so if we went back in time & caught & put on trial, adolph hittler, his top & lower ss officers including dr. josef mengele; it would be wrong to seek the death penalty for these vile monsters?
so if we went back in time & caught & put on trial, adolph hittler, his top & lower ss officers including dr. josef mengele; it would be wrong to seek the death penalty for these vile monsters?
so if we went back in time & caught & put on trial, adolph hittler, his top & lower ss officers including dr. josef mengele; it would be wrong to seek the death penalty for these vile monsters?
Yes....because if we kill, we are just like them.
Lock them up...don't let them out. Solved...
no we are not just like them. we would be destroying demonic evil. this is good. josef mengele deserved medical torture/experiments on himself as he done on others. as a man of half jew blood running through my veins, i fully would support offing all nazis & i'll go further... any modern day bullshit nazis who harm others in hate crimes... they deserve no oxygen.
someone somewhere has to support capital punishment for these terrible & disgusting maniacs. i find it extremely bizarre to allow hitler & his gang to breathe freely
that movie where brad pitt & his crew hunted nazis... fantastic flick. pitt's character throughly enjoyed hunting nazis. i laughed at pitt's character, he was a good dude
so if we went back in time & caught & put on trial, adolph hittler, his top & lower ss officers including dr. josef mengele; it would be wrong to seek the death penalty for these vile monsters?
Yes....because if we kill, we are just like them.
Lock them up...don't let them out. Solved...
The we would end up being just like them argument is hardly valid.
For us to be just like them... that would mean we would be preying on innocents and doing unspeakable and obscene things to them.
Your line is locked up forever. Some others, such as the moron who married David Shearing after he murdered a family of six in brutal fashion, don't want them locked up at all. Others, want a more definitive method of justice exercised that clearly reflects our disdain for the crime and for the person who committed the crime.
No opportunities to go on hunger strikes because you don't like shepherd's pie. No opportunities to connect with people and marry them. No opportunities to read and write and listen to the new music that is being released. The victims cannot. Why should the 'segment' be accepting of such mild penalties for rape and murder?
No. You never said it as bluntly as I did, but you did say it.
I rarely say this in life, but you are 100% wrong if you attribute those comments to me. I did not say those things.
Well Mr. Right... I do recall you saying this: We should rise above the scumbag murderers and rapists. We are better than them. Lock em up throw away the key. Give em just enough to keep them sane to limit costs.
So... what exactly does such a program look like? Keeping someone sane means offering those 'extras' that we currently do. Sounds to me like you haven't fully thought this one out.
Edit: Callen said it. You supported Callen. I confused you two.
from what i understand on many occasions & from state to state as laws & time in prisons vary; a child molester & a rapist often times do less time in prison than a simple ass marijuana dealer. this is truly bizarre & throughly out of order & out of control.
this is not the death penalty... but it sure as shit should be especially after a number of times some nasty bastard has harmed a child or a rapist keeps on keeping on. i am shocked i just stated they may deserve another chance at life.
i do enjoy thinking to myself (or writing my thoughts here) all pedophiles dig their hole & stay in it. there is no excuse for sexually attacking children, women or men.
how is it a guy dealing green weed gets more time than a pedophile? this is one scrabbled up country we u.s. citizens live in.
I think it's wrong to take comfort, pleasure, solace, healing, etc. from someone being killed - no matter who they are.
Why don't you message Mr. Petit and tell him you think he is wrong to seek comfort in seeing the scum that killed his family facing the DP? He was a former opponent of the DP, but his perspective changed that horrible day. Perhaps he might be able to share with you why his perspective has changed.
the agony, torture, rape & murders caused to dr. petit's family is one of the most vile & disgusting crimes i have ever heard about. those two demons deserve death ASAP
CLEVELAND A man condemned to death for fatally stabbing a neighbor during a Cleveland burglary was found hanged in his cell Sunday just days before his Wednesday execution.
Billy Slagle
This undated file photo provided by the Ohio Department of Rehabilitation and Correction shows Billy Slagle.
/ File,AP Photo/Ohio Department of Rehabilitation
Billy Slagle, 44, was found at about 5 a.m. at the Chillicothe Correctional Institution south of Columbus and was declared dead within the hour, prison spokeswoman JoEllen Smith said.
"He was in his cell alone. No other inmates suspected to be involved," Smith said in an email. "It does appear to be a suicide."
Under regular prison policy, he was scheduled to be placed under pre-execution watch Sunday morning but "was not yet placed under constant watch," Smith said.
Police say in the wee hours of the morning, then-18-year-old Billy Slagle broke into his neighbor Mari Anne Pope's home and stabbed her 17 times with a pair scissors, reports CBS affiliate WOIO in Cleveland. Turns out two children she was watching that night heard the attack. They told detectives they heard Pope start praying and then heard her blood curdling screams.
In a rare move, the prosecutor in Cleveland asked the Ohio Parole Board to spare Slagle. Cuyahoga County Prosecutor Tim McGinty said jurors today, with the option of life without parole, would be unlikely to sentence Slagle to death.
The parole board and Gov. John Kasich both rejected mercy for Slagle.
Last week, Slagle's attorney argued that a jury never got the chance to hear the full details of his troubled childhood.
The attorneys, arguing for a new trial and to delay his execution, said that information met requirements for asking for a new trial, which normally must happen within four months of a conviction.
Slagle was "unavoidably prevented" from filing his request because his original attorneys didn't develop and present the evidence, the filing said.
McGinty and Slagle's attorneys had cited his age — at 18(*), he was barely old enough for execution in Ohio — and his history of alcohol and drug addiction.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
I think it's wrong to take comfort, pleasure, solace, healing, etc. from someone being killed - no matter who they are.
Why don't you message Mr. Petit and tell him you think he is wrong to seek comfort in seeing the scum that killed his family facing the DP? He was a former opponent of the DP, but his perspective changed that horrible day. Perhaps he might be able to share with you why his perspective has changed.
I'm not going out of my way to harass or antagonize him, but I do think that he's wrong. If he and I happened to end up in a discussion about it somewhere or someday, I would tell him my opinion.
The only people we should try to get even with...
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
Petit's parents were also anti-DP until this incident. I really feel like most anti-DP people would change their tune if confronted with this type of mental anguish.
I can appreciate the anti-DP view....I just don't hold that view.
Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago 2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy 2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE) 2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston 2020: Oakland, Oakland:2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana 2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville 2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana
so if we went back in time & caught & put on trial, adolph hittler, his top & lower ss officers including dr. josef mengele; it would be wrong to seek the death penalty for these vile monsters?
Yes....because if we kill, we are just like them.
Lock them up...don't let them out. Solved...
As long as you love spending your tax dollars on the cable TV, healthcare, education, and rehabilitation...
I see nothing wrong. I rather my taxes go to public education?
I must be crazy. OJ Simpson is getting overweight in prison...
I wish that was my only worry.
I need to shell out more taxes for prison gyms?!!!
I think it's wrong to take comfort, pleasure, solace, healing, etc. from someone being killed - no matter who they are.
Why don't you message Mr. Petit and tell him you think he is wrong to seek comfort in seeing the scum that killed his family facing the DP? He was a former opponent of the DP, but his perspective changed that horrible day. Perhaps he might be able to share with you why his perspective has changed.
There are also many former proponents of the death penalty, including family members of victims, prison guards, and executioners, who have since changed their minds about it, and are now staunchly opposed to it.
so if we went back in time & caught & put on trial, adolph hittler, his top & lower ss officers including dr. josef mengele; it would be wrong to seek the death penalty for these vile monsters?
Yes....because if we kill, we are just like them.
Lock them up...don't let them out. Solved...
As long as you love spending your tax dollars on the cable TV, healthcare, education, and rehabilitation...
I see nothing wrong. I rather my taxes go to public education?
I must be crazy. OJ Simpson is getting overweight in prison...
I wish that was my only worry.
I need to shell out more taxes for prison gyms?!!!
Who cares if kids can't read, if they are fat?!
Do you watch reality TV??
I don’t watch reality TV and I pay a sh*t load of taxes and likely more than most that use this as an argument...and I don’t mind paying my fair share so we as a society aren’t barbaric to sanction state sponsored executions. Let alone being content with a few innocents executed so that we feel better about killing a killer.
Wrong + Wrong not= Right
I think it's wrong to take comfort, pleasure, solace, healing, etc. from someone being killed - no matter who they are.
Why don't you message Mr. Petit and tell him you think he is wrong to seek comfort in seeing the scum that killed his family facing the DP? He was a former opponent of the DP, but his perspective changed that horrible day. Perhaps he might be able to share with you why his perspective has changed.
There are also many former proponents of the death penalty, including family members of victims, prison guards, and executioners, who have since changed their minds about it, and are now staunchly opposed to it.
Byrnzie...
Normally you always provide a refernce for your claims such as this one. Regardless, I'll take this point and can accept it to some degree.
I have advocated for the DP in the event of murders of the grotesque/obscene nature (kids, serial fashion, mass fashion, elements of torture, etc.). I would speculate that the family members of victims of these sorts of crimes are very much in the minority. I know every crime I referenced, the family members are outraged that their killer either never received death or are awaiting death to serve as justice for the depravity displayed towards their loved ones.
Guards and executioners are probably a mixed bag: for some they can't wait to pull the switch and for others they are hesitant depending on who they are dealing with. The Green Mile (great show by the way), would speak to the point I am trying to make.
http://www.mvfr.org/ MVFR is a community led by family members of murder victims and the executed that advocates for the repeal of the death penalty. 'California Crime Victims for Alternatives to the Death Penalty is a coalition of families, friends, and loved ones of murder victims who oppose the death penalty. The coalition supports families, friends, and loved ones in telling their stories and being heard. CCV educates the public about alternatives to the death penalty and provides information, resources, and support to families regardless of their views on the death penalty or whether the perpetrator has been apprehended.'
www.californiacrimevictims.org/about.html California Crime Victims for Alternatives to the Death Penalty 'California Crime Victims for Alternatives to the Death Penalty is a coalition of families, friends, and loved ones of murder victims who oppose the death penalty. The coalition supports families, friends, and loved ones in telling their stories and being heard. CCV educates the public about alternatives to the death penalty and provides information, resources, and support to families regardless of their views on the death penalty or whether the perpetrator has been apprehended.'
http://www.murdervictimsfamilies.org/ Murder Victims' Families for Human Rights 'Murder Victims’ Families for Human Rights is an international, non-governmental organization of family members of victims of criminal murder, terrorist killings, state executions, extrajudicial assassinations, and “disappearances” working to oppose the death penalty from a human rights perspective. Membership is open to all victims’ family members who oppose the death penalty in all cases. “Friend of MVFHR” membership is open to all those interested in joining our efforts.'
I read through three of them. Well, two of them- one was in Japanese.
The 'survivor' stories I read provided some insight as to the circumstances of the murders that took their loved ones. These cases didn't exactly qualify as the murders I would seek the death penalty for. They were singular in nature (not mass or serial), didn't involve bondage and torture, and each one I reviewed was that of a young adult- not a young child.
The arguments presented were not novel- I've heard them all before.
I have cited several cases where the parents of murdered victims have sought the DP for the murderers: Shearing, Olson, Rafferty, the Cheshire idiots, and Richard Allen Davis have family members wishing for their execution and for good reason.
They are not as forgiving as some of the religious types describing their experiences in the links you provided, but certainly not evil or simple for seeking what they see as justice.
Christian woman in Pakistan sentenced to death-for drinking from muslim well.
Where are the moderate muslim voices...cair?
Bob Beckel said it good today.
"Speak up or join the extremist".
Totally agree with that statement.
As do I.
Completely outrageous.
Here's a telling excerpt: Embarrassed by Bibi’s case but still refusing to release her because of angry protests by extremists, the Pakistan government has transferred her to a more remote prison, hoping the 42-year-old dies quietly behind bars, perhaps poisoned by another inmate. Already two government officials who have spoken out on her behalf have been murdered, including Minister for Minorities Shahbaz Bhatti, who was killed by the Taliban.
Sometimes you have to pick your fights. In this case... at least two people have and paid for their lives. Where is the 'outpouring' of support though? If it is true that the overwhelming majority of Muslims are peaceful people poorly characterized by the extremists and they are affected by things such as this... then maybe it's time to do something about it.
It's tough to defend such a faith in light of such incidents. One can't expect to be immune from some form of criticism when they permit such atrocities to occur with deafening silence.
Here's a telling excerpt: Embarrassed by Bibi’s case but still refusing to release her because of angry protests by extremists, the Pakistan government has transferred her to a more remote prison, hoping the 42-year-old dies quietly behind bars, perhaps poisoned by another inmate. Already two government officials who have spoken out on her behalf have been murdered, including Minister for Minorities Shahbaz Bhatti, who was killed by the Taliban.
Sometimes you have to pick your fights. In this case... at least two people have and paid for their lives. Where is the 'outpouring' of support though? If it is true that the overwhelming majority of Muslims are peaceful people poorly characterized by the extremists and they are affected by things such as this... then maybe it's time to do something about it.
It's tough to defend such a faith in light of such incidents. One can't expect to be immune from some form of criticism when they permit such atrocities to occur with deafening silence.
Here's a telling excerpt: Embarrassed by Bibi’s case but still refusing to release her because of angry protests by extremists, the Pakistan government has transferred her to a more remote prison, hoping the 42-year-old dies quietly behind bars, perhaps poisoned by another inmate. Already two government officials who have spoken out on her behalf have been murdered, including Minister for Minorities Shahbaz Bhatti, who was killed by the Taliban.
Sometimes you have to pick your fights. In this case... at least two people have and paid for their lives. Where is the 'outpouring' of support though? If it is true that the overwhelming majority of Muslims are peaceful people poorly characterized by the extremists and they are affected by things such as this... then maybe it's time to do something about it.
It's tough to defend such a faith in light of such incidents. One can't expect to be immune from some form of criticism when they permit such atrocities to occur with deafening silence.
dude, that last sentence is a damn slippery slope you're climbing.
Just recently, in America, Americans took to the streets in droves for opposing their country's war efforts overseas and whites stood with blacks to fight oppression in the south.
It's tough to defend such a faith in light of such incidents. One can't expect to be immune from some form of criticism when they permit such atrocities to occur with deafening silence.
Because murder only occurs in Muslim countries? :?
Capital punishment is murder – especially for the wrongfully accused
There's no way to calculate how many prisoners were executed for crimes they didn't commit. I met a man who almost was
Lindsey Bever
theguardian.com, Tuesday 27 August 2013
So far this year, 23 death row inmates have been executed in the US. One was killed by electrocution, the others by lethal injection. A 24th committed suicide. Among these prisoners, they served a total of 335 years as they were waiting to die. And there are 14 more Americans slated for execution by their government before the end of the year.
We're told to believe they were guilty – of murder. What if they weren't? In fact, what if they were the victims – of prejudice, racism, corruption?
In 1976, Shujaa Graham was one of them – wrongly sentenced to die and shipped to San Quentin prison in California.
Recently, the 62-year-old death row exoneree invited me into the sunroom in the back of his Takoma Park, Maryland, home. It's a space only slightly larger than the prison cell in which he spent more than a decade, but he said he feels oddly at home there. That's where he opened up about his own death sentence – one meant to be carried out in a gas chamber.
I visited Graham to film a short documentary about his childhood in the racially segregated South, his adolescence in gangs in South Central Los Angeles – and in juvenile detention – and, ultimately, his young adulthood on San Quentin's death row where he served three years until a jury exonerated him in the murder of white California prison guard Jerry Sanders. Graham said he still dwells on it 40 years later. But despite his troubled past – or perhaps in spite of it – he has maintained character and appreciation for his life.
I saw it almost immediately – when he shot me a wry smile, winked and gave his demand: "You're at PawPaw's house. Either make yourself at home or keep that camera in its bag."
I felt like family the rest of that afternoon, listening to his stories of political outrage. And in that moment, I thought about how unfair life would have been if this man's wrongful conviction hadn't been overturned and his life had ended there.
It's chilling to think how many innocents may have lost their lives at the hands of the US criminal justice system since 1976 – when capital punishment was reinstated. Worse, according to the Death Penalty Information Center, there's no way to calculate how many were executed for crimes they didn't commit since courts typically won't consider claims of innocence when a defendant is dead. But with more than 250 death row inmates exonerated with DNA evidence, it's impossible to not think about the others who fell through the cracks – especially when looking at a man who almost did.
In many ways, Graham's life mirrors America's civil rights movement. Graham grew up on a Southern plantation where his family worked as sharecroppers. In 1961, they moved to South Central Los Angeles to establish a better life and "that's where my trouble began", he said. As a teenager, Graham got caught up in gangs. He committed minor crimes. He spent much of his adolescence in juvenile institutions. And when he was 18, he went to Soledad Prison on a minor robbery charge.
Graham turned away from the gang life when he became influenced by the Black Panther Party in prison and he took a leadership position in the black prison movement, working for prisoners' rights. Because of his leadership, he said, he was framed in the 1973 murder of a prison guard while serving out his sentence at the Deul Vocational Institute in Stockton, California.
During Graham's second trial in 1976, he and his co-defendant, Eugene Allen, also an African-American, were charged with murder and sent to San Quentin's death house. It would take two more (all-white) trials and five more years before Graham would be freed, he said.
That was the story I expected to hear – one of a defunct criminal justice system, political corruption and racial bias. But ironically, Graham's story reveals his progressive attitudes against stereotypical 1970s America. Pacing back and forth in his sunroom, he clutched a picture of those who worked on his defense committee around the time of his third trial in 1979. Among his supporters was 30-year-old Phyllis Prentice – who stuck around.
Prentice, now 64, was a nurse in the county jail where Graham was being held while he awaited trial. "I thought she was a cop", he said, "because she was so nice to me – and white." But, on the heels of desegregation, Prentice, a political activist, and Graham, an African-American political prisoner, became friends. She quit her job and joined his defense committee. And when Graham was finally exonerated and released in 1981, they started a life together.
Now, their home is filled with photographs of their three children and four grandchildren – perhaps another testament to Graham's willingness to break social and political barriers.
Prentice is still a nurse – a palliative care nurse. Graham has a landscaping business. But listening to their story, it's clear their passion still lies in the political work they started back in the 1970s. They are both on the board of Witness to Innocence, an organization dedicated to empowering exonerated death row survivors like Graham, who is vice chair. Graham still travels and speaks out against issues of capital punishment, wrongful convictions and inhumane prison conditions, much like the ones he has lived through.
Graham's experience will forever be part of his history but, after I met him, I realized that his real story lies within the life he built because of – or maybe even in spite of – his past.
I sat in the sunroom staring at Graham through a camera lens. That's when he said something I'll never forget:
"I know why you're here. Perhaps if I'd never been on death row, you wouldn't be here today talking to me. That reminds me I should be looking at this as a great thing – and it is – to get the chance to pass on my experience and hope that you'll take it to another level. I promised the prisoners I would fight until the day I die."
Comments
"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
Lock them up...don't let them out. Solved...
No. You never said it as bluntly as I did, but you did say it.
someone somewhere has to support capital punishment for these terrible & disgusting maniacs. i find it extremely bizarre to allow hitler & his gang to breathe freely
that movie where brad pitt & his crew hunted nazis... fantastic flick. pitt's character throughly enjoyed hunting nazis. i laughed at pitt's character, he was a good dude
"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
The we would end up being just like them argument is hardly valid.
For us to be just like them... that would mean we would be preying on innocents and doing unspeakable and obscene things to them.
Your line is locked up forever. Some others, such as the moron who married David Shearing after he murdered a family of six in brutal fashion, don't want them locked up at all. Others, want a more definitive method of justice exercised that clearly reflects our disdain for the crime and for the person who committed the crime.
No opportunities to go on hunger strikes because you don't like shepherd's pie. No opportunities to connect with people and marry them. No opportunities to read and write and listen to the new music that is being released. The victims cannot. Why should the 'segment' be accepting of such mild penalties for rape and murder?
I rarely say this in life, but you are 100% wrong if you attribute those comments to me. I did not say those things.
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
Well Mr. Right... I do recall you saying this: We should rise above the scumbag murderers and rapists. We are better than them. Lock em up throw away the key. Give em just enough to keep them sane to limit costs.
So... what exactly does such a program look like? Keeping someone sane means offering those 'extras' that we currently do. Sounds to me like you haven't fully thought this one out.
Edit: Callen said it. You supported Callen. I confused you two.
this is not the death penalty... but it sure as shit should be especially after a number of times some nasty bastard has harmed a child or a rapist keeps on keeping on. i am shocked i just stated they may deserve another chance at life.
i do enjoy thinking to myself (or writing my thoughts here) all pedophiles dig their hole & stay in it. there is no excuse for sexually attacking children, women or men.
how is it a guy dealing green weed gets more time than a pedophile? this is one scrabbled up country we u.s. citizens live in.
"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
Why don't you message Mr. Petit and tell him you think he is wrong to seek comfort in seeing the scum that killed his family facing the DP? He was a former opponent of the DP, but his perspective changed that horrible day. Perhaps he might be able to share with you why his perspective has changed.
"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-575 ... nd-hanged/
CLEVELAND A man condemned to death for fatally stabbing a neighbor during a Cleveland burglary was found hanged in his cell Sunday just days before his Wednesday execution.
Billy Slagle
This undated file photo provided by the Ohio Department of Rehabilitation and Correction shows Billy Slagle.
/ File,AP Photo/Ohio Department of Rehabilitation
Billy Slagle, 44, was found at about 5 a.m. at the Chillicothe Correctional Institution south of Columbus and was declared dead within the hour, prison spokeswoman JoEllen Smith said.
"He was in his cell alone. No other inmates suspected to be involved," Smith said in an email. "It does appear to be a suicide."
Under regular prison policy, he was scheduled to be placed under pre-execution watch Sunday morning but "was not yet placed under constant watch," Smith said.
Police say in the wee hours of the morning, then-18-year-old Billy Slagle broke into his neighbor Mari Anne Pope's home and stabbed her 17 times with a pair scissors, reports CBS affiliate WOIO in Cleveland. Turns out two children she was watching that night heard the attack. They told detectives they heard Pope start praying and then heard her blood curdling screams.
In a rare move, the prosecutor in Cleveland asked the Ohio Parole Board to spare Slagle. Cuyahoga County Prosecutor Tim McGinty said jurors today, with the option of life without parole, would be unlikely to sentence Slagle to death.
The parole board and Gov. John Kasich both rejected mercy for Slagle.
Last week, Slagle's attorney argued that a jury never got the chance to hear the full details of his troubled childhood.
The attorneys, arguing for a new trial and to delay his execution, said that information met requirements for asking for a new trial, which normally must happen within four months of a conviction.
Slagle was "unavoidably prevented" from filing his request because his original attorneys didn't develop and present the evidence, the filing said.
McGinty and Slagle's attorneys had cited his age — at 18(*), he was barely old enough for execution in Ohio — and his history of alcohol and drug addiction.
edit (*) refers to at trial.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
I'm not going out of my way to harass or antagonize him, but I do think that he's wrong. If he and I happened to end up in a discussion about it somewhere or someday, I would tell him my opinion.
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
I can appreciate the anti-DP view....I just don't hold that view.
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana
I see nothing wrong. I rather my taxes go to public education?
I must be crazy. OJ Simpson is getting overweight in prison...
I wish that was my only worry.
I need to shell out more taxes for prison gyms?!!!
Who cares if kids can't read, if they are fat?!
Do you watch reality TV??
There are also many former proponents of the death penalty, including family members of victims, prison guards, and executioners, who have since changed their minds about it, and are now staunchly opposed to it.
Wrong + Wrong not= Right
Byrnzie...
Normally you always provide a refernce for your claims such as this one. Regardless, I'll take this point and can accept it to some degree.
I have advocated for the DP in the event of murders of the grotesque/obscene nature (kids, serial fashion, mass fashion, elements of torture, etc.). I would speculate that the family members of victims of these sorts of crimes are very much in the minority. I know every crime I referenced, the family members are outraged that their killer either never received death or are awaiting death to serve as justice for the depravity displayed towards their loved ones.
Guards and executioners are probably a mixed bag: for some they can't wait to pull the switch and for others they are hesitant depending on who they are dealing with. The Green Mile (great show by the way), would speak to the point I am trying to make.
https://www.aclunc.org/issues/criminal_ ... alty.shtml
Families of Murder Victims Speak Out Against the Death Penalty
http://www.mvfr.org/
MVFR is a community led by family members of murder victims and the executed that advocates for the repeal of the death penalty.
'California Crime Victims for Alternatives to the Death Penalty is a coalition of families, friends, and loved ones of murder victims who oppose the death penalty. The coalition supports families, friends, and loved ones in telling their stories and being heard. CCV educates the public about alternatives to the death penalty and provides information, resources, and support to families regardless of their views on the death penalty or whether the perpetrator has been apprehended.'
www.californiacrimevictims.org/about.html
California Crime Victims for Alternatives to the Death Penalty
'California Crime Victims for Alternatives to the Death Penalty is a coalition of families, friends, and loved ones of murder victims who oppose the death penalty. The coalition supports families, friends, and loved ones in telling their stories and being heard. CCV educates the public about alternatives to the death penalty and provides information, resources, and support to families regardless of their views on the death penalty or whether the perpetrator has been apprehended.'
http://www.murdervictimsfamilies.org/
Murder Victims' Families for Human Rights
'Murder Victims’ Families for Human Rights is an international, non-governmental organization of family members of victims of criminal murder, terrorist killings, state executions, extrajudicial assassinations, and “disappearances” working to oppose the death penalty from a human rights perspective. Membership is open to all victims’ family members who oppose the death penalty in all cases. “Friend of MVFHR” membership is open to all those interested in joining our efforts.'
http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/node/2037
Why two mothers back death penalty repeal
by Vicki Schieber and Carolyn Leming
Feb. 16, 2007
Thanks for links.
I read through three of them. Well, two of them- one was in Japanese.
The 'survivor' stories I read provided some insight as to the circumstances of the murders that took their loved ones. These cases didn't exactly qualify as the murders I would seek the death penalty for. They were singular in nature (not mass or serial), didn't involve bondage and torture, and each one I reviewed was that of a young adult- not a young child.
The arguments presented were not novel- I've heard them all before.
I have cited several cases where the parents of murdered victims have sought the DP for the murderers: Shearing, Olson, Rafferty, the Cheshire idiots, and Richard Allen Davis have family members wishing for their execution and for good reason.
They are not as forgiving as some of the religious types describing their experiences in the links you provided, but certainly not evil or simple for seeking what they see as justice.
I noticed that, but thought it might have just been my p.c fucking about, or being fucked with.
Obama
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
He's a thorn in my side.
Where are the moderate muslim voices...cair?
Bob Beckel said it good today.
"Speak up or join the extremist".
As do I.
Completely outrageous.
Here's a telling excerpt: Embarrassed by Bibi’s case but still refusing to release her because of angry protests by extremists, the Pakistan government has transferred her to a more remote prison, hoping the 42-year-old dies quietly behind bars, perhaps poisoned by another inmate. Already two government officials who have spoken out on her behalf have been murdered, including Minister for Minorities Shahbaz Bhatti, who was killed by the Taliban.
Sometimes you have to pick your fights. In this case... at least two people have and paid for their lives. Where is the 'outpouring' of support though? If it is true that the overwhelming majority of Muslims are peaceful people poorly characterized by the extremists and they are affected by things such as this... then maybe it's time to do something about it.
It's tough to defend such a faith in light of such incidents. One can't expect to be immune from some form of criticism when they permit such atrocities to occur with deafening silence.
Link:
http://www.nypost.com/p/news/opinion/op ... DzasfQxkKK
dude, that last sentence is a damn slippery slope you're climbing.
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
Just recently, in America, Americans took to the streets in droves for opposing their country's war efforts overseas and whites stood with blacks to fight oppression in the south.
You cannot sit idle when brutality is the norm.
Because murder only occurs in Muslim countries? :?
Capital punishment is murder – especially for the wrongfully accused
There's no way to calculate how many prisoners were executed for crimes they didn't commit. I met a man who almost was
Lindsey Bever
theguardian.com, Tuesday 27 August 2013
So far this year, 23 death row inmates have been executed in the US. One was killed by electrocution, the others by lethal injection. A 24th committed suicide. Among these prisoners, they served a total of 335 years as they were waiting to die. And there are 14 more Americans slated for execution by their government before the end of the year.
We're told to believe they were guilty – of murder. What if they weren't? In fact, what if they were the victims – of prejudice, racism, corruption?
In 1976, Shujaa Graham was one of them – wrongly sentenced to die and shipped to San Quentin prison in California.
Recently, the 62-year-old death row exoneree invited me into the sunroom in the back of his Takoma Park, Maryland, home. It's a space only slightly larger than the prison cell in which he spent more than a decade, but he said he feels oddly at home there. That's where he opened up about his own death sentence – one meant to be carried out in a gas chamber.
I visited Graham to film a short documentary about his childhood in the racially segregated South, his adolescence in gangs in South Central Los Angeles – and in juvenile detention – and, ultimately, his young adulthood on San Quentin's death row where he served three years until a jury exonerated him in the murder of white California prison guard Jerry Sanders. Graham said he still dwells on it 40 years later. But despite his troubled past – or perhaps in spite of it – he has maintained character and appreciation for his life.
I saw it almost immediately – when he shot me a wry smile, winked and gave his demand: "You're at PawPaw's house. Either make yourself at home or keep that camera in its bag."
I felt like family the rest of that afternoon, listening to his stories of political outrage. And in that moment, I thought about how unfair life would have been if this man's wrongful conviction hadn't been overturned and his life had ended there.
It's chilling to think how many innocents may have lost their lives at the hands of the US criminal justice system since 1976 – when capital punishment was reinstated. Worse, according to the Death Penalty Information Center, there's no way to calculate how many were executed for crimes they didn't commit since courts typically won't consider claims of innocence when a defendant is dead. But with more than 250 death row inmates exonerated with DNA evidence, it's impossible to not think about the others who fell through the cracks – especially when looking at a man who almost did.
In many ways, Graham's life mirrors America's civil rights movement. Graham grew up on a Southern plantation where his family worked as sharecroppers. In 1961, they moved to South Central Los Angeles to establish a better life and "that's where my trouble began", he said. As a teenager, Graham got caught up in gangs. He committed minor crimes. He spent much of his adolescence in juvenile institutions. And when he was 18, he went to Soledad Prison on a minor robbery charge.
Graham turned away from the gang life when he became influenced by the Black Panther Party in prison and he took a leadership position in the black prison movement, working for prisoners' rights. Because of his leadership, he said, he was framed in the 1973 murder of a prison guard while serving out his sentence at the Deul Vocational Institute in Stockton, California.
During Graham's second trial in 1976, he and his co-defendant, Eugene Allen, also an African-American, were charged with murder and sent to San Quentin's death house. It would take two more (all-white) trials and five more years before Graham would be freed, he said.
That was the story I expected to hear – one of a defunct criminal justice system, political corruption and racial bias. But ironically, Graham's story reveals his progressive attitudes against stereotypical 1970s America. Pacing back and forth in his sunroom, he clutched a picture of those who worked on his defense committee around the time of his third trial in 1979. Among his supporters was 30-year-old Phyllis Prentice – who stuck around.
Prentice, now 64, was a nurse in the county jail where Graham was being held while he awaited trial. "I thought she was a cop", he said, "because she was so nice to me – and white." But, on the heels of desegregation, Prentice, a political activist, and Graham, an African-American political prisoner, became friends. She quit her job and joined his defense committee. And when Graham was finally exonerated and released in 1981, they started a life together.
Now, their home is filled with photographs of their three children and four grandchildren – perhaps another testament to Graham's willingness to break social and political barriers.
Prentice is still a nurse – a palliative care nurse. Graham has a landscaping business. But listening to their story, it's clear their passion still lies in the political work they started back in the 1970s. They are both on the board of Witness to Innocence, an organization dedicated to empowering exonerated death row survivors like Graham, who is vice chair. Graham still travels and speaks out against issues of capital punishment, wrongful convictions and inhumane prison conditions, much like the ones he has lived through.
Graham's experience will forever be part of his history but, after I met him, I realized that his real story lies within the life he built because of – or maybe even in spite of – his past.
I sat in the sunroom staring at Graham through a camera lens. That's when he said something I'll never forget:
"I know why you're here. Perhaps if I'd never been on death row, you wouldn't be here today talking to me. That reminds me I should be looking at this as a great thing – and it is – to get the chance to pass on my experience and hope that you'll take it to another level. I promised the prisoners I would fight until the day I die."