Ban 'anonymous' speech online?

hedonist

pandora wrote:

Why would anyone oppose this unless they in fact use their anonymousness to hurt others
or to should we say ... pull the wool over.

There are many reasons; I oppose this for my own reasons - privacy among them - and am not an asshole (in general, anyway). To say that anyone not in favor of this is insincere or hurtful seems an unfair and sweeping statement.

Also, Monster Rain made some damn good points up there.

pandora

Monster Rain wrote:

pandora wrote:

Monster Rain wrote:

The biggest problem with this bill is that its stated goal is to "cut down on mean-spirited and baseless political attacks." So if you make mean comments about a politician on some forum the state wants to force you to reveal your identity? Nope, nothing scary about that. :roll:

actually I am all for less mean spirited and baseless attacks
political or otherwise.

Who wouldn't be?

That is not founded criticism based in fact and action, it is not the right to speak
it just means that words will be much more likely to be civil, truthful, and fair minded
as it should be ... like when everyone can see your face.

Doesn't scare me in the least, what is much scarier is the uncontrolled who are ignorant
to inflicting pain on others....
the bullies.

My problem is this: someone goes on a message board and makes a comment about a NY politician that someone deems "mean-spirited." Now the state decides to force the poster to post his/her real name with that comment so the state knows who said it. Doesn't that seems a little extreme? What's to stop that politician from making that person a target for state tax audits, "speeding" tickets on the state highway when the person is going with the flow of traffic, and things like that? What if my boss reads my post and disagrees with me and retaliates against me for my political beliefs (and I'd never know since he could be posting anonymously as long as his posts don't offend any politicians in power or even just lurking on the site without posting)?

Also, who determines what is mean-spirited? If I call someone a liar, is that mean-spirited enough to require my name being posted next to my comment? It seems like the government is trying to protect itself from bullying by passing a law that allows the state to bully others. I also don't see how the NY state government thinks it has the power to force people in other states to reveal their identities just because a website they use happens to be based out of NY.

I think you wouldn't post personal comments about someone else
because who cares about what you think of someone, right? Only you do.
Even here as a guideline ... no personal comments.

So you would not say someone was a liar but could point out an untruth
if indeed you have proof of that. You would be speaking of an action not the person.
And your name and address stands proudly next to your words.

And where bullying comes in...
it is personal attacks based in personal opinion not fact and it is hurtful.
It muddies the cyber world with negativity and hate and above all else
allows the bully to be anonymous which gives them strength.

As I said in the other thread every one has the right to live their lives
not as a victim.

pandora

hedonist wrote:

pandora wrote:

Why would anyone oppose this unless they in fact use their anonymousness to hurt others
or to should we say ... pull the wool over.

There are many reasons; I oppose this for my own reasons - privacy among them - and am not an asshole (in general, anyway). To say that anyone not in favor of this is insincere or hurtful seems an unfair and sweeping statement.

Also, Monster Rain made some damn good points up there.

And why I asked why would anyone oppose this...

I am all for the right to privacy and free speech.
I certainly don't think my privacy would be invaded
by standing up for the words I write. Not sure why yours would be....
perhaps you could explain.

So your privacy is an issue what about bullies and those that do hurt,
should they be allowed protection to continue making victims?
Or should they be held accountable for their actions?

JOEJOEJOE

anonymous speech has been around forever...in the old days, people could call into talk radio programs and speak their mind.....people could also write letters to the editor of their local newspapers.

Anytime there is a new technological advancement that allows for better distribution of information, Porno mongers and hate groups are always on the cutting edge. There are downsides to the interwebs, and the ease of spewing anonymous hate is one of them.

pandora

JOEJOEJOE wrote:

anonymous speech has been around forever...in the old days, people could call into talk radio programs and speak their mind.....people could also write letters to the editor of their local newspapers.

Anytime there is a new technological advancement that allows for better distribution of information, Porno mongers and hate groups are always on the cutting edge. There are downsides to the interwebs, and the ease of spewing anonymous hate is one of them.

ah but it can be fixed

someone just thought of a way to a kinder gentler world

BinauralJam

It's about control

catefrances

BinauralJam wrote:

It's about control

of course it is... it always is.

and what does 'anonymous' mean anyway? and what about thsoe idiots who call up the radio and say stupid shit.. should we make them fully disclose their identities too???

hedonist

pandora wrote:

I am all for the right to privacy and free speech.
I certainly don't think my privacy would be invaded
by standing up for the words I write. Not sure why yours would be....
perhaps you could explain.

So your privacy is an issue what about bullies and those that do hurt,
should they be allowed protection to continue making victims?
Or should they be held accountable for their actions?

One reason off the top of my head - I don't need my boss or anyone else I don't feel is privy to my personal information knowing I like to come home after a long day at work and smoke a bowl or four :P

Also, I'm tired of being penalized (for lack of a better word) because of idiots who don't know how to debate, drive, get along with others, etc. We should deal with them, not make everyone else have to sacrifice because of them.

This is a very slippery slope here.

mikepegg44

Monster Rain wrote:

pandora wrote:

cincybearcat wrote:

Can't people avoid these bullies by closing their web-browser?

And in reality, is it really random meanness and bullying that has really hurt people in real life? I think not, I think they know who there bully is on facebook, etc when it ends up in suicide, etc.

I think the proposal is attempting to have personal accountability for our words
as we do our actions in real life.

Which I am all for.

As we have been told here many times ...
there is a real person on the other end of our words, this often forgotten.
If this happens we would know exactly who we were talking to and it would
make for a much more honest exchange.

It would also make for a safer environment for our children.

Why would anyone oppose this unless they in fact use their anonymousness to hurt others
or to should we say ... pull the wool over.

Perhaps I am missing why someone would not want to stand next to their words.

I can only think many on the social networks, forums, blogs
might be very surprised as to who exactly they have been talking to
and how many personas people actually have, that is, pretending to be
for whatever reason.

Cowards hide and bully, who needs them? Honesty and decency is where it's at,
where we want to be.

Maybe people don't want strangers on a web site knowing who they are, regardless of whether they post something "mean-spirited" or not. How many people on this board use their real names? There are genuine creeps in the world and some people would rather not tell 1,000 normal people their real name because person #1,001 might be the weirdo who becomes a crazy stalker or the guy who works at the deli who now wants to debate politics every time you try to get some roast beef. Besides, maybe Monster Rain is my real name.

I do

I agree. this law is unnecessary, as a person could already do this to their site if they wanted. I see it all over the internet...post deleted by admin

the bigger problem is the Morality police are at it again...I have no problem with someone calling me a liar...if I am being called that maybe I am lying...or maybe I got my shit wrong
This isn't about bullying, this is about a way to get in to the internet. Politicians keep dreaming up ways to get ip addresses of people...this will just further their attempts
If anyone thinks this will cut down on any mean spirited discussions they live in a fantasy world where legislation has the power to eliminate being an asshole. Don't like the tone don't go to the site. I pretty much hate all the posters who constantly talk about happy meal toys being completely inappropriate over on pissedconsumers.com but I am not going to use the government to intimidate them into shutting up. I will just sit back and think..."these are the people, these are the people who continue to make it so my friends cannot smoke a J"

oh...and you can ghost an IP address with a program that takes about 8 mins to download and install.

pandora

Perhaps there is a correlation here...

anonymous = negative opinion
identified = positive opinion

I will always vote for more positivity in the world...
be proud enough of what you write to claim it.

pandora

hedonist wrote:

pandora wrote:

I am all for the right to privacy and free speech.
I certainly don't think my privacy would be invaded
by standing up for the words I write. Not sure why yours would be....
perhaps you could explain.

So your privacy is an issue what about bullies and those that do hurt,
should they be allowed protection to continue making victims?
Or should they be held accountable for their actions?

One reason off the top of my head - I don't need my boss or anyone else I don't feel is privy to my personal information knowing I like to come home after a long day at work and smoke a bowl or four :P

Also, I'm tired of being penalized (for lack of a better word) because of idiots who don't know how to debate, drive, get along with others, etc. We should deal with them, not make everyone else have to sacrifice because of them.

This is a very slippery slope here.

hmmmm.... I see it as a level playing field myself.

And it is never wise to speak of things you don't want the boss or those in power knowing...
they have their ways of finding out.

catefrances

pandora wrote:

Perhaps there is a correlation here...

anonymous = negative opinion
identified = positive opinion

I will always vote for more positivity in the world...
be proud enough of what you write to claim it.

i own everything i write where ever i write it. my disclosing my full name rank and serial number wont change that.

pandora

mikepegg44 wrote:

[

oh...and you can ghost an IP address with a program that takes about 8 mins to download and install.

yes you can

now...

but....

hedonist

pandora wrote:

Perhaps there is a correlation here...

anonymous = negative opinion
identified = positive opinion

I will always vote for more positivity in the world...
be proud enough of what you write to claim it.

Perhaps not a correlation there, pandora.

My personal concerns are not about shame at all. I don't think anyone here has intimated even close to that.

I'm with you, though, on positivity. I just don't believe it can or should be legislated.

cincybearcat

pandora wrote:

Why would anyone oppose this unless they in fact use their anonymousness to hurt others
or to should we say ... pull the wool over.

Because it's something that doesn't need government regulation. And where exactly is the line? Different people are offended by all sorts of different things. Will they regulate language as well?

Just seems like a useless law that could be used very inappropriately to serve someones needs.

pandora

hedonist wrote:

pandora wrote:

Perhaps there is a correlation here...

anonymous = negative opinion
identified = positive opinion

I will always vote for more positivity in the world...
be proud enough of what you write to claim it.

Perhaps not a correlation there, pandora.

My personal concerns are not about shame at all. I don't think anyone here has intimated even close to that.

I'm with you, though, on positivity. I just don't believe it can or should be legislated.

We will agree to disagree then, yes.

Oh and the problem with cyber bullies they feel no shame and we need legislature
to protect the innocent.

cincybearcat

pandora wrote:

Oh and the problem with cyber bullies they feel no shame and we need legislature
to protect the innocent.

Government legislation is not an effective way to combat bullying in my opinion.

redrock

catefrances wrote:

BinauralJam wrote:

It's about control

of course it is... it always is.

Control, censorship, etc.

“would cut down on mean-spirited and baseless political attacks” - the true reason - veiled in some wishy-washy thing about cyberbullying to divert attention and make it sound like it's something done for the good of the people.

Who will be monitoring this? What will the info be used for? Who will have access to this info (besides the hackers who could probably make very good use of it)? Everything can already be monitored if the government wishes - phones, e-mails, internet useage, etc.

More big brother....

pandora

cincybearcat wrote:

pandora wrote:

Why would anyone oppose this unless they in fact use their anonymousness to hurt others
or to should we say ... pull the wool over.

Because it's something that doesn't need government regulation. And where exactly is the line? Different people are offended by all sorts of different things. Will they regulate language as well?

Just seems like a useless law that could be used very inappropriately to serve someones needs.

I happen to think anonymous gives bullies a place to hide and spread their dirt.
And it also creates bullies that otherwise would not have the guts to be.

I vote for this law that make us accountable for what we say to each other
All they are asking is that you stand by what you write.

Another thing to think about before you hit submit.

Would you say it if people were to know who you are? No different than face to face really.

cincybearcat

Well, I think whoever thought this up is a simple-minded idiot. And I'd gladly send that person my name, address, and phone number. In fact, they can probably get it from this board.