obama and rev. wright......

ed243421

i know this is old news
but always relevant

what did wright say that was not true?

i think obama's biggest mistake was to not support this man's beliefs

and i ain't no democrat
sure as fuck ain't no republican, either
i only know one party
and that is
freedom

murphyJammer

My favorite observation about the Reverend Wright scenario was by Chris Rock. He pointed out that he is almost seventy years old, and if he hates white people it shouldn't surprise anyone. He said that it is understandable for a person of his age, because he saw his kindergarten class lynched.

mikepegg44

ed243421 wrote:

what did wright say that was not true?

“Racism is how this country was founded and how this country is still run!…We [in the U.S.] believe in white supremacy and black inferiority and believe it more than we believe in God.” (sermon)
well, racism was not how this country was founded, and the majority of the country do not believe in black inferiority...so seems untrue to me.

I mean, that is just one statement, he also talked about how HIV and Crack were a government plot against the black man. Maybe shouldn't hitch your wagons to this one man.
But I am sure you will call me a racist

Godfather.

mikepegg44 wrote:

ed243421 wrote:

what did wright say that was not true?

“Racism is how this country was founded and how this country is still run!…We [in the U.S.] believe in white supremacy and black inferiority and believe it more than we believe in God.” (sermon)
well, racism was not how this country was founded, and the majority of the country do not believe in black inferiority...so seems untrue to me.

I mean, that is just one statement, he also talked about how HIV and Crack were a government plot against the black man. Maybe shouldn't hitch your wagons to this one man.
But I am sure you will call me a racist

great post.

Godfather

gimmesometruth27

mikepegg44 wrote:

ed243421 wrote:

what did wright say that was not true?

“Racism is how this country was founded and how this country is still run!…We [in the U.S.] believe in white supremacy and black inferiority and believe it more than we believe in God.” (sermon)
well, racism was not how this country was founded, and the majority of the country do not believe in black inferiority...so seems untrue to me.

I mean, that is just one statement, he also talked about how HIV and Crack were a government plot against the black man. Maybe shouldn't hitch your wagons to this one man.
But I am sure you will call me a racist

does having and keeping an economy based on slave labor count as racism? i believe slavery implies white superiority over blacks at that time...i could be wrong tho...

also, i can totally see where he is coming from when he said crack and hiv were plots against the black man. when the official governent policy relating to crack was "just say no" and the hiv policy was "don't have sex " or use a condom"...instead of offering real solutions i could see how folks could view it like that.

ed243421

mikepegg44 wrote:

ed243421 wrote:

what did wright say that was not true?

“Racism is how this country was founded and how this country is still run!…We [in the U.S.] believe in white supremacy and black inferiority and believe it more than we believe in God.” (sermon)
well, racism was not how this country was founded, and the majority of the country do not believe in black inferiority...so seems untrue to me.

I mean, that is just one statement, he also talked about how HIV and Crack were a government plot against the black man. Maybe shouldn't hitch your wagons to this one man.
But I am sure you will call me a racist

m
how was this country founded?
with equality?
what percentage of this country does believe in black inferiority?
how were the slaves treated?
like slaves?
have there been no government plots against the black man?

would love to see your answers soon

and since you took the time to show us something he said that you believe to be false,
could you show us something he said that you believe to be true?

or is everything he has ever said a lie?

mikepegg44

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

mikepegg44 wrote:

ed243421 wrote:

what did wright say that was not true?

“Racism is how this country was founded and how this country is still run!…We [in the U.S.] believe in white supremacy and black inferiority and believe it more than we believe in God.” (sermon)
well, racism was not how this country was founded, and the majority of the country do not believe in black inferiority...so seems untrue to me.

I mean, that is just one statement, he also talked about how HIV and Crack were a government plot against the black man. Maybe shouldn't hitch your wagons to this one man.
But I am sure you will call me a racist

does having and keeping an economy based on slave labor count as racism? i believe slavery implies white superiority over blacks at that time...i could be wrong tho...

also, i can totally see where he is coming from when he said crack and hiv were plots against the black man. when the official governent policy relating to crack was "just say no" and the hiv policy was "don't have sex " or use a condom"...instead of offering real solutions i could see how folks could view it like that.

A real solution for HIV is wearing a condom, abstinence works as well. And considering the government funds prevention programs, it seems like they are doing more than that. I work in that world every day so I would be careful what I say about it, I do know quite a bit.
Who's fault is it if you get addicted to drugs?

mikepegg44

Ed,

the easiest way to do this for me and my crappy IE is to reply in the quote, my stuff is in bold

ed243421 wrote:

m
how was this country founded?
with equality? as a place to escape religious freedom. Why we revolted from our colony status, was among other things Did we have slaves, yes, unfortunately the entire world has had slaves at one point or another. Was it racist for the egyptians to keep jewish slaves? How about the romans keeping roman slaves? Slavery is a dark time in all of humanity, it isn't specific to the United States any more than any other country. There were also free and respected black men. I am not saying that was the norm, but there were some there.
what percentage of this country does believe in black inferiority? I don't know, but I would guess that the fringe on the outside that is vocal about their hatred, whether it be white or black, has skewed how you feel about it. How many believe in it?
how were the slaves treated? Like slaves, like all slaves have been throughout history.
have there been no government plots against the black man? I cannot point to one in particular, there have definitely been experiments, tuskegee comes to mind, and during the 50's and 60's there were many investigations and "plots" against all sorts of people, including but not limited to Dr. Martin Luther King JR. I am not saying that our country has not done awful things, but to say that we were founded on slavery is a lie. To say that HIV was a plot against the black man by our government is a lie.
would love to see your answers soon..no you don't like seeing my answers. I would love some answers from you to the questions I have asked.[/b]]
and since you took the time to show us something he said that you believe to be false,
could you show us something he said that you believe to true?

or is everything he has ever said a lie?

no, not everything he has said is a lie, but when you are extreme, often times you make statements that are not true. He was even asked about his feelings on HIV. He then back tracked and simply said it was possible. you see that is the problem. he spouts it out as if it was gospel, but it isn't, so then he comes back and says ok it is only possible...two vastly different messages
I think he is spot on in his discussion of Palestine, and the problems caused by us either helping to happen or sitting by and watching as they did the unjustices to the palestinian people

gimmesometruth27

mikepegg44 wrote:

A real solution for HIV is wearing a condom, abstinence works as well. And considering the government funds prevention programs, it seems like they are doing more than that. I work in that world every day so I would be careful what I say about it, I do know quite a bit.
Who's fault is it if you get addicted to drugs?

abstinance only is great in theory, but you are not going to keep people from repressing their urge to procreate. its the saame as repressing the urge to eat. where is the cure for HIV? how can magic johnson not only survive but thrive for 19 years while others die within a year or two? if you remember in the height of the aids epidemic in the 80s the government instead of throwing everything behind the effort of finding a cure because it was a "gay disease" instead said use a condom or don't have sex. is hiv still a problem in this country? yes it is. is it still a problem in africa? yes it is an epidemic there...is drug use still a problem in this country? yes it is. if you all want a war on drugs have a war on drugs and get the feds involved and do something about it instead of blaming the poor who were the prey of the drug dealers.

Godfather.

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

mikepegg44 wrote:

A real solution for HIV is wearing a condom, abstinence works as well. And considering the government funds prevention programs, it seems like they are doing more than that. I work in that world every day so I would be careful what I say about it, I do know quite a bit.
Who's fault is it if you get addicted to drugs?

abstinance only is great in theory, but you are not going to keep people from repressing their urge to procreate. its the same as repressing the urge to eat. where is the cure for HIV? how can magic johnson not only survive but thrive for 19 years while others die within a year or two? if you remember in the height of the aids epidemic in the 80s the government instead of throwing everything behind the effort of finding a cure because it was a "gay disease" instead said use a condom or don't have sex. is hiv still a problem in this country? yes it is. is it still a problem in africa? yes it is an epidemic there...is drug use still a problem in this country? yes it is. if you all want a war on drugs have a war on drugs and get the feds involved and do something about it instead of blaming the poor who were the prey of the drug dealers.

"its the saame as repressing the urge to eat." fixed that for ya buddy.

Godfather.

mikepegg44

USING CONDOMS WORKS

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

mikepegg44 wrote:

A real solution for HIV is wearing a condom, abstinence works as well. And considering the government funds prevention programs, it seems like they are doing more than that. I work in that world every day so I would be careful what I say about it, I do know quite a bit.
Who's fault is it if you get addicted to drugs?

abstinance only is great in theory, but you are not going to keep people from repressing their urge to procreate. its the saame as repressing the urge to eat. where is the cure for HIV? how can magic johnson not only survive but thrive for 19 years while others die within a year or two? if you remember in the height of the aids epidemic in the 80s the government instead of throwing everything behind the effort of finding a cure because it was a "gay disease" instead said use a condom or don't have sex. is hiv still a problem in this country? yes it is. is it still a problem in africa? yes it is an epidemic there...is drug use still a problem in this country? yes it is. if you all want a war on drugs have a war on drugs and get the feds involved and do something about it instead of blaming the poor who were the prey of the drug dealers.

First off, Magic johnson isn't the only person that has lived for 19 years with HIV. More than likely he also was tested and found out the results early on in his infection than most do. Early detection is very important.
When the HIV/AIDS epidemic began there was a lot of fear. Because of that, while research was being done, they had some misguided efforts to control the disease. That is different than saying it is a PLOT AGIANST A GROUP OF PEOPLE.
About the cure, are you serious? do you not think that people worldwide have dedicated their lives to finding this cure? HIV is a virus, a complicated virus, you cannot just throw money at it and think that is going to solve the problem. It takes time, research, and trial and error. A vaccination is going to be the most likely thing to come out.
As far as the poor getting proper medical care for HIV, I work in a program funded by the MDH and by proxy CDC that coordinates care for people who cannot afford it, are uninsured, or are underinsured. Trust me, there are a shit load of people working to make sure that HIV is managed properly in this country.
I have known many white people who have had their lives ruined by crack. You are not arguing in support of the idea that the government deliberately released crack to keep the black man down are you? That was Wright's point.
No one is a prey of drug dealers, besides possibly the prostitutes who are literally forced to do drugs. Deflection of blame is the easiest way for the same cycle to contiue. I don't care if people do drugs, but they shouldn't blame anyone but themselves whenthey become addicts. Plain and simple. You and I will have to disagree on that one.

ed243421

mikepegg44 wrote:

USING CONDOMS WORKS

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

mikepegg44 wrote:

A real solution for HIV is wearing a condom, abstinence works as well. And considering the government funds prevention programs, it seems like they are doing more than that. I work in that world every day so I would be careful what I say about it, I do know quite a bit.
Who's fault is it if you get addicted to drugs?

abstinance only is great in theory, but you are not going to keep people from repressing their urge to procreate. its the saame as repressing the urge to eat. where is the cure for HIV? how can magic johnson not only survive but thrive for 19 years while others die within a year or two? if you remember in the height of the aids epidemic in the 80s the government instead of throwing everything behind the effort of finding a cure because it was a "gay disease" instead said use a condom or don't have sex. is hiv still a problem in this country? yes it is. is it still a problem in africa? yes it is an epidemic there...is drug use still a problem in this country? yes it is. if you all want a war on drugs have a war on drugs and get the feds involved and do something about it instead of blaming the poor who were the prey of the drug dealers.

First off, Magic johnson isn't the only person that has lived for 19 years with HIV. More than likely he also was tested and found out the results early on in his infection than most do. Early detection is very important.
When the HIV/AIDS epidemic began there was a lot of fear. Because of that, while research was being done, they had some misguided efforts to control the disease. That is different than saying it is a PLOT AGIANST A GROUP OF PEOPLE.
About the cure, are you serious? do you not think that people worldwide have dedicated their lives to finding this cure? HIV is a virus, a complicated virus, you cannot just throw money at it and think that is going to solve the problem. It takes time, research, and trial and error. A vaccination is going to be the most likely thing to come out.
As far as the poor getting proper medical care for HIV, I work in a program funded by the MDH and by proxy CDC that coordinates care for people who cannot afford it, are uninsured, or are underinsured. Trust me, there are a shit load of people working to make sure that HIV is managed properly in this country.
I have known many white people who have had their lives ruined by crack. You are not arguing in support of the idea that the government deliberately released crack to keep the black man down are you? That was Wright's point.
No one is a prey of drug dealers, besides possibly the prostitutes who are literally forced to do drugs. Deflection of blame is the easiest way for the same cycle to contiue. I don't care if people do drugs, but they shouldn't blame anyone but themselves whenthey become addicts. Plain and simple. You and I will have to disagree on that one.

m

could you find something he said that you believe to be true?
or are you afraid to look?
please share what you find with us?

unsung

Slavery ended 145 years ago, give or take. Move on.

gimmesometruth27

unsung wrote:

Slavery ended 145 years ago, give or take. Move on.

that is so easy for you to say isn't it?

so should the jews move on from the holocaust as well?

should the palestinians just move on from the oppressive situation they are currently faced with?

better yet, should all of us ever forget that the institution of slavery and the attempted systematic elimination of an entire ethnic group ever happened?

unsung

Comparing the Holocaust to anything in repression terms is pretty laugable. Ease up Johnny Drama.

gimmesometruth27

unsung wrote:

Comparing the Holocaust to anything in repression terms is pretty laugable. Ease up Johnny Drama.

slavery and the holocaust were systematic, institutionalized, and was allowed to go unchecked until the south was defeated and the germans were defeated. yes, the holocaust was on a much larger scale and was infinitely more terrible, yet it was no more institutional or systematic than snatching africans from their homeland, bringing them across the ocean, and selling them into a lifetime of bondage. i would be willing to bet you anything that the death toll of slaves over the course of the hundreds of years of slavery in the US would be in the millions, just like the deaths of the jews, gypsies, invalids, etc in the years of the holocaust.

unsung

I never said slavery was right, it isn't, however at what point in time will the white man officially stop oppressing the black man? When can we get past the past and work together to end racism?

Godfather.

unsung wrote:

I never said slavery was right, it isn't, however at what point in time will the white man officially stop oppressing the black man? When can we get past the past and work together to end racism?

:thumbup:

Godfather.

ed243421

Godfather. wrote:

unsung wrote:

I never said slavery was right, it isn't, however at what point in time will the white man officially stop oppressing the black man? When can we get past the past and work together to end racism?

:thumbup:

Godfather.

if this work you're talking about are the posts from the two of you

it will never end

Dirtie_Frank

ed243421 wrote:

Godfather. wrote:

unsung wrote:

I never said slavery was right, it isn't, however at what point in time will the white man officially stop oppressing the black man? When can we get past the past and work together to end racism?

:thumbup:

Godfather.

if this work you're talking about are the posts from the two of you

it will never end

It also will not work when people like Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton claim racism every time something does not go a black man's way.

Cosmo

Dirtie_Frank wrote:

It also will not work when people like Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton claim racism every time something does not go a black man's way.

...
Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton speak for all black people as much as Glenn Beck speaks for all white people... or Rev. Fred Phelps speaks for all Christians.

Dirtie_Frank

Cosmo wrote:

Dirtie_Frank wrote:

It also will not work when people like Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton claim racism every time something does not go a black man's way.

...
Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton speak for all black people as much as Glenn Beck speaks for all white people... or Rev. Fred Phelps speaks for all Christians.

True

_

murphyJammer wrote:

My favorite observation about the Reverend Wright scenario was by Chris Rock. He pointed out that he is almost seventy years old, and if he hates white people it shouldn't surprise anyone. He said that it is understandable for a person of his age, because he saw his kindergarten class lynched.

Excellent point.

_

mikepegg44 wrote:

ed243421 wrote:

what did wright say that was not true?

“Racism is how this country was founded and how this country is still run!…We [in the U.S.] believe in white supremacy and black inferiority and believe it more than we believe in God.” (sermon)

Hmm... I don't know; seems kinda true to me.

_

unsung wrote:

I never said slavery was right, it isn't, however at what point in time will the white man officially stop oppressing the black man? When can we get past the past and work together to end racism?

You can't end racism until you acknowledge it.

mikepegg44

ed243421 wrote:

m

could you find something he said that you believe to be true?
or are you afraid to look?
please share what you find with us?

I already answered that question...read my response to you in my earlier post. /M/uch of it had to do with the palestinians.

KDH12

scb wrote:

murphyJammer wrote:

My favorite observation about the Reverend Wright scenario was by Chris Rock. He pointed out that he is almost seventy years old, and if he hates white people it shouldn't surprise anyone. He said that it is understandable for a person of his age, because he saw his kindergarten class lynched.

Excellent point.

good point but still no excuse

I was not bothered by what the rev said, I have been to many "black churches" and well they worship in different ways and believe different things... this does not make them racist

however racist beliefs can not be written off due to age, my grandfather if he had not died a few years ago would have been about 92 and was one of the most close minded hateful people (although god fearing). people always tried to excuse him of his comments and beliefs cause of his age but I had a hard time with it because as times change, people need to......

my other grandparents are about 10 years younger... 80 in October.... and have made significant changes in their worldview and have adapted well to the multicultural society.

I am bias and hyper sensative to this issue since I am in a biracial marriage with biracial children

ed243421

mikepegg44 wrote:

ed243421 wrote:

m

could you find something he said that you believe to be true?
or are you afraid to look?
please share what you find with us?

I already answered that question...read my response to you in my earlier post. /M/uch of it had to do with the palestinians.

america

what has he said true about america?

Blockhead

If you live in the city then you know, black people are far more racist than white peoplem
I am nto saying they need to forget about what happened. But using an excuse that is 145 years old seems to be a
Bit excessive. We will never get over racism because black people use it as
An excuse for failure. I covered this in another thread but they are GIVEN all the tools to
Succeed, there should be no excuses anymore.

inmytree

HeidiJam wrote:

If you live in the city then you know, black people are far more racist than white peoplem
I am nto saying they need to forget about what happened. But using an excuse that is 145 years old seems to be a
Bit excessive. We will never get over racism because black people use it as
An excuse for failure. I covered this in another thread but they are GIVEN all the tools to
Succeed, there should be no excuses anymore.

sweet fn jesus... :roll:

gimmesometruth27

HeidiJam wrote:

If you live in the city then you know, black people are far more racist than white peoplem
I am nto saying they need to forget about what happened. But using an excuse that is 145 years old seems to be a
Bit excessive. We will never get over racism because black people use it as
An excuse for failure. I covered this in another thread but they are GIVEN all the tools to
Succeed, there should be no excuses anymore.

exactly what tools are they given? to many of them who have no luxury of living in the nice suburbs being born in the inner city in poverty is hardly a gift...

people seem to forget that slavery ended during the early 1860s, yet there were jim crow laws for a hundred years after that in the south designed to keep african americans down. they were still considered 3/5 of a person remember? they did not even get the right to vote for the longest time after that. and if it had not been for the civil rights movement and many people giving their lives for that struggle who knows where the african americans would be today? so to say that slavery ended 145 years ago and they should get over it is extremely short sighted....hell they could not even attend the university of alabama until the early 1960s, and even that first black student had to be allowed in by the national fucking guard because the governor was blocking her entrance...they had to have their own fucking schools...there are people still living today that had to use separate but equal facilities and most of their grandkids are the first generation to have real equality and opportunity. ONE generation out of 10 or 12 getting the same opportunities as whites is progress, but it is way too late after ending slavery for that to happen.... it is that which you and unsung should keep in perspective...