socialism

i shit and i stink

Commy wrote:

A socialist society has individuals that want to be a part of the society, is motivated by a desire to help your fellow human beings. Life is spent working together, not against one another.

In theory my marriage, and most people's out there, should be like that. It's hard enough to do it with just two people working together all the time, let alone a whole country! The theory is wonderful, but the reality is often terribly flawed, ask my wife...

RR14171

Drifting is doing just that.
Acting like you're incredibly repressed by the government is inane and completely false.
If there were no society, civilization, you would be crouched in your basement with a shotgun right now. You don't like the modern world? Go up to f'in Walden Pond like Thoreau and do without all the luxuries of modern life if they're so taxing on you. (pun intended) Paranoid anyone?
A lot of places have it a lot worse. Get real.
Well, anyway, I hear American Gladiators is back on!

cincybearcat

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

cincybearcat wrote:

[ I would also suggest than that no one that hasn't been to America is allowed to comment on how bad it is. Boy, there will be nothing to talk about on this thread.

blame your foreign policy for that. you forget that whatever the US does internationally affects many more people than just americans. that is why people have such a negative opinion of americans.

Nope, unless you've been here, you can't say a word. That's the rules previously set by Smellyman.

I didn't forget anything, I'm just following the new rules.

yahamita

Mortality wrote:

Drifting has it right folks.

He usually does...He must stay up hours into the night researching and typing..thanks for all your info!

fife

AndiM wrote:

And again I get confused by American notions of Europe being "socialist". I always considered Socialism to be a sort of undemocratic, totalitarian form of government and not what I see here in Europe or in Canada for that matter . But maybe that's rather a language issue with English not being my first language.

i can see why you think that as usually when people say socialism as a government it does beccome somewhat dictatorish

Smellyman

cincybearcat wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

cincybearcat wrote:

[ I would also suggest than that no one that hasn't been to America is allowed to comment on how bad it is. Boy, there will be nothing to talk about on this thread.

blame your foreign policy for that. you forget that whatever the US does internationally affects many more people than just americans. that is why people have such a negative opinion of americans.

Nope, unless you've been here, you can't say a word. That's the rules previously set by Smellyman.

I didn't forget anything, I'm just following the new rules.

How is it you can say one system is the best without experiencing another one? Sorry, but I would never be that arrogant.

And he doesn't have the means to travel, after he sings the praises of free markets and making as much money as he wants to? That if you work hard you are rewarded? He must be one of those lazy welfare liberal losers....then

AND I was talking about supposedly spooky "socialism" with him. You can talk about foreign policy all you want. We all get to experience that.

But thanks for taking up Mortality's battle for him and making no sense.

OffHeGoes29

i shit and i stink wrote:

Commy wrote:

A socialist society has individuals that want to be a part of the society, is motivated by a desire to help your fellow human beings. Life is spent working together, not against one another.

In theory my marriage, and most people's out there, should be like that. It's hard enough to do it with just two people working together all the time, let alone a whole country! The theory is wonderful, but the reality is often terribly flawed, ask my wife...

THIS IS THE MOST INTELLIGENT THING I HAVE EVER READ ON THE TRAIN.............

good analogy

breath123

ever use a public library?

call 911?

send a child to public school?

have your garbage picked up?

Used the post office?

driven on a smooth paved road?

taken public trasportation?

If you answered yes to any of these questions, you are socialist.

that is to say, everybody pays in, everybody benefits.

If that's socialism I'll take it.

Songburst

breath123 wrote:

ever use a public library?

call 911?

send a child to public school?

have your garbage picked up?

Used the post office?

driven on a smooth paved road?

taken public trasportation?

If you answered yes to any of these questions, you are socialist.

that is to say, everybody pays in, everybody benefits.

If that's socialism I'll take it.

Socialism is all well and good for things like garbage pickup and mailing letters and national defense but we are talking about health care here. Somebody should be able to get rich off of the misfortune of others --- it's the American way.

Lauri

OffHeGoes29 wrote:

Europeans are just a better adopted culture for socialism. Most Europeans live modestly compaired to Americans, and it would be hard for the average slob to give up his large house, gas guzzling SUV, and half their pay to taxes. I like the way Europe does things, but that works for Europe, not here. There would be a fundimental change in the way we live here....and I don't ever see that coming....sadly.

This isn't the reason, it's the symptom. Why do Americans dislike socialism AND cling to big houses and gas guzzling SUVs is a better question. The fact is the U.S. was born and raised on capitalism. We're only a few generations away from pioneer days, when people ventured out west with nothing and tried to build themselves up (of course people tend to forget the government gave land away out there for anyone willing to go...). We're a country of immigrants who came from nothing and used entrepreneurship and ingenuity to establish themselves. If you think about it, historically, it's been pretty hard to be an American. You really have (had?) to be quite determined and self sufficient to survive. People cling to that because they're proud of it. If you ask someone why they are against government assistance of any kind, they might cite the fact that their grand parents came to this country with nothing but the shirts on their backs and managed to create a lucrative business, so why shouldn't everyone else. Or if they managed to provide health care for their kids, why shouldn't someone else. Most people aren't saying these things out of privilege but quite the opposite- even if their generation had things easy, they know their parents or grandparents did not.

It's also the "country of immigrants" thing that makes socialism, and a lot of other things that work in Europe, work not so well in the U.S. It is a REALLY big and diverse country. It's definitely no Sweden, where everyone is the same race and religion and it's so small there's a good chance you're related to the guy down the street. People in the U.S. do not necessarily identify with each other, even if they have the same problems. It makes it hard to convince people that they should be contributing to the overall well-being.

Finally, Americans equate socialism with communism, and communism was the enemy of the state for decades. I can see that if you grew up being taught to fear commies, you would resist the concept of socialism.