New Ticket Lottery system thoughts

Nami · January 2012

All I know with this new system I hope to see them in either Hamilton or Toronto- either show BUT I want at least go to one show and not getting shut out.

That would suck

High Fidelity 2000 · January 2012

Zod wrote:

IE most everyone renews there memberships, and you never really gain senority.

So say people that joined in 1992, would have enjoyed the best tickets (and having tickets) from the 2000 tour on (at 8 years of membership), but anyone who joined in 2000 probably still gets pretty mediocre tickets (and its 12 years on from that date now).

If everything was based on senority, I don't think the 10c would attract new members. Which I don't think is good. The people that signed up in the early 90's have been loyal, but I don't think it's a lifetime entitlement?

It's not a lifetime entitlement, but you do have to continue to renew and pay every year, so I think some benefit should come with that. And I know it SEEMS like most everyone renews their memberships, but that's not entirely true. I have friends who were members since '95 who finally decided to let their membership pass on the last few years (Pearl Jam never plays where we live anyway), and I also have friends who just joined in the last 2-3 years. Ten Club definitely attracts new members, still. Generally ANY ten club ticket (not counting EV solo shows) is going to be better than any public on sale ticket (at least here in the states with the reserveds-- I really don't get why people get crazy about Europe shows with ten club tix, when it's general anyway?).

I don't think this will be the system they use for the future, but if they do, they should stagger it out a bit, like DMB does (I think? or used to?)... it's gonna be to hard to put in for a bunch of shows you MIGHT or might not get, and then what if you DO get all of them but didn't want all of them, just wanted some as a backup in case you didn't score MSG tickets or whatever....

pandora · January 2012

Maybe I am in twilight zone but is this not the way
I bought Eddie tickets for Atl solo show in '09?

Said I wanted both .. email told me I got 2nd night only
and then I was lucky enough to score TM for the first night

perhaps I am remembering wrong

any who seems good by me :thumbup:

Pearl Jam! Please play the South 2012!

boyo79 · January 2012

shep wrote:

lukin2006 wrote:

Why not just contract out ticketmaster for 10 c sales?

Because this is a band called Pearl Jam that got in a big fight with ticketmaster in the 1990's...

Isn't it time people got over this?

EdsonNascimento · January 2012

boyo79 wrote:

shep wrote:

lukin2006 wrote:

Why not just contract out ticketmaster for 10 c sales?

Because this is a band called Pearl Jam that got in a big fight with ticketmaster in the 1990's...

Isn't it time people got over this?

PJ already did. Didn't EV use TM for a 2nd chance 10C ticket sale? Didn't PJ resort to them for Canada?

So, it appears they don't really have an issue using them when they need to. Perhaps, at this point, TM should tell PJ - no can do!

Haywood Yablomee · January 2012

gndcd402 wrote:

Jeff side wrote:

Why should someone whose been a member for 2 years have the same chance as the person whose been a member for 19 years? They shouldn't!

Why not? Why are you more entitled to tickets than somebody else? You already have seniority (which is a whole other topic, don't get me started). Why does a kid who is 16 who just discovered the band and who pays the same membership amount as you not deserve to have the same chance at a ticket as some elitist like you?

Because Pearl jam is obviously a business now... That's how businesses treat their loyal and long standing customers/members. I have an American Express card that I've had for 3 years and I use it here and there, I'm a "member". Do you think they treat me the same way as say a guy who's been a member since the 60's and spends $100,000 a year? No, and they shouldn't. This can be said about most good and successfull businesses. Again, Pearl Jam is a BUSINESS. You always treat your loyal and long standing customers/clients better. FACT OF LIFE.

EdsonNascimento · January 2012

Jeff side wrote:

Because Pearl jam is obviously a business now... That's how businesses treat their loyal and long standing customers/members. I have an American Express card that I've had for 3 years and I use it here and there, I'm a "member". Do you think they treat me the same way as say a guy who's been a member since the 60's and spends $100,000 a year? No, and they shouldn't. This can be said about most good and successfull businesses. Again, Pearl Jam is a BUSINESS. You always treat your loyal and long standing customers/clients better. FACT OF LIFE.

But, they would treat you BETTER if you spent a million a year for the 3 years you were a member. So, your analogy doesn't work.

Even if you consider PJ a business, not all businesses are the same.

Cable gives you free channels for 6 months to new customers if you switch now, but does not give those same free channels to existing customers. So, let's turn this on it's head and give newer members the pleasure of the front row and work our way back. This way, the business will attract new members (attrition of old members duly noted and factored into the business model).

If I wanted to be totally selfish, I'd want PJ just to go to the tier pricing and price the crap out of the front rows. That way, I wouldn't have to worry about any lottery.

Zod · January 2012

EdsonNascimento wrote:

PJ already did. Didn't EV use TM for a 2nd chance 10C ticket sale? Didn't PJ resort to them for Canada?

So, it appears they don't really have an issue using them when they need to. Perhaps, at this point, TM should tell PJ - no can do!

Yah when the online site crashed, 10c used TM for the Canada Tour. It turned out to be pretty awesome.

Basically they gave everyone a unique code to use on the TM website. It entitled you to a pair of tickets at each show. You basically got an order confirmation indicating they were GA tickets, but this was just their way of dealing with the 10c allocating them afterwards. It worked really really well. 10c matched the order info to their 10c member info (to make sure people weren't giving their codes away). I'm really not sure how much extra work that would of entailed on there end.

I thought this method was really really good. It should work for most North American shows as TM has a large presense in NA. Probably not so much in other countries where TM isn't as big.

RedMosquito22 · January 2012

Ticketmaster sucks. The last thing I want is them having any part of our ticket buying process. Yippee, it worked for a few Canadian dates.

gndcd402 · January 2012

Jeff side wrote:

gndcd402 wrote:

Jeff side wrote:

Why should someone whose been a member for 2 years have the same chance as the person whose been a member for 19 years? They shouldn't!

Why not? Why are you more entitled to tickets than somebody else? You already have seniority (which is a whole other topic, don't get me started). Why does a kid who is 16 who just discovered the band and who pays the same membership amount as you not deserve to have the same chance at a ticket as some elitist like you?

Because Pearl jam is obviously a business now... That's how businesses treat their loyal and long standing customers/members. I have an American Express card that I've had for 3 years and I use it here and there, I'm a "member". Do you think they treat me the same way as say a guy who's been a member since the 60's and spends $100,000 a year? No, and they shouldn't. This can be said about most good and successfull businesses. Again, Pearl Jam is a BUSINESS. You always treat your loyal and long standing customers/clients better. FACT OF LIFE.

You ARE rewarded with seniority! Dude you crack me up

Haywood Yablomee · January 2012

EdsonNascimento wrote:

Jeff side wrote:

Because Pearl jam is obviously a business now... That's how businesses treat their loyal and long standing customers/members. I have an American Express card that I've had for 3 years and I use it here and there, I'm a "member". Do you think they treat me the same way as say a guy who's been a member since the 60's and spends $100,000 a year? No, and they shouldn't. This can be said about most good and successfull businesses. Again, Pearl Jam is a BUSINESS. You always treat your loyal and long standing customers/clients better. FACT OF LIFE.

But, they would treat you BETTER if you spent a million a year for the 3 years you were a member. So, your analogy doesn't work.

Even if you consider PJ a business, not all businesses are the same.

Cable gives you free channels for 6 months to new customers if you switch now, but does not give those same free channels to existing customers. So, let's turn this on it's head and give newer members the pleasure of the front row and work our way back. This way, the business will attract new members (attrition of old members duly noted and factored into the business model).

If I wanted to be totally selfish, I'd want PJ just to go to the tier pricing and price the crap out of the front rows. That way, I wouldn't have to worry about any lottery.

I'd be happy with that... Probably not too far off of that actually happening

benjs · January 2012

Jeff side wrote:

Glad I've been paying membership dues for 19 years now to get added to a "lottery" with all the newbies and scalpers. Way to help out the scalpers that have 10 memberships each!! GREAT JOB GUYS!!!

I'm 22 and am no less of a Pearl Jam fan than someone who discovered them at their conception. Since I discovered them at fifteen I have listened to every song off every album countless times, seen them 13 times live, and think the lottery is a great way to show appreciation for young fans like myself. To call me a newbie is wrong, and to say that you should always be entitled to better seats than me because you were born earlier is an elitist opinion I believe to be false.

RedMosquito22 · January 2012

The tickets for future tours will not be done with this lottery system. I think it's hilarious that people think that it will.

dimitrispearljam · January 2012

Jeff side wrote:

bootlegger10 wrote:

Jeff side wrote:

against trying this system.
I actually decided to cut my trip short cause of it.
I was gonna do Amsterdam through the end of the tour.
Now, I'm just doing the 2 Amsterdam shows. Mainly for Amsterdam...
I feel that after 19 years of paying membership dues that I shouldn't and won't be thrown into a lottery for a regular show.
How's that for selfish??

You seriously based your decision on following Pearl Jam around Europe on the basis of whether you got Ten Club tickets? I don't think that is selfish, I just find it very odd. I view this trip as a European vacation with some Pearl Jam shows sprinkled in. My seat location is the last priority in deciding on a trip to Europe.

Also, it is a lottery amongst Ten Club members that want to go to the show. There are always going to be fan club members left out and having to go with public sale tickets. This is just another way of doing a fan club presale (and the same number of fan clubbers will get tickets and the same number of fan club members won't get them). It isn't like you are now thrown back to Ticketmaster or something.

Actually, I've been boycotting seeing them live since the 2008 tour. For many reasons...
These were gonna be my first shows seeing them in 4 years. (I've seen them in triple digits)
My main reason to see them again was mostly to hang out with my friends in Amsterdam.
Somehow that turned into me planning on going to more shows, but then I realized why I stopped going in the first place.

And to Dimitris....
If I was 15 years late to the party like yourself, I'd probably have the same view....
Also, I pay $40 and my money is a different color than yours and a different value.

party no party..this year is only one party...the current members can go all and all get the same invitation...
now lets party..its 2012..

Zod · January 2012

High Fidelity 2000 wrote:

It's not a lifetime entitlement, but you do have to continue to renew and pay every year, so I think some benefit should come with that. And I know it SEEMS like most everyone renews their memberships, but that's not entirely true. I have friends who were members since '95 who finally decided to let their membership pass on the last few years (Pearl Jam never plays where we live anyway), and I also have friends who just joined in the last 2-3 years. Ten Club definitely attracts new members, still. Generally ANY ten club ticket (not counting EV solo shows) is going to be better than any public on sale ticket (at least here in the states with the reserveds-- I really don't get why people get crazy about Europe shows with ten club tix, when it's general anyway?).

It sort of is lifetime entitlement (as long as you pay your fees). I didn't say there was no attrition, I just said that attrition rates were low. There isn't really alot of movement in terms of seats/senority for members, especially ones who signed up before 2000. Which means the earliest members of the fan club will experience benefits (super awesome seats), that other members will never recieve, because no matter how long they are in the club, they'll never be in it the longest. My example would be the first tour with senority (binaural). So at the point members who had 8 years senority got seats in the first few rows. There's no way members with 8-9 years senority on the backspacer tour would get that. Not that many people let their memberships lapse, people are pretty much stuck where they are in terms of senority. It's fairly static (except for new members because their tickets are kind of low quality). So if you started to allocate a limited supply of tickets on senority too (and not lottery). New members will never have access to tickets because they'll never be able to gain senority. I hope that makes sense? I think I have enough senority I'd be better off with them allocating on senority, but I'd feel bad for the newbz.

JimmyV · January 2012

benjs wrote:

Jeff side wrote:

Glad I've been paying membership dues for 19 years now to get added to a "lottery" with all the newbies and scalpers. Way to help out the scalpers that have 10 memberships each!! GREAT JOB GUYS!!!

I'm 22 and am no less of a Pearl Jam fan than someone who discovered them at their conception. Since I discovered them at fifteen I have listened to every song off every album countless times, seen them 13 times live, and think the lottery is a great way to show appreciation for young fans like myself. To call me a newbie is wrong, and to say that you should always be entitled to better seats than me because you were born earlier is an elitist opinion I believe to be false.

Well said, benjs. Well said.

Haywood Yablomee · January 2012

*

shep · January 2012

boyo79 wrote:

shep wrote:

lukin2006 wrote:

Why not just contract out ticketmaster for 10 c sales?

Because this is a band called Pearl Jam that got in a big fight with ticketmaster in the 1990's...

Isn't it time people got over this?

That's exactly my point.... people need to get over this, Pearl Jam included.

The TM presale's went very well for the Canadian dates, possibly the best method employed so far - yet most people didn't stop to think about it twice, and most people aren't pushing for it.

The reason people will have an issue with this is that when there is 2 high demand shows (say 2 show's in Philly on back to back nights) and the presale for both starts at the same time, ticketmaster's server can handle the traffic, and by the time you've bought your tickets for Night 1, Night 2 is all sold out as well... thus eliminating the possibility of getting multiple 10C tickets for all your shows if they drop at the same time (for big markets anyway).... That's why a TM pre-sale won't be supported by most traveling fans.

I mean let's be realistic - 10C ticket prices have not been any different than TM prices (including taxes and sur charges) for the last few tours. In fact for the Toronto 09 date at the ampitheater, 2 tickets through ticketmaster (including fees and taxes) were actually cheaper than what 10C charged me (only like 3 or 4 dollars mind you, but you get my point).

JimmyV · January 2012

If anyone is feeling ambitious they can check the Kelly Curtis thread but I am pretty sure he said that both he and the band have moved on from the TM fight and have no problem working with them in the future.

The band fought the good fight in the nineties and I give them all the credit in the world. But I also give them credit for being able to move on as times change.

MG79478 · January 2012

gndcd402 wrote:

EdsonNascimento wrote:

First, your analogy is silly. This isn't a job. And, it certainly not brain surgery (doctor - get it?). I'm all for free market capitalism. But, this is not an "achievement" or participation trophy. This is to see who gets to see a concert. Pretty low on the importance scale of life and certainly not a competition (though you wouldn't know that from around here). If the system didn't keep failing, I could understand leaving it, as it is easier for 10C, easier for us, etc. But, it's broken. Looking for a different, more equitable system in order for folks to see a concert seems like the right thing to do.

Second - it's much more difficult to scalp 10C tickets than open Ticketmaster sales. I'm sure it can be done - pick up early, then sell, etc. That seems like a bit more work just to make a few bucks when those same scalpers have the Ticketmaster system down and can probably get as many tickets as they want there.

Finally - how does hitting F5 prove your fandom? And who cares? If a "lesser" fan than me (not even sure how to quantify that) gets to go to a show and not me - good for them. Missing out on a concert is disappointing, but I'm no more entitled to see a concert than anyone else. (And if you ARE a true fan, there's always a way - perhaps that's how best to determine fandom).

I still have not read a single "I'm against trying this new system" post that is anything more than a rationalization. It's ok to be selfish. It's our right to do so. But, don't try to color it.

^^^ this.

I apologize that I have a life and a full-time job which prevents me from sitting at my office computer wasting company time for hours/days trying to get tickets. Does that make me less of a fan? If so, you might want to try typing my screenname into YouTube and see how little a fan I am...

It’s a perfectly relevant analogy. Someone who put in effort because they want to achieve something should be rewarded for their effort. Whether that is being rewarded with a doctor’s job because you went to medical school, or tickets because you put in time learning the ticket system, and hitting F5.

You also missed the point about fans hitting F5. It was about fans versus scalpers. A scalper wouldn’t sit and hit F5 for hours trying to make a few bucks.

I think wanting the new system is selfish. I put in effort learning the ins and out of the ticket system. I put in time buying tickets, or I arrange someone to do it for me. It’s odd that you think that I’m selfish for wanting to work hard to achieve a goal. I think you are selfish for wanting an equal share of the pie without putting in any effort. Plus it's almost fun, the thrill of finally scoring tickets!

As for having a job, there is probably not a person on this board who has a job as hectic as mine. I also have a family, and hobbies. I can still find time to get tickets. It’s all about planning and priorities. It’s not that hard to hit F5 while doing something else at work. If I am out of town, I arrange for someone else to do it for me. I’ve never missed out on 10c tickets, but only because of the effort I put in to it. It’s OK that you want to be selfish and try and get something for nothing, it’s your prerogative. But don’t try to make it appear otherwise.

New Ticket Lottery system thoughts

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