You should fix your quote... you make me look like the bad guy
(Pandora)
I'm not sure what happened to my jumble of quotes. To avoid the problem again, I just italicized your last words. I stand by what I have said and never intended to make my words yours.
There's a 'bad guy' in this discussion?
Is this because he called 'bullshit' to your claim that some of the the victims of the crime have publically empathized with the ruthless killer? Is it the term I used? If so, I must apologize for my crude mannerisms- in my circle of friends... it's commonly used and not deemed offensive. I am seriously not sure what else you would call such utterings the way they sit in my mind?
I'll apologize again, but, "No, seriously I saw it once on CNN in the afternoon sometime" doesn't legitimize your statements. Until proven, they remain outlandish.
Again, if I hear differently... I'll be on this forum, hat in hand, apologizing.
Until then, I think I'm going to leave your comments alone. For at least this topic, we are way too far apart to do anything but argue. We have done enough of that. Have a nice day.
Yes the bullshit term is rude and condescending and truly inappropriate for debate
or even polite discussion. (And I think you meant I not "he")
Those were not my words,
I gave you an estimated time and it sticks with me because it moved my heart.
A young lady and I sat at home from 2pm until we picked up my son from work at 5 pm
watching CNN mostly, flipping maybe to Fox news. Didn't think I would need to prove it
To me what is outlandish is that you would think not a soul in the world
could have empathy for this man. I will give a good lord here and mean that.
I have a feeling church sermons are reflecting on the shooter as well,
giving empathy.
An apology does not contain a BUT because it puts blame on the one receiving it
therefore removing all heartfelt and sincere feeling from it.
An apology is sorry plain and simple.
I agree no need to speak on the subject further... your day as well.
Maybe I wasn't very clear. For clarification's sake... I apologized for the term I used. I never apologized for my reluctance to believe the victims are empathizing with the victim through the media- but said I would apologize again if I ever hear this is actually the case.
I do think there are people that have empathy for this man- I never once implied that (you are living proof). I stated that the victims are not part of that group.
Some dude who got shot was in the hostpital and did an interview, and he briefly mentioned that he has pity for the man or something because he assumed he was a sick fuck. And I think I saw one witness say she felt bad for him in a way because he must be so screwed up in the head. That's it. 1 out of 70 people, and 1 more out of another couple hundred witnesses. But Pandora was right... but as far as I know, ONE victim has expressed this sentiment publicly, and that was within 24 hours of him being shot (and his mother was sitting there and actually kind of looked at him like he was crazy when he said it, lol). Who knows how he feels now that the shock has worn off. *shrug* I think all that is neither here nor there, frankly.
Post edited by PJ_Soul on
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Woah, interesting. Thanks for that.
I also found this an interesting read: http://us.cnn.com/2012/07/25/health/rai ... ?hpt=hp_t2
***
"How can we better guard ourselves against crimes that make no sense and come with no warning?
Court appearance fuels theories about Colorado shooting suspect.
I don't have an answer to this hugely important question, but one doesn't have to share my experience as an emergency psychiatrist to recognize at least two factors that most of the recent mass murders share in common. First, they have been conducted by young men. And second, they were conducted by men who may have become psychotic, although few details are currently known regarding accused Colorado shooter James Holmes' mental condition.
Because we use the word "psychotic" loosely in common parlance it is worth defining it more carefully here. To be psychotic is to have lost touch with common shared human reality. While this can and does occur in a variety of ways, most people with psychosis struggle with two primary types of symptoms: delusions and hallucinations.
Delusions are fixed false beliefs. Sometimes delusions are wrong, but make sense. But just as often, they are so bizarre that the people afflicted with them cannot explain their ideas in a way that is comprehensible to anyone else.
Hallucinations occur when someone experiences something that is not present, or more technically, that is not experienced by others in the same environment. All the senses are vulnerable to hallucinations, but most hallucinations involve either sight or sound. People see or hear things that aren't there. Interestingly, visual hallucinations are more common in older people with brain diseases such as dementia, and auditory hallucinations are more common in younger people suffering from psychiatric illnesses such as schizophrenia or bipolar disorder (manic depression).
We know from many studies that the vast majority of individuals afflicted with a psychotic disorder do not commit violence. And I know from much professional experience that people with schizophrenia are, as a group, among the sweetest and most dignified people on the planet. But it is also very clear from studies that people with psychotic disorders are far more likely than others to commit violent acts.
And the great tragedy behind these acts is that they are typically committed by people who may believe they are doing the right thing. Some of the most harrowing experiences of my professional life have involved watching people who had done something terrible when psychotic come to realize the horror of their deeds as they regained their sense of reality through treatment."
Ok...your quoting has me a bit boggled :crazy: so not sure if I'm replying to the right part of your post.
that's ok, we can just start over. I have all the time in the world.
guns protect by.....wait for it....killing or injuring or threatening to kill or injure. Unless you use it to repel the bullets à la Wonder Woman's bracelets, in which case you are required to wear her whole outfit. Do you need an assault rifle to do target practice? And even so, why do you then need to keep it in your car or in your home or on your person?
Threatening a criminal with bodily harm, or harming them isn't something I am going to lose sleep over. Ever.
threatening the innocent is a crime already punishable.
I have answered this a few times, but no, no one needs an AR-15 or AK-47. No one needs anything but food water and shelter. In fact, most hunters wouldn't use them to hunt because of the caliber of the bullets. they are low caliber for big game if my memory serves correctly, and unless you are a crack shot you will wound an animal rather than, as odd as this sounds, kill it humanely (I get the slight contradiction in that but this isn't an argument about hunting). Most hunters don't go for that.
Sure he could kill a lot of people by setting a fire. How many people keep cans of gasoline in their homes or in their cars or on their person? I'm guessing not many...because it's dangerous
anyone with a lawn mower has at least 2 gallons at home...or they will wish they did when the mower stops working in the middle of the work
87 killed in a new york arson fire at a bar. kind of puts into perspective that people intent on doing harm will do it, and with something he likely purchased for a dollar a gallon.
Of course people's behavior matters more than the tools, but why have such open access to those tools that serve no other purpose than to injure and kill?
I already explained that they do serve other purposes than injuring and killing humans. Target shooting is a fun, stress relieving, adrenaline pumping activity and is a good skill to have. Not acknowledging that fact makes it hard to discuss further with any real hope at a conclusion. Your bias is clear, and so is mine. Prove to the supreme court that guns are a constant clear and present danger and you will be able to limit the 2nd amendment to your heart's desire. Or get a constitutional amendment passed. Those really are the options. Common sense isn't the same to everyone and thinking that all the limits in the world will stop dip-shits from doing this is wrong.
Hand guns kill far more people and are used in far more violent crimes than assault rifles. Regardless of how effective a gun appears to be, the vast majority of the people who own assault rifles are responsible gun owners. Why punish all of them for the actions of a few? I don't understand that rational. That isn't limited to guns by the way, it is in all things.
No one walks around with an assault rifle in the streets. Often times that is illegal. Leaving the house with a loaded weapon in MN without a permit will land you in some serious trouble. They don't just hand out those permits to anyone who wants one by the way.
Hunting shotguns/rifles need to be unloaded in vehicles while transporting them. as well as being unloaded, they need to be out of reach by vehicle passengers but you may get some leeway depending on what you are doing.
We have an extremely high murder rate comparatively, do you think they go away with less guns? i don't know if I agree with that. You can point to other countries and say the gun laws there are strict and look, less murders and violent crime. To some degree you may be right. But correlation doesn't = causality. I could hand you a rock and tell you it protects you from tiger attacks, and if you live on earth you will probably not be attacked by a tiger. Doesn't mean that the rock protected you...it probably means there is a Host of other reasons as to why you weren't attacked, mystical powers of the rock not withstanding of course. point being, we need to figure out our penchant in the US to "take things out side" to punch/stab/shoot first and ask questions later attitude that is so prevalent. That is my greater concern, it isn't what those people use to kill that concerns me.
Best statistics I could find in one place
Homicides by Weapon Used, 2000-2008
Totals, 2000-2008 % of total
Handguns 65,581 51%
Rifles 3,791 3% should add that it isn't necessarily assault rifles.
Shotguns 4,356 3%
Other firearm not specified or type unknown 820 1%
Firearms, type not stated 11,564 9%
Firearm subtotals 86,112 66%
Knives or cutting instruments 16,547 13%
Blunt Objects 5,782 4%
Personal Weapons 8,220 6%
Poison 106 0%
Explosives 43 0%
Fire 1,093 1%
Narcotics 408 0%
Drowning 150 0%
Strangulation 1,281 1%
Asphyxiation 948 1%
All other 9,051 7%
All other weapons subtotals 43,629 34%
Total, all types: 129,741 100%
Interesting stats from the census bureau. Tells me that I have a better chance of being stabbed to death than killed by an assault rifle. But maybe I am wrong...I mean even if you factor in all types of guns not known and consider them assault rifles...add that to the total of all rifles (hunting and assault) it is still less. I don't know, but I am now terrified of cutting tools I can tell you that.
I would be remiss if I didn't acknowledge the fact that accidental discharge deaths would be preventable if guns were completely banned. That is a fair amount of people, same with suicide (although don't know how many of them would have still done it).
I understand the want for gun control in the country, but do we need it is the better question isn't it?
:shock: That's a lot of words. And we seem to have shifted from your original question about how a gun could impact free speech, but I'm used to following tangential lines of thought I'm going to answer the main points as succinctly as possible.
Regardless of whether or not you would lose sleep, we come back to the same conclusion that guns are solely designed to injure or kill or to threaten to injure or kill (I feel like I've said this before). :think: People may keep cans of gasoline for a lawnmower (ideally not in their home) :shock: which also proves the point that gas serves a purpose other than to kill or injure.
That's great that target practice is a stress reliever for you. I would argue that you don't need a gun to engage in this. I have a whole list of effective stress reducers that don't involve guns if you're interested.
You're point about the murder rate is interesting. I agree that human behavior is the most important factor, namely the need for power. Some people use guns to attain power, others drive big cars to feel more powerful. I think if someone wants to kill themselves or others, they will find a tool and a way to do it, but I'm all for advocating for a less efficient way. Guns certainly aren't the source of the problem, but since it's clear that we live in a country in which the homicide rate is high, having such an effective tool to murder is a huge concern. It would be an interesting experiment to have 2 islands, one where everyone has a gun and one where no one does, and see what happens Lord of the Flies style. Something tells me the same human traits for power and control would emerge, but poor little Piggy might suffer a worse fate on the island of guns.
"I need your strength for me to be strong...I need your love to feel loved"
:shock: That's a lot of words. And we seem to have shifted from your original question about how a gun could impact free speech, but I'm used to following tangential lines of thought I'm going to answer the main points as succinctly as possible.
Regardless of whether or not you would lose sleep, we come back to the same conclusion that guns are solely designed to injure or kill or to threaten to injure or kill (I feel like I've said this before). :think: People may keep cans of gasoline for a lawnmower (ideally not in their home) :shock: which also proves the point that gas serves a purpose other than to kill or injure.
That's great that target practice is a stress reliever for you. I would argue that you don't need a gun to engage in this. I have a whole list of effective stress reducers that don't involve guns if you're interested.
You're point about the murder rate is interesting. I agree that human behavior is the most important factor, namely the need for power. Some people use guns to attain power, others drive big cars to feel more powerful. I think if someone wants to kill themselves or others, they will find a tool and a way to do it, but I'm all for advocating for a less efficient way. Guns certainly aren't the source of the problem, but since it's clear that we live in a country in which the homicide rate is high, having such an effective tool to murder is a huge concern. It would be an interesting experiment to have 2 islands, one where everyone has a gun and one where no one does, and see what happens Lord of the Flies style. Something tells me the same human traits for power and control would emerge, but poor little Piggy might suffer a worse fate on the island of guns.
First, I thought I received the answer I was looking for...and since it can happen but is VERY unlikely to happen, I don't believe it to be a major concern. and considering a gun being brandished or pointed at a person for no other reason than intimidation is already a crime, I am not concerned with it legitimately legally being used to limit free speech.
again, if you aren't willing to see that a gun's sole purpose is not to kill and maim we cannot go much further. I have given you a purpose to a firearm that has nothing to do with killing. It seems like you assume that someone who haves a gun in their house for protection will threaten to kill with it. That may be the case sometimes, but sometimes simply having it in hand will do the trick. I wouldn't have to threaten anyone, they will feel threatened themselves, and it serves them right for breaking into my house uninvited. What this clearly shows is that you aren't willing to see more uses for a weapon than simply killing. Which is fine, you can have that opinion but further discussion of the point is rather moot wouldn't you think?
I understand why people want gun control, I understand a lot about why people want the government to limit certain things...I just don't agree that it is their duty or their right to do it all the time with everything.
You may have a whole list of stress reducers that work for you, the same philosophy that asks the question why do people need guns gives birth to questioning what I do to relieve stress as if it is somehow wrong and that i don't need to do it. You are right, I don't need to do it, you don't need to squeeze a stress ball or get a massage, what it is is SOMETHING THAT WORKS FOR YOU.
I ask a lot of why do people need questions all day long...why do people need to text while they drive, why do people need to yell at their 1 year old kids like they are adults that have a different level of cognitive ability....the list goes on forever...the answer is no one NEEDS to do those things. We choose to do them.
The list of stats I posted is pretty clear...knives are more dangerous to you than assault weapons. I can buy a million knives tomorrow that I intend on doing harm with...I have to wait and go through a background check to legally purchase the firearm.
do you honestly believe that you can prove that all guns are a clear and present danger to society? that VAST majority will never be used to harm or threaten. Ever. That doesn't represent a clear and present danger to me.
that’s right! Can’t we all just get together and focus on our real enemies: monogamous gays and stem cells… - Ned Flanders
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
:shock: That's a lot of words. And we seem to have shifted from your original question about how a gun could impact free speech, but I'm used to following tangential lines of thought I'm going to answer the main points as succinctly as possible.
Regardless of whether or not you would lose sleep, we come back to the same conclusion that guns are solely designed to injure or kill or to threaten to injure or kill (I feel like I've said this before). :think: People may keep cans of gasoline for a lawnmower (ideally not in their home) :shock: which also proves the point that gas serves a purpose other than to kill or injure.
That's great that target practice is a stress reliever for you. I would argue that you don't need a gun to engage in this. I have a whole list of effective stress reducers that don't involve guns if you're interested.
You're point about the murder rate is interesting. I agree that human behavior is the most important factor, namely the need for power. Some people use guns to attain power, others drive big cars to feel more powerful. I think if someone wants to kill themselves or others, they will find a tool and a way to do it, but I'm all for advocating for a less efficient way. Guns certainly aren't the source of the problem, but since it's clear that we live in a country in which the homicide rate is high, having such an effective tool to murder is a huge concern. It would be an interesting experiment to have 2 islands, one where everyone has a gun and one where no one does, and see what happens Lord of the Flies style. Something tells me the same human traits for power and control would emerge, but poor little Piggy might suffer a worse fate on the island of guns.
First, I thought I received the answer I was looking for...and since it can happen but is VERY unlikely to happen, I don't believe it to be a major concern. and considering a gun being brandished or pointed at a person for no other reason than intimidation is already a crime, I am not concerned with it legitimately legally being used to limit free speech.
again, if you aren't willing to see that a gun's sole purpose is not to kill and maim we cannot go much further. I have given you a purpose to a firearm that has nothing to do with killing. It seems like you assume that someone who haves a gun in their house for protection will threaten to kill with it. That may be the case sometimes, but sometimes simply having it in hand will do the trick. I wouldn't have to threaten anyone, they will feel threatened themselves, and it serves them right for breaking into my house uninvited. What this clearly shows is that you aren't willing to see more uses for a weapon than simply killing. Which is fine, you can have that opinion but further discussion of the point is rather moot wouldn't you think?
I understand why people want gun control, I understand a lot about why people want the government to limit certain things...I just don't agree that it is their duty or their right to do it all the time with everything.
You may have a whole list of stress reducers that work for you, the same philosophy that asks the question why do people need guns gives birth to questioning what I do to relieve stress as if it is somehow wrong and that i don't need to do it. You are right, I don't need to do it, you don't need to squeeze a stress ball or get a massage, what it is is SOMETHING THAT WORKS FOR YOU.
I ask a lot of why do people need questions all day long...why do people need to text while they drive, why do people need to yell at their 1 year old kids like they are adults that have a different level of cognitive ability....the list goes on forever...the answer is no one NEEDS to do those things. We choose to do them.
The list of stats I posted is pretty clear...knives are more dangerous to you than assault weapons. I can buy a million knives tomorrow that I intend on doing harm with...I have to wait and go through a background check to legally purchase the firearm.
do you honestly believe that you can prove that all guns are a clear and present danger to society? that VAST majority will never be used to harm or threaten. Ever. That doesn't represent a clear and present danger to me.
Oh good. I'm glad you felt your question was answered. I wasn't sure.
I assume nothing about the people who own guns, only about the guns themselves. I'm positive that not everyone who has a gun in their home would threaten or kill with it, but yes we do disagree as that it still seems to be the only reason guns were made, whether or not someone chooses to use it in that manner. Just as shoes are made to be walked in, whether or not I choose to have a whole collection just to admire on a shelf :shifty: I'm open to hearing more purposes for a gun, but the target practice use is not a convincing one for me. And yes you wouldn't need to use the gun to threaten, I agree the gun is threatening in and of itself, as that is one of its purposes.
You absolutely can use any stress relieving activity that works for you. I'm not here to limit that choice....just pointing out that there are other options and guns are not a necessity for this. Good for you for finding something that works! Stress probably kills even more than guns.
Guns are certainly more efficient at killing than knives. I certainly don't feel safe being in the presence of one. They're certainly used for illegal purposes by people who own them legally often enough to make me feel unsafe.
"I need your strength for me to be strong...I need your love to feel loved"
Oh good. I'm glad you felt your question was answered. I wasn't sure.
I assume nothing about the people who own guns, only about the guns themselves. I'm positive that not everyone who has a gun in their home would threaten or kill with it, but yes we do disagree as that it still seems to be the only reason guns were made, whether or not someone chooses to use it in that manner. Just as shoes are made to be walked in, whether or not I choose to have a whole collection just to admire on a shelf :shifty: I'm open to hearing more purposes for a gun, but the target practice use is not a convincing one for me. And yes you wouldn't need to use the gun to threaten, I agree the gun is threatening in and of itself, as that is one of its purposes.
You absolutely can have use any stress relieving activity that works for you. I'm not here to limit that choice....just pointing out that there are other options and guns are not a necessity for this. Good for you for finding something that works! Stress probably kills even more than guns.
Guns are certainly more efficient at killing than knives. I certainly don't feel safe being in the presence of one. They certainly used for illegal purposes by people who own them legally often enough to make me feel unsafe.
fair enough.
But statistics would say you should be more afraid of knives than assault rifles. That is my point. You feel afraid of them, not everyone does and that is what makes the argument so hard I think...You will never here me say someone needs an AR-15. Ever. But it isn't my job to tell someone what they can have if it isn't being used against other people. Each situation is different and when we look at them as blankets we might as well cover all of the homicides with the same blanket. Likelihood of attack would show that assault weapons shouldn't be feared like some other tools people use for murder.
Maybe it would do you some good to target shoot. Give me a PM if you are ever in Minneapolis, you certainly can come with first timers are a blast to shoot with...it might give a better understanding of what I am talking about...My guns, and there are far many more people like me than not, are kept locked and safe and are used for legitimate purposes and yes, sometimes those purposes are intimidation of other people who happen to be criminals.
Assault rifles are definitely better at killing than knives, I guess the stabbers are just looking for more of a challenge?
It all boils down to needs and wants I suppose...We all want to tell someone what they need and what they should want...I don't think anyone is different there. Me saying that people shouldn't care about what anyone else does until it affects them directly is me telling someone what they should want...I am fully aware of that irony.
that’s right! Can’t we all just get together and focus on our real enemies: monogamous gays and stem cells… - Ned Flanders
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
Oh good. I'm glad you felt your question was answered. I wasn't sure.
I assume nothing about the people who own guns, only about the guns themselves. I'm positive that not everyone who has a gun in their home would threaten or kill with it, but yes we do disagree as that it still seems to be the only reason guns were made, whether or not someone chooses to use it in that manner. Just as shoes are made to be walked in, whether or not I choose to have a whole collection just to admire on a shelf :shifty: I'm open to hearing more purposes for a gun, but the target practice use is not a convincing one for me. And yes you wouldn't need to use the gun to threaten, I agree the gun is threatening in and of itself, as that is one of its purposes.
You absolutely can have use any stress relieving activity that works for you. I'm not here to limit that choice....just pointing out that there are other options and guns are not a necessity for this. Good for you for finding something that works! Stress probably kills even more than guns.
Guns are certainly more efficient at killing than knives. I certainly don't feel safe being in the presence of one. They certainly used for illegal purposes by people who own them legally often enough to make me feel unsafe.
fair enough.
But statistics would say you should be more afraid of knives than assault rifles. That is my point. You feel afraid of them, not everyone does and that is what makes the argument so hard I think...You will never here me say someone needs an AR-15. Ever. But it isn't my job to tell someone what they can have if it isn't being used against other people. Each situation is different and when we look at them as blankets we might as well cover all of the homicides with the same blanket. Likelihood of attack would show that assault weapons shouldn't be feared like some other tools people use for murder.
Maybe it would do you some good to target shoot. Give me a PM if you are ever in Minneapolis, you certainly can come with first timers are a blast to shoot with...it might give a better understanding of what I am talking about...My guns, and there are far many more people like me than not, are kept locked and safe and are used for legitimate purposes and yes, sometimes those purposes are intimidation of other people who happen to be criminals.
Assault rifles are definitely better at killing than knives, I guess the stabbers are just looking for more of a challenge?
It all boils down to needs and wants I suppose...We all want to tell someone what they need and what they should want...I don't think anyone is different there. Me saying that people shouldn't care about what anyone else does until it affects them directly is me telling someone what they should want...I am fully aware of that irony.
Thanks for the invitation, but you seriously would not want to take me target shooting :shock: Seriously, if you ever have the opportunity to see me play softball, table tennis, golf or bowling you would not want to let me anywhere near a gun :? You might quickly jump to wanting to ban all guns as a matter of fact :think:
I just feel like if someone wants to kill me they should work for it, so statistically knives might be more responsible for more deaths, but at least they have to put a little effort in :P I mean don't be lazy about your killings :roll:
"I need your strength for me to be strong...I need your love to feel loved"
Oh good. I'm glad you felt your question was answered. I wasn't sure.
I assume nothing about the people who own guns, only about the guns themselves. I'm positive that not everyone who has a gun in their home would threaten or kill with it, but yes we do disagree as that it still seems to be the only reason guns were made, whether or not someone chooses to use it in that manner. Just as shoes are made to be walked in, whether or not I choose to have a whole collection just to admire on a shelf :shifty: I'm open to hearing more purposes for a gun, but the target practice use is not a convincing one for me. And yes you wouldn't need to use the gun to threaten, I agree the gun is threatening in and of itself, as that is one of its purposes.
You absolutely can have use any stress relieving activity that works for you. I'm not here to limit that choice....just pointing out that there are other options and guns are not a necessity for this. Good for you for finding something that works! Stress probably kills even more than guns.
Guns are certainly more efficient at killing than knives. I certainly don't feel safe being in the presence of one. They certainly used for illegal purposes by people who own them legally often enough to make me feel unsafe.
fair enough.
But statistics would say you should be more afraid of knives than assault rifles. That is my point. You feel afraid of them, not everyone does and that is what makes the argument so hard I think...You will never here me say someone needs an AR-15. Ever. But it isn't my job to tell someone what they can have if it isn't being used against other people. Each situation is different and when we look at them as blankets we might as well cover all of the homicides with the same blanket. Likelihood of attack would show that assault weapons shouldn't be feared like some other tools people use for murder.
Maybe it would do you some good to target shoot. Give me a PM if you are ever in Minneapolis, you certainly can come with first timers are a blast to shoot with...it might give a better understanding of what I am talking about...My guns, and there are far many more people like me than not, are kept locked and safe and are used for legitimate purposes and yes, sometimes those purposes are intimidation of other people who happen to be criminals.
Assault rifles are definitely better at killing than knives, I guess the stabbers are just looking for more of a challenge?
It all boils down to needs and wants I suppose...We all want to tell someone what they need and what they should want...I don't think anyone is different there. Me saying that people shouldn't care about what anyone else does until it affects them directly is me telling someone what they should want...I am fully aware of that irony.
Thanks for the invitation, but you seriously would not want to take me target shooting :shock: Seriously, if you ever have the opportunity to see me play softball, table tennis, golf or bowling you would not want to let me anywhere near a gun :? You might quickly jump to wanting to ban all guns as a matter of fact :think:
I just feel like if someone wants to kill me they should work for it, so statistically knives might be more responsible for more deaths, but at least they have to put a little effort in :P I mean don't be lazy about your killings :roll:
on both accounts
I agree, I don't want to be murdered by anything other than a bowling bowl falling through a bath tub that starts off a chain reaction ah la mouse trap. I would be disappointed if it went down any other way.
that’s right! Can’t we all just get together and focus on our real enemies: monogamous gays and stem cells… - Ned Flanders
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
Oh good. I'm glad you felt your question was answered. I wasn't sure.
I assume nothing about the people who own guns, only about the guns themselves. I'm positive that not everyone who has a gun in their home would threaten or kill with it, but yes we do disagree as that it still seems to be the only reason guns were made, whether or not someone chooses to use it in that manner. Just as shoes are made to be walked in, whether or not I choose to have a whole collection just to admire on a shelf :shifty: I'm open to hearing more purposes for a gun, but the target practice use is not a convincing one for me. And yes you wouldn't need to use the gun to threaten, I agree the gun is threatening in and of itself, as that is one of its purposes.
You absolutely can have use any stress relieving activity that works for you. I'm not here to limit that choice....just pointing out that there are other options and guns are not a necessity for this. Good for you for finding something that works! Stress probably kills even more than guns.
Guns are certainly more efficient at killing than knives. I certainly don't feel safe being in the presence of one. They certainly used for illegal purposes by people who own them legally often enough to make me feel unsafe.
fair enough.
But statistics would say you should be more afraid of knives than assault rifles. That is my point. You feel afraid of them, not everyone does and that is what makes the argument so hard I think...You will never here me say someone needs an AR-15. Ever. But it isn't my job to tell someone what they can have if it isn't being used against other people. Each situation is different and when we look at them as blankets we might as well cover all of the homicides with the same blanket. Likelihood of attack would show that assault weapons shouldn't be feared like some other tools people use for murder.
Maybe it would do you some good to target shoot. Give me a PM if you are ever in Minneapolis, you certainly can come with first timers are a blast to shoot with...it might give a better understanding of what I am talking about...My guns, and there are far many more people like me than not, are kept locked and safe and are used for legitimate purposes and yes, sometimes those purposes are intimidation of other people who happen to be criminals.
Assault rifles are definitely better at killing than knives, I guess the stabbers are just looking for more of a challenge?
It all boils down to needs and wants I suppose...We all want to tell someone what they need and what they should want...I don't think anyone is different there. Me saying that people shouldn't care about what anyone else does until it affects them directly is me telling someone what they should want...I am fully aware of that irony.
The thing is, knife attacks are almost NEVER random or accidents. They are usually fights in bar parking lots and domestic disputes and street fights and shit like that. Random innocent bystanders don't get caught in the downswing of a knife, and someone with a knife can't commit a mass murder.
Post edited by PJ_Soul on
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
But statistics would say you should be more afraid of knives than assault rifles. That is my point. You feel afraid of them, not everyone does and that is what makes the argument so hard I think...You will never here me say someone needs an AR-15. Ever. But it isn't my job to tell someone what they can have if it isn't being used against other people. Each situation is different and when we look at them as blankets we might as well cover all of the homicides with the same blanket. Likelihood of attack would show that assault weapons shouldn't be feared like some other tools people use for murder.
Maybe it would do you some good to target shoot. Give me a PM if you are ever in Minneapolis, you certainly can come with first timers are a blast to shoot with...it might give a better understanding of what I am talking about...My guns, and there are far many more people like me than not, are kept locked and safe and are used for legitimate purposes and yes, sometimes those purposes are intimidation of other people who happen to be criminals.
Assault rifles are definitely better at killing than knives, I guess the stabbers are just looking for more of a challenge?
It all boils down to needs and wants I suppose...We all want to tell someone what they need and what they should want...I don't think anyone is different there. Me saying that people shouldn't care about what anyone else does until it affects them directly is me telling someone what they should want...I am fully aware of that irony.
Thanks for the invitation, but you seriously would not want to take me target shooting :shock: Seriously, if you ever have the opportunity to see me play softball, table tennis, golf or bowling you would not want to let me anywhere near a gun :? You might quickly jump to wanting to ban all guns as a matter of fact :think:
I just feel like if someone wants to kill me they should work for it, so statistically knives might be more responsible for more deaths, but at least they have to put a little effort in :P I mean don't be lazy about your killings :roll:
on both accounts
I agree, I don't want to be murdered by anything other than a bowling bowl falling through a bath tub that starts off a chain reaction ah la mouse trap. I would be disappointed if it went down any other way.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Thanks for the invitation, but you seriously would not want to take me target shooting :shock: Seriously, if you ever have the opportunity to see me play softball, table tennis, golf or bowling you would not want to let me anywhere near a gun :? You might quickly jump to wanting to ban all guns as a matter of fact :think:
I just feel like if someone wants to kill me they should work for it, so statistically knives might be more responsible for more deaths, but at least they have to put a little effort in :P I mean don't be lazy about your killings :roll:
on both accounts
I agree, I don't want to be murdered by anything other than a bowling bowl falling through a bath tub that starts off a chain reaction ah la mouse trap. I would be disappointed if it went down any other way.
Well here's hoping we both go out that way at the ripe old age of 105 just to stir those stats of yours up a bit
"I need your strength for me to be strong...I need your love to feel loved"
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Oh good. I'm glad you felt your question was answered. I wasn't sure.
I assume nothing about the people who own guns, only about the guns themselves. I'm positive that not everyone who has a gun in their home would threaten or kill with it, but yes we do disagree as that it still seems to be the only reason guns were made, whether or not someone chooses to use it in that manner. Just as shoes are made to be walked in, whether or not I choose to have a whole collection just to admire on a shelf :shifty: I'm open to hearing more purposes for a gun, but the target practice use is not a convincing one for me. And yes you wouldn't need to use the gun to threaten, I agree the gun is threatening in and of itself, as that is one of its purposes.
You absolutely can have use any stress relieving activity that works for you. I'm not here to limit that choice....just pointing out that there are other options and guns are not a necessity for this. Good for you for finding something that works! Stress probably kills even more than guns.
Guns are certainly more efficient at killing than knives. I certainly don't feel safe being in the presence of one. They certainly used for illegal purposes by people who own them legally often enough to make me feel unsafe.
fair enough.
But statistics would say you should be more afraid of knives than assault rifles. That is my point. You feel afraid of them, not everyone does and that is what makes the argument so hard I think...You will never here me say someone needs an AR-15. Ever. But it isn't my job to tell someone what they can have if it isn't being used against other people. Each situation is different and when we look at them as blankets we might as well cover all of the homicides with the same blanket. Likelihood of attack would show that assault weapons shouldn't be feared like some other tools people use for murder.
Maybe it would do you some good to target shoot. Give me a PM if you are ever in Minneapolis, you certainly can come with first timers are a blast to shoot with...it might give a better understanding of what I am talking about...My guns, and there are far many more people like me than not, are kept locked and safe and are used for legitimate purposes and yes, sometimes those purposes are intimidation of other people who happen to be criminals.
Assault rifles are definitely better at killing than knives, I guess the stabbers are just looking for more of a challenge?
It all boils down to needs and wants I suppose...We all want to tell someone what they need and what they should want...I don't think anyone is different there. Me saying that people shouldn't care about what anyone else does until it affects them directly is me telling someone what they should want...I am fully aware of that irony.
[Thanks for the invitation, but you seriously would not want to take me target shooting :shock: Seriously, if you ever have the opportunity to see me play softball, table tennis, golf or bowling you would not want to let me anywhere near a gun :? You might quickly jump to wanting to ban all guns as a matter of fact :think:
I just feel like if someone wants to kill me they should work for it, so statistically knives might be more responsible for more deaths, but at least they have to put a little effort in :P I mean don't be lazy about your killings :roll:
I agree one must work hard these days can't stand lazy people.
Peace
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
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Surfing The far side of THE Sombrero Galaxy Posts: 18,200
If you own a gun, you are statistically 50% more likely to die from your own gun than somebody elses.
So, owning a gun is statistically more deadly than not owning a gun.
I'm still for the right to bear arms, I just don't feel the need to own a gun.
Thats how I feel, I had many guns when I was younger, never an AR-15, mostly Browning 9mm and Wicnchestor Police Defenders. As I got older, I just don't feel the need to carry one or own one. Thankfully I never carried a gun in my car, I would have been a road rage statistic waiting to happen. I just don't want to live my life feeling I need to carry a gun everwhere I go, that would suck, for me at least.
Guns are DESIGNED to kill, many can use them for target practice (I did when was on my school's rifleteam) or they use guns to PROTECT themselves. I don't feel the need to own a gun at the moment. I may in the future purchase a 22 caliber rifle to shoot at our gun club. Just to see if I'm STILL as good of a shot as I was in college, I was #2 on my rifle team. Number one had at the time the best rifle and scope that rifle was badass.
Now in our home for protection let's see I have somewhere in our master bedroom a machete, baseball bat and a 4ft sword from Pakistan (you know the kind Conan would use..not the redhead, The Barbarian). Many times I'll go bare feet and practice Conan The Barbarian moves by the lake, I'm sure if my neighbors could see they would think I'm nuts. On the her side has a billy club sometimes I think it's for me.
Peace
This is the rifle I will get just to see if i STILL have the great training i recieved on my rifleteam and in the military. In all 3 positions...standing, kneeling and prone for target practice.
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
South Florida has a gang problem. The gang problem was rampant in my area until a few years ago when Palm Beach County Sheriff took over my little town of Lake Worth.(Gunder P you probably know) There were 5-6 shots fired from a gang member in the intersection outside my house a few weeks ago too. I thought about getting a gun a few times, but I decided to move instead.
BUT, the more I think about limiting certain guns, the more I think someday we could catch up to some of the criminals with special task forces. (I know, doubtful thinking)
And I saw this story today ^^^ of (likely) 12 guns taken off the street. Hopefully 15 guns werent sold illegally or stolen to offset that. I know that's just one instance, but every now and then they do a sweep and take dozens of guns off the streets. I wish we could come up with a way to get these guns off the street, at least some of them.
South Florida has a gang problem. The gang problem was rampant in my area until a few years ago when Palm Beach County Sheriff took over my little town of Lake Worth.(Gunder P you probably know) There were 5-6 shots fired from a gang member in the intersection outside my house a few weeks ago too. I thought about getting a gun a few times, but I decided to move instead.
BUT, the more I think about limiting certain guns, the more I think someday we could catch up to some of the criminals with special task forces. (I know, doubtful thinking)
And I saw this story today ^^^ of (likely) 12 guns taken off the street. Hopefully 15 guns werent sold illegally or stolen to offset that. I know that's just one instance, but every now and then they do a sweep and take dozens of guns off the streets. I wish we could come up with a way to get these guns off the street, at least some of them.
JP, living here in Lake Worth/Wellington area you were one of the first people to bring it to my attention we had gangs here. I had no idea i even asked myself what you were talking about way back. I asked my other half who has been here all her life she went to Lake Worth High says there has ALWAYS been gangs here. I mean every single day there's shootings in Riveria Beach....man I'm so glad I live to western edge of Lake Worth where it SEEMS like there's no gangs out here.
Peace
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
C'mon out to LA! - hell, just southern California. Northern Cali too.
Not sure if it's been on the news in your area, but in Anaheim (Orange County - quite aways from me, probably closer to where Cosmo is) there've been "protests" (read: looting, destruction of property, rocks and bottles tossed at police) in response to two separate police shootings last week...one of an armed man (I believe a gang member) and the other of an unarmed but known gang member.
Not saying it's right to shoot a weaponless person, but honestly? Two less pieces of shit off the streets, along with their guns.
(most of these asshats have lousy aim anyway, and end up taking out some innocents)
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Surfing The far side of THE Sombrero Galaxy Posts: 18,200
If you own a gun, you are statistically 50% more likely to die from your own gun than somebody elses.
So, owning a gun is statistically more deadly than not owning a gun.
I'm still for the right to bear arms, I just don't feel the need to own a gun.
Thats how I feel, I had many guns when I was younger, never an AR-15, mostly Browning 9mm and Wicnchestor Police Defenders. As I got older, I just don't feel the need to carry one or own one. Thankfully I never carried a gun in my car, I would have been a road rage statistic waiting to happen. I just don't want to live my life feeling I need to carry a gun everwhere I go, that would suck, for me at least.
Guns are DESIGNED to kill, many can use them for target practice (I did when was on my school's rifleteam) or they use guns to PROTECT themselves. I don't feel the need to own a gun at the moment. I may in the future purchase a 22 caliber rifle to shoot at our gun club. Just to see if I'm STILL as good of a shot as I was in college, I was #2 on my rifle team. Number one had at the time the best rifle and scope that rifle was badass.
Now in our home for protection let's see I have somewhere in our master bedroom a machete, baseball bat and a 4ft sword from Pakistan (you know the kind Conan would use..not the redhead, The Barbarian). Many times I'll go bare feet and practice Conan The Barbarian moves by the lake, I'm sure if my neighbors could see they would think I'm nuts. On the her side has a billy club sometimes I think it's for me.
Peace
This is the rifle I will get just to see if i STILL have the great training i recieved on my rifleteam and in the military. In all 3 positions...standing, kneeling and prone for target practice.
I just went shopping ONLINE for this rifle $3922.15 + shipping and handling. All they needed was my credit card and the rifle is mine. I can't believe that's all I need to get this.....I thought they would be some sort of background check of some sort., WOW! That's without a sights which would be another $515....this could be a another very expensive hobby.
Peace
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
Gun are for pussies; I have claymores rigged around my house and a grizzly I personally trained living inside. Guns...pffft.
You mean the ones with over 700 steel balls if so you are a bad *mothershutyourmouth* go on with your bad self.
Peace
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
Obama calls for US gun control laws to be tightened in wake of Aurora shooting
President affirms right to bear arms but says assault rifles do not belong in the hands of citizens, drawing contrast with Romney
Adam Gabbatt in New York
guardian.co.uk, Thursday 26 July 2012
'Barack Obama has addressed the issue of gun control for the first time since the Colorado film premiere shootings, appealing for "a consensus around violence reduction" and suggesting assault rifles "belong on the battlefield".
...The president's comments came as the Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney said the US did not need new gun laws and argued that "changing the heart of the American people" might be the way to avoid future tragedy instead.
...As governor of Massachusetts, Romney banned assault weapons such as the AR-15 used in the Aurora shooting. He described them as "instruments of destruction with the sole purpose of hunting down and killing people" as he signed the bill outlawing them in 2002.'
...Mitt Romney said the US did not need new gun laws and argued that "changing the heart of the American people" might be the way to avoid future tragedy instead....
if guns are the heart of the american people you all have a serious problem.
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
...Mitt Romney said the US did not need new gun laws and argued that "changing the heart of the American people" might be the way to avoid future tragedy instead....
if guns are the heart of the american people you all have a serious problem.
Yeah... There is more to it than what Mitt claims.
...Mitt Romney said the US did not need new gun laws and argued that "changing the heart of the American people" might be the way to avoid future tragedy instead....
if guns are the heart of the american people you all have a serious problem.
Yeah... There is more to it than what Mitt claims.
i actually think i misread that quote. :?
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
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Surfing The far side of THE Sombrero Galaxy Posts: 18,200
Obama calls for US gun control laws to be tightened in wake of Aurora shooting
President affirms right to bear arms but says assault rifles do not belong in the hands of citizens, drawing contrast with Romney
Adam Gabbatt in New York
guardian.co.uk, Thursday 26 July 2012
'Barack Obama has addressed the issue of gun control for the first time since the Colorado film premiere shootings, appealing for "a consensus around violence reduction" and suggesting assault rifles "belong on the battlefield".
...The president's comments came as the Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney said the US did not need new gun laws and argued that "changing the heart of the American people" might be the way to avoid future tragedy instead.
...As governor of Massachusetts, Romney banned assault weapons such as the AR-15 used in the Aurora shooting. He described them as "instruments of destruction with the sole purpose of hunting down and killing people" as he signed the bill outlawing them in 2002.'
Well don't ya know Romnry is now running for president so now EVERYTHING CHANGES!
Peace
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
Gun are for pussies; I have claymores rigged around my house and a grizzly I personally trained living inside. Guns...pffft.
Seriously...my attack cat would claw some shit out of people (she really would...all 8 pounds of her) :shock: and I can kick some ass with the right stiletto in my hand. WTF do I need a gun for?
"I need your strength for me to be strong...I need your love to feel loved"
Gun are for pussies; I have claymores rigged around my house and a grizzly I personally trained living inside. Guns...pffft.
Seriously...my attack cat would claw some shit out of people (she really would...all 8 pounds of her) :shock: and I can kick some ass with the right stiletto in my hand. WTF do I need a gun for?
for shooting those bastards who be wanting to take your shoes.
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
Gun are for pussies; I have claymores rigged around my house and a grizzly I personally trained living inside. Guns...pffft.
Seriously...my attack cat would claw some shit out of people (she really would...all 8 pounds of her) :shock: and I can kick some ass with the right stiletto in my hand. WTF do I need a gun for?
for shooting those bastards who be wanting to take your shoes.
Don't mess with my shoes :twisted:
My mom has to come feed my cats this weekend and we're a little afraid she won't let her in the door :oops: She wouldn't let her come inside when we went away before. Who needs guns for protection :roll: I mean really
"I need your strength for me to be strong...I need your love to feel loved"
Comments
http://www.schizophrenic.com/content/sc ... statistics
Woah, interesting. Thanks for that.
I also found this an interesting read:
http://us.cnn.com/2012/07/25/health/rai ... ?hpt=hp_t2
***
"How can we better guard ourselves against crimes that make no sense and come with no warning?
Court appearance fuels theories about Colorado shooting suspect.
I don't have an answer to this hugely important question, but one doesn't have to share my experience as an emergency psychiatrist to recognize at least two factors that most of the recent mass murders share in common. First, they have been conducted by young men. And second, they were conducted by men who may have become psychotic, although few details are currently known regarding accused Colorado shooter James Holmes' mental condition.
Because we use the word "psychotic" loosely in common parlance it is worth defining it more carefully here. To be psychotic is to have lost touch with common shared human reality. While this can and does occur in a variety of ways, most people with psychosis struggle with two primary types of symptoms: delusions and hallucinations.
Delusions are fixed false beliefs. Sometimes delusions are wrong, but make sense. But just as often, they are so bizarre that the people afflicted with them cannot explain their ideas in a way that is comprehensible to anyone else.
Hallucinations occur when someone experiences something that is not present, or more technically, that is not experienced by others in the same environment. All the senses are vulnerable to hallucinations, but most hallucinations involve either sight or sound. People see or hear things that aren't there. Interestingly, visual hallucinations are more common in older people with brain diseases such as dementia, and auditory hallucinations are more common in younger people suffering from psychiatric illnesses such as schizophrenia or bipolar disorder (manic depression).
We know from many studies that the vast majority of individuals afflicted with a psychotic disorder do not commit violence. And I know from much professional experience that people with schizophrenia are, as a group, among the sweetest and most dignified people on the planet. But it is also very clear from studies that people with psychotic disorders are far more likely than others to commit violent acts.
And the great tragedy behind these acts is that they are typically committed by people who may believe they are doing the right thing. Some of the most harrowing experiences of my professional life have involved watching people who had done something terrible when psychotic come to realize the horror of their deeds as they regained their sense of reality through treatment."
Regardless of whether or not you would lose sleep, we come back to the same conclusion that guns are solely designed to injure or kill or to threaten to injure or kill (I feel like I've said this before). :think: People may keep cans of gasoline for a lawnmower (ideally not in their home) :shock: which also proves the point that gas serves a purpose other than to kill or injure.
That's great that target practice is a stress reliever for you. I would argue that you don't need a gun to engage in this. I have a whole list of effective stress reducers that don't involve guns if you're interested.
You're point about the murder rate is interesting. I agree that human behavior is the most important factor, namely the need for power. Some people use guns to attain power, others drive big cars to feel more powerful. I think if someone wants to kill themselves or others, they will find a tool and a way to do it, but I'm all for advocating for a less efficient way. Guns certainly aren't the source of the problem, but since it's clear that we live in a country in which the homicide rate is high, having such an effective tool to murder is a huge concern. It would be an interesting experiment to have 2 islands, one where everyone has a gun and one where no one does, and see what happens Lord of the Flies style. Something tells me the same human traits for power and control would emerge, but poor little Piggy might suffer a worse fate on the island of guns.
"I need your strength for me to be strong...I need your love to feel loved"
First, I thought I received the answer I was looking for...and since it can happen but is VERY unlikely to happen, I don't believe it to be a major concern. and considering a gun being brandished or pointed at a person for no other reason than intimidation is already a crime, I am not concerned with it legitimately legally being used to limit free speech.
again, if you aren't willing to see that a gun's sole purpose is not to kill and maim we cannot go much further. I have given you a purpose to a firearm that has nothing to do with killing. It seems like you assume that someone who haves a gun in their house for protection will threaten to kill with it. That may be the case sometimes, but sometimes simply having it in hand will do the trick. I wouldn't have to threaten anyone, they will feel threatened themselves, and it serves them right for breaking into my house uninvited. What this clearly shows is that you aren't willing to see more uses for a weapon than simply killing. Which is fine, you can have that opinion but further discussion of the point is rather moot wouldn't you think?
I understand why people want gun control, I understand a lot about why people want the government to limit certain things...I just don't agree that it is their duty or their right to do it all the time with everything.
You may have a whole list of stress reducers that work for you, the same philosophy that asks the question why do people need guns gives birth to questioning what I do to relieve stress as if it is somehow wrong and that i don't need to do it. You are right, I don't need to do it, you don't need to squeeze a stress ball or get a massage, what it is is SOMETHING THAT WORKS FOR YOU.
I ask a lot of why do people need questions all day long...why do people need to text while they drive, why do people need to yell at their 1 year old kids like they are adults that have a different level of cognitive ability....the list goes on forever...the answer is no one NEEDS to do those things. We choose to do them.
The list of stats I posted is pretty clear...knives are more dangerous to you than assault weapons. I can buy a million knives tomorrow that I intend on doing harm with...I have to wait and go through a background check to legally purchase the firearm.
do you honestly believe that you can prove that all guns are a clear and present danger to society? that VAST majority will never be used to harm or threaten. Ever. That doesn't represent a clear and present danger to me.
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
I assume nothing about the people who own guns, only about the guns themselves. I'm positive that not everyone who has a gun in their home would threaten or kill with it, but yes we do disagree as that it still seems to be the only reason guns were made, whether or not someone chooses to use it in that manner. Just as shoes are made to be walked in, whether or not I choose to have a whole collection just to admire on a shelf :shifty: I'm open to hearing more purposes for a gun, but the target practice use is not a convincing one for me. And yes you wouldn't need to use the gun to threaten, I agree the gun is threatening in and of itself, as that is one of its purposes.
You absolutely can use any stress relieving activity that works for you. I'm not here to limit that choice....just pointing out that there are other options and guns are not a necessity for this. Good for you for finding something that works! Stress probably kills even more than guns.
Guns are certainly more efficient at killing than knives. I certainly don't feel safe being in the presence of one. They're certainly used for illegal purposes by people who own them legally often enough to make me feel unsafe.
"I need your strength for me to be strong...I need your love to feel loved"
fair enough.
But statistics would say you should be more afraid of knives than assault rifles. That is my point. You feel afraid of them, not everyone does and that is what makes the argument so hard I think...You will never here me say someone needs an AR-15. Ever. But it isn't my job to tell someone what they can have if it isn't being used against other people. Each situation is different and when we look at them as blankets we might as well cover all of the homicides with the same blanket. Likelihood of attack would show that assault weapons shouldn't be feared like some other tools people use for murder.
Maybe it would do you some good to target shoot. Give me a PM if you are ever in Minneapolis, you certainly can come with
Assault rifles are definitely better at killing than knives, I guess the stabbers are just looking for more of a challenge?
It all boils down to needs and wants I suppose...We all want to tell someone what they need and what they should want...I don't think anyone is different there. Me saying that people shouldn't care about what anyone else does until it affects them directly is me telling someone what they should want...I am fully aware of that irony.
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
I just feel like if someone wants to kill me they should work for it, so statistically knives might be more responsible for more deaths, but at least they have to put a little effort in :P I mean don't be lazy about your killings :roll:
"I need your strength for me to be strong...I need your love to feel loved"
I agree, I don't want to be murdered by anything other than a bowling bowl falling through a bath tub that starts off a chain reaction ah la mouse trap. I would be disappointed if it went down any other way.
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
"I need your strength for me to be strong...I need your love to feel loved"
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
This is the rifle I will get just to see if i STILL have the great training i recieved on my rifleteam and in the military. In all 3 positions...standing, kneeling and prone for target practice.
More stats on this rifle...http://www.championshooters.com/2012big.htm
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
BUT, the more I think about limiting certain guns, the more I think someday we could catch up to some of the criminals with special task forces. (I know, doubtful thinking)
http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/news/ ... g-d/nP4cw/
And I saw this story today ^^^ of (likely) 12 guns taken off the street. Hopefully 15 guns werent sold illegally or stolen to offset that. I know that's just one instance, but every now and then they do a sweep and take dozens of guns off the streets. I wish we could come up with a way to get these guns off the street, at least some of them.
JP, living here in Lake Worth/Wellington area you were one of the first people to bring it to my attention we had gangs here. I had no idea i even asked myself what you were talking about way back. I asked my other half who has been here all her life she went to Lake Worth High says there has ALWAYS been gangs here. I mean every single day there's shootings in Riveria Beach....man I'm so glad I live to western edge of Lake Worth where it SEEMS like there's no gangs out here.
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
Not sure if it's been on the news in your area, but in Anaheim (Orange County - quite aways from me, probably closer to where Cosmo is) there've been "protests" (read: looting, destruction of property, rocks and bottles tossed at police) in response to two separate police shootings last week...one of an armed man (I believe a gang member) and the other of an unarmed but known gang member.
Not saying it's right to shoot a weaponless person, but honestly? Two less pieces of shit off the streets, along with their guns.
(most of these asshats have lousy aim anyway, and end up taking out some innocents)
http://www.championshooters.com/2213big.htm
I just went shopping ONLINE for this rifle $3922.15 + shipping and handling. All they needed was my credit card and the rifle is mine. I can't believe that's all I need to get this.....I thought they would be some sort of background check of some sort., WOW! That's without a sights which would be another $515....this could be a another very expensive hobby.
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
is your bear armed??
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
You mean the ones with over 700 steel balls if so you are a bad *mothershutyourmouth* go on with your bad self.
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/ju ... -tightened
Obama calls for US gun control laws to be tightened in wake of Aurora shooting
President affirms right to bear arms but says assault rifles do not belong in the hands of citizens, drawing contrast with Romney
Adam Gabbatt in New York
guardian.co.uk, Thursday 26 July 2012
'Barack Obama has addressed the issue of gun control for the first time since the Colorado film premiere shootings, appealing for "a consensus around violence reduction" and suggesting assault rifles "belong on the battlefield".
...The president's comments came as the Republican presidential candidate
Mitt Romney said the US did not need new gun laws and argued that "changing the heart of the American people" might be the way to avoid future tragedy instead.
...As governor of Massachusetts, Romney banned assault weapons such as the AR-15 used in the Aurora shooting. He described them as "instruments of destruction with the sole purpose of hunting down and killing people" as he signed the bill outlawing them in 2002.'
if guns are the heart of the american people you all have a serious problem.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
Yeah... There is more to it than what Mitt claims.
i actually think i misread that quote. :?
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
Well don't ya know Romnry is now running for president so now EVERYTHING CHANGES!
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
"I need your strength for me to be strong...I need your love to feel loved"
for shooting those bastards who be wanting to take your shoes.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
My mom has to come feed my cats this weekend and we're a little afraid she won't let her in the door :oops: She wouldn't let her come inside when we went away before. Who needs guns for protection :roll: I mean really
"I need your strength for me to be strong...I need your love to feel loved"