Trayvon Martin

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  • polaris_x
    polaris_x Posts: 13,559
    mikepegg44 wrote:
    I am more asking how you can speculate that the increase is only due to what you claim? I just asked if it would be reasonable to assume something different because of the statistics shown. Apparently you believe it isn't, that the only assumption that can be made based on an increase in justifiable homicide cases is that people are getting away with murder. that is fine.
    I agree with you that the law was unnecessary, that it is too vague. Which is why I made my comment about mandatory arrest in the first place. You seemed to think that mandatory arrest and grand jury would do nothing, I would disagree. I think it would have helped in this case and brought us to where we are today...holes in the story can only last so long without being exposed...But your statements read to me as, this law is the worst law ever because it PROMOTES the killing of innocent people. I don't think it does that.

    and how else should I have taken your NRA comment? I am not a fan of the organization either and I am not sure why you threw that in there with a question mark. Why don't you tell me why they supported the law if you don't like my response.

    mandatory arrest does nothing because in essence zimmerman was "arrested" ... he was brought into the police station for questioning ... the "stand your ground" law will make it very hard for the prosecution in this case ... there are numerous examples of how this law has resulted in people dying unnecessarily and the killers not held accountable ... again - it is why the state-attorney and police are vehemently opposed to this law ...

    it is a horrible law because it promotes gun violence and taken away any accountability ...

    the NRA's primary purpose is to promote gun ownership and freedom ... this law promotes gun ownership ...

    http://bottomline.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2 ... bout-obama
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,713
    Godfather. wrote:
    why are we debating the outcome of this case ? I guess it's worth a guess but we won't know till the gavel hits the wood and after that it won't matter what we thought but if Zimmerson gets off or gets off easy we will be debating equal rights and riots...wouldn't that be just peachy.. so I think I'll just watch FoxNews and wait for the fireworks that may or may not come. ;) ..and about this law,I don't think many us will compleatly understan untill we are in a situation that we have to fight for our lives.

    Godfather.
    ... You aren't really going to watch all the coverage on FoxNews, are you?
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • mikepegg44
    mikepegg44 Posts: 3,353
    polaris_x wrote:
    mikepegg44 wrote:
    I am more asking how you can speculate that the increase is only due to what you claim? I just asked if it would be reasonable to assume something different because of the statistics shown. Apparently you believe it isn't, that the only assumption that can be made based on an increase in justifiable homicide cases is that people are getting away with murder. that is fine.
    I agree with you that the law was unnecessary, that it is too vague. Which is why I made my comment about mandatory arrest in the first place. You seemed to think that mandatory arrest and grand jury would do nothing, I would disagree. I think it would have helped in this case and brought us to where we are today...holes in the story can only last so long without being exposed...But your statements read to me as, this law is the worst law ever because it PROMOTES the killing of innocent people. I don't think it does that.

    and how else should I have taken your NRA comment? I am not a fan of the organization either and I am not sure why you threw that in there with a question mark. Why don't you tell me why they supported the law if you don't like my response.

    mandatory arrest does nothing because in essence zimmerman was "arrested" ... he was brought into the police station for questioning ... the "stand your ground" law will make it very hard for the prosecution in this case ... there are numerous examples of how this law has resulted in people dying unnecessarily and the killers not held accountable ... again - it is why the state-attorney and police are vehemently opposed to this law ...

    it is a horrible law because it promotes gun violence and taken away any accountability ...

    the NRA's primary purpose is to promote gun ownership and freedom ... this law promotes gun ownership ...

    http://bottomline.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2 ... bout-obama

    I was wondering about how the NRA would tie in and you raise good points. Sorry for the overstatement earlier as I really wasn't sure at all where you were going...But, I think the NRA would be for the law more so because it "protects" those with conceal and carry permits...I don't think this law alone makes people want to go buy guns or get conceal and carry...The laws of my state did nothing to motivate my want for firearms.
    I guess we will just have to disagree on the difference between promoting and allowing for...because it seems you won't budge from your assessment that it promotes behaviors, and I won't from mine that it allows for behaviors but does nothing to promote them. I wish there was a handshake emoticon

    Don't forget about the Grand Jury as well, not just mandatory arrest. there is a difference. Mandatory arrest would leave it in the hands of the police only...a grand jury would open the door to much more scrutiny.
    But I agree the vagueness of the law leaves doors open for unnecessary deaths. It is way too subjective.
    that’s right! Can’t we all just get together and focus on our real enemies: monogamous gays and stem cells… - Ned Flanders
    It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
    - Joe Rogan
  • polaris_x
    polaris_x Posts: 13,559
    fair enough ...

    the NRA is out to promote the sale of guns ... it's the gun lobby ... they see regulation and restrictions as limitations to gun sales ... no different than air quality standards would affect the sale of gas ... the consequences of these lobbyists are irrelevant ... they don't care if more people die because they are only concerned with sales ...

    and i am dismissing your mandatory arrest and grand jury simply because in many cases - these things have gone to trial and the outcome is killer goes free and taxpayers money went down the tubes, prosecutors are frustrated and cops are pissed ... south carolina is already looking to repeal their law ...
  • Jason P
    Jason P Posts: 19,316
    polaris_x wrote:
    no ... it IS horrible ... "justifiable" homicides TRIPLED since the law was put in place ...
    They may have tripled because the law just changed the way a homicide was categorized from the past. It doesn't necessarily mean that it encourages homicides to take place.
    Be Excellent To Each Other
    Party On, Dudes!
  • g under p
    g under p Surfing The far side of THE Sombrero Galaxy Posts: 18,237
    Godfather. wrote:
    why are we debating the outcome of this case ? I guess it's worth a guess but we won't know till the gavel hits the wood and after that it won't matter what we thought but if Zimmerson gets off or gets off easy we will be debating equal rights and riots...wouldn't that be just peachy.. so I think I'll just watch FoxNews and wait for the fireworks that may or may not come. ;) ..and about this law,I don't think many us will compleatly understan untill we are in a situation that we have to fight for our lives.

    Godfather.

    Why is it that some of you think that they will be riots if the decision isn't sufficient to those who want a guilty verdict or some sort of punishment for Zimmerman? Most I believe will accept what comes out of this case and leave it where the the jury rules.

    peace
    *We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti

    *MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
    .....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti

    *The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)


  • Godfather.
    Godfather. Posts: 12,504
    g under p wrote:
    Godfather. wrote:
    why are we debating the outcome of this case ? I guess it's worth a guess but we won't know till the gavel hits the wood and after that it won't matter what we thought but if Zimmerson gets off or gets off easy we will be debating equal rights and riots...wouldn't that be just peachy.. so I think I'll just watch FoxNews and wait for the fireworks that may or may not come. ;) ..and about this law,I don't think many us will compleatly understan untill we are in a situation that we have to fight for our lives.

    Godfather.

    Why is it that some of you think that they will be riots if the decision isn't sufficient to those who want a guilty verdict or some sort of punishment for Zimmerman? Most I believe will accept what comes out of this case and leave it where the the jury rules.

    peace

    history.

    Godfather.
  • Godfather.
    Godfather. Posts: 12,504
    PJ_Soul wrote:
    Godfather. wrote:
    why are we debating the outcome of this case ? I guess it's worth a guess but we won't know till the gavel hits the wood and after that it won't matter what we thought but if Zimmerson gets off or gets off easy we will be debating equal rights and riots...wouldn't that be just peachy.. so I think I'll just watch FoxNews and wait for the fireworks that may or may not come. ;) ..and about this law,I don't think many us will compleatly understan untill we are in a situation that we have to fight for our lives.

    Godfather.
    ... You aren't really going to watch all the coverage on FoxNews, are you?

    no not all of it :lol:

    Godfather.
  • polaris_x
    polaris_x Posts: 13,559
    Jason P wrote:
    polaris_x wrote:
    no ... it IS horrible ... "justifiable" homicides TRIPLED since the law was put in place ...
    They may have tripled because the law just changed the way a homicide was categorized from the past. It doesn't necessarily mean that it encourages homicides to take place.

    :fp:
  • Jason P
    Jason P Posts: 19,316
    polaris_x wrote:
    Jason P wrote:
    polaris_x wrote:
    no ... it IS horrible ... "justifiable" homicides TRIPLED since the law was put in place ...
    They may have tripled because the law just changed the way a homicide was categorized from the past. It doesn't necessarily mean that it encourages homicides to take place.

    :fp:
    :corn:
    Be Excellent To Each Other
    Party On, Dudes!
  • mikepegg44
    mikepegg44 Posts: 3,353
    Jason P wrote:
    polaris_x wrote:
    Jason P wrote:
    They may have tripled because the law just changed the way a homicide was categorized from the past. It doesn't necessarily mean that it encourages homicides to take place.

    :fp:
    :corn:
    :nono:
    that’s right! Can’t we all just get together and focus on our real enemies: monogamous gays and stem cells… - Ned Flanders
    It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
    - Joe Rogan
  • polaris_x
    polaris_x Posts: 13,559
    :lol:
  • goingtoverona
    goingtoverona Posts: 616
    god you anti gun nuts really make me laugh.

    gimmesometruth27 wrote:
    the nra convention is in my fair city this weekend. 65,000 gun nuts are going to be in our convention center, and most of them no doubt will be packing some sort of heat.

    my city has a huge problem with gun violence. way too many shootings and gun murders. some years it is as high or higher than chicago and detroit. i think it is pretty tasteless for them to come here.

    i would be down there silently protesting with the rest of them but then come next week we might be discussing my own shooting...
    if you think what I believe is stupid, bizarre, ridiculous or outrageous.....it's ok, I think I had a brain tumor when I wrote that.
  • Godfather.
    Godfather. Posts: 12,504
    goingtoverona wrote:
    god you anti gun nuts really make me laugh.

    gimmesometruth27 wrote:
    the nra convention is in my fair city this weekend. 65,000 gun nuts are going to be in our convention center, and most of them no doubt will be packing some sort of heat.

    my city has a huge problem with gun violence. way too many shootings and gun murders. some years it is as high or higher than chicago and detroit. i think it is pretty tasteless for them to come here.

    i would be down there silently protesting with the rest of them but then come next week we might be discussing my own shooting...

    read Democrats against Agenda 21 "guns did and will again keep America free" ;)

    Godfather.
  • ComeToTX
    ComeToTX Austin Posts: 8,069
    I'm not anti-gun but I am against guns getting into the wrong hands. Unfortunately our country hasn't figured out how to keep this from happening. Not even a little bit.
    This show, another show, a show here and a show there.
  • ComeToTX
    ComeToTX Austin Posts: 8,069
    Godfather. wrote:
    goingtoverona wrote:
    god you anti gun nuts really make me laugh.

    gimmesometruth27 wrote:
    the nra convention is in my fair city this weekend. 65,000 gun nuts are going to be in our convention center, and most of them no doubt will be packing some sort of heat.

    my city has a huge problem with gun violence. way too many shootings and gun murders. some years it is as high or higher than chicago and detroit. i think it is pretty tasteless for them to come here.

    i would be down there silently protesting with the rest of them but then come next week we might be discussing my own shooting...

    read Democrats against Agenda 21 "guns did and will again keep America free" ;)

    Godfather.

    The largest military in the history of our world is keeping us free. Guys like George Zimmerman having access to guns has nothing to do with it.
    This show, another show, a show here and a show there.
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,713
    ComeToTX wrote:
    Godfather. wrote:

    read Democrats against Agenda 21 "guns did and will again keep America free" ;)

    Godfather.

    The largest military in the history of our world is keeping us free. Guys like George Zimmerman having access to guns has nothing to do with it.

    America's military isn't anywhere near the largest. It's just got the most technology available to it. Just sayin'. Anyway, yeah, it sure as hell isn't citizens with guns keeping us free, nor the military. It's wealth.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • hedonist
    hedonist Posts: 24,524
    PJ_Soul wrote:
    ComeToTX wrote:
    Godfather. wrote:

    read Democrats against Agenda 21 "guns did and will again keep America free" ;)

    Godfather.

    The largest military in the history of our world is keeping us free. Guys like George Zimmerman having access to guns has nothing to do with it.

    America's military isn't anywhere near the largest. It's just got the most technology available to it. Just sayin'. Anyway, yeah, it sure as hell isn't citizens with guns keeping us free, nor the military. It's wealth.
    So...rich soldiers?
  • ComeToTX
    ComeToTX Austin Posts: 8,069
    Sorry, I should have said most powerful. My point remains.
    This show, another show, a show here and a show there.
  • catefrances
    catefrances Posts: 29,003
    gimmesometruth27 wrote:
    ...
    i would be down there silently protesting with the rest of them but then come next week we might be discussing my own shooting...

    OI! now dont be going and getting yourself shot just yet thanx. i have plasn and they dont include visiting you in hospital or attending your funeral... but just in case, what kind of flowers would you prefer? :P
    hear my name
    take a good look
    this could be the day
    hold my hand
    lie beside me
    i just need to say

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