What Are People's Motivation To Outlaw Guns In The US?

DS1119

Just curious to hear.

Wilds

They don't understand the importance guns play in keeping people free, and only see the cost of that freedom on display when people do bad things with guns.

gimmesometruth27

i say we just get swedish made penis enlargers for all american males and we would not need guns...

fife

Wilds wrote:

They don't understand the importance guns play in keeping people free, and only see the cost of that freedom on display when people do bad things with guns.

if guns kept people safe wouldn't America be the safest place in the world considering you do have the most guns?

Cosmo

DS1119 wrote:

Just curious to hear.

...
Question: Who wants to outlaw guns?
Answer: Not me.
...
Question: Who wants to try to do something... anything to keep guns out of the hands of crazy fucks?
Answer: Me.
...
Question: How?
Answer: I have no fucking idea.

DS1119

This thread isn't really going the way I intended. I would really like to hear people's ultimate motivations for banning guns.

keeponrockin

I think reducing the amount of hand guns would greatly reduce the number of shooting deaths due to murder.

And before one says 'reducing the amount of cars would reduce driving deaths', it would. But wouldn't comparing car accidents to gun accidents be more apt... I could see comparing vehicular homicide to gun murder however.

Outlawing completely isn't the answer, but stupidly strict controls on hand guns? I could get behind that.

Jamminonthe1

DS1119 wrote:

This thread isn't really going the way I intended. I would really like to hear people's ultimate motivations for banning guns.

Sorry, but you don't get to pick how people answer or what direction they take the thread.

gimmesometruth27

DS1119 wrote:

This thread isn't really going the way I intended. I would really like to hear people's ultimate motivations for banning guns.

most americans are not in favor of banning guns. that rumor is a right wing fear tactic to get out their vote.

JimmyV

Is there a large push to outlaw guns? Maybe in some quarters but I don't believe that is the goal of many who would like to see gun laws strengthened. I have no problem if someone wants to own a gun or two guns or five guns, but I do think we should be able to set a limit on how many guns anyone citizen can possess at any one time. The 2nd Amendment never ever intended to make it legal for you to have an arsenal in your basement. Setting a limit on how many guns can be owned would not infringe upon anyone's right to bare arms, and it wouldn't outlaw guns in the US.

Cosmo

DS1119 wrote:

This thread isn't really going the way I intended. I would really like to hear people's ultimate motivations for banning guns.

...
Question: Who wants to ban guns?
Answer: Not me.
...
etc, etc, etc...

fife

DS1119 wrote:

This thread isn't really going the way I intended. I would really like to hear people's ultimate motivations for banning guns.

I am not into banning all guns, i just want to make them very hard to get. I think we have seen that there needs to be tougher rules for people to get them.

Vitalogensia

I was about to ask the opposite question.

I don't see the point, I guess. I've never owned a gun, never fired a gun, don't hunt, and never felt unsafe, whether I was living in the suburbs or the city. Plus I listened to a lot of PJ and 311 growing up.

DS1119

So would you say it's harder to get cigarettes or guns? Alcohol or guns? Illegal drugs or guns?


Would you say the motivation is to save lives?

Vitalogensia

I can't answer that question as I've never tried to buy a gun. I read a lot more about people accidentally killing other people with a gun than accidentally saving someone.

To be clear, I don't think guns should be banned.

fife

DS1119 wrote:

So would you say it's harder to get cigarettes or guns? Alcohol or guns? Illegal drugs or guns?


Would you say the motivation is to save lives?

where I live in toronto Canada it is easier to buy cigarettes than anything else but when i travel to america i see places that sell all the above so I don't know.

keeponrockin

DS1119 wrote:

So would you say it's harder to get cigarettes or guns? Alcohol or guns? Illegal drugs or guns?


Would you say the motivation is to save lives?

I think there's a self harm principle at stake here as well. If you want to kill yourself with cigarettes, that's on you (same with booze) but don't get behind the wheel drunk or smoke indoors with other people around you.

That would be my argument against that argument. Guns are designed to kill other people/animals.

DS1119

keeponrockin wrote:

DS1119 wrote:

So would you say it's harder to get cigarettes or guns? Alcohol or guns? Illegal drugs or guns?


Would you say the motivation is to save lives?

I think there's a self harm principle at stake here as well. If you want to kill yourself with cigarettes, that's on you (same with booze) but don't get behind the wheel drunk or smoke indoors with other people around you.

That would be my argument against that argument. Guns are designed to kill other people/animals.

Is it safe to assume then you want guns banned because you feel it would save lives?

Jason P

I don't want to ban guns but I sure want to restrict access. Each day I encounter my fellow citizens in passing by and I wouldn't trust the majority to safely operate a wiffle ball bat, less yet a handgun.

Testing and training need to be prerequisites to owning a handgun. Assault rifles should be banned from the general public. And high-capacity clips should be banned as well. In my opinion.

keeponrockin

DS1119 wrote:

keeponrockin wrote:

DS1119 wrote:

So would you say it's harder to get cigarettes or guns? Alcohol or guns? Illegal drugs or guns?


Would you say the motivation is to save lives?

I think there's a self harm principle at stake here as well. If you want to kill yourself with cigarettes, that's on you (same with booze) but don't get behind the wheel drunk or smoke indoors with other people around you.

That would be my argument against that argument. Guns are designed to kill other people/animals.

Is it safe to assume then you want guns banned because you feel it would save lives?

Overly simplistic.

What are your thoughts on the alcohol/cigarette self harm aspect of it?

JonnyPistachio

Of all the insane discussions we've had here, I think i've only seen maybe 1-2 folks say we should completely ban guns. I fucking hate guns, but I dont think an all out ban is even worthy of talking about.

Im with JasonP here -- I do think guns should be harder to get, smaller magazine capacities, and longer background checks. I dont think 50 caliber sniper rifles should be available to the public because its just not necessary. No online sales with zero background check -- I was amazed to learn how easy it was to get a gun. There should also be mandatory classes. (I know, I know, what criminal with a filed off serial number is going to blah, blah blah...) I dont think these things is too much to ask, just to see if we can reduce the amounts of senseless killings and accidents.

Depends on what you mean by how easy it is to get a gun compared to alcohol, cigs, etc... Anyone can get a gun online pretty easily. Absolutely anyone.

Cosmo

Jason P wrote:

I don't want to ban guns but I sure want to restrict access. Each day I encounter my fellow citizens in passing by and I wouldn't trust the majority to safely operate a wiffle ball bat, less yet a handgun.

Testing and training need to be prerequisites to owning a handgun. Assault rifles should be banned from the general public. And high-capacity clips should be banned as well. In my opinion.

...
Agree.
Ever been to the Department of Motor Vehicles?
Would anyone feel safer if all of those people in line that owns or drives a car... carried a gun. Please, raise you hand.

blackredyellow

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

DS1119 wrote:

This thread isn't really going the way I intended. I would really like to hear people's ultimate motivations for banning guns.

most americans are not in favor of banning guns. that rumor is a right wing fear tactic to get out their vote.

True... different people want different levels of gun control, but you don't hear anyone (except in pro-gun strawmen arguments), actually want to outlaw all guns or take guns away from people.

But, I would guess for most people who want to restrict gun access, the motivation is safety. I'm not sure what else there would be (that isn't a crazy tin foil conspiracy theory thought up by paranoid gun-obsessed people).

I am a gun owner, so I guess that makes me "pro gun", but I see stories everyday where there are people who shouldn't own guns. How we as a society decides that, and weeds them out, I have no idea.


On this subject, with recent shootings, you keep hearing people say, "Guns don't kill people, people kill people", basically disavowing any capability or power that the gun had in the situation, but then in the next breath, say that guns have the capacity to "keep our freedom" and "make us safer". How can it be so powerless in one situation, and so powerful in another?

DS1119

keeponrockin wrote:

DS1119 wrote:

Is it safe to assume then you want guns banned because you feel it would save lives?

Overly simplistic.

What are your thoughts on the alcohol/cigarette self harm aspect of it?

I really don't think it's overly simplistic at all actually. I mean it seems people's concerns over guns is saving lives. Shouldn't they start higher on the list of things that may harm people than legally obtained weapons first?

JonnyPistachio

Cosmo wrote:

Jason P wrote:

I don't want to ban guns but I sure want to restrict access. Each day I encounter my fellow citizens in passing by and I wouldn't trust the majority to safely operate a wiffle ball bat, less yet a handgun.

Testing and training need to be prerequisites to owning a handgun. Assault rifles should be banned from the general public. And high-capacity clips should be banned as well. In my opinion.

...
Agree.
Ever been to the Department of Motor Vehicles?
Would anyone feel safer if all of those people in line that owns or drives a car... carried a gun. Please, raise you hand.

Wait, you mean they dont give out free guns at the DMV in your town?

vant0037

DS1119 wrote:

keeponrockin wrote:

DS1119 wrote:

Is it safe to assume then you want guns banned because you feel it would save lives?

Overly simplistic.

What are your thoughts on the alcohol/cigarette self harm aspect of it?

I really don't think it's overly simplistic at all actually. I mean it seems people's concerns over guns is saving lives. Shouldn't they start higher on the list of things that may harm people than legally obtained weapons first?

DS...you've clearly got a point in all this (starting the thread with an unproven assumption, suggesting reasons etc), which is fine. But just say it already. You think people who want to ban guns want to do so because X, Y, or Z, and you obviously think there's something faulty with that OR there's some other point you want to make. Again, that's all fine and good, but just spit it out already. What are you trying to get at!

DS1119

vant0037 wrote:

DS...you've clearly got a point in all this (starting the thread with an unproven assumption, suggesting reasons etc), which is fine. But just say it already. You think people who want to ban guns want to do so because X, Y, or Z, and you obviously think there's something faulty with that OR there's some other point you want to make. Again, that's all fine and good, but just spit it out already. What are you trying to get at!

I'm just waiting for someone to ultimately give me the reason they feel why legal owned guns should be banned and if that ever happened what they feel will be the result?

fife

DS1119 wrote:

keeponrockin wrote:

DS1119 wrote:

Is it safe to assume then you want guns banned because you feel it would save lives?

Overly simplistic.

What are your thoughts on the alcohol/cigarette self harm aspect of it?

I really don't think it's overly simplistic at all actually. I mean it seems people's concerns over guns is saving lives. Shouldn't they start higher on the list of things that may harm people than legally obtained weapons first?

if you look at it, there are more restrictions around smoking than ever before. you are not allowed to smoke indoors now. You have to be 19 to buy smokes.

do you find it weird that people can't smoke in stores but in certain states people can have a concealed weapon.

fife

DS1119 wrote:

vant0037 wrote:

DS...you've clearly got a point in all this (starting the thread with an unproven assumption, suggesting reasons etc), which is fine. But just say it already. You think people who want to ban guns want to do so because X, Y, or Z, and you obviously think there's something faulty with that OR there's some other point you want to make. Again, that's all fine and good, but just spit it out already. What are you trying to get at!

I'm just waiting for someone to ultimately give me the reason they feel why legal owned guns should be banned and if that ever happened what they feel will be the result?

the reason you are not getting what you are looking for is because no-one wants to ban guns. we just want more restrictions.

Go Beavers

Cosmo wrote:

Jason P wrote:

I don't want to ban guns but I sure want to restrict access. Each day I encounter my fellow citizens in passing by and I wouldn't trust the majority to safely operate a wiffle ball bat, less yet a handgun.

Testing and training need to be prerequisites to owning a handgun. Assault rifles should be banned from the general public. And high-capacity clips should be banned as well. In my opinion.

...
Agree.
Ever been to the Department of Motor Vehicles?
Would anyone feel safer if all of those people in line that owns or drives a car... carried a gun. Please, raise you hand.

People do accept a higher level of enforcement and monitoring with regards to driving, but why if more enforcement, regulation, and monitoring of guns is proposed, the alarm is sounded and now the dictatorial government is on its way to banning guns?

JonnyPistachio

I just clicked he local news site a minute ago and (sadly) here are the top three stories:

Florida concealed weapons permits soon to reach 1 million milestone, the most in the USA
http://www.postonpolitics.com/2012/12/f ... milestone/

Packing my damned bags! j/k, overall, this is a good article and does reflect on how most are responsible. But I doubt those numbers matter when you consider how many accidental shooting we have in FL. I swear I see 2-3 a month where some kid is accidentally shot

Fla man fatally shot roommate over dinner, Pissed at pork chop perparation
http://www.palmbeachpost.com/ap/ap/crim ... ner/nTTFy/

Woman tries to calm naked gunman before Palm Beach Shores police arrive
http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/news/ ... g-i/nTS4p/
This man might be just a tad unbalanced.