Its a possible sequence of events... however this paragraph:
"As for the key, I believe it was the spare as others have pointed out, and I think there's little to no doubt that was planted by Manitowoc Sheriff's Deputies. I don't think the reason is exactly as you would think though. I think they were worried they didn't have enough evidence to put Avery away, I think they were concerned he was going to go free, and I think they got desperate in trying to convict him. I also think the bullet with Halbach's DNA was planted. It wasn't blood DNA, after all, just "unspecified" DNA."
This to me invalidates every piece of information connecting to Avery. If law enforcement, who is tasked to be impartial and find the truth in the way of evidence/clues, tampers and plants evidence... who knows where it stops and starts? In this situation, you have a very valid/real motive for MC authorities to want to put Avery away and the timing was impeccable. The whole case is contaminated and there should be an overall sense of reasonable doubt. Its way beyond getting off on a technicality. This is criminal misconduct on the part of the authorities.
Who knows what/if Dassey saw or did anything? I have seen/heard like 7 versions. In this version he was invited to the fire by a guy burning/trying to hide a corpse (didnt smell anything) and saw body parts?
Another very important point the prosecution could not deliver: Motive What was Steven Averys motive to kill Halbach? He was in prison for many years and he knew how easy he could go back. Would he risk going back to prison, instead of living quite happy with a new built family? Plus, he is just ahaed of a lawsuit against the police, and could get more than $30 million out of it. More than enough to start fresh without any financial sorrow. So why risk all this without any motive?
Speaking about motive, why did the police never look into anyone else for having a motive? Look at the family members, look at the ex-boyfriend - that is standard procedure when a murder took place. These are the most logical places to look when searching for a murderer, because these are the people where often a motive can be found. But not even after the ex admitted he wondrously found out the password for Teresas cellphone, and it is proven that messages definitely got deleted, police gets suspicious.
Another party also had a clear motive for Steven Avery to get sentences; The police and some officers. The 36-million-Dollar lawsuit could ruin some officers, what better motive than money and fear of losing everything can there be?
As for the evidence planted, I think we can be sure of the following: - the key was clearly planted, most likely by officer Lenk - the same with the bullet with the DNA on it in the garage. Also Mr. Lenk involved. - the blood in the car and the car itself on the property. Again, Lenk is an active part when the car is found. And to find Stevens blood, but no DNA, would make him Avery criminial mastermind to achive this. Plus, the blood tube in the evidence room was used which is a clear indication police was involved.
Avery wasn't very smart. I think he thought he could get away with it.
He almost did.
Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago 2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy 2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE) 2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston 2020: Oakland, Oakland:2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana 2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
Avery wasn't very smart. I think he thought he could get away with it.
He almost did.
I agree that he wasn't very smart. And if he did kill her (I don't know if he did it or not), he surely would have made mistakes. But exactly this is the thing. He would not have been able to clean his room / the garage so no DNA could be found. He would not have been so smart to clean all of his DNA from the car (and leave some obvious blood tracks back). If he did kill her, the police made a huge mistake by obviously planting some evidence to frame him.
Avery wasn't very smart. I think he thought he could get away with it.
He almost did.
I agree that he wasn't very smart. And if he did kill her (I don't know if he did it or not), he surely would have made mistakes. But exactly this is the thing. He would not have been able to clean his room / the garage so no DNA could be found. He would not have been so smart to clean all of his DNA from the car (and leave some obvious blood tracks back). If he did kill her, the police made a huge mistake by obviously planting some evidence to frame him.
He didn't clean all of his DNA from the car. His blood was all over it (the preservative was NOT found in the blood stains by the FBI) and they got his DNA off of sweat stains that he left in the car and on the hood latch.
Even if we say that the blood was planted they still got DNA from his sweat.
He called to specifically request that she come to his property...he used his sister's name to lead her in because she had told her boss that she never wanted to visit that property again because of him. Her burned body was right behind his house. His DNA (via sweat) was on her car.
That alone is "beyond a reasonable doubt" in my opinion.
Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago 2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy 2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE) 2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston 2020: Oakland, Oakland:2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana 2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
Avery wasn't very smart. I think he thought he could get away with it.
He almost did.
I agree that he wasn't very smart. And if he did kill her (I don't know if he did it or not), he surely would have made mistakes. But exactly this is the thing. He would not have been able to clean his room / the garage so no DNA could be found. He would not have been so smart to clean all of his DNA from the car (and leave some obvious blood tracks back). If he did kill her, the police made a huge mistake by obviously planting some evidence to frame him.
He didn't clean all of his DNA from the car. His blood was all over it (the preservative was NOT found in the blood stains by the FBI) and they got his DNA off of sweat stains that he left in the car and on the hood latch.
Even if we say that the blood was planted they still got DNA from his sweat.
He called to specifically request that she come to his property...he used his sister's name to lead her in because she had told her boss that she never wanted to visit that property again because of him. Her burned body was right behind his house. His DNA (via sweat) was on her car.
That alone is "beyond a reasonable doubt" in my opinion.
His blood was not 'all over' the car. It was smeared on three little spots. Why was his blood in the car anyways? Did she injure him?
A forensics specialist refuted the legitimacy of the preservative test. To this date... a reliable test has not been developed.
The creators of the popular Netflix documentary series "Making a Murderer" said that a juror from Steven Avery's trial reached out to them with an important revelation. The two filmmakers, Laura Ricciardi and Moira Demos, said on NBC's "Today" Tuesday that the juror believes Avery, who was convicted of murdering a 25-year-old woman in 2005, was not proven guilty in his trial. The juror, who voted to convict Avery, only did so out of fear for his/her personal safety, Demos said. Netflix's ‘Making a Murderer’ Inspires Petitions "(The juror believed) Steven was framed by law enforcement and that he deserves a new trial, and if he receives a new trial, in their opinion it should take place far away from Wisconsin," Ricciardi said. "Making a Murderer" depicts the story of Steven Avery, a Wisconsin man who was imprisoned for 18 years and later exonerated for sexual assault. Avery went on to sue Manitowoc County, Wisconsin, officials for $36 million. Soon after county officials were deposed in that lawsuit, Avery was accused of murder in the killing of Teresa Halbach, a 25-year-old photographer.
Avery ultimately was convicted of murder and of illegally possessing a firearm, but was found not guilty of mutilating a corpse. The series was filmed over 10 years by Ricciardi and Demos, two Columbia film school graduates, and has garnered powerful reactions from viewers.
The juror who contacted the documentary's filmmakers also said that the verdict reached in Avery's trial was a "compromise." "The juror contacted us directly ... and went on to describe the jurors ultimately trading votes in the jury room and explicitly discussing, 'If you vote guilty on this count, I will vote not guilty on this count,'" Ricciardi said.
The juror told the filmmakers that they hoped a split verdict would send a message to the appellate courts to give Avery a new trial. "That was sort of their plan but obviously it didn’t work out that way," Ricciardi said.
“This juror said that they have been open about what they told us and that if someone were to ask they would admit to being a source,” Ricciardi said. The two filmmakers have not yet contacted other jurors to independently verify this revelation, they said. NBC News has not independently verified this claim with any jurors.
A Change.org petition requesting pardons for Avery and his nephew Brendan Dassey, who was also convicted in Halbach's murder, has over 200,000 signatures. A petition on Whitehouse.gov received more than 58,000. Should the White House petition receive 100,000 signatures by January 16, the White House has to respond publicly. The prosecutor in Avery's case, Ken Kratz, has said that the documentary left out important evidence, and told The New York Times that the filmmakers had an "agenda" to stoke public outrage.
Demos and Ricciardi have denied the accusation and told "Today" they were pleased with the reaction to their show. “We made this series to start a dialogue and the fact that so many people are talking is just thrilling,” Demos said. She hopes the dialogue will encourage those with information to come forward.
Avery wasn't very smart. I think he thought he could get away with it.
He almost did.
I agree that he wasn't very smart. And if he did kill her (I don't know if he did it or not), he surely would have made mistakes. But exactly this is the thing. He would not have been able to clean his room / the garage so no DNA could be found. He would not have been so smart to clean all of his DNA from the car (and leave some obvious blood tracks back). If he did kill her, the police made a huge mistake by obviously planting some evidence to frame him.
He didn't clean all of his DNA from the car. His blood was all over it (the preservative was NOT found in the blood stains by the FBI) and they got his DNA off of sweat stains that he left in the car and on the hood latch.
Even if we say that the blood was planted they still got DNA from his sweat.
He called to specifically request that she come to his property...he used his sister's name to lead her in because she had told her boss that she never wanted to visit that property again because of him. Her burned body was right behind his house. His DNA (via sweat) was on her car.
That alone is "beyond a reasonable doubt" in my opinion.
His blood was not 'all over' the car. It was smeared on three little spots. Why was his blood in the car anyways? Did she injure him?
A forensics specialist refuted the legitimacy of the preservative test. To this date... a reliable test has not been developed.
They photographed a cut on Avery's finger as the potential source of the blood
and remember...they still found his DNA via a sweat stain on the hood latch
Post edited by Gern Blansten on
Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago 2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy 2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE) 2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston 2020: Oakland, Oakland:2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana 2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
13. Avery's blood was found in six places in the Halbach vehicle, and DNA from his sweat was found on a hood latch
I found this in Kratz' opening statement in the Dassey trial transcript. He told the jury that the Avery blood was found on the ignition of the vehicle, on a CD case and on seats. He also said that Avery had a cut on his finger. And he stated that the state crime lab analyst had found DNA from Avery's sweat on the hood latch of the Halbach vehicle. He also stated that Dassey had said in his confession that Avery opened the car's hood.
Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago 2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy 2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE) 2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston 2020: Oakland, Oakland:2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana 2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
The first vote showed 7 of the 12 jurors voting for 'not guilty'. During the days, this changed. Would be interesting to hear why these 7 members of the jury changed their mind.
Avery wasn't very smart. I think he thought he could get away with it.
He almost did.
I agree that he wasn't very smart. And if he did kill her (I don't know if he did it or not), he surely would have made mistakes. But exactly this is the thing. He would not have been able to clean his room / the garage so no DNA could be found. He would not have been so smart to clean all of his DNA from the car (and leave some obvious blood tracks back). If he did kill her, the police made a huge mistake by obviously planting some evidence to frame him.
He didn't clean all of his DNA from the car. His blood was all over it (the preservative was NOT found in the blood stains by the FBI) and they got his DNA off of sweat stains that he left in the car and on the hood latch.
Even if we say that the blood was planted they still got DNA from his sweat.
He called to specifically request that she come to his property...he used his sister's name to lead her in because she had told her boss that she never wanted to visit that property again because of him. Her burned body was right behind his house. His DNA (via sweat) was on her car.
That alone is "beyond a reasonable doubt" in my opinion.
His blood was not 'all over' the car. It was smeared on three little spots. Why was his blood in the car anyways? Did she injure him?
A forensics specialist refuted the legitimacy of the preservative test. To this date... a reliable test has not been developed.
They photographed a cut on Avery's finger as the potential source of the blood
and remember...they still found his DNA via a sweat stain on the hood latch
The bead of sweat they found (one drop of sweat?) was interesting to me. It was interesting because prosecutor made a direct reference to him being a 'middle aged man covered in sweat' twice during a press conference prior to the trial.
To me... the over the top emphasis of 'a real sweaty, gross, stupid man' set up the 'drop of sweat' found really well: "Look... sweat... a drop of it... and hey... remember... he was really sweaty when he came to the door for his nephew when interrupted raping his victim!"
I might have missed it... but where does it state the missing evidence that supports the conviction?
Kratz was afforded the opportunity to be interviewed for the film and elected not to. I think he underestimated his need to do this- more arrogance on his part.
another missing piece from the documentary was Brandon's bleach stained jeans
Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago 2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy 2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE) 2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston 2020: Oakland, Oakland:2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana 2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
I dont think anything that is being pushed as 'left out' is particularly ground-breaking as far as evidence goes. Especially in light of the foul play that has *probably occurred here.
You would think with those restraints, the woman would struggle and some dna or something would be left on them... as well as markation on the bed posts. The amount of blood/human matter that would have been produced by a few of the various Dassey stories would not have been cleaned without a trace. The property was like a hoarders episode and authorities were desperately trying to find anything. You would think that there would be biological evidence. The bleach theory was also debunked a bit in the garage as they still found Avery's DNA in the concrete (but not Halbach). Even if they were able to meticulously clear the murder scene like professionals... why not use the car crusher, why leave blood in the car... and also why not use the Smelter on site to incinerate the body?
I think these arguments against Avery are way beyond reasonable doubt territory.
another missing piece from the documentary was Brandon's bleach stained jeans
Sooo...
These simple idiots are smart enough to thoroughly cleanse a crime scene of any trace remnants that would link them to the murder... but leave the deceased's vehicle on their lot with a couple twigs on top of it to hide it... not to mention the charred remains outside the front door of their trailer?
Things just don't add up. I too question culpability with the circumstantial evidence against them, but it's not near enough to convict them in my mind.
another missing piece from the documentary was Brandon's bleach stained jeans
Sooo...
These simple idiots are smart enough to thoroughly cleanse a crime scene of any trace remnants that would link them to the murder... but leave the deceased's vehicle on their lot with a couple twigs on top of it to hide it... not to mention the charred remains outside the front door of their trailer?
Things just don't add up. I too question culpability with the circumstantial evidence against them, but it's not near enough to convict them in my mind.
Exactly. They clean up 1 part of the murder like Dexter cleans up his kill room, but then leave the car and her charred bones out in the open?? That combined with the constant presence of the scumbag Manitowoc County cops just leaves way too much doubt.
I dont think anything that is being pushed as 'left out' is particularly ground-breaking as far as evidence goes. Especially in light of the foul play that has *probably occurred here.
These simple idiots are smart enough to thoroughly cleanse a crime scene of any trace remnants that would link them to the murder... but leave the deceased's vehicle on their lot with a couple twigs on top of it to hide it... not to mention the charred remains outside the front door of their trailer?
Things just don't add up. I too question culpability with the circumstantial evidence against them, but it's not near enough to convict them in my mind.
That does not fit at all and makes no sense - you are absolutely right.
Right but again they had a few days to clean up and the police force wasn't necessarily expert on these type of situations either.
I rewatched a few episodes last night. I will say that after seeing the whole documentary and following up on other articles it does still shock me that Avery might be guilty. His demeanor just doesn't match a killer. The news reporters were interviewing him right out in front of his house and asking about what the police were asking, etc. His responses immediately seemed to jump to the police trying to frame him so you could argue that he was going to use that as a defense from the beginning but it still seems like his demeanor would be shaky.
If he would have refused to talk to the news I would feel stronger that he was the murderer.
Plus...as Strang pointed out yesterday, Halbach knew she was going to the Avery property. If she really had strong fears about Steven she most likely would have said something.
Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago 2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy 2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE) 2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston 2020: Oakland, Oakland:2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana 2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
Right but again they had a few days to clean up and the police force wasn't necessarily expert on these type of situations either.
I rewatched a few episodes last night. I will say that after seeing the whole documentary and following up on other articles it does still shock me that Avery might be guilty. His demeanor just doesn't match a killer. The news reporters were interviewing him right out in front of his house and asking about what the police were asking, etc. His responses immediately seemed to jump to the police trying to frame him so you could argue that he was going to use that as a defense from the beginning but it still seems like his demeanor would be shaky.
If he would have refused to talk to the news I would feel stronger that he was the murderer.
Plus...as Strang pointed out yesterday, Halbach knew she was going to the Avery property. If she really had strong fears about Steven she most likely would have said something.
His defensive instincts against the police might have been as strong as anyone in America's.
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago 2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy 2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE) 2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston 2020: Oakland, Oakland:2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana 2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
"...Dimitri...He talks to me...'.."The Ghost of Greece..".
"..That's One Happy Fuckin Ghost.."
“..That came up on the Pillow Case...This is for the Greek, With Our Apologies.....”
Very interesting. More potential suspects that they should have looked into.
But so hellbent on making their case given the indignity they were suffering for their previous work which saw them wrongfully convict an innocent man.
I was convinced he is.innocent after saw the lady saying how she found the car and by the phonecall of the officer asking if the plate number was correct while is clear he was reading the plate like he had the car infront of him Those 2 was lying..
"...Dimitri...He talks to me...'.."The Ghost of Greece..".
"..That's One Happy Fuckin Ghost.."
“..That came up on the Pillow Case...This is for the Greek, With Our Apologies.....”
Comments
"As for the key, I believe it was the spare as others have pointed out, and I think there's little to no doubt that was planted by Manitowoc Sheriff's Deputies. I don't think the reason is exactly as you would think though. I think they were worried they didn't have enough evidence to put Avery away, I think they were concerned he was going to go free, and I think they got desperate in trying to convict him. I also think the bullet with Halbach's DNA was planted. It wasn't blood DNA, after all, just "unspecified" DNA."
This to me invalidates every piece of information connecting to Avery. If law enforcement, who is tasked to be impartial and find the truth in the way of evidence/clues, tampers and plants evidence... who knows where it stops and starts? In this situation, you have a very valid/real motive for MC authorities to want to put Avery away and the timing was impeccable.
The whole case is contaminated and there should be an overall sense of reasonable doubt. Its way beyond getting off on a technicality. This is criminal misconduct on the part of the authorities.
Who knows what/if Dassey saw or did anything? I have seen/heard like 7 versions. In this version he was invited to the fire by a guy burning/trying to hide a corpse (didnt smell anything) and saw body parts?
The police and some officers.
The 36-million-Dollar lawsuit could ruin some officers, what better motive than money and fear of losing everything can there be?
As for the evidence planted, I think we can be sure of the following:
- the key was clearly planted, most likely by officer Lenk
- the same with the bullet with the DNA on it in the garage. Also Mr. Lenk involved.
- the blood in the car and the car itself on the property. Again, Lenk is an active part when the car is found. And to find Stevens blood, but no DNA, would make him Avery criminial mastermind to achive this. Plus, the blood tube in the evidence room was used which is a clear indication police was involved.
.
He almost did.
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
And if he did kill her (I don't know if he did it or not), he surely would have made mistakes.
But exactly this is the thing.
He would not have been able to clean his room / the garage so no DNA could be found.
He would not have been so smart to clean all of his DNA from the car (and leave some obvious blood tracks back).
If he did kill her, the police made a huge mistake by obviously planting some evidence to frame him.
Even if we say that the blood was planted they still got DNA from his sweat.
He called to specifically request that she come to his property...he used his sister's name to lead her in because she had told her boss that she never wanted to visit that property again because of him. Her burned body was right behind his house. His DNA (via sweat) was on her car.
That alone is "beyond a reasonable doubt" in my opinion.
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
A forensics specialist refuted the legitimacy of the preservative test. To this date... a reliable test has not been developed.
The creators of the popular Netflix documentary series "Making a Murderer" said that a juror from Steven Avery's trial reached out to them with an important revelation.
The two filmmakers, Laura Ricciardi and Moira Demos, said on NBC's "Today" Tuesday that the juror believes Avery, who was convicted of murdering a 25-year-old woman in 2005, was not proven guilty in his trial. The juror, who voted to convict Avery, only did so out of fear for his/her personal safety, Demos said.
Netflix's ‘Making a Murderer’ Inspires Petitions
"(The juror believed) Steven was framed by law enforcement and that he deserves a new trial, and if he receives a new trial, in their opinion it should take place far away from Wisconsin," Ricciardi said.
"Making a Murderer" depicts the story of Steven Avery, a Wisconsin man who was imprisoned for 18 years and later exonerated for sexual assault. Avery went on to sue Manitowoc County, Wisconsin, officials for $36 million. Soon after county officials were deposed in that lawsuit, Avery was accused of murder in the killing of Teresa Halbach, a 25-year-old photographer.
Avery ultimately was convicted of murder and of illegally possessing a firearm, but was found not guilty of mutilating a corpse.
The series was filmed over 10 years by Ricciardi and Demos, two Columbia film school graduates, and has garnered powerful reactions from viewers.
The juror who contacted the documentary's filmmakers also said that the verdict reached in Avery's trial was a "compromise."
"The juror contacted us directly ... and went on to describe the jurors ultimately trading votes in the jury room and explicitly discussing, 'If you vote guilty on this count, I will vote not guilty on this count,'" Ricciardi said.
The juror told the filmmakers that they hoped a split verdict would send a message to the appellate courts to give Avery a new trial.
"That was sort of their plan but obviously it didn’t work out that way," Ricciardi said.
“This juror said that they have been open about what they told us and that if someone were to ask they would admit to being a source,” Ricciardi said.
The two filmmakers have not yet contacted other jurors to independently verify this revelation, they said. NBC News has not independently verified this claim with any jurors.
A Change.org petition requesting pardons for Avery and his nephew Brendan Dassey, who was also convicted in Halbach's murder, has over 200,000 signatures. A petition on Whitehouse.gov received more than 58,000. Should the White House petition receive 100,000 signatures by January 16, the White House has to respond publicly.
The prosecutor in Avery's case, Ken Kratz, has said that the documentary left out important evidence, and told The New York Times that the filmmakers had an "agenda" to stoke public outrage.
Demos and Ricciardi have denied the accusation and told "Today" they were pleased with the reaction to their show.
“We made this series to start a dialogue and the fact that so many people are talking is just thrilling,” Demos said. She hopes the dialogue will encourage those with information to come forward.
LIVEFOOTSTEPS.ORG/USER/?USR=435
and remember...they still found his DNA via a sweat stain on the hood latch
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
If he wore no gloves, there probably would be tons of other DNA (not only sweat stain).
By the way, were does it say that sweat stain was found in the car?
From the article:
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
During the days, this changed.
Would be interesting to hear why these 7 members of the jury changed their mind.
To me... the over the top emphasis of 'a real sweaty, gross, stupid man' set up the 'drop of sweat' found really well: "Look... sweat... a drop of it... and hey... remember... he was really sweaty when he came to the door for his nephew when interrupted raping his victim!"
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/05/arts/television/ken-kratz-making-a-murderer.html?smid=tw-nytimes&smtyp=cur&_r=1
Kratz was afforded the opportunity to be interviewed for the film and elected not to. I think he underestimated his need to do this- more arrogance on his part.
Good info here...
another missing piece from the documentary was Brandon's bleach stained jeans
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
You would think with those restraints, the woman would struggle and some dna or something would be left on them... as well as markation on the bed posts.
The amount of blood/human matter that would have been produced by a few of the various Dassey stories would not have been cleaned without a trace. The property was like a hoarders episode and authorities were desperately trying to find anything. You would think that there would be biological evidence. The bleach theory was also debunked a bit in the garage as they still found Avery's DNA in the concrete (but not Halbach).
Even if they were able to meticulously clear the murder scene like professionals... why not use the car crusher, why leave blood in the car... and also why not use the Smelter on site to incinerate the body?
I think these arguments against Avery are way beyond reasonable doubt territory.
These simple idiots are smart enough to thoroughly cleanse a crime scene of any trace remnants that would link them to the murder... but leave the deceased's vehicle on their lot with a couple twigs on top of it to hide it... not to mention the charred remains outside the front door of their trailer?
Things just don't add up. I too question culpability with the circumstantial evidence against them, but it's not near enough to convict them in my mind.
http://fusion.net/story/249427/netflix-making-a-murderer-what-happened-theories/
I rewatched a few episodes last night. I will say that after seeing the whole documentary and following up on other articles it does still shock me that Avery might be guilty. His demeanor just doesn't match a killer. The news reporters were interviewing him right out in front of his house and asking about what the police were asking, etc. His responses immediately seemed to jump to the police trying to frame him so you could argue that he was going to use that as a defense from the beginning but it still seems like his demeanor would be shaky.
If he would have refused to talk to the news I would feel stronger that he was the murderer.
Plus...as Strang pointed out yesterday, Halbach knew she was going to the Avery property. If she really had strong fears about Steven she most likely would have said something.
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
Interesting...
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
"..That's One Happy Fuckin Ghost.."
“..That came up on the Pillow Case...This is for the Greek, With Our Apologies.....”
Those 2 was lying..
"..That's One Happy Fuckin Ghost.."
“..That came up on the Pillow Case...This is for the Greek, With Our Apologies.....”