America's Gun Violence

jnimhaoileoin

unsung said:

jnimhaoileoin said:

unsung said:

PJ_Soul said:

unsung said:

PJ_Soul said:

unsung said:

Go Beavers said:

unsung said:

jnimhaoileoin said:

mace1229 said:

And to answer your question, no its not because they can kill. Its just fun. Why aremodel rockets fun? I dont know, they just are. its fun to light a rocket and watch it launch hundreds of feet up. Its fun to shoot clay targets and watch them shatter when you hit them.Most of my guns are .22, essentially the smallest caliber, so it isnt about killing capabilities. 
Which I guess is why I'm okay with a lot of gun restrictions. I can still target shoot with smaller magazine limits, I can wait 10 days before shooting, I can pass a background check. 

Ok, of course bows and arrows were created to kill also but I don't think we need fear their use in mass murders.

I still don't understand why it's important for you to shoot with live rounds. Would it be less fun for you to shoot with a paint ball or even some kind of rubber bullet?

I'm genuinely trying to understand this gun culture that is so alien to me

When discussing mass murder with a leftist it is so hard to take them seriously.

And this is why discussing guns with right wingers is difficult. Someone’s asking questions out of sincere curiousity and your response is to shut down the discussion, not expand it. 

I made the assumption that since the antis are always telling me how much training should be needed it was obvious that in order to be trained you'd have to use real ammo.

You can't really train things like marksmanship with paintballs.

She wasn't talking about training.

Ugh, that ban wasn't very long at all.

Is that what you want for people that you don't agree with?

Awful boring place to be.

Nope, just you.

You spend your time in awful boring places? Weird.

No, I prefer to have discussions from many points of view, not just those that I agree with.  I would also never request that someone be banned either.  

But you don't want to have a discussion with someone you deem a 'leftist'. Make up your mind

I'm here aren't I?  Demanding that I go along with a ban is not a discussion.

I don't know anything about a ban. I know that you suggested talking to me was pointless because of the political orientation you perceived me to have

unsung

Gern Blansten said:

unsung said:

Narrative: Fuck the NRA, they have blood on their hands.

Reality: Feds blew the background check, shooter stopped by NRA member.


I actually hate that I have to defend the NRA.  I'd never send them a dollar.

I don't think many people have issues with NRA members.  The NRA members are much more reasonable then the NRA leadership.

Wayne LaPierre should be beaten to death publicly.  He is an absolute piece of shit and I can't imagine that subsequent leaders of the NRA will be as evil as that piece of shit.

http://www.politifact.com/wisconsin/statements/2015/mar/18/lena-taylor/most-nra-members-back-background-checks-all-gun-pu/

The majority of NRA members actually hold what you would consider "liberal" views toward gun registration and licensing.

Careful, I got 30 days for speaking ill of someone's impending death, you certainly should not be advocating murder.

PJ_Soul

I don't think anyone wants their children to live in a place where they can go watch the government beat people to death anyway.

Gern Blansten

unsung said:

Gern Blansten said:

unsung said:

Narrative: Fuck the NRA, they have blood on their hands.

Reality: Feds blew the background check, shooter stopped by NRA member.


I actually hate that I have to defend the NRA.  I'd never send them a dollar.

I don't think many people have issues with NRA members.  The NRA members are much more reasonable then the NRA leadership.

Wayne LaPierre should be beaten to death publicly.  He is an absolute piece of shit and I can't imagine that subsequent leaders of the NRA will be as evil as that piece of shit.

http://www.politifact.com/wisconsin/statements/2015/mar/18/lena-taylor/most-nra-members-back-background-checks-all-gun-pu/

The majority of NRA members actually hold what you would consider "liberal" views toward gun registration and licensing.

Careful, I got 30 days for speaking ill of someone's impending death, you certainly should not be advocating murder.

You were celebrating the impending death of a national hero.  I'm talking about an evil piece of shit.

unsung

Gern Blansten said:

unsung said:

Gern Blansten said:

unsung said:

Narrative: Fuck the NRA, they have blood on their hands.

Reality: Feds blew the background check, shooter stopped by NRA member.


I actually hate that I have to defend the NRA.  I'd never send them a dollar.

I don't think many people have issues with NRA members.  The NRA members are much more reasonable then the NRA leadership.

Wayne LaPierre should be beaten to death publicly.  He is an absolute piece of shit and I can't imagine that subsequent leaders of the NRA will be as evil as that piece of shit.

http://www.politifact.com/wisconsin/statements/2015/mar/18/lena-taylor/most-nra-members-back-background-checks-all-gun-pu/

The majority of NRA members actually hold what you would consider "liberal" views toward gun registration and licensing.

Careful, I got 30 days for speaking ill of someone's impending death, you certainly should not be advocating murder.

You were celebrating the impending death of a national hero.  I'm talking about an evil piece of shit.

We can agree to disagree on that status.  That war monger used those points long ago.

RYME

My point is that a guy that was sitting in his living room next door to the church minding his own business without shoes on came out and ended the threat because he was armed and knew what he was doing and took action.
Back to my other question.  A lot of people want to paint at the NRA as an evil entity. I am an NRA member. How many National Rifle Association members are mass shooters?  Which one of these Mass Shooters is an NRA member? My point is NRA members are not the people you need to worry about. By and large we are law-abiding citizens who mind our own business.

Gern Blansten

RYME said:

My point is that a guy that was sitting in his living room next door to the church minding his own business without shoes on came out and ended the threat because he was armed and knew what he was doing and took action.
Back to my other question.  A lot of people want to paint at the NRA as an evil entity. I am an NRA member. How many National Rifle Association members are mass shooters?  Which one of these Mass Shooters is an NRA member? My point is NRA members are not the people you need to worry about. By and large we are law-abiding citizens who mind our own business.

How many mass shooters are not gun owners?  

RYME

Gern Blansten said:

RYME said:

My point is that a guy that was sitting in his living room next door to the church minding his own business without shoes on came out and ended the threat because he was armed and knew what he was doing and took action.
Back to my other question.  A lot of people want to paint at the NRA as an evil entity. I am an NRA member. How many National Rifle Association members are mass shooters?  Which one of these Mass Shooters is an NRA member? My point is NRA members are not the people you need to worry about. By and large we are law-abiding citizens who mind our own business.

How many mass shooters are not gun owners?  

How many more people would this attacker have killed if this guy didn't come out from his house and do something about it?

dignin

Gern Blansten

RYME said:

Gern Blansten said:

RYME said:

My point is that a guy that was sitting in his living room next door to the church minding his own business without shoes on came out and ended the threat because he was armed and knew what he was doing and took action.
Back to my other question.  A lot of people want to paint at the NRA as an evil entity. I am an NRA member. How many National Rifle Association members are mass shooters?  Which one of these Mass Shooters is an NRA member? My point is NRA members are not the people you need to worry about. By and large we are law-abiding citizens who mind our own business.

How many mass shooters are not gun owners?  

How many more people would this attacker have killed if this guy didn't come out from his house and do something about it?

No idea....maybe none?  Maybe hundreds like tRump said.

My guess is that the police weren't too far away at that point.

Bentleyspop

jnimhaoileoin said:

unsung said:

jnimhaoileoin said:

mace1229 said:

And to answer your question, no its not because they can kill. Its just fun. Why aremodel rockets fun? I dont know, they just are. its fun to light a rocket and watch it launch hundreds of feet up. Its fun to shoot clay targets and watch them shatter when you hit them.Most of my guns are .22, essentially the smallest caliber, so it isnt about killing capabilities. 
Which I guess is why I'm okay with a lot of gun restrictions. I can still target shoot with smaller magazine limits, I can wait 10 days before shooting, I can pass a background check. 

Ok, of course bows and arrows were created to kill also but I don't think we need fear their use in mass murders.

I still don't understand why it's important for you to shoot with live rounds. Would it be less fun for you to shoot with a paint ball or even some kind of rubber bullet?

I'm genuinely trying to understand this gun culture that is so alien to me

When discussing mass murder with a leftist it is so hard to take them seriously.

What the fuck are you talking about?

It's simple...don't try and have a conversation with a leftist, a commie, a pinko, a red, or a socialist and maybe just maybe President Eisenhower will be successful.

Go Beavers

RYME said:

My point is that a guy that was sitting in his living room next door to the church minding his own business without shoes on came out and ended the threat because he was armed and knew what he was doing and took action.
Back to my other question.  A lot of people want to paint at the NRA as an evil entity. I am an NRA member. How many National Rifle Association members are mass shooters?  Which one of these Mass Shooters is an NRA member? My point is NRA members are not the people you need to worry about. By and large we are law-abiding citizens who mind our own business.

The NRA lobbies for less restriction on gun access. We have more mass murders and a higher gun homicide rate in the US because of the proliferation of guns and the ease of purchasing a gun. I think the issue with the NRA is about their legal side, and less with their members, although the members enable the lobbying. 

PJPOWER

RYME said:

Gern Blansten said:

RYME said:

My point is that a guy that was sitting in his living room next door to the church minding his own business without shoes on came out and ended the threat because he was armed and knew what he was doing and took action.
Back to my other question.  A lot of people want to paint at the NRA as an evil entity. I am an NRA member. How many National Rifle Association members are mass shooters?  Which one of these Mass Shooters is an NRA member? My point is NRA members are not the people you need to worry about. By and large we are law-abiding citizens who mind our own business.

How many mass shooters are not gun owners?  

How many more people would this attacker have killed if this guy didn't come out from his house and do something about it?

There is no way of knowing, that is why you cannot have stats on lives saved by gun owners even though they do (most likely) save lives occasionally.

mace1229

Marksmanship is needed for anyone shooting a gun. If you're a hunter a poor shot will just wound the animal and make it run off to not be found, only to suffer and slowly die. Actually happens a lot even with practice and training, but would be a lot more without it.
I've never been hunting, but almost everyone I know who has can tell a story about how one got a way. Well, it only got away to go die slowly somewhere else.
One of the saddest things I saw was a dead deer at the edge of a lake with an arrow in it. Poor thing ran off to get a drink after it was hit and the hunter never found him. I'm not against hunting, but its sad to see a deer go to waste like that.
So yes, aside from just other safety issues of not practicing how to properly shoot a gun, marksmanship is a good thing.

jeffbr

jnimhaoileoin said:

Gern Blansten said:

unsung said:

Go Beavers said:

unsung said:

jnimhaoileoin said:

mace1229 said:

And to answer your question, no its not because they can kill. Its just fun. Why aremodel rockets fun? I dont know, they just are. its fun to light a rocket and watch it launch hundreds of feet up. Its fun to shoot clay targets and watch them shatter when you hit them.Most of my guns are .22, essentially the smallest caliber, so it isnt about killing capabilities. 
Which I guess is why I'm okay with a lot of gun restrictions. I can still target shoot with smaller magazine limits, I can wait 10 days before shooting, I can pass a background check. 

Ok, of course bows and arrows were created to kill also but I don't think we need fear their use in mass murders.

I still don't understand why it's important for you to shoot with live rounds. Would it be less fun for you to shoot with a paint ball or even some kind of rubber bullet?

I'm genuinely trying to understand this gun culture that is so alien to me

When discussing mass murder with a leftist it is so hard to take them seriously.

And this is why discussing guns with right wingers is difficult. Someone’s asking questions out of sincere curiousity and your response is to shut down the discussion, not expand it. 

I made the assumption that since the antis are always telling me how much training should be needed it was obvious that in order to be trained you'd have to use real ammo.

You can't really train things like marksmanship with paintballs.

Marksmanship?  

I don't see a need to train gun owners on marksmanship.  That's the military's job

Exactly

Not exactly. I personally hope that all gun owners are able to hit what they're aiming at. I don't understand why someone would downplay the need to be proficient with whatever tool you're using.

Gern Blansten

https://twitter.com/ericabuist/status/927281277719465986

Brilliant

Gern Blansten

jeffbr said:

jnimhaoileoin said:

Gern Blansten said:

unsung said:

Go Beavers said:

unsung said:

jnimhaoileoin said:

mace1229 said:

And to answer your question, no its not because they can kill. Its just fun. Why aremodel rockets fun? I dont know, they just are. its fun to light a rocket and watch it launch hundreds of feet up. Its fun to shoot clay targets and watch them shatter when you hit them.Most of my guns are .22, essentially the smallest caliber, so it isnt about killing capabilities. 
Which I guess is why I'm okay with a lot of gun restrictions. I can still target shoot with smaller magazine limits, I can wait 10 days before shooting, I can pass a background check. 

Ok, of course bows and arrows were created to kill also but I don't think we need fear their use in mass murders.

I still don't understand why it's important for you to shoot with live rounds. Would it be less fun for you to shoot with a paint ball or even some kind of rubber bullet?

I'm genuinely trying to understand this gun culture that is so alien to me

When discussing mass murder with a leftist it is so hard to take them seriously.

And this is why discussing guns with right wingers is difficult. Someone’s asking questions out of sincere curiousity and your response is to shut down the discussion, not expand it. 

I made the assumption that since the antis are always telling me how much training should be needed it was obvious that in order to be trained you'd have to use real ammo.

You can't really train things like marksmanship with paintballs.

Marksmanship?  

I don't see a need to train gun owners on marksmanship.  That's the military's job

Exactly

Not exactly. I personally hope that all gun owners are able to hit what they're aiming at. I don't understand why someone would downplay the need to be proficient with whatever tool you're using.

The inference was that people should be required to be trained with marksmanship.  Yes, I understand the need/desire for a hunter to want to practice his/her shot.

I was referring to the idea that those in favor of gun control/registration/licensing, etc. would require marksmanship training.  I, for one, don't really care if you are a good shot.  I just believe you should have proper instruction on how to handle and store the weapon before you get a license.  Kind of like how we require people to learn traffic laws before we give them a driver's license.

mace1229

Gern Blansten said:

https://twitter.com/ericabuist/status/927281277719465986

Brilliant

That actually made me laugh.

PJPOWER

Gern Blansten said:

jeffbr said:

jnimhaoileoin said:

Gern Blansten said:

unsung said:

Go Beavers said:

unsung said:

jnimhaoileoin said:

mace1229 said:

And to answer your question, no its not because they can kill. Its just fun. Why aremodel rockets fun? I dont know, they just are. its fun to light a rocket and watch it launch hundreds of feet up. Its fun to shoot clay targets and watch them shatter when you hit them.Most of my guns are .22, essentially the smallest caliber, so it isnt about killing capabilities. 
Which I guess is why I'm okay with a lot of gun restrictions. I can still target shoot with smaller magazine limits, I can wait 10 days before shooting, I can pass a background check. 

Ok, of course bows and arrows were created to kill also but I don't think we need fear their use in mass murders.

I still don't understand why it's important for you to shoot with live rounds. Would it be less fun for you to shoot with a paint ball or even some kind of rubber bullet?

I'm genuinely trying to understand this gun culture that is so alien to me

When discussing mass murder with a leftist it is so hard to take them seriously.

And this is why discussing guns with right wingers is difficult. Someone’s asking questions out of sincere curiousity and your response is to shut down the discussion, not expand it. 

I made the assumption that since the antis are always telling me how much training should be needed it was obvious that in order to be trained you'd have to use real ammo.

You can't really train things like marksmanship with paintballs.

Marksmanship?  

I don't see a need to train gun owners on marksmanship.  That's the military's job

Exactly

Not exactly. I personally hope that all gun owners are able to hit what they're aiming at. I don't understand why someone would downplay the need to be proficient with whatever tool you're using.

The inference was that people should be required to be trained with marksmanship.  Yes, I understand the need/desire for a hunter to want to practice his/her shot.

I was referring to the idea that those in favor of gun control/registration/licensing, etc. would require marksmanship training.  I, for one, don't really care if you are a good shot.  I just believe you should have proper instruction on how to handle and store the weapon before you get a license.  Kind of like how we require people to learn traffic laws before we give them a driver's license.

I totally agree with your last paragraph, and I would say that a large portion of gun owners do get that kind of education.  You are required to have it to obtain a CCW or even to hunt legally(at least in Texas).  I’m not a paying member of the NRA, but they are probably the most active group in providing the educational trainings.  

PJPOWER

Gern Blansten said:

https://twitter.com/ericabuist/status/927281277719465986

Brilliant

Haha, funny!  “But no one is saying that we should ban guns”