Reference to Jeremy Lin and PJ

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  • Redmosquito22 Said

    John Starks averaged 12 points per game for his career) and was in 1 All Star Game,

    Avery Johnson averaged 8 points a game for his career for goodness sakes and never played in an All Star Game.

    Ben Wallace for his career averages under 6 points per game



    These are the examples you are throwing at me in his defense? Great list. :lol::lol::lol: What a joke.



    The NFL is full of late round hits, you can't compare the 2 sports.



    Starks was one of the best defenders of his generation. He was on the all defensive team in 92.

    Ben Wallace was one of the best defensive players of all time. He was a 4 time defensive player of the year. Was on the all nba defensive First team 5 times.

    Avery Johnson, I will concede wasnt that great, although he was also a great leader who helped Duncan and Robinson will titles.
  • Yes Way wrote:
    This whole thing is hilarious. I don't come on here looking for solid sports arguments, but someone is willing to engage in one I expect them to do so because they know what they're talking about. It is clear that some sophisticated arguments are being made here, and some are less so.

    The "cut from three teams in two years" (two teams, actually)* is irrelevant to what is happening now. There was a perfect storm that kept him out (the league is incredibly point guard heavy and he's an undrafted free agent), and now a perfect storm that got him in. The truth of him as a player lies in between, but the guy can flat out play. He fits perfectly in his current system, and he's taken a team on life-support and has them positioned for the playoffs.

    P.S. Harvard has been in the top 25 all year and they're pretty good. He's unconventional, but that doesn't mean he's not good. He can score and distribute, get to the basket and inspire teammates. He's not a great shooter and turns it over. But to say he's barely a bench player and to base that solely on the fact that he was cut and went to Harvard is what's laughable.

    *My bad, this isn't what was said. It doesn't change my feeling about how the amount of teams he's been on affects how good he is.

    First of all we said he was on his 3rd team in 2 years not "cut from 3", although NY was about to cut him because he is horrible in practice, Harvard is not in the top 25, and he can't play. you will see that over the next few weeks when Mello is back and Lin is back to averaging 5 points per game or less.

    So much for us not knowing what we are talking about.
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  • 8181 Posts: 58,276

    Starks was one of the best defenders of his generation. He was on the all defensive team in 92.

    he make the second team once


    beat about by Dumars and some guy named Jordan for the first team.
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  • Starks was one of the best defenders of his generation. He was on the all defensive team in 92.

    Ben Wallace was one of the best defensive players of all time. He was a 4 time defensive player of the year. Was on the all nba defensive First team 5 times.

    Avery Johnson, I will concede wasnt that great, although he was also a great leader who helped Duncan and Robinson will titles.

    Are you kidding me, seriously. Defensive players? If that's the criteria for being great than Andre Iguadala is one of the top 50 players of all time.
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  • CROJAM95CROJAM95 Posts: 9,789
    The lack of sports knowledge in this thread is mind boggling
  • Starks was one of the best defenders of his generation. He was on the all defensive team in 92.

    I think this is a bit of an exaggeration though he is a very underrated player who guarded MJ better than most.
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  • RedMosquito22RedMosquito22 Posts: 8,158
    edited February 2012
    CROJAM95 wrote:
    The lack of sports knowledge in this thread is mind boggling


    Tell me about it.

    First these sports geniuses gave us Tim Tebow and now we have to listen to this Jeremy Lin nonsense.
    Post edited by RedMosquito22 on
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  • LOL @ all the Jeremy Lin haters.


    Keep hating, and he'll keep dropping 20+
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  • LOL @ all the Jeremy Lin haters.


    Keep hating, and he'll keep dropping 20+

    No he won't. He will end the season averaging under 12 per game and most likely under 10.
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  • LOL @ all the Jeremy Lin haters.


    Keep hating, and he'll keep dropping 20+

    No he won't. He will end the season averaging under 12 per game and most likely under 10.
    And this is you being jealous, and bitter.

    Dude, keep denying his stats he has put up over the last 7 games.

    Why can't he be for real? Answer that.
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  • CROJAM95 wrote:
    The lack of sports knowledge in this thread is mind boggling


    Tell me about it.

    First these sports geniuses gave us Tim Tebow and now we have to listen to this Jeremy Lin nonsense.


    "The playoffs are a season unto themselves. The competition is heightened, the game slows, and defense -- Starks is one of the best defenders in the league -- is everything. "

    From this NY Times article in 1994. I'm not saying he was the best defender but was definitely one of the better of his generation. And he would have made the first team had some guy named Jordan wasn't playing.

    http://www.nytimes.com/1994/04/17/magaz ... wanted=all
  • 8181 Posts: 58,276
    CROJAM95 wrote:
    The lack of sports knowledge in this thread is mind boggling


    Tell me about it.

    First these sports geniuses gave us Tim Tebow and now we have to listen to this Jeremy Lin nonsense.


    "The playoffs are a season unto themselves. The competition is heightened, the game slows, and defense -- Starks is one of the best defenders in the league -- is everything. "

    From this NY Times article in 1994. I'm not saying he was the best defender but was definitely one of the better of his generation.

    http://www.nytimes.com/1994/04/17/magaz ... wanted=all


    you are really going to cite a NY publication? really? :lol:
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  • 8181 Posts: 58,276
    LOL @ all the Jeremy Lin haters.


    Keep hating, and he'll keep dropping 20+

    No he won't. He will end the season averaging under 12 per game and most likely under 10.
    And this is you being jealous, and bitter.

    Dude, keep denying his stats he has put up over the last 7 games.

    Why can't he be for real? Answer that.


    7 games does not make a player.

    i'm not on the hate wagon....but 7 games does not make a player.

    you can't dismiss the rest of his stats and only focucs on the last 7 games.
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  • 8181 Posts: 58,276
    81 wrote:
    drewdawgq wrote:
    You don't go for 38 against the Lakers and fade away.

    Troy Hudson

    ;)


    ;):lol:

    dropped 37 on the lakers in a playoff game.
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  • And this is you being jealous, and bitter.

    Dude, keep denying his stats he has put up over the last 7 games.

    Why can't he be for real? Answer that.

    Jealous and bitter of what? A below average basketball player that has had 1 good week of basketball against 1 decent team?

    I've said he has had a good week. wooptie friggin doo

    He can't consistently play like this, he just doesn't have that ability. Can he be serviceable? Of course, but this guy is a 10 point or under guy who will get some assists. That's about it. He isn't a savior and he will never be an All Star. It's just the way it is in the NBA.
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  • 81 wrote:


    7 games does not make a player.

    i'm not on the hate wagon....but 7 games does not make a player.

    you can't dismiss the rest of his stats and only focucs on the last 7 games.
    ???????

    He sat on a bench the rest of the time. What are you saying? He finally got his chance to start, and this is what he's doing.

    Can't just take away the points, and the assists. He's moving this offense. They are playing their best basketball of the season. It's not just Jeremy, everyone is playing better.
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  • JimmyVJimmyV Posts: 19,128
    I read Simmons column earlier and knew it was going to blow up on the board...but I really thought it was going to be super fans ripping him for getting the Jeremy story wrong. Never thought we would have a three page debate about Jeremy Lin.

    Seven games is too small a sample to draw any conclusions, good or bad. But he has been a dynamo so far for the Knicks.
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  • And this is you being jealous, and bitter.

    Dude, keep denying his stats he has put up over the last 7 games.

    Why can't he be for real? Answer that.

    Jealous and bitter of what? A below average basketball player that has had 1 good week of basketball against 1 decent team?

    I've said he has had a good week. wooptie friggin doo

    He can't consistently play like this, he just doesn't have that ability. Can he be serviceable? Of course, but this guy is a 10 point or under guy who will get some assists. That's about it. He isn't a savior and he will never be an All Star. It's just the way it is in the NBA.
    SAYS WHO????????????


    Do you see what you are typing? And what if he doesn't slow down? Sure he won't put up 38 every night, but why can't he be as good as he has been? Just stop ignoring the fact that for 7 straight games he has been awesome. Not two straight, not just one game.
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  • 81 wrote:


    7 games does not make a player.

    i'm not on the hate wagon....but 7 games does not make a player.

    you can't dismiss the rest of his stats and only focucs on the last 7 games.
    ???????

    He sat on a bench the rest of the time. What are you saying?

    Exactly that. If you are good in the NBA you aren't on the bench. Coaches don't miss that, they see it in practice. If Mello didn't get hurt, he'd either be out of the league today or on his 4th bench in 2 years.
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  • Rossum20Rossum20 Posts: 910
    If Jeremy Lin could play he wouldn't have played at Harvard and wouldn't be on his 3rd team in 2 years. Not to mention the Knicks were injuries away from cutting him this year.

    Please enough already. The guy is barely an NBA bench player.


    This makes absolutely no sense - everyone gets to the top (meaning a starting position in the NBA and other sports) in different ways. Because he took an abnormal path to get there, it's impossible for him to keep his job? You're not making any sense. I can only hope that some other people who actually know something about sports can help enlighten you. No one is saying he is going to be an NBA SUPERSTAR the rest of his career, but he likely isn't going away. The media frenzy undoubtedly will though at some point - and I'm sure that will be the determinant for you that he has "disappeared" and that he is no longer a good player. Although according to you, he isn't even a good one now. :lol:


    Ben Wallace average 6 points a game for his career. That's your defense? This proves to me and everyone else you are clueless as to how different players contribute to the TEAM in different ways. Wallace is not there as a shooter.

    Wallace is a four-time All-Star, four-time Defensive Player of the Year, five-time All-NBA Defensive Team selection, and five-time All-NBA Team selection.

    He won an NBA title with Detroit in 2004.

    He's fourth among active players in total rebounds (34th all-time), and has finished in the top five in total rebounds five times.

    He's also fourth among active players in total blocks (16th all-time), and has finished in the top 10 in blocks seven times.


    Avery and Starks are also perfect examples because they are similiar to Lin...they didn't need to be the superstar and center of attention to have successful NBA careers. Keep insisting "it never happens, not in this sport!" while I try and give you perfect examples THAT IT DOES. Get it?


    It's about getting an opportunity to show what you have, and it's a lot harder to do that when you come in as a late round pick or an undrafted player. How many roster spots are there in the NFL? 53. 45 or 46 active on game day. Injuries are abundant so players are put into positions to play and showcase what they have far more often than the NBA. 5 starting positions compared to 22. If a team like Lin was on before (Golden State) has depth at the point, he simply will never get a shot, unless that guard gets hurt. Clearly QB's in the NFL taking Terry Tate-like hits are much more likely to allow that backup at least a few opportunities to show what they have. But I'll stop trying to compare the sports (because apparently only you can) - just again trying to help you understand why it happens more in the NFL than the NBA...and it has just about nothing to do with the inner workings of the sport. It's about the opportunity.
  • Should I remember the first year and a half of games? Or just not the last 7?
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  • 8181 Posts: 58,276
    81 wrote:


    7 games does not make a player.

    i'm not on the hate wagon....but 7 games does not make a player.

    you can't dismiss the rest of his stats and only focucs on the last 7 games.
    ???????

    He sat on a bench the rest of the time. What are you saying? He finally got his chance to start, and this is what he's doing.

    Can't just take away the points, and the assists. He's moving this offense. They are playing their best basketball of the season. It's not just Jeremy, everyone is playing better.



    http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... nje01.html

    i'm not saying he isn't going to be a solid player.....but 7 games does not define a career....and more importantly....espn/the media need to tone down the the lin coverage, i'm not predicting the future like the rest of you....from him being a complete nobody in two years, to him being the second coming.
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  • Rossum20Rossum20 Posts: 910
    Should I remember the first year and a half of games? Or just not the last 7?


    You should remember that you don't know very much about sports (and that's ok), but it'll at least prevent you from making a fool of yourself in the future.
  • CallawayCallaway Posts: 635
    edited February 2012
    .
    Post edited by Callaway on
  • Jeremys SpokenJeremys Spoken Posts: 7,578
    edited February 2012
    Should I remember the first 23 games? Or just not the last 7?
    Tell me how Tim Thomas (Bruins goalie) became the starter.

    He was a backup the whole time, then injuries, and bad play made him the eventual starter. Tell me how he won 2 Vezina trophy's.

    Lin has been in the league for 1 and a half years. He was cut, un-drafted and overlooked by many. Give the guy a fucking chance.

    You're a joke. What you are writing is actually angering me for some reason.
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  • teskeincteskeinc Posts: 1,603
    Bottom line is Lin has led a crappy NYK team to 7 straight wins. He is an underdog, an Asian kid in the NBA. People eat up the feel good story. Thats why its on ESPN 24/7. Like him or not you cant discount the wins/stats this kid has put up.

    Problem with the Knicks is the me first players like Carmelo Anthony and Amare Stoudamire who would rather have huge stats than wins. Anthony is a 1 on 1 player and Amare is a black hole inside. Plus both are half-assed defensive players which kill their chances to win. When Anthony returns it will be interesting to see the dynamics, I know Anthony hates the attention Lin is getting and will see to it his stats suffer, and affect his play significantly.

    The Knicks are a better "team" without Anthony and Stoudamire. But have more talent with them in the line-up. Weird situation when your "superstars" dont want to win.
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  • Rossum20Rossum20 Posts: 910
    81 wrote:
    81 wrote:


    7 games does not make a player.

    i'm not on the hate wagon....but 7 games does not make a player.

    you can't dismiss the rest of his stats and only focucs on the last 7 games.
    ???????

    He sat on a bench the rest of the time. What are you saying? He finally got his chance to start, and this is what he's doing.

    Can't just take away the points, and the assists. He's moving this offense. They are playing their best basketball of the season. It's not just Jeremy, everyone is playing better.



    http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... nje01.html

    i'm not saying he isn't going to be a solid player.....but 7 games does not define a career....and more importantly....espn/the media need to tone down the the lin coverage, i'm not predicting the future like the rest of you....from him being a complete nobody in two years, to him being the second coming.


    Second coming of what?? No one is proclaiming he is the next Jordan. "Someone" is claiming he won't be in existence in 2 years while supporting that argument with the "fact" ( :roll: ) that it has "never" ( :roll: ) happened. When it has.

    Of course the media is blowing it out of proportion - it's a great story that sells. That's not the argument though. It's that he simply CANNOT be a good player because of his history. Wow.
  • RedMosquito22RedMosquito22 Posts: 8,158
    edited February 2012
    Rossum20 wrote:
    Should I remember the first year and a half of games? Or just not the last 7?


    You should remember that you don't know very much about sports (and that's ok), but it'll at least prevent you from making a fool of yourself in the future.

    Come talk to me after this stretch pal.

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  • What RM22 seems to be ignorant about is the fact that the kid got a chance to step up and lead a team for the FIRST TIME....and he's making history with his numbers.

    Why is it that in his first few starts he scored the most points of anyone, ever? Everyone on that list is a great player.

    Why? Because they were all highly drafted? Why, because they weren't cut twice, and overlooked?

    Give me a break. Jeremy Lin is for real. You don't lose his basketball IQ and you don't lose a jump shot.
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  • 81 wrote:
    81 wrote:
    drewdawgq wrote:
    You don't go for 38 against the Lakers and fade away.

    Troy Hudson

    ;)


    ;):lol:

    dropped 37 on the lakers in a playoff game.

    Nice! Good memory I forgot about that one. Troy Hudson wasn't 6'3 200lbs either. He also had some significant injury problems.
    Tread Lightly.
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