What I've learned on "This Moving Train"
dancepartner
Posts: 324
Currently, I’m learning about how voting precincts are skewed, (posts in ‘reach across the aisle’ by Hugh Freaking Dillon), a refresher about the electoral college, (post from Pandora), learning about what Drones are doing to Pakistanis, (post from PJL44 in Living under Drones).
Many threads have been interesting and informative; The Polar Ice Melts by brianlux, The Death Penalty by Byrnzie, refresher about The Bill of Rights and The Constitution from Prince of Dorkness, the Tax Break thread by whygohome — the list goes on.
There are many regular contributors here offering insightful stuff, not discluding the above mentioned contributors; jeanwah, hedonist, cindybearcat, cosmo, binauraljam, riotgirl, Polaris, dimitriuspearljam, bootlegger10, newch91, Dirty Frank, cliffy, Zosco, satansfuton, DS1119, drifting by the storm, joewalshdc, gimmesometruth, 81, lukin2006 — on the list goes. I’ve noticed that on a good night, there’s somewhere around 50 users online at any given time with the maximum coming in at 1608 in May of 2011. I don’t know the total number of registered members and I don’t know if this forum has grown or diminished.
Here’s what I do know. The Election Night Thread posted by cliffy6745 has over 500 posts. Cliffy began it by saying maybe we should all just keep to this thread for the night. And so we did. I had put up a few threads reminding us that regardless of the outcome, we must move forward together; a concept that did not get lost for Dirty Frank, joewalshdc, brianlux and dimitrispearljam. A concept that Hugh Freaking Dillon followed up the next day with a thread about reaching across the aisle. Same concept Riotgirl made a post about waking up America! Givemesometruth27 chimed in somewhere about needing to work together because working apart is just not working. Brianlux has been softly reminding us about this basic need ever since I became a member here.
Today, I looked back thru the thread archives and found some constants; environment, tax and governing/law policies consistently sprinkled, but the most constant of threads comes from solid fact-based concerns about where we are heading. These threads consistently have you people concluding we must find unity in order to redirect where we want to go. Here’s what I then notice: we move onto the next hot topic thread.
This doesn’t just happen here at PJ. Since attempting to involve myself in social networking, I’ve found this process is the typical circle everywhere. Even on fevered left or right sites; people find a place they like, some even make posts which the rest read and maybe even comment — and then move on.
The internet is providing an array of social networking tools—inundating us. I liken it to a mine filled with gems of every kind and the miners, Americans (as others, like Mideast masses, have already shown the way) must now figure out how to extract these gems and learn to barter, in-unison, for a fair return.
So while I’m out there scouting, trying to find a group of like-minded miners, here’s what I’ve found: all unifying sites, regardless of whether they are hoping to just keep their left or right flock tight, or reaching for a broader base, (Citizens United or Progressives Untied etc.) with the exception of but a few — they aren’t much interested in our voiced contributions. They’d rather pay established writers to post a ‘thread’ for us so we will make a few comments to ensure their gamble on this or that writer is paying off. But what they really want is for us to pay for these writers: Donate Now screams back from top to bottom and from left to right on nearly every page of nearly every unifying site.
So here we are. We are yelping ourselves. We know unifying this mass must happen but I’d guess we keep thinking this movement will come from some other source like the ones already established. Yes, they are doing some good and could use always, more help, more money. But the kind of unity all these sites could use, the same as us, is something we all know needs to happen in a big way and I’d guess here — you people hanging out here don’t see your train as the place for this to happen. Yet, hedonist hit on this; something about “we should keep our focus on the immediate circle and ripple-effects will surely happen.”
Somewhere, somehow, a ripple-effect will take shape. Will it be one we can get behind? Realize—powerful money knows the same as we do: social networking will take off here. It had the power to change the face of Mideast rule and we will attempt to do the same here so it’s only a matter of time before the next Occupy or Tea party unity flares. However, powermongers don’t stay powerful if they don’t foresee, to then quell, rough waters detrimental to them.
Clever people reside here in on ‘moving train’ but I believe frustration resides because this train is more like a track of stalled idler cars; doing little but waiting to be a part of something tangible yet nothing ever happens. Well, the dialogue moves, hell—it jumps! Like lightening bugs, everybody’s insightful thoughts jump all over the place right up until we’ve become so inundated with it all—we switch the lights off and go take cover.
the bantering of musings is all you want from this train then you’ve got it. But consider; could this train do more? Had it once been more active, alive? Sometimes I get on here and there are 2 or 3 others. Considering this is a world-wide forum, I’d guess this train is a fading fad where only a handful of loyal die-hards remain. For the many others just like me, who once thought they finally found a place where our voice could unify and ripple beyond, probably deboard after a time.
I suppose they are still looking for a place just like this. A place where our voice matters—not money, money, more money. A place where clever people gather and the potential of what a social networking site can do—hangs ripe in the air. Do you guys, the ones I named earlier, realize you are standing guard over this diamond in the rough? And, is that all you want to do with it? Kat; are you listening? “Stick” this so it doesn’t get lost in the shuffle. I’d like to hear from ALL of you. What do you want this ‘moving train’ to do? I can’t check in all the time to keep this thread active—you must do it.
Many threads have been interesting and informative; The Polar Ice Melts by brianlux, The Death Penalty by Byrnzie, refresher about The Bill of Rights and The Constitution from Prince of Dorkness, the Tax Break thread by whygohome — the list goes on.
There are many regular contributors here offering insightful stuff, not discluding the above mentioned contributors; jeanwah, hedonist, cindybearcat, cosmo, binauraljam, riotgirl, Polaris, dimitriuspearljam, bootlegger10, newch91, Dirty Frank, cliffy, Zosco, satansfuton, DS1119, drifting by the storm, joewalshdc, gimmesometruth, 81, lukin2006 — on the list goes. I’ve noticed that on a good night, there’s somewhere around 50 users online at any given time with the maximum coming in at 1608 in May of 2011. I don’t know the total number of registered members and I don’t know if this forum has grown or diminished.
Here’s what I do know. The Election Night Thread posted by cliffy6745 has over 500 posts. Cliffy began it by saying maybe we should all just keep to this thread for the night. And so we did. I had put up a few threads reminding us that regardless of the outcome, we must move forward together; a concept that did not get lost for Dirty Frank, joewalshdc, brianlux and dimitrispearljam. A concept that Hugh Freaking Dillon followed up the next day with a thread about reaching across the aisle. Same concept Riotgirl made a post about waking up America! Givemesometruth27 chimed in somewhere about needing to work together because working apart is just not working. Brianlux has been softly reminding us about this basic need ever since I became a member here.
Today, I looked back thru the thread archives and found some constants; environment, tax and governing/law policies consistently sprinkled, but the most constant of threads comes from solid fact-based concerns about where we are heading. These threads consistently have you people concluding we must find unity in order to redirect where we want to go. Here’s what I then notice: we move onto the next hot topic thread.
This doesn’t just happen here at PJ. Since attempting to involve myself in social networking, I’ve found this process is the typical circle everywhere. Even on fevered left or right sites; people find a place they like, some even make posts which the rest read and maybe even comment — and then move on.
The internet is providing an array of social networking tools—inundating us. I liken it to a mine filled with gems of every kind and the miners, Americans (as others, like Mideast masses, have already shown the way) must now figure out how to extract these gems and learn to barter, in-unison, for a fair return.
So while I’m out there scouting, trying to find a group of like-minded miners, here’s what I’ve found: all unifying sites, regardless of whether they are hoping to just keep their left or right flock tight, or reaching for a broader base, (Citizens United or Progressives Untied etc.) with the exception of but a few — they aren’t much interested in our voiced contributions. They’d rather pay established writers to post a ‘thread’ for us so we will make a few comments to ensure their gamble on this or that writer is paying off. But what they really want is for us to pay for these writers: Donate Now screams back from top to bottom and from left to right on nearly every page of nearly every unifying site.
So here we are. We are yelping ourselves. We know unifying this mass must happen but I’d guess we keep thinking this movement will come from some other source like the ones already established. Yes, they are doing some good and could use always, more help, more money. But the kind of unity all these sites could use, the same as us, is something we all know needs to happen in a big way and I’d guess here — you people hanging out here don’t see your train as the place for this to happen. Yet, hedonist hit on this; something about “we should keep our focus on the immediate circle and ripple-effects will surely happen.”
Somewhere, somehow, a ripple-effect will take shape. Will it be one we can get behind? Realize—powerful money knows the same as we do: social networking will take off here. It had the power to change the face of Mideast rule and we will attempt to do the same here so it’s only a matter of time before the next Occupy or Tea party unity flares. However, powermongers don’t stay powerful if they don’t foresee, to then quell, rough waters detrimental to them.
Clever people reside here in on ‘moving train’ but I believe frustration resides because this train is more like a track of stalled idler cars; doing little but waiting to be a part of something tangible yet nothing ever happens. Well, the dialogue moves, hell—it jumps! Like lightening bugs, everybody’s insightful thoughts jump all over the place right up until we’ve become so inundated with it all—we switch the lights off and go take cover.
the bantering of musings is all you want from this train then you’ve got it. But consider; could this train do more? Had it once been more active, alive? Sometimes I get on here and there are 2 or 3 others. Considering this is a world-wide forum, I’d guess this train is a fading fad where only a handful of loyal die-hards remain. For the many others just like me, who once thought they finally found a place where our voice could unify and ripple beyond, probably deboard after a time.
I suppose they are still looking for a place just like this. A place where our voice matters—not money, money, more money. A place where clever people gather and the potential of what a social networking site can do—hangs ripe in the air. Do you guys, the ones I named earlier, realize you are standing guard over this diamond in the rough? And, is that all you want to do with it? Kat; are you listening? “Stick” this so it doesn’t get lost in the shuffle. I’d like to hear from ALL of you. What do you want this ‘moving train’ to do? I can’t check in all the time to keep this thread active—you must do it.
Post edited by Unknown User on
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Comments
seriously ... i would say that the critical thinkers that post on this forum (majority) could come to a consensus on 95% of the issues out there given objective factual information ... we all really want the same thing - it's a matter of how we get there and whether or not the true conspirators in this play take us off course ...
Alpine tickets sale was that day at May 11
"..That's One Happy Fuckin Ghost.."
“..That came up on the Pillow Case...This is for the Greek, With Our Apologies.....”
The poison from the poison stream caught up to you ELEVEN years ago and you floated out of here. Sept. 14, 08
That's for you "question mark"!
But I'm a tired member. I don't participate a whole lot because I can't stand the extreme negativity that this place can be, especially in the past few months. So when I see other members at least trying to talk about uniting, it is definitely a start. But like you said, folks just go on to the next hot topic.
One thing I've noticed here. A positive thread gets hardly any replies vs. a negative one.
If people really, truly want to unite, then stop talking politics and start talking to each other like we're friends. Because politics breeds nothing but hate, and I've seen a lot of hate here in the last coming months during election season. I can't stand it, and it definitely causes me to leave.
To dimitris; Alpine tickets eh? I wondered what happened that day.
To evenflow- question mark; a canook? the 911 thread, I'll look for it but here's my question back — must it take something like that for us to reach out to each other?
To cindybearcat; A sense of humor! thanks! Guess you told him... (yikes, I know what can happen now).
To whygohome; thanks for the encouragement. This doesn't have to be painful — we can have fun doing this and your post help keeps it on track. All we have to do is figure out how to move it forward!
To Jeanwah; well said. Thanks. I've left several times because of the negative. Just had an arguement with my Dad because he's pouting about the turnout and all he wants to spew is all the negatives. Wall street, education in the dumps etc.. I did reply the power dance is playing the markets right now, and the commentators & experts he likes to listen to (all negative) are paid to be part of that show. The education, I did tell him I know we are now ranked 17th, but later, I did think I remembered at the end of Bush's term — our education ranked 21st...
Anyone remember?
I just got home, I'll check in later to see if anyone else is game but I'm surely getting close to 75 words!
Ps. is it a cut & paste thing when you want to quote someone's response in your post?
Very nice post Dancepartner,
Many times I have to take breaks from the negativity that comes our way on AMT. I can just imagine how things would have been had the election been a Romney victory. Some from the Romney side after having very strong views on their issues have ALL but disappeared and that's sad because one should stand by those strong views whether or not you came out on top or not. I know I would be here to say congratulations to the Romney team and hopefully he can turn our economy around like he campaigned throughout this year.
Just the same I hope we can come to some sort of connection in these upcoming years especially here in Florida with our voting systems and our governor. The same leader who appears to not care how long some voters have to wait in lines till they just give up hopefully in his eyes. However, floridians stuck it out in my county Palm Beach County, Broward, Dade County and sent the message to let all the citizens of Florida have the opportunity to vote and counted in a timely fashion.
I hope we can all come together in the upcoming years in peace and love but could I just be having some wishful thinking?
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
I can't say I blame the Romney supporters for being MIA. there was one thread that usamasan1 started a while before the election declaring Romney the winner. After Obama won, it was one "told ya so" and laughy smiley face after another from the Obama side.
And that would have happened if Romney had one as well. See, it's the internet. None of know each other personally, well, most of us don't. There's largely no consequence for posting something you wouldn't normally say to someone's face. that's what makes this place really hard to take sometimes.
On the other side, I have had some very enlightening discussions with people on here that I disagree with, but can remain respectful of their views as they do mine.
I've learned (after many warnings and a few bannings) not to add fuel to any fire. Just walk away from it. Let it burn out. If you aren't making a constructive comment, then just don't say it.
These fucking emoticons to the right don't help either. They incite more anger and defensiveness than any words that are said on here. this one
> :fp: in particular.
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
I'm Canadian. And I'm awesome.
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
Hugh, man I totally agree I can't stand that sob, what do you call it emoticons. First time I saw the word I did not know what the hell it meant, my favorite is just simply the smile.
Anger and I know more than you attitude is what is given off with that palm face thing. To maybe incite more of an argument which is what we need much less of here on AMT. just a little more peace and understanding is more of what we need...oppps I'm sounding like a few on here but I mean that from the heart without the red face angry person some of here can be including myself. I have lost my kool here but I know a New Years resolution of mine will to play it kool and be more graceful under pressure.
Peace people and Stay Human
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
"I need your strength for me to be strong...I need your love to feel loved"
It's late, I'm tired, just scanned this thread ( I will read the whole thing though, Dance!) so far but this really sticks out wonderfully. As much as I strongly disagree with some of you here I would defend you all as my friends. After Joey Ramone died, Johnny was asked how he felt and he basically said he was confused becasue it really bothered him. He kind of stared off and thought a minute and went on to say that Joey was a part of the Ramone and he loved the Ramones and if someone attacked Joey he would stand up for him.
So there you have it- too many words from me, succinct and right on, Jeanwah.
-Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
To g under p; the wishful thinking comment got me. Yeah, we can vote then hope. And, we can wish for should of's and could of's but the thing is — we create our own reality. So! I've put it out there, a chance to turn a wish into a reality but it's up to you guys, keep wishing — or — take a chance.
To Hugh FD; Anonymity. When I began the Dancing Partner series, I thought a good deal about whether to expose myself, picture and all, or if a unity message would fare better under anonymity. It's now been 3 months. I still don't know the answer to that. Yeah, it provides an easy escape; you don't have to fully own up to what you say which is one reason I like EV. He goes way out there, unafraid to own his words or actions. Sometimes I'm embarrassed for him but then I gotta laugh at the very idea.
For me, 3 months later, I've evloved a bit. I no longer have trepidations about putting out for all the world to see, my beliefs, convictions and passions; the very traits that make me feel fully exposed — anonymous or not. My beliefs, convictions and passions are rock-solid, yet going from a wishing state of mind to actually doing something public, was not easy and though I've grown comfortable, (for the most part) I must still contend with a fickle ego; 'is my average American voice worth resounding or not?' Basically, I try to keep myself centered with the thought that somewhere, somehow, someone, must at least try to rally us and I may have a hard time forgiving myself if I don't at least try.
So tell me, do you think a unity message would fare better if I splayed myself right down to my white ass & crooked smile, or do you think for this mission; it's better to focus on the message rather than the messenger?
To binuaraljam; i'll guess your post had to do with emoticons?
To brianlux; Good call! I'm going to bed as well. Thanks for chimming in though.
To Cliffy; Thanks for the encouragement. While you are thinking, please remember to consider the last part of this original thread: what do you want to see happen on this moving train? Do you like it the way it is, or do you think it, we, could do so much more here?
my honest opinion is that if anyone really wants to make a difference and for the world to take them seriously, they can't hide behind a screen name/face. there's no accountability there. and I use the word hide not because that's what we are doing, but because if we try to be taken seriously that is what is perceived. that we can say anything without consequence because we are internet ghosts.
there's one guy on here, I don't know if I see him that much anymore, who used his full real name and picture of himself. I think his name might be Andrew, I think he is from Australia. He said if everyone here did that we'd all be a lot nicer to each other, and he's probably right.
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
"I need your strength for me to be strong...I need your love to feel loved"
"I need your strength for me to be strong...I need your love to feel loved"
that is, once a post is made that attacks the person and doesn't address the opinion/argument just stated, the buzzer needs to be blown and and poster needs to be politely reminded. Not by kat or sea, but by all of us. --Very most importantly...policing OUR OWN SELVES.
Personal attacks are part of so many of these threads,
It just shouldn't be accepted, yet it is.
Not only is it merely accepted, its VERY common practice and by used by ALMOST ALL of the regular posters (yes that you listed) and almost all of the time.
The eye rolling and the face palming smilies should also be disallowed. They promote condoscending which is also a very common practice.
It is just as easy to use the phrases "there must be some misunderstanding" or "I believe you might be misinformed", rather than "You don't know what you're talking about"
yet it is the tone of the latter phrase which is 94 out of 100 times chosen.
This is the biggest breakdown of true debate that I find to be a problem on the moving train that can be easily fixed just by everyone checking their own selves.
Brave soul! I can't believe he did that!
my real name is Abrahma Lincoln... shhhhh!
-Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
As for AMT- my experience in the last few years is that besides being a moving train it is also a fluid and rather dysfunctional family. But a lot of good can come from that. Think the Ramones, "We're a Happy Family".
Who knows if you'll get this stickied- kind of doubtful- but that's probably why they came up with the "bump" concept. In any case, it's generated some good thought and discussion already. Good to have you aboard!
-Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
"..That's One Happy Fuckin Ghost.."
“..That came up on the Pillow Case...This is for the Greek, With Our Apologies.....”
Now you owe me two beers.
Yeah, it is a good thing that we can agree to disagree on things, and then all meet up for drinks before the shows and laugh our asses off.
The poison from the poison stream caught up to you ELEVEN years ago and you floated out of here. Sept. 14, 08
― Bertrand Russell
Thank you, dancepartner & bravo! I for one am glad you are truly learning things -->constitution, politics, environment, etc... There are so many smart, humorous and caring folks on this board.
Why is there a "moving train" or an "AET" to begin with? I would guess Pearl Jam believes people should have a voice, one that can be expressed, regardless of age, race, gender, religion, etc... I would also assume that just being plain respectful would be the only guideline to follow. There is a reason so many of us, from so many different walks of life, come to this place to begin with. Enthusiasm and Spirit for the band we love. Sure, there is moaning and complaining, but ideas CAN actually be built upon. People DO help each other.
These threads allow interested people to trade thoughts, pick up ideas, exchange music, cheerlead (and complain) about PJ, politics etc...
Sadly, like the real physical world, where people engage belly to belly -if you are here long enough, you will find some nasty comments and cheap shots. Depending on the day one is having, once one reads enough cheap shots, one might get angry. When people are angry enough, they eventually lash out and flame back. If these same people treated this as belly to belly and more of a business environment, what would happen if you were mean, rude, crude and inflamatory to your customer or co-workers? Never ends well and the end results are usually poor, right?
(When you sign up for 10 C and the privilege to post here, they should send a PJ rubberband for your wrist - with the instruction: when you want to be angry, retaliate or say something negative towards someone - being downright nasty or rude, simply snap the band back a few times before you post as a reminder!)
I want this train to be a place where people learn, generate ideas, feel safe and are able to communicate with people where spots in their everyday life just wouldn't allow - a safe haven, if you will. Your message of unity is a welcomed one, dancepartner. I am very proud of your efforts here and as well, all of the thoughtful responses from this community.
I for one look forward to more of your light, dancepartner!
SHINE ON!
7.9.03~9.28.04~10.1.05~5.12.06~5.13.06~5.27.06~5.28.06
8.5.08(EV)~10.9.09~5.21.10~6.20.11(EV)~7.5.11(EV)~7.9.11(EV)
11.21.13~8.27.16(EV)~11.14.16(TOTD)~4.13.20~9.27.20~9.26.21~10.2.21
2.15.22 (EV)~2.25.22 (EV)~2.27.22 (EV)~5.3.22~5.7.22~9.17.24~9.29.24
I'll buy ya 4!!!!
Biggest... thanks to a few, I've learned I really don't ever want a thick skin,
I want to feel...
it is where my common sense, my logic, my intuition lies.
I say thanks to those who are truly versed both in topics and in people skills,
who want to share, listen, and attempt understanding, after all, that is how we learn.