Direct hit

aerial

Cosmo wrote:

aerial wrote:

IRS Frustration
Person gets letter from IRS saying they owe money.....of course IRS waits a year before they send the information so as to add on entrust I am sure. They show a list of items that were not claimed...
1...income spouse had that this person did not know about....
2...a forgiven debt, which falls under income

Problem
Can’t contact ex spouse because new mate is insecure
Forgiven debt from a company you never heard of
Solution
1..call IRS listen to automated answer machine press 2 because your not sure who the hell is the right person to talk to stay on hold about 10min
2....they say call another number..listen to automated answer machine press 5 wait 10 more min. till someone comes on the line......then explain you don’t know who the Portfolio Recovery service is
3....they say to call th Portfolio Recovery service so they can to send you a form that the IRS needs
4....Call portfolio and ask them to send form...they say “you need to pay this debt” (if I did owe this debt and they for gave it why are they trying to collect it after turning it in as forgiven?)I tell them I do not own them anything and I need a form for the IRS...they say no
5.... I research Portfolio Recovery Service on the internet....they are all over the net because they are doing the same thing to others. The ones that take Portfolio Recovery Service to court ends up with Portfolio Recovery Service dropping the whole thing...because they can’t prove people owed them the money in the first place.
6.....Call IRS back listen to automated answer machine....press 3 wait for human to answer....as I
took a shower
washed my hair
shaved my legs
and got dressed
still waiting
7....10 to 15 min. later finally person answers I tell her my story once again...and fill her in on what I have found out about the company that says I owed them money and ask if the IRS is investigating them...of course she does not know...so I ask her if any one can claim a forgiven debt to the IRS without the IRS investigating who they are or if there even legit.....she gets pissy with me so I ask to speak to a manager or supervisor....she says there is not one available right now, I say I will hold she says no and hangs up on me.....now I am PISSED
8...I call the Treasury Department in Washington DC and they give me a number
9....call the number and they give me another number
10...I call that number and a real person answers!
11....This is a Criminal Investigator in Miami...very nice man....I tell him the story...he says he will check it out but in the end he sends it to his supervisor and if they have bigger fish to fry there will not be anything done...FUCK!.....I am really frustrated now
That was my day off 5hrs trying to get information from the IRS!

I waited 2 months before I followed up with the investigator who had done nothing...guess he never had time..... he had another local investigator call me and I had to fax info....and it goes on and on
Here is the topper to the story...The IRS has subcontracted collection agencies to collect owed tax money....guess what I found out looking around on the net....Portfolio Recovery Service is one of the company’s they have hired!
Maybe this guy had gone thru some of this IRS Bullshit! It gets very frustrating!...and I am not a TAX CHEAT!....you think they could make it any harder for a person to try and be honest?
I condensed this story. It is MUCH longer.
I feel this guys pain but please don’t mistake that for agreeing on how he dealt with it

...
Wait a minute...
....
You're a CHICK?!?!?!

:? I typed all that and that is all you got?

_

Cosmo wrote:

And as far a Viet Nam vet... he was my age.

Dude. I had no idea you are that old. :shock:

puremagic

CJMST3K wrote:

puremagic wrote:

What makes the difference if a terrorist is homegrown or not when results are the same.

Two things:
-The "perceived" intent.
-The supporters

puremagic wrote:

Too kill, too cause fear and panic, too alter peoples' prospective of others, and, too be remembered as an instrument of death and destruction on a massive scale for a CAUSE.

I think this deranged pilot wanted to kill IRS employees in particular, and he was acting alone.

Al Qaida, on the other hand, wants to kill random people to strike fear in the entire US population, and they have a large financial and idealogical supporters who directly help this person or people do this.

These are two different goals with two different support structures. I put them in two different categories because they act in two different ways for two different ends.


Of course, they are both terrorizing - but I don't mind a qualifier before the word "terrorist".

He killed random PEOPLE, everyday, tax paying people who got up and went to work at the IRS. Yet you're justifying his actions knowing that he was at fault for not paying his taxes. You're justifying and supporting his target simply because we all don't like pay taxes.

I gave you an example of a man in Afghanistan who straps on backpack full of explosives, walks to a village marketplace to kill two soldiers at the cost of 50 of his own people. Do you realize that you did not even acknowledge the fact that you were responding about an individual. Your immediate thought was to associate the man with a designated terrorist organization, thereby, you could not conceive of any personal reason why this man could commit such an act. The same thing you did with your listing of individuals/groups.

As long was we continue to rationalize who was behind the trigger, we will always be one step behind the homegrown terrorist. We have a deep seeded need to believe people like Newt Grinch, Charles Stuart and Susan Smith before looking at ourselves and that is dangerous when you look at the anthrax individual.

Godfather.

keeponrockin wrote:

Godfather. wrote:

watch out you might winde up on a goverment watch list
EZ Eddie I never said I have any compassion for the guy. and BTW people kill for money every day.
all I was saying who are we to judge anybody, let the law do it.

Godfather.

Do you feel the same about Al-Queda (sp)?

no, so far I have been called a terriest sympthiser and that I should be watched by some goverment agency
because I will not judge this guy in the plane as you all have. forgive my spelling

Godfather.

Sludge Factory

Cosmo wrote:

Sludge Factory wrote:

Guess what? Filling out your taxes is VOLUNTARY! It even says so on the fucking forms. But being coerced into paying them because the IRS will sick the FBI on you if you don't is not a form of voluntary compliance. It is duress. Just because the system is set up for people to have to pay taxes does not mean that it is actually constitutional. The U.S. survived the first 100 years of its existence without an income tax at all because no one had crafted a good enough way to subvert the constitution to be able to apply income taxes on the citizens.

I do not think this guy was a liar and cheat as you label him just because he didn't file his taxes. Constitutionally he was within his rights.

...
Guess what? Filing a tax return (Form 1040) is voluentary... paying the taxes on your income isn't. The Tax Return is what you get back if you have been withheld too much... or your payment if you haven't had enough withheld. You cannot voluenteer to not pay taxes.
Lying on your tax returns is lying... cheating on your tax return is cheating. Interpreting the law as you see fit... is not following the law.
...
And last time I checked.. there hasn't been a repeal of the 16th Amendment. Therefore... like it or not... the 16th Amendment is part of our Constitution.
...
So... you can go ahead and not pay your share of the taxes and interpret Constitutional Law as you see it. But, know this... you will be held up to adhere to the laws of this land in the justice system... according to that Constitution... not your opinion of the Constitution.
Me? Not so much. I don't mind paying taxes because I like things such as the U.S. Marines and Air Force and Yosemite and Yellowstone... and don't want IRS matters in my life.

Like I said earlier (but after my first post you are quoting) the 16th amendment wasn't necessarily ratified under legal means but anytime it is brought up it is swept under the rug before anyone really has a chance to look at it. To say that the income tax goes directly to the things you suggests overlooks the fact that the income tax is one of the more totalitarian of all possible taxes because it implies that the government owns the lives and labor of the citizens it is supposed to represent.

There are other venues available to fund the federal governement for the services you mention that you enjoy: excise taxes, non-protectionist tarrifs, and massive cuts in our current government spending. Everyone always overlooks the fact that the United States government operated without revenues made on the income tax. But hey, I'm not very good at explaining this so I'll just let this column that I saved that Ron Paul wrote on May 7, 2001 do the talking for me.

On May 7, 2001, Ron Paul wrote the following column:

The Case Against the Income Tax

Could America exist without an income tax? The idea seems radical, yet in truth America did just fine without a federal income tax for the first 126 years of its history. Prior to 1913, the government operated with revenues raised through tariffs, excise taxes, and property taxes, without ever touching a worker’s paycheck. In the late 1800s, when Congress first attempted to impose an income tax, the notion of taxing a citizen’s hard work was considered radical! Public outcry ensued; more importantly, the Supreme Court ruled the income tax unconstitutional. Only with passage of the 16th Amendment did Congress gain the ability to tax the productive endeavors of its citizens.

Yet don’t we need an income tax to fund the important functions of the federal government? You may be surprised to know that the income tax accounts for only approximately one-third of federal revenue. Only 10 years ago, the federal budget was roughly one-third less than it is today. Surely we could find ways to cut spending back to 1990 levels, especially when the Treasury has single year tax surpluses for the past several years. So perhaps the idea of an America without an income tax is not so radical after all.

The harmful effects of the income tax are obvious. First and foremost, it has enabled government to expand far beyond its proper constitutional limits, regulating virtually every aspect of our lives. It has given government a claim on our lives and work, destroying our privacy in the process. It takes billions of dollars out of the legitimate private economy, with most Americans giving more than a third of everything they make to the federal government. This economic drain destroys jobs and penalizes productive behavior. The ridiculous complexity of the tax laws makes compliance a nightmare for both individuals and businesses. All things considered, our Founders would be dismayed by the income tax mess and the tragic loss of liberty which results.

America without an income tax would be far more prosperous and far more free, but we must be prepared to fight to regain the liberty we have lost incrementally over the past century. I recently introduced “The Liberty Amendment,” legislation which would repeal the 16th Amendment and effectively abolish the income tax. I truly believe that real tax reform, reform that so many frustrated Americans desperately want, requires bold legislation that challenges the Washington mind set. Congress talks about reform, but the current tax debate really involves nothing of substance. Both parties are content to continue tinkering with the edges of the tax code to please various special interests. The Liberty Amendment is an attempt to eliminate the system altogether, forcing Congress to find a simple and fair way to collect limited federal revenues. Most of all, the Liberty Amendment is an initiative aimed at reducing the size and scope of the federal government.

Is it impossible to end the income tax? I don’t believe so. In fact, I believe a serious groundswell movement of disaffected taxpayers is growing in this country. Millions of Americans are fed up with the current tax system, and they will bring pressure on Congress. Some sidestep Congress completely, bringing legal challenges questioning the validity of the tax code and the 16th Amendment itself. Ultimately, the Liberty Amendment could serve as a flashpoint for these millions of voices.

I tried googling for it since I can't really link my copy that I printed out and this is what I came up with. You need to scroll down a bit to see the stuff I pasted if you are interested:

http://www.ronpaul.com/2009-04-15/end-t ... h-the-irs/

michelleelise

C'mon.

If there was no income tax this guy would have been pissing and moaning about his property taxes. The particular issue he decided to fixate on is not the problem - the fact that he fixated and couldn't get past it is.

aerial

michelle822 wrote:

C'mon.

If there was no income tax this guy would have been pissing and moaning about his property taxes. The particular issue he decided to fixate on is not the problem - the fact that he fixated and couldn't get past it is.

Obviously you have never dealt with the IRS

michelleelise

aerial wrote:

michelle822 wrote:

C'mon.

If there was no income tax this guy would have been pissing and moaning about his property taxes. The particular issue he decided to fixate on is not the problem - the fact that he fixated and couldn't get past it is.

Obviously you have never dealt with the IRS

Unfortunately, I have, and as an engineering contractor, even - which is what this guy was.

This is how I know firsthand that if you don't fill out the correct forms the IRS will calculate what you owe for you and mail you a bill

michelleelise

aerial wrote:

Obviously you have never dealt with the IRS

Raise your hand if you've had to deal with the IRS and did not use it as an excuse to commit mass murder. :wave:

dunkman

rebornFixer wrote:

dunkman wrote:

film director Kevin Smith was his co-pilot... that was as high as the plane would go.

Horrible.

at least you appreciate a quick fire joke unlike the other bore-atrons.

aerial

michelle822 wrote:

aerial wrote:

michelle822 wrote:

C'mon.

If there was no income tax this guy would have been pissing and moaning about his property taxes. The particular issue he decided to fixate on is not the problem - the fact that he fixated and couldn't get past it is.

Obviously you have never dealt with the IRS

Unfortunately, I have, and as an engineering contractor, even - which is what this guy was.

This is how I know firsthand that if you don't fill out the correct forms the IRS will calculate what you owe for you and mail you a bill

That maybe but
The IRS is not always right
And it is not always easy to get information from them...that’s why people have to hire lawyers....but if you can’t afford one, well then your screwed and they are Right

Cosmo

aerial wrote:

...
:? I typed all that and that is all you got?

...
Caught me off guard. But, that explains the constant overuse of the 'Have a Nice Day' face derivatives.
...
As to your anecdotal example, I have one of my own...
Back when I needed a down payment on my house, I withdrew $30K from my Salaried Savings program at work. These funds were taxed, then placed into the account.
I took the $30K and dumped it into my meager savings account which drove the balance up to $4nK. I used this interium account as a staging area for escrow.
The IRS caught the descrepency and audited my tax return for that year because it said I owed on the unreported $30K.
I got the required documentation from my company's benefits department, along with a letter explaining the withdrawal. I also attached my 1040 tax return (copies) and 1099 forms, statements from the savings plan, my savings passbook and the escrow payments documents to my evidence file.
Called the IRS and arranged an appointment at the Long Beach office that worked around my work schedule and showed up.
After about 10 minutes... the audit was cleared. I had claimed the interest paid to the savings account as stated in the INT-1099 forms i had received from the company and the bank where the saving account was.
...
I understand the reasoning for the audit... knew my taxes were clear of any errors (intentional or unintentional) and that there was nothing to fear... collected the proper documents as evidence and it was done.

NoK

rebornFixer wrote:

For what its worth, I agree with you. This sort of act does not really fit the current use of the term (and I am not refering to the persecution complex of people like NoK, who apparently thinks everyone loathes Muslims and loves "white men") ... This unstable individual probably wanted to call attention to his plight, but its not clear to me that he had a specific political goal to terrorize or coerse in mind. This is in contrast to someone like the Oklahoma bomber, who commited an act that IS widely referred to as terrorism. This guy was lashing out, but its not clear to me that he had coersion via fear in mind. The sorts of people who shoot up post offices are commiting horrible crimes, but its not accurate to call all forms of mass murder terrorism.

Do you think its mature to constantly try to bait people? Or perhaps you get off on it? Either way its incredibly lame.

If your officials are stupid enough to think the phrase "link to terrorism" is a logical phrase then that is your problem. The fact is if a muslim had done this for the exact same reasons it would be called a terrorist act, especially by YOU.

Whichever way you or anyone on this board tries to spin the facts, terrorism does not have to be linked to a POLITICAL goal, it could be any type of message. The guy drove a fucking plane into a specific building for specific reasons, killed people and injured many others, to get people to see his message. If anything he is trying to coerce the US government to change some laws. How is this any different to 911? Terrorists drove planes into a building to inflict casualties and get your government to understand their message (which in that case was to dismantle bases in the middle east, stop supporting Israel, etc..).

But go ahead and continue to spin it.

Cosmo

Sludge Factory wrote:

...Is it impossible to end the income tax? I don’t believe so. In fact, I believe a serious groundswell movement of disaffected taxpayers is growing in this country. Millions of Americans are fed up with the current tax system, and they will bring pressure on Congress. Some sidestep Congress completely, bringing legal challenges questioning the validity of the tax code and the 16th Amendment itself. Ultimately, the Liberty Amendment could serve as a flashpoint for these millions of voices.

I tried googling for it since I can't really link my copy that I printed out and this is what I came up with. You need to scroll down a bit to see the stuff I pasted if you are interested:

http://www.ronpaul.com/2009-04-15/end-t ... h-the-irs/

...
Great. When Ron Paul changes the Constitution to repeal the 16th Amendment... then, I'll stop paying Income Taxes.
Until then... I am not going to use opinion and debate points justify my not paying my share of taxes and risk jailtime and fines.
You see... I am a basic law and order guy. I like having law and order in my society.

rebornFixer

NoK wrote:

Do you think its mature to constantly try to bait people? Or perhaps you get off on it? Either way its incredibly lame.

If your officials are stupid enough to think the phrase "link to terrorism" is a logical phrase then that is your problem. The fact is if a muslim had done this for the exact same reasons it would be called a terrorist act, especially by YOU.

Whichever way you or anyone on this board tries to spin the facts, terrorism does not have to be linked to a POLITICAL goal, it could be any type of message. The guy drove a fucking plane into a specific building for specific reasons, killed people and injured many others, to get people to see his message. If anything he is trying to coerce the US government to change some laws. How is this any different to 911? Terrorists drove planes into a building to inflict casualties and get your government to understand their message (which in that case was to dismantle bases in the middle east, stop supporting Israel, etc..).

But go ahead and continue to spin it.

Actually, what's lame is the near constant stream of racial references that people casually toss out there whenever the words "terrorism" and "Israel" come up. If you don't want to be baited, knock that shit off. Its goddamn tiring. I can't stop anyone from posting what they want to post, but I can have a reaction. You want to dub this terrorism? Fine, power to ya. The argument can be made. Why this topic called for a big rant about Muslims is an open question. Me and at least one other poster argued that the word terrorism doesn't really apply here, and neither one of us evoked Muslims as the reason. And I am not American! Shocking, I know.

aerial

Cosmo wrote:

aerial wrote:

...
:? I typed all that and that is all you got?

...
Caught me off guard. But, that explains the constant overuse of the 'Have a Nice Day' face derivatives.
...
As to your anecdotal example, I have one of my own...
Back when I needed a down payment on my house, I withdrew $30K from my Salaried Savings program at work. These funds were taxed, then placed into the account.
I took the $30K and dumped it into my meager savings account which drove the balance up to $4nK. I used this interium account as a staging area for escrow.
The IRS caught the descrepency and audited my tax return for that year because it said I owed on the unreported $30K.
I got the required documentation from my company's benefits department, along with a letter explaining the withdrawal. I also attached my 1040 tax return (copies) and 1099 forms, statements from the savings plan, my savings passbook and the escrow payments documents to my evidence file.
Called the IRS and arranged an appointment at the Long Beach office that worked around my work schedule and showed up.
After about 10 minutes... the audit was cleared. I had claimed the interest paid to the savings account as stated in the INT-1099 forms i had received from the company and the bank where the saving account was.
...
I understand the reasoning for the audit... knew my taxes were clear of any errors (intentional or unintentional) and that there was nothing to fear... collected the proper documents as evidence and it was done.

I am really happy it worked out for you.
In my case it looks as though any shit company can contact the IRS and give false information with no proof....so they and the Credit bureau are not held to the standards we are as they are not required to be accountable. They report what they want and put the burden on the American citizens to deal with it....if they are proven wrong there is no punishment for them at all....Seems to me the two Bureau’s that have the most impact on ones life should have to be accountable in some way. That’s why it gets so frustrating dealing with them.

_

michelle822 wrote:

aerial wrote:

Obviously you have never dealt with the IRS

Raise your hand if you've had to deal with the IRS and did not use it as an excuse to commit mass murder. :wave:

NoK

rebornFixer wrote:

Actually, what's lame is the near constant stream of racial references that people casually toss out there whenever the words "terrorism" and "Israel" come up. If you don't want to be baited, knock that shit off. Its goddamn tiring. I can't stop anyone from posting what they want to post, but I can have a reaction. You want to dub this terrorism? Fine, power to ya. The argument can be made. Why this topic called for a big rant about Muslims is an open question. Me and at least one other poster argued that the word terrorism doesn't really apply here, and neither one of us evoked Muslims as the reason. And I am not American! Shocking, I know.

Who do you think you are to tell me what I can or cannot post? I didn't call you out specifically in my post I posted an opinion (which mind you was 2-3 sentences and not a BIG rant as you say) but you went ahead and called me out specifically as a person who thought everyone loathed muslims and loved the white guy. I hope my posts continue to get more and more tiring for you.

Besides if you cannot see the major bias in the media when it comes to acts committed by muslims vs. acts committed by non-muslims then you might as well be blind.

Plus I know you're not American, you are Canadian. But the way you jump straight up to defend all the shit America does they might as well give you the citizenship or at least a number 1 supporter sticker/t-shirt.

OffHeGoes29

arthurdent wrote:

Stupid Tim McVeigh wannabe. I'm only surprised it hasn't happened sooner. With Obama as prez, the right-wing yahoos are climbing outta the woodwork.

I know, only if he was a liberal he would have never of done this..... :roll:

rebornFixer

NoK wrote:

I hope my posts continue to get more and more tiring for you.

Well, at this rate you're getting your wish. I've said my piece. You seem like a knowledgeable guy, but you know nothing about me personally or my views on American foreign policy. Your biases a lot more transparent. Enjoy them, they obviously serve some sort of function.