Actually I do live life to the fullest. I didn't say that MY life has or needs a purpose. I was referring to the purpose of ALL life. A purpose of the earth. Or even a purpose of the universe. This world is so vast, it's incredible. And I never said I wanted it to go on forever. I said that I don't know. And it wasn't being egotistical because I don't know what happens to other animals or life forms either.
My best guess is that it's all over after we die. But I don't know for sure. The only thing that I know for sure is that you don't know either.
Well since you're a living being too I took it to mean your life was included in ALL life. I don't know what purpose you want for the earth or for the universe?? But if you ask the religious people they'll say that god built the earth for us (even though dinosaurs were here before us) and we're all alone in the universe (highly likely that we're not). Yes, earth is vast and incredible. You never said you WANTED it to go on forever, what you said was "And to think that there is no purpose or possible afterlife would be disappointing". That's why I said "why would you even want an afterlife". But you sound confused. First you said that you "certainly" don't believe in god and then you say you don't know for sure, so I don't know what to tell you.....
But hey, if there is an afterlife you can tell me how wrong I was and we'll have a good laugh about it and then talk some Pearl Jam! (See how stupid that sounds??) lol
I'm not confused at all. But it seems that you are very confused about my position. I'm not sure how I can make it more clear for you. But I'll try.
-I do not believe in God or Religion.
-I really don't believe in anything other than living a fulfilling life.
-I don't pretend to know what happens after death. (because I have never died)
-I don't know if there is some sort of higher power in this universe.
-When I talk of purpose...I'm referring to this vast world we live in. And just how small and fragile we are, even as a planet. I marvel at the solar system and it's possibility of being unbounded and infinite.
Basically I am saying that I don't believe in any man made religion. But I don't know for sure what happens after I die or if there is something out there far more spectacular than life on earth. Pretty simple concept really.
And as to your last quote about meeting and talking about PJ in an afterlife...Of course that sounds stupid. Because that would be a stupid persons idea of what an afterlife might be like. Hence why so many religious people believe that we all go to heaven and hang out. My best guess is that we all just die and that is it. But Iv'e never died and this world seems incredible and vast. So I just don't know.
No it's illogical for you to say that it's nuts to pray to something that you have no proof does not exist. At the very least, do not judge others, that would be fair.
Then again, you seem to believe in luck (as you mention), which is also beyond a persons control. Contradictory to your reason for not praying, as you say.
Really? It's illogical for me to say that it's nuts to pray to an imaginary being in the sky? I don't think I really need to prove that it doesn't exist. I think one just needs to pull their head out of their arse, join the 21st century, lose all that religious BS and try to keep up with science. And I will judge people if they do something is is completely bat-shit crazy. What if I told you I spend my Sundays summoning the spirits of dead movie stars? Or that I'm learning the ways of the force? Are you saying you wouldn't judge me?
And luck is different. I do believe in good fortune. It doesn't mean there's an imaginary being responsible for it and I can't pray for it to happen. It's not contradictory at all.
Actually yes you have to prove that "god or whatever you call it" doesn't exist to say that it is illogical to believe in it? that is whole basis of science (which you seem to be a fan of) the scientific answer would be that you have no reason to believe or not believe in a god. you and the believer are the same, you both don't have any facts to support you argument.
I'm not good at deleting multiple replies and leaving part of a quote on here, so I'll paste what Pandora said.
"It is up to us to help the millions living in terrible conditions, not God.
That is the gift God gave us.... the opportunity to help others. It is why we are here.
To learn compassion and unconditional love."
That would get a thumbs up on Facebook.
Amen, sister.
I am probably one of the very few who don't facebook so I don't even know how that works
but thank you and I give you a :thumbup: for your encouragement and support!
One quick thought that has occurred to me over the years now...
No offense, but doesnt this just make it a back-up plan? If you truely believe in God, shouldnt you believe because you are confident in your God, not because it serves your needs?
I'm sorry I haven't done this before, but its making me crazy and I'm usually not particular but thats not my quote! and I must just say so cause I would never say that...no offense Jon.... the one quick thought is mine... the back up plan no,... thats Jon's
so any who that is all
the purpose of science is not to prove something DOESN'T exist. it's the other way around. proving something doesn't exist only happens by trying to prove something does exist, and finding otherwise. you can't just say "hey, I saw an eight-legged frog with a chicken head", and I say "prove it", it's illogical for you to come back and say "no, it exists until you DISPROVE it". That's impossible in almost every scenario.
Actually yes you have to prove that "god or whatever you call it" doesn't exist to say that it is illogical to believe in it? that is whole basis of science (which you seem to be a fan of) the scientific answer would be that you have no reason to believe or not believe in a god.
I also have no reason to believe an eight-legged frog with a chicken head doesn't exist. doesn't mean I pray to it and put a picture of its "son" above my mantle.
Gimli 1993
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
What if I told you I spend my Sundays summoning the spirits of dead movie stars? Or that I'm learning the ways of the force? Are you saying you wouldn't judge me?
I wouldn't. I'd fucking JOIN you.
Gimli 1993
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
the purpose of science is not to prove something DOESN'T exist. it's the other way around. proving something doesn't exist only happens by trying to prove something does exist, and finding otherwise. you can't just say "hey, I saw an eight-legged frog with a chicken head", and I say "prove it", it's illogical for you to come back and say "no, it exists until you DISPROVE it". That's impossible in almost every scenario.
Actually yes you have to prove that "god or whatever you call it" doesn't exist to say that it is illogical to believe in it? that is whole basis of science (which you seem to be a fan of) the scientific answer would be that you have no reason to believe or not believe in a god.
I also have no reason to believe an eight-legged frog with a chicken head doesn't exist. doesn't mean I pray to it and put a picture of its "son" above my mantle.
Faith is not a cop out. And it's not a scientific concept.
funny I totally got it and it wasn't either what you guys said...hmmmm
Of course you did.
Pascal's quote which prompted this...^^^^^^^
"I would rather live my life believing that God does exist, then die to find out he doesn't, than to live my life not believing he exists, only to die to find out that he does".
Yes redrock I felt I understood the quote differently than you and Jon
because many believers feel their lives are far more meaningful
with the the presence of God in them.
So to live your life with God, believing you will journey on,
is far more satisfying then it would be
living your life without him
And then flip side
to live your life then to find out he existed your whole time on Earth
and you wasted that time without this fulfillment,
well you might want to kick your self in the arse
Kind of like not learning Abe Lincolns beautiful quotes til you are 55
missed time .... missed revelations.... missed enjoyment
Actually yes you have to prove that "god or whatever you call it" doesn't exist to say that it is illogical to believe in it? that is whole basis of science (which you seem to be a fan of) the scientific answer would be that you have no reason to believe or not believe in a god. you and the believer are the same, you both don't have any facts to support you argument.
Not really - science doesn't 'disprove'. Science could probably say there is evidence of absence, as it would have been researched/observed that there is nothing there (should this be/have been researched). Also, science doesn't work with 'absolutes', either way. If one looks at probabilities of existence, it would seriously tip towards the negative.
funny I totally got it and it wasn't either what you guys said...hmmmm
Of course you did.
Pascal's quote which prompted this...^^^^^^^
"I would rather live my life believing that God does exist, then die to find out he doesn't, than to live my life not believing he exists, only to die to find out that he does".
Yes redrock I felt I understood the quote differently than you and Jon
because many believers feel their lives are far more meaningful
with the the presence of God in them.
So to live your life with God, believing you will journey on,
is far more satisfying then it would be
living your life without him
And then flip side
to live your life then to find out he existed your whole time on Earth
and you wasted that time without this fulfillment,
well you might want to kick your self in the arse
Kind of like not learning Abe Lincolns beautiful quotes til you are 55
missed time .... missed revelations.... missed enjoyment
That was my interpretation of the quote
so what you are saying is
if you die and there is nothing
it's ok that you spent your entire life believing in a myth
that, you believe, made you a better person
but in reality, it is only ourselves that have the ability for peace, love and understanding
or if you die and you find yourself at the pearly gates check-in desk
and you did not believe in a god during your life
this god will be very upset that you did not worship it
and you will then spend eternity on fire
so you might as well spend your life in fear of that fire?
The whole world will be different soon... - EV
RED ROCKS 6-19-95
AUGUSTA 9-26-96
MANSFIELD 9-15-98
BOSTON 9-29-04
BOSTON 5-25-06
MANSFIELD 6-30-08
EV SOLO BOSTON 8-01-08
BOSTON 5-17-10
EV SOLO BOSTON 6-16-11
PJ20 9-3-11
PJ20 9-4-11
WRIGLEY 7-19-13
WORCESTER 10-15-13
WORCESTER 10-16-13
HARTFORD 10-25-13
the purpose of science is not to prove something DOESN'T exist. it's the other way around. proving something doesn't exist only happens by trying to prove something does exist, and finding otherwise. you can't just say "hey, I saw an eight-legged frog with a chicken head", and I say "prove it", it's illogical for you to come back and say "no, it exists until you DISPROVE it". That's impossible in almost every scenario.
Actually yes you have to prove that "god or whatever you call it" doesn't exist to say that it is illogical to believe in it? that is whole basis of science (which you seem to be a fan of) the scientific answer would be that you have no reason to believe or not believe in a god.
I also have no reason to believe an eight-legged frog with a chicken head doesn't exist. doesn't mean I pray to it and put a picture of its "son" above my mantle.
I hope you didn't take what i said wrong. I am not saying that god does exist or doesn't exist. all i am saying is that we don't have proof of either. I don't believe its a cop out to say we don't know.
as for the "son" issue. that more about religion than existence of god. I don't pray to jesus or any god but i do believe in a "god".
"I would love to believe that when I die I will live again, that some thinking, feeling, remembering part of me will continue. But much as I want to believe that, and despite the ancient and worldwide cultural traditions that assert an afterlife, I know of nothing to suggest that it is more than wishful thinking.
The world is so exquisite with so much love and moral depth, that there is no reason to deceive ourselves with pretty stories for which there's little good evidence. Far better it seems to me, in our vulnerability, is to look death in the eye and to be grateful every day for the brief but magnificent opportunity that life provides. "
"I would love to believe that when I die I will live again, that some thinking, feeling, remembering part of me will continue. But much as I want to believe that, and despite the ancient and worldwide cultural traditions that assert an afterlife, I know of nothing to suggest that it is more than wishful thinking.
The world is so exquisite with so much love and moral depth, that there is no reason to deceive ourselves with pretty stories for which there's little good evidence. Far better it seems to me, in our vulnerability, is to look death in the eye and to be grateful every day for the brief but magnificent opportunity that life provides. "
I guess he will find out for sure when he dies, just like the rest of us.
I have a questions. when we talk about a "god" what does that mean to everyone? Are we talking of god of Socrates, Einstein or the catholic church etc? are we talking about the unmoved mover, the big bang theory.
I guess he will find out for sure when he dies, just like the rest of us.
This is the kind of remark that only one who believes in an afterlife can make. A bit patronising, if you ask me.
When I die, I die - full stop. My memory will live through those that I leave behind, at least for some time, but that's it.
BTW - Sagan is dead - hasn't given any 'sign' of being somewhere else. If such things existed, I would have thought he would be a prime candidate to 'come back' and comment on this theories.
A friend of mine is catholic, like really catholic. I guess they're called practising catholics or devout catholics or whatever. They're super duper religious.Anyways, I try to tolerate it and not let it get in the way of our friendship but sometimes she says stuff that really make me question her sanity. For example, her and her husband are trying to have more kids. She's hoping, or I should say praying, to have twins. She said to me "we'll have to wait and see what god has planned for us." I felt like shaking her and screaming "God is not planning for you to have kids - you are!!" God's not going to plant a seed - they're going to go home and fuck until her husband puts one past the goalie! And praying to god is going to have just as much of an affect as praying to the Dude or Zeus. If it's gonna happen, it'll happen. You can't pray for it to happen any more than you can close your eyes, blow out the candles and wish for it to happen. It really bugs me. I believe "to each his own" to a certain extent. But this kind of talk is crazy to me. I really think that people like my friend have mental problems. Religious beliefs to me are a form of mental illness. It's fantasy. It's Santa Claus and the Easter bunny for grown ups who don't want to get real. And it's scary because they are reproducing and teaching their kids this shit! And I don't think it's harmless. I don't think it's necessarily okay to believe whatever you want because it makes people feel good or it gives them hope. It's false hope. And it keeps them on the outskirts of reality. I think people need to grow up, get real and face the facts (scientific facts). Put the bible away and buy a subscription to Discover magazine or something. (I'm not talking to anyone in here specifically, I just mean religious people in general). That is all. Please hold your applause.
my mother took, as she called it,
the 'privilege of going to church' away from me at the tender age of 4 or 5
this because my sisters took me and we skipped out and went to the candy store
each Sunday....
I didn't at the time know the impact and I rather thank her and I guess my big sisters
for this now.
It has surely changed how I have felt and feel about religion.
I was never baptized, endoctrined to believe, brainwashed, whatever one wants to call it.
I view religion in an open minded way.
Religion is not for me, at least not yet, but I just discovered Abe so who knows
I believe in God and the afterlife. Religion is man made for me, it is not God.
What I feel though is ....
it is the person who makes the religion not the religion who makes the person.
If we choose to look at only the hypocrites in the churches, the greedy, those who prey or
people who use religion as a crutch
we are not seeing the compassionate loving people who make our religions of the world
a beautiful bonding place. A place of heart. A place that is needed.
I think it's important as with anything to not focus only on the negative but see the positive in things,
this very true with religion.
To think of it as something only ugly, when there is beauty there, is unfair to the beauty.
What I feel personally is.... faith is not taught it is found and not all people need to find it.
Our paths take us to the things we need in this life, it is there we find fulfillment,
different for everyone
And then there is Pearl Jam! the only religion some of us need!
I guess he will find out for sure when he dies, just like the rest of us.
This is the kind of remark that only one who believes in an afterlife can make. A bit patronising, if you ask me.
When I die, I die - full stop. My memory will live through those that I leave behind, at least for some time, but that's it.
BTW - Sagan is dead - hasn't given any 'sign' of being somewhere else. If such things existed, I would have thought he would be a prime candidate to 'come back' and comment on this theories.
oh, okay, well I guess he already knows. And, no, it's not patronizing at all...I think that anybody with an open mind--whether they do or don't believe in an afterlife---could make that statement because everybody is going to die, and then it will be revealed. If there isn't an afterlife, then there will be no 'knowing', so it won't matter.
I have a questions. when we talk about a "god" what does that mean to everyone? Are we talking of god of Socrates, Einsteinor the catholic church etc? are we talking about the unmoved mover, the big bang theory.
Einstein's 'version' of god wouldn't be a very 'loving and compassionate' one!
And, no, it's not patronizing at all...I think that anybody with an open mind--whether they do or don't believe in an afterlife---could make that statement because everybody is going to die, and then it will be revealed. If there isn't an afterlife, then there will be no 'knowing', so it won't matter.
Anybody with an open mind? So those that have already made up their mind, are deemed 'small/closed minded'? One can't assume that one needs to wait until the end to find out anything. I don't have to jump into a black hole (if I could) to know it would be oblivion for me - even if science hasn't quite figured out what these are. I still believe anything that needs to be 'revealed' will be for believers and maybe-ers.
Afterlife is a religious or mythical concept. As I do not believe in religion and a myth is exactly what it says - for me there is no afterlife.
And, no, it's not patronizing at all...I think that anybody with an open mind--whether they do or don't believe in an afterlife---could make that statement because everybody is going to die, and then it will be revealed. If there isn't an afterlife, then there will be no 'knowing', so it won't matter.
Anybody with an open mind? So those that have already made up their mind, are deemed 'small/closed minded'? One can't assume that one needs to wait until the end to find out anything. I don't have to jump into a black hole (if I could) to know it would be oblivion for me - even if science hasn't quite figured out what these are. I still believe anything that needs to be 'revealed' will be for believers and maybe-ers.
Some people who have made up their mind are closed minded, yes. And I am not referring to you, btw. Have you not ever had a conversation with somebody who is decided on something and cannot/will not consider any other alternative?? And why can't one assume that one needs to wait until the 'end' to find out anything? As far as an afterlife, I don't think that there is any possible way to know absolutely if it does or does not exist until one is dead. And, you may be right that anything to be 'revealed' will be reserved for believers and maybe-ers, but I don't know, nobody does, and I'm not saying that I do. I have no idea.
..I just saw your edition, and personally, I believe that an afterlife is more of a 'spiritual' concept than a religious one...perhaps mythical on some levels, yes, and I respect and appreciate your views. You totally have a right to be sure about something, of course. Me, I'm not too sure about anything frankly.
b] faith is not taught it is found and not all people need to find it.
[/b]
Our paths take us to the things we need in this life, it is there we find fulfillment,
different for everyone
we FINALLY understand each other.
Gimli 1993
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
actually, I think I'd go so far as to say that anyone who claims to know either way IS close minded. I sometimes make fun of those who do believe, however, I always acknowledge that I don't know, nobody knows, no living being will ever know.
I teeter on the side of atheism, however, I can't say 100% sure that god does no exist. 99% sure is still agnostic.
Some people who have made up their mind are closed minded, yes. And I am not referring to you, btw. Have you not ever had a conversation with somebody who is decided on something and cannot/will not consider any other alternative?? And why can't one assume that one needs to wait until the 'end' to find out anything? As far as an afterlife, I don't think that there is any possible way to know absolutely if it does or does not exist until one is dead. And, you may be right that anything to be 'revealed' will be reserved for believers and maybe-ers, but I don't know, nobody does, and I'm not saying that I do. I have no idea.
Gimli 1993
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
to those saying they are agnostic or aethiest (I really don't know the difference.)
I'm curious. When you were growing up, did your parent/guardians take you to church or teach you about God?
or was God or a higher being not mentioned? I'm not trying to start a fight, just curious. one of my friends used to be Lutheran and she told me she stopped believing in God when she was 13.
I believe in God and I believe in Jesus. You aethiests are being prayed for, I hope you know
9/98, 9/00 - DC, 4/03 - Pitt., 7/03 - Bristow, 10/04 - Reading, 10/05 - Philly, 5/06 - DC, 6/06 - Pitt., 6/08 - Va Beach, 6/08 - DC, 5/10 - Bristow, 10/13 B'more
8/08 - Ed solo in DC, 6/09 Ed in B'more,
10/10 - Brad in B'more
actually, I think I'd go so far as to say that anyone who claims to know either way IS close minded. I sometimes make fun of those who do believe, however, I always acknowledge that I don't know, nobody knows, no living being will ever know.
Some people who have made up their mind are closed minded, yes. And I am not referring to you, btw. Have you not ever had a conversation with somebody who is decided on something and cannot/will not consider any other alternative?? And why can't one assume that one needs to wait until the 'end' to find out anything? As far as an afterlife, I don't think that there is any possible way to know absolutely if it does or does not exist until one is dead. And, you may be right that anything to be 'revealed' will be reserved for believers and maybe-ers, but I don't know, nobody does, and I'm not saying that I do. I have no idea.
As far as an afterlife, I don't think that there is any possible way to know absolutely if it does or does not exist until one is dead. And, you may be right that anything to be 'revealed' will be reserved for believers and maybe-ers, but I don't know, nobody does, and I'm not saying that I do. I have no idea.
I edited my post to explain why I didn't believe in an afterlife. Lots of people here make a huge point about believing in god but not in religion and the majority of those will believe in an afterlife. As I said in my previous post, afterlife is a RELIGIOUS (or mythical) concept based on the 'good books/good word' or whatever it is called - this is for all religions who do have an afterlife. So those not believing in religion will then still pick and choose the bits they like whilst discarding the other bits?
Edit: saw your edit. Spiritual, based on religion. Again, one can't really completely dissociate god and religion.
actually, I think I'd go so far as to say that anyone who claims to know either way IS close minded. I sometimes make fun of those who do believe, however, I always acknowledge that I don't know, nobody knows, no living being will ever know.
I teeter on the side of atheism, however, I can't say 100% sure that god does no exist. 99% sure is still agnostic.
Some people who have made up their mind are closed minded, yes. And I am not referring to you, btw. Have you not ever had a conversation with somebody who is decided on something and cannot/will not consider any other alternative?? And why can't one assume that one needs to wait until the 'end' to find out anything? As far as an afterlife, I don't think that there is any possible way to know absolutely if it does or does not exist until one is dead. And, you may be right that anything to be 'revealed' will be reserved for believers and maybe-ers, but I don't know, nobody does, and I'm not saying that I do. I have no idea.
I'm close minded.
9/98, 9/00 - DC, 4/03 - Pitt., 7/03 - Bristow, 10/04 - Reading, 10/05 - Philly, 5/06 - DC, 6/06 - Pitt., 6/08 - Va Beach, 6/08 - DC, 5/10 - Bristow, 10/13 B'more
8/08 - Ed solo in DC, 6/09 Ed in B'more,
10/10 - Brad in B'more
to those saying they are agnostic or aethiest (I really don't know the difference.)
I'm curious. When you were growing up, did your parent/guardians take you to church or teach you about God?
or was God or a higher being not mentioned? I'm not trying to start a fight, just curious. one of my friends used to be Lutheran and she told me she stopped believing in God when she was 13.
I believe in God and I believe in Jesus. You aethiests are being prayed for, I hope you know
Atheist - does not believe in a god
Agnostic - not sure if a god exists or not.
Save your prayers for those who believe in them - might work better
Comments
You're a sweetheart. : )
Another habit says its long overdue
Another habit like an unwanted friend
I'm so happy with my righteous self
I'm not confused at all. But it seems that you are very confused about my position. I'm not sure how I can make it more clear for you. But I'll try.
-I do not believe in God or Religion.
-I really don't believe in anything other than living a fulfilling life.
-I don't pretend to know what happens after death. (because I have never died)
-I don't know if there is some sort of higher power in this universe.
-When I talk of purpose...I'm referring to this vast world we live in. And just how small and fragile we are, even as a planet. I marvel at the solar system and it's possibility of being unbounded and infinite.
Basically I am saying that I don't believe in any man made religion. But I don't know for sure what happens after I die or if there is something out there far more spectacular than life on earth. Pretty simple concept really.
And as to your last quote about meeting and talking about PJ in an afterlife...Of course that sounds stupid. Because that would be a stupid persons idea of what an afterlife might be like. Hence why so many religious people believe that we all go to heaven and hang out. My best guess is that we all just die and that is it. But Iv'e never died and this world seems incredible and vast. So I just don't know.
"It is up to us to help the millions living in terrible conditions, not God.
That is the gift God gave us.... the opportunity to help others. It is why we are here.
To learn compassion and unconditional love."
That would get a thumbs up on Facebook.
Amen, sister.
8/08 - Ed solo in DC, 6/09 Ed in B'more,
10/10 - Brad in B'more
Actually yes you have to prove that "god or whatever you call it" doesn't exist to say that it is illogical to believe in it? that is whole basis of science (which you seem to be a fan of) the scientific answer would be that you have no reason to believe or not believe in a god. you and the believer are the same, you both don't have any facts to support you argument.
but thank you and I give you a :thumbup: for your encouragement and support!
I'm sorry I haven't done this before, but its making me crazy and I'm usually not particular but thats not my quote! and I must just say so cause I would never say that...no offense Jon.... the one quick thought is mine... the back up plan no,... thats Jon's
so any who that is all
and a cop out.
I also have no reason to believe an eight-legged frog with a chicken head doesn't exist. doesn't mean I pray to it and put a picture of its "son" above my mantle.
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
I wouldn't. I'd fucking JOIN you.
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
Faith is not a cop out. And it's not a scientific concept.
"I would rather live my life believing that God does exist, then die to find out he doesn't, than to live my life not believing he exists, only to die to find out that he does".
Yes redrock I felt I understood the quote differently than you and Jon
because many believers feel their lives are far more meaningful
with the the presence of God in them.
So to live your life with God, believing you will journey on,
is far more satisfying then it would be
living your life without him
And then flip side
to live your life then to find out he existed your whole time on Earth
and you wasted that time without this fulfillment,
well you might want to kick your self in the arse
Kind of like not learning Abe Lincolns beautiful quotes til you are 55
missed time .... missed revelations.... missed enjoyment
That was my interpretation of the quote
Not really - science doesn't 'disprove'. Science could probably say there is evidence of absence, as it would have been researched/observed that there is nothing there (should this be/have been researched). Also, science doesn't work with 'absolutes', either way. If one looks at probabilities of existence, it would seriously tip towards the negative.
so what you are saying is
if you die and there is nothing
it's ok that you spent your entire life believing in a myth
that, you believe, made you a better person
but in reality, it is only ourselves that have the ability for peace, love and understanding
or if you die and you find yourself at the pearly gates check-in desk
and you did not believe in a god during your life
this god will be very upset that you did not worship it
and you will then spend eternity on fire
so you might as well spend your life in fear of that fire?
RED ROCKS 6-19-95
AUGUSTA 9-26-96
MANSFIELD 9-15-98
BOSTON 9-29-04
BOSTON 5-25-06
MANSFIELD 6-30-08
EV SOLO BOSTON 8-01-08
BOSTON 5-17-10
EV SOLO BOSTON 6-16-11
PJ20 9-3-11
PJ20 9-4-11
WRIGLEY 7-19-13
WORCESTER 10-15-13
WORCESTER 10-16-13
HARTFORD 10-25-13
I hope you didn't take what i said wrong. I am not saying that god does exist or doesn't exist. all i am saying is that we don't have proof of either. I don't believe its a cop out to say we don't know.
as for the "son" issue. that more about religion than existence of god. I don't pray to jesus or any god but i do believe in a "god".
Carl Sagan:
"I would love to believe that when I die I will live again, that some thinking, feeling, remembering part of me will continue. But much as I want to believe that, and despite the ancient and worldwide cultural traditions that assert an afterlife, I know of nothing to suggest that it is more than wishful thinking.
The world is so exquisite with so much love and moral depth, that there is no reason to deceive ourselves with pretty stories for which there's little good evidence. Far better it seems to me, in our vulnerability, is to look death in the eye and to be grateful every day for the brief but magnificent opportunity that life provides. "
I guess he will find out for sure when he dies, just like the rest of us.
This is the kind of remark that only one who believes in an afterlife can make. A bit patronising, if you ask me.
When I die, I die - full stop. My memory will live through those that I leave behind, at least for some time, but that's it.
BTW - Sagan is dead - hasn't given any 'sign' of being somewhere else. If such things existed, I would have thought he would be a prime candidate to 'come back' and comment on this theories.
my mother took, as she called it,
the 'privilege of going to church' away from me at the tender age of 4 or 5
this because my sisters took me and we skipped out and went to the candy store
each Sunday....
I didn't at the time know the impact and I rather thank her and I guess my big sisters
for this now.
It has surely changed how I have felt and feel about religion.
I was never baptized, endoctrined to believe, brainwashed, whatever one wants to call it.
I view religion in an open minded way.
Religion is not for me, at least not yet, but I just discovered Abe so who knows
I believe in God and the afterlife. Religion is man made for me, it is not God.
What I feel though is ....
it is the person who makes the religion not the religion who makes the person.
If we choose to look at only the hypocrites in the churches, the greedy, those who prey or
people who use religion as a crutch
we are not seeing the compassionate loving people who make our religions of the world
a beautiful bonding place. A place of heart. A place that is needed.
I think it's important as with anything to not focus only on the negative but see the positive in things,
this very true with religion.
To think of it as something only ugly, when there is beauty there, is unfair to the beauty.
What I feel personally is.... faith is not taught it is found and not all people need to find it.
Our paths take us to the things we need in this life, it is there we find fulfillment,
different for everyone
And then there is Pearl Jam! the only religion some of us need!
oh, okay, well I guess he already knows.
Einstein's 'version' of god wouldn't be a very 'loving and compassionate' one!
Anybody with an open mind? So those that have already made up their mind, are deemed 'small/closed minded'? One can't assume that one needs to wait until the end to find out anything. I don't have to jump into a black hole (if I could) to know it would be oblivion for me - even if science hasn't quite figured out what these are. I still believe anything that needs to be 'revealed' will be for believers and maybe-ers.
Afterlife is a religious or mythical concept. As I do not believe in religion and a myth is exactly what it says - for me there is no afterlife.
neither do I. that's exactly my stance as an agnostic. I took what you said incorrectly I guess.
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
Some people who have made up their mind are closed minded, yes. And I am not referring to you, btw. Have you not ever had a conversation with somebody who is decided on something and cannot/will not consider any other alternative?? And why can't one assume that one needs to wait until the 'end' to find out anything? As far as an afterlife, I don't think that there is any possible way to know absolutely if it does or does not exist until one is dead. And, you may be right that anything to be 'revealed' will be reserved for believers and maybe-ers, but I don't know, nobody does, and I'm not saying that I do. I have no idea.
..I just saw your edition, and personally, I believe that an afterlife is more of a 'spiritual' concept than a religious one...perhaps mythical on some levels, yes, and I respect and appreciate your views. You totally have a right to be sure about something, of course.
we FINALLY understand each other.
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
I teeter on the side of atheism, however, I can't say 100% sure that god does no exist. 99% sure is still agnostic.
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
I'm curious. When you were growing up, did your parent/guardians take you to church or teach you about God?
or was God or a higher being not mentioned? I'm not trying to start a fight, just curious. one of my friends used to be Lutheran and she told me she stopped believing in God when she was 13.
I believe in God and I believe in Jesus. You aethiests are being prayed for, I hope you know
8/08 - Ed solo in DC, 6/09 Ed in B'more,
10/10 - Brad in B'more
I edited my post to explain why I didn't believe in an afterlife. Lots of people here make a huge point about believing in god but not in religion and the majority of those will believe in an afterlife. As I said in my previous post, afterlife is a RELIGIOUS (or mythical) concept based on the 'good books/good word' or whatever it is called - this is for all religions who do have an afterlife. So those not believing in religion will then still pick and choose the bits they like whilst discarding the other bits?
Edit: saw your edit. Spiritual, based on religion. Again, one can't really completely dissociate god and religion.
I'm close minded.
8/08 - Ed solo in DC, 6/09 Ed in B'more,
10/10 - Brad in B'more
Atheist - does not believe in a god
Agnostic - not sure if a god exists or not.
Save your prayers for those who believe in them - might work better