education is where it needs to start. but since education is funded and mandated by government, and government is in bed with the NRA, that won't ever happen.
I always wonder how someone that could do such a horrific thing could not have given off some clues about their mental instability.
Please don't equate violence and mental "instability"/mental illness.
Come on. I'm not saying mental instability equals violence. I'm saying to commit violence in this manner, something is wrong with your way of thinking and I would think your behavior beforehand would likely indicate something, at least in hindsight.
here is the part i don't get. they said he checked on Thursday. Are you telling me no one cleaned his room and/or saw anything in that room since Thursday? it is that easy to hide high powered rifles and ammo?
Never mind how about the fact that he was able to just get all those items into casino ? he could of just left the do not disturbe sign on door they absolutly respect those ....
Could have easily brought that stuff in a golf bag. Definitely big enough and no one would look twice at it.
So the answer is to do what to avoid this kind of scenario ?
For now I don't think hotels should do anything. I don't want to live in a police state and that is what happened with the Patriot Act. Now if these type of hotel shootings continue then I think the hotels would need to act.
We need stronger gun control legislation for sure.
What truly shows our ignorance as a country is that we're looking at this from the perspective of how the hotel could do a better job preventing this guy from hauling in his Normandy Beach invasion do it yourself kit. You're absolutely right, hotels shouldn't do anything because they aren't the root cause. Whatever they do is just a stop gap.
It's like we do the opposite of what should be done. Mass shooting happens, buy more guns. We're willing to spend millions, probably billions, on personnel and hardware which then only fuels the same industry who is leading us into the burning building and does nothing to address the problem.
We've been focused on school and workplace shootings so much that our response and prevention of them has become better, but people are still being killed and will always be killed. This is the evolution of the mass shooter. Find more victims with less chance for survival based on geography and vulnerability. How about for once we attack the problem at the source; gun manufacturing and ownership, rules, laws and policies.
When meth labs started popping up across the country and people were blowing themselves up left and right in their mobile shit holes we determined that limiting and tracking the purchase of pseudoephedrine would help prevent the home lab issue. Unfortunately Mexico had the super labs and no restrictions so production there peaked, but it was successful in the US.
How many mass shootings will it take before we can do something similar with firearms and ammunition? Limiting daily, weekly, monthly and annual purchases of ammo. What about the amount of guns you can own (probably never happen)?
These are things as gun owners that we don't want people to take away from us.
When I shot competitively I would go through 1000 rounds a week easy. It was my hobby and pastime. Put a limit on my purchases and I can't do any practicing.
You could allow me to buy and store them at my local gun shop though, that might be viable for me but not the gun shop.
It's a tough thing to figure out but what is a happy medium?
I always wonder how someone that could do such a horrific thing could not have given off some clues about their mental instability.
Please don't equate violence and mental "instability"/mental illness.
Come on. I'm not saying mental instability equals violence. I'm saying to commit violence in this manner, something is wrong with your way of thinking and I would think your behavior beforehand would likely indicate something, at least in hindsight.
here is the part i don't get. they said he checked on Thursday. Are you telling me no one cleaned his room and/or saw anything in that room since Thursday? it is that easy to hide high powered rifles and ammo?
Never mind how about the fact that he was able to just get all those items into casino ? he could of just left the do not disturbe sign on door they absolutly respect those ....
Could have easily brought that stuff in a golf bag. Definitely big enough and no one would look twice at it.
So the answer is to do what to avoid this kind of scenario ?
For now I don't think hotels should do anything. I don't want to live in a police state and that is what happened with the Patriot Act. Now if these type of hotel shootings continue then I think the hotels would need to act.
We need stronger gun control legislation for sure.
Stronger legislation lol like that could ever happen remember sandy hook nothing nada zilch happened after that event , tell me what's kepping the next mass murdered from taking aim from another hotel why is it that we have to go thru security check points at every airport , it seems to me that if hotels made it imposible for you to just walk in with as many guns & ammo lives could be saved ...But the fear of a police state is worse than anything that could be done to save lives .....
Our solution shouldn't need to come down to installing metal detectors and searches every where we can go. That's ludicrous and dumb. Everything we do to prevent violence is a response. When will we take the initiative? It's like we're on the other side of the looking glass and a more advanced civilization is studying our absurd responses to the escalating experiment they've set up. Maybe this time they'll get it....nope. Keeping running on the hamster wheel.
Yes i agree we shouldn't have to be searched at every event but at this juncture there is no alternative , no new laws will ever be in place to help in this matter NRA have bought & payed for our governing bodies they rule not us pee on's just wait till the silencers are legal that will happen before any anti laws !
I always wonder how someone that could do such a horrific thing could not have given off some clues about their mental instability.
Please don't equate violence and mental "instability"/mental illness.
Come on. I'm not saying mental instability equals violence. I'm saying to commit violence in this manner, something is wrong with your way of thinking and I would think your behavior beforehand would likely indicate something, at least in hindsight.
here is the part i don't get. they said he checked on Thursday. Are you telling me no one cleaned his room and/or saw anything in that room since Thursday? it is that easy to hide high powered rifles and ammo?
Never mind how about the fact that he was able to just get all those items into casino ? he could of just left the do not disturbe sign on door they absolutly respect those ....
Could have easily brought that stuff in a golf bag. Definitely big enough and no one would look twice at it.
So the answer is to do what to avoid this kind of scenario ?
For now I don't think hotels should do anything. I don't want to live in a police state and that is what happened with the Patriot Act. Now if these type of hotel shootings continue then I think the hotels would need to act.
We need stronger gun control legislation for sure.
What truly shows our ignorance as a country is that we're looking at this from the perspective of how the hotel could do a better job preventing this guy from hauling in his Normandy Beach invasion do it yourself kit. You're absolutely right, hotels shouldn't do anything because they aren't the root cause. Whatever they do is just a stop gap.
It's like we do the opposite of what should be done. Mass shooting happens, buy more guns. We're willing to spend millions, probably billions, on personnel and hardware which then only fuels the same industry who is leading us into the burning building and does nothing to address the problem.
We've been focused on school and workplace shootings so much that our response and prevention of them has become better, but people are still being killed and will always be killed. This is the evolution of the mass shooter. Find more victims with less chance for survival based on geography and vulnerability. How about for once we attack the problem at the source; gun manufacturing and ownership, rules, laws and policies.
When meth labs started popping up across the country and people were blowing themselves up left and right in their mobile shit holes we determined that limiting and tracking the purchase of pseudoephedrine would help prevent the home lab issue. Unfortunately Mexico had the super labs and no restrictions so production there peaked, but it was successful in the US.
How many mass shootings will it take before we can do something similar with firearms and ammunition? Limiting daily, weekly, monthly and annual purchases of ammo. What about the amount of guns you can own (probably never happen)?
These are things as gun owners that we don't want people to take away from us.
When I shot competitively I would go through 1000 rounds a week easy. It was my hobby and pastime. Put a limit on my purchases and I can't do any practicing.
You could allow me to buy and store them at my local gun shop though, that might be viable for me but not the gun shop.
It's a tough thing to figure out but what is a happy medium?
This is where we as a country and civilization need to figure out what our priorities are and what we want our legacy to be. Is it that mass shootings are just an acceptable flipside to gun ownership and a police state of safety or is it that we value life and an end to violence. We have become systematically desensitized to the ugly truth of our existence and how our way of life is destroying us.
I expect to get ragged on for this, but I think car racing and competitive shooting are two of the biggest wastes of resources in this world. I too was sucked up in both as a kid, but I can no longer support or understand the purpose behind them. We waste so much for "entertainment".
I always wonder how someone that could do such a horrific thing could not have given off some clues about their mental instability.
Please don't equate violence and mental "instability"/mental illness.
Come on. I'm not saying mental instability equals violence. I'm saying to commit violence in this manner, something is wrong with your way of thinking and I would think your behavior beforehand would likely indicate something, at least in hindsight.
here is the part i don't get. they said he checked on Thursday. Are you telling me no one cleaned his room and/or saw anything in that room since Thursday? it is that easy to hide high powered rifles and ammo?
Never mind how about the fact that he was able to just get all those items into casino ? he could of just left the do not disturbe sign on door they absolutly respect those ....
Could have easily brought that stuff in a golf bag. Definitely big enough and no one would look twice at it.
So the answer is to do what to avoid this kind of scenario ?
For now I don't think hotels should do anything. I don't want to live in a police state and that is what happened with the Patriot Act. Now if these type of hotel shootings continue then I think the hotels would need to act.
We need stronger gun control legislation for sure.
What truly shows our ignorance as a country is that we're looking at this from the perspective of how the hotel could do a better job preventing this guy from hauling in his Normandy Beach invasion do it yourself kit. You're absolutely right, hotels shouldn't do anything because they aren't the root cause. Whatever they do is just a stop gap.
It's like we do the opposite of what should be done. Mass shooting happens, buy more guns. We're willing to spend millions, probably billions, on personnel and hardware which then only fuels the same industry who is leading us into the burning building and does nothing to address the problem.
We've been focused on school and workplace shootings so much that our response and prevention of them has become better, but people are still being killed and will always be killed. This is the evolution of the mass shooter. Find more victims with less chance for survival based on geography and vulnerability. How about for once we attack the problem at the source; gun manufacturing and ownership, rules, laws and policies.
When meth labs started popping up across the country and people were blowing themselves up left and right in their mobile shit holes we determined that limiting and tracking the purchase of pseudoephedrine would help prevent the home lab issue. Unfortunately Mexico had the super labs and no restrictions so production there peaked, but it was successful in the US.
How many mass shootings will it take before we can do something similar with firearms and ammunition? Limiting daily, weekly, monthly and annual purchases of ammo. What about the amount of guns you can own (probably never happen)?
These are things as gun owners that we don't want people to take away from us.
When I shot competitively I would go through 1000 rounds a week easy. It was my hobby and pastime. Put a limit on my purchases and I can't do any practicing.
You could allow me to buy and store them at my local gun shop though, that might be viable for me but not the gun shop.
It's a tough thing to figure out but what is a happy medium?
This is where we as a country and civilization need to figure out what our priorities are and what we want our legacy to be. Is it that mass shootings are just an acceptable flipside to gun ownership and a police state of safety or is it that we value life and an end to violence. We have become systematically desensitized to the ugly truth of our existence and how our way of life is destroying us.
I expect to get ragged on for this, but I think car racing and competitive shooting are two of the biggest wastes of resources in this world. I too was sucked up in both as a kid, but I can no longer support or understand the purpose behind them. We waste so much for "entertainment".
Apparently, 80% of murders of white people are committed by other white people. You really never hear about that either. I don't think it's helpful at all to try and ignore or deny the massive role that racism/race relations plays in public perceptions of crime. I understand it's unpleasant to acknowledge, but the only way to solve something is to face it head on, not try to pretend it's not so bad and hope it goes away on its own.
I'm not trying to ignore it all and I agree that race plays a huge role in how a crime is perceived. But that is also because of how crimes like these are reported a lot times. Whether if its correct or not when you hear about a cop shooting you automatically assume its a white cop shooting a black person and it events like today the first thought is that it was committed by an Islamic terrorist. Too many conclusions before facts are presented.
I never once thought this act today was committed by an Islamic terrorist. It would have really gone against the norm, but your point is still valid because the majority of Americans probably believe that is the case before the facts come out. They've been trained well by the media and politicians with agendas.
Yeah, I've gotta say, when I hear about mass shootings in the USA, I kind of first assume it was probably some crazy white guy, since it usually is ... and then if it turns out to be a Muslim, I think "oh shit, that is even worse because it's more ammunition for all the Islamophobes and alt-right." In other words, I'm a lot more scared of the alt-right than I will ever be of Islamic terrorism.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
At a certain point, when the bodies are piling up by the dozens, I simply no longer have any fucks to give about somebody's hobby. Seriously.
i'm almost to the point that these events don't really register anymore like today i'm more shocked that Tom Petty died than 58 people getting murdered by a lone gun man !!
At a certain point, when the bodies are piling up by the dozens, I simply no longer have any fucks to give about somebody's hobby. Seriously.
i'm almost to the point that these events don't really register anymore like today i'm more shocked that Tom Petty died than 58 people getting murdered by a lone gun man !!
I don't quite feel that way because I'm not really shocked by Petty's imminent death, given his age and how he went. But I fully acknowledge that Tom Petty's death affects me more personally, and it likely does anyone who was a fan of his and loves his music vs someone who is impacted by the Las Vegas tragedy directly. It's all about personal impact IMO. And I don't think anyone should feel guilty about having stronger personal emotions about something that are already more connected to. That said, I am more shocked by they shooting by far, and when I woke up to that news and saw the chaos on TV I felt true grief and dismay for those who had to go through that and for those who died while attending a concert, and their loved ones (including the parents of the 23 year old from metro Vancouver who was killed... his parents stated that he was their only child and they just don't know what to do - totally lost. So, so sad. I am not desensitized to these shootings at all, and I especially feel it when it happens at a concert because, again, that brings it closer to home for me personally. Just not as close to home as Tom Petty's music is, for me. And that's okay.
Anyway, I await more news on the the Vegas shooting. It is very unusual for this kind of event to happen when they were apparently zero warning signs at all, according to his neighbors and family. What was his motivation??? Did his long-term GF know about it? Is that why she was out of the country? To avoid being charge with collusion?? Or did the guy simply wait until she was conveniently out of the country so he could go about his "business" without her knowing about it? Did she know he was nuts? Was he nuts? Or just evil and hiding it well (although one neighbor described him as "aggressively unfriendly").
Post edited by PJ_Soul on
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
At a certain point, when the bodies are piling up by the dozens, I simply no longer have any fucks to give about somebody's hobby. Seriously.
Gotta agree here. There are bigger concerns and there are other hobbies.
The problem is, if the guns were acquired illegally, what's your solution? A bag of bullets won't do you any good if there is no gun to to shoot, just like a gun does no good if there is no one to shoot it. Now you are just limiting someone else's rights for something that wouldn't have prevented this or any similar shootings from happening just because you think it would. That's the problem with arguing for stricter gun laws, no suggestion that has been made prevents the events from happening. I think more focus should be on us as a society that has a fascination with violence as opposed to the gun restrictions. Gun restrictions are in place in places like Chicago. I've never heard of gun violence in Chicago.
I always wonder how someone that could do such a horrific thing could not have given off some clues about their mental instability.
Please don't equate violence and mental "instability"/mental illness.
Come on. I'm not saying mental instability equals violence. I'm saying to commit violence in this manner, something is wrong with your way of thinking and I would think your behavior beforehand would likely indicate something, at least in hindsight.
here is the part i don't get. they said he checked on Thursday. Are you telling me no one cleaned his room and/or saw anything in that room since Thursday? it is that easy to hide high powered rifles and ammo?
Never mind how about the fact that he was able to just get all those items into casino ? he could of just left the do not disturbe sign on door they absolutly respect those ....
Could have easily brought that stuff in a golf bag. Definitely big enough and no one would look twice at it.
So the answer is to do what to avoid this kind of scenario ?
For now I don't think hotels should do anything. I don't want to live in a police state and that is what happened with the Patriot Act. Now if these type of hotel shootings continue then I think the hotels would need to act.
We need stronger gun control legislation for sure.
Stronger legislation lol like that could ever happen remember sandy hook nothing nada zilch happened after that event , tell me what's kepping the next mass murdered from taking aim from another hotel why is it that we have to go thru security check points at every airport , it seems to me that if hotels made it imposible for you to just walk in with as many guns & ammo lives could be saved ...But the fear of a police state is worse than anything that could be done to save lives .....
Because we don't need to have safety checks at thousands of hotels because one person went crazy. Planes have a little more history of this shit.
Yeah im there i know it's shocking that 58 humans were gunned down but i know we will be here again talking about this issue again & again ! with more casualties ...so i feel TP dying hits closer to home for me shit day all around ....
At a certain point, when the bodies are piling up by the dozens, I simply no longer have any fucks to give about somebody's hobby. Seriously.
Gotta agree here. There are bigger concerns and there are other hobbies.
The problem is, if the guns were acquired illegally, what's your solution? A bag of bullets won't do you any good if there is no gun to to shoot, just like a gun does no good if there is no one to shoot it. Now you are just limiting someone else's rights for something that wouldn't have prevented this or any similar shootings from happening just because you think it would. That's the problem with arguing for stricter gun laws, no suggestion that has been made prevents the events from happening. I think more focus should be on us as a society that has a fascination with violence as opposed to the gun restrictions. Gun restrictions are in place in places like Chicago. I've never heard of gun violence in Chicago.
I would never argue against greater gun restrictions just because I think people absolutely should have to jump through hoops to get them legally, and that includes having access to private medical information and juvenile criminal records, and also an alert that shows anytime a police officer looks up a legal gun owner's info. I also don't think using guns seems like something that should be hobby at all. They are weapons, not toys. Guns as a hobby seems ludicrous to me. I am also adamantly against sport hunting because I think it is SICK to get pleasure out of killing. However, I do totally agree with you about the real probably being the gun culture, as I've stated many times. Until this twisted fascination with and glorification of guns is gone in the mindset of citizens, America will not be free of their gun problem. But.... I think gun regulations could certainly contribute to causing this gun culture to slowly die out. If it becomes so hard to get guns legally that a big portion of normal society decides it's more trouble than it's worth, that would go a long way in the long term, since they would be less likely to pass this love of guns down to their kids, a stigma against guns would grow (and yes, that's a good thing IMO), and a large number of them would just find other hobbies. Nobody loves a hobby that is more a pain in the ass than anything else.
Post edited by PJ_Soul on
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
THe reason Tom Petty's death hits closer to home is because most of us have a connection through music and memories with him and the art he gave us. There is a direct relationship. It's something you process on a personal level.
I always wonder how someone that could do such a horrific thing could not have given off some clues about their mental instability.
Please don't equate violence and mental "instability"/mental illness.
Come on. I'm not saying mental instability equals violence. I'm saying to commit violence in this manner, something is wrong with your way of thinking and I would think your behavior beforehand would likely indicate something, at least in hindsight.
here is the part i don't get. they said he checked on Thursday. Are you telling me no one cleaned his room and/or saw anything in that room since Thursday? it is that easy to hide high powered rifles and ammo?
Never mind how about the fact that he was able to just get all those items into casino ? he could of just left the do not disturbe sign on door they absolutly respect those ....
Could have easily brought that stuff in a golf bag. Definitely big enough and no one would look twice at it.
So the answer is to do what to avoid this kind of scenario ?
For now I don't think hotels should do anything. I don't want to live in a police state and that is what happened with the Patriot Act. Now if these type of hotel shootings continue then I think the hotels would need to act.
We need stronger gun control legislation for sure.
Stronger legislation lol like that could ever happen remember sandy hook nothing nada zilch happened after that event , tell me what's kepping the next mass murdered from taking aim from another hotel why is it that we have to go thru security check points at every airport , it seems to me that if hotels made it imposible for you to just walk in with as many guns & ammo lives could be saved ...But the fear of a police state is worse than anything that could be done to save lives .....
Because we don't need to have safety checks at thousands of hotels because one person went crazy. Planes have a little more history of this shit. fucking quote function sucks
At a certain point, when the bodies are piling up by the dozens, I simply no longer have any fucks to give about somebody's hobby. Seriously.
Gotta agree here. There are bigger concerns and there are other hobbies.
The problem is, if the guns were acquired illegally, what's your solution? A bag of bullets won't do you any good if there is no gun to to shoot, just like a gun does no good if there is no one to shoot it. Now you are just limiting someone else's rights for something that wouldn't have prevented this or any similar shootings from happening just because you think it would. That's the problem with arguing for stricter gun laws, no suggestion that has been made prevents the events from happening. I think more focus should be on us as a society that has a fascination with violence as opposed to the gun restrictions. Gun restrictions are in place in places like Chicago. I've never heard of gun violence in Chicago.
I would never argue against greater gun restrictions just because I think people absolutely should have to jump through hoops to get them legally, and that includes having access to private medical information and juvenile criminal records, and also an alert that shows anytime a police officer looks up a legal gun owner's info. I also don't think using guns seems like something that should be hobby at all. They are weapons, not toys. Guns as a hobby seems ludicrous to me. I am also adamantly against sport hunting because I think it is SICK to get pleasure out of killing. However, I do totally agree with you about the real probably being the gun culture, as I've stated many times. Until this twisted fascination with and glorification of guns is gone in the mindset of citizens, America will not be free of their gun problem. But.... I think gun regulations could certainly contribute to causing this gun culture to slowly die out. If it becomes so hard to get guns legally that a big portion of normal society decides it's more trouble than it's worth, that would go a long way in the long term, since they would be less likely to pass this love of guns down to their kids, a stigma against guns would grow (and yes, that's a good thing IMO), and a large number of them would just find other hobbies. Nobody loves a hobby that is more a pain in the ass than anything else.
I am all for having to take a psych exam in order to obtain a fire arm. I'm all for every so many years having to retake one. I'm against access to private medical records and being on some sort of police alert list. The problem with society isn't love of guns (this is where the argument always gets lost on me), it's with violence. I don't care if someone's hobby is to go shooting. Good for them. If they like trophy hunting and it's legal, good for those hunters. I'm not going to take away someone else's hobbies or things they like to do because I personally don't like it or agree with it. At that point, you are just taking away from people because you disagree with them with no factual basis that it improves society.
I didn't mean like a RED FLAG!!! police list btw. I just meant that when a police officer happens to look you up (like when you're pulled over or something) that a note be there stating whether or not you're a registered gun owner. I think that could be very useful info, depending on the situation.
I would never say "good for those people who get a rush out of killing". Hunting, for me, is a huge no-no unless it's necessary.... I honestly really wonder about people who actually enjoy killing a beautiful animal, and then keep their sad, dead carcass as a way to show off how they murdered it. I think it's sick.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Unless you are making your own guns in a basement somewhere, all these guns were legal at one time. The gun company manufactured them, legally. They were shipped somewhere, legally. Sometime after that, whether it be via theft or gun running, those same guns that were once manufactured legally magically became illegal. That's a problem. There are too many guns and they are too easy to get.
I didn't mean like a RED FLAG!!! police list btw. I just meant that when a police officer happens to look you up (like when you're pulled over or something) that a note be there stating whether or not you're a registered gun owner. I think that could be very useful info, depending on the situation.
I would never say "good for those people who get a rush out of killing". Hunting, for me, is a huge no-no unless it's necessary.... I honestly really wonder about people who actually enjoy killing a beautiful animal, and then keep their sad, dead carcass as a way to show off how they murdered it. I think it's sick.
I still don't agree with a national registration of gun owners. Doesn't account for illegal owners which, and I'm just assuming here, would be a bigger threat to a police officer than a legal gun owner.
I dont agree with trophy hunting, but if it's legal and some hunters enjoy it, that's good for them. I don't get it, but I'm not going to judge someone as if I'm a better person for it.
Unless you are making your own guns in a basement somewhere, all these guns were legal at one time. The gun company manufactured them, legally. They were shipped somewhere, legally. Sometime after that, whether it be via theft or gun running, those same guns that were once manufactured legally magically became illegal. That's a problem. There are too many guns and they are too easy to get.
For sure. Illegal guns were either stolen or sold illegally. I don't know why legal gun owners try to pretend they as a group have nothing to do with the illegal gun trade, because they do.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Unless you are making your own guns in a basement somewhere, all these guns were legal at one time. The gun company manufactured them, legally. They were shipped somewhere, legally. Sometime after that, whether it be via theft or gun running, those same guns that were once manufactured legally magically became illegal. That's a problem. There are too many guns and they are too easy to get.
The first step in combating this would be securing the borders. It would be a lot easier to track and find the guns on the illegal market once the illegal market is contained to the US instead of the with the rest of the world. Would you agree with that?
I didn't mean like a RED FLAG!!! police list btw. I just meant that when a police officer happens to look you up (like when you're pulled over or something) that a note be there stating whether or not you're a registered gun owner. I think that could be very useful info, depending on the situation.
I would never say "good for those people who get a rush out of killing". Hunting, for me, is a huge no-no unless it's necessary.... I honestly really wonder about people who actually enjoy killing a beautiful animal, and then keep their sad, dead carcass as a way to show off how they murdered it. I think it's sick.
I still don't agree with a national registration of gun owners. Doesn't account for illegal owners which, and I'm just assuming here, would be a bigger threat to a police officer than a legal gun owner.
I dont agree with trophy hunting, but if it's legal and some hunters enjoy it, that's good for them. I don't get it, but I'm not going to judge someone as if I'm a better person for it.
It would account for the gun, if not the owner. Registration is a literal no brainer.
Those who oppose it are extremist in their views and it's suspicious. What is the motive behind keeping something like that secret?
Unless you are making your own guns in a basement somewhere, all these guns were legal at one time. The gun company manufactured them, legally. They were shipped somewhere, legally. Sometime after that, whether it be via theft or gun running, those same guns that were once manufactured legally magically became illegal. That's a problem. There are too many guns and they are too easy to get.
The first step in combating this would be securing the borders. It would be a lot easier to track and find the guns on the illegal market once the illegal market is contained to the US instead of the with the rest of the world. Would you agree with that?
I know you weren't asking me, but I would say that this would help much at all - gun thefts would just skyrocket, and so would the prices, which would likely lead more gun owners to sell on the black market more often when they hit hard times and need some fast cash. And yes, people would figure out how to beat gun safes, so they aren't a solution in this context either. You don't want the solution to actually make things more dangerous - I don't think following the same tactics as they did with the war on drugs would work too well.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Unless you are making your own guns in a basement somewhere, all these guns were legal at one time. The gun company manufactured them, legally. They were shipped somewhere, legally. Sometime after that, whether it be via theft or gun running, those same guns that were once manufactured legally magically became illegal. That's a problem. There are too many guns and they are too easy to get.
The first step in combating this would be securing the borders. It would be a lot easier to track and find the guns on the illegal market once the illegal market is contained to the US instead of the with the rest of the world. Would you agree with that?
I would agree that we should secure the border. I don't know if that would cut back on the number of mass shootings that we see in this country.
I didn't mean like a RED FLAG!!! police list btw. I just meant that when a police officer happens to look you up (like when you're pulled over or something) that a note be there stating whether or not you're a registered gun owner. I think that could be very useful info, depending on the situation.
I would never say "good for those people who get a rush out of killing". Hunting, for me, is a huge no-no unless it's necessary.... I honestly really wonder about people who actually enjoy killing a beautiful animal, and then keep their sad, dead carcass as a way to show off how they murdered it. I think it's sick.
I still don't agree with a national registration of gun owners. Doesn't account for illegal owners which, and I'm just assuming here, would be a bigger threat to a police officer than a legal gun owner.
I dont agree with trophy hunting, but if it's legal and some hunters enjoy it, that's good for them. I don't get it, but I'm not going to judge someone as if I'm a better person for it.
It would account for the gun, if not the owner. Registration is a literal no brainer.
Those who oppose it are extremist in their views and it's suspicious. What is the motive behind keeping something like that secret?
I am in no way an extremist. As I've already mentioned, I don't own a gun. I just don't believe there should be a registry. It goes against the whole purpose of the second amendment. You can find that suspicious all you want to, I'm fine good with you thinking I'm suspicious.
I just don't understand your "good for them" statements, lol. It's legal to do something awful so good for them? I'm not sure why you find that necessary to say if you don't even approve of the gratuitous killing. I mean.... picking your nose and flicking it in public is legal too, but I don't say "good for them" because they've decided to do it. And killing an innocent animal for pleasure is a hell of a lot worse than the flick and pick.
Post edited by PJ_Soul on
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Unless you are making your own guns in a basement somewhere, all these guns were legal at one time. The gun company manufactured them, legally. They were shipped somewhere, legally. Sometime after that, whether it be via theft or gun running, those same guns that were once manufactured legally magically became illegal. That's a problem. There are too many guns and they are too easy to get.
The first step in combating this would be securing the borders. It would be a lot easier to track and find the guns on the illegal market once the illegal market is contained to the US instead of the with the rest of the world. Would you agree with that?
I know you weren't asking me, but I would say that this would help much at all - gun thefts would just skyrocket, and so would the prices, which would likely lead more gun owners to sell on the black market more often when they hit hard times and need some fast cash. And yes, people would figure out how to beat gun safes, so they aren't a solution in this context either. You don't want the solution to actually make things more dangerous - I don't think following the same tactics as they did with the war on drugs would work too well.
i would complete disagree with you on that. If you are going after the illegal market, the first thing you have to do is isolate the market and minimize it. You can't keep emptying a bucket under a leaking pipe and wonder why the bucket keeps filling up. The war on drugs is completely different. You can grow and make your own drugs. The war on drugs also failed due to not having secured borders. Violence went up in territorial areas that were good for smuggling and allowed cartels to form in order to transport drugs and money across the borders and defend the territories they carved out for themselves.
At a certain point, when the bodies are piling up by the dozens, I simply no longer have any fucks to give about somebody's hobby. Seriously.
Gotta agree here. There are bigger concerns and there are other hobbies.
The problem is, if the guns were acquired illegally, what's your solution? A bag of bullets won't do you any good if there is no gun to to shoot, just like a gun does no good if there is no one to shoot it. Now you are just limiting someone else's rights for something that wouldn't have prevented this or any similar shootings from happening just because you think it would. That's the problem with arguing for stricter gun laws, no suggestion that has been made prevents the events from happening. I think more focus should be on us as a society that has a fascination with violence as opposed to the gun restrictions. Gun restrictions are in place in places like Chicago. I've never heard of gun violence in Chicago.
I would never argue against greater gun restrictions just because I think people absolutely should have to jump through hoops to get them legally, and that includes having access to private medical information and juvenile criminal records, and also an alert that shows anytime a police officer looks up a legal gun owner's info. I also don't think using guns seems like something that should be hobby at all. They are weapons, not toys. Guns as a hobby seems ludicrous to me. I am also adamantly against sport hunting because I think it is SICK to get pleasure out of killing. However, I do totally agree with you about the real probably being the gun culture, as I've stated many times. Until this twisted fascination with and glorification of guns is gone in the mindset of citizens, America will not be free of their gun problem. But.... I think gun regulations could certainly contribute to causing this gun culture to slowly die out. If it becomes so hard to get guns legally that a big portion of normal society decides it's more trouble than it's worth, that would go a long way in the long term, since they would be less likely to pass this love of guns down to their kids, a stigma against guns would grow (and yes, that's a good thing IMO), and a large number of them would just find other hobbies. Nobody loves a hobby that is more a pain in the ass than anything else.
I am all for having to take a psych exam in order to obtain a fire arm. I'm all for every so many years having to retake one. I'm against access to private medical records and being on some sort of police alert list. The problem with society isn't love of guns (this is where the argument always gets lost on me), it's with violence. I don't care if someone's hobby is to go shooting. Good for them. If they like trophy hunting and it's legal, good for those hunters. I'm not going to take away someone else's hobbies or things they like to do because I personally don't like it or agree with it. At that point, you are just taking away from people because you disagree with them with no factual basis that it improves society.
I guess I'm an idiot because removing all guns seems like a no brainer to reducing violence and improving society. How could it not? This is no longer primitive times so why do we still think and respond primitively? How much of the food the average person eats in a given year is actually procured via hunting in some way? Seriously, I don't know, but it can't be more then 5%. Yet, we're not doing anything about guns because of hunters and hobby shooters?
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When I shot competitively I would go through 1000 rounds a week easy. It was my hobby and pastime. Put a limit on my purchases and I can't do any practicing.
You could allow me to buy and store them at my local gun shop though, that might be viable for me but not the gun shop.
It's a tough thing to figure out but what is a happy medium?
I expect to get ragged on for this, but I think car racing and competitive shooting are two of the biggest wastes of resources in this world. I too was sucked up in both as a kid, but I can no longer support or understand the purpose behind them. We waste so much for "entertainment".
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Yeah, I've gotta say, when I hear about mass shootings in the USA, I kind of first assume it was probably some crazy white guy, since it usually is ... and then if it turns out to be a Muslim, I think "oh shit, that is even worse because it's more ammunition for all the Islamophobes and alt-right." In other words, I'm a lot more scared of the alt-right than I will ever be of Islamic terrorism.
Seriously.
Anyway, I await more news on the the Vegas shooting. It is very unusual for this kind of event to happen when they were apparently zero warning signs at all, according to his neighbors and family. What was his motivation??? Did his long-term GF know about it? Is that why she was out of the country? To avoid being charge with collusion?? Or did the guy simply wait until she was conveniently out of the country so he could go about his "business" without her knowing about it? Did she know he was nuts? Was he nuts? Or just evil and hiding it well (although one neighbor described him as "aggressively unfriendly").
Gotta agree here. There are bigger concerns and there are other hobbies.
"...I changed by not changing at all..."
I would never say "good for those people who get a rush out of killing". Hunting, for me, is a huge no-no unless it's necessary.... I honestly really wonder about people who actually enjoy killing a beautiful animal, and then keep their sad, dead carcass as a way to show off how they murdered it. I think it's sick.
"...I changed by not changing at all..."
I dont agree with trophy hunting, but if it's legal and some hunters enjoy it, that's good for them. I don't get it, but I'm not going to judge someone as if I'm a better person for it.
Registration is a literal no brainer.
Those who oppose it are extremist in their views and it's suspicious. What is the motive behind keeping something like that secret?
I would agree that we should secure the border. I don't know if that would cut back on the number of mass shootings that we see in this country.
"...I changed by not changing at all..."