you obviously don't know what your talking about, but I'm sticking with Rodman, he was just such a beast and without a doubt the best pound for pound defender ever, on another note does anyone agree with me that Shaq is the second greatest player of all time??
shaq was like wilt in that he was completely unstoppable at times but no not 2nd greatest of all time. jordan magic bird and kareem were better and i also think kobe is better.
Bill Simmons has Shaq ranked 11th with these 10 ahead of him
10. Hakeem Olajuwon
9. Oscar Robertson
8. Jerry West
7. Tim Duncan
6. Wilt Chamberlain
5. Larry Bird
4. Magic Johnson
3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
2. Bill Russell
1. Michael Jordan
ouch. gonna have to strongly disagree with you 81, to each their own but I would barley have sweet lew in my top 10........I was expecting you to say something like Bird, West, or Russel in which case I would have agreed more, IMO it's about a 4 way tie for 2nd between them
to each their own... but if you are looking for a center that can do it all....you really should take a look at Kareem. go take a few minutes and compare careers
Thats an interesting list, have to disagree with Duncan, I wouldn't even consider him the greatest spur, also would put west a little higher.........but Kobe better than shaq?!?!?! :shock: if it wasn't for Shaq I don't think Kobe would even be in this discussion or have any rings
maybe players finally realize they can't win and should shut up and collect their pay and play.
juggler see previous page. want to hear your thoughts on iverson vs. rodman. a couple of guys here are trying to tell me that rodman was better and more of a hall of famer than iverson (one guy even mentioned rodman's championships cause you know playing with jordan and duncan had nothing to do with those). as an aside Bill Simmons list Iverson as #29 all time and Rodman #69 all time in his book of Basketball.
pssst...he didn't win with Duncan...
2 with Detroit
3 with Chicago
i guess Ai vs. Rodman boils down to what you like
Rodman - defense, rebounding, a few put back points, hustle, old school all around tough nosed player
vs
AI - scoring, assisting
i think Rodman practiced as well.
as far as championships go...do they bulls beat utah in 98 without rodman guarding malone? do they go 72-10 in 95/96?
how can you compare a scoring guard to a rebounding forward who didn't care about scoring?
i think they're both hall of famers. however i don't think rodman gets in without being on those pistons or bulls teams. ai gets in without a title. that says something.
how can you compare a scoring guard to a rebounding forward who didn't care about scoring?
happens every draft day....
although team needs do come into play...
if on draft day, you knew how each player's career would pan out...which one is the juggler drafting?
depends on what your team needs. that is absolutely what the draft is about. comparing these two guys is like comparing a qb to a defensive tackle. 2 completely different kinds of players.
the better question would be if you were starting a team from scratch today, who would you take? ai is the better overall player but difficult to build around. rodman is the ultimate team player but can't lead a team on his own. both come with their own baggage.
i honestly don't know. probably ai. and i, of course, will be build a better team around him than what the sixers did.
For a PG, I'd say that's a low stat... but then again, different styles of PG I guess... he was a consistent scorer, with 26.7 PPG.
7/2/06 - Denver, CO
6/12/08 - Tampa, FL
8/23/09 - Chicago, IL
9/28/09 - Salt Lake City, UT (11 years too long!!!)
9/03/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 1
9/04/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 2
if it wasn't for Shaq I don't think Kobe would even be in this discussion or have any rings
you do realize Kobe has two rings post shaq?
true but I'm not so sure that he ever would have became so popular if it wasn't for him winning the first 3 with Shaq and then how do we know that the team goes and builds a team around him or even keeps him on the team period, he really never hit his stride until 10 years after he was drafted, do you think they would have waited around that long? I don't know maybe it's just my hate for Kobe and love for Shaq showing through but that's always been how I thought about it
please say you aren't trying to compare the two...
but real quick
jordan had a higher scoring average...higher block rate, higher steal rate, higher rebounding rate, and shot better from the 3pt line, free throw line and overall from the field.....and was a brilliant overall defender.
plus he practiced to make both himself and his teammates better....
please say you aren't trying to compare the two...
but real quick
jordan had a higher scoring average...higher block rate, higher steal rate, higher rebounding rate, and shot better from the 3pt line, free throw line and overall from the field.....and was a brilliant overall defender.
plus he practiced to make both himself and his teammates better....
please say you aren't trying to compare the two...
[/quote]
of course i'm not. but you guys are calling ai a point guard (he was not) and poo pooing 6.4 assists per game or whatever it was. that is nothing to poo poo about especially for a guy who averaged 27 points per game.
For a PG, I'd say that's a low stat... but then again, different styles of PG I guess... he was a consistent scorer, with 26.7 PPG.
he wasn't a point guard.
michael jordan is #82 by the way.
He was known to play both PG and SG. I could be wrong, but I thought I remembered AI playing the PG almost primarily... :?
7/2/06 - Denver, CO
6/12/08 - Tampa, FL
8/23/09 - Chicago, IL
9/28/09 - Salt Lake City, UT (11 years too long!!!)
9/03/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 1
9/04/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 2
michael jordan is #82 by the way.
please say you aren't trying to compare the two...
of course i'm not. but you guys are calling ai a point guard (he was not) and poo pooing 6.4 assists per game or whatever it was. that is nothing to poo poo about especially for a guy who averaged 27 points per game.
yes, i said poo-pooing
and don't forget Iverson played with a shitfest of teammates. how does this group sound? jerry stackhouse, larry hughes, keith van horn, todd mccullough, dikembe mutombo, theo ratliff, eric snow, aaron mckie and i'm sure i'm missing a shitload of other stiffs.
and juggler as i said about a page ago Rodman was never better than the 3rd best player on his own team. i don't see how you take a guy who was never a star of a team over iverson. but that is coming from a guy who watched a ton of iverson games and most of his career.
For a PG, I'd say that's a low stat... but then again, different styles of PG I guess... he was a consistent scorer, with 26.7 PPG.
he wasn't a point guard.
michael jordan is #82 by the way.
He was known to play both PG and SG. I could be wrong, but I thought I remembered AI playing the PG almost primarily... :?
eric snow was the point guard. ai was sort of a hybrid shooting guard. snow brought the ball up and, invariably, it would end up in ai's hands pretty quickly. but he was not a pg for most of his time here.
i don't see how you take a guy who was never a star of a team over iverson.
both were great players on the court....
and being they played different positions and all that...
AI was still a chump off the court and a lousy teammate
the truly great ones look forward to practice to improve themselves and their teammates.
i think it's easier to find players who did what rodman did than what iverson did. rodman was essentially a role player for his entire career. he never had plays called for him. ever.
i don't see how you take a guy who was never a star of a team over iverson.
both were great players on the court....
and being they played different positions and all that...
AI was still a chump off the court and a lousy teammate
the truly great ones look forward to practice to improve themselves and their teammates.
i think it's easier to find players who did what rodman did than what iverson did. rodman was essentially a role player for his entire career. he never had plays called for him. ever.
when was the last time you saw somebody average 18 boards a game for a season?
i see 30 point averages every year.
but i sort of agree...it's tougher to find an elite scorer. you can be a great rebounder/defender if you are athetic enough and put your mind to it.
eric snow was the point guard. ai was sort of a hybrid shooting guard. snow brought the ball up and, invariably, it would end up in ai's hands pretty quickly. but he was not a pg for most of his time here.
Thank you for clarifying, I had always thought he was a PG... me thinking his assist numbers being low for a PG now makes sense seeing as thought he was not primarily one.
7/2/06 - Denver, CO
6/12/08 - Tampa, FL
8/23/09 - Chicago, IL
9/28/09 - Salt Lake City, UT (11 years too long!!!)
9/03/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 1
9/04/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 2
i think it's easier to find players who did what rodman did than what iverson did. rodman was essentially a role player for his entire career. he never had plays called for him. ever.
when was the last time you saw somebody average 18 boards a game for a season?
i see 30 point averages every year.
but i sort of agree...it's tougher to find an elite scorer. you can be a great rebounder/defender if you are athetic enough and put your mind to it.
but only 2 guys averaged more than 25ppg last year. and ai almost singlehandidly led his team to the finals. a rodman type player cannot do that. he's a role player.
i'm not saying it's easy to find a guy who can grab that many rebounds. but you can find multiple role players to pound the boards and accomplish something similiar.
with all that said, i would loooooooooooooooooooooove a rodman type player on the sixers right now
is there actually a discussion on rodman vs. iverson!?? ... this board is awesome ...
stick around, next topic is great Raptors past and present...
haha ... the only guy that counts is alvin williams ... maybe damon stoudemire gets an honorable mention but that's it ... oh ... and toronto loves the oak but he only played like a year or two here ...
edit: sorry - you said great ... there are none ... ... the guys i mentioned are guys fans like ...
you obviously don't know what your talking about, but I'm sticking with Rodman, he was just such a beast and without a doubt the best pound for pound defender ever, on another note does anyone agree with me that Shaq is the second greatest player of all time??
Take it easy buddy....it was a joke. But thanks for sharing your basketball expertise....I feel enlightened.
Comments
shaq was like wilt in that he was completely unstoppable at times but no not 2nd greatest of all time. jordan magic bird and kareem were better and i also think kobe is better.
Bill Simmons has Shaq ranked 11th with these 10 ahead of him
10. Hakeem Olajuwon
9. Oscar Robertson
8. Jerry West
7. Tim Duncan
6. Wilt Chamberlain
5. Larry Bird
4. Magic Johnson
3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
2. Bill Russell
1. Michael Jordan
to each their own... but if you are looking for a center that can do it all....you really should take a look at Kareem. go take a few minutes and compare careers
you do realize Kobe has two rings post shaq?
how can you compare a scoring guard to a rebounding forward who didn't care about scoring?
i think they're both hall of famers. however i don't think rodman gets in without being on those pistons or bulls teams. ai gets in without a title. that says something.
happens every draft day....
although team needs do come into play...
if on draft day, you knew how each player's career would pan out...which one is the juggler drafting?
depends on what your team needs. that is absolutely what the draft is about. comparing these two guys is like comparing a qb to a defensive tackle. 2 completely different kinds of players.
the better question would be if you were starting a team from scratch today, who would you take? ai is the better overall player but difficult to build around. rodman is the ultimate team player but can't lead a team on his own. both come with their own baggage.
i honestly don't know. probably ai. and i, of course, will be build a better team around him than what the sixers did.
For a PG, I'd say that's a low stat... but then again, different styles of PG I guess... he was a consistent scorer, with 26.7 PPG.
6/12/08 - Tampa, FL
8/23/09 - Chicago, IL
9/28/09 - Salt Lake City, UT (11 years too long!!!)
9/03/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 1
9/04/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 2
47th overall
http://www.basketball-reference.com/lea ... areer.html
considering he scores as much as he does...it's not all that bad.
he wasn't a point guard.
michael jordan is #82 by the way.
true but I'm not so sure that he ever would have became so popular if it wasn't for him winning the first 3 with Shaq and then how do we know that the team goes and builds a team around him or even keeps him on the team period, he really never hit his stride until 10 years after he was drafted, do you think they would have waited around that long? I don't know maybe it's just my hate for Kobe and love for Shaq showing through but that's always been how I thought about it
please say you aren't trying to compare the two...
but real quick
jordan had a higher scoring average...higher block rate, higher steal rate, higher rebounding rate, and shot better from the 3pt line, free throw line and overall from the field.....and was a brilliant overall defender.
plus he practiced to make both himself and his teammates better....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZARgv6ulkg
Just kidding, there is no comparison but that was an awesome play
please say you aren't trying to compare the two...
[/quote]
of course i'm not. but you guys are calling ai a point guard (he was not) and poo pooing 6.4 assists per game or whatever it was. that is nothing to poo poo about especially for a guy who averaged 27 points per game.
yes, i said poo-pooing
He was known to play both PG and SG. I could be wrong, but I thought I remembered AI playing the PG almost primarily... :?
6/12/08 - Tampa, FL
8/23/09 - Chicago, IL
9/28/09 - Salt Lake City, UT (11 years too long!!!)
9/03/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 1
9/04/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 2
and don't forget Iverson played with a shitfest of teammates. how does this group sound? jerry stackhouse, larry hughes, keith van horn, todd mccullough, dikembe mutombo, theo ratliff, eric snow, aaron mckie and i'm sure i'm missing a shitload of other stiffs.
and juggler as i said about a page ago Rodman was never better than the 3rd best player on his own team. i don't see how you take a guy who was never a star of a team over iverson. but that is coming from a guy who watched a ton of iverson games and most of his career.
both were great players on the court....
and being they played different positions and all that...
AI was still a chump off the court and a lousy teammate
the truly great ones look forward to practice to improve themselves and their teammates.
eric snow was the point guard. ai was sort of a hybrid shooting guard. snow brought the ball up and, invariably, it would end up in ai's hands pretty quickly. but he was not a pg for most of his time here.
i think it's easier to find players who did what rodman did than what iverson did. rodman was essentially a role player for his entire career. he never had plays called for him. ever.
when was the last time you saw somebody average 18 boards a game for a season?
i see 30 point averages every year.
but i sort of agree...it's tougher to find an elite scorer. you can be a great rebounder/defender if you are athetic enough and put your mind to it.
I agree, especially at his height it's insane that he could do that
Thank you for clarifying, I had always thought he was a PG... me thinking his assist numbers being low for a PG now makes sense seeing as thought he was not primarily one.
6/12/08 - Tampa, FL
8/23/09 - Chicago, IL
9/28/09 - Salt Lake City, UT (11 years too long!!!)
9/03/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 1
9/04/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 2
but only 2 guys averaged more than 25ppg last year. and ai almost singlehandidly led his team to the finals. a rodman type player cannot do that. he's a role player.
i'm not saying it's easy to find a guy who can grab that many rebounds. but you can find multiple role players to pound the boards and accomplish something similiar.
with all that said, i would loooooooooooooooooooooove a rodman type player on the sixers right now
+85 trillion
stick around, next topic is great Raptors past and present...
haha ... the only guy that counts is alvin williams ... maybe damon stoudemire gets an honorable mention but that's it ... oh ... and toronto loves the oak but he only played like a year or two here ...
edit: sorry - you said great ... there are none ...
i blame the lockout
and philly peeps defending anything philly :P
Take it easy buddy....it was a joke. But thanks for sharing your basketball expertise....I feel enlightened.