Are there really that many from the old guard still around? I thought most were in the younger crowd these days. Either way, get their asses out of voting for awards and who goes into the Hall.
Baseball writers ALL hold the HOF in a very high regard. It is the most heralded of all the sports HOF's so they take it seriously. Just look at past voting and how certain players weren't unanimously voted in. I mean who is the assholes that DIDN'T vote for Griffey Jr or the 6 jackwagons that didn't vote for Ryan and the list goes on.
I totally agree with you about the WAR phenomenon...
If you don't vote for Griffey or Ryan, you should never be allowed to write so much as a text message to your child ever again.
we all know what's up....Bonds is alleged, too. right now, I figure they have already put in at least 4-5 steroid guys.
If I had known then what I know now...
Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
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EV LA1 08
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St. Paul 14, Denver 14
nearly 10% of current MLBers have a "therapuetic use exemption" to take Adderral. go see what Aubrey Huff has to say about Adderral....
If I had known then what I know now...
Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
VIC 07
EV LA1 08
Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
Columbus 10
EV LA 11
Vancouver 11
Missoula 12
Portland 13, Spokane 13
St. Paul 14, Denver 14
we all know what's up....Bonds is alleged, too. right now, I figure they have already put in at least 4-5 steroid guys.
Rob, I'm with you. The only actual evidence Bonds used was the failed sample test that Big Papi and a decent portion of MLB failed. Baseball told the players the test wouldn't be used against them which should include the HOF. Bonds was eventually acquitted of the only charge from his trial he was convicted of. Mind you that charge was for obstruction for not fully answering a question about his trainer and other players, nothing to do with him. There is technically no more evidence against him than any of the other guys suspected from that era other than a book written with illegally obtained court documents. I hate when baseball says he was a roid user but other guys like Piazza are suspected. We all know he did them. I am not denying that but he is still technically a suspected user when it comes to MLB and the HOF.
Tom Brady & Donald Trump, BFF's Fuckus rules all Rob Seattle
we all know what's up....Bonds is alleged, too. right now, I figure they have already put in at least 4-5 steroid guys.
Rob, I'm with you. The only actual evidence Bonds used was the failed sample test that Big Papi and a decent portion of MLB failed. Baseball told the players the test wouldn't be used against them which should include the HOF. Bonds was eventually acquitted of the only charge from his trial he was convicted of. Mind you that charge was for obstruction for not fully answering a question about his trainer and other players, nothing to do with him. There is technically no more evidence against him than any of the other guys suspected from that era other than a book written with illegally obtained court documents. I hate when baseball says he was a roid user but other guys like Piazza are suspected. We all know he did them. I am not denying that but he is still technically a suspected user when it comes to MLB and the HOF.
That sample test with the leaked names are also alleged. Leaked by a media member/outlet. NO ONE knows for sure who is on that list. So, to me anyway, is not actual evidence. I'm not gonna believe some person who says they have a "source" that says so-and-so was on that list. Not enough proof for me.
You can almost make a argument over every era of baseball for a player not to be in the HOF.
Pitchers like Cy Young & Old Hoss Radbourn , who pitched in the late 1800's, could pitch spit-balls, scuff the ball, and whatever else they could do with the ball and only played against white Americans. Old Hoss won 59 games one year and completed 73!! Cy Young won over 500 games!>You really think they could've done that now? Or even in the 20's-70's? Of course not, but ther in the HOF.
Babe Ruth, Ty Cobb, Lou Gehrig, etc, and also only played against white Americans(yeah i know, that wasn't ther fault). Do they put up the stats that they did if they played against the best? Sucks, because we would never know how good they really were. And, ther in the HOF.
Players in the 40's, 50's, 60's, 70's, 80's and probably up until recently used "greenies"/speed, and like Rob said, Adderal. I think Mays, Mantle & Arron said they did greenies, so do they put up the stats they did without using? Who knows, but ther in the HOF.
Do we know what players loaded ther bats, by corking, or sand-papering ther bats and pitchers that threw spitters/scuffed/vasoline balls? We don't of course. And trust me, some of those players are in the HOF. And, not just Gaylord Perry.
I actually think that a few players took some steroids as early as the 70's. I was in HS in the late 70's and we, my friends, knew about steroids. A guy i grew up with was in the Phillies organization in the early-mid 80's and he knew players were taking steroids then. And you know thers some players that are in the HOF who used.
Like i said, a argument can made for every era. It's baseball !! I HATE A-Rod, even before steroids, but the guy is a HOF. Just like Bonds, Clemens, etc.etc.
we all know what's up....Bonds is alleged, too. right now, I figure they have already put in at least 4-5 steroid guys.
Rob, I'm with you. The only actual evidence Bonds used was the failed sample test that Big Papi and a decent portion of MLB failed. Baseball told the players the test wouldn't be used against them which should include the HOF. Bonds was eventually acquitted of the only charge from his trial he was convicted of. Mind you that charge was for obstruction for not fully answering a question about his trainer and other players, nothing to do with him. There is technically no more evidence against him than any of the other guys suspected from that era other than a book written with illegally obtained court documents. I hate when baseball says he was a roid user but other guys like Piazza are suspected. We all know he did them. I am not denying that but he is still technically a suspected user when it comes to MLB and the HOF.
That sample test with the leaked names are also alleged. Leaked by a media member/outlet. NO ONE knows for sure who is on that list. So, to me anyway, is not actual evidence. I'm not gonna believe some person who says they have a "source" that says so-and-so was on that list. Not enough proof for me.
You can almost make a argument over every era of baseball for a player not to be in the HOF.
Pitchers like Cy Young & Old Hoss Radbourn , who pitched in the late 1800's, could pitch spit-balls, scuff the ball, and whatever else they could do with the ball and only played against white Americans. Old Hoss won 59 games one year and completed 73!! Cy Young won over 500 games!>You really think they could've done that now? Or even in the 20's-70's? Of course not, but ther in the HOF.
Babe Ruth, Ty Cobb, Lou Gehrig, etc, and also only played against white Americans(yeah i know, that wasn't ther fault). Do they put up the stats that they did if they played against the best? Sucks, because we would never know how good they really were. And, ther in the HOF.
Players in the 40's, 50's, 60's, 70's, 80's and probably up until recently used "greenies"/speed, and like Rob said, Adderal. I think Mays, Mantle & Arron said they did greenies, so do they put up the stats they did without using? Who knows, but ther in the HOF.
Do we know what players loaded ther bats, by corking, or sand-papering ther bats and pitchers that threw spitters/scuffed/vasoline balls? We don't of course. And trust me, some of those players are in the HOF. And, not just Gaylord Perry.
I actually think that a few players took some steroids as early as the 70's. I was in HS in the late 70's and we, my friends, knew about steroids. A guy i grew up with was in the Phillies organization in the early-mid 80's and he knew players were taking steroids then. And you know thers some players that are in the HOF who used.
Like i said, a argument can made for every era. It's baseball !! I HATE A-Rod, even before steroids, but the guy is a HOF. Just like Bonds, Clemens, etc.etc.
Well said.
My argument to folks about amphetamines/ greenies, is the same as yours, there was an edge!
Bonds was the best pure hitter I've ever seen. He put fear in every pitcher and manager he faced. He belongs in the hall...
Klausen did a silk screen poster commemorating Ellis' no-no on acid. I bought it. I don't have it up on a wall yet, but am looking forward to framing it one day.
we all know what's up....Bonds is alleged, too. right now, I figure they have already put in at least 4-5 steroid guys.
Rob, I'm with you. The only actual evidence Bonds used was the failed sample test that Big Papi and a decent portion of MLB failed. Baseball told the players the test wouldn't be used against them which should include the HOF. Bonds was eventually acquitted of the only charge from his trial he was convicted of. Mind you that charge was for obstruction for not fully answering a question about his trainer and other players, nothing to do with him. There is technically no more evidence against him than any of the other guys suspected from that era other than a book written with illegally obtained court documents. I hate when baseball says he was a roid user but other guys like Piazza are suspected. We all know he did them. I am not denying that but he is still technically a suspected user when it comes to MLB and the HOF.
That sample test with the leaked names are also alleged. Leaked by a media member/outlet. NO ONE knows for sure who is on that list. So, to me anyway, is not actual evidence. I'm not gonna believe some person who says they have a "source" that says so-and-so was on that list. Not enough proof for me.
You can almost make a argument over every era of baseball for a player not to be in the HOF.
Pitchers like Cy Young & Old Hoss Radbourn , who pitched in the late 1800's, could pitch spit-balls, scuff the ball, and whatever else they could do with the ball and only played against white Americans. Old Hoss won 59 games one year and completed 73!! Cy Young won over 500 games!>You really think they could've done that now? Or even in the 20's-70's? Of course not, but ther in the HOF.
Babe Ruth, Ty Cobb, Lou Gehrig, etc, and also only played against white Americans(yeah i know, that wasn't ther fault). Do they put up the stats that they did if they played against the best? Sucks, because we would never know how good they really were. And, ther in the HOF.
Players in the 40's, 50's, 60's, 70's, 80's and probably up until recently used "greenies"/speed, and like Rob said, Adderal. I think Mays, Mantle & Arron said they did greenies, so do they put up the stats they did without using? Who knows, but ther in the HOF.
Do we know what players loaded ther bats, by corking, or sand-papering ther bats and pitchers that threw spitters/scuffed/vasoline balls? We don't of course. And trust me, some of those players are in the HOF. And, not just Gaylord Perry.
I actually think that a few players took some steroids as early as the 70's. I was in HS in the late 70's and we, my friends, knew about steroids. A guy i grew up with was in the Phillies organization in the early-mid 80's and he knew players were taking steroids then. And you know thers some players that are in the HOF who used.
Like i said, a argument can made for every era. It's baseball !! I HATE A-Rod, even before steroids, but the guy is a HOF. Just like Bonds, Clemens, etc.etc.
As an Angels fan I'd love to see Vlad in soon but I honestly think Garrett Anderson should get in first.
If I had known then what I know now...
Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
VIC 07
EV LA1 08
Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
Columbus 10
EV LA 11
Vancouver 11
Missoula 12
Portland 13, Spokane 13
St. Paul 14, Denver 14
“You just felt mentally invincible,” Huff said. “Think of Adderall like this: it’s a PED. You’ve got steroids, right? Everybody thinks steroids are the biggest PED going. I don’t believe that. Because what’s the biggest thing in baseball you need in order to be successful? Your mind, right?
“Steroids aren’t going to make your mind any stronger. But these Adderall things? My focus was laser sharp, the air was clean, it was crisp, every fan was like in 3-D. I mean everything around me … the ball looked bigger. Oh, I felt amazing!
If I had known then what I know now...
Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
VIC 07
EV LA1 08
Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
Columbus 10
EV LA 11
Vancouver 11
Missoula 12
Portland 13, Spokane 13
St. Paul 14, Denver 14
we all know what's up....Bonds is alleged, too. right now, I figure they have already put in at least 4-5 steroid guys.
Rob, I'm with you. The only actual evidence Bonds used was the failed sample test that Big Papi and a decent portion of MLB failed. Baseball told the players the test wouldn't be used against them which should include the HOF. Bonds was eventually acquitted of the only charge from his trial he was convicted of. Mind you that charge was for obstruction for not fully answering a question about his trainer and other players, nothing to do with him. There is technically no more evidence against him than any of the other guys suspected from that era other than a book written with illegally obtained court documents. I hate when baseball says he was a roid user but other guys like Piazza are suspected. We all know he did them. I am not denying that but he is still technically a suspected user when it comes to MLB and the HOF.
how about his giant head? look at his body from the World Series with the Pirates to his body when with the Giants. He belongs in the hall but if you don't think he was doing PEDs pass that bong you must be hitting on a regular basis.
we all know what's up....Bonds is alleged, too. right now, I figure they have already put in at least 4-5 steroid guys.
Rob, I'm with you. The only actual evidence Bonds used was the failed sample test that Big Papi and a decent portion of MLB failed. Baseball told the players the test wouldn't be used against them which should include the HOF. Bonds was eventually acquitted of the only charge from his trial he was convicted of. Mind you that charge was for obstruction for not fully answering a question about his trainer and other players, nothing to do with him. There is technically no more evidence against him than any of the other guys suspected from that era other than a book written with illegally obtained court documents. I hate when baseball says he was a roid user but other guys like Piazza are suspected. We all know he did them. I am not denying that but he is still technically a suspected user when it comes to MLB and the HOF.
how about his giant head? look at his body from the World Series with the Pirates to his body when with the Giants. He belongs in the hall but if you don't think he was doing PEDs pass that bong you must be hitting on a regular basis.
Look at Jeters melon. His head swelled up too.
I get a kick out of the "head" argument. My head has grown since my 20's too.
we all know what's up....Bonds is alleged, too. right now, I figure they have already put in at least 4-5 steroid guys.
Rob, I'm with you. The only actual evidence Bonds used was the failed sample test that Big Papi and a decent portion of MLB failed. Baseball told the players the test wouldn't be used against them which should include the HOF. Bonds was eventually acquitted of the only charge from his trial he was convicted of. Mind you that charge was for obstruction for not fully answering a question about his trainer and other players, nothing to do with him. There is technically no more evidence against him than any of the other guys suspected from that era other than a book written with illegally obtained court documents. I hate when baseball says he was a roid user but other guys like Piazza are suspected. We all know he did them. I am not denying that but he is still technically a suspected user when it comes to MLB and the HOF.
how about his giant head? look at his body from the World Series with the Pirates to his body when with the Giants. He belongs in the hall but if you don't think he was doing PEDs pass that bong you must be hitting on a regular basis.
You will notice the second to last sentence in my post was that we all know Barry used them. I have zero doubt he did. A court of law couldn't prove he used them despite as Rob mentioned 50 million spent to do it. Therefor as far as baseball is concerned he is a suspected user. Pudge was mentioned in a book as a steroid user yet he was first ballot. That book has also been proven to be pretty accurate. Baseball should keep them all out (which means zero players from the steroid era get in) or base their candidacy the same as everyone before them. Based on what they did on the field. Barry, Clemens and even Schilling are being held to a higher standard than everyone else before them which needs to stop. It is a museum of the greatest players ever and that is all.
Tom Brady & Donald Trump, BFF's Fuckus rules all Rob Seattle
Comments
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Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
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Missoula 12
Portland 13, Spokane 13
St. Paul 14, Denver 14
I believe, without googling, there are 1000 runs and 2000 hits that separate them also.
So I can say Tim Wakefield has more wins than Koufax and he should be in the HOF too.
So we should see a lot more really good players get in, not great players.
I agree with Larkin being a stretch. I also agree that if you were one of the voters that never voted for Griffey... you suck at doing things.
Raines was a really solid player for awhile, but I don't think he belongs. He was never the best anything in his entire career.
Pudge had solidified his spot with his defense long before 2005.
Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
VIC 07
EV LA1 08
Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
Columbus 10
EV LA 11
Vancouver 11
Missoula 12
Portland 13, Spokane 13
St. Paul 14, Denver 14
Fuckus rules all
Rob
Seattle
You can almost make a argument over every era of baseball for a player not to be in the HOF.
Pitchers like Cy Young & Old Hoss Radbourn , who pitched in the late 1800's, could pitch spit-balls, scuff the ball, and whatever else they could do with the ball and only played against white Americans. Old Hoss won 59 games one year and completed 73!! Cy Young won over 500 games!>You really think they could've done that now? Or even in the 20's-70's? Of course not, but ther in the HOF.
Babe Ruth, Ty Cobb, Lou Gehrig, etc, and also only played against white Americans(yeah i know, that wasn't ther fault). Do they put up the stats that they did if they played against the best? Sucks, because we would never know how good they really were. And, ther in the HOF.
Players in the 40's, 50's, 60's, 70's, 80's and probably up until recently used "greenies"/speed, and like Rob said, Adderal. I think Mays, Mantle & Arron said they did greenies, so do they put up the stats they did without using? Who knows, but ther in the HOF.
Do we know what players loaded ther bats, by corking, or sand-papering ther bats and pitchers that threw spitters/scuffed/vasoline balls? We don't of course. And trust me, some of those players are in the HOF. And, not just Gaylord Perry.
I actually think that a few players took some steroids as early as the 70's. I was in HS in the late 70's and we, my friends, knew about steroids. A guy i grew up with was in the Phillies organization in the early-mid 80's and he knew players were taking steroids then. And you know thers some players that are in the HOF who used.
Like i said, a argument can made for every era. It's baseball !! I HATE A-Rod, even before steroids, but the guy is a HOF. Just like Bonds, Clemens, etc.etc.
Don't forget some pitchers even pitched on acid.
My argument to folks about amphetamines/ greenies, is the same as yours, there was an edge!
Bonds was the best pure hitter I've ever seen. He put fear in every pitcher and manager he faced. He belongs in the hall...
He was a GREAT Angels player, along with Erstad but not a HOF!!!
Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
VIC 07
EV LA1 08
Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
Columbus 10
EV LA 11
Vancouver 11
Missoula 12
Portland 13, Spokane 13
St. Paul 14, Denver 14
“Steroids aren’t going to make your mind any stronger. But these Adderall things? My focus was laser sharp, the air was clean, it was crisp, every fan was like in 3-D. I mean everything around me … the ball looked bigger. Oh, I felt amazing!
Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
VIC 07
EV LA1 08
Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
Columbus 10
EV LA 11
Vancouver 11
Missoula 12
Portland 13, Spokane 13
St. Paul 14, Denver 14
I get a kick out of the "head" argument. My head has grown since my 20's too.
Fuckus rules all
Rob
Seattle
One of my buddies even grew a ridge on his forehead. We stand under it when it's too hot.