Is it not so that someone walking around without an ID I would have greater concerns about weather he/she could vote or not? It's seems to me it's just not safe or wise to walk around without an ID.
I think you should have some kind of an I.D. on you, you need to identify yourself. I agree... However I think having to have a National I.D. is ridiculous... Perhaps that's for another time.
The fact that you are on the voter registration roll is proof that you are a US citizen, isn't it? You just need to prove you are that person.
Yes, I would think so. Makes sense, although when I read about dogs and dead folks being called for jury duty or sent concensus forms, I have to wonder.
So are we back to square one then?
How does one prove who they are? State-issued/photo ID?
Certainly not a phone bill...
Yes I think we're back to using state ID's, but I do agree there needs to be a way to waive the fee, you shouldn't have to pay to vote.
Maybe a voter ID card that is provided fee of charge?
Correct me if I'm wrong ... The new laws are not simply adding the requirement of an ID for the first time. The new laws tighten the ID laws by requiring state issued ID, such as a photo driver's license. I'm pretty certain you always needed ID, but things like your heating bill or lease were accepted in lieu of a government issued photo ID. They now want to eliminate those less reliable forms of ID. If passed, the law will have the effect of turning registered voters away from the polls.
For example: grandma, who was born here and is a citizen, doesn't currently have any state issued photo ID. For the last few years she's been voting and her phone bill which lists her name and address was a valid form of ID. This year, she isn't aware of the change in the law and gets turned away on election day.
I think much of the media is reporting this issue in a misleading way ... they just like the "New Law Requiring ID at the Polls" headline.
A few views on the subject--I'm sure if we all sift through the swamp that is the media, we'll find an answer:
So, let me get this straight. There are states where you are required to carry an ID at all times? Like, when you're running or taking out the trash? :?
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So, let me get this straight. There are states where you are required to carry an ID at all times? Like, when you're running or taking out the trash? :?
...
What about people who don't drive? Why pay the state for a Drivers License, if you don't drive a car? Yeah, you can get a State License, but who wants to spend their time in the DMV for something you don't need?
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Hail, Hail!!!
State ID is not a Drivers License they are two separate things so if you don't drive
or lose your license to a DUI you must get a State ID.
It is law here but not greatly enforced.
They can and will ask for ID ... just cause. Best to have it then and always answer Sir,
with each question ... respectfully.
So, let me get this straight. There are states where you are required to carry an ID at all times? Like, when you're running or taking out the trash? :?
...
What about people who don't drive? Why pay the state for a Drivers License, if you don't drive a car? Yeah, you can get a State License, but who wants to spend their time in the DMV for something you don't need?
i agree. here's why i think requiring voters to show State photo ID is wrong.
granted my father passed 15 years ago but hypothetically if he were still living he'd be approaching 90 yrs old. let's say for whatever reason he could no longer drive. in which case, he wouldn't even be able to obtain a state ID because;
he was born at home so never had a birth certificate.
didn't have a passport.
showing an expired DL it's not accepted.
sure he had a ss card & utility bills but that's not enough proof of citizenship according to the DMV in the states he lived (likely the fact in most, if not all states)
he could walk into a DMV with his WWII metals... or even show the pic of him at Arlington one Veterans day handing the wreath off to then pres. Reagan to place on the tomb of the Unknowns... still those things wouldn't count for a damn thing.
for a man that strongly felt voting was his duty as a citizen...if he was required to show a state ID? he would be denied
So, let me get this straight. There are states where you are required to carry an ID at all times? Like, when you're running or taking out the trash? :?
...
What about people who don't drive? Why pay the state for a Drivers License, if you don't drive a car? Yeah, you can get a State License, but who wants to spend their time in the DMV for something you don't need?
i agree. here's why i think requiring voters to show State photo ID is wrong.
granted my father passed 15 years ago but hypothetically if he were still living he'd be approaching 90 yrs old. let's say for whatever reason he could no longer drive. in which case, he wouldn't even be able to obtain a state ID because;
he was born at home so never had a birth certificate.
didn't have a passport.
showing an expired DL it's not accepted.
sure he had a ss card & utility bills but that's not enough proof of citizenship according to the DMV in the states he lived (likely the fact in most, if not all states)
he could walk into a DMV with his WWII metals... or even show the pic of him at Arlington one Veterans day handing the wreath off to then pres. Reagan to place on the tomb of the Unknowns... still those things wouldn't count for a damn thing.
for a man that strongly felt voting was his duty as a citizen...if he was required to show a state ID? he would be denied
You can get a state I.D. that is not a driver license. It doesn't have to be a driver license. Your father could still get one of those.
...
What about people who don't drive? Why pay the state for a Drivers License, if you don't drive a car? Yeah, you can get a State License, but who wants to spend their time in the DMV for something you don't need?
i agree. here's why i think requiring voters to show State photo ID is wrong.
granted my father passed 15 years ago but hypothetically if he were still living he'd be approaching 90 yrs old. let's say for whatever reason he could no longer drive. in which case, he wouldn't even be able to obtain a state ID because;
he was born at home so never had a birth certificate.
didn't have a passport.
showing an expired DL it's not accepted.
sure he had a ss card & utility bills but that's not enough proof of citizenship according to the DMV in the states he lived (likely the fact in most, if not all states)
he could walk into a DMV with his WWII metals... or even show the pic of him at Arlington one Veterans day handing the wreath off to then pres. Reagan to place on the tomb of the Unknowns... still those things wouldn't count for a damn thing.
for a man that strongly felt voting was his duty as a citizen...if he was required to show a state ID? he would be denied
You can get a state I.D. that is not a driver license. It doesn't have to be a driver license. Your father could still get one of those.
i know, and that's what i meant. if someone's most recent DL or State ID has expired, in order to obtain a new/current state ID a person is still required to show the DMV a birth certificate AND things like as a passport, ss card or utility bills in addition. a person can't just walk in to the DMV and say 'here's $20...give me a State ID'
i know, and that's what i meant. if someone's most recent DL or State ID has expired, in order to obtain a new/current state ID a person is still required to show the DMV a birth certificate AND things like as a passport, ss card or utility bills in addition. a person can't just walk in to the DMV and say 'here's $20...give me a State ID'
i know, and that's what i meant. if someone's most recent DL or State ID has expired, in order to obtain a new/current state ID a person is still required to show the DMV a birth certificate AND things like as a passport, ss card or utility bills in addition. a person can't just walk in to the DMV and say 'here's $20...give me a State ID'
Oh alright, sorry.
...
Also... the DMV fucking SUCKS. Who wants to have to spend a day in line in that place unless you absolutely have to.
...
Also... what about absentee votes? how are those things verified? It's not like you have to have a notary validat it... you fill it out, plop a stamp in it and drop it in th mail box. Who is checking those?
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
I hope no one thinks you have to carry ID, or even are required to have an ID in the U.S.
Very true. But there are plenty of things that if you want to do you are required to show ID. Getting on a plane, buying alcohol, receiving certain medications, etc. I certainly don't want anyone buying firearms without ID.
Voting is a right, but it's a right you need to register for in advance in order to exercise. Requiring voters to prove they are who they say they are, to me, seems like common sense.
The problem of ID being expensive and/or hard to acquire can and should be fixed.
I hope no one thinks you have to carry ID, or even are required to have an ID in the U.S.
Very true. But there are plenty of things that if you want to do you are required to show ID. Getting on a plane, buying alcohol, receiving certain medications, etc. I certainly don't want anyone buying firearms without ID.
Voting is a right, but it's a right you need to register for in advance in order to exercise. Requiring voters to prove they are who they say they are, to me, seems like common sense.
The problem of ID being expensive and/or hard to acquire can and should be fixed.
To obtain an ID is rather easy. Birth certificate, SS card is all you need sometimes. I can't imagine NOT having an ID on me. Police can make it very difficult for you if you get stopped/detained and you have no id...
I hope no one thinks you have to carry ID, or even are required to have an ID in the U.S.
Very true. But there are plenty of things that if you want to do you are required to show ID. Getting on a plane, buying alcohol, receiving certain medications, etc. I certainly don't want anyone buying firearms without ID.
Voting is a right, but it's a right you need to register for in advance in order to exercise. Requiring voters to prove they are who they say they are, to me, seems like common sense.
The problem of ID being expensive and/or hard to acquire can and should be fixed.
To obtain an ID is rather easy. Birth certificate, SS card is all you need sometimes. I can't imagine NOT having an ID on me. Police can make it very difficult for you if you get stopped/detained and you have no id...
Easy for you is not the standard of ease though. There are elderly and infirm folks who dont/can't leave the house. There many thousands of people who live on SS alone, living on 10,000$ or under per year is an incredibly difficult thing to do.
There's a reason republicans are pushing. And it isn't fraud. Nuff said.
I agree about the Republicans but I don't agree it is nuff said. This shouldn't be a red vs blue, Democrat vs Republican issue. Both parties are trying to frame the issue a certain way and neither have it right, IMO.
To obtain an ID is rather easy. Birth certificate, SS card is all you need sometimes. I can't imagine NOT having an ID on me. Police can make it very difficult for you if you get stopped/detained and you have no id...
Easy for you is not the standard of ease though. There are elderly and infirm folks who dont/can't leave the house. There many thousands of people who live on SS alone, living on 10,000$ or under per year is an incredibly difficult thing to do.
I'm curious as to how those on SS cash their checks? If they can't leave the house then how do they get out to vote?
Both dead serious questions.
I couldn't fathom trying to live on 10G a year. That is another problem in its entirety...
To obtain an ID is rather easy. Birth certificate, SS card is all you need sometimes. I can't imagine NOT having an ID on me. Police can make it very difficult for you if you get stopped/detained and you have no id...
Easy for you is not the standard of ease though. There are elderly and infirm folks who dont/can't leave the house. There many thousands of people who live on SS alone, living on 10,000$ or under per year is an incredibly difficult thing to do.
I'm curious as to how those on SS cash their checks? If they can't leave the house then how do they get out to vote?
Both dead serious questions.
I couldn't fathom trying to live on 10G a year. That is another problem in its entirety...
In many cases people have payments made directly to a care center or have family members/lawyers handle their affairs.
I know it seems like a trivial number of people, but when you combine the reasons people will be turned away, it outweighs the occurance of fraud.
Leave without your wallet or bring the wrong purse, pops, too bad, hope you have time to go get it and come back!
To obtain an ID is rather easy. Birth certificate, SS card is all you need sometimes. I can't imagine NOT having an ID on me. Police can make it very difficult for you if you get stopped/detained and you have no id...
Easy for you is not the standard of ease though. There are elderly and infirm folks who dont/can't leave the house. There many thousands of people who live on SS alone, living on 10,000$ or under per year is an incredibly difficult thing to do.
I'm curious as to how those on SS cash their checks? If they can't leave the house then how do they get out to vote?
Both dead serious questions.
I couldn't fathom trying to live on 10G a year. That is another problem in its entirety...
In many cases people have payments made directly to a care center or have family members/lawyers handle their affairs.
I know it seems like a trivial number of people, but when you combine the reasons people will be turned away, it outweighs the occurance of fraud.
Leave without your wallet or bring the wrong purse, pops, too bad, hope you have time to go get it and come back!
Election days should be holidays.
I'm not so sure I'm sold on your points.
You should have ID. If you forget your ID for whatever reason then shame on you. It should be on your person. If I forget my wallet and train pass the conductor doesn't care what my story is.
As for voter fraud I'm with you that it's minimal if at all. As for SS fraud? I think that's a bigger picture. I've seen that first hand.
There's a reason republicans are pushing. And it isn't fraud. Nuff said.
I agree about the Republicans but I don't agree it is nuff said. This shouldn't be a red vs blue, Democrat vs Republican issue. Both parties are trying to frame the issue a certain way and neither have it right, IMO.
Please provide an evidenced based reason as to why voters should have an id to vote.
There's a reason republicans are pushing. And it isn't fraud. Nuff said.
I agree about the Republicans but I don't agree it is nuff said. This shouldn't be a red vs blue, Democrat vs Republican issue. Both parties are trying to frame the issue a certain way and neither have it right, IMO.
Please provide an evidenced based reason as to why voters should have an id to vote.
We went through this in the other thread. I was perfectly clear then. Since we require people to register to vote, and we require they be eligible to vote, in my opinion we should require ID showing they are the person registered.
I do not need any more evidence than that nor does my opinion need to pass your muster.
There's a reason republicans are pushing. And it isn't fraud. Nuff said.
I agree about the Republicans but I don't agree it is nuff said. This shouldn't be a red vs blue, Democrat vs Republican issue. Both parties are trying to frame the issue a certain way and neither have it right, IMO.
Please provide an evidenced based reason as to why voters should have an id to vote.
We went through this in the other thread. I was perfectly clear then. Since we require people to register to vote, and we require they be eligible to vote, in my opinion we should require ID showing they are the person registered.
I do not need any more evidence than that nor does my opinion need to pass your muster.
Just thought we would make that clear for this thread, the people wanting other people to provide id to vote do so on belief and opinion....not evidence.
I personally believe policy should be based in evidence, fact and reason. Your opinion shouldn't factor into it.
Comments
I think you should have some kind of an I.D. on you, you need to identify yourself. I agree... However I think having to have a National I.D. is ridiculous... Perhaps that's for another time.
Yes I think we're back to using state ID's, but I do agree there needs to be a way to waive the fee, you shouldn't have to pay to vote.
Maybe a voter ID card that is provided fee of charge?
A few views on the subject--I'm sure if we all sift through the swamp that is the media, we'll find an answer:
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/04/ ... 0W20120405
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/03 ... er-id-law/
http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/ ... story.html
http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/ ... story.html
http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/are ... 53065.html
http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/politi ... ment-says/
http://www.thenation.com/blog/167217/voter-fraud-fraud
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What about people who don't drive? Why pay the state for a Drivers License, if you don't drive a car? Yeah, you can get a State License, but who wants to spend their time in the DMV for something you don't need?
Hail, Hail!!!
or lose your license to a DUI you must get a State ID.
It is law here but not greatly enforced.
They can and will ask for ID ... just cause. Best to have it then and always answer Sir,
with each question ... respectfully.
i agree. here's why i think requiring voters to show State photo ID is wrong.
granted my father passed 15 years ago but hypothetically if he were still living he'd be approaching 90 yrs old. let's say for whatever reason he could no longer drive. in which case, he wouldn't even be able to obtain a state ID because;
he was born at home so never had a birth certificate.
didn't have a passport.
showing an expired DL it's not accepted.
sure he had a ss card & utility bills but that's not enough proof of citizenship according to the DMV in the states he lived (likely the fact in most, if not all states)
he could walk into a DMV with his WWII metals... or even show the pic of him at Arlington one Veterans day handing the wreath off to then pres. Reagan to place on the tomb of the Unknowns... still those things wouldn't count for a damn thing.
for a man that strongly felt voting was his duty as a citizen...if he was required to show a state ID? he would be denied
angels share laughter
*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
You can get a state I.D. that is not a driver license. It doesn't have to be a driver license. Your father could still get one of those.
http://rollingout.com/sports/mlbs-torii ... t-by-cops/
i know, and that's what i meant. if someone's most recent DL or State ID has expired, in order to obtain a new/current state ID a person is still required to show the DMV a birth certificate AND things like as a passport, ss card or utility bills in addition. a person can't just walk in to the DMV and say 'here's $20...give me a State ID'
angels share laughter
*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
Oh alright, sorry.
Also... the DMV fucking SUCKS. Who wants to have to spend a day in line in that place unless you absolutely have to.
...
Also... what about absentee votes? how are those things verified? It's not like you have to have a notary validat it... you fill it out, plop a stamp in it and drop it in th mail box. Who is checking those?
Hail, Hail!!!
Why are there different state by state rules for a federal election?
"...I changed by not changing at all..."
Voting is a right, but it's a right you need to register for in advance in order to exercise. Requiring voters to prove they are who they say they are, to me, seems like common sense.
The problem of ID being expensive and/or hard to acquire can and should be fixed.
"...I changed by not changing at all..."
I can't imagine NOT having an ID on me.
Police can make it very difficult for you if you get stopped/detained and you have no id...
"...I changed by not changing at all..."
"...I changed by not changing at all..."
If they can't leave the house then how do they get out to vote?
Both dead serious questions.
I couldn't fathom trying to live on 10G a year. That is another problem in its entirety...
I know it seems like a trivial number of people, but when you combine the reasons people will be turned away, it outweighs the occurance of fraud.
Leave without your wallet or bring the wrong purse, pops, too bad, hope you have time to go get it and come back!
Election days should be holidays.
You should have ID. If you forget your ID for whatever reason then shame on you. It should be on your person. If I forget my wallet and train pass the conductor doesn't care what my story is.
As for voter fraud I'm with you that it's minimal if at all.
As for SS fraud? I think that's a bigger picture. I've seen that first hand.
I do not need any more evidence than that nor does my opinion need to pass your muster.
"...I changed by not changing at all..."
I personally believe policy should be based in evidence, fact and reason. Your opinion shouldn't factor into it.