are left unsecured and are stolen then the person who didn’t secure them is partially responsible. It’s analogous to the situation where, if someone had confidential medical or financial information and they left it unsecured and it was stolen, they would be sanctioned.  

I wonder if there is a law on the books where a homeowner must secure their firearms in a safe.  
I still 100% disagree with your thinking that the gun owner is partially responsible.

In Sweden - a saner country then the US as we all know :P     

Storage, movement and transportation of weapons

When applying for a weapon license, you must specify how and where your weapons are stored when not in use. The storage space must be approved or meet the corresponding requirements.

 You who are authorized to possess firearms are, according to the general rule of the law of arms, obliged to take care of the weapons and keep them under such a view that there is no risk of unauthorized access to them.

 Storage of weapons at home
When firearms are not used, you must store them in approved safety cabinets that meet the requirements of SS 3492 or SSF 3492. An approved cabinet is fitted with a sticker SS 3492 / SSF3492, placed inside the cabinet. If you store a large number of weapons, or especially dangerous firearms, the police will in some cases place higher demands on the custody.

But then the government knows exactly where they are and can come and take them anytime.

Spiritual_Chaos

Halifax2TheMax said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

mcgruff10 said:

oftenreading said:

mcgruff10 said:

Wait, the two of you are proclaiming that if someone breaks into my house illegally and takes them illegally I am partly to blame if those stolen firearms aren’t in a safe?  

Yes, of course. Any gun owner has a responsibility to take particular care with it. Are you actually claiming that’s not the case? It’s a lethal weapon with a decent street value, after all. Any doofus knows a gun would be a target in a burglary. 

If guns are left unsecured and are stolen then the person who didn’t secure them is partially responsible. It’s analogous to the situation where, if someone had confidential medical or financial information and they left it unsecured and it was stolen, they would be sanctioned.  

I wonder if there is a law on the books where a homeowner must secure their firearms in a safe.  
I still 100% disagree with your thinking that the gun owner is partially responsible.

In Sweden - a saner country then the US as we all know :P     

Storage, movement and transportation of weapons

When applying for a weapon license, you must specify how and where your weapons are stored when not in use. The storage space must be approved or meet the corresponding requirements.

 You who are authorized to possess firearms are, according to the general rule of the law of arms, obliged to take care of the weapons and keep them under such a view that there is no risk of unauthorized access to them.

 Storage of weapons at home
When firearms are not used, you must store them in approved safety cabinets that meet the requirements of SS 3492 or SSF 3492. An approved cabinet is fitted with a sticker SS 3492 / SSF3492, placed inside the cabinet. If you store a large number of weapons, or especially dangerous firearms, the police will in some cases place higher demands on the custody.

But then the government knows exactly where they are and can come and take them anytime.

I get so turned on when you roleplay as Unsung.

my2hands

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

mcgruff10 said:

oftenreading said:

mcgruff10 said:

Wait, the two of you are proclaiming that if someone breaks into my house illegally and takes them illegally I am partly to blame if those stolen firearms aren’t in a safe?  

Yes, of course. Any gun owner has a responsibility to take particular care with it. Are you actually claiming that’s not the case? It’s a lethal weapon with a decent street value, after all. Any doofus knows a gun would be a target in a burglary. 

If guns are left unsecured and are stolen then the person who didn’t secure them is partially responsible. It’s analogous to the situation where, if someone had confidential medical or financial information and they left it unsecured and it was stolen, they would be sanctioned.  

I wonder if there is a law on the books where a homeowner must secure their firearms in a safe.  
I still 100% disagree with your thinking that the gun owner is partially responsible.

In Sweden - a saner country then the US as we all know :P     

Storage, movement and transportation of weapons

When applying for a weapon license, you must specify how and where your weapons are stored when not in use. The storage space must be approved or meet the corresponding requirements.

 You who are authorized to possess firearms are, according to the general rule of the law of arms, obliged to take care of the weapons and keep them under such a view that there is no risk of unauthorized access to them.

 Storage of weapons at home
When firearms are not used, you must store them in approved safety cabinets that meet the requirements of SS 3492 or SSF 3492. An approved cabinet is fitted with a sticker SS 3492 / SSF3492, placed inside the cabinet. If you store a large number of weapons, or especially dangerous firearms, the police will in some cases place higher demands on the custody.

But then the government knows exactly where they are and can come and take them anytime.

I get so turned on when you roleplay as Unsung.

Lol

mcgruff10

Spiritual_Chaos said:

mcgruff10 said:

oftenreading said:

mcgruff10 said:

Wait, the two of you are proclaiming that if someone breaks into my house illegally and takes them illegally I am partly to blame if those stolen firearms aren’t in a safe?  

Yes, of course. Any gun owner has a responsibility to take particular care with it. Are you actually claiming that’s not the case? It’s a lethal weapon with a decent street value, after all. Any doofus knows a gun would be a target in a burglary. 

If guns are left unsecured and are stolen then the person who didn’t secure them is partially responsible. It’s analogous to the situation where, if someone had confidential medical or financial information and they left it unsecured and it was stolen, they would be sanctioned.  

I wonder if there is a law on the books where a homeowner must secure their firearms in a safe.  
I still 100% disagree with your thinking that the gun owner is partially responsible.

The law in Sweden - a saner country then the US as we all know :P     

Storage, movement and transportation of weapons

When applying for a weapon license, you must specify how and where your weapons are stored when not in use. The storage space must be approved or meet the corresponding requirements.

 You who are authorized to possess firearms are, according to the general rule of the law of arms, obliged to take care of the weapons and keep them under such a view that there is no risk of unauthorized access to them.

 Storage of weapons at home
When firearms are not used, you must store them in approved safety cabinets that meet the requirements of SS 3492 or SSF 3492. An approved cabinet is fitted with a sticker SS 3492 / SSF3492, placed inside the cabinet. If you store a large number of weapons, or especially dangerous firearms, the police will in some cases place higher demands on the custody.

I was talking about the US.   
Halifax, all of my firearms are locked up nice and tight. Trigger locks on them, keys are stored in a separate place,  bolts removed , I also have a safe.  

Spiritual_Chaos

mcgruff10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

mcgruff10 said:

oftenreading said:

mcgruff10 said:

Wait, the two of you are proclaiming that if someone breaks into my house illegally and takes them illegally I am partly to blame if those stolen firearms aren’t in a safe?  

Yes, of course. Any gun owner has a responsibility to take particular care with it. Are you actually claiming that’s not the case? It’s a lethal weapon with a decent street value, after all. Any doofus knows a gun would be a target in a burglary. 

If guns are left unsecured and are stolen then the person who didn’t secure them is partially responsible. It’s analogous to the situation where, if someone had confidential medical or financial information and they left it unsecured and it was stolen, they would be sanctioned.  

I wonder if there is a law on the books where a homeowner must secure their firearms in a safe.  
I still 100% disagree with your thinking that the gun owner is partially responsible.

The law in Sweden - a saner country then the US as we all know :P     

Storage, movement and transportation of weapons

When applying for a weapon license, you must specify how and where your weapons are stored when not in use. The storage space must be approved or meet the corresponding requirements.

 You who are authorized to possess firearms are, according to the general rule of the law of arms, obliged to take care of the weapons and keep them under such a view that there is no risk of unauthorized access to them.

 Storage of weapons at home
When firearms are not used, you must store them in approved safety cabinets that meet the requirements of SS 3492 or SSF 3492. An approved cabinet is fitted with a sticker SS 3492 / SSF3492, placed inside the cabinet. If you store a large number of weapons, or especially dangerous firearms, the police will in some cases place higher demands on the custody.

I was talking about the US.   
Halifax, all of my firearms are locked up nice and tight. Trigger locks on them, keys are stored in a separate place,  bolts removed , I also have a safe.  

And i compared the US to a sane country.

Halifax2TheMax

mcgruff10 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

mcgruff10 said:

oftenreading said:

mcgruff10 said:

Wait, the two of you are proclaiming that if someone breaks into my house illegally and takes them illegally I am partly to blame if those stolen firearms aren’t in a safe?  

Yes, of course. Any gun owner has a responsibility to take particular care with it. Are you actually claiming that’s not the case? It’s a lethal weapon with a decent street value, after all. Any doofus knows a gun would be a target in a burglary. 

If guns are left unsecured and are stolen then the person who didn’t secure them is partially responsible. It’s analogous to the situation where, if someone had confidential medical or financial information and they left it unsecured and it was stolen, they would be sanctioned.  

I wonder if there is a law on the books where a homeowner must secure their firearms in a safe.  
I still 100% disagree with your thinking that the gun owner is partially responsible.

The law in Sweden - a saner country then the US as we all know :P     

Storage, movement and transportation of weapons

When applying for a weapon license, you must specify how and where your weapons are stored when not in use. The storage space must be approved or meet the corresponding requirements.

 You who are authorized to possess firearms are, according to the general rule of the law of arms, obliged to take care of the weapons and keep them under such a view that there is no risk of unauthorized access to them.

 Storage of weapons at home
When firearms are not used, you must store them in approved safety cabinets that meet the requirements of SS 3492 or SSF 3492. An approved cabinet is fitted with a sticker SS 3492 / SSF3492, placed inside the cabinet. If you store a large number of weapons, or especially dangerous firearms, the police will in some cases place higher demands on the custody.

I was talking about the US.   
Halifax, all of my firearms are locked up nice and tight. Trigger locks on them, keys are stored in a separate place,  bolts removed , I also have a safe.  

Good, as they should be.

PJ_Soul

mcgruff10 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

mcgruff10 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Just another “responsible” gun owner in ‘Murica.

Police arrest 13-year-old boy in fatal shooting of boy, 14 - ABC News https://apple.news/Agvg6Zn1WT6emAKBNZmehrQ

How could you call them responsible if they can’t even legally own a firearm?  

A “responsible” gun owner was “responsible” somewhere along the way until they weren’t.

Perhaps it was stolen?

I personally kind of blame stolen weapons on the legal owners who had it stolen as well as the person who stole it (and particularly those who made it easy to steal, i.e. not locked up like Fort Knox). When there isn't a gun to steal then someone can't steal it. It's one of the reasons I think it's pretty lame to own guns. But if one must for some reason, then yeah, they shouldn't really be "stealable", assuming we're talking about regular thieves and not the Italian Job.

unsung

Another responsible hypocrite.

https://www.wsbtv.com/news/local/former-congressional-candidate-accused-of-killing-campaign-treasurer/811132728

HesCalledDyer

Surprised you’re not defending here for “just exercising her rights.”

Oh yeah, she’s a democrat so that’s all you wanted to point out.

cincybearcat

See, she knew guns were too easy to get. And she proved her point.

Thirty Bills Unpaid

unsung said:

Another responsible hypocrite.

https://www.wsbtv.com/news/local/former-congressional-candidate-accused-of-killing-campaign-treasurer/811132728

Well thank gawd the laws are so lenient so she could murder her treasurer!

I think Sean Davis is making a good case for gun reform. Further... it's the classic tale of the 'responsible gun owner turns irresponsible'.

Don't worry, Unsung. There will never be any gun reform in the US. If Sandy Hook couldn't get anything done (or Vegas for that matter)... nothing will.

If guns can survive those blatant demonstrations demanding some measure of gun control then nothing can. 

unsung

HesCalledDyer said:

Surprised you’re not defending here for “just exercising her rights.”

Oh yeah, she’s a democrat so that’s all you wanted to point out.

Nobody has a right to murder, do you think otherwise?

josevolution

unsung said:

Another responsible hypocrite.

https://www.wsbtv.com/news/local/former-congressional-candidate-accused-of-killing-campaign-treasurer/811132728

Ok How many of these occurrences have happened compared to the true gun owners who do go the irresponsible route ? What says you for every one of these I’d say there’s 20 that fall in the latter of these occurrences....