How about this meat head Incognito? Bullying a teammate? Sounds like he's in trouble with racially charged emails and texts that were sent to the league for review.
Alright, alright, alright!
Tom O. "I never had any friends later on like the ones I had when I was twelve. Jesus, does anyone?"
-The Writer
How about this meat head Incognito? Bullying a teammate? Sounds like he's in trouble with racially charged emails and texts that were sent to the league for review.
Over the years i've only heard negative things when I hear that bum Incognito's name. Seems like just a terrible human being. Glad he got suspended. He deserves all the embarrassment and humiliation from what I understand. Not Martin.
PJ - 36
EV - 5
(**Letterman'02, Irving Plaza, Storytellers, Beacon, ACL, Spectrum 3&4, Bridge School '10**)
"Constant recoil,..sometimes life don't leave you alone."
Let's connect on twitter - @Jeffgorra
ESPN's Adam Schefter has the vile quotes. "Hey, wassup, you half n
piece of (expletive). I saw you on Twitter, you been training ten weeks. (I want to) (expletive) in your (expletive) mouth. (I'm going to) slap your (expletive) mouth. (I'm going to) slap your real mother across the face (laughter). (Expletive) you, you're still a rookie. I'll kill you." Jonathan Martin has left the team and Incognito has been suspended indefinitely.
How did his teammates let him get away with this bullshit? How did the coaches have their heads so far up their asses that they allowed this to go on? Needs to be a major shake-up. The Dolphins have been my team (along with the Seahawks) since Dan was a rookie. Cheering from Western Canada, I think I'll look elsewhere for a team to cheer for. Complete bush league.
ESPN's Adam Schefter has the vile quotes. "Hey, wassup, you half n
piece of (expletive). I saw you on Twitter, you been training ten weeks. (I want to) (expletive) in your (expletive) mouth. (I'm going to) slap your (expletive) mouth. (I'm going to) slap your real mother across the face (laughter). (Expletive) you, you're still a rookie. I'll kill you." Jonathan Martin has left the team and Incognito has been suspended indefinitely.
How did his teammates let him get away with this bullshit? How did the coaches have their heads so far up their asses that they allowed this to go on? Needs to be a major shake-up. The Dolphins have been my team (along with the Seahawks) since Dan was a rookie. Cheering from Western Canada, I think I'll look elsewhere for a team to cheer for. Complete bush league.
All the shittiness of the past 20 years of Dolphins football and THIS is what's gonna make you look elsewhere for a team to cheer for? Well have it your way but if you ever want to come back and lament all things Dolphins, we have a thread for it. viewtopic.php?f=14&t=195453
ESPN's Adam Schefter has the vile quotes. "Hey, wassup, you half n
piece of (expletive). I saw you on Twitter, you been training ten weeks. (I want to) (expletive) in your (expletive) mouth. (I'm going to) slap your (expletive) mouth. (I'm going to) slap your real mother across the face (laughter). (Expletive) you, you're still a rookie. I'll kill you." Jonathan Martin has left the team and Incognito has been suspended indefinitely.
How did his teammates let him get away with this bullshit? How did the coaches have their heads so far up their asses that they allowed this to go on? Needs to be a major shake-up. The Dolphins have been my team (along with the Seahawks) since Dan was a rookie. Cheering from Western Canada, I think I'll look elsewhere for a team to cheer for. Complete bush league.
All the shittiness of the past 20 years of Dolphins football and THIS is what's gonna make you look elsewhere for a team to cheer for? Well have it your way but if you ever want to come back and lament all things Dolphins, we have a thread for it. viewtopic.php?f=14&t=195453
They are inept and continually go to great lengths to prove it. Frustrating is not the term that best describes this organization.
Failed draft picks (Ginn). Poor personnel choices (Culpepper over Brees). Shitty coaches (Saban). Obscene team culture (Incognito). The list goes on...
The team has doen a fantastic job of letting things spiral out of control since the Don Shula/ Dan Marino days. I'll always remember throwing things at the television when Thurman Thomas would gash us 7 yds a pop and we would get bumped from the playoffs, but this organization is moronic to say the most polite thing I could about them.
All the shittiness of the past 20 years of Dolphins football and THIS is what's gonna make you look elsewhere for a team to cheer for? Well have it your way but if you ever want to come back and lament all things Dolphins, we have a thread for it. viewtopic.php?f=14&t=195453
LOL, I had the same reaction. 1 player who goes overboard and is a jerk to another and that is what would make you kick the team to the curb?
(And no racial slurs are acceptable but handling it like a child in a schoolyard is kind of blowing it out of the water in my limited view so far given what we know. Maybe the whole team was against him and making racial comments to him and threatened to slap him (in which case I could understand) but this is a job where he is paid a million a year to show up and do your work. Go to the coach if you cannot resolve a conflict with a co-worker, just as you would in another job. Anyway, as stated we have a limited view so far of what actually happened...sorry for the guy that it did but I would swap jobs with him if he wants and would have no problem with someone being mean to me so that I could collect the approximately $1,000,000 that they are meant to pay him this year.)
(And no racial slurs are acceptable but handling it like a child in a schoolyard is kind of blowing it out of the water in my limited view so far given what we know. Maybe the whole team was against him and making racial comments to him and threatened to slap him (in which case I could understand) but this is a job where he is paid a million a year to show up and do your work. Go to the coach if you cannot resolve a conflict with a co-worker, just as you would in another job. Anyway, as stated we have a limited view so far of what actually happened...sorry for the guy that it did but I would swap jobs with him if he wants and would have no problem with someone being mean to me so that I could collect the approximately $1,000,000 that they are meant to pay him this year.)
The NFL isn't any other job though. Off the top of my head I can't think of a better way to handle it. Incognito is a Pro Bowler, Martin is not, and that's probably more on the coaches mind than personal issues. I'm guessing Incognito might not have been suspended had Martin not gone public and forced their hand with a potential public relations problem. You can get away with murder (literally) in the NFL if you're good enough and crucial enough to your team. He took the decision out of the franchises hands and forced them into the court of public opinion. I can't even imagine going to my high school football coaches with a bullying problem, much less a professional one. They would have told me to grow a pair and stop wasting their time. Hell, half the shit they used to do to us probably would be called bullying these days. It's a very macho culture in football, you're expected to play through injuries or whatever else life throws at you, including name calling.
I agree that I would take millions of dollars to have somebody hurl insults at me, but it doesn't HAVE to be that way for him. He shouldn't have to put up with shit like that to do his job. He has every right to try and resolve it, and maybe there was a better way, but I can easily see how he might have thought this was the best way. Because if he goes to his coach and the coach doesn't do shit, now he still has to deal with this asshole who is probably extra mad for getting "told" on.
"See a broad to get dat booty yak 'em, leg 'er down, a smack 'em yak 'em!"
(And no racial slurs are acceptable but handling it like a child in a schoolyard is kind of blowing it out of the water in my limited view so far given what we know. Maybe the whole team was against him and making racial comments to him and threatened to slap him (in which case I could understand) but this is a job where he is paid a million a year to show up and do your work. Go to the coach if you cannot resolve a conflict with a co-worker, just as you would in another job. Anyway, as stated we have a limited view so far of what actually happened...sorry for the guy that it did but I would swap jobs with him if he wants and would have no problem with someone being mean to me so that I could collect the approximately $1,000,000 that they are meant to pay him this year.)
The NFL isn't any other job though. Off the top of my head I can't think of a better way to handle it. Incognito is a Pro Bowler, Martin is not, and that's probably more on the coaches mind than personal issues. I'm guessing Incognito might not have been suspended had Martin not gone public and forced their hand with a potential public relations problem. You can get away with murder (literally) in the NFL if you're good enough and crucial enough to your team. He took the decision out of the franchises hands and forced them into the court of public opinion. I can't even imagine going to my high school football coaches with a bullying problem, much less a professional one. They would have told me to grow a pair and stop wasting their time. Hell, half the shit they used to do to us probably would be called bullying these days. It's a very macho culture in football, you're expected to play through injuries or whatever else life throws at you, including name calling.
I agree that I would take millions of dollars to have somebody hurl insults at me, but it doesn't HAVE to be that way for him. He shouldn't have to put up with shit like that to do his job. He has every right to try and resolve it, and maybe there was a better way, but I can easily see how he might have thought this was the best way. Because if he goes to his coach and the coach doesn't do shit, now he still has to deal with this asshole who is probably extra mad for getting "told" on.
Well put.
Alright, alright, alright!
Tom O. "I never had any friends later on like the ones I had when I was twelve. Jesus, does anyone?"
-The Writer
wow ... it's gotta be bad to suspend the guy before the investigation wraps up ... sounds like incognito is an asshole who no one ever stood up to and this is the result ...
Strong teams and strong organizations do not allow for this type of conduct.
Athletes/employees/or members of any organization are much more committed and much more productive when they feel they are valued. I realize that teams are littered with guys who behave poorly off the field, but this type of in-house behaviour is unbelievably poor. The fact that there were so many participants lends evidence to the fact that this is a shoddy organization that is either indifferent... ot unknowing: both ridiculous to say the least.
Allowing for such rogue behaviour is piss poor. Bottom line. Those that are saying this is the NFL and that guys should just toughen up are not in touch with reality.
* And as far as a 'knee jerk' reaction to this amounting to my disowning the Dolphins from afar... I have listed just a few items that have led me to this point. This is hardly an emotional reaction. This is just, yet another, goofy thing that I don't have to ignore for blind allegiance.
(And no racial slurs are acceptable but handling it like a child in a schoolyard is kind of blowing it out of the water in my limited view so far given what we know. Maybe the whole team was against him and making racial comments to him and threatened to slap him (in which case I could understand) but this is a job where he is paid a million a year to show up and do your work. Go to the coach if you cannot resolve a conflict with a co-worker, just as you would in another job. Anyway, as stated we have a limited view so far of what actually happened...sorry for the guy that it did but I would swap jobs with him if he wants and would have no problem with someone being mean to me so that I could collect the approximately $1,000,000 that they are meant to pay him this year.)
The NFL isn't any other job though. Off the top of my head I can't think of a better way to handle it. Incognito is a Pro Bowler, Martin is not, and that's probably more on the coaches mind than personal issues. I'm guessing Incognito might not have been suspended had Martin not gone public and forced their hand with a potential public relations problem. You can get away with murder (literally) in the NFL if you're good enough and crucial enough to your team. He took the decision out of the franchises hands and forced them into the court of public opinion. I can't even imagine going to my high school football coaches with a bullying problem, much less a professional one. They would have told me to grow a pair and stop wasting their time. Hell, half the shit they used to do to us probably would be called bullying these days. It's a very macho culture in football, you're expected to play through injuries or whatever else life throws at you, including name calling.
I agree that I would take millions of dollars to have somebody hurl insults at me, but it doesn't HAVE to be that way for him. He shouldn't have to put up with shit like that to do his job. He has every right to try and resolve it, and maybe there was a better way, but I can easily see how he might have thought this was the best way. Because if he goes to his coach and the coach doesn't do shit, now he still has to deal with this asshole who is probably extra mad for getting "told" on.
Some good points made there. I certainly agree that it doesn't HAVE to be that way for him. I cant believe that there is not leadership on the team (specifically black players, who would side with him and help him given Incognito's supposed use of the un-usable word) to help resolve w/o walking away.
The guy did go to Stanford and you have to think that even with some allowances being made on admitting him there due to football that he must be a pretty smart guy to pass the classwork...so maybe this is all he could find to do.
However...if the result of him going to his coach would be 'Grow a pair buddy' (which sounds about right from a coach) then how will be received in the locker room when he goes back to work after walking out on them?
It is an interesting case and I let my belief that I WOULD put up with that sort of grief for a 4 year 5 million dollar contract (which this guy signed) get in the way of the human reaction, which is that if Incognito did what he is reported to have done then he is a total ahole and you have to give the harassed player room to deal with it as he can.
Will have to watch and see what else comes out to shed more light on it as well. Certainly doesn't make the Dolphins look good.
Maybe Riley Cooper can play there next year. :nono:
Some good points made there. I certainly agree that it doesn't HAVE to be that way for him. I cant believe that there is not leadership on the team (specifically black players, who would side with him and help him given Incognito's supposed use of the un-usable word) to help resolve w/o walking away.
The guy did go to Stanford and you have to think that even with some allowances being made on admitting him there due to football that he must be a pretty smart guy to pass the classwork...so maybe this is all he could find to do.
However...if the result of him going to his coach would be 'Grow a pair buddy' (which sounds about right from a coach) then how will be received in the locker room when he goes back to work after walking out on them?
It is an interesting case and I let my belief that I WOULD put up with that sort of grief for a 4 year 5 million dollar contract (which this guy signed) get in the way of the human reaction, which is that if Incognito did what he is reported to have done then he is a total ahole and you have to give the harassed player room to deal with it as he can.
Will have to watch and see what else comes out to shed more light on it as well. Certainly doesn't make the Dolphins look good.
Maybe Riley Cooper can play there next year. :nono:
I'm guessing there is a total lack of leadership, and that's the problem. A locker room is a pretty lawless place. Coaches generally don't care or don't want to know what goes on in there, they're worried about the X's and O's. Without leadership in the locker room, it's generally the aggressive assholes who take over. Then it's usually some dickhead clique running things, and nobody wants to rock the boat or put a target on their back. There has to be somebody in there who both commands respect, and has the balls to stand up to people like this. Apparently nobody in the Dolphins locker room possesses both of those traits.
I've seen some ex-players talking about this today, and they don't seem to know what to think. On one hand they're saying you have to have a thick skin and all that, but on the other hand they're saying there is a line. And this stuff, if true, is over that line. Hazing is one thing, this is another from how it sounds.
Like I said, I too would probably gladly get paid millions to have insults (and death threats, as long as they're only threats) hurled at me, but I'm sure after a time I would want to put a stop to it. It's not part of his job, not what he's trained his whole life for, and I'm sure any of us would get fed up at some point due to the fact it's completely unnecessary. Especially a guy who's been working his whole life to get to the NFL, and expects those millions, only to get this bullshit thrown in when he gets there. Even making millions, I'm sure most of us would want to improve our situation and do away with bullshit like this. I personally probably wouldn't care for a while, then once the shock of being a millionaire was over I'd be like "Hey, why do I have to put up with this shit?".
It will be curious to see how he's accepted in other locker rooms after this, as you said. You never know, some people might understand. I doubt he'll get harassed anymore, at least not to this extent. Nobody will want to be the next Richie Incognito. If it were simple hazing most players would probably despise him for this, but this doesn't sound like hazing. And it apparently extends to team employees, not just players.
Looking at Incognito's history of getting suspended and expelled from schools/teams for his behavior, I'm sure Miami knew exactly what they were getting and didn't care. There may be more to this story than what we've heard so far, but however it turns out Incognito is an undeniable douchebag who at the VERY least has no business on a team's "Leadership Committee", which he is. Or was.
"See a broad to get dat booty yak 'em, leg 'er down, a smack 'em yak 'em!"
A teasing here and a teasing there is fine, but when there is an isolated target and the level of teasing goes to manic proportions... the club was negligent for not intervening. They act now that everything is public, but they could have acted much earlier if so inclined. They obviously didn't because they were okay with one of their own being treated like a piece of garbage.
When they asked Ditka about it earlier, I thought he was going to be the tough as nails old ball coach and say Martin needs thicker skin (like some analysts who have never played a down have said), but even he thought this stuff was bullshit. If I were Incognito I'd steer clear of Hurricane Ditka.
But none of this shit really falls under hazing like some of the analysts have said, so I wish they'd just stop calling it that. There have been death threats, family threats, and other rookies (not just Martin) have been complaining about the alleged extortion. Hazing is having somebody do an Atomic Sit-Up or the old Ghost Balls joke, not shit like this.
"See a broad to get dat booty yak 'em, leg 'er down, a smack 'em yak 'em!"
Comments
Redskins over the Chargers 30 - 24
Seahawks over Bucs 27 - 24 another ugly one but they came back for the win! 8-1 hell yeah!
whew!
angels share laughter
*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
Both my teams? :fp: :?: :nono:
Tom O.
"I never had any friends later on like the ones I had when I was twelve. Jesus, does anyone?"
-The Writer
Tom O.
"I never had any friends later on like the ones I had when I was twelve. Jesus, does anyone?"
-The Writer
My thoughts exactly. :fp: :fp:
EV - 5
(**Letterman'02, Irving Plaza, Storytellers, Beacon, ACL, Spectrum 3&4, Bridge School '10**)
"Constant recoil,..sometimes life don't leave you alone."
Let's connect on twitter - @Jeffgorra
if prism feels so inclined, he can explain himself there.
ESPN's Adam Schefter has the vile quotes. "Hey, wassup, you half n
piece of (expletive). I saw you on Twitter, you been training ten weeks. (I want to) (expletive) in your (expletive) mouth. (I'm going to) slap your (expletive) mouth. (I'm going to) slap your real mother across the face (laughter). (Expletive) you, you're still a rookie. I'll kill you." Jonathan Martin has left the team and Incognito has been suspended indefinitely.
How did his teammates let him get away with this bullshit? How did the coaches have their heads so far up their asses that they allowed this to go on? Needs to be a major shake-up. The Dolphins have been my team (along with the Seahawks) since Dan was a rookie. Cheering from Western Canada, I think I'll look elsewhere for a team to cheer for. Complete bush league.
All the shittiness of the past 20 years of Dolphins football and THIS is what's gonna make you look elsewhere for a team to cheer for? Well have it your way but if you ever want to come back and lament all things Dolphins, we have a thread for it. viewtopic.php?f=14&t=195453
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
http://deadspin.com/psa-features-richie ... socialflow
Tom O.
"I never had any friends later on like the ones I had when I was twelve. Jesus, does anyone?"
-The Writer
They are inept and continually go to great lengths to prove it. Frustrating is not the term that best describes this organization.
Failed draft picks (Ginn). Poor personnel choices (Culpepper over Brees). Shitty coaches (Saban). Obscene team culture (Incognito). The list goes on...
The team has doen a fantastic job of letting things spiral out of control since the Don Shula/ Dan Marino days. I'll always remember throwing things at the television when Thurman Thomas would gash us 7 yds a pop and we would get bumped from the playoffs, but this organization is moronic to say the most polite thing I could about them.
I checked that thread out by the way.
Geezuz.
Lends support for what I had just written.
A bush league operation.
LOL, I had the same reaction. 1 player who goes overboard and is a jerk to another and that is what would make you kick the team to the curb?
(And no racial slurs are acceptable but handling it like a child in a schoolyard is kind of blowing it out of the water in my limited view so far given what we know. Maybe the whole team was against him and making racial comments to him and threatened to slap him (in which case I could understand) but this is a job where he is paid a million a year to show up and do your work. Go to the coach if you cannot resolve a conflict with a co-worker, just as you would in another job. Anyway, as stated we have a limited view so far of what actually happened...sorry for the guy that it did but I would swap jobs with him if he wants and would have no problem with someone being mean to me so that I could collect the approximately $1,000,000 that they are meant to pay him this year.)
The NFL isn't any other job though. Off the top of my head I can't think of a better way to handle it. Incognito is a Pro Bowler, Martin is not, and that's probably more on the coaches mind than personal issues. I'm guessing Incognito might not have been suspended had Martin not gone public and forced their hand with a potential public relations problem. You can get away with murder (literally) in the NFL if you're good enough and crucial enough to your team. He took the decision out of the franchises hands and forced them into the court of public opinion. I can't even imagine going to my high school football coaches with a bullying problem, much less a professional one. They would have told me to grow a pair and stop wasting their time. Hell, half the shit they used to do to us probably would be called bullying these days. It's a very macho culture in football, you're expected to play through injuries or whatever else life throws at you, including name calling.
I agree that I would take millions of dollars to have somebody hurl insults at me, but it doesn't HAVE to be that way for him. He shouldn't have to put up with shit like that to do his job. He has every right to try and resolve it, and maybe there was a better way, but I can easily see how he might have thought this was the best way. Because if he goes to his coach and the coach doesn't do shit, now he still has to deal with this asshole who is probably extra mad for getting "told" on.
Well put.
Tom O.
"I never had any friends later on like the ones I had when I was twelve. Jesus, does anyone?"
-The Writer
Athletes/employees/or members of any organization are much more committed and much more productive when they feel they are valued. I realize that teams are littered with guys who behave poorly off the field, but this type of in-house behaviour is unbelievably poor. The fact that there were so many participants lends evidence to the fact that this is a shoddy organization that is either indifferent... ot unknowing: both ridiculous to say the least.
Allowing for such rogue behaviour is piss poor. Bottom line. Those that are saying this is the NFL and that guys should just toughen up are not in touch with reality.
* And as far as a 'knee jerk' reaction to this amounting to my disowning the Dolphins from afar... I have listed just a few items that have led me to this point. This is hardly an emotional reaction. This is just, yet another, goofy thing that I don't have to ignore for blind allegiance.
Some good points made there. I certainly agree that it doesn't HAVE to be that way for him. I cant believe that there is not leadership on the team (specifically black players, who would side with him and help him given Incognito's supposed use of the un-usable word) to help resolve w/o walking away.
The guy did go to Stanford and you have to think that even with some allowances being made on admitting him there due to football that he must be a pretty smart guy to pass the classwork...so maybe this is all he could find to do.
However...if the result of him going to his coach would be 'Grow a pair buddy' (which sounds about right from a coach) then how will be received in the locker room when he goes back to work after walking out on them?
It is an interesting case and I let my belief that I WOULD put up with that sort of grief for a 4 year 5 million dollar contract (which this guy signed) get in the way of the human reaction, which is that if Incognito did what he is reported to have done then he is a total ahole and you have to give the harassed player room to deal with it as he can.
Will have to watch and see what else comes out to shed more light on it as well. Certainly doesn't make the Dolphins look good.
Maybe Riley Cooper can play there next year. :nono:
I'm guessing there is a total lack of leadership, and that's the problem. A locker room is a pretty lawless place. Coaches generally don't care or don't want to know what goes on in there, they're worried about the X's and O's. Without leadership in the locker room, it's generally the aggressive assholes who take over. Then it's usually some dickhead clique running things, and nobody wants to rock the boat or put a target on their back. There has to be somebody in there who both commands respect, and has the balls to stand up to people like this. Apparently nobody in the Dolphins locker room possesses both of those traits.
I've seen some ex-players talking about this today, and they don't seem to know what to think. On one hand they're saying you have to have a thick skin and all that, but on the other hand they're saying there is a line. And this stuff, if true, is over that line. Hazing is one thing, this is another from how it sounds.
Like I said, I too would probably gladly get paid millions to have insults (and death threats, as long as they're only threats) hurled at me, but I'm sure after a time I would want to put a stop to it. It's not part of his job, not what he's trained his whole life for, and I'm sure any of us would get fed up at some point due to the fact it's completely unnecessary. Especially a guy who's been working his whole life to get to the NFL, and expects those millions, only to get this bullshit thrown in when he gets there. Even making millions, I'm sure most of us would want to improve our situation and do away with bullshit like this. I personally probably wouldn't care for a while, then once the shock of being a millionaire was over I'd be like "Hey, why do I have to put up with this shit?".
It will be curious to see how he's accepted in other locker rooms after this, as you said. You never know, some people might understand. I doubt he'll get harassed anymore, at least not to this extent. Nobody will want to be the next Richie Incognito. If it were simple hazing most players would probably despise him for this, but this doesn't sound like hazing. And it apparently extends to team employees, not just players.
Looking at Incognito's history of getting suspended and expelled from schools/teams for his behavior, I'm sure Miami knew exactly what they were getting and didn't care. There may be more to this story than what we've heard so far, but however it turns out Incognito is an undeniable douchebag who at the VERY least has no business on a team's "Leadership Committee", which he is. Or was.
http://www.sportspickle.com/
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
What a douche
Don't do steroids kids.
Lol
What a. Scary douche!
One of the Pouncy twins aka one half of the free Aaron Hernandez team :twisted:
The nfl really is fucked up with thugs
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BYQZs3UCUAEWaB6.jpg:large
A teasing here and a teasing there is fine, but when there is an isolated target and the level of teasing goes to manic proportions... the club was negligent for not intervening. They act now that everything is public, but they could have acted much earlier if so inclined. They obviously didn't because they were okay with one of their own being treated like a piece of garbage.
Dysfunctional.
Seems like such a fun guy to be around.
But none of this shit really falls under hazing like some of the analysts have said, so I wish they'd just stop calling it that. There have been death threats, family threats, and other rookies (not just Martin) have been complaining about the alleged extortion. Hazing is having somebody do an Atomic Sit-Up or the old Ghost Balls joke, not shit like this.
He needs to be, Seneca Wallace is unbelievably bad.