Last line of the "Official Statement" is crucial: The penalty of disqualification was waived by the Committee under Rule 33 as the Committee had previously reviewed the information and made its initial determination prior to the finish of the player’s round.
IF...
And this is a BIG IF...
If the rules official ok'd Tiger's drop, then why is he being penalized AT ALL?
So strange. Meanwhile the poor 14yr old gets a penalty on a day it took everyone 6 hrs to play :roll:
Augusta National Official Statement:
“Yesterday afternoon, the Rules Committee was made aware of a possible Rules violation that involved a drop by Tiger Woods on the 15th hole.
“In preparation for his fifth shot, the player dropped his ball in close proximity to where he had played his third shot in apparent conformance with Rule 26. After being prompted by a television viewer, the Rules Committee reviewed a video of the shot while he was playing the 18th hole. At that moment and based on that evidence, the Committee determined he had complied with the Rules.
“After he signed his scorecard, and in a television interview subsequent to the round, the player stated that he played further from the point than where he had played his third shot. Such action would constitute playing from the wrong place.
“The subsequent information provided by the player’s interview after he had completed play warranted further review and discussion with him this morning. After meeting with the player, it was determined that he had violated Rule 26, and he was assessed a two-stroke penalty. The penalty of disqualification was waived by the Committee under Rule 33 as the Committee had previously reviewed the information and made its initial determination prior to the finish of the player’s round.”
At hole #15, I took a drop that I thought was correct and in accordance with the rules. I was unaware at that time I had violated any rules. didn’t know I had taken an incorrect drop prior to signing my scorecard. Subsequently, I met with the Masters Committee Saturday morning and was advised they had reviewed the incident prior to the completion of my round. Their initial determination was that there was no violation, but they had additional concerns based on my post-round interview. After discussing the situation with them this morning, I was assessed a two-shot penalty. I understand and accept the penalty and respect the Committees’ decision.
0
Choccoloccotide
A grass shack nailed to a pinewood floor Posts: 1,140
I know Augusta National has had pr issues in the past dealing with social issues, but they look bad in this deal with Tiger. The integrity of the tournament has been tainted IMHO.
I know Augusta National has had pr issues in the past dealing with social issues, but they look bad in this deal with Tiger. The integrity of the tournament has been tainted IMHO.
Why? All governing bodies, USGA, R&A, PGA and European Tour were all in agreement on the decision. As mentioned, I am surprised he was not disqualified but I agree with their statement that if they knew prior to signing his scorecard and was deemed in line with the rule, then he should not be disqualified
To say he should withdraw after all governing bodies agree on a ruling, I think is fucking absurd and makes zero sense. None.
after thinking about this and hearing all sides especially the rules committee's reasons, i don't thing he should have been dq'ed but in the best interests of the game, tiger should have withdrawn...as a professional, he should know the rules re: where to play your penalty shot from a yellow staked water hazard
after thinking about this and hearing all sides especially the rules committee's reasons, i don't thing he should have been dq'ed but in the best interests of the game, tiger should have withdrawn...as a professional, he should know the rules re: where to play your penalty shot from a yellow staked water hazard
See, I agree he should have known, well more specifically, LaCava should have made sure he knew. He was clearly not thinking about where the ball went into the water but where it crossed. It's a mistake that should not have been made, but he was not alerted to the mistake and it was ruled okay until his comments.
I just don't think he should withdraw after the decision. Listen, I get this history of golf and the honesty behind it and I think that is very important. He made an honest mistake that could have had him disqualified. It didn't though. I get that golf is different from other sports, but if a center fielder traps a ball and an umpire calls an out, he is not going to say, "you know, I actually didn't catch that" put him on first (analogy probably isn't great, but point is, no one is going to go over the head of the ruling in any sport). Listen, I get the difference, but they ruled one way and I think you have to respect that. Golf is a very very very different game than it was when Bobby Jones ratted himself out. Augusta knew of it, ruled it okay and didn't tell him there was an issue until later.
i guess what really sticks in my craw is that he admits to dropping the ball 2 yards back...his thinking that if he hits the exact same shot that hit the pin, it will land right next to the hole...which it did...know did tiger knowingly ignore the rule or did he honestly think he was in the right? we'll never know but it seems like his intentions were good
frankly in all this, i haven't heard anyone's thoughts on joey...a good caddie will make sure that his player is playing the correct shot
if tiger wins, there won't be room in the record books to hold the asterisk
i guess what really sticks in my craw is that he admits to dropping the ball 2 yards back...his thinking that if he hits the exact same shot that hit the pin, it will land right next to the hole...which it did...know did tiger knowingly ignore the rule or did he honestly think he was in the right? we'll never know but it seems like his intentions were good
frankly in all this, i haven't heard anyone's thoughts on joey...a good caddie will make sure that his player is playing the correct shot
if tiger wins, there won't be room in the record books to hold the asterisk
I completely agree about Joey, and this isn't the first time shit like this has happened to his player.
But he clearly thought he was in the right. You think he would have described the situation in that detail if he knew he had violated the rules?
I don't think Tiger should dq himself. I understand the point of trying to get an unfair advantage, but the 2 shot penalty makes up for that. The rule for signing a correct score card but having the score card become wrong after an additional review is a good rule that allows him to stay in the tournament without any asterisk needed.
2003: 7/14 NJ ... 2006: 6/1 NJ, 6/3 NJ ... 2007: 8/5 IL ... 2008: 6/24 NY, 6/25 NY, 8/7 EV NJ ... 2009: 10/27 PA, 10/28 PA, 10/30 PA, 10/31 PA 2010: 5/20 NY, 5/21 NY ... 2011: 6/21 EV NY, 9/3 WI, 9/4 WI ... 2012: 9/2 PA, 9/22 GA ... 2013: 10/18 NY, 10/19 NY, 10/21 PA, 10/22 PA, 10/27 MD 2015: 9/23 NY, 9/26 NY ... 2016: 4/28 PA, 4/29 PA, 5/1 NY, 5/2 NY, 6/11 TN, 8/7 MA, 11/4 TOTD PA, 11/5 TOTD PA ... 2018: 8/10 WA 2022: 9/14 NJ ... 2024: 5/28 WA, 9/7 PA, 9/9 PA ---- http://imgur.com/a/nk0s7
I do think that its pretty messed up that people are allowed to call in and complain about a rules infringment. If the officials on the course don't see the infringement, then there was no infringement. No other sport lets fans/not fans call in, complain, and then listen to them and affect the game.
2003: 7/14 NJ ... 2006: 6/1 NJ, 6/3 NJ ... 2007: 8/5 IL ... 2008: 6/24 NY, 6/25 NY, 8/7 EV NJ ... 2009: 10/27 PA, 10/28 PA, 10/30 PA, 10/31 PA 2010: 5/20 NY, 5/21 NY ... 2011: 6/21 EV NY, 9/3 WI, 9/4 WI ... 2012: 9/2 PA, 9/22 GA ... 2013: 10/18 NY, 10/19 NY, 10/21 PA, 10/22 PA, 10/27 MD 2015: 9/23 NY, 9/26 NY ... 2016: 4/28 PA, 4/29 PA, 5/1 NY, 5/2 NY, 6/11 TN, 8/7 MA, 11/4 TOTD PA, 11/5 TOTD PA ... 2018: 8/10 WA 2022: 9/14 NJ ... 2024: 5/28 WA, 9/7 PA, 9/9 PA ---- http://imgur.com/a/nk0s7
I do think that its pretty messed up that people are allowed to call in and complain about a rules infringment. If the officials on the course don't see the infringement, then there was no infringement. No other sport lets fans/not fans call in, complain, and then listen to them and affect the game.
I didn't know this, but I guess it happens ALL the time.
I do think that its pretty messed up that people are allowed to call in and complain about a rules infringment. If the officials on the course don't see the infringement, then there was no infringement. No other sport lets fans/not fans call in, complain, and then listen to them and affect the game.
that's why they added/amended rule 30 a couple years back...and it's why tiger wasn't dq'ed
after thinking about this and hearing all sides especially the rules committee's reasons, i don't thing he should have been dq'ed but in the best interests of the game, tiger should have withdrawn...as a professional, he should know the rules re: where to play your penalty shot from a yellow staked water hazard
How excited are we for musicismylife's comments on this situation? I am pretty sure we will hear that he burned Augusta to the ground, ruined the game of golf forever and killed 37 babies.
Or perhaps he made the mistake because he was thinking about his kids and not the situation at hand?
Or perhaps he did it on purpose because golf just isn't important to him anymore?
0
Choccoloccotide
A grass shack nailed to a pinewood floor Posts: 1,140
I will say. NO ONE said anything on TV, on here, on Twitter until much much later.
except for that asshole that called augusta
which leads me to this thought...if this had been kevin streelman we wouldn't had ever seen the violation
Ha, yeah, I mean, how often do these things happen and go unnoticed? If Tiger does it, others clearly do.
I'm sure your right that these things do go unnoticed all the time, but are we still supposed to give a pass when the illegal act does get noticed. Baseball analogy: we all know that pitchers get away all the time with doctoring the ball, or that some players cork bats that are never caught. Are we to give them a slap on the wrist or worse yet, turn our heads just because everyone else does it and they never get caught?
I'm sure your right that these things do go unnoticed all the time, but are we still supposed to give a pass when the illegal act does get noticed. Baseball analogy: we all know that pitchers get away all the time with doctoring the ball, or that some players cork bats that are never caught. Are we to give them a slap on the wrist or worse yet, turn our heads just because everyone else does it and they never get caught?
No, but if MLB didn't slap a suspension on the player for the corked bat or doctored ball, they sure as hell aren't going to suspend them self.
They made a ruling and said it was fine, his words then got him a 2 stroke penalty. It's fair to say you think he should have been dq'ed. I thought he was going to be and said so here.
Faldo has done a 360 on this situation
0
Choccoloccotide
A grass shack nailed to a pinewood floor Posts: 1,140
I'm sure your right that these things do go unnoticed all the time, but are we still supposed to give a pass when the illegal act does get noticed. Baseball analogy: we all know that pitchers get away all the time with doctoring the ball, or that some players cork bats that are never caught. Are we to give them a slap on the wrist or worse yet, turn our heads just because everyone else does it and they never get caught?
No, but if MLB didn't slap a suspension on the player for the corked bat or doctored ball, they sure as hell aren't going to suspend them self.
They made a ruling and said it was fine, his words then got him a 2 stroke penalty. It's fair to say you think he should have been dq'ed. I thought he was going to be and said so here.
Faldo has done a 360 on this situation
I get what your saying. Did you ever watch The legend of Bagger Vance? The scene at the end where Matt Damon penalizes himself b/c he saw the ball move 1/4 inch. He still tied Bobby Jones and Walter Hagan but could have won nonetheless. That's how I see the game of golf.
Comments
The penalty of disqualification was waived by the Committee under Rule 33 as the Committee had previously reviewed the information and made its initial determination prior to the finish of the player’s round.
IF...
And this is a BIG IF...
If the rules official ok'd Tiger's drop, then why is he being penalized AT ALL?
So strange. Meanwhile the poor 14yr old gets a penalty on a day it took everyone 6 hrs to play :roll:
Augusta National Official Statement:
“Yesterday afternoon, the Rules Committee was made aware of a possible Rules violation that involved a drop by Tiger Woods on the 15th hole.
“In preparation for his fifth shot, the player dropped his ball in close proximity to where he had played his third shot in apparent conformance with Rule 26. After being prompted by a television viewer, the Rules Committee reviewed a video of the shot while he was playing the 18th hole. At that moment and based on that evidence, the Committee determined he had complied with the Rules.
“After he signed his scorecard, and in a television interview subsequent to the round, the player stated that he played further from the point than where he had played his third shot. Such action would constitute playing from the wrong place.
“The subsequent information provided by the player’s interview after he had completed play warranted further review and discussion with him this morning. After meeting with the player, it was determined that he had violated Rule 26, and he was assessed a two-stroke penalty. The penalty of disqualification was waived by the Committee under Rule 33 as the Committee had previously reviewed the information and made its initial determination prior to the finish of the player’s round.”
7.9.03~9.28.04~10.1.05~5.12.06~5.13.06~5.27.06~5.28.06
8.5.08(EV)~10.9.09~5.21.10~6.20.11(EV)~7.5.11(EV)~7.9.11(EV)
11.21.13~8.27.16(EV)~11.14.16(TOTD)~4.13.20~9.27.20~9.26.21~10.2.21
2.15.22 (EV)~2.25.22 (EV)~2.27.22 (EV)~5.3.22~5.7.22~9.17.24~9.29.24
+1. Sports controversy...I love it.
Go Freddie! (and Tiger)
DEGENERATE FUK
This place is dead
"THERE ARE NO CLIQUES, ONLY THOSE WHO DON'T JOIN THE FUN" - Empty circa 2015
"Kfsbho&$thncds" - F Me In the Brain - circa 2015
wow
just wow
At hole #15, I took a drop that I thought was correct and in accordance with the rules. I was unaware at that time I had violated any rules. didn’t know I had taken an incorrect drop prior to signing my scorecard. Subsequently, I met with the Masters Committee Saturday morning and was advised they had reviewed the incident prior to the completion of my round. Their initial determination was that there was no violation, but they had additional concerns based on my post-round interview. After discussing the situation with them this morning, I was assessed a two-shot penalty. I understand and accept the penalty and respect the Committees’ decision.
Why? All governing bodies, USGA, R&A, PGA and European Tour were all in agreement on the decision. As mentioned, I am surprised he was not disqualified but I agree with their statement that if they knew prior to signing his scorecard and was deemed in line with the rule, then he should not be disqualified
To say he should withdraw after all governing bodies agree on a ruling, I think is fucking absurd and makes zero sense. None.
Now go win the thing (not likely)
See, I agree he should have known, well more specifically, LaCava should have made sure he knew. He was clearly not thinking about where the ball went into the water but where it crossed. It's a mistake that should not have been made, but he was not alerted to the mistake and it was ruled okay until his comments.
I just don't think he should withdraw after the decision. Listen, I get this history of golf and the honesty behind it and I think that is very important. He made an honest mistake that could have had him disqualified. It didn't though. I get that golf is different from other sports, but if a center fielder traps a ball and an umpire calls an out, he is not going to say, "you know, I actually didn't catch that" put him on first (analogy probably isn't great, but point is, no one is going to go over the head of the ruling in any sport). Listen, I get the difference, but they ruled one way and I think you have to respect that. Golf is a very very very different game than it was when Bobby Jones ratted himself out. Augusta knew of it, ruled it okay and didn't tell him there was an issue until later.
frankly in all this, i haven't heard anyone's thoughts on joey...a good caddie will make sure that his player is playing the correct shot
if tiger wins, there won't be room in the record books to hold the asterisk
I completely agree about Joey, and this isn't the first time shit like this has happened to his player.
But he clearly thought he was in the right. You think he would have described the situation in that detail if he knew he had violated the rules?
Guan on Tiger "Rules are rules"
I LOVE THIS KID
2010: 5/20 NY, 5/21 NY ... 2011: 6/21 EV NY, 9/3 WI, 9/4 WI ... 2012: 9/2 PA, 9/22 GA ... 2013: 10/18 NY, 10/19 NY, 10/21 PA, 10/22 PA, 10/27 MD
2015: 9/23 NY, 9/26 NY ... 2016: 4/28 PA, 4/29 PA, 5/1 NY, 5/2 NY, 6/11 TN, 8/7 MA, 11/4 TOTD PA, 11/5 TOTD PA ... 2018: 8/10 WA
2022: 9/14 NJ ... 2024: 5/28 WA, 9/7 PA, 9/9 PA ---- http://imgur.com/a/nk0s7
nope but it is strange to me that he thought he was in the right
nice!
Oh, I agree with. Like I said, he must have been thinking about where it crossed and not where it went in. Can't explain why.
I will say. NO ONE said anything on TV, on here, on Twitter until much much later.
2010: 5/20 NY, 5/21 NY ... 2011: 6/21 EV NY, 9/3 WI, 9/4 WI ... 2012: 9/2 PA, 9/22 GA ... 2013: 10/18 NY, 10/19 NY, 10/21 PA, 10/22 PA, 10/27 MD
2015: 9/23 NY, 9/26 NY ... 2016: 4/28 PA, 4/29 PA, 5/1 NY, 5/2 NY, 6/11 TN, 8/7 MA, 11/4 TOTD PA, 11/5 TOTD PA ... 2018: 8/10 WA
2022: 9/14 NJ ... 2024: 5/28 WA, 9/7 PA, 9/9 PA ---- http://imgur.com/a/nk0s7
I didn't know this, but I guess it happens ALL the time.
except for that asshole that called augusta
which leads me to this thought...if this had been kevin streelman we wouldn't had ever seen the violation
that's why they added/amended rule 30 a couple years back...and it's why tiger wasn't dq'ed
Ha, yeah, I mean, how often do these things happen and go unnoticed? If Tiger does it, others clearly do.
Exactly.
Or perhaps he made the mistake because he was thinking about his kids and not the situation at hand?
Or perhaps he did it on purpose because golf just isn't important to him anymore?
I'm sure your right that these things do go unnoticed all the time, but are we still supposed to give a pass when the illegal act does get noticed. Baseball analogy: we all know that pitchers get away all the time with doctoring the ball, or that some players cork bats that are never caught. Are we to give them a slap on the wrist or worse yet, turn our heads just because everyone else does it and they never get caught?
No, but if MLB didn't slap a suspension on the player for the corked bat or doctored ball, they sure as hell aren't going to suspend them self.
They made a ruling and said it was fine, his words then got him a 2 stroke penalty. It's fair to say you think he should have been dq'ed. I thought he was going to be and said so here.
Faldo has done a 360 on this situation
I get what your saying. Did you ever watch The legend of Bagger Vance? The scene at the end where Matt Damon penalizes himself b/c he saw the ball move 1/4 inch. He still tied Bobby Jones and Walter Hagan but could have won nonetheless. That's how I see the game of golf.
tiger apologists ... hahaha ... i am pretty sure if this was sergio - i wouldn't be reading the same comments ...
"Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon